Total Newbie - Wholesale Advice Needed!

[albus16]

Hi All,

This is my first post here so bear with me. I am hoping to tap into the vast expanse of experts this site seems to harbour.

I have (albeit briefly so I apologise if such a thread already exists) looked around the forums and I can't seem to find any threads where complete beginners' have sought starting-up advice. I used to love making things out of wood when I was a child and the urge clearly hasn't left me. I recently made a small box out of a piece of oak I found in my dad's workshop for my girlfriend. It was rudimentary to say the least - basic joints, dowel hinges, simply finished etc and I want to start doing this woodworking thing more seriously.

Sorry if I have come to the wrong place and this is for more advanced workers and if so please direct me elsewhere.

So, I have a few general questions so that I can try and get into it:

1. Are there any specialist tools besides general workshop ones which are absolute necessities? When I say general workshop I mean things like electric sanders, bandsaws, drills etc, and no real 'woodworking' tools as such.

2. In general terms, where does one source wood from for small projects? I understand that you can't tell me specifically (I live in between Leicester and Nottingham if anyone lives near me and can tell me specifically), but just what types of places should I be going to? and What should I be asking for?

3. Is anyone able to give me brief lesson on different woods? I love oak generally speaking but I don't feel like I know enough about different types, and their characteristics.

4. Does anyone have any good starter projects which you think might be suitable for me?

5. What general advice does anyone have for someone just starting out in woodworking. I know I have the passion and staying power for it, I'm just not sure where to start with it all.

I realise these questions are quite general and are not easily answered simply, but any help, no matter how basic or fleeting, would be greatly received.

Alex

 

[AndyT]

A lot depends on what you need around the house. But you've already hit on one good idea - go for small projects, which don't need a lot of wood, or acres of finishing. So, boxes are ideal - you can make one out of a single piece of wood, and you can always find a use for one more.
I'd recommend getting familiar with hand tools before you go near any machines - basically follow the sort of elementary course that used to be taught in schools.
The Americans are getting quite zealous about promoting this approach - rediscovering Sloyd and similar. But it also means that they are reprinting some older, simpler books which will guide you through simple projects and build up your skills.

For the very important basics of measuring and marking out and cutting to size, there's a good intro on Jeff Gorman's site at http://www.amgron.clara.net/ - he posts on here sometimes.

And welcome to the forum!

 

[Digit]

Boxes, clocks, chopping boards, anything that won't cost too much in money and labour when something goes wrong.
We all make mistakes, we just keep quiet about them!

Roy.

 

[Pond]

Hi Alex, welcome.

You will find MANY very knowledgeable people here who are more than willing to answer any question you may have, so don't be shy!

I too am a novice at this lark, but have jumped in at the deep end and am making a handmade oak kitchen! If it wasn't for the people on here I wouldn't have known where to start.

Tools are a very subjective thing, there are many desirable ones, but most are not 'essential'. Some would argue that a set of chisels, a hand plane, a mallet and a pencil are all you 'need', however, a great deal of skill and time would be required to produce anything with just these!
An excellent place to look is http://www.axminster.co.uk, they have every woodworking tool under the sun and their prices are generally very good too! I have two of their catalogues, one by the bed and the other in the kazi!

I have spent a lot of cash on tools and machinery lately, however, the most useful everyday ones I find are a £1.50 steel rule (more accurate than a tape measure) and a cheap pair of digital calipers (£18 from Axminster). My little Kreg pocket hole jig (£30) is really useful too.

Their is an oak supplier in Corby called 'uk oak', they are not the cheapest but will supply any amount for collection.

HTH

Andy

 

[milkman]

I think its important to mention the info on here can be supplemented with a good book. I think Collins Complete Woodworkers Manual* is a great book and has something about everything.

I agree with Pond's list, (did he include blockplane? Oh, handplane, he did)

I find its best to go in with the right attitude. That is, you're going to get tools you think are useful, they'll turn out to be a bit pants and you'll have to take that on the chin.
And no, asking us won't help you cos its a very personal thing! : )
(except for mini bullnose planes, everyone seems to think they're rubbish which is why I've never managed to ebay mine!)

