Oak framed, ledged and braced door construction

[Stormer1940]

Hi looking to make a door like this from euro oak. Usually I'd groove the stiles and form a barefaced tongue to accommodate the matchboard at the sides and top rail but whats the best way to fix the matchboard to the rails across the door without nailing through the face?

Cheers

 

[Logger]

I would cut the middle and bottom rails to have essentially and narrow tenon and cut a groove in the uprights and then plenty of glue. This will hold the matchboards weight and easy to put together.

With the internal supports glued on, that should do it.

Cheers

Nick

 

[Stormer1940]

I'm not sure I'd be happy gluing the matchboard as it needs to float in away for movement unless I have read your post wrong. The top rail will obviously be the full thickness of the door 44mm and I plan to use bare face tenons on the bottom and middle rails for the matchboard to sit flat on and then fix to the rails. If it was softwood I'd nail it from the front and fill the nail holes to take a paint finish but as it will be a natural finish I want as discreet fixing as possible .

 

[ColeyS1]

Screw through the back ? Is it gonna be an internal door or an external one?

Coley

 

[Stormer1940]

Yep Thanks Coley. I think you are right. I just found my answer here http://www.orlestoneoak.co.uk/joinery/o ... brace.html

It's going to be a front door.

 

[ColeyS1]

If it's opening in you could secret nail all the boards besides the last. Then route a groove in the face of boards to fit a weather bar and by the time you screw that from the back they won't go anywhere.
On a side note one of the best things I ever did was stop using bare faced tenons. If you allow a 1-2mm shoulder on what would have been the bare faced side, the stiles behave much better when you wang the clamp on. They don't seem to try and twist over with the extra ickle shoulder

Coley

 

[Stormer1940]

Good info mate. I was just going to use a lowline threshold so probably wont be fitting a weather bar

 

[Dan j]

I'd avoid gluing the boards. They need to be free to expand/contract independently of the rest of the door.
Not normally keen on screws with wide boards as they don't give with any expansion.

 

[dzj]

It's going to be a front door.

Looks interesting, but in reality it's a ~20mm thick door. Not the best of thermal properties.
And the vertical seams of the match-boarding, unless caulked in some way, are not exactly waterproof.

 

[Stormer1940]

It's going to be a front door.

Looks interesting, but in reality it's a ~20mm thick door. Not the best of thermal properties.
And the vertical seams of the match-boarding, unless caulked in some way, are not exactly waterproof.

May not have the best thermal properties but this style of door has been used for god knows how long for exterior style doors.

 

[Mike Jordan]

I suggest you run two grooves across the inside face of the centre and bottom rails, site the screw heads in these grooves and then cover them with a decorative bead tapped in as a tight fit. I have used this method many times on the outer strings of open tread stairs, in that instance two strips of dentil moulding look good as a feature rather than a scattering of pellets which never do match exactly even when cut from the same piece of timber.

 

[Stormer1940]

Hi Mike,

Interesting method. Cant 100% picture it on the back of the door though. I understand the feature part to make the job look a little different but is there a way to make it look as descreet as possible?
Cheers

 

[Mike Jordan]

In the instance of the stair case I used a groove about 18mm wide an a bead that projected above the surface of the outer face. It would probably be better in the case of the door rails if the bead was made to look as if you had just run an ornamental mould into the rear face.

 

[Stormer1940]

Something like this

 

[Mike Jordan]

Yes I think that's right. It was a great success on the staircases but I've not used it on a door. I think there is every chance it will look the part.
Mike.

 

[ColeyS1]

I've really over thought this so bare with me :lol:

It's a bit of faffing around, but it would allow you to get a decent fixing ( probably 15mm) into the back of the board. Some thick galvanised strapping that they use to hold down wall plates would be best.
You still got the last board to worry fix though.
I just finished making this door for a chippy.

The two pack fillers visible but it's not hideously obvious. Have you tried any filler/ finish combinations ?

Coley

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk

 

[Stormer1940]

I'm confused on how it all goes together if using that method lol

 

[ColeyS1]

I'm confused on how it all goes together if using that method lol

That's just me being crap at trying to explain things

Something like this

Then screw the metal into the groove you've made on the rails. Majorly over engineered but I'd imagine it'd be as good if not better than secret nailing through the tongue. Just keep the screw in tight to the edge of the board when you fix it to the rail.
Then there's just that little last board you need to fix- go on, smash two nail through the front :twisted:
Coley

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[Stormer1940]

Oh I see... Good thinking.... Got another door question now lol. Going to start new thread on it.