Electric vehicles

[sploo]

The only flaw in that is there no such thing as a Carbon free Source of electric. It's all smoke and mirrors!
Quite why us the question. To take power and wealth away from the Oil. To gain more control over the vehicle. Who knows, but EV's are something being pushed very hard and at a lot of expense (Subs of £5k, taxes breaks of the same or more. Ved breaks too). Not known anything quite like it except the vast amounts of money wasted on Space.

Yes; but the original assertion was that it could take 8 years for an EV to gain parity with an ICE vehicle in terms of pollution (if the EV is charged with "non green" sources). Given that's not an unreasonable life for a car it would appear that even in the worst case the EVs will be better (in the long run). Any charging via green sources will reduce the time it takes for the EV to "win".

You are absolutely correct about nothing being totally carbon free; a solar panel, and wind turbine, wave generators etc all take resources to build. However for the larger commercial scale systems the upfront (pollution) cost is a relatively small negative, vs the long term benefits. That's not always true for smaller installations; I recall a small (~1.5m blade span) home wind turbine marketed some years ago where it turned out the lifespan of the unit wouldn't even allow it to recover its own carbon cost.

Modern solar panels (even for domestic use) are, I understand, good - in the sense that they should last long enough to more than offset their carbon cost.

 

[RogerS]

More bad news for EV proponents, I'm afraid. Article in the paper today quotes Addison Lee.

For Addison Lee chief executive Liam Griffin, it meant a choice: invest in plug-in hybrid cars, or “go full electric” and stump up millions for a new fleet of electric cars.

He chose the latter strategy. Griffin ordered 1,000 Volkswagen ID4s as part of a move to “fully embrace” electric vehicles (EVs).

The plan has backfired. Last month, the company was forced to make an about-turn, abandoning its pledge to reach zero emissions by the end of 2023. “We were slightly oversold the dream,” Griffin says.

A similar story is playing out across the entire private hire car sector. Rental companies and taxi operators across the world are backing away from electric cars amid low uptake from drivers and losses caused by plummeting used car prices.

Less than 20% of Addision Lee's drivers have off-street parking which makes charging a bit of problem.

Uber are finding it very hard to get drivers to go 'EV' ...also due to lack of charging facilities.


Sure, it will eventulally get sorted but not in any time soon.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

less than 20% of our drivers have off street parking ...

And that occurred to no one before the purchase of £30m of vans (and the rest)? Sounds like something the government would do.

 

[porker]

I have a nephew who is a manager in one of the big national car rental companies. He tells me they lose money on the EVs on their fleet due to the same reasons above, but apparently have to buy a certain number although not sure who imposes this. The best part was that they don't have any charging facilities at the branch so they have to charge them at the local supermarket.

 

[Blackswanwood]

More bad news for EV proponents, I'm afraid. Article in the paper today quotes Addison Lee.

For Addison Lee chief executive Liam Griffin, it meant a choice: invest in plug-in hybrid cars, or “go full electric” and stump up millions for a new fleet of electric cars.

He chose the latter strategy. Griffin ordered 1,000 Volkswagen ID4s as part of a move to “fully embrace” electric vehicles (EVs).

The plan has backfired. Last month, the company was forced to make an about-turn, abandoning its pledge to reach zero emissions by the end of 2023. “We were slightly oversold the dream,” Griffin says.

A similar story is playing out across the entire private hire car sector. Rental companies and taxi operators across the world are backing away from electric cars amid low uptake from drivers and losses caused by plummeting used car prices.


View attachment 174322

View attachment 174321
Less than 20% of Addision Lee's drivers have off-street parking which makes charging a bit of problem.

Uber are finding it very hard to get drivers to go 'EV' ...also due to lack of charging facilities.


Sure, it will eventulally get sorted but not in any time soon.

The Telegraph are a bit slow on that as AL announced it before Christmas. As I understand it the fall in second hand values is exacerbated as the price of new EV’s reduce and get much closer to their ICE equivalents. I guess there will be a few more twists and turns as the transition happens and undoubtedly there’ll be a Harvard Business Review paper on it in five years!

 

[Screwed]

Apparently approx 96% of a wind turbine is made of recyclable materials - National Grid.

Even accepting they may be putting a somewhat positive slant on things, I doubt it is any more polluting than fossil fuel generation.

Total UK electricity consumption was 275TWhrs/year in 2022. It is estimated that the UK has the potential to generate ~3000TWhrs/year from "green" sources - mainly offshore wind.

There are some issues - in particular overcoming variability of generation. But to assert that green electricity will never be enough is entirely wrong even allowing for some estimating errors.

Well yeah if 96% of it is steel, copper and concrete. Of course it can be recycled, but that's the same of most things, but the blades are not recyclable and that seems a lot more than 4%, but I guess that's depends how you use the data.
As I've already mentioned we had a good green network and to me that means independent energy production which is a good thing, but didn't protect us from global activities. So either we didn't or we've been conned about one particular aspect of green energy. Just a side note on windfarms offshore. There owned by the Royals! Shame there not a lot cheaper
So how do we go about making 100% green energy then? Without environmental damage or way more front loaded pollution.
There's loads wrong with them. Same as EV's. Even ICE cars have be in production for over 100 years and are still rubbish really, but I'm not trying to convince you they are great and without faults.

 

[John Brown]

More bad news for EV proponents, I'm afraid. Article in the paper today quotes Addison Lee.

For Addison Lee chief executive Liam Griffin, it meant a choice: invest in plug-in hybrid cars, or “go full electric” and stump up millions for a new fleet of electric cars.