Best wishes and enjoy the trip

*I'm sure other books are available as they say

 

[Steve Maskery]

Lots of good advice above.
My dad was a cabinet maker and my grandad was a pattern maker, so I grew up with wood and tools. When I went out inot the big bad world on ,y own, my dad gave me a very good piece of advice. Buy one tool every week. It doesn't matter if it is a steel rule or a planer/thicknesser. Just build up a tool kit week by week. Well he was paid weekly, so today it would probably be month by month, but the principle stands.

Magazines are a great source of ideas too, especially for people at your stage. I used to devour them. Several of us here write for the UK range, Good Woodworking (Andy King), Furniture and Cabinetmaking (Rob Woodbloke), Woodworker (not sure any more) and British Woodworking (Me) and there are the American titles as well.

Fitchett & Wollacott in Nottingham stock a decent range of timbers, but you can't go and browse the racks like you once could. But you can often pick up a kilned sample or two quite cheaply, great for smaller projects.

Nixon Knowles (now International Timber) is usually my first port of call. Not a huge range of hardwoods, but good for the main stuff (American oak, ash, canary, as well as softwoods and ply/ MDF). Also in Nottingham.

HTH
Steve

 

[kirkpoore1]

Alex:

Welcome aboard. Woodworking can be fulfilling no matter what level of commitment or expertise, so you can dip your toe in the pool and see how you like it before having to jump in with both feet. You'll find good used tools to be easier to use than bad new ones, and if you buy tools only as you need them, you'll end up knowing the good ones before you make too many wrong turns.

As AndyT was saying, learning handtools first will teach you the basics. If you go that way, try reading Roy Underhill's Woodwright's Shop books. I learned a whole bunch of basics reading Roy. But if you can, find somebody local to work with to show you a few things. Much quicker than learning of a book. If you aren't going to do everything in your dad's shop, the first thing I'd build would be a sturdy workbench with a good vise. Don't go for a super-duper hard maple monster with a three inch thick top. Build it heavy, cheap, and sturdy out of construction grade lumber with a hardboard top surface. Put a shelf on it for some sandbags to hold it in place. After you have the workbench and vise, you'll be able to use every hand tool much more easily. A couple of decent planes, a nice saw, a coping saw, a drill, a few chisels, and a mallet and you'll have a good start.

For power tools, in my opinion the safest and most versatile is a bandsaw. You can make a bandsaw do a whole bunch of things that other tools can do. After that, a drill press is really handy. Get used to these, and you'll be ready for others.

Sorry, I can't help with the wood, I'm not in the neighborhood.

Kirk

 

[Benchwayze]

Welcome aboard Alex.

Boxes are good for practice on a lot of corner jointing techniques. And don't forget... Most items of free-standing furniture are just boxes really.
Drawers? Lid-less boxes in a lid-less box!

And don't put yourself down over using dowels. There's nothing wrong with a good dowel joint, used in the right place and in the right orientation.
If you get just half of the satisfaction I've had over the years you'll be well in the black.

(Well maybe in the red after buying tools... But it isn't all about money!)

regards
John

 

[albus16]

Hello again,

Thanks very much for the advice so far! most of my questions seem to have been answered comprehensively and I have tried to take it all on board.

I have ordered The Woodworkers' Manual milkman mentioned as I have heard this is good for setting up beginners, and as an encyclopaedic reference for later reference. Other than that I guess I just have to get out there and start trying things.

One further query, you have all recommended timber yards and wood sources, but what do I want from places like that? is it a case of trying to get off-shoots or what? I'm not quite sure what I would say if I wandered into a place like that. I sort of envisage them doing supplying builder's merchants and the like with massive bits of wood, when all I want is a few small bits. Even worse, I don't have (although I can access) a thickneser or anything of the sort. So what would I ask for/do at a massive timber yard?

Thanks again for all your help, once I start my own projects you will no doubt be hearing from me again. Most likely something along the lines of "I have stuck my hand between two bits of wood, what now?" or something similar.

Regards,

Alex

 

[chipchaser]

Hi Alex,

Robert Wearing wrote some very good books in a simple and straight forward way:

“Hand Tools and Techniques” covers basic skills and can be bought cheaply second-hand from Amazon etc.

