Replacement iron for Stanley No.8

[bohngy]

Hi all, I’ve Stanley no.8 jointer plane that needs a new iron. The current one is a late addition and at 3 mm thick I can only take one thin shaving before the mouth of the plane is choked. As some of you are aware, this is a known issue with these newer, thicker irons.

I know I could get the current setup working; if I open the mouth with some judicious filing, but I don’t really want to be that destructive with this one. It’s a type 6 which dates it to about 1890, so I would really like to find an original thickness iron that I can drop in and get using this plane.

I‘ve had a look, but can’t find anything other than the Ray Iles, which I believe to be as thick as the iron I already have.
If anyone had a secret supplier, or have one they like to sell to me that would be great. Thanks in advance

 

[shed9]

Have you looked at Japanese laminated blades, they tend to be under 2.5mm and are superb replacements.

Edit: Scratch that, I can't find them in 2 5/8" size anywhere. However these may fit the bill; RON HOCK Plane Blades

 

[bohngy]

Great suggestion shed, but Dieter Schmidt don’t ship to the uk anymore!
thanks for the lead though, it’s much appreciated and I’ll look around for Hock blades already in the uk.

 

[shed9]

Great suggestion shed, but Dieter Schmidt don’t ship to the uk anymore!
thanks for the lead though, it’s much appreciated and I’ll look around for Hock blades already in the uk.

https://www.classichandtools.com/acatalog/Hock-Blades-for-Bench-Planes-BP-BPA.html#SID=1498Give these guys a call. They will probably offer advice before you commit to the purchase.

I'm sure you are contravening some form of international law if you were to take a file to a Type 6, No. 8.

 

[D_W]

If you can't find one in the UK for a while, give me a heads up. I'll make you one out of o1 steel .094 thick or so for the cost of the steel and shipping.

 

[bohngy]

D_W what an astonishingly kind offer. I’ll have a hunt and report back. I might contact you directly if I have no luck.

my other option is to buy another number 8, then swap the irons over and file the mouth of a newer model. Not sure I can run to the expense of that plan at the moment, the cost of used planes on eBay has shot through the roof!

Thanks so much for all your help folks!

 

[D_W]

Yeah, high - shipping is high here to there. I think the cost of good O1 would be about $20 and shipping probably about 15 or $20 for first class to the UK.

Nothing is really cheap, but the iron would be a little better than stock irons (I can make an iron that matches hock without an issue but it'll look better).

8 irons and lever caps and cap irons are about the only thing really hard to find over here. That size of plane is always expensive, and the irons and lever caps are quickly snagged because there's plenty who need them and they only came in one plane model that didn't sell many in the first place.

If you can find the odd one inexpensive and it's original, that'd be my first choice in your place as it makes the whole plane more valuable.

 

[Ttrees]

Might it be an option to grind the bevel side, a bit of a slog though.
I'd imagine a permament marker, a bench grinder, a flap disc on an angle grinder and a lap would make short work of it.
Would it be necessary to make it parallel?

 

[eribaMotters]

I'm following this with interest as I'm in the same position. I'd held off buying a replacement blade due to the thickness issue.
The plane is only 130 years old and I cannot get a blade. What are things coming to?

Colin

 

[Jacob]

Local engineer or saw doctor might be able to machine it?

Or DIY? Glue on a wooden handle block to the face and grind the back on wet 40grit wet n dry on a flat surface - glass, machine bed, whatever.
Or a holding block held on with a few rare earth magnets - always useful to have around afterwards.

 

[D_W]

I will make a video sometime in the next month showing making a stanley style iron to good precision with your particular plane's lateral adjuster wheel (as in, you can tighten up lateral adjustment if you care, or not if you don't).

I have devised a way to relatively safely make an iron without any special tools. Just a drill press, hack saw, files (you will need a way to heat treat an iron, but if you have O1 steel (or whatever you call it over there - gauge plate or whatever), you just need a way to house heat from a typical torch (a can slightly wider than the iron is fine).

I'd not buy an iron from a regular machine shop as there's a range of hardness where you're between the toughness and strength limits, and you can find that pretty easily yourself if you're willing to start hard on the temper and then back off with intervals in a kitchen oven.

You can make an iron as good as hock's without any of the knife enthusiast nonsense about needing vacuum normalization work and two separate long tempering sessions.

You may end up needing to buy some files, but you can use them over and over in the future to make things or work wood (a double cut rat tail file is a wonderful thing to have for wood work and will work for wood long after it's dull from metal).

