Rutlands Warning!

[akirk]

I hope those who are making certain comments in a public forum are sure that they have the evidence to back them - wouldn't want to see them being sued for libel

each person can only speak accurately to their own experience, but we have a variety of experiences being posted on here - as I mentioned above, I have never had an issue and always had good speedy correspondence with customer services at Rutland. I totally get that others may not, but there may be a number of reasons as to why, and ultimately as a consumer buying online you have a swathe of consumer law protecting you, so use it - not sure that it is appropriate to publicly post threads slating a company - it is clear from the amount of business they are doing that something must be right - and despite the cynicism which claims that it is all new purchasers - I (and I am sure many others) have bought many times from them

As individuals we have the right to choose where we shop, but we don't have the right to tell the shops how we want them to behave - if they are not being illegal, then it is up to them - our rights are limited to choosing to not shop there. This modern approach of telling a supplier that you want to shop there and then telling them how you want to do it is as arrogant as others are claiming the supplier to be

I buy from all sorts of suppliers and I make my own judgement about them and whether I will return, my prerogative to choose where to spend my money, but I don't get to tell businesses how to run their business (well I do in my job and they pay me, but that is another story!)

 

[thetyreman]

they can't sue anyone, I think they are using fake names and posting fake reviews, I knew when they were fake when I saw that the day they launched a new product on every single one there was automatically two 5 star reviews immediately, this could be proven in court using the internet archive tool, nobody bought the product within 10 seconds of it launching on the website, recieved it and gave a 4 or 5 star review, it would be a few days before the product arrives, just use your common sense.

 

[southendwoodworker]

As individuals we have the right to choose where we shop, but we don't have the right to tell the shops how we want them to behave - if they are not being illegal, then it is up to them - our rights are limited to choosing to not shop there. This modern approach of telling a supplier that you want to shop there and then telling them how you want to do it is as arrogant as others are claiming the supplier to be

The original poster wasn't telling them how to behave, only expressing their recent frustrations with the company. You are correct, there is no right to tell them how to behave, and the example given in the original post, they do seem to be fobbing off responsibility against consumer protection laws and acting illegally (in the posters original unique circumstance). The blamed the courier company (the customer has no relationship with the courier company) and I am assuming trying to get the original poster to approach courier for a solution - which is against consumer protection laws. The simple thing is - Rutlands have the legal responsibility of resolving the issue by either refunding, repairing or replacing - and their customer service, in this circumstance, was poor.

Also, isn't is wise for a company to accept feedback from the customers and aspire to do better? Of course they don't have to, but isn't that something that companies should be doing?

 

[johna.clements]

I just got one now from BenchDogs, you can get a half price rail square with your rail square.

and a half price 400mm t square when you buy a 600mm. How many people want both or would make do with one or the other.

 

[johna.clements]

Perhaps they have a filter which blocks anything less! The laws of probability tell you that you will always get a negative even if it is not justified because there are so many factors involved and people will blame the supplier for their own shortcomings.

I saw a review recently on screwfix where someone was complaining about their new tracksaw. The splinter guard clashed with the blade out of the box so they gave it one star.

Fake reviews (or ones like the one above) are very common both good and bad. I would not believe the reviews if there was not a range, but that does not necessarily mean that the product is good or bad but it does make you wonder.

 

[Spectric]

How many people want both or would make do with one or the other.

But maybe if two people wanted something in one of the deals they could collaborate and both save money, ie a carpenters square for half price.

I saw a review recently on screwfix where someone was complaining about their new tracksaw. The splinter guard clashed with the blade out of the box so they gave it one star.

That is what I mean, that review is pointless and worthless, not to mention how safe is it letting that sort of muppet loose with a saw, perhaps when he removes a couple of his digits he will blame everyone else for that as well.

 

[akirk]

The original poster wasn't telling them how to behave, only expressing their recent frustrations with the company. You are correct, there is no right to tell them how to behave, and the example given in the original post, they do seem to be fobbing off responsibility against consumer protection laws and acting illegally (in the posters original unique circumstance). The blamed the courier company (the customer has no relationship with the courier company) and I am assuming trying to get the original poster to approach courier for a solution - which is against consumer protection laws. The simple thing is - Rutlands have the legal responsibility of resolving the issue by either refunding, repairing or replacing - and their customer service, in this circumstance, was poor.

Also, isn't is wise for a company to accept feedback from the customers and aspire to do better? Of course they don't have to, but isn't that something that companies should be doing?

