Festool Kapex Recall

[Doug71]

Seems a bit daft that the saws have to go to Germany for the fix, you would think it would be easier for everyone if they just fixed them here in the UK?

 

[scholar]

My Kapex was picked up by UPS on 4/6/21 for its trip to Germany. I received neither receipt nor email confirmation that it had been picked up.
The UPS site has been unable to locate it using the tracking no. that Festool gave me since it set off on its journey.
"Unable to complete your tracking request at this time. Please try again later."

If the TR is not recognised by UPS, then UPS cannot confirm its existence or wherabouts, according to the lady with whom I managed to speak.

My advice to anyone giving their saw to a chap with a van would be to either insist on a receipt or take a photo of the fellow, the box and the van. It might, but probably won't, help in the event of a need to make a claim.

Phil - ever hopeful.

Ah! I didn’t do this. My box was collected on 3rd June - I haven’t even got a copy of the tracking number. What I do have is the email confirming the collection booking and that just shows a collection reference - that does at least provide a link to UPS stating it was successfully collected.

I think @Glenhyrst ’s advice is sound.

Incidentally, when I was trying to book the collection online, I ran into difficulty when inputting the tracking number from the label provided, because the UPS system kept saying that charges may apply and would not let me proceed - eventually, I just booked the collection without entering the tracking number - it seemed to work OK from there. But we shall see.., hopefully later this week.

Cheers

 

[paulrbarnard]

A large part of the delay has been down to the fact that post-brexit, there would be export/import duties applied on each saw; this has taken some time to work around, and I received an email from Festool explaining this. My empty box was delivered last week, and the full box is being collected on Monday, with an expected turnaround time of 10 working days. My Kapex is 8 years old; I have no complaints, so far.

Shipping to and from Germany is now a nightmare. I shipped some test kit from our U.K. office to our German office and it was held in German customs for four weeks and it cost me £2000 in duty to get it released. This kit had been shipped back and forth five or six times previously over the last few years. All the kit had been bought years ago with duty paid in various EU countries, U.K., France, Germany, but German customs insisted on charging duty on the new price of the kit. Most of it was fully deprecated on our books. Then once we finally did get it out of customs, too late to use for the job, it was shipped to the US only to arrive back in Germany a few days later as German customs are now insisting on using a registered broker of any shipment above a set value. This does seem to be specific to Germany and I am hearing a lot of complaints about this situation. Perhaps German customs has always been this bad but we just didn’t see it before Brexit.

 

[MikeK]

Please don't turn this thread into a BREXIT discussion; otherwise, it will be moved to the Off-Topic II forum where such discussions are allowed.

Shipping between the UK and Germany has always been interesting for me. When I attended the week-long courses offered by David Charlesworth in 2019 and early 2020, I shipped my tools to and from his shop. In each case, I used Mail Boxes Etc as the shipping agent and UPS as the carrier for both directions. The cost to ship from Germany to the UK was about €65, while the return shipping from the UK to Germany was about £235. In each case, the same box was used for the round-trip shipping, the shipping weight of the box was the same, and the shipment was insured for the same amount of loss.

I shipped my tools so that I could travel with just a backpack for my clothes and no checked bags. If I do this again, I'll use a Pelican container and check my tools on the flight.

 

[TheTiddles]

Seems a bit daft that the saws have to go to Germany for the fix, you would think it would be easier for everyone if they just fixed them here in the UK?

You know Festool is made in Germany right?

 

[paulrbarnard]

Please don't turn this thread into a BREXIT discussion; otherwise, it will be moved to the Off-Topic II forum where such discussions are allowed.

Shipping between the UK and Germany has always been interesting for me. When I attended the week-long courses offered by David Charlesworth in 2019 and early 2020, I shipped my tools to and from his shop. In each case, I used Mail Boxes Etc as the shipping agent and UPS as the carrier for both directions. The cost to ship from Germany to the UK was about €65, while the return shipping from the UK to Germany was about £235. In each case, the same box was used for the round-trip shipping, the shipping weight of the box was the same, and the shipment was insured for the same amount of loss.