The #8 irons are just hard to find and have been for at least 15 years, unfortunately.

It takes me about 1 hour to make a stanley iron that will outlast any hobbyist. .094" is a common size here precision ground - it's just slightly thicker than a typical stanley, but doesn't cause problems in many planes. If it does, gauge plate in .080 and .084 or something can also be found looking around.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

You could try a trick I saw written about for fettling planes many years ago - relieve the front inside of the mouth. Get a thin file and take back the right angled front edge opening up the top of the mouth not the bottom, it gives the shavings a little more room to roll.

 

[heimlaga]

I would have use for a thick number 8 iron for my transitional with rather wide mouth...... I could make one for myself but if anyone has a surplus I may be interrested.

 

[D_W]

You could try a trick I saw written about for fettling planes many years ago - relieve the front inside of the mouth. Get a thin file and take back the right angled front edge opening up the top of the mouth not the bottom, it gives the shavings a little more room to roll.

What you're describing is how infill planes were made by norris so that the mouth could be tight but the cap set close enough to work. Stanley and other planes are sloppier because they're as cast and that part wasn't machined. If they machined, it would be just as you describe to provide room for the cap iron. Thus, my suggestion is normally just to set the mouth open a little. When iron thickness doesn't allow, it can be opened, or "filed away" on top as you describe.

I've had more than one person tell me that when planes were made better, they didn't use the cap iron because a tight mouth is more practical. That's kind of a dumb notion as a closed mouth is inferior to the cap, and those folks could never tell me why even on the cast infills, the inside of the mouth looks like this.

 

[Corset]

i might have a spare no 8 iron in my box of misc rubbish i have accumilated let me see

 

[Vann]

I bought a Clifton No.8 iron for a Record 08ss. I had it surface ground to 2.6mm thick to avoid filing the mouth and other issues associated with thick irons.

...and they only came in one plane model that didn't sell many in the first place...

Not so. Stanley No.8, Stanley No.608, Record No.08 and Record No.08ss (although the last two are effectively the same plane).

Cheers, Vann.

 

[D_W]

Vann, that's one plane model. 24" jointer, regardless of the maker (I have a record 08 that I "stole" from the UK on ebay, though the universe of buyers made me pay a strong bit of coin for it).

Record irons in 2 5/8ths from a decent era would be orders of magnitude rarer than stanley, and the ones I've used have been softer. Their ad copy showed finer grain structure, but a middle of the road stanley iron is a bit harder and the grain size argument is negated (that stuff is important for straight razors unless steel quality is absolutely poor).

2 3/8" irons, obviously in at least four different plane models. 2" in two very common models, and 1 3/4" irons also much easier to find.

Generally advisable in the states if you want original parts to be easy to find, it's wise to choose something that was used across several plane models. The 8 size is unique and the volume of the planes was lower than most of the array of 2 3/8" planes already - tough combination.

But, if you can make your own, all it requires is getting the right thickness stock and wide enough. So, cost in the open market for a #8 market, probably 2-3 times a 2 3/8" iron, I looked this morning at 3/32 O1 since my on-hand bar stock is 2.5" and the cost to make a 2 5/8" iron vs. 2 3/8" is about $2 different. Probably less, as the 3" stock leaves enough on the side for me to use the offcut to make a hard marking knife.

browsed ebay here - in the old days, the stuff went up and sold quickly. Now, we have enterprising sellers who just list things high. There's a later model iron listed by MJD for $65+tax, one pitted "sleeper" for about $38+ shipping (same era - interesting that it's still there) and then another original iron for $80+shipping plus tx.

Just a tough thing to find.

So tough that I took the original near unused iron out of my record 8 and put it aside (it's an OK iron, but its value as original is more than it's value as use - I can make an iron that's better without much trouble).

 

[bohngy]

Thanks so much for all your input folks. Such a helpful group here!
I’m still on the hunt, I had no idea it would be such a tricky thing to find. I think this might be a long road, but I’ll update with anything newsworthy!

 

[bohngy]

i might have a spare no 8 iron in my box of misc rubbish i have accumilated let me see

If you had anything, Corset, I’m sure we could do a deal!

 

[JohnPW]

https://www.workshopheaven.com/hand...ons-and-accessories/ray-iles-plane-irons.html
lists a thin and thick version for the 50mm iron.

But Ray Iles hasn't got info on thickness:
https://www.oldtoolstore.co.uk/repl...nley-no-8-record-08-and-bedrock-608-205-p.asp
maybe contact them about the thickness?