Festool

[chippy1970]

My TS55 cannot drive me to site yet but he makes a great cup of tea :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:

 

[DangerousDave]

Just out of curiosity, why the Festool over the Mafell M55 CC which got a better review in the mags. It it much more expensive? The Mafell certainly doesn't look as ergonomic but I guess its performance that counts.

I've no doubt the Mafell is an excellent bit of kit, and they offer a 3year warranty as well. My suppliers didn't have one in stock; I only got to see the DeWalt and the Festool. D&M are doing the Mafell KSS300 with 1.4m guide rail for £409. An additional 1.6m rail is £87.95 but the connecting bar is a whopping £47.25 :shock: So, all in there's not too much difference in price. I've never seen the Mafell in action, so I can't comment on its performance, but I'm sure it's good

 

[p111dom]

Krikey I cut stuff up in the car park all the time. No ones every said I can't. The guys at the depot even give me a hand carrying it out. I just use a straight edge clamp and a 18v saw at the moment. The results aren't great with regards to breakout etc. A plunge saw would be an ideal if not expensive solution but like I say only in cordless form. I haven't seen the Mafel either in the flesh but the mags seem to suggest that it has features the Festool doesn't. I was just asking if anyone else had used one.

As for saying anything battery powered is a toy I think thats untrue and unfair. Its a fact that my 18v circular saw is poor and underpowered but I've seen this in action an it was impressive. Like I say all the advantages none of the drawbacks appart from the price of course.

As for Chippy1970's comments in one post you say,

"I don't think a panel saw would do a better job."

And then

"Oh and I never said a ts55 was better than a panel saw "

Sounds a bit contradictory. Perhaps its indecisiveness?

And I was mistaken. you origionally said 10-20 seconds not 20-30. No I didn't call you a liar but perhaps if you're so truthful you'd like to post a video with you unpacking the saw and cutting sheets material accurately in 10 seconds before taking the hump. We'll just call is exaggeration shall we. :wink:

 

[CNC Paul]

Dom,

It looks like you supplier has no regard for H & S or risk assessment.

Would I spend nearly £600 in a saw which gave a poor finish....No

Unless they have changed the Mafell it is not as quick to setup as the festool with regards to the blade to rail offset, maybe someone else could chime in here.

The Festool now has the rip guide for parallel rips down to 20mm or so.

 

[p111dom]

Thanks Paul. I guess I'll have to try and find somewhere that has the Mafell on demo I guess. I think its a bit of a shame. Mafell and Milwaukee don't seem to have anything like the following of some of the others but I rate them highly as tools. I did the same with Delta and bought one of their mitre saws but subsequently in the UK, Delta have fizzled out. I saw a page in a catalogue a few weeks ago which has several pages on the Festool rail saws but some of the prices were a lot lower for seemingly the same capacities. The only difference I think was a break and possbly a wave control. The body seemed the same but the serial numbers differed slightly. All still corded though but are the more expensive ones worth the extra? I'll try and find the catalogue in the meantime so I can post what I'm on about.

 

[p111dom]

Sorry I can't find it anywhere. I think it was a flier from the Anglia Tools Centre which on one page had tow TS55's. Both from recollection had 1.4m rails but the one to the top of the page had about 6 bullet points and the lower one only 4. The two missing points on the cheaper saw were electronic speed control and a mention of a break. The cheaper one was about £295 which seemed less than I expected. Like I say the serial numbers were similar but deffinately different. I know Festool adds a letter if its 110v but it seemed to be a bit more than that. Its possibly a missprint or I have read it wrong. Do they make differeing models of the TS55?

 

[p111dom]

Prices seem to be...

TS55EBQ-PLUS-FS saw plus 1.4m rail for £411.70
TS55EQ-PLUS-FS-GB saw plus 1.4m rail for £411.70
TS55Q-PLUS-FS-GB saw plus 1.4m rail for £334.65

Then there's just the saw no rail which are...

TS55EQ-PLUS-GB for £369.00
TS55Q-PLUS-GB for £289.80

So its the 'E' which seems to make the difference. Obviously you'd want the rail but there's quite a difference in price between the TS55Q and TS55EQ. Worth the extra?

