Should be instant confiscation and crushing of the vehicle, same for no insurance. Make them walk home too…
Have you noticed....
- Thread starter Cozzer
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So do the large number of people in France and elsewhere that he owes money to.
I understand from chatting to only a few people (I avoid people if I can), that they think SUVs are safe - but this is not upheld by the tests, according to the EU ENCAP (dare I mention the EU), of the top 10 safest cars only one is an SUV.
John Brown
Freeloading Social media influenza
Sorry, can anyone direct me to the woodwork forum? I seem to have taken a wrong turning, and ended up in the Daily Mail letters column! Why oh why does this keep happening! I blame the wokerati snowflake EV driving tree hugging pronoun pushers..
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You seem to have missed ( in your haste to rant ) the title of the sub forum "general chat off topic".
John Brown
Freeloading Social media influenza
Ah! Ok! Thanks. It all makes perfect sense now.You seem to have missed ( in your haste to rant ) the title of the sub forum "general chat off topic".
Hello! Thats me, or would be if I could afford an EV.
If the various governments were really serious about EVs, they'd make the price something that most peoplecould afford, most people would then buy them, and a large part of the energy / pollution problem would be solved.
Instead they offer subsidies at purchase of an EV, but not enough, so only relatively rich people ( like my neighbour , who is waiting for his and will be keeping his polluting VW caravel as well ) can afford them even with the subsidy.The leccy they run on is then subsidised , as are the domestic charging installations.Subsidised by those who cannot afford to buy one even with the current subsidies, and who are then told that their taxes must increase because they are polluting and in order to pay for the transition to "clean energy".
As a result, the average person who cannot afford an EV feels that it is all a scam ( about 50% is ) to get the average person to pay for the rich people's EV transport. when the people see that they are increasingly taxed for this, that they personally cannot "clean up" via EV transport for themselves, they begin to resent the taxes they pay and then move on to doubting the science, wrongly, but justifiably.
Most of the rich don't really care about the coming problems due to climate changes etc, they think that they can insulate themselves from such problems in their large air conditioned houses, safe behind the doors in the security patrolled grounds.As long as the politicians continue using the poor to subsidise the rich EV transition, the rich are correct in the short term in their assumptions.
No single person should be able to get any subsidy from public money to buy an EV car if that same person also keeps a non EV vehicle and uses the EV as a second "clean washing" vehicle.
Instead they offer subsidies at purchase of an EV, but not enough, so only relatively rich people ( like my neighbour , who is waiting for his and will be keeping his polluting VW caravel as well ) can afford them even with the subsidy.The leccy they run on is then subsidised , as are the domestic charging installations.Subsidised by those who cannot afford to buy one even with the current subsidies, and who are then told that their taxes must increase because they are polluting and in order to pay for the transition to "clean energy".
As a result, the average person who cannot afford an EV feels that it is all a scam ( about 50% is ) to get the average person to pay for the rich people's EV transport. when the people see that they are increasingly taxed for this, that they personally cannot "clean up" via EV transport for themselves, they begin to resent the taxes they pay and then move on to doubting the science, wrongly, but justifiably.
Most of the rich don't really care about the coming problems due to climate changes etc, they think that they can insulate themselves from such problems in their large air conditioned houses, safe behind the doors in the security patrolled grounds.As long as the politicians continue using the poor to subsidise the rich EV transition, the rich are correct in the short term in their assumptions.
No single person should be able to get any subsidy from public money to buy an EV car if that same person also keeps a non EV vehicle and uses the EV as a second "clean washing" vehicle.
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Lons
Established Member
Of course it would
Or rather everything would grind to a halt because the infrastructure isn't there to support it an d it's highly likely the grid couldn't cope anyway. I could do it as I have a drive but my son has no chance at the minute as it's street parking and his wife especially would be stuffed. Being a specialist nurse and on often call, if she couldn't get to a patient in time the consequences could be serious. Is she supposed to get on a bike or take a bus at 2 am.We don't live in fantasy world yet.