I shipped my tools so that I could travel with just a backpack for my clothes and no checked bags. If I do this again, I'll use a Pelican container and check my tools on the flight.

I didn’t intend to divert the discussion in that direction.
An interesting point about the peli case. All our test kit was in a peli case, we shipped the case, as we usually have an engineer travel with it. With Covid we decided to ship a kit so an engineer in country could use it if our U.K. based FAE couldn’t travel. As it turned out the FAE did manage to travel and took another kit with her. However she got stopped by customs who insisted she needed a carnet for the equipment now. Fortunately she managed to get away with a warning not to travel without a carnet again.
you might need documentation to show the value of your tools is less than the personal duty free allowance even if you take them with you in a peli case.

 

[Doug71]

You know Festool is made in Germany right?

Both times my Kapex motor was replaced it was done here in the UK.

I guess Festool have just employed some company in Germany to do all the motor swaps (or whatever is involved).

It sounds like the whole shipping to Germany thing isn't that straightforward, I'm sure shipping to Bury St Edmunds would be much easier.

Anyway I trust Festool will have done the maths and worked out that the Germany thing is the best option for them.

 

[Hartwood]

You know Festool is made in Germany right?

Festool is a German company but the 3rd party company handling the refit has an address in Bury St Edmonds

@Hartwood - That sounds frustrating with the holdup at UPS, but you are possibly being a little harsh on Festool in this case.

I don’t think there are many companies that would undertake such a recall programme for products sold 13 years ago (as in my case) - by all accounts the machines come back having been given a pretty good overhaul as well as the electrical problem being fixed - mine is currently in Germany and due back shortly, so we shall see.

I also registered mine for the retrofit over New Year - I got an email and a phone call at various stages explaining that they had encountered logistics problems (possibly with the UK only) and the recall was delayed to Q2 as is now happening. I got another phone call to confirm all the details regarding the shipping box and timing which has all happened like clockwork. I have been critical of Festool UK’s service function based on a few experiences, but in this case, I feel that the original outlay on what has been an excellent machine has been more than vindicated.

I trust your glitch will get sorted out quickly.

Cheers

You may well be right and others experience seems better than mine and the quality of the machine is not in doubt generally. But having lost one workshop to fire, it's concerning to have a machine that "may" catch fire.

It's the fact that all along there has been zero contact initiated by Festool or their agents and when they do respond to my communications to them I have to tell them to read the email several times before I get an answer. Yes stuff gets lost and an empty box is of little significance, but it does not inspire confidence. The changes we have seen since we left the EU have been known about for quite some time and so why Festool could not have done the refit in the UK and saved the issues of customs etc is a mystery.

Initially they said they would need the machine for 48 hours, now it's up to a week plus transit time both ways. I have just checked the tracker for my replacement box, delivery is still down as being by the end of Tuesday, but the thing is still in Germany and hasn't moved in 4 days, no way it will get to me until at least Thursday. Peter Parfett commented that maybe it's because I am in the Highlands. Heaven help us if queen Nicola gets her way.

The real sad thing this debacle highlights is the decline in British made tools and machines.

 

[Hartwood]

Both times my Kapex motor was replaced it was done here in the UK.

I guess Festool have just employed some company in Germany to do all the motor swaps (or whatever is involved).

It sounds like the whole shipping to Germany thing isn't that straightforward, I'm sure shipping to Bury St Edmunds would be much easier.

Anyway I trust Festool will have done the maths and worked out that the Germany thing is the best option for them.

But this is customer service, what about doing the best for the customers. I have one mitre saw and work that needs to be done. I scheduled my work load around the date they gave and have failed to meet through no fault of mine. I now have to reschedule again whilst trying to make sure my customers don't suffer what is a problem with Festool.

 

[Distinterior]

Hartwood,

Have you reached out to your local Festool (TTS) representative...? I've always found mine to be really helpful and I have heard tell that they have on occasion, arranged the use of a loan tool to help out a customer in similar circumstances to you.

I have only had to have one tool sent back to Bury St Edmund's and it was an absolutely painless exercise....

