Is it any wonder why.....

[mwinfrance]

There used to be similar fights in some areas of some cities in the UK at many times in the past ( I can think of at least two in London in the time I lived there in the 70s ..Brixton , I lived on "the front line"..loved it ), then there were the mods and the rockers in the 60s, the teds before them, peaky blinders was based on an actual group, similar in parts of Scotland and Norn and Dublin going back multiple decades. Proir to WW2 there was again similar, and ditto prior to WW1 etc etc.The difference now is CCTV. Nowadays the places , events and ares that most would avoid are brought to your TV. I remember pitched battles involving knives,( some very big ones , but they weren't called machetes then ) razors etc in the shopping centre ( the "Wulfrun", or maybe the "Wolfrun" I think it was ) at Wolverhampton on match days. Some of the battles on the seafronts in some areas involved axes and zip guns. The gangs such as the Krays didn't always wait for darkness either.

ps.I did mention it earlier, I said it will get worse..Now it is on TV it will be copied, there will be escalation.."Interesting Times"

 

[Jacob]

I will comment on the machete "fight"......

It's absolutely typical of this country that the youth of today can't even do bladed weapon fighting properly.

Any self respecting Mexican machete exponent would just p*ss themselves laughing.......

This list of things that this country can be proud of diminishes on a daily basis.

They weren't all youths there were several fat old Welsh blokes too!
Nobody got killed and several got sent down.
No Albanians, Afghans, muslims, boat people - really boring!
I blame the Welsh, coming here in gangs and taking our jobs etc etc.
Send them to Rwanda? Too good for them.

 

[Fergie 307]

Maybe they think it is in Wales, hence the efforts to prevent being sent there, the Rwanda Valley perhaps? ........ I'll get my coat.

 

[thetyreman]

Well done for trying to drag the post back on topic.

I try my best

 

[J-G]

The tories think it will disenfranchise feeble minded Labour voters.

Why have you omitted to mention that there is already in place a perfectly reasonable alternative to the Photo ID in the form of a 'Voter Authority Certificate' ?

Not only that, there is also a free-phone help-line for advice on how to apply and this information is distributed along with the election notification.

 

[Fergie 307]

Why have you omitted to mention that there is already in place a perfectly reasonable alternative to the Photo ID in the form of a 'Voter Authority Certificate' ?

Not only that, there is also a free-phone help-line for advice on how to apply and this information is distributed along with the election notification.

It does seem a strange idea, cant say I have seen any reports of some massive increase in voting fraud that might have prompted it.

 

[Jacob]

Why have you omitted to mention that there is already in place a perfectly reasonable alternative to the Photo ID in the form of a 'Voter Authority Certificate' ?

Thats a peculiar question. What else have I omitted? Should I have included a recipe for hot cross buns perhaps?

Not only that, there is also a free-phone help-line for advice on how to apply and this information is distributed along with the election notification.

Yes. But all totally unnecessary as voter fraud has never been an issue, except in the minds of some losers, and the scope for voter fraud is now even wider!
For instance I've had to change my electoral role name back to my birth certificate name ("Jacob" is a nickname I got stuck with years back) but could have hung on and voted on both, with a bit of dodging and weaving.

 

[Keith Cocker]

The tories think it will disenfranchise feeble minded Labour voters.

And young people of course

 

[Keith Cocker]

It does seem a strange idea, cant say I have seen any reports of some massive increase in voting fraud that might have prompted it.

Apparently there have been more Tory MPs investigated for *** offences than there have been cases of electoral fraud in the past 13 years.

 

[J-G]

Thats a peculiar question. What else have I omitted? Should I have included a recipe for hot cross buns perhaps?

Not peculiar at all. You promoted the 'apparent' attempt to restrict the younger voter without saying that there were alternative measures already in place - which totally iradicates any such attempt.

The rest of your statement is just a silly non sequitur.

 

[John Brown]

Why have you omitted to mention that there is already in place a perfectly reasonable alternative to the Photo ID in the form of a 'Voter Authority Certificate' ?

Not only that, there is also a free-phone help-line for advice on how to apply and this information is distributed along with the election notification.

It's still another step in the process, and by all accounts a totally unnecessary one.
What do you think the motivation is?

 

[J-G]

It's still another step in the process, and by all accounts a totally unnecessary one.
What do you think the motivation is?

I have no idea - I try not to concern myself with irrelevant political rhetoric.

The only reason I commented was to provide a 'balance' - which previous posters had tried to avoid.

 

[Jacob]

Not peculiar at all. You promoted the 'apparent' attempt to restrict the younger voter without saying that there were alternative measures already in place - which totally iradicates any such attempt.

