Japanese tools.

[MIGNAL]

Time to throw away your Lie Nielsen and Holtey Planes. They are obviously junk compare to:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=p ... jhTbePvyXc

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rxJbjpxGNbQ

 

[Jelly]

That is a really really cool technique, I did not see where it was going at first!

 

[Jacob]

Interesting. Pulling the tool seems to be the Jap thing - which looks natural from a seated position and very controlled.
We only pull spokeshaves and draw-knives and the latter are usually from seated (on shave horse). Just historical chance?

 

[MIGNAL]

I can't work it out. The piece of wood he cuts with the saw (at the start) suggests that the pattern would finish in end grain rather than side grain. That would be the usual Tonbridge ware effect and incredibly impressive for a hand plane to cut end grain at 0.15 mm's! But having experience of making similar end grain patterns the resulting shaving crumbles in the hand. It has to be side grain!

 

[Corneel]

Oh yes, that's endgrain for sure!

And no doubt that some Japanes planes outperform any Holtey by miles.

 

[Jacob]

I can't work it out. The piece of wood he cuts with the saw (at the start) suggests that the pattern would finish in end grain rather than side grain. That would be the usual Tonbridge ware effect and incredibly impressive for a hand plane to cut end grain at 0.15 mm's! But having experience of making similar end grain patterns the resulting shaving crumbles in the hand. It has to be side grain!

My nearest experience was in A level biology doing slides with a scalpel. The word "microtome" springs to mind but I can't actually remember using one - it was 50 years ago. End grain no prob but I guess it depends on the glue or other surrounding medium, as much as the material itself.

 

[bugbear]

I can't work it out. The piece of wood he cuts with the saw (at the start) suggests that the pattern would finish in end grain rather than side grain. That would be the usual Tonbridge ware effect and incredibly impressive for a hand plane to cut end grain at 0.15 mm's! But having experience of making similar end grain patterns the resulting shaving crumbles in the hand. It has to be side grain!

Agreed - 0.15mm is around 6 thou. In end grain, that's a very delicate shaving, regardless of how well it's cut, and yet the shaving appears robust.

Perhaps there's any kind of softener/support treatment used, making the cut easier, and the shaving more pliable.

Regardless - kudos to the plane and the guy using it.

Edit; re-watching. If that first saw cut is cross grain (and it certainly looks that way), the final plane stroke is long grain, which is much more understandable.

BugBear

 

[GazPal]

I'd say at least 97% of such pattern making involves end grain work. It can be intricate and time consuming to lay out, but quite a quantity of usable material can be obtained once everything is in place. By using end grain there's less risk of hitting problems with grain orientation, plus you also tend to have more uniform finish/surface textures.

Guitar soundhole rosettes are one example illustrating the use of intricate end grain pattern layouts, although they tend to involve pieces made in veneer rather than paper thickness.

 

[MIGNAL]

I've made many mosaic Guitar rosette patterns. The end grain work for Guitar rosettes seems to appear sometime in the mid 19 th century and is the same technique as Tonbridge Ware. Side grain patterns tend to appear to be less complex (not to make) but have greater definition and better contrast when using natural woods.
The Japanese example in the Video has to be side grain. End grain at that thickness and width/length would be far too delicate. Look at the second video and note how the pattern comes out of the plane all curled up. If you tried to straighten an end grain piece it would fall apart in your hands.

 

[Corneel]

Mmm, maybe you are right. When you look at the sawcut around 11 seconds in the first video, like bugbear said, that looks like he cuts a strip from the end of the board.

So that means we should also be surprised about the glue they use. That's all endgrain glue surfaces!

 

[GazPal]

I've made many mosaic Guitar rosette patterns. The end grain work for Guitar rosettes seems to appear sometime in the mid 19 th century and is the same technique as Tonbridge Ware. Side grain patterns tend to appear to be less complex (not to make) but have greater definition and better contrast when using natural woods.
The Japanese example in the Video has to be side grain. End grain at that thickness and width/length would be far too delicate. Look at the second video and note how the pattern comes out of the plane all curled up. If you tried to straighten an end grain piece it would fall apart in your hands.

So have I and Tesselated rosette patterns from the early-mid C19th are an excellent example of end grain work where intricate decoration can be produced and duplicated en masse.

The Japanese (Chinese and Korean also) routinely produce paper thin work using end and side grain patterns and prime the surface by dampening the end grain prior to shaving - hence the minimal curling seen in the shaved patterns. This in turn makes it possible for one to produce extremely fine shavings capable of being wrapped upon underlying - often pre-contoured - strata such as box lids, etc..

 

[iNewbie]

Never knew about Yosegi before. 8)

 

[JohnPW]

At about 0:43 seconds where he's glueing the sticks together, I think you can just about see banding going across the sticks.

 

[MIGNAL]

There are plenty of examples on google images if you just type in 'yosegi'
This one shows it quite clearly and is a decent file size. You can click on the picture for a much larger version. Those are clearly side grain:

http://tracepattern.wordpress.com/2011/ ... egi-zaiku/

 

[frankederveen]

Hi,

those are really interesting videos. Of course with youtube, one thing leads to another and I found this guy; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FeXAzU8XrJA. He has a series of videos on japanese planes; what to look for, how to tune and sharpen them.

I thought it was a really good watch and hope maybe someone else will also enjoy them =)

Regards,
Frank

 

[bugbear]

Hi,

those are really interesting videos. Of course with youtube, one thing leads to another and I found this guy; http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FeXAzU8XrJA. He has a series of videos on japanese planes; what to look for, how to tune and sharpen them.

I thought it was a really good watch and hope maybe someone else will also enjoy them =)

Regards,
Frank

It turns out there are lots of ways to work wood. Who knew?

BugBear