Moving to Brazil: selling up or using a portable power station?

[Bojam]

It’s looking likely that we will be moving to Brazil in 2-3 years time (for my wife’s work). May seem premature to start thinking about this now but there’s a lot of planning involved.

The domestic electrical supply in Brazil is not standardised nationally. In some places it’s 110v in others it’s 220v. But always 60Hz. My machines (PT, bandsaw, extractors) and power tools are all European 230v, 50hz.

If I understand correctly they won’t run well or at all with a 60Hz supply.

So I could sell everything and spend the time in Brazil building my hand tool skills.

Or sell everything and look to replace with machines/tools bought locally once in Brazil (maybe with a focus on hand tools supplemented with a few key power tools as required).

Or buy something like the EcoFlow Delta Pro portable power station, which can be charged from the domestic supply or from a solar array and then output at the required volatage and frequency. Outputs at upto 3kW, can be boosted to 4.5kW and can handles surges up to 7kW apparently. This isn’t a cheap solution but certainly something I’m willing to consider. Thoughts on if it would work? My PT is rated at 3kW, the Bandsaw and large cyclonic extractor are both rather at 1.5kW. All the power tools are no more than 1.5kW. Matt at Badger Workshop did a YouTube video on the EcoFlow Delta pro recently.

Appreciate any knowledgeable input here. Thanks!

Should just add that I won’t be able to get a working visa to set up a business (as far as I understand) so work would be limited to stuff for us, friends, family and maybe a bit of under the table word of mouth type commissions.

 

[Droogs]

Have a look at Will Prowse on Youtube for a young lad he has an amazing knowledge about all this power from the sun type stuff. He is US based but his info on what is available will probably be much more in line with what you could possibly be able to get in your neck of the woods than here.

 

[BucksDad]

You live / work in interesting places. Does your wife work in the diplomatic service?

 

[Jarno]

Might make sense to have a look at how expensive equipment is locally, could be a shock because Brasil has quite a tax on imported goods.

 

[Bojam]

You live / work in interesting places. Does your wife work in the diplomatic service?

No she’s a tropical forest ecologist. She does have civil service status in France but is currently employed by a French research institute which expatriates some staff around the world. Certainly makes for an interesting life!

 

[Bojam]

Might make sense to have a look at how expensive equipment is locally, could be a shock because Brasil has quite a tax on imported goods.

Yeah, if i sold everything and bought locally I’m pretty sure I would downscale and just buy the essentials. Not adverse to working primarily with hand tools. Maybe a thicknesser to reduce drudgery, maybe a small bench top bandsaw. And a drill.

 

[Trainee neophyte]

Yeah, if i sold everything and bought locally I’m pretty sure I would downscale and just buy the essentials. Not adverse to working primarily with hand tools. Maybe a thicknesser to reduce drudgery, maybe a small bench top bandsaw. And a drill.

If I was moving to Brazil I would be looking to buy the world's biggest chainsaw and a bandsaw mill...

I have no idea about what is available locally in Brazil but I would imagine the cost of getting a local to prepare your wood for you wouldn't be huge.

 

[Jameshow]

If I was moving to Brazil I would be looking to buy the world's biggest chainsaw and a bandsaw mill...

I have no idea about what is available locally in Brazil but I would imagine the cost of getting a local to prepare your wood for you wouldn't be huge.

Might be a slight conflict of interests!

 

[baldkev]

I guess the real question is, do you need your wife? If not, you dont need to worry about the tools

If the answer is yes, id probably look into where is safe out there.... i know a guy who lives in brazil part time ( rio i believe ) and he said it can be quite dangerous, especially driving / stopping at traffic lights where theres a good chance of being car jacked etc

 

[Bojam]

I guess the real question is, do you need your wife? If not, you dont need to worry about the tools

If the answer is yes, id probably look into where is safe out there.... i know a guy who lives in brazil part time ( rio i believe ) and he said it can be quite dangerous, especially driving / stopping at traffic lights where theres a good chance of being car jacked etc

Lol, yeah she’s on the essential list. So need to plan around that. The choice of location at the moment seems likely to be Santarem (on the Amazon between Belem and Manaus) or Brasilia (the capital). May be some room for negotiation. Quite like the idea of Santarem. Small city. Seems to be a popular ecotourism destination with km of white sandy beaches along the sides of a tributary river. No French or English school though.

