Wadkin 12" Planer thicknesser, Have I been ripped off?

[Clee_to_Clee]

I've just bought a Wadkin 12" BAOS planer thicknesser on ebay, I already have an old wadkin bandsaw and had read, probably on here people saying how good the planer was and decided that was exactly what I was after.

I had a brief look at it as we loaded it onto the truck and it looked great, but as soon as we got it back to the shop I noticed the kickback teeth were nowhere to be seen, is it normal for those units to have been removed?

The person who sold it seemed in our conversations to be very knowledgeable about machines and said it was in good condition and didnt mention they were missing.

Ive only used machines with them fitted so is it safe to use?
Should I not be worried about it?
Its already cost me £160 to go and pick up the machine so and I dont really have money to piss up the wall returning it, but a replacement unit would cost me £800

I spent time yesterday cleaning/greasing etc and it looks great, some opinions and advice would be greatly appreciated!!

 

[Trevanion]

It probably won’t be a problem, I’ve used a few thicknessers without any anti-kickback measures and they did the job fine. To be honest, I wonder whether it’s an unnecessary bit of safety equipment anyway and it’s added on for the sake of adding on as I’ve ploughed miles of timber through and I’ve never had anything remotely close to a kickback with a thicknesser since the feed rollers are exerting so much downward pressure.

 

[Doug71]

I used to have an old 12"BAOS and to be honest I can't remember it having the anti kick back fingers on.

Make sure you keep the gearbox for the feed rollers greased, there is a couple of cogs in there that can wear and cost £750 to replace.

As you have found replacement parts are very expensive.

 

[Clee_to_Clee]

thanks!
thats actually my first job when I get in this morning I started yesterday but was unsure if I was doing it correctly, and at the moment it isnt wired in so I cant move the cogs, do you just squirt grease over them?

Ive also been trying to work out what oil i should use, it seems most of the ones they recommended back in the day were discontinued

 

[Trevanion]

Ive also been trying to work out what oil i should use, it seems most of the ones they recommended back in the day were discontinued

Not so much discontinued as some were renamed and became modern ISO graded

Shell Alvania 3 Grease became Shell Gadus S2 V220
Shell Vitrea 75 (Pre ISO) became Shell Vitrea 320 (ISO)
Shell Vitrea 33 (Pre ISO) became Shell Vitrea 68 (ISO)
Shell Tellus 27 (Pre ISO became Shell Tellus 37 (ISO)

You can find somewhat cheaper equivalent oils just by searching for say "ISO 320 oil" but to be honest, any oil would probably be fine since it's only a planing machine and not a precision race car with a £100,000 gear box. Don't skimp by having cheap grease though, and don't over-do the greasing as that will cause more damage than having no grease at all because it will overheat the bearing trying to churn up the compacted grease, it's there to stop corrosion of the ball bearings and the races and is only marginally required for lubrication if at all.

 

[Clee_to_Clee]

Thanks Trevanion!

Ive used Gradus for the grease as I already had that for my lathe, the oil that wadkin specifies is power em125 but I cant see online what that one became

Phew! just been reading about over greasing, I had no idea, I gave the motors a squirt each so hopfully not too much

 

[Trevanion]

This is the lubrication chart that's in the BAOS manual available in PDF form from Daltons.

I saw a small tin of Wadkin's own grease on eBay once a long time ago, I wonder if it was still any good.

"Woodworking machinery is not made foolproof, it requires skilled attention to obtain the best results. Starting from the turning of the cutters or saws, let it be understood that with modern machinery using ball or roller bearings, there is a great difference between their lubrication and the plain bearing of old-time machines. Ball and roller bearings do not depend on oil or grease for their successful running. Many a bearing has been ruined by operatives gamming grease into a ball-race, pressing it in so hard that the balls are checked, and they have to churn the grease up before they can move freely. Grease and oil are used in bearings to prevent rust and for the balls or rollers to retain their surfaces. Unless the bearing is in a very exposed position, a greasing of the bearings about once in three months will keep them in excellent condition. On no account grease the bearings every day, or they will become hot and trouble will come."

"Woodworking Machinery for Small Workshops" by W.J. Blackmur 1937. The excerpt is still relevant despite being over 80 years old.

 

[wallace]

That is a reasonable price for a BAOS, like already mentioned I don't think the missing fingers will affect the use. I've never had a kickback on my 18"

 

[Clee_to_Clee]

This is the lubrication chart that's in the BAOS manual available in PDF form from Daltons.