Appreciate that - however, there is often an easy bandwagon people like to get on, and there seems to be one regarding rutlands with people slating them online - every time it happens others say that they have only had good interaction, yet it is the negative that remains - the reality is that they must deal with 100s / 1000s of people a year, and yes they will screw up some times, but probably not the majority of the time - and yes, they should sort it out - but wouldn't it be a better outcome if the original poster simply dealt with it directly with Rutlands rather than deciding that this is so important that their only contribution to the forum is to warn everyone off Rutlands? I have no particular affiliation with them, but I don't like the modern habit of using the online space to air dirty laundry - I think it is often lazy and inappropriate. Yes, you are right, consumer law supports the poster (assuming of course that their side of the story is accurate ), in which case all they need to do is send the customer services email address a simple email stating:
- what happened
- the law covering it
- what needs to be resolved
- how they would like to see it be resolved
job done - most companies given that would simply do it...

it is relatively simple and easy to do - why take the additional effort to come and rubbish a company online?

regarding reviews that others mention - it is very easy to set software to only show positive reviews - e.g. only show 4* and above - huge numbers of organisations do that, does anyone really believe the blurb on the back of a book or the comments about a film? They extract what is positive and show it...

if that is what they are doing, well it of course tells us something more about them as an organisation, where a more accurate portrayal of reviews might give us a different impression, you observe, analyse and decide whether to do business with them - however it is up to them to choose how to run their business, if someone doesn't like it, they can go elsewhere - after all if a part of the claim about rutlands is that they simply badge items from china, then it shouldn't be hard to buy those items elsewhere!

if the customer experience is bad, then let them know - if they don't care, don't buy there again...
if you don't get what you ordered, inform them, let them sort it out and if not - take them to the small claims court - it is why we have a process, and it is a good process.
but posting negative comments about a company online (esp. when the OP is not an active member of the community, so it is not someone telling their mates to be careful), is not appropriate

 

[johna.clements]

But maybe if two people wanted something in one of the deals they could collaborate and both save money, ie a carpenters square for half price.


That is what I mean, that review is pointless and worthless, not to mention how safe is it letting that sort of muppet loose with a saw, perhaps when he removes a couple of his digits he will blame everyone else for that as well.

Collaboration is a good idea to make use second item at reduced price deals. But it would be better if it you had a choice from a list of second items. What I have bought from Benchdogs has been very well made.

I was a bit surprised that the person did not read the instructions when they did not understand something before going into print (or electrons).

 

[Phil Pascoe]

A lot of reviews are a joke. As above, a one star because the courier was a day late etc. The worst I've seen was for a very good chainsaw given one star because it was delivered with no petrol in it.

 

[carry book]

I have had Rutland stuff some time ago now, but I give them a wide berth nowadays, IMHO their stuff is rubbish

 

[Jake]

Just have to search on here and the ratio of bad CS stories compared to others is fact. Personally used them quite a few times a long time ago with no complaints when the stuff was delivered fine, then had two transactions where there were issues with damaged product, very sour and terrible customer service leaving me out of pocket, and wouldn't and haven't touched them with a bargepole since. As for the idea of them suing anyone for libel about bad CS, see first sentence.

 

[Bob008]

I have only had good service and very fast delivery and good prices from Rutlands.

I would be interested to know from the above responses what people's expectations are built on - what size company do people think they are? one man, a dog and a tin shack in cornwall, or a behemoth stretching across the globe?!

A benefit of the internet is that you can present your business however you wish, and as long as you can back it up then that is fine - but equally it can be a weakness in that the punter can't always understand the nature of the business they are dealing with - if you walk into a shop you can tell whether it is run by husband and wife on a shoe string / is part of a multi-national chain / is somewhere in-between, but a website is tricky to read.

Looking at their company accounts for last year makes interesting reading:
- owned by husband and wife
- employing a further 9 people (2 more than the previous year)
- c. 2.5m of stock
- c. 600k cash in the bank (plus a further 1.8m in cash owed to their suppliers / tax man, but cash is there for it, just pre-accounted.)
- equity value of c. 3.4m
- £110k of £138k in value of assets is in motor vehicles
- they paid over 500k in tax
- their property is leased from another business they own with investment properties valued at 2.5m

How does this read then?
A successful business which is making them some serious money - a very slim operation with minimum overheads, a slick website, overall - a company I would be proud to own, if we were advising them professionally, there is little change we would / could advise.

So, what about customer service? They have removed the ability to phone them, however I am sure they worked out the logic behind that - and while for some people it is not ideal, using email allows a business to track the communication etc. they have other options for communication and when I have emailed them I have had a fast response. I don't know what balance of staff they use for fulfillment / customer service / buying etc. and I am sure that there are times when they get it wrong, but people are very quick to post negative comments about businesses and that is what others see - they have sent out over 1m parcels since starting c. 13 years ago so on average they are sending out 300 parcels a day (or assuming it is ramping up over time, presumably many more than that now) - I suspect that their ratio of getting it right to wrong is pretty good.

