Scroll saw recommendations

[Peter907]

I would like to buy a scroll saw, though I've never used one before. After some practice I'd eventually like to make wooden clock type mechanisms and other small moving things with cogs etc. I've scoured reviews online, but entry level machines come with both good and bad reports. In order to fully enjoy this new interest, I feel that I'd prefer to use a machine with minimal noise and vibration, and a foot pedal switch seems really convenient to me. To get started, I'd like to keep the price below £250. I am currently erring towards a Charnwood SS16F, mainly because it has a foot pedal. I don't really need the other bells and whistles like the lamp or rotary tool, since I already have very good work lights and a Dremel.
Can anyone please provide recommendations for machines that might best suit my needs.

 

[Peter907]

In fact, thinking about it, I don't even need one with a foot pedal. I have some radio controlled remote smart plugs which are great for switching on dust extraction. I'm sure I could modify a remote switch into a foot pedal so I wouldn't even need the extra cable.

 

[AES]

@Peter907 Plenty of guidance within the "stickies" (i.e. posts fixed at the top of the Scroll Saw section), amongst others, "Why pay more ......?" a post and other info by a very experienced Scroller called scrimper.

Unfortunately, you will NOT buy a good new machine withing your budget - we're talking brands like Hegner, Excalibur/Pegas, etc, etc, which will cost, in round figures, 3 times your budget. But the machine you mention WILL do the job. Look at the above sticky, and do a search within the section and you'll find out what the differences are, and what machines others have chosen.

ALSO, do a Google search of Youtube where you'll find some excellent videos about making wooden clocks, including some plans you can purchase.

Good luck.

 

[Peter907]

Thanks @AES as with most things it seems I need to spend more money . £250 is my budget at the moment, so I'll have to dip my toe in at that level, and if the bug really bites, I will have learned exactly what I need from, and why I need a substantially more expensive machine, and will then be more inclined to spend.

I have viewed Scrimpers very useful "Why pay more" videos and others of his, and will search this forum for more info. Will also be looking for more clockmaking videos and searching out some plans, as per your advice thank you.

In the meantime, if anyone here would care to reply with any experiences, good or bad, with budget scroll saws, that would be very useful to help narrow down my search.

 

[ajs]

You're in the same boat I found myself a few months back. There is a bit of a gap between the sub £200 machines and better models from £500 up. Obviously I have only seen a sample but the cheaper machines struck me as being much of a muchness whether is a £60-70 machine from Aldi or Lidl or a £160 model from Machine Mart. Any saw vibrates, it's in their nature, the only solution is mounting. Ideally that's bolting to a solid bench but F clamping to a workmate works almost as well.

Used is the obvious alternative, if you are not in a hurry or are willing to travel you can get good deals since people can't be bothered shipping them. It you are willing to wait the likes of a good Hegner often go for as little as £100 on eBay, perhaps £150 for variable speed. There are also a few older brands which are well respected but get forgotten about, Diamond and Meddings come to mind.

Me? I picked up a Diamond in April or May for £130. Can't speak too highly of it. Compared to new machines in that price range you simply have that "feel" of a good tool rather than rubbish built to a price. I chose the Diamond partly on reputation, partly because I dreamed of owning one 30 years ago as a kid , and also the sheer power and ability to take coping and hacksaw blades make it a lot more flexible than the typical scroll saw.

Looking on the bay now I see a lot of three Diamonds about 50 miles from you, one working with the stand and chair (which some really value) and two for spares. Personally it's the white one there that catches my eye if you can get it working by swapping parts - it's a late model 25", the later ones supposedly have a modified mechanism that mostly eliminates vibration. I expect the price will jump in the last few minutes there, it difficult to value because of the chair. Personally I'd disregard the spares machines for value and if it goes for perhaps £210 or less that's a good deal.

 

[powertools]

To be honest before you will be able to make clocks and other gears you will need a lot of practice and you may even find that you don't enjoy it.
An expensive machine is no guarantee that you will get good results.

 

[AES]

FWIW, personally I agree with powertools above. Just about any scroll saws WILL do the job you want, but a LOT - an awful lot actually - depends on your skills. You will need to practice a lot to be able to cut gears accurately, and accuracy more than just any other factor is what you need for any sort of meshing gears, especially for clocks.

BUT, the difference between the say, up to 200 quid machine and the over, say, 500 quid machine lies more in the general convenience of use, speed/convenience of blade changing, the effectiveness of the device to clear sawdust from the cut line, how easy/hard it is to adjust the machine to ensure you cut at EXACTLY at 90 degrees, and the "general feel" of using the machine. If you read my own posts on the subject "Biting the bullet ..... ", and others by several other members, you'll see I opted for an expensive machine (an Excalibur 21 in my case), and others have chosen similarly, both with Excalibur/Pegas, and Hegner, and in at least one case Delta (but that via SH sourcers because the American Delta isn't imported into UK). But in my case - and that of many others - decisions like that were made only AFTER I had used a total of 3 cheapo machines over a period of about 20 years, on and off. And each was probably a step up from the previous.

