Panel raiser (am I a big girls blouse?).

[petertheeater]

A number of years ago I tried using a panel raising bit in a router table. I didn't enjoy it. The whole thing vibrated like crazy and snapped something in the router.

Today I have attempted it again. Better router table, better router, better router bit. I've started on speed setting 1 and just nudged it up from that. I didn't enjoy it. Lots of vibration and the router sounds like the power is dipping up and down.
The router is a 2,000w router. CMT collet extension and CMT router cutter 80mm diameter.
I have a workshop full of machinery with sharp metal blades spinning day in and day out. I feel comfortable with all the tools and methods employed within.
This is one operation I feel there is not a good marriage between tool, tooling and method. So I've stopped. Am I just being a bit wet on a Thursday morning?

 

[marcros]

how does the router run with the extension on with a standard bit in.

my CMT one wasnt nice to use either. A panel raising bit will exaggerate the issue further.

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

Not wet....wise!

First those 80mm/90mm bits are right at the upper limit of the capacity of a 2kw router. They're BIG! So number one priority is you need to make light passes....never go full depth in one pass. When I raise panels I tend to do it in four passes.

Second, you need decent work holding...either a featherboard both pushing into and down from the fence. Personally I use a rubber bottomed long 2 handled push device. It's not really a push stick...its like a plane but with a rubber shoe and it grips the wood really well as you push it slowly and gently through the cutter.

Third, use a sled to keep it square and backed to avoid tearout. Many folk clamp the work to the sled to avoid vibration. The sled runs in the T track or mitre slot.

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

I meant to mention what Mark raised also....it's not generally accepted practice to use a collet extension with panel raisers, they're just too big. Why do you need one, is your router table top too thick?

Also check on the packaging of the bit, it will have a recommended speed range which will be slow but I think you mentioned you were going slow.

I've made a fair few raised and fielded panels in my time on various woods including solid oak and the vibration shouldn't make you feel unsafe if you take the precautions I've listed so you are right to be wary. I would recommend you try all the work holding/vibration reduction strategies mentioned and if possible lose the collet extension and then report back. Also, wear full face protection just to be belt n braces.

 

[RobinBHM]

There shouldnt be any vibration with the cutter spinning at any speed. I'd try it without the collet extension first and see if the vibration goes (I realise you may not be able to use the cutter without the extension).

If you still get vibration, I would check the bearings on the router.

I personally wouldnt use a fielding cutter for horizontal use, Id go for a vertical one

 

[CHJ]

...This is one operation I feel there is not a good marriage between tool, tooling and method. So I've stopped. Am I just being a bit wet on a Thursday morning?

No, if it doesn't sound and feel right then it isn't.

Suspect the extension is not helping things one bit, can you not get adequate depth of travel without the extension for this one job (at the expense of fitting convenience)

 

[petertheeater]

Don't know where the Roger came from in the title.
Thanks for input. I agree the bit is pushing the boundaries of size for a router.
I think I agree with the general feeling that the collet extension does not help. Unfortunately I can't lift the bit high enough without it.
I have a Jess em router table with rout-R-Lift. I love the fence etc and the ability to lift router from above very smoothly but you do lose a bit of depth. I think I might upgrade soon. Any suggestions? I don't want to make one (been there).
Cheers

 

[pcb1962]

The collet on the Triton TRA001 (or TRB001) router extends through the base, so there's no need to use an extension.
In this Peter Parfitt video he shows what can happen to an unbalanced collet extension https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OwiXbNSmhus

 

[Racers]

I have a cheap collet extension that vibrated with large cutters so I only use it with 1/4" ones.

Pete

 

[Woody2Shoes]

I don't think you're a BGB at all. As has been said, vibration is not a good sign and won't yield a good finish anyway. Whenever using a router in a router table I ALWAYS make sure that there is suitable guarding to provide a barrier between cutter and hand - in any eventuality. I was feeding a long piece of timber into a 2kW router on a cast iron table, the timber overbalanced and I reflexively grabbed at it to stop it falling on the floor - I then heard the sound of tiny bits of my finger hitting the fence a few thousand times a second. It was some weeks, and several hospital visits later, that I was brave enough to use the machine again.

I later realised that if I had provided an employee with a rig as dangerous as the one I used (and as dangerous as many I see on Youtube and the like) I would have been prosecuted - and quite rightly. Push sticks are only part of the story, as are things like feather boards etc.. Proper guarding is essential too and you need to expect the unexpected.

Cheers, W2S

 

[dickm]

There was a collet extension came with my secondhand Elu 177; don't know whether the previous owner had ever used it, but the vibration with even a small cutter was bad. Put me off extensions for life; fortunately my table is only 1/4" thick at the important bit.

 

[cornishjoinery]

Using these big panel cutters can be scary.

1.reduce the speed right down to the slowest setting
2. Take tiny passes at a time, its better to lower the cutter right down and move the fence foward, then raise it up very slower and move fence back.

If your getting vibration your not doing it right!
this is why i don't believe router should be sold to anyone with the right qualifications or proper training.

 

[petertheeater]

If your getting vibration your not doing it right!
this is why i don't believe router should be sold to anyone with the right qualifications or proper training.[/quote]

Yeh thanks for your input. I think if you read the helpfull responses above you will see that the consensus seems to be the issue is most likely attributed to the collet extension. And the general tenor of the post was that if it doesn't feel right, with all the experience had pushing and guiding kilometres of timber through various machinery, it ain't right.
You have no idea of my training and capabilities. Your ending remark just comes across as a bit snidey and grumpy. This is why I don't think computers, tablets or smart phones with access to the Internet should be sold to people without the right qualifications or proper training.
Thanks for your input.

 

[marcros]

the vertical panel cutters don't seem particularly popular, but as somebody stated above, they would also be my preference.

 

[dickm]

W.r.t. the vertical panel raising cutters, it's always been a puzzle as to how to fix a suitably rigid tall fence in order to use them. Or am I missing something?

 

[n0legs]

W.r.t. the vertical panel raising cutters, it's always been a puzzle as to how to fix a suitably rigid tall fence in order to use them. Or am I missing something?

I've got one and because my RT is home made I just screw a piece of MDF to my fence, for the full length of the fence at about 18" tall.
It also acts as a good zero clearance aid.