Radiator (and boiler) drain valve keys?

[pe2dave]

https://www.amazon.co.uk/gohantee-Ratchet-Wrench-Service-Refrigeration/dp/B07TGC3D1T

Thanks Chris. Saw this, tempted. If the ratchet is fine, it will work. Still hoping to find a 'clock key' type.
I'll try this if I can't find a key.

 

[chris.s]

https://www.screwfix.com/p/rothenberger-4-way-radiator-services-cabinet-key/84379

 

[chris.s]

I have somewhere 2 different sizes of this style somewhere but when working used the rachet spanner if possible

 

[pe2dave]

https://www.screwfix.com/p/rothenberger-4-way-radiator-services-cabinet-key/84379

No mention of sizes Chris? Also I doubt I'll get enough swing with 4 arms?

 

[chris.s]

No mention of sizes Chris? Also I doubt I'll get enough swing with 4 arms?

thats why I preferred the ratchet spanner or if that didn't fit the 4 inch adjustable got used. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Bahco-8069-Black-Adjustable-Wrench/dp/B0001IX8T6

 

[pe2dave]

thats why I preferred the ratchet spanner or if that didn't fit the 4 inch adjustable got used. https://www.amazon.co.uk/Bahco-8069-Black-Adjustable-Wrench/dp/B0001IX8T6

Yes, I have a small adjustable (that's where I got the 1/4 guess from). The ratchet idea seems optimal if I can't find
a 'key' type.

Thanks all,please consider this thread closed.

 

[Daniel2]

Not sure which part you disagree with but my advice is based on my own experiences over many years. I’m not saying this applies to every boiler and every type of system but on many it does .

My apologies
I was having a brain fart - put it down to old age.

 

[Bingy man]

dripping outside and variable pressures are symptoms that you have lost the pressure in the expansion tank you need to get the pressure out of the system and with a vent open repressurise the air side of the expansion tank to 2/3 running pressure

All you say is correct but expansion vessels have to be charged to the manufacturers instructions typically 0.8 too 1.5 bar on a regular sealed system . If boiler is connected to a thermal store or a unvented hot water system the charge value could be higher but again as per manufacturers instructions.

 

[Bingy man]

Seems you have to first establish why you have increasing pressure.

seems to me your possibilities are either:

1) your filling loop is letting by, or;
2) your pressure is increasing as a result of inability to accommodate thermal expansion.

By Regs, your filling loop shouldn’t be connected unless filling the system but everyone ignores this. Disconnect the loop and see if the valve is letting by when closed. Replace if needed.

Properly diagnosing an expansion vessel failure is less straightforward but when the system is cold, get the pressure to around 1.2 bar (assuming two storey house), make sure the rads are bled (any air in them will act as expansion space), then turn the heating on full whack (some boilers have a service/test mode that forces full heat). Keep and eye on the pressure gauge and see what happens once the system is up to temperature. If it rises by any more than a few tenths of a bar you likely have either a failed or depleted expansion vessel. At this point you should call a gas engineer as you’ll have to gain access to the boiler internals (unless you have an external vessel). Either way you have to drain down the boiler/system to establish if the vessel can take more charge or if the diaphragm/bladder has failed… honestly, it’s probably easier to just get a new one than diagnose the fault, and if it’s old (5+ years), I’d certainly swap it anyway.

Again the information you have posted is a fair assessment but I would not expect a customer to change a 5 year old boiler due to expansion vessel issues, friend of mine had this same issue and had a new expansion vessel fitted at a cost of £268.00 and because it didn’t cure the problem he was told to have a new boiler. His current 6 year old Worcester Bosch boiler was fitted by the same engineer. He asked me for a second opinion and I found the flexible pipe to the expansion vessel blocked with sludge . Cleared it replaced the o rings for less than a £ and job done . The expansion vessel he changed was not the fault . Suffice to say it’s not always the expansion vessel at fault hence why in my original reply I said it sounds like he has issues with the boiler. The dripping prv valve is just a indication of a potential issue.