 

[Mr Ed]

I have the Mafell KSP55F, which I think is the predecessor to the one you are talking about. I've had it for 7 years now and found it a brilliant tool, BUT what is good is the principle of using a track mounted saw to break down sheet goods, not necessarily the particular brand. I bought Mafell because it was the only one I was aware of that offered this setup - don't know if Festool were doing this type of saw 7 years ago.

The Mafell has excellent build quality and precision and will last out my requirements, however if I was buying now I would be considering the Festool as the leader in class to match up to. I haven't used a Festool one, but all the feedback is positive, so they must be doing something right. That said, I can't easily see what more a saw of this type could do that the Mafell doesn't do for me?

Cheers, Ed

 

[chippy1970]

This could go on for ever, I did not say the ts55 was better than a panel saw if you read it right. but for me and what I do I cannot carry a huge panel saw to someones house obviously that makes it a better option for ME personally.

I was commenting on you saying about a "panel saw with a scoring blade" well if you had ever used a TS55 you would know that you can actually score cut with it and get as good a cut as a panel saw when cutting veneered panels say. Look at CNC Pauls post he said the cut is as good as his panel saw too.

Heres a list of codes for you may help you

TS = Plunge Saw
55 = Depth of cut (in mm)
E = Electronics (variable speed plus soft start)
B = Brake
Q = Plug it removable mains cable system
Plus = Comes in a Systainer case
FS = Comes with a Guide Rail
GB = GB spec with UK 3 pin plug

Oh and I have seen the Maffell demo'ed at the D&M show it was ok a few good ideas on it like the depth gauge simply twists around to adjust for thickness of the rail for when used on or off the rail.

 

[Petiegolfer]

I dont have a table saw. I probably wont get one.

I do have a TS55 and assorted rails. Two 1400's...yes I made that mistake. An 800 a couple of 1080s one with the hole drilling kit and a 3000m

If you are going to buy the TS55....do not buy the same length rail! Unless you do a lot of site work and carrying two 1400's is easiest.
Go 800/1080 1400 1900 3000. The 3000 gives you more room and you dont have to plunge to start your cut I have the new fs-pa as well and they add to the flexibility of the system.

In additon I have the hole drilling kit a domino an OF1010 router a CTL22 two 1080 tables..... I have the green addiction!

If you want to see what festools can do when you start to think about how to use them....

www.festoolownersgroup.com

and

www.talkfestool.com

Are two websites dedicated to the green machines.

Lots of TS55's on ebay at the moment with boys being laid off and the crunch biting.

Piers

 

[p111dom]

Yes it's a shame about the layoffs at the moment. I agree the track idea is a good one regardless of brand. Thanks for the key Chippy that makes things a little clearer. Don't see why they have to make it so complicated though. Surely it costs more to do a double production run of the two products than make just one with all the features. I take it that the bodies are the same so the dust extraction will be just as good on either?

 

[FatFreddysCat]

I've never seen the Mafell in action, so I can't comment on its performance, but I'm sure it's good

Oner of the subs came in a few weeks back and "demoed" his MT55cc and it looks good. Typical Mafell, well made and acurate. Even comes in a Systainer. We have a TS55 at work so we had them lined up side by side. One of the nuicest things for us is that the MT55cc will happily use the Festool rails and most of the accessories. The Mafell lacks the chip break-out thingy that the Festool has. Not sure how much use that is. Our TS55 is a year old and we've never used it. Instead it has an automatic scoring facility where the first cut is made backwards from the far end of the material at a depth of 2mm or so then flick of a lever and the saw is plunged full depth and the full cut is made. It also tilts to 47° which can be useful.

I also went and took a look at the deWalt and the Makita on the same day, partly because they'll run on our existing Festool track. Don't like the plunge motion on the deWalt but the Makita SP6000K1 looks good partly because they're a good £100 or more under the price of a Festool.

Unless they have changed the Mafell it is not as quick to setup as the festool with regards to the blade to rail offset, maybe someone else could chime in here.

The MT55cc is almost identical to the TS55, Paul. The moving scale for bevel ripping looked interesting, but may just be a gimick. The one thing I didn't ask about was if the MT55cc is braked in 110 volt - the TS55 certainly isn't

 

[woof]

Interesting thread and informative.