Agree about the infrastructure not being remotely in place for everyone to go EV..but if they want the average person to beleive them, they have to drastically drop the prices, or make the subventions to buy only available to those who do not make more than twice the minimum wage, or preferably do both those things.rather than as now ( in the UK and France ) subsidising the rich so that they can buy an EV to use for the school run or to take little Jean-Bernard and Sophie-Angel to ballet whilst sneering at the plebs ( whose taxes pay for the subsidies on the EVs ) in their second hand old diesels., which probably pollute less than the Chelsea tractor driven by Jean-Bernard's and Sophie-Angel's dad, which he kept when he bought the EV ( with a subsidy from public taxes ), to be used by the kid's mum.
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If he keeps both chances are he will drive the EV more so the purpose has been fulfilled. In other words his use of the polluting caravel will reduce. A plus point here is he will still be paying full excise duty for the caravel.
The fundamental problem is the fact that the cars people are buying are designed for their maximum capacity, not to suit their majority use case. Vehicles need to be much smaller than they are now.
Unfortunately Paul that will not be the case.Since I last mentioned his arriving EV here he has thought about the limited range ( Dacia Spring, range 200-250km with nothing switched on ). He announced today that he will use the EV to go to his bank ( once per month, round trip 2km, to go to the supermarket, once per week, round trip 2km, and to go to the nearest town once every two months or so for medical reasons, round trip 25km ) each of these places he finds the caravel too difficult to park.He has scraped the side of it 5 times in the last year while parking and 2 times on his own gateposts, his insurers have increased his premium to 4 times the original, and have now said that another accident with the caravel and they will refuse to insure him.
Apparently it was this threat that pushed him to go for the Dacia as it is smaller and he thinks will be easier to park.
He will continue to use the caravel to collect his adult son from the town where he works each Friday and return him on each Sunday .Journey each way 250km, so 4000km per month.He also saves his newspapers, and takes them , using his caravel, in a carton once per month to his sister ( who lives 125km from here ) who donates them to a church who are using the collected newspapers to sell as a recycle to raise money to repair their roof. Round trip 250km, due to worries about the EVs range he intends using it for any other long journeys such as a twice yearly journey to take his son's family to a spa in the french alps, round trip including excursions about 3500 km, so yearly 7000 km.
Total EV kms per year about 300 to 350kms max..Total kms per year in caravel ( consumption ..he has a "heavy foot on the diesel and on the brakes and stays a long time in low gears with the engine racing 10 to 12 litres per 100km ) around 65000 kms..yes he has a huge fuel bill also tyres etc, yet complains about a yearly servicing charge of €350.oo , He can afford to run the caravel, even with the extremely high kms he does yearly, but will run the EV so as to be able ( he hopes ) to avoid scrapes when parking locally.
When the caravel gives up the ghost due to mechanical wear high km , he intends to buy a diesel Merc to last him the rest of his life, he is 79.He is happy that the EV will last him to as he says "the end of his days".
I know Carnies here whose total km make his total kms look like small beer, they all drive Merc or BMW or Lexus diesels, they have EVs on a trailer that they two behind their caravans. for a "run about" when they are parked up on a fairground, the diesels are for driving to marriages and family gatherings and going to Italy to look at new attractions before buying them.
They all drive vehicles which are recent ( they trade them on every couple of years within the families ) recent diesels here are considered "clean" even after the VW etc emissions scandal, Vehicles are designated "clean" basqed upon their year of manufacture, no matter what their actual emissions.According to the owner of our nearest vehicle testing station ( cars are tested here every two years ) the modern diesels have actual emissions ( Co2 NO and particulate ) which are two or three times higher than my 25 year old Clio. but they are allowed into major towns because they are "clean" due to their year, whereas my car is considered dirty, due to it"s year.Real figures don't matter, the idea is to sell new cars. Tyres cause more particulate problems than a clean diesel engine, the heavier the car the more wear on the tyres, the more wear the more tyre particulates thrown into the air. EVs weigh more than the equivalent IC engine car, a lot more. Owner of a tyre supplier I know says that he changes EV tyres due to wear at a ratio of 3 EV tyres to one IC car tyre.The bigger heavier EVs like Teslas it is 4 to 5 times more tyres per kms driven than the equivalent size IC car. He loves EVs, they are making him richer faster than he thought he would be when he opened his business.
He drives an IC Lexus.
SWMBO goes every where by her own power, walking or cycle, around 15kms per day 6 days per week, 365.
