nosuchhounds
Established Member
Im looking to add a shoulder plane to my setup but just wondering which size would be best suited for all purpose work?
Shoulder planes, which one?
- Thread starter nosuchhounds
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Jacob
What goes around comes around.
If not sure then the Stanley 78 makes a cheap and good general purpose plane including shoulders.
None - a moving fillister (a wooden one, not a stanley 78. the 78 is a construction plane) and a good rabbet plane is a lot more practical. Anything that you'd cut with a shoulder plane is something that should probably have been marked a little more cleanly and cut to the mark with a chisel. Any error from that should be below normal glue lines. As in, will disappear when glued and finished.
If you're in England, you're probably in the place with the best opportunity in the world to get a good boxed moving filister (for a reasonable price) and set it up.
If you're in England, you're probably in the place with the best opportunity in the world to get a good boxed moving filister (for a reasonable price) and set it up.
Medium, can do most things. For delicate small stuff a small if that’s what you mainly do.
He’s asking for a shoulder plane, which is used to square off tenons and alike. He’s not asking for a plane to cut rebates.
He’s asking for a shoulder plane, which is used to square off tenons and alike. He’s not asking for a plane to cut rebates.
thetyreman
Established Member
I don't have a shoulder plane, and have managed without one so far, I use a knifewall and chisel to cut away the waste, you just get used to it eventually, I never really undercut shoulders anymore, it's more of a feel thing you need to practise, and you'll see improvements if you put the work in.
Jacob
What goes around comes around.
78 good for shoulders too if sharp enough. A lot cheaper than a "shoulder" plane, and other uses too.
Argus
Established Member
I know which I would recommend (and why), but it will engender nothing other than disagreement here - however, you are welcome to send me a PM.
Anyway, when you have arrived at the shoulder-plane-of-your-choice, you will need to take the next logical step...... and you have already assembled the attention of all the varying expertise you need on keeping the thing sharp!
Good luck!
Anyway, when you have arrived at the shoulder-plane-of-your-choice, you will need to take the next logical step...... and you have already assembled the attention of all the varying expertise you need on keeping the thing sharp!
Good luck!
rabbet planes will cut a shoulder that's too high for some reason, work straight up in a vise and not laying down.
Shoulder planes are a tool for adjustment of really large shoulders, and people tend to also try to use them to clean rebates thinking they're somehow more accurate than a good rabbet plane.
My point about the moving fillister is that a moving fillister and a rabbet plane will cost about the same as a shoulder if there's a burning desire to spend the cost of a shoulder plane, but you'll have something far more practical if the point is using hand tools.
Using a shoulder plane to cut shoulders can be tedious and inaccurate and if the point is woodworking, it's sort of going backwards.
Everyone is different and there are many ways of doing things. My use of and understanding of the principle use of a shoulder plane is that its not to cut shoulders. A tenon done my hand has the shoulders typically cut with a saw and the waste removed either by saw or chisel. Typically pairing chisels are used to adjust the fit of the tenon checks and the shoulder plane is used to remove minute whiskers off the tenon cheeks to adjust the fit so that there is no gap. The plane (say a Clifton which is a typical tradition design ) has a very tight mouth and can only take very small amounts off.
I have the record 708 and cannot image using it to finesse a tenon on anything other than carpentry type work. I make the distinction between that and Joinery work, or cabinetry.
I have the record 708 and cannot image using it to finesse a tenon on anything other than carpentry type work. I make the distinction between that and Joinery work, or cabinetry.
Jacob
What goes around comes around.
I've got Record 073 and 042 I assume they are called a shoulder planes because they are for trimming shoulders. That's what I use them for anyway! Basically a finishing cut after a chisel etc
Also for trimming tenons but a 78 is good too. A bit "general purpose".
rogxwhit
Established Member
For furniture and joinery I'm a devotee of accurate marking out and cutting to the line with a 14pt backsaw ... and that's it.
Jacob
What goes around comes around.
Well yes thats the way to do it! But they often seem to need a little trim!
Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)
Established Member
I think that the question to be asked is what you believe a shoulder plane is best used for ... what use you plan for it? Otherwise you get a bunch of biased answers.
Regards from Perth
Derek
nosuchhounds
Established Member
I have a 78 already so will try cleaning up tenons with that I just felt that a shoulder plane would help finnesse them
rogxwhit
Established Member
Or concentrate on stock preparation, accurate marking, and sawing to a line ... ;-)
the 78 is a hogging plane - it's intended for relatively coarse work establishing rebates and it's not a terribly stable plane, nor are the irons or original replacements for it very hard. I think you'll find it difficult to use as a shoulder plane on anything smaller than house-sized joinery.
It's a site plane with a relatively coarse finish - referenced a lot in the last 50 years more or less just because it was available and still made.
I think if you really want a shoulder plane to try, buy something in the "medium" territory, or look until you find an older preston for a good price. Mind the cost you pay and the proven recent sale prices on ebay so that when you decide it's not that practical day to day, you have the option to sell.
I had two shoulder planes - no longer have them, but I do have a norris shoulder plane that i almost never use - like once every five years at the very most. Not to use, but because it might be interesting to make one just like it at some point.
Jacob
What goes around comes around.
It's useful only in the absence of a real moving fillister, which is a more accurate and far faster working (no friction) plane that's easier to set up properly with the nicker, and with a better depth stop.
78s and sargent's decorative version here were so cheap at one point that I had three. I still have a stanley 249 or whatever the skew version is.
Living in England where a moving fillister is plentiful, there's no practical need for a 78 or record's version of the same.
Both stanley and sargent versions had very soft blades - something that is done on purpose, often on site work tools.
Even worse than a 78 is buying a very cheap 78 without a fence, nicker and depth stop thinking that those can always be found later. There are more planes without those parts than there are parts.
Hornbeam
Established Member
Shoulder planes do a lot more than just tidy up tennon shoulders/cheeks. While a 78 will also do a lot of things it is nowhere near as sophisticated and delicate to use. I have a couple of old infill planes a record 73 and a medium veritas. The old planes work very well once you know how to adjust with just a wedge and small hammer. I find the 073 a bit large and the veritas is my go to. i know not everybody likes the little knobs/handles but I do.
One comment is that unless you can get a really good sharp edge you will not get a true feel as to how they perform
One comment is that unless you can get a really good sharp edge you will not get a true feel as to how they perform
I'm curious re: what the other items are. They're generally designed to be laid flat on their side, grabbed with both hands and pulled from the edges toward the center on end grain.
There are a lot of things that they do, but the trouble is that in almost every case, something simpler is far more efficient.
