Some advice on creating these joints.

[Risky Duckfeet]

As above, I've got a slide saw and guessing that that is the easiest way to cut the joint but in case anyone knows better I thought I'd ask. I'm a bit worried that the saw will not be accurate enough.

I've asked somewhere else and had some good answers but the most recent comment was; "There are obviously quicker methods but you need a good knowledge of machinery and a higher skill level than being able to use a sliding saw for those methods................dado cutters, wobble blades etc." Don't know if it was supposed to sound like that........
So what I really want to know is :- If 400 of these joints were being cut to order to make a cabin or similar, how would they be done.
- If I wanted an efficient way of cutting around 400 of these joints, assuming that I have a reasonable level of skill, how would I go about it?

Many thanks for any good advice that I may receive.

 

[jasonB]

There are specialist machines specifically for cutting these type of halving corner joints but thats for mass production.

By sliding saw I assume you mean a radial arm saw. You can nibble it away with a standard blade which will only remove about 3mm per pass or if you have the appropriate wide blade gaurd then a dado head or wobble saw can be used which will do a joint in 2-3 passes.

J

 

[Jacob]

Difficult to do with a spindle moulder as the workpieces have to be held vertically.
So a stacked dado set or wobble saw in a sliding table saw set up. Have to be set up carefully with plenty of protection. Won't fit most modern table saws as the arbors are too short.
Needs to have a no brake motor or the set can unscrew itself.

 

[Midlife]

If 400 of these joints were being cut to order to make a cabin or similar, how would they be done.
- If I wanted an efficient way of cutting around 400 of these joints, assuming that I have a reasonable level of skill, how would I go about it?

Many thanks for any good advice that I may receive.

how long is the wood :?: if not that long how about the router table with the correct size tooling.
it will save time.

Tony

 

[theartfulbodger]

how long is the wood :?: if not that long how about the router table with the correct size tooling.
it will save time.
Tony

I was thinking the same. Perhaps use a seperate table to hold the end of the wood if it's too long for the router table.

I made similar joints (out of rough reclaimed pine) for a compost bin :idea: and used a jigsaw/chisel. But my desired standard of finish was less than that required in a cabin build.

 

[Midlife]

if you go with the router table and you have long wood, at the support end i use two roller stands with a bit of wood resting on both rollers then put the wood to be routed on top of that.

Tony

 

[Rob Platt]

Is it 1/2" timber or 12" timber is it square or round as used for a cabin? You will get a better answer if we know the whole question.
All the best
Rob

 

[Shane]

You could always make a frame jig to hold, say, 20+ pieces at a time steady and run a router along removable fences either side of the router, and just adjust the blade depth for the cheeks and top/btm cuts. If you use a sliding saw with a 3mm kerf, it will work ok, but you'll be hacked right off after 400 joints :lol:

 

[Eric The Viking]

How complex is this joint? The image doesn't look as though it actually fits together well at all.

Do you intend two U-shaped half-height notches (one upside down) that fit over each other, or is it more complicated. Is there a second cutaway, to one side or underneath (on top, for the mating piece). Yes, I do appreciate this is intended to make frames that stack, but otherwise I can't make out the drawing you posted.

Can you just show the two pieces separately?

Thanks,

E.

 

[theartfulbodger]

possibly similarish to these

http://donaldsonloghomes.com/Log_Homes_ ... _Homes.php

 

[Eric The Viking]

possibly similarish to these

http://donaldsonloghomes.com/Log_Homes_ ... _Homes.php

Yes but none of those match the original picture (and what is 'spliced' anyway? You do that to ropes!)

 

[Shane]

Eric, I see at this (please excuse my terrible sketch) although I haven't shown the shoulder detail. I can see the benefit of this method in that you dont have to scribe the flutes into the bottom of the cutout in the same way as the pics in the link

 

[theartfulbodger]

Yes but none of those match the original picture (and what is 'spliced' anyway? You do that to ropes!)

only trying to help :?

I wonder if the word spliced has a different meaning in American English?

 

[ondablade]

I'd imagine that there's kit made for doing this job in even moderate quantities (the 400 or so listed?), maybe even DIY. Some of the US house building mag websites would be worth a search given their focus on the use of timber. e.g. Fine Homebuilding. This is I think a sister publication to Fine Woodworking, and may well have an option to subscribe and search back issues.

Something you could bring to the wood rather than the reverse sounds desirable given the issues of handling long timbers. It's not that obvious (to me anyway) how you could set up stock woodworking equipment (e.g. dado or rebate cutters - whether on a saw or a spindle) to do that sort of joint without needing several cuts - which if true would introduce more handling and possible accuracy issues.

Failing there being something ready made and portable available at DIY feasible cost maybe something like a chain morticer would form a basis for a cost effective method: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UfsYGC92 ... re=related and here: http://www.mafell.com/produkte/prod_fraesen_i.htm - I think there's even track systems and and clamp on mountings available that might make it a lot easier....

 

[jasonB]

As I said at the start of teh thread there are specific machines to do these corner joints and more complex forms but they cost tens of thousands, something like a Stromab Auto Blox is whats used, heres one in action

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V2KVgLQSae8&NR=1

I've put up a couple of these shed/summer houses and the corner joints are nothing more than a halving joint, so a radial arm (sliding saw?) or even a SCMS with trenching facility if you can get the blade high enough will do.

JAson

 

[Shane]

What size are the sections, the top pic looks to me smaller than cabin stuff, looks like 21mm x 44mm judging by the grain?

If it is small section I would still go for router and jig, if larger stuff SCMS trench cut intermittantly and chisel out the waste

 

[jumps]

this is almost one of those jobs where you could finish with most methods before you agreed how is the best way to do it!

sitting here surrounded by 110x44 'logged' walls I would assume that's roughly the size you are looking at, clearly nowadays it's going to be between 28 and 64 (ish).

as someone has already pointed out, moving the tool is probably going to be easier than moving the stock given likely lengths - but I'm assuming again.

the idea world solution has been pointed out

I don't think accuracy is the problem with the solution you have at all - simply going to be a long process cutting as many at a time as you can and making your call as to the compromise between how many cuts and how much chisel work

Whilst a router jig is possible you are going to be taking out a huge amount of waste, and will need to make quite deep cuts. Not impossible but on balance I agree with Shane's post above. The router solution could well be better suited to the shallow cuts necessary to the sides, which would also suit a simple jig after top and bottom cuts with the saw.

 

[Risky Duckfeet]

Sorry, should have thought more about the first post. Here is a Sketchup image of a single piece, cut.

The lengths range from 244mm to 5200mm. The reason for the 2mm rebate on either side of the joint is so that the "logs" sit into each other hopefully meaning less draughts getting through and hopefully, a cleaner looking joint. Also it is double tongue and groove but didn't put that on the model.
The saw that I have is a Bosch GCM12 SD, I have a router but not to confident with it yet and would rather practise using it on a cheaper project.
What does SCMS stand for if nobody minds me asking?
Hopefully got everything in there. Thanks for all the help so far and if anyone can think of a better or more sensable joint then I won't take offence.
Thanks

 

[Shane]

Your Bosch is a scms - sliding compound mitre saw

 

[barkwindjammer]

A 'saddle' type jig and a router, you could route say, 6 at a time ?