I do about 5000kms per year nowadays by car, including visits to wood yards, tree sites, shopping, medical visits etc. Used to be about two to three times that when I was working decorating carny stuff, harleys, planes, boats etc.Scaled it all back nowadays.Building a tricycle ( recumbent ) amongst other things in the free time that I don't have. Might get an EV motorcycle or EV trike in a few years.I'd make one but France is not very friendly to self builds. legal nightmare to get anything non standard road legal here.
Apparently it was this threat that pushed him to go for the Dacia as it is smaller and he thinks will be easier to park.
He will continue to use the caravel to collect his adult son from the town where he works each Friday and return him on each Sunday .Journey each way 250km, so 4000km per month.He also saves his newspapers, and takes them , using his caravel, in a carton once per month to his sister ( who lives 125km from here ) who donates them to a church who are using the collected newspapers to sell as a recycle to raise money to repair their roof. Round trip 250km, due to worries about the EVs range he intends using it for any other long journeys such as a twice yearly journey to take his son's family to a spa in the french alps, round trip including excursions about 3500 km, so yearly 7000 km.
Total EV kms per year about 300 to 350kms max..Total kms per year in caravel ( consumption ..he has a "heavy foot on the diesel and on the brakes and stays a long time in low gears with the engine racing 10 to 12 litres per 100km ) around 65000 kms..yes he has a huge fuel bill also tyres etc, yet complains about a yearly servicing charge of €350.oo , He can afford to run the caravel, even with the extremely high kms he does yearly, but will run the EV so as to be able ( he hopes ) to avoid scrapes when parking locally.
When the caravel gives up the ghost due to mechanical wear high km , he intends to buy a diesel Merc to last him the rest of his life, he is 79.He is happy that the EV will last him to as he says "the end of his days".
I know Carnies here whose total km make his total kms look like small beer, they all drive Merc or BMW or Lexus diesels, they have EVs on a trailer that they two behind their caravans. for a "run about" when they are parked up on a fairground, the diesels are for driving to marriages and family gatherings and going to Italy to look at new attractions before buying them.
They all drive vehicles which are recent ( they trade them on every couple of years within the families ) recent diesels here are considered "clean" even after the VW etc emissions scandal, Vehicles are designated "clean" basqed upon their year of manufacture, no matter what their actual emissions.According to the owner of our nearest vehicle testing station ( cars are tested here every two years ) the modern diesels have actual emissions ( Co2 NO and particulate ) which are two or three times higher than my 25 year old Clio. but they are allowed into major towns because they are "clean" due to their year, whereas my car is considered dirty, due to it"s year.Real figures don't matter, the idea is to sell new cars. Tyres cause more particulate problems than a clean diesel engine, the heavier the car the more wear on the tyres, the more wear the more tyre particulates thrown into the air. EVs weigh more than the equivalent IC engine car, a lot more. Owner of a tyre supplier I know says that he changes EV tyres due to wear at a ratio of 3 EV tyres to one IC car tyre.The bigger heavier EVs like Teslas it is 4 to 5 times more tyres per kms driven than the equivalent size IC car. He loves EVs, they are making him richer faster than he thought he would be when he opened his business.
He drives an IC Lexus.
SWMBO goes every where by her own power, walking or cycle, around 15kms per day 6 days per week, 365.
I do about 5000kms per year nowadays by car, including visits to wood yards, tree sites, shopping, medical visits etc. Used to be about two to three times that when I was working decorating carny stuff, harleys, planes, boats etc.Scaled it all back nowadays.Building a tricycle ( recumbent ) amongst other things in the free time that I don't have. Might get an EV motorcycle or EV trike in a few years.I'd make one but France is not very friendly to self builds. legal nightmare to get anything non standard road legal here.
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Or we, as a society, are behaving less well.
Where once, we had police officers on the beat with limited mobility, we now have officers with cars and radios who can respond much faster.
Beeching just made a report on the railways. The government of the time made the cuts.
stuart little
Established Member
I'm one who has been encouraged not to drive! Glad I sold my car of 21yrs with a tax rate then of £340 [last Sept.] now the tax is £640. Yet one can buy a 'classic' oil burner, no MOT nor tax required! WHY?,WHY? How many owners of such vehicles are aware of the 'time life' of tyres, I ask? I was a low mileage driver 30K in 21 yrs, but replaced more rear tyres that were beyond their 'use-by-date'starting to perish, than worn out, including one 'blow out, that I'd mised.
