Electrician // Manchester ¦ North West - Recomendations

[JohnerH]

Good Morning All,

In the market for an electrician to assist and install the last leg of a 3 phase implementation for my garage.

I've had a few quotes, but quite frankly the pricing received (which is eye watering considering the actual work involved) combined with a distinct lack of interest by some is leaving me despondent.

Where are the times gone where tradesman wanted work?

Help?

Many thanks in advance,

 

[BucksDad]

Where are the times gone when customers wanted to pay trades people fairly and not judge everything as 'eye watering'

 

[JohnerH]

Where are the times gone when customers wanted to pay trades people fairly and not judge everything as 'eye watering'

Your assuming a lot here, £7-15k for a board installation...

I don't judge and more often than not I go with the little guy than big corporations who don't pay tradespeople fairly.

Given I work in a factory and know roughly the costs for this type of work, I don't like to be taken for a ride.

And if I could... I would use the industrial contractors/contacts I have, but alas they are not certified to do domestic installations and it's around 30-40 miles away.

Any other recommendations?

 

[HOJ]

but alas they are not certified to do domestic installations

All the domestic installers I know of wouldn't know what 3 phase was, is this not outside the scope of Part P anyway, what is it they are pricing for? .

 

[JohnerH]

All the domestic installers I know of wouldn't know what 3 phase was, is this not outside the scope of Part P anyway, what is it they are pricing for? .

ENWL is coming in to feed a 3-phase cable directly from the grid,

After that meter is changed by my supplier,

The electrician would then install a board feeding in all the different wiring ends (which I will be installing myself) from the garage which will contain the all machinery, they would then also hook a wire (which I will be providing) for a single phase to the main house and single phase board.

Nothing all too complicated from a glance point of view,

One of the chaps I had in, wants to charge me £420 for a single EICR.

 

[johnnyb]

An spark certified to do an eicr may well charge £420/day but I would expect a thorough examination and detailed report. Remove the vat that's £340. I guess this is a prerequisite before the installation.

 

[JohnerH]

An spark certified to do an eicr may well charge £420/day but I would expect a thorough examination and detailed report. Remove the vat that's £340. I guess this is a prerequisite before the installation.

£420/day definitely yes...

But £420 for one test that takes maybe 1h tops?

Still searching...

 

[johnnyb]

The spark has decided that your install would require a more detailed inspection(or thinks you won't be happy no matter what this will jeopardise his getting paid) see my post on selling things. If a job even smells annoying I bolt. I need to get paid regardless of your opinion on a job you can't do. It's something they don't teach on inspection and testing it's through long and bitter experience of people.

 

[JohnerH]

I definitely understand and appreciate experience and if I agree to something, people get paid for sure (even if it's expensive).

However, I'm just amazed by the range of quotes for this particular job, hard to know or trust where to go.

But I get your point.

 

[HOJ]

But £420 for one test that takes maybe 1h tops?

Where do you get the idea its only an hours work, an EICR on a basic single phase domestic installation would/should take half a day at least, to do it thoroughly, and fill in the paperwork, plus the cost of the use of the calibrated, expensive, test equipment.

 

[JohnerH]

Where do you get the idea its only an hours work, an EICR on a basic single phase domestic installation would/should take half a day at least, to do it thoroughly, and fill in the paperwork,

This would be 1h (I would imagine) given the house has been tested and certified before, so it's just a reiteration of the previous certificate I would image.

However,

plus the cost of the use of the calibrated, expensive, test equipment.

This is a good point, given what I'm going through with the Wadkins point well made that stands to reason.

 

[johnnyb]

I view it entirely differently. The calibrated equipment and a guy who knows what he's doing and is certificated is a package. It allows the gate to open on your job. But the second one is the most important. A calibrated machine is a few hundred pound. People say to me of course I could do it if I had the tools quite often. Do I argue? No cos I wanna get paid does it annoy me? Of course! I just think I must make it look easy!

 

[BucksDad]

Also even if the job takes 1 hour of physical time at the property, there is the overhead of travel time and maybe no possibility to book another job for the day

 

[HOJ]

A calibrated machine is a few hundred pound

Bit more than a few hundred I'm afraid, and that's only part of the kit needed: Megger

 

[johnnyb]

That's an mft there not expensive in comparison with almost any woodwork gadget. Used and calibrated is just a few hundred. Even less if you get 2 or 3 calibrated machines(to do the same jobs). Needless to say firms are needlessly upgrading testers all the time. Thus calibrated old machines are common.

 

[HOJ]

That's an mft there not expensive in comparison with almost any woodwork gadget.

Don't understand the relevance to be honest

 

[johnnyb]

I suppose my only point here is tools are cheap in comparison with labour. And a sparkies toolkit is tiny in comparison to a joiner. But the labour rates are less.

 

[Sideways]

The biggest issue I see as I read this is that you are proposing to do a lot of the installation yourself. You imply you will be selecting and installing cables etc before the electrician installs the board. So you are taking design, selection and installation responsibilities on yourself, who I assume have no qualifications to do any of those things.
This section you're doing sounds like effectively a new installation so it's an EIR that requires 100% test.
Your electrician can't trust anything that came before them because they'll just know that it has been put in by or potentially meddled with by someone unqualified.
They weren't there when you pulled new cable to know if you used approved cables, fittings, etc, they may not be able to see how you installed it, what it passes through, or if you damaged it during installation.
Regardless of the installation of the board, you'd be asking him/her to sign off the inspection and test of something that they'd have to consider potentially dangerous until proven otherwise. Several £k sounds way too much but a day for an EIR doesn't.

 

[dgs2001]

Sadly this is just another example of what our nanny state, overly reliant on regulation does for both workers and customers at ground level accross most trades.

The customer gets left with a feeling of being ripped off, while the tradesman gets left with, well, not alot after the relentless drugery of training costs, tool calibration, certification software, scheme memberships, insurance and countless other necessary costs.

The money all dissapears from the middle to make fat cats fatter.

I get the need for safety, I even get the need for some regulation, but sadly accross the trades safety and regulation have given rise to wholesale thievery by licensed bodies which are run solely as business for the purpose of making money.

In my humble opinion we should all be heading back to the days of a hand shake and cash.
Rant Over

As Sideways has suggested, the issue is that you are asking a stranger to take you at your word and issue certification for work they have not done, this in itself is a big regulatory no-no and could potentially lead to prosecution of the person signing the certificate.
To confirm, a full EICR definatley cannot be completed in 1 hour and anybody who suggests otherwise is not doing it properly.

I suspect the high quote variance you are seeing is just a way of some people rather than saying 'No' pricing themselves out of the job.

Never understood why, but there are not many domestic sparks who deal with 3 phase so I would suggest looking for a small electrical or M&E building services company who may be more able to help and shouldnt be too expensive.

 

[naughtymoose]

Everything that Sideways says!

This would be 1h (I would imagine) given the house has been tested and certified before, so it's just a reiteration of the previous certificate I would image.

Question: when was it tested, and by whom?

Point: if you have done it all yourself, I'm going to need to test EVERYTHING, because I can't POSSIBLY trust that it's been done correctly.