As for the complaints about quality of what they sell, or that you can buy the same elsewhere for less / re-badged / etc. - sorry, but those are pointless complaints! there is a simple answer, don't buy from them - buy from China if you want to, if you want the hassle of dealing with companies not regulated under UK law, with hassles if you wish to return goods, if you want to do all the legwork, if you want to wait 3-4 weeks for delivery - however, for those who want the convenience of buying from a British company with stunningly fast delivery, from a website that is easy to use, and where everything is made simple - then I reckon that Rutlands is not a bad supplier...

It is arguable that a company shouldn't have negative feedback, but I can tell you from running businesses for 35+ years, and a management consultancy for c. 20 years advising hundreds of businesses - every business has times they mess up and every business has clients for whom nothing is good enough and who will rant and rave about their issues with that business, because it makes them feel good. To grow a business, there comes a time when you have to ignore the very few who complain publicly and get on with serving those vast majority where you have a good commercial relationship.

As punters there seems to be an expectation now that no responsibility lies with the punter, the supplier gets blamed for everything - but it is a balance and punters do also need to take responsibility for who they deal with etc. If someone wants the top end service / supply / etc. then there are companies who prioritise this, but almost universally they are slower to deliver, have a less mature business and are less successful financially - it is all about balance and choices...

NB All of this information is in the public domain - companies house etc.

What a fantastic reply! I too think there a decent company I buy regularly from them and never have any problems

 

[JimJay]

The Rutlands web site clearly shows that it's referring to Trustpilot reviews and specifies that it's displaying 4 and 5 star reviews - it even has a direct link to Trustpilot so that sceptics can see for themselves. I can't see what's supposed to be bogus or misleading about that!

 

[ChrisMa]

FWIW I have not used Rutland for many years ( buy direct from Banggood now). I found their products to be either poor or barely adequate (kind of expected). However found their CS to be quite good.

I can definitely see the logic in using Banggood instead of Rutland (often identical items), but how do you speak to Banggood customer services or return an item ?

I've used Rutlands for several 'non critical' items and I've never has an issue with their items or their customer services.

 

[Dave Moore]

We also have Trading Standards if you don’t get satisfaction from a company, and I have found them to be very helpful in resolving problems. Don’t forget you have 7 years warranty on electrical goods under the sale of goods act irrespective of what they guarantee you.

 

[JimJay]

I can definitely see the logic in using Banggood instead of Rutland (often identical items), but how do you speak to Banggood customer services or return an item ?

I've used Rutlands for several 'non critical' items and I've never has an issue with their items or their customer services.

I use Banggood quite a bit. I'm not in the UK but I always buy from one of the Banggood EU warehouses and CS is always pretty good if you have a problem (eg a 90cm cutting map folded in half to fit into a courier packet ). They'll usually ask to see a photo of the packaging and any damaged goods but they're quick, efficient and usually don't want the less expensive damaged goods back (so two free 45cm cutting mats ). They arrange a courier for returns. They do have at least one UK warehouse.

 

[Terrytpot]

Have just had a quick look at my order history with Rutlands…
5 orders placed since 2020 and the only one I had an issue with was the first which did drag on for a while but I was probably over optimistic in my expectations of an item and gave them longer than I should have to resolve an issue but when I did say enough was enough they promptly refunded me. Their quality isn’t particularly outstanding but that’s not why I use them, take for example the deep throat G-clamps at £60 for 6… try matching that at Axminster for something I might use once a year or £9.99 for 20 belts for my makita belt sander. You pays your money and you make your choice..caveat something or other

 

[johna.clements]

The Rutlands web site clearly shows that it's referring to Trustpilot reviews and specifies that it's displaying 4 and 5 star reviews - it even has a direct link to Trustpilot so that sceptics can see for themselves. I can't see what's supposed to be bogus or misleading about that!

It is not clearly displayed that they are only displaying 4 and 5 star reviews.

If you decide to click on "trust pilot" at the bottom of the page, there is no indication that you should click it, then a page comes up ""Showing our 4 & 5 star reviews"".
You can then click trust pilot on that page to see that there are in fact 1, 2 and 3 star reviews.

"Showing our 4 & 5 star reviews" is also a bit of a problem as it implies that they are not showing all the 4 and 5 star reviews, but a selection of them.
There are claims on trust pilot that they do in fact select the reviews that they post on the Rutlands website. Maybe if you post "5 stars excellent product but came two days latter than promised" your review will be banished.

On trust pilot Rutlands has 95% 4 and 5 stars and 5% 1 to 3 star. I see no reason why they would not show all the reviews. I cannot see any link for the reviews on trust pilot to any product so they are not helpful if you are looking at a particular product.

 

[Doug71]

My problem with Rutlands is their constant use of the words premium, precision and professional when the item they are talking about clearly isn't.

 

[bertterbo]

A lot of reviews are a joke. As above, a one star because the courier was a day late etc. The worst I've seen was for a very good chainsaw given one star because it was delivered with no petrol in it.

My favourite is :

"Only giving 3 out of 5 stars as I have not had it long"