 

[PerryGunn]

The domestic electrical supply in Brazil is not standardised nationally. In some places it’s 110v in others it’s 220v. But always 60Hz. My machines (PT, bandsaw, extractors) and power tools are all European 230v, 50hz.

If I understand correctly they won’t run well or at all with a 60Hz supply.

I thought that the vast majority of 50Hz equipment will work fine on a 60Hz supply - it's 60Hz equipment on a 50Hz supply that can be more problematic...

Definitely worth an email to each manufacturers support people to ask the question

 

[AES]

Can't help you too much on this one, but back in the mid noughties, I was running an aviation project in Rio.

Fairly unusually, the local airline where we were based couldn't supply us with ANY support equipment at all - didn't matter if you needed a packet of paper clips or a spare aero engine, we had to procure it all ourselves.

Now I'm NOT saying we got aero engines at the local market (!!!!) but a lot of stuff such as ali ladders, steps, electric extension leads, inspection lamps, ink jet printers, and gawd knows what else were bought locally.

Amongst other things there was a large local DIY supermarket chain who's name I've been racking my brains to remember but can't for the life of me, sorry. If it comes to me I'll post again. But that DIY place was fairly similar to DIY Emporia where I live (Switzerland) and also in UK. We didn't need any electrical tools as such so I didn't look closely and as above, it's a while back, but I seem to remember seeing a number of quite familiar brands of power tools on the shelves.

One thing that DID strike me though was the VERY low prices of the extension leads, ladders, etc, that we did buy. All pretty low prices and at least reasonable quality.

And the same applies to office stuff. There were several outlets there quite similar to places I've seen (but not used) in UK. Would "Office World" or "PC World" sound right? (Here the equivalent would be "Media Markt"). Anyway, I was struck by the low prices of the significant amounts of just general stuff like printer paper, ink jet cartridges, etc, and as said, one replacement lap top and 2 inkjet printers and a separate scanner were all MUCH cheaper than European (inc UK) prices. ALL such stuff (and extension leads, etc) were 240 V BTW.

So some indicators that MAY guide you a little at least.

But caution please:

1. This was in Rio (and another place a 90 min flight down the coast towards Argentina, called Porto Allegre);

2. No idea what Brasilia or Santarem would be like for such stores (never been to either);

3. The above project lasted nearly 18 months and started in 2005 or 6 (I forget). No idea what's happened to the exchange rate (for example) since then.

4. Re security, we were in a hotel about a 45 mins drive from the airport (where our aeroplanes were) and went to and from daily, and at all odd times of the day and night. We used a chauffeur car service (booked on a weekly basis from the hotel, so cheaper than hiring a car) and though we heard about people being robbed at traffic lights, etc, the drivers seemed to know where/where not to go and we had nil incidents. BUT one of my colleagues walking on Coppa Cabana in broad daylight on the crowded beach did have a not too huge-looking/not so ostentatious gold neck chain snatched from his neck by a guy on a bike. Oh, and BTW, I had to pay for an armed guard to sleep aboard each of 2 of my aeroplanes parked with no work going on over a Christmas and New Year! (To stop parts being removed from my aeroplanes and being put to use on other aircraft of the same type).

Very nice people in general (how's your Portuguese)? But whatever you're doing, wherever you go, do NOT expect to get anything at all done during carnival or if there's a football world cup on! Although having breakfast on the patio while humming birds take sips of nectar (?) from huge tropical flowers next to the table takes some beating for a "normal" hotel stay!

HTH

 

[AES]

@Bojam: I do appreciate my post above is rather vague - to say the least!

But still racking my brains about that DIY supermarket chain, "half a penny" has dropped - MAYBE! I have a vague feeling it was a French chain (or similar-sounding name). Maybe Le Clerc???? Sorry, sleeping on it may help, but if your good lady has any contacts in Brazil already, maybe worth a quick query along those lines????

 

[PhilipL]

My experience is that Brazil is very, very large, very poor and can be dangerous. Lovely country in many parts, too.

I think you should go out prior to your planned move and assess your options afterwards.

I hosted a young female student in Belfast. She loved it. It was so safe, she said, you could walk streets at night. Not in that sense, of course. (Edit: she was from Porto Allegre).