I saw a small tin of Wadkin's own grease on eBay once a long time ago, I wonder if it was still any good.

"Woodworking machinery is not made foolproof, it requires skilled attention to obtain the best results. Starting from the turning of the cutters or saws, let it be understood that with modern machinery using ball or roller bearings, there is a great difference between their lubrication and the plain bearing of old-time machines. Ball and roller bearings do not depend on oil or grease for their successful running. Many a bearing has been ruined by operatives gamming grease into a ball-race, pressing it in so hard that the balls are checked, and they have to churn the grease up before they can move freely. Grease and oil are used in bearings to prevent rust and for the balls or rollers to retain their surfaces. Unless the bearing is in a very exposed position, a greasing of the bearings about once in three months will keep them in excellent condition. On no account grease the bearings every day, or they will become hot and trouble will come."

"Woodworking Machinery for Small Workshops" by W.J. Blackmur 1937. The excerpt is still relevant despite being over 80 years old.

Thats great thank you!

the manual says once a year for the motors, though they wont be running daily, so I guess less for me and weekly for the gears etc, so Ill just keep an eye on them

 

[Clee_to_Clee]

That is a reasonable price for a BAOS, like already mentioned I don't think the missing fingers will affect the use. I've never had a kickback on my 18"

Thanks wallace, the machine was £700 + collecting £160 though I also picked up a wadkin spindle moulder on the way back

 

[Sgian Dubh]

In forty years or more of using planers and thicknessers and/or planer/thicknessers I can report, unlike others that have contributed here, that I have experienced kickback when using a thicknesser, and it happened on the same Wadkin planer/thicknesser on both occasions, so twice in the space of two or three years more than thirty years ago. I can't recall the model for sure now, but it was probably one of their BTS500 machines, with surface planing tables that didn't lift up to access the thicknesser function. I don't think it had anti-kickback fingers, but I could be wrong on that. But I've also used dozens of planers and thicknessers, all different models and manufacturers, where some had anti-kickback fingers, and many didn't.

The first kickback involved a thin strip, maybe 3 - 6 mm thick that somehow got hung up, shattered, and kicked back, and almost broke my fingers holding on to the rear end of the piece. The second occurrence was when I was thicknessing a fairly big lump (maybe 8' X 3-1/2" X 2-1/2") that had a large loose knot that got caught up in the cutters. After the first kickback (of the thin piece) I got into the habit of feeding pieces into these machines by holding boards by their edges or sides rather than the end: my reasoning being that if a kickback ever occurred again, at least my fingers wouldn't get bruised or smashed, and I could maybe live better if splinters happened to get driven somewhere into my hand ... but I've not since experienced another kickback to test that theory.

So, just two kickbacks in all that time having planed and thicknessed unknown thousands of linear feet of wood suggests kickback is very rare indeed, but that maybe it's not a bad idea to develop the method I described above (holding wood by the side) to feed the machine ... just in case, ha, ha. Slainte.

 

[Clee_to_Clee]

In forty years or more of using planers and thicknessers and/or planer/thicknessers I can report, unlike others that have contributed here, that I have experienced kickback when using a thicknesser, and it happened on the same Wadkin planer/thicknesser on both occasions, so twice in the space of two or three years more than thirty years ago. I can't recall the model for sure now, but it was probably one of their BTS500 machines, with surface planing tables that didn't lift up to access the thicknesser function. I don't think it had anti-kickback fingers, but I could be wrong on that. But I've also used dozens of planers and thicknessers, all different models and manufacturers, where some had anti-kickback fingers, and many didn't.

The first kickback involved a thin strip, maybe 3 - 6 mm thick that somehow got hung up, shattered, and kicked back, and almost broke my fingers holding on to the rear end of the piece. The second occurrence was when I was thicknessing a fairly big lump (maybe 8' X 3-1/2" X 2-1/2") that had a large loose knot that got caught up in the cutters. After the first kickback (of the thin piece) I got into the habit of feeding pieces into these machines by holding boards by their edges or sides rather than the end: my reasoning being that if a kickback ever occurred again, at least my fingers wouldn't get bruised or smashed, and I could maybe live better if splinters happened to get driven somewhere into my hand ... but I've not since experienced another kickback to test that theory.

So, just two kickbacks in all that time having planed and thicknessed unknown thousands of linear feet of wood suggests kickback is very rare indeed, but that maybe it's not a bad idea to develop the method I described above (holding wood by the side) to feed the machine ... just in case, ha, ha. Slainte.

I will definitely be doing that!