Metal working lathe

[Escudo]

Hello all,

I have been thinking that a small metal working lathe would be a useful and handy addition to the workshop.

The ability to make thumb screws, knurled knobs, bushes, ferrels, small items and parts for making tools etc. would be very useful and fun.

I am waiting for a friend of mine to make a few small items I need for my secret santa gift. :wink: It would be nice to make these in house.

I will take some advice from him on this subject, he has a large lathe and also a Myford super 7.

I know that one or two of our forum friends have metal working lathes, Philly and Ed. Does anybody else have a small lathe for metal work?

Axminster sell a range of Sieg machines, which also look like machines offered by Warco, Chester and Sealey. Are these all the same? Which is the best make?

A Sieg C3 is available on ebay for only £375 which seems good value.

I am in no hurry for this item, but would like to hear views from the forum on this subject.

Any ideas?

Cheers, Tony.

 

[Mr Ed]

My lathe was purchased from a forum member for £100 - Its practically an antique, but does its job brilliantly.

I had a good look at the Axminster lathes today when I was at Nuneaton and was surprised how small they are. The cheapest ones (which I had previously considered) are really tiny - the catalogue is a bit deceptive in that way. Also the sub £500 ones felt like pretty poor quality to me.

I would look for an older model, people seem to favour Myford, as you will get a better level of engineering than in a cheap chinese model.

I had not realised how much I would use a metalworking lathe until I had one; I also use it to turn occasional bits of wood as need dictates.

This site is a good source of information;

http://www.lathes.co.uk/

and this one, whilst American, is a good source of techniques info;

http://www.americanmachinetools.com/how ... _lathe.htm

Ed

 

[GraemeD]

I thought exactly the same way as you, that a metalworking lathe would be great for occasional use to make all kinds of little fittings. So, I bought an Emco Unimat 3 on Ebay for less than £200. http://www.lathes.co.uk/emco/page3.html. This is a tiny lathe like the ones you see at Axminster, but being a precision Austrian made bit of kit, it makes the Chinese ones at Axminster look extremely crude. The Unimat is more like a watchmaker's lathe in build quality, but aimed at making small items for modellers. After all, what size of item do we woodworkers want to make? Not massive stuff certainly.....little knurled screws, custom fasteners etc.

One downside of the Unimat is that it isn't great at thread cutting, which is arguably an issue. It can do it with accessories (which I don't have), so I just use taps and dies. Worth bearing in mind if this is a big part of what you planned.

Of course the biggest advantage to a small lathe like this is that you can put it in a cupboard when you've finished with it. that keeps it clean and out of the way! Wood and precision metal lathes don't mix too well!

If I could have any lathe I'd get a Myford or similar....but I don't have the space to dedicate to it, and can't justify the cost. For me at least the Emco is a pretty good compromise, and I've used it quite a bit.

Hope that helps!

Cheers
Graeme

 

[Harbo]

I have an Emco Unimat 3 too - it's a great small lathe.
Really well made and general a few on Ebay as they have been around for about 40 years?

The new (Chinwanese) Unimat 4 accessories generally fit it.
The rubber belts break quite easily but can be replaced with a plastic type or even Nitrile ones.

I have used it for making replacements tool parts (from memory it will turn up to 3" diam and has a 12 " bed? ).
I am also (slowly) making a brass skeleton Clock.
Look for one with lots of accessories and if possible a Milling attachment with separate motor.

Rod

 

[Boz62]

I have a pre-war Myford ML2. I'd LOVE to have an ML7 to get something more accurate and stronger, but since I only use it for the odd knob, spacer or widget it would be overkill . However, I wouldn't be without it, it's just too useful to have around

I have also looked into the mini-lathe thing. Have you seen the wealth of info here. This is based on the SIEG lathes - yes lots of people ship them with various colours/badges. I would also read through these articles on how to setup a C3. They do seem to need a very complete strip-down to get them ready for a long future. I'm also worried that at least some of the SIEG machines use plastic gears in the headstock - may be worth checking which ones. They provide a lot of lathe for the money but you need to be very aware of their limitations.

Sparey is the usual recommendation for a bible and covers the basics well, although I'm sure there are more modern books that focus on the mini-lathes

Good luck

Boz

Edit: Found it! Arc Euro Trade also provide a PDF of what their preparation service for the SIEG X3 mill involves. Might give you an idea of how much can be done to this level of machinary in general.

 

[dchallender]

I have a larger lathe - A Harrison 11" which has a bed that will take work upto 48" long, again I got it second hand and it cost me about £250, the down side was that I had to refit a new motor which was fine though.

My advice would be to get a second hand one which will be well bedded in, I would also agree with the other comments in that it depends on what you use it for and whether you are going to move it at some point (mine weighs the best part of half a tonne!!)

You may want to have a look here http://www.lathes.co.uk/ to have a look at the many varieties that are out there.

I'm in the process of rebuilding mine at the moment as I'm just about to move it back into the workshop after an absence of 3 yrs and I never realised just how much I would miss it.