I have to confess to less than stellar eco credentials as I own a 24 year old Defender. It does about 2000 miles a year mainly with the dog in the back or for carting heavy stuff around in the back or in a trailer. I have not worn a set of tires out on it for years (I’ve owned it for 20 years) but I have to replace them periodically due to perishing and tire life rating. I just replaced them for the latest MOT, including the un-driven spare. That was £1250…
bansobaby
Accustomly titled
I have no particular banner to wave on this, other than to say that I am a fervent supporter of doing what we can to mitigate the damage that we as a race have done to our planet.
But I would like to make a couple of observations:
On "cars should be smaller": cars are larger these days primarily as a result of increased safety demands.
On "electric cars": time will tell us fairly soon, but as an engineer I'm of the opinion that in the UK at least, there is not a snowballs chance of the critical infrastructure coping with the demand, especially when most of our electricity will be trying to squeeze enough heat from fresh air to keep us warm. And don't get me started on the environmental damage caused during their manufacture.....
On "buses": around here the average bus has a similar average occupancy to the cars. I totally agree that this is cause and effect, but it is the case nonetheless.
Lastly, my "SUV" (an acronym for a term written by someone with a passing acquaintance of the English language) weighs 2.5 tons; the only regular passenger has four legs, big teeth and drools; it carries lots of very heavy, delicate and expensive equipment; regularly does 300 to 400 miles a day and for example is right now 2 miles from the nearest public road, let alone public transport. Again, I agree that this is not the norm.......just saying that I wouldn't want to be in an SUV that only weighed a ton when it was hit by a bus........
But I would like to make a couple of observations:
On "cars should be smaller": cars are larger these days primarily as a result of increased safety demands.
On "electric cars": time will tell us fairly soon, but as an engineer I'm of the opinion that in the UK at least, there is not a snowballs chance of the critical infrastructure coping with the demand, especially when most of our electricity will be trying to squeeze enough heat from fresh air to keep us warm. And don't get me started on the environmental damage caused during their manufacture.....
On "buses": around here the average bus has a similar average occupancy to the cars. I totally agree that this is cause and effect, but it is the case nonetheless.
Lastly, my "SUV" (an acronym for a term written by someone with a passing acquaintance of the English language) weighs 2.5 tons; the only regular passenger has four legs, big teeth and drools; it carries lots of very heavy, delicate and expensive equipment; regularly does 300 to 400 miles a day and for example is right now 2 miles from the nearest public road, let alone public transport. Again, I agree that this is not the norm.......just saying that I wouldn't want to be in an SUV that only weighed a ton when it was hit by a bus........
But he has replaced some of the caravel trips! The same holds true to the carnies you mention. Not all trips are suited to all vehicles. Most long distant hauliers wouldn’t chose a fleet of minis, to use a silly example.
The locations with the most impact of pollution are the cities, exactly the places where you describe the EV being used.
Now of course there is the problem of tire and brake particulates, the congestion and the storage/charging challenges to also be aware of but frankly your neighbour and the car use are making a positive impact, albeit in a very small way.
stuart little
Established Member
The 'old SAAB 900 Classic', had reverse lights in the front indicator/side lamp which directed light back to let you see the front end was clear of obstacles - very useful I found.
Agent_zed
Established Member
Sorry don't agree with this statement. In my opinion cars are larger as people have more money (or did) or at least access to more money via loans etc than they used to so car companies make cars that are bigger as they can charge a premium for them.
The idea that I could have had a brand new car when i was 20 was ludicrous, but now most young people drive nicer cars than I have. The difference though is I own my car but they buy on finance.
My neighbours have 2 audi's, one is a Q8. I'm 99.9% sure they are on finance which is how they can afford them. In the past when you had to buy it outright they would not have had such huge luxury cars as like most people they wouldn't have been able to afford them.
Very few people need a 4x4 (in your case it is appropriate) but they still buy them as it is a status symbol. If safety was priority they wouldn't buy them as they regularly score badly on ncap and are 50% more likely to roll in an accident.
Safety is an “arms race”. Many years ago someone said the greatest contributor to road safety would be a 12inch steel spike coming out of the steering wheel.
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