Spindle moulder Questions.

[Ollie78]

Hi all.

I have to make 30 odd double glazed sliding sashes to install in a period property. The moulding does not have to be an absolutely spot on accurate copy, as I will be changing all of them to correct the many various unbelievable bodges of the past.

I normally make my sashes using a router table and a CMT sash set, or sometimes individual cutters to get different mouldings.
Mostly though I only make 6 or so at a time.

So I have decided to take a plunge and get a spindle moulder.

My reasoning being that the job is large enough to cover most of the cost and I should be able to speed up production. Also once I have the machine I will be able to use it for many more things in future.

I have been doing a fair bit of googling about, including some useful posts on this very site.

I have been looking at the Record power machine. http://www.recordpower.co.uk/product/sp ... ckage-deal which seems like a good deal at the moment with sliding carriage for tennoning.

Or perhaps the iTech ( looks identical to SIP one) http://www.scosarg.com/new-machines/spi ... -carr.html also looks good deal.

I don`t think the Record has tilting head, but the iTech does. How useful is the tilt mechanism ?

I will probably get little power feed for safety and smooth finish but I am not sure if the beds will need drilling and tapping (not really keen on drilling into a nice new machine bed) or if there is a standard pre drilled pattern for the feeds. ?
I can only use single phase at the moment.
If anyone has any useful knowledge/ advice about either of these machines I would appreciate it. Or of course another machine I have not considered.

Will these machines be powerful enough to mould 50mm rails etc. And tennon 50 to 60mm in one cut or will i need to sneak up on the tennons in a few passes.?
I have been looking on ebay for second hand as well but I don`t see many single phase units on there with much capacity. Also it is nice to have a warranty.
I have discounted the very small 1500w fox/ charnwood ones on the grounds of small tooling capacity and little power.

I have ordered the spindle moulder handbook, and may take a course if I can find one near to me.

All advice most welcome.

Thanks Ollie.

 

[woodman2]

pm sent- Woodman2

 

[Allylearm]

All the feed motors I have had are 3 phase, only differing part is amount of rollers they had.

All the Spindles I have used or setup came with predrilled holes. Spindles I had were Wadkin, Wilson, SCM, Martin. Have you considered second hand or is single phase only option to you.

 

[Ollie78]

Allylearm

I have considered second hand, you do seem to get more for your money. However at the moment single phase is my only option.

I have had a look at various options for phase converters but not being very good with electrics it has baffled me quite a bit, and will add more costs.

Thanks Ollie

 

[Giff]

Ollie
I have the single phase SIP which if it is the same as the iTech is very good. It's got plenty of power and the sliding table is really usefull for tenoning / scribing. The only suggestion I would have is the power feed. I looked at the smaller ones but after advice from this forum went for a Maggie Steff which is two speed and has a reverse ( essential for setting up ). The power feed adds a lot of accuracy and safety. The table is pre-drilled for the power feeder. Hope that helps Geoff

 

[MJ80]

Hi,
Where are you in the country? I have got the Trend stacked window tooling system at my workshop you could potentially make use of.

 

[Ollie78]

I am in Wiltshire, in the south . A bit far from Leeds unfortunately. Thanks for the offer though.

I am planning to use Whitehill cutters number 38 or 40 with corresponding scribes.
I am not sure whether to use a standard rebate cutter and run the tennons through one side then the other and then scribe separately (at least 3 passes). Or to use a pair of tennoning heads one with a square cutter and the other with a scribe cutter (obviously spaced for relevant mortice chisel) probably still doing it in a couple of passes.

Ollie

 

[Andy RV]

Don't let the three phase put you off secondhand machines, especially well build english cast iron examples, its worth doing abit more research before you wright it off.
Digital inverters are easily obtained now and offer many advantages over the older rotary and static converters, most digital inverters are available in 240v 1ph to 240v 3ph, so its important to look at the motor to see if it is dual voltage and can be run off 240v 3ph without any modifications. 240v 1ph to 415v 3ph digital inverters are available however they are quite a bit more expensive. The secondhand saving may only be small when you've added everything up compared to a new eastern machine but you should have a far superior machine.

 

[Giff]

Ollie
I use a Whitehill cutter set as well. I scribe and tenon at the same time and they have matched them up so it cuts the rebate shoulder as well.They are expensive but don't I think worth it especially if you have a lot to do as you have.You need the rebate cutter which can run with the profiling block at the same time but I don't think deep enough for the tenons. On my machine I have found it better to cut the tenons / scribe with a few gradual passes. Geoff

 

[graduate_owner]

Hi,
regarding 3-phase power inverters, as someone has pointed out they are now very competitively priced and give you the advantage of variable speed. Whilst this may not be useful on a spindle moulder (since I'm assuming you'll need the top speed available anyway) it could be useful on other machines. So you could end up saving a bit by getting other 3 phase machinery after buying a s/h moulder - just a thought.

I have a small (2 HP) inverter and am gradually replacing most of the motors in my workshop (I'm very much DIY, no way a Pro) with 3 phase - especially my 2 lathes.

If you feel concerned about wiring it up you could always ask a local sparky to set it up for you, but it's not difficult to do. They come with loads (as in hundreds) of parameters for setting things like time from switch on to full speed etc but there's often a 'default' setting which should more or less be suitable, and you probably won't need to alter these settings.

The only problem I have with mine is low torque at really slow speeds and I can't find a parameter setting for that. However I don't really need things that slow.

Finally, remember the bit about the 3 phase motor needing to be suitable - it should state that it can be connected in 'star' or 'delta' mode, and you need Delta.. See this link. http://www.drivesdirect.co.uk/Downloads/InvertertoMotorWiring.pdf

If you end up with a motor that is star only then you won't get the torque. I had one of these and had to get it rewired (about £40) so not such a problem.

Hope this helps.