Setting up a plane

[Sgian Dubh]

Moving on to a separate issue, those Faithfull planes always seem to be hit and miss when it comes to quality and usability, and in my experience, they're almost always pretty ropey without a great deal of fiddling and correcting of manufacturing faults. Some I've come across have been so ropey they really weren't worth effort trying to get them to work.

In this instance, I noticed some photographs showed quite a large build up of ragged wood shavings trapped at the cutting edge of the iron or blade. This might indicate the meeting point between the cap iron or chip breaker and the blade is either gappy or the the leading edge of the cap iron has been ground in such a way that its front edge sits up from the blade. Both these faults lead to shavings getting trapped as in the photographs. However, that's only one potential issue, and being Faithfull planes I suspect there are a few more faults needing correction.

I suspect lee1596 might be best to find someone who knows their way around planes if he can to help him learn given his earlier admission that he knows very little about them. Slainte.

 

[lee1596]

With respect, whatever plane you own, you really need to understand how it works to get the best out of it - whether or not it's currently set up in a 'useable' state! Once you understand how a plane is supposed to work, you can 'fine tune' any plane...

Unfortunately it's very hard to learn when you don't have a working tool. There's no way to know if it's a you problem or a tool problem so you can't fix your technique. Anyway I've had someone else try it and there are casting issues, and nothing will stay in place when adjusted anyway, even when used by someone competent.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I like it when my tools are first class and properly fettled - when things don't go right there's only one thing left at fault ...

 

[Adam W.]

You're being a very naughty boy making a provocative post like that. Slainte.

I'm sorry.

 

[ajs]

I'm surprised from my quick skim of this thread that no one has mentioned it... Is the sole flat? Take a steel rule and hold it against the sole and hold it to the light. A plane isn't precision engineered so you would not expect the line between plane and ruler to be light tight, but if there is any discernable gap along the length that is where the problem is.

The symptoms you describe fit a concave sole, try taking some fine shavings from the middle of a timber instead of from the end. If you can do that you know where the problem is. You can flatten the sole but it is possibly many hours of elbow grease; if that is the problem and you are in the returns window I'd simply send it back.

 

[lee1596]

I'm surprised from my quick skim of this thread that no one has mentioned it... Is the sole flat? Take a steel rule and hold it against the sole and hold it to the light. A plane isn't precision engineered so you would not expect the line between plane and ruler not to be light tight, but if there is any discernable gap along the length that is where the problem is.

The symptoms you describe fit a concave sole, try taking some fine shavings from the middle of a timber instead of from the end. If you can do that you know where the problem is. You can flatten the sole but it is possibly many hours of elbow grease; if that is the problem and you are in the returns window I'd simply send it back.

I suspect it isn't fully flat. It's already boxed up and a return started. I had an old 19th century 22 inch wooden jointing plane turn up (really cheap off ebay, even jf it didn't work it was too good to ignore at the time) and after a half arsed attempt at sharpening and my 1st attempt at setting the blade in place it's already taking fantastic shavings. It's too big to do most ordinary jobs but it's nice to know I'm not going crazy and I can use a plane.

 

[Sgian Dubh]

I'm sorry.

I forgive you, not for your original act of naughtiness, you understand, but for trying to buy my forgiveness and mollify me with a 'cute' kitten picture. Allegedly cute kittens don't make me all weak at the knees, or gooey and soppy. Slainte.

 

[Jameshow]

I forgive you, not for your original act of naughtiness, you understand, but for trying to buy my forgiveness and mollify me with a 'cute' kitten picture. Allegedly cute kittens don't make me all weak at the knees, or gooey and soppy. Slainte.

Not like freehand sharpening does!