But again echoing powertools above, NONE of these, including my present machine (which I regard as "THE Rolls-Royce") actually directly improved my skills, In fact when newly bought I had to start practising a bit again on each one of them!

Hence my suggestion for looking at vids of cutting gears, and/or of clock making generally. And add general scroll sawing exercises too - Examples: can you cut a dead straight line? Or split a pencil line thickness consistently down the middle?

You'll find a number of items there demonstrating various techniques, some of which will probably help you along, some will probably not fit the personal technique you develop so well.

All that brings us back to the same basic point again - only by practising those different techniques will you develop enough of your own skills to decide what works really well for you, what not so much.

But your plan will be a fascinating adventure, and you'll learn a lot. I wish you well.

I see you only joined back in June, so a belated welcome to the Forum. Please keep us "posted" (sorry!) on how you get on.

 

[Adam W.]

I bought a second hand Hegner 2s for £260 delivered off ebay. It may be from 2002, but it has seen little use and I think it was very good value.

 

[AES]

I'm completely out of touch with UK prices Adam, but from what I know of Hegner prices, I would say you got a bargain mate.

@Peter907: there's a good point here. If you're not in a hurry, there ARE good S/H machines to be had at decent prices. They even come up here from time to time.

HTH

 

[eribaMotters]

I taught Technology in a secondary school for 35 years and we went through many different makes of Scroll saw. One name stands out and that is Hegner. Most saws lasted 2, 3 years at best, but some of the Hegners I'd ordered were still going strong after 15 years of teenage abuse.
Find a good second hand one and you will not regret it.

Colin

 

[Sandyn]

I got a 4 speed Meddings cast iron Scroll saw for £50. It required a wee bit of work to get it working well. I couldn't resist a classic name for that money. I'm not sure if they were good machines in their day. It works very well with good blades, I found that scrolling is quite difficult to do well. Not really my interest, but it's handy to have for occasional work.

 

[ajs]

Just noticed this one on ebay. I don't have any experience of Delta myself but I know people do rate them. £155 buy it now with the stand - it's not a give away but I'd say its a good deal. In Nottingham so looks quite handy for the OP too. Only thing I would look into is that switch looks suspiciously like an NVR to me. Normally that is a good thing but it does complicate things if you want to retrofit a foot switch.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/314091054251

 

[Mr Christopher]

As has already been commented a s/h Hegner would be my advice. I did just that after researching like you are doing now.

 

[AES]

Just noticed this one on ebay. I don't have any experience of Delta myself but I know people do rate them. £155 buy it now with the stand - it's not a give away but I'd say its a good deal. In Nottingham so looks quite handy for the OP too. Only thing I would look into is that switch looks suspiciously like an NVR to me. Normally that is a good thing but it does complicate things if you want to retrofit a foot switch.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/314091054251

To add to that, there's a member here, Lofty Hermes I think is his name (do a search), who has several Delta scroll saws, and he likes them a LOT! Definitely at least worth checking out IMO, though I don't know these machines myself.

 

[loftyhermes]

Yes, I would recommend the Delta saws, (well remembered AES), they are heavy cast machines, I can use mine on a workmate not fastened down and it not move. I have and still use one that I bought in the mid 90's, a type 2, 40-560, 2 speed, I also have a 40-540 variable speed as back up. The model linked to on ebay above is a 40-570, all these saws have the Quickset blade clamps, fitted on the top arm but the 40-570 had them on the bottom as well. A word of caution though, check that the clamps do work as spares for these machines are rare but the clamps are rarer than hens teeth.
But as has been said before, experience is more important than the machine, and blade choice is an important factor as well.

 

[AES]

@Peter907: To add to Lofty's post above, re blade choice, if you haven't looked already, there's another sticky at the top of this Section giving info on blade/s to choose, and possible sources.

HTH

 

[Peter907]

I'm may have found a good secondhand Hegner 2s. What are your thoughts on this model? Does anyone know if this is a variable speed model?

 

[ajs]

I'm may have found a good secondhand Hegner 2s. What are your thoughts on this model? Does anyone know if this is a variable speed model?

It's one of the classic models that people aspire to own. Determining variable speed is tricky with Hegners, if there's a V suffix on the model number you know it is variable speed but it often gets dropped so it's absence doesn't mean it isn't. In short you need to check with the seller but it could be either.

Hegner's current range below for reference.
https://www.hegner.co.uk/products/machine-tools/scrollsaws.html

 

[Adam W.]

Mine's a fixed speed 2s, but I find it OK to use, although I don't do fine inlay or marquetry which I think I would do by hand anyway.

 

[Peter907]

Thanks @AES that blade post will be very useful .

Thanks @ajs still waiting for a reply about the exact details.

Assuming this is the basic single speed model, might that give me any limitations worth considering as a scroll saw newbie?

I was originally considering a brand new entry level scroll saw for a maximum budget of £250, but everyone here is steering me towards a better quality machine . So I'm taking in your advice, while seeking out a bargain and trying to get the right deal for me as a keen, but newly inspired woodworker. This secondhand Hegner 2s satisfies that budget, is clean looking and fully working. Perhaps this is the best way for me to go to embark on a new learning curve that will be enjoyable and satisfying.