Bottom line - I want one! Is there a closed shop on Festool prices? Where do people buy this from - I get most of my gear from Axminster and see they do the TS. Has anyone had a 10% voucher this year - I haven't! Mind you, I seem to remember that Festool products were omitted from the 10% voucher.

 

[CNC Paul]

Woof,

Just a reminder Festool stuff will rise in price by 5-7% in May.

 

[RogerS]

Interesting. I've had the TS55 for a while and my take is..

I like the plunge action.

I've learned the hard way that if you use the saw to cut at an angle then you screw up your reference edge

That you need different green thingies that stop the breakout if you change your depth of cut

Their right-angle add-on for the guide rail is crap

I like the overall package

Cutting sheet is a doddle because I lean all my sheets against the wall and drop them down easily until I get to the one before the one I want, slip in my sheet of Kingspan then lay the one I'm going to cut down on top. No hernias for me manoeuvring an 8x4 sheet onto a panel saw.

parallel cuts are a pain but looking at the dollar price of $325 for their parallel guide looks equally painful....

...so much so that an idea ferkling away at the back of the brain is to see if i can use the TS55 with the EZguide and see what their parallel cut arrangements are like...??

 

[ivan]

The new Mafell has a purpose built scoring-by-backward-cut position, which my older saw lacks (also less good extraction). My (Mafell) saw also plunges on columns like a router, rather than tilts into work, possibly better for plunge cuts.

The main point of all these saws is the retractable riving knife. Any saw thus fitted can do the backward scoring cut 2mm deep followed by the normal forward cut, for a chip free finish without having to replace the Festool outbord splinterguard (sold in 5s). The saw bearings and guide rail arrangement does need to be top class tho'.

 

[chippy1970]

I've learned the hard way that if you use the saw to cut at an angle then you screw up your reference edge

If you are talking about the rubber anti splinter strip on the guide rail you must be doing something wrong Roger, because I have cut loads of bevelled cuts and still have an intact anti splinter edge. I am sure it even mentions in the Festool advertising about bevel cuts being right on the same line as straight cuts because of the way the saw leans over when adjusting bevel angle.

Ivan,

when I saw the Mafell saw demonstrated they did the scoring chip free cut in front of me on some chipboard and to be honest I wasnt that impressed it still had a few chips, when I have to cut stuff like that I usually run the saw forward set at about 8mm thats about 3 mm into the surface then adjust to full depth and cut again. This works well, I have tried once I think running the saw backwards at 8 mm deep but I dont think the cut was any better.

 

[RogerS]

I've learned the hard way that if you use the saw to cut at an angle then you screw up your reference edge

If you are talking about the rubber anti splinter strip on the guide rail you must be doing something wrong Roger, because I have cut loads of bevelled cuts and still have an intact anti splinter edge. I am sure it even mentions in the Festool advertising about bevel cuts being right on the same line as straight cuts because of the way the saw leans over when adjusting bevel angle.

.

Yup..that's what I was referring to though can't see what there is to 'go wrong' as you put it. I'm wondering if when you make the bevel cut one must make a bevel cut on the splinter guard as well which then gives it a point of weakness maybe? But then you'd also have a problem. Strange.

 

[gasman]

I know that Festools are excluded from the Axi 10% offers, but the last 2 times they have had such offers, I have just gone ahead and bought a Festool and then the 10% discount has been applied... so it is worth a try

 

[chippy1970]

I've learned the hard way that if you use the saw to cut at an angle then you screw up your reference edge

If you are talking about the rubber anti splinter strip on the guide rail you must be doing something wrong Roger, because I have cut loads of bevelled cuts and still have an intact anti splinter edge. I am sure it even mentions in the Festool advertising about bevel cuts being right on the same line as straight cuts because of the way the saw leans over when adjusting bevel angle.

.

Yup..that's what I was referring to though can't see what there is to 'go wrong' as you put it. I'm wondering if when you make the bevel cut one must make a bevel cut on the splinter guard as well which then gives it a point of weakness maybe? But then you'd also have a problem. Strange.

Excuse the crude drawing but this is how I see it works when set to bevel the angled line is the blade which just touches the bottom edge of the rubber strip on the guide rail. This is why I cant see how you are messing up your reference edge on yours.