 

[Keith Cocker]

As Jacob said right at the beginning of the thread Faithful planes have an iffy reputation. When I was restarting woodworking I bought a couple new not wanting to spend too much money in case I didn’t carry on with the hobby. I had exactly the same experience as you. I spent a lot of time and read a lot to try to get them up and running but eventually gave up and threw them in the scrap bin at the tip. I have a mixture of Axminster, Veritas and Lie Nielsen now. The Axminster are good and reasonably priced even if the other two brands are a bit ouch. Good luck

 

[spanner48]

1: It sounds as if the front of the blade is not being adequately supported by the frog. So, when it starts to 'bite' the surface, it bends downwards under the thrust from the wood. That will cause jamming. Check the frog's alignment - both horizontally and vertically. Make sure the blade is in contact with the frog IMMEDIATELY behind its sharpened edge. Also check that the frog is securely bolted down to the plane base, and that there is no roundness or rocking play in the frog's own mounting.

2: Check and sharpen the counter-iron. It should be sharpened on the bottom face and edge, at an angle such that the front edge clamps onto the plane blade BEFORE any other part touches. Also, put a very slight rounding into the sharpening, so the counter-iron clamps most strongly and intimately onto the blade in the centre. Only then will it produce nice curly shavings.

I restore and renovate classic Stanley and Record planes. It is a suprise how many come to me with shavings and chips stuffed into the gap between the blade and the counter-iron.

 

[pe2dave]

2: Check and sharpen the counter-iron. It should be sharpened on the bottom face and edge, at an angle such that the front edge clamps onto the plane blade BEFORE any other part touches.

Counter iron! A new one on me. Tks @spanner48
Is cap iron more usual in the UK?

 

[spanner48]

Counter iron! A new one on me. Tks @spanner48
Is cap iron more usual in the UK?

Can be confused with the lever cap iron.

 

[Sgian Dubh]

Not like freehand sharpening does!

Oh, that can make me positively moist with excitement, ha, ha. Slainte.

 

[Sgian Dubh]

Counter iron! A new one on me. Tks @spanner48
Is cap iron more usual in the UK?

Counter iron is a new one on me too, but I can see the logic. Back when I started in the 1960s (I was only a kid then) the terminology I was taught and I've used ever since was cap iron. Later I became aware that some people called the cap iron the chip breaker: I think that came mostly from the Americans, but I can't be sure of that.

I've never heard of the lever cap iron before either, it always having been the the lever cap to me so very unlikely to be confused with a cap iron.

Always interesting is the variations in terminology people use for the same thing - confusing too sometimes. Slainte.

 

[Adam W.]

Wars have been fought over less.

Anyway, I'm still waiting to find out what the true one way to sharpening nirvana is.

 

[profchris]

Anyway, I'm still waiting to find out what the true one way to sharpening nirvana is.

I thought everyone knew that you place the blade under a pyramid at new moon so that the etheric vibrations can reshape the edge to ultimate sharpness.

Blade angle is determined by orientation to the applicable holy city (see manual, terms and conditions apply).

 

[Orraloon]

I thought everyone knew that you place the blade under a pyramid at new moon so that the etheric vibrations can reshape the edge to ultimate sharpness.

Blade angle is determined by orientation to the applicable holy city (see manual, terms and conditions apply).

If only it were that simple.
Regards
John

 

[Sgian Dubh]

Wars have been fought over less.

Anyway, I'm still waiting to find out what the true one way to sharpening nirvana is.

I too am waiting, but I'll maybe just have to give up. Slainte.

 

[Woody2Shoes]

Unfortunately it's very hard to learn when you don't have a working tool. There's no way to know if it's a you problem or a tool problem so you can't fix your technique. Anyway I've had someone else try it and there are casting issues, and nothing will stay in place when adjusted anyway, even when used by someone competen

It's good that you've got a "plane-buddy" - a great way to short-circuit the learning curve is definitely to get someone who knows how to set up a plane to show you how to do it. There's no substitute for you understanding how to make a plane, whichever one you end up with, work properly, though.
In the absence of a plane buddy, youtube videos can help e.g. this one isn't too bad:

 

[Phil Pascoe]

I too am waiting, but I'll maybe just have to give up. Slainte.

We have a member who'll be happy to lead you to enlightenment.