It doesn't totally eradicate the attempt. It means people have to take measures instead of just turning up to vote.

 

[Spectric]

All we need is for everyone to have photo ID which can also double up as a UK passport and proof of age, then make voting a legal requirement so that an election represents everyone and not just a selection of the ones that could be bothered but who also winge at the outcome. Then move onto proportional representation so we get a fairer electorial system and replace the house of lords, nothing but a well paid retirement home for the so called elite.

This would move things along and break the two party stalemate so nothing has to be difficult or hard providing you are neutral and open to change rather than having greater self interest.

 

[Terry - Somerset]

The US regards itself, and is regarded by many others as being the largest democracy in the world.

Yet they became the global laughing stock in 2000 due to "hanging chads" and 20 years later their ability to actually count votes cast was questioned by the Trump team.

Politicians are ambitious for power, pressure groups desperate for influence. Both may willingly corrupt the system to achieve their goals.

That voter fraud in the UK may now be at a low level does justify complacency. The most important characteristic of a democracy is free and fair elections. Weaknesses that may compromise the outcome should be properly addressed.

Voter ID seems a very sensible measure to avoid the risk of voter fraud. ID is a basic check without which a car cannot be driven, foreign travel undertaken, or possibly even registration at a GP or getting a library card. Why should the right to vote be any different.

 

[Stan]

Thats a peculiar question. What else have I omitted? Should I have included a recipe for hot cross buns perhaps?

Yes please! This would be much more use than 99.9% of the political pony we are fed. Light on the cinnamon please.

Time for a new slogan: make cakes, not politics.
( Ok, so this is borrowed from somewhere, and needs a little refinement to be catchy enough ).

Seriously:

Somebody more famous than me said "freedom is not free".
This includes the freedom to walk down the road safely at night as well as political freedom.

A problem with voting is that it appears to be free and worthless so a lot of people don't bother. Perhaps if there was some way of limiting some other rights for people who could have voted but didn't, maybe more would make the effort. Trouble is such a system would be unworkable. There would be appeals, appeals against the appeals ..ad nauseam, racking up costs against the public purse better spent on people who actually gave a sh$t. At the very least, people who fail to vote have no right to moan about what they get.

 

[Jacob]

.....

Voter ID seems a very sensible measure to avoid the risk of voter fraud. ID is a basic check without which a car cannot be driven, foreign travel undertaken, or possibly even registration at a GP or getting a library card. Why should the right to vote be any different.

You have to be on the electoral role in the first place so it's not that different.

 

[mwinfrance]

Everyone has to produce photo ID to vote in elections here in France ( non french, like me , can only vote in local elections ) and also to show a voter ID card ( which has no photo but is in the same name as the photo ID ). If you are old enough to vote here, you will have photo ID, as photo ID cards are issued upon your 16th birthday.When my son turned 16 the form for him to get his photo ID card arrived automatically. The photo ID card is free.

The local mairie ( town hall / city hall ) issues a voter ID card upon request and production of photo ID and proof of residence.

Theoretically everyone has to carry ID here all the time, what is accepted as ID is officially the free photo ID card, or a driving licence, or a passport, or another form of ID papers issued by the Govt in the case of foreigners.

I've never found being required to have ID on me, and, or photo ID to vote to be any imposition.

I'd be perfectly happy if voting was compulsory here, as long as it is possible to vote "non of the above" , here that is called "vote blanc", and is allowed, despite voting not being compulsory.

 

[paulrbarnard]

A simple solution is to alternate between the main parties, forget about voting completely. Most parties are ineffectual in their first term, screw things up in their second and become completely abhorrent in subsequent terms.
Swapping from ineffectual left to ineffectual right at each ‘election’ is probably the most desirable outcome for the country.

 

[Agent_zed]

A simple solution is to alternate between the main parties, forget about voting completely. Most parties are ineffectual in their first term, screw things up in their second and become completely abhorrent in subsequent terms.
Swapping from ineffectual left to ineffectual right at each ‘election’ is probably the most desirable outcome for the country.

I'm pretty sure that's what Putin has been doing since 2000. Flip flopping back and forth into Presidential position.

Isn't really working out so well for everyone right now.

But I do agree in some respects. Part of the problem is if you aren't in power you don't want to agree with the things that will actually help the country as that will also mean the other party are more likely to stay in power. So everyone is actively fighting against the best interests of the country so they can get power and ultimately not achieve all that much.

Same with the SNP. If they do a good job then a devolved government works and no reason to change. But also has the problem that if they do a rubbish job then how could they run an independant country.