 

[Bingy man]

My apologies
I was having a brain fart - put it down to old age.

I have those several times a day

 

[MikeJhn]

If you are going to replace the expansion vessel put a service valve on the inlet, makes life much easier in the future.

 

[Stevekane]

As an aside has anyone else found that the quite decent rad key they have is a bit too small to fit the bleed valve, I have several nice brass keys but I often come across bleed valves that they just will not slip over,,,have I wandered through life not realiseing that they come in two different sizes??
steve

 

[pe2dave]

As an aside has anyone else found that the quite decent rad key they have is a bit too small to fit the bleed valve, I have several nice brass keys but I often come across bleed valves that they just will not slip over,,,have I wandered through life not realiseing that they come in two different sizes??
steve

Two different beasts (probably). I've found bleed valve keys and drain valve keys (5 and 6mm respectively).
I bought bleed valve keys and yes, they're too small for drain valves!

 

[Bingy man]

As an aside has anyone else found that the quite decent rad key they have is a bit too small to fit the bleed valve, I have several nice brass keys but I often come across bleed valves that they just will not slip over,,,have I wandered through life not realiseing that they come in two different sizes??
steve

Radiator bleed valves are relatively standard apart from some towel rail bleed valves utilise hex keys to release the valve to bleed . Drain off valves come in several sizes depending on the manufacturer and the type - the really old school ones are probably the largest I’ve come across ..

 

[Stevekane]

And some bleedvalves also have a screwdriver slot, but maybe its down to sloppy manufacturing, either that or perhaps metric/ english? For instance I have a couple of fairly new rads from Wicks, the rad bleed key is too small to fit them, the keys fit the older rads though,,maybe I should buy a couple of new keys! I also have a couple of the bigger multi keys and one of them has keys that Ive never found a use for,,,but I keep them in my plumbing bag just in case!
Steve

 

[Bingy man]

And some bleedvalves also have a screwdriver slot, but maybe its down to sloppy manufacturing, either that or perhaps metric/ english? For instance I have a couple of fairly new rads from Wicks, the rad bleed key is too small to fit them, the keys fit the older rads though,,maybe I should buy a couple of new keys! I also have a couple of the bigger multi keys and one of them has keys that Ive never found a use for,,,but I keep them in my plumbing bag just in case!
Steve

Life is full of variety, the brass type keys tend to wear out quickly if used on a daily basis and then will slip and round over inside on the flats . Several radiator makers now supply plastic bleed keys which at first thought is a bit crap- but this is to prevent the bleed valve being over tightened by the ( customer) wait until you come across the rads with the bleed valve on the back of the rad as appose to either end -they rust in and it’s often a new rad reqd .

 

[Stevekane]

Many thanks Bingy, I shall sleep soundly tonight thinking about the nightmare of rusted in bleed valves!

 

[Inspector]

Is there enough room to use 8 point sockets?

https://www.amazon.ca/Stanley-Proto...x=8+point+socket+set+3/8+drive,aps,210&sr=8-5
I also have one or two 4 point sockets. I could see them fitting the valves you guys are talking about. Another nice thing about them is being able to use extension drives if in an awkward location.

https://www.amazon.ca/dp/B09BFCVZGQ...uPWNsaWNrUmVkaXJlY3QmZG9Ob3RMb2dDbGljaz10cnVl
Pete

 

[Bingy man]

Many thanks Bingy, I shall sleep soundly tonight thinking about the nightmare of rusted in bleed valves!

Nah don’t sweat it ,, thankfully rads are pretty cheap nowadays- and I’d always recommend the rads with the separate brass bleed valves ( they can be changed independently of the radiator ( Stelrad or even Toolstation/screwfixs own make kudox are designed like this ..

 

[pe2dave]

Update: I bought this from Amazon.
The 1/4 fits my radiator drain valve.
The 5/16 fits the boiler drain valve.

Seems well made.