Rutlands sale

[Rknott2007]

Just a quick moan, I'd decided on buying myself a domino jointer, various reasons, mainly i do alot of veneered work with biscuits, and do alot of dry assembly, so the added strength would help no end, anyway saw that rutlands had a 10% discount so that only added to my decision.
So I went on their website, just thought i'd check the terms, and right at the bottom, excludes festool!
Is it just me or is anyone else outraged at this? Maybe its because its what i want to purchase, but yes festool is pricey, but having owned some festool gear already i know its worth it, but when we try to save a bit on some pricey gear, we cant!

Rant over!

 

[wizer]

Yes, another of those perpetual debated. Festool 'fix' their prices and don't allow retailers to offer discounts. Apparently it's 'good' business. For them

 

[big soft moose]

Yes, another of those perpetual debated. Festool 'fix' their prices and don't allow retailers to offer discounts. Apparently it's 'good' business. For them

its fair enough for festool to do this if they want - though i think it is shortsighted as except for the dom they arent that much better than their competitors imo

but rutlands shouldnt be advertising their sale as "10% of everything" , when whast they mean is "10% off everything except festool" I mean i know they tell you that but they tell you in the tiny print

but then as you know fromthe other thread i dont expect consideration for their customers time from rutlands anyway so i'm not really suprised they have taken the disingenuous route

 

[Chems]

Only way to get a Festool discount is get an Ebay 10% voucher.

 

[Escudo]

Or an ebay 20% voucher. :wink:

 

[HeathRobinson]

On the other hand I scored 10% off my new plane and honing guide in this Rutlands sale. I think it is unfair to complain that Rutlands is to blame when clearly they are at the mercy of Festool's terms and conditions of resale.

If you're upset with anybody it should be with Festool. Though you probably felt you shouldn't be because their domino machine is your current want and anyway how could this well respected manufacturer possibly do anything to upset you. It must be Rutlands the reseller eh? :wink:

I own one festool, the TS55, and while I agree that the prices are extraordinary for these tools, I take solace in the knowledge that if I ever came to sell it I wouldn't lose terribly much on the second hand market. This is largely due to Festool's policy of no discount - ever! While I don't usually keep track of resale values of tools when I buy them like I might a car, it is an interesting point to note on any purchase.

Simon

 

[Graeme]

10% or not are Festools worth the money :?:

The Domino jointing tool looks very handy I have to say. The chop saw looks well put together. But there is a nagging doubt in my mind that its just a little OTT.

 

[crazylilting]

how does one get those ebay vouchers? I had one a couple of years ago! I want more more more damn it!!!

 

[Chems]

Sometimes they send you them if you haven't been active for a while. Other than that I don't know.

 

[Ross K]

If you owned Festool and had a product range that has a level of demand that is the envy of every manufacturer, if you had invested huge amounts of cash developing unique, superbly engineered products that sell strongly despite high price tags, would you offer discounts to retailers?

No, of course you wouldn't.

As it happens I've just ordered a Domino machine from Axminster. £579.60, the exact same price that every retailer sells them for. I must admit I did groan when I saw the "not including Festool" and had a small rant myself, but....

I know I'm getting a unique machine that will save me the purchase price in just a few months and allow me to be more creative and offer customers good quality and good value.

I accept that Festool are such a successful company that they control the market price of their products (like Apple etc) so I will pay the price and not whinge about it.

This has nothing to do with Rutlands at all. I'd guess that Festool have hammered their margin to hardly anything anyway, and will certainly have signed a "we will not discount" supplier clause.

 

[wizer]

I've never had one of these 10 or 20% ebay vouchers. Do you have to be in some secret auction society?

 

[matt]

Does anyone understand the legality of price fixing? Maybe I'm too cautious but I think this thread could be sailing too close to the wind given some of the accusations.

 

[Doug B]

Does anyone understand the legality of price fixing? Maybe I'm too cautious but I think this thread could be sailing too close to the wind given some of the accusations.

Think it`s a well known fact that Festool are price fixed. Doesn`t take a genius to work this out, every supplier is selling the same product at the same price & that non of the suppliers are willing to give a discount.

Think that is the proof, the anoying bit is no one in authority seems to care.

 

[matt]

Does anyone understand the legality of price fixing? Maybe I'm too cautious but I think this thread could be sailing too close to the wind given some of the accusations.

Think it`s a well known fact that Festool are price fixed. Doesn`t take a genius to work this out, every supplier is selling the same product at the same price & that non of the suppliers are willing to give a discount.

Think that is the proof, the anoying bit is no one in authority seems to care.

I'm not disputing that there is evidence just suggesting caution when it comes to accusations of illegal activity on an open forum.

Perhaps the absence of activity on the part of the authorities is due to an absence of real proof versus circumstantial evidence. Perhaps further reinforcing the view that posts alluding some inside knowledge are risky (unless, of course, the poster does have real proof to substantiate the claim).

My caution comes from some experience in this area. It's the poster and the forum that will end up carrying the stick.

 

[Doug B]

Does anyone understand the legality of price fixing? Maybe I'm too cautious but I think this thread could be sailing too close to the wind given some of the accusations.

Think it`s a well known fact that Festool are price fixed. Doesn`t take a genius to work this out, every supplier is selling the same product at the same price & that non of the suppliers are willing to give a discount.

Think that is the proof, the annoying bit is no one in authority seems to care.

I'm not disputing that there is evidence just suggesting caution when it comes to accusations of illegal activity on an open forum.

They can hardly have a case.
I was talking at length to one of their reps last week, who informed me, it was reassuring for Festool customers that it didn`t matter if they were in London or Scotland, they would be charged the same for a Festool product.

I certainly slept better that night :roll: .

 

[wizer]

Festool fix their prices. As Doug says, that's a fact. Whether they do it legally or not. I have no idea. It's been openly debated all over the internet ad infinitum. I doubt Festool are going to pick this forum and this thread, out of the many out there that have already been through this loop, and try to sue someone. I doubt they'd get anywhere if they did. It's not like they're loosing any sales is it? We'd all still buy Festool if we could afford it.

 

[matt]

Strictly speaking there is no legal way of fixing the retail price. The last legal accepted area was books but that ended back in the 90's. Hence my post.

I wasn't intending to start an argument, merely suggesting some caution regardless of the likelihood - which I agree is unlikely if, as you say, it's talked about everywhere and you're confident Festool have not taken action.

 

[wizer]

Price fixing is normally when a bunch of retailers get together and fix prices. What Festool are doing is forcing retailers to fix their prices. So the retailers have no say in the matter (unless they want to stop stocking Festool products). I'm not sure if that's legal or not. I suspect it is because this debate has been going on for years.

 

[chippy1970]

This one keeps coming around.

I cannot see the problem myself, if say a Festool router is the same price everywhere then at least you know that you have bought it for the very best price, this saves you all the time wasted looking all over shops and the internet to get the best price. Also you are more likely to buy from your local dealer as his price is the same as a large internet dealer. That way you get better service in my eyes.

 

[matt]

Price fixing is normally when a bunch of retailers get together and fix prices. What Festool are doing is forcing retailers to fix their prices. So the retailers have no say in the matter (unless they want to stop stocking Festool products). I'm not sure if that's legal or not. I suspect it is because this debate has been going on for years.

It's rarely the retailers that are massaging prices, regardless of the the generic description of price fixing. And it's not legal for a supplier to attempt to fix prices by any means. If a supplier withdraws supply for this reason that's illegal too. It's all incredibly difficult to prove though.

Like I said - I would exercise caution.