 

[Doug B]

It's the fact that all along there has been zero contact initiated by Festool or their agents

This does surprise me I’ve not got in touch with Festool or the folks handling the shipping but they’ve emailed me 3 times & phoned prior to the box arriving.

I fully understand your frustrations with UPS but that’s not down to Festool other than they’ve employed them to do the shipping & is certainly not a reflection on Festool products.

Whilst I also understand the inconvenience of being without the saw as I’ve had to rig up my tracksaw to do cuts I’d normally do with the kapex in the workshop but it’s not the end of the world after all we are woodworkers & there is more than one way to skin a cat.
Personally I’m really grateful & impressed that Festool are undertaking this recall completely at their expense on, in my case, a machine that is 9 years out of warranty, when I think of the trouble I’ve had over the years with other power tool manufacturers trying to get machines fixed that where still under guarantee this has confirmed my faith in Festool.

 

[Hartwood]

Hartwood,

Have you reached out to your local Festool (TTS) representative...? I've always found mine to be really helpful and I have heard tell that they have on occasion, arranged the use of a loan tool to help out a customer in similar circumstances to you.

I have only had to have one tool sent back to Bury St Edmund's and it was an absolutely painless exercise....

No idea how to get in touch with them. All my contact has been direct to Festool CS and my email to them last Monday still hasn't received a response. As I said before I have had to initiate all contact. The issue with UPS whilst not directly Festools issue, the lack of action when I reported the failure of UPS to deliver is most definitely their issue.

You and others may be right about their commitment to keeping older machine running, mine is now 12 years old and frankly it is running absolutely fine, but so are other machines I have that are a great deal older. After 12 years it has more than paid for itself and had the motor failed or other significant component I wouldn't complain. But they have initiated a process that they should be able to follow through on, managing expectations is the primary role of customer service. It seems I am a lone voice is a sea of satisfied Festool users and if I wa paranoid maybe I would suspect I am on a Festool blacklist somewhere

 

[Mike-W]

Just had a phone call from Germany inviting me to get my Kapax serviced w/c 28th June, I did discuss the problems highlighted above and the company is aware of transit problems, they I said I particularly did not want to get hit with a custom charge and the lady told me this should be a totally free repair. She advised me the repair should take about 10 working days
the confirmation email came from this address [email protected]
PM me if you need the phone number of the repair company in Germany.

 

[Hartwood]

Just had a phone call from Germany inviting me to get my Kapax serviced w/c 28th June, I did discuss the problems highlighted above and the company is aware of transit problems, they I said I particularly did not want to get hit with a custom charge and the lady told me this should be a totally free repair. She advised me the repair should take about 10 working days
the confirmation email came from this address [email protected]
PM me if you need the phone number of the repair company in Germany.

Thanks Mike, I have the number but it just rings out with a continuous tone, no message saying to leave a message. I got the box today but there was no shipping label so I cannot return the machine to Germany. I contacted Emma in customer service in Bury and she is arranging collection back to Bury for the repair to be done in the UK. Heaven knows why they are stumping up for shipping empty boxes internationally, and they come full assembled

 

[Hartwood]

This does surprise me I’ve not got in touch with Festool or the folks handling the shipping but they’ve emailed me 3 times & phoned prior to the box arriving.

I fully understand your frustrations with UPS but that’s not down to Festool other than they’ve employed them to do the shipping & is certainly not a reflection on Festool products.

Whilst I also understand the inconvenience of being without the saw as I’ve had to rig up my tracksaw to do cuts I’d normally do with the kapex in the workshop but it’s not the end of the world after all we are woodworkers & there is more than one way to skin a cat.
Personally I’m really grateful & impressed that Festool are undertaking this recall completely at their expense on, in my case, a machine that is 9 years out of warranty, when I think of the trouble I’ve had over the years with other power tool manufacturers trying to get machines fixed that where still under guarantee this has confirmed my faith in Festool.

Thanks Doug. I could go back to using a handsaw and bench hook. The problem is not in finding an alternative way to cut wood but the additional time it takes to complete a task, time that has not been priced into the job. It really would have been better if Festool had given the warning and I could have gone out an bought a new saw. The Kapex doesn't owe me anything after 12 years but the time taken over this issue is time I will never get back and money I will no longer be able to earn.

