Electric vehicles

[Droogs]

What are EV`s like for towing? I have a folding camper many others drag sheds (caravans) boats, trailers and the like on a daily basis, especially in holiday season, how will EV`s affect the holiday business I wonder.

Watch this chaps latest series

 

[Kittyhawk]

And then what about tools? Woodworking tools for example, that spend hours on end, idle in a workshop. A central location of tools or even somewhere where you could hire tools as and when needed?

True, but I know my tools and they know me and I'm not sharing with anyone.

 

[MikeJhn]

When ever I have loaned tools to anyone they come back in such a state it takes me ages to get them right again, I try to avoid it.

 

[Geoff_S]

When ever I have loaned tools to anyone they come back in such a state it takes me ages to get them right again, I try to avoid it.

Exactly. Can you imagine that with a car? Especially if most of the time we are sharing with someone we don’t know

 

[johna.clements]

Exactly. Can you imagine that with a car? Especially if most of the time we are sharing with someone we don’t know

I would be surprised if you are forced to share as in sat next to each other on the back seat of a cab.

 

[Terry - Somerset]

There are many companies, certainly in London and I suspect many large cities, where rent a car by the hour is the norm for many.

Cost per hour is less than £9, and for a day ~£60 for a small car. No worries about insurance, parking, servicing etc. Much cheaper and less hassle for occasional use than ownership.

In larger cities travel is otherwise by tube, train, bus (+ bike and feet) where proximity to the unwashed is unavoidable. Why should cars be materially different - except that if a user leaves a vehicle in a poor state they can simply have access removed.

 

[ian33a]

Many of us live with a different mentality. I was always of the opinion that I should not buy something that I cannot afford.

So many people today, younger than me especially, have come through the school of hire purchase. More recently, car owners especially, have come through the school of lease, lease-purchase or pure rental. While they get exclusive use of the vehicle, for many it is not their own and never will be. In any case, after a few years, so many of them want something different anyway.

I know plenty of people, recent graduates and the like, who can't drive and have little wish to learn. With insurance costs for young drivers as they are and the costs of running a car, who can blame them.

I suspect that the UK will have to be pulled, kicking and screaming, rather too gradually, into a society where public transport is seen as an integral part of life and not something that poor people use. In that regard, for those who have a driving licence, an occasional car rental would probably be just fine and a better public transport infrastructure will do the rest.

How we get to that stage with the current infrastructure as it is, god knows!

 

[Spectric]

More recently, car owners especially, have come through the school of lease, lease-purchase or pure rental. While they get exclusive use of the vehicle, for many it is not their own and never will be. In any case, after a few years, so many of them want something different anyway.

The big problem with lease is that if you do high mileage then it becomes less attractive as you are penalised but for the right person it saves so much hassle with associated running cost. There is nothing wrong with not owning something providing it works out financially and maybe this attitude will move us in the direction of property rental rather than purchase as it will give people more spending money providing the regulations for landlords are regulated.

I suspect that the UK will have to be pulled, kicking and screaming, rather too gradually, into a society where public