 

[stuart little]

I thought that the vast majority of 50Hz equipment will work fine on a 60Hz supply - it's 60Hz equipment on a 50Hz supply that can be more problematic...

Definitely worth an email to each manufacturers support people to ask the question

I ran an 8-track model railroad using US 110v 60hz controllers via 230v 50hz transformers with no problems. The makers in the US did warn that the controllers may get hot, but they never did, but then there wasn't the ampage of power tools ,I guess. Just my thoughts.

 

[KingAether]

Figured it worth noting here that the Wadkin Tradesmen stuff had the factory(s) in Brazil and while they are certainly a lower quality than the Bursgreen we know, they are decent enough and likely very cheap over there on the used market

 

[johna.clements]

How much will it cost to ship your tools to Brazil
What about insurance for when the container falls off the ship or someone helps them to the contents.
Import taxes into Brazil
Cost of the power station.
Cost of shipping back to Europe plus insurance.

How much would it cost to store the tools in Europe.

Will your workshop be in your house or some other place. If some other place will the tools be secure there and what about your safety if you want to work in the evening.

If the workshop is in the house will there be room for all your tools. You do not want so many tools in the workshop that you can not work in it.
If it is in the house what about noise, will your wife be working from home at all.

Will you be working the same way and doing the same projects in Brazil and so need the same tools. As was noted above you could pay people to prepare your timber. No point in paying to take tools that you do not use. If you bought tools there you could just get the tools you need which maybe cheaper even if you get little for them when you leave.

Will you be able to get parts for your tools as noted above. Locally sourced tools should! have parts.

 

[DRC]

It’s looking likely that we will be moving to Brazil in 2-3 years time (for my wife’s work). May seem premature to start thinking about this now but there’s a lot of planning involved.

The domestic electrical supply in Brazil is not standardised nationally. In some places it’s 110v in others it’s 220v. But always 60Hz. My machines (PT, bandsaw, extractors) and power tools are all European 230v, 50hz.

If I understand correctly they won’t run well or at all with a 60Hz supply.

So I could sell everything and spend the time in Brazil building my hand tool skills.

Or sell everything and look to replace with machines/tools bought locally once in Brazil (maybe with a focus on hand tools supplemented with a few key power tools as required).

Or buy something like the EcoFlow Delta Pro portable power station, which can be charged from the domestic supply or from a solar array and then output at the required volatage and frequency. Outputs at upto 3kW, can be boosted to 4.5kW and can handles surges up to 7kW apparently. This isn’t a cheap solution but certainly something I’m willing to consider. Thoughts on if it would work? My PT is rated at 3kW, the Bandsaw and large cyclonic extractor are both rather at 1.5kW. All the power tools are no more than 1.5kW. Matt at Badger Workshop did a YouTube video on the EcoFlow Delta pro recently.

Appreciate any knowledgeable input here. Thanks!

Should just add that I won’t be able to get a working visa to set up a business (as far as I understand) so work would be limited to stuff for us, friends, family and maybe a bit of under the table word of mouth type commissions.

I used to troubleshoot for USA-manufactured equipment here in the UK and the large manufacturer Westinghouse informed us all the stuff sold into the UK was 50 cycles. I found in summer being overwhelmed with callouts from my engineers for fridge freezers overheating so I fitted in series with the AC supplies transformers problem was gone. The same situation on the large laundry equipment same manufacturer motors burning out (3ph) I did the same thing with the star point of the motors end of the problem.
So perhaps you could research converting 50hz to 60hz conversion to run in Brazil obviously it will not help with 110v supplies. you could find out ahead what supply is in the area where you will be living.

 

[Cozzer]

Nowt to do with your power question, but as an aside, my best pal moved to Manaus having married a Brazilian girl.
His main complaint about the place was that anything metal - including his favourite guitar's strings and pickups - rusted so quickly, it was hard to keep up with replacements....

 

[Bojam]

Nowt to do with your power question, but as an aside, my best pal moved to Manaus having married a Brazilian girl.
His main complaint about the place was that anything metal - including his favourite guitar's strings and pickups - rusted so quickly, it was hard to keep up with replacements....

Yeah, we live in French Guiana. It’s a familiar problem. That said, I’ve managed to keep my cast iron PT and bandsaw tables largely free of rust with regular cleaning and machine wax. Maybe it’s worse in the deep Amazon but we have to contend with the tropical humidity and proximity to the sea here.