 

[Hartwood]

I really thought the debacle with the re-fit had been sorted for me with Emma down in Bury arranging for the work to be done in the UK.

I finally got a response from Germany with a shipping label, which was fine if now surplus to requirements. What did surprise me was that along with the shipping label was an additional instruction to attach 3 copies of the invoice to the outside of the box. On the instructions received with the box there was no mention of the invoice and it was just the shipping label that needed to be attached when sending the machine back. There was only two copies attached when I received the box.

The real insult I now feel is that following a phone call on Thursday from the Festool advising that the re-fit had been complete and the machine would be sent out I received an invoice for the labour and shipping this morning. There is no other instructions other that it is a upfront payment. There is no indication that the machine has been shipped back to me and no indication it will be sent until the invoice is paid.

I understood from the website that this re-fit was entirely at Festools expense and whilst the invoice states no charge for the re-fit kit the labour and shipping have been charges out at £33.42.

I know there are a dedicated following of Festool on this forum and I appreciate the quality of the machines they sell, but honestly if they cannot manage to design a process and communicate all the relevant information out to customers then they are no better than cheaper brands from whom we would not have any expectations.

This whole matter has cost me time and hence money at a level which is not acceptable.

 

[Doug B]

I’m guessing @Hartwood that as Festool UK have nothing to do with this recall they will want to recoup their expenses though they should have explained that before undertaking the repair.
As UPS picked up my saw 23 days ago & it still hasn’t been returned I’m coming to the conclusion I would have happily paid a small fee for the recall to have been undertaken in the uk, they are definitely easier to converse with than the shower of a third party who are undertaking the recall, this whole thing is reflecting very badly on Festool Germany.

 

[Doug B]

My Kapex was picked up by UPS on 4/6/21 for its trip to Germany. I received neither receipt nor email confirmation that it had been picked up.
The UPS site has been unable to locate it using the tracking no. that Festool gave me since it set off on its journey.
"Unable to complete your tracking request at this time. Please try again later."

If the TR is not recognised by UPS, then UPS cannot confirm its existence or wherabouts, according to the lady with whom I managed to speak.

My advice to anyone giving their saw to a chap with a van would be to either insist on a receipt or take a photo of the fellow, the box and the van. It might, but probably won't, help in the event of a need to make a claim.

Phil - ever hopeful.

Hi Phil, could I ask if you have received your saw yet?

 

[Glenhyrst]

Hello Doug.

Sadly no. What I have received from Germany is a UPS Tracking No that produces the following:
"Unable to complete your tracking request at this time. Please try again later."

Here is a copy of the latest reply I have received after emails repeating my concerns:

"Please excuse the late reply, unfortunately there are currently delays in processing due to an error in the system.
At the moment your machine is still on its way to our workshop. We will inform you as soon as the machine has arrived.
We fully understand your concerns, but I would like to confirm again that the shipment of your machine is of course insured. The tracking number linked to your machine is always used as proof of dispatch.
If you have any further questions, please do not hesitate to contact us."

Note the reference to insurance. I wonder what that will amount to if my saw remains untraceable? New replacement saw or written down value?

I've now been without it for 3 weeks and at the moment, have little faith that I will ever see it again. It's lost and likely sawing away with the proverbial choir invisible. It will be sadly missed but there is the consolation that should it remain in the ether, it will be one less tool for my kids to sort out when I go the same way.

Not sure that I would have sent the saw off if I had an inkling that this would be the result.

Good luck with yours.

Phil

 

[Doug B]

Thanks for the reply @Glenhyrst mine was picked up the 3 of June so no doubt is in the same consignment as yours, they couldn’t be bothered to reply to my email until that is I contacted Festool UK who were good enough to prod them for me although hardly worth it for the reply:-

“Good afternoon,

Thank you for your message.

I have forwarded your request and we will inform you as soon as we receive new information.

Please accept our sincere apologies for the delay.”

That was 6 days ago & nothing since.