He chose the latter strategy. Griffin ordered 1,000 Volkswagen ID4s as part of a move to “fully embrace” electric vehicles (EVs).

The plan has backfired. Last month, the company was forced to make an about-turn, abandoning its pledge to reach zero emissions by the end of 2023. “We were slightly oversold the dream,” Griffin says.

A similar story is playing out across the entire private hire car sector. Rental companies and taxi operators across the world are backing away from electric cars amid low uptake from drivers and losses caused by plummeting used car prices.
It

View attachment 174322

View attachment 174321
Less than 20% of Addision Lee's drivers have off-street parking which makes charging a bit of problem.

Uber are finding it very hard to get drivers to go 'EV' ...also due to lack of charging facilities.


Sure, it will eventulally get sorted but not in any time soon.

Didn't the boss of Addison Lee just get an honour in the New year list for services to Tory donations or some such? Maybe he's just falling in line with his patrons, who have also abandoned their net-zero.targets. Addison Lee, of course, are largely(totally?) driven by financial considerations, whereas I naively believed the government were supposed to be working for the general good. Anyway, it sounds as though Addison Lee effed up, got it wrong. Tough.

 

[sploo]

More bad news for EV proponents, I'm afraid. Article in the paper today quotes Addison Lee.

For Addison Lee chief executive Liam Griffin, it meant a choice: invest in plug-in hybrid cars, or “go full electric” and stump up millions for a new fleet of electric cars.

He chose the latter strategy. Griffin ordered 1,000 Volkswagen ID4s as part of a move to “fully embrace” electric vehicles (EVs).

The plan has backfired. Last month, the company was forced to make an about-turn, abandoning its pledge to reach zero emissions by the end of 2023. “We were slightly oversold the dream,” Griffin says.

A similar story is playing out across the entire private hire car sector. Rental companies and taxi operators across the world are backing away from electric cars amid low uptake from drivers and losses caused by plummeting used car prices.


View attachment 174322

View attachment 174321
Less than 20% of Addision Lee's drivers have off-street parking which makes charging a bit of problem.

Uber are finding it very hard to get drivers to go 'EV' ...also due to lack of charging facilities.


Sure, it will eventulally get sorted but not in any time soon.

I'm slightly amused by the "EV sellers forced to offer big discounts" graph; when it actually shows that EV sellers are having to discount 2.9% more than non-EV sellers (10.6% vs 7.7%). I.e. all are being heavily discounted, but over the course of a year EV discounts went from about 1.5% less than non-EV discounts, to parity, then finally up to about 2.9% more (heavily discounted). But I guess that's a less sensational angle, so not as attention grabbing.

 

[RogerS]

.... Anyway, it sounds as though Addison Lee effed up, got it wrong. Tough.

What...like Hertz ? Or Uber finding it hard to get drivers to go EV ?

 

[John Brown]

What...like Hertz ? Or Uber finding it hard to get drivers to go EV ?

Yes.

 

[Jester129]

I saw somewhere that Vauxhall are going to produce the equivalent of the Ford Transit (can't remember the name, sorry) as 100% hydrogen power and have teamed up with a company that begins with 'Z' (?) for a national infrastructure for refuelling, which will take all of 5 minutes and the range will be 300 miles! Being built here in the UK. Anyone else heard the same?
If it's true it could be the kick-start towards hydrogen.

 

[Cabinetman]

If that works great, if not that’s an expensive gamble.

 

[John Brown]

I saw somewhere that Vauxhall are going to produce the equivalent of the Ford Transit (can't remember the name, sorry) as 100% hydrogen power and have teamed up with a company that begins with 'Z' (?) for a national infrastructure for refuelling, which will take all of 5 minutes and the range will be 300 miles! Being built here in the UK. Anyone else heard the same?
If it's true it could be the kick-start towards hydrogen.

Viritech.
It's still an EV, by the way.

 

[Vulcan]

Addison Lee seem to be buying more EV’s according to this?

https://www.addisonlee.com/addlib/a...brand-new-zero-emission-capable-vw-multivans/

 

[Vulcan]

I'm slightly amused by the "EV sellers forced to offer big discounts" graph; when it actually shows that EV sellers are having to discount 2.9% more than non-EV sellers (10.6% vs 7.7%). I.e. all are being heavily discounted, but over the course of a year EV discounts went from about 1.5% less than non-EV discounts, to parity, then finally up to about 2.9% more (heavily discounted). But I guess that's a less sensational angle, so not as attention grabbing.

The cost of producing EV’s is coming down slowly whilst the cost of producing ICE vehicles is still going up.
This is bound to upset the car market, and also buyers. From what I’ve read some motorists are hanging on to their ICE vehicles longer than they would normally to see if EV’s drop to a price they want to pay.

 

[porker]

Daily costs in London for running non zero emissions vehicles are high £12.50/day but London taxis are exempt. However all newly registered taxis must be zero emission capable so if the fleet needs renewing it's probably not a difficult decision

 

[Cabinetman]

Whenever I go to London and surrounds I feel so very glad I don’t have to live there. Nightmare of a place.
It’s surprising how many evacuees from down South there are even in my sleepy little village.

 

[Phil Pascoe]

Try Cornwall. You're unlikely to find a pub in many areas where Cornish accents are more likely to be heard than estuary English ones

 

[Jameshow]

Try Cornwall. You're unlikely to find a pub in many areas where Cornish accents are more likely to be heard than estuary English ones

I'm on my way!!

 

[Vulcan]

https://asia.nikkei.com/Spotlight/E...EV-target-forward-to-45-of-auto-sales-by-2027