“The Essential Woodworker: Skills, Tools and Methods” I don’t yet have this one myself but Christopher Schwarz gives it a very good review. It is now very expensive second-hand but there is a reprint from http://www.lostartpress.com/catalog.

“Traditional Woodworking Workshop Devices” also gets very good reviews.

“The Resourceful Woodworker: Tools, Techniques and Tricks of the Trade” I like this one and have made some of his tools and jigs which work well.

Some local libraries have copies for loan, for example, Warwickshire has two of the above titles.

Graham

 

[Escudo]

Welcome aboard Alex, I am sure you will find lots of information and friendly advice here on the forum.

I would also like to endorse having a look at a couple of the monthly magazines, British woodworking edited by the forum's Nick Gibbs, and Furniture and Cabinet making another top mag. These include details for projects, tips, techniques and tool reviews. If you want to catch up a bit you often see back issues for sale for not much money.

I started woodworking by making simple small items, birdboxes, I used to love making drain covers!, I graduated to kitchen roll holders, spice racks, and then boxes. Making items for your workshop like a shooting board, or saw bench hook are also fun projects a chance to test your skills.

With regard to timber I was fortunate in landing on a large job lot of oak offcuts via the ebay. I still have a lot left, if you could source something like this that would be great.

Woodworking is a rewarding hobby, and somehow spending time away from the pressures of work and life, pottering in your shed/workshop provides a real boost at times.

Good luck, Tony.

 

[Pond]

Alex,

Most timber suppliers/ importers will supply PAR (planed all round) to your requirements. It will obviously cost more than sawn, but with no planer is the way to go.

I was in the same position as you, so found mention of a couple of reputable suppliers on here (Sykes Timber in Atherstone and British Hardwoods in Yorks) and rang them. They were happy to chat and advise on the best way forward (especially Sykes so ordered from them).

All will send any amount of timber either by courier or own transport, or you can collect.

If you only want 'scraps' for now, why not put a wanted post in the for sale/ wanted forum, in exchange for beer tokens? There are many professionals based in your area!

HTH

Andy

 

[bucheron]

Hi Alex,
You surely have set yourself on a steep learning curve.
Not knowing how good your dad's workshop is equipped, leaves a project list open.
I totally agree with Kirk's post, a good heavy workbench will give you lots of hands on experience with tools and the quality of finish is up to you.
Buy more tools than magazines or books and cost your project.

 

[Alf]

Lots of good advice - it's such an open-ended question it's really a matter of pointing you at stuff, in the spirit of which I offer up I Can Do That from Popular Woodworking. Absorb as much as you can from everywhere, and eventually it comes out again in the form of results. Buying the raw materials is the single biggest pain in the posterior, in my experience - lots of members in your area, so if you can hook up with any of them, that'll help a lot.

 

[woodbloke]

...the first thing I'd build would be a sturdy workbench with a good vise. Don't go for a super-duper hard maple monster with a three inch thick top. Build it heavy, cheap, and sturdy out of construction grade lumber with a hardboard top surface. Put a shelf on it for some sandbags to hold it in place. After you have the workbench and vise, you'll be able to use every hand tool much more easily. A couple of decent planes, a nice saw, a coping saw, a drill, a few chisels, and a mallet and you'll have a good start.

For power tools, in my opinion the safest and most versatile is a bandsaw. You can make a bandsaw do a whole bunch of things that other tools can do. After that, a drill press is really handy. Get used to these, and you'll be ready for others.

Kirk

Some great information thus far that I'd take seriously 'on board'. I'd agree completely with all of it, but in particular the bench. Make it cheap, make it heavy, make the top flat and include some diagonal bracing joists to prevent the thing from 'racking' when planing.

Keep the tools down to a minimum to start with but try and buy quality whenever you can (Steve M's advice here is excellent...one a week) as cheap tool purchases are always disappointing in the long run. I'd also include some sort of sharpening regime (plenty of info on the forum) for your planes and chisels...they'll soon get blunt and if you can't sharpen them nothing is more disheartening and in addition, the quality of your work will suffer.