On the unimat a friend of mine has one and he loves it, but again he only does quite small things on it whereas I have built small marine steam engines on mine and need something slightly larger.

rgds

Darren

 

[9fingers]

I have had a myford ML7R from new but the equivalent machine is now very expensive and possible more than the OP needs in terms of capabilty.

Used myfords go for silly money on Ebay so the best way to get one is through friends who are associated with model engineering clubs where older members pass on or have to give up through health issues. This way you can pay a fair price and borrow some expertise on the condition of the machine.

Non Myford classical machines possible are better value on ebay or if you want new then the taig/sieg machines via ArcEuro trade are well prepared and come with after sales support.

Good Luck

Bob

Of course metal working machinery is a whole new slope heading off in a different direction but with a similar effect on the wallet!

 

[SammyQ]

If you look REALLY carefully....you might see a Checko/Ehrlich monster that I'm supposed to be retoring and using.....

Advise for what you want to do: BUY A SMALL ONE!

Sam

 

[Jamesc]

Hi Tony, If you are looking to buy new, and to be honest the Chiwanese lathes are hard to beat, particularly for the occasional metal worker. I have a BV20 from Axminser and in spite having 2 proper old british lathes I will neve get rid of it.

One thing to bear in mind is not all lathes that look the same are created equal. I would recommend going to a good source and maybe paying a little more to know that the company you are buying from has good quality control on place, preferably in house with the manufacturer.

A name that is highly regarded in Engineering circles for these lathes is Arc Euro Trade http://www.arceurotrade.co.uk. Another is Warco http://www.warco.co.uk though you are moving up a few notches here. One thing to bear in mind is even more than woodworking a metal working lathe will easily cost more than twice its purchase price in accessories, especially if you get the bug.

You may be interested to know that there is an engineering show on at Sandown in a weeks time. You can't beat seeing these things in the flesh. Full info here http://www.modelengineershow.co.uk

Good luck with your purchase.

 

[Digit]

I have the Axminster BV20 Tony. Not up there with the Myford Super Seven, but certainly well able to produce what you have suggested.

Roy.

 

[jasonB]

If all you want to do is make a few parts for tools, jigs etc then one of the far eastern 7x20 lathes would be more than adequate, these are often refered to as "mini-lathes"

I started with a Unimat 3 when in my early teens and then progressed upto an Emco Ecomat by the same company. I have only recently changed theis for one of Warco's WM-280VF lathes as I needed the larger capacity for this. The build quality and final finish of the far eastern ones is not upto european or english lathes but they (well mine anyway) are capable of very accurate work.

As has been said the same lathes are available in many different colours, the specs can vary between them and also some do not include things like faceplates, 4-jaw chuck and steadies, several on e-bay are like this.

Old English iron is another option but you will not find such a compact machine and will have to start looking at Myford, Boxford or a Colchester Bantum. The latter two will more than likely be 3 phase so you need to allow for an phase converter.

Jason

 

[wizer]

Jason I take it that to make those parts it takes a lathe and a milling machine? The lathe can't produce the gears and wheels on it's own. Can it?

Just wonderin'

 

[9fingers]

Many model engineers will cut gears on the lathe. Technically it is a milling process as the cutter is driven and the gear blank is indexed round by a dividing head.

see here for an example set up on a Myford lathe.

http://www.astronomiainumbria.org/advan ... earcut.jpg

Bob

 

[wizer]

thanks Bob.

Are milling attachments on these 'hobby' end lathes worth having or is it better to have them separate?

I'm just thinking along the same lines as Tony. A small metalworking 'shop' would be handy but it'd have to be small and do much. Would be nice to make custom metal work.

How easy would it be to make a hinge? Or is this not in the realms of lathes\mills ?

 

[John. B]

I've got one of these, A chester DBV7 great for making toolbits for the wood lathe.

John. B

 

[Digit]

Separate every time, same as with P/T or separates, and for the same reasons.

Roy.

 

[9fingers]

I've not used a combined machine but I guess if space is tight and you just want to do odd jobs there could be a place for them.

Milling requires great rigidity so make sure what ever you buy is up to the job.
The round column mill drills should be avoided if at all possible.

Making hinges? hardly worth the bother. Buy them and maybe modify on a mill if you need a special size.

Bob

 

[Mr Ed]

Are milling attachments on these 'hobby' end lathes worth having or is it better to have them separate?

I have a milling attachment for mine and its handy. I've never really used a milling machine so not in a position to compare, but I suspect a dedicated machine is always going to be far better. That said, the attachment is useful and for the small bits I do works well...I will reveal an example after Christmas Day.. :wink:

Ed

 

[jasonB]

Yes I also have a small mill which I used for that traction engine but all the milling operations for the engine on this page were done on the lathe as its half the size at 18" long.

A lathe with the right attachments such as a vertical slide would allow you to make hinges. the little oil boxes on top of these bearing housings have hinged lids, the lid is 1/16" thick and the pins are 1/32 (only temp bent wire ones at the moment)

Jason

Jason

 

[Digit]

What make is the mill Jason?

Roy.