Projects...keep them small and simple to begin with while you learn the skills and don't be tempted into thinking that 'shed' pine is the stuff for beginners, it's not and is one of the hardest timbers to use successfully. A mild working hardwood (mahogany or chestnut say) will be much easier to use and will respond better to hand tools.

Eventually you may want to consider machinery and I agree as well that the bandsaw is probably the first one to buy, after which maybe a selection of hand power tools (eg router...but be sure you know what you're doing with it) and a drill press.

Good luck and crack on...don't forget to ask any questions of us as you progress as there's always someone around who'll give you a sound answer. I'd also recommend that you contact a member in you local area who'd be willing to give you a run through of the basics one weekend...I would offer but you're a bit far away - Rob

 

[Orcamesh]

Welcome to the forum Alex!

I haven't had time to read all the other advice, but I am sure it is all fantastic. Apologies but I may therefore repeat something, but my advice is :

Buy the best tools you can afford. For me, buying cheap tools has always ended up in tears and I end up buying a more expensive tool in the end so it seems a bit of a false economy to me.
I have lived with a bandsaw for more than 10 years and it is undoubtedly the most versatile saw, but I bought a table saw a year ago and do not regret it. I should have bought one years ago! Mainly it speeds up and increases the accuracy of most of your initial cuts.
Hand tools are a necessity, no machine can produce hand tool prepared finishes. Whatever surface finish you end up with will be magnified when the finish (oil/lacquer/wax...) is applied to the wood.
Machines do not generally cut difficult grains very well and usually handplanes are needed to remove tears in the surface.
Ensuring your prepared stock is square & true will enable a much smoother build.
A planer/thicknesser is probably needed in the end too if you are going to prepare your own boards for projects, but in the meantime you could get someone to plane boards for you at cost.

I have some more info on my website which goes through the training courses I did as a hobbyist, some years ago now, but they taught me a great deal. The first course I did was just a general hand tools course, the sort of thing you would have done at school, but better! I did this with Adrian Marks (he is no longer working), but you could find one near you probably.

See http://www.orcamesh.com/Orcamesh/Adrian_Marks.html where there are some basic tools listed (according to Adrian).

You might find also Michael Scott's course notes useful?
http://www.orcamesh.com/Orcamesh/Michael_Scott.html

Hope it helps?
cheers Steve

 

[Chems]

Learn by doing. And asking here.

Thats how I did/do.

 

[jumps]

there is no such thing as a basic tool set, and you can't (fundamentally) separate hand tools from power - such delineations are more from principled perspectives than practical ones; obvious excluding the 'I don't have mains electricity...'!

for some things quality is king - I would rather have a good 1/2" chisel than a poor 1/2, 3/4 and 1" one, as others have suggested. Ideally with a solid means to sharpen it too.

whilst I appreciate my table saw, love my band saw, and find the circular saw useful - a good jigsaw and range of blades would be my starting point.

planner/thicknessers are never big enough! Even 16" (which in cast iron UK is a huge machine) is a real pain when you have a 20" x 2" sycamore slice you want to work - so it's back to basics.

I'm not a fan of hand v power, it's not that straightforward. I can be as impressed with a virtuoso on the router as chisels or a plane; again as already highlighted you can't get away from the need for accurate measuring and marking before you make your (accurate) cuts - however you make them.

 

[Benchwayze]

I'm not a fan of hand v power, it's not that straightforward. I can be as impressed with a virtuoso on the router as chisels or a plane; again as already highlighted you can't get away from the need for accurate measuring and marking before you make your (accurate) cuts - however you make them.

Absolutely!

If you don't start off with square and accurate stock, you'll never finish that way either!

HTH

John

 

[lanemaux]

Welcome, welcome , thrice welcome amigo. As I am not a fount of knowledge as are others here I will give the only advice I have not seen yet. Have fun... I do and that is enough for me. If you are not making a go of making an income from wood related workings , then ,fun or relaxation should be the real focus. In my case I stay at home looking after my daughter... we both enjoy old tools and making sawdust. So that is what we do. My advice is to get tools like Steve advises (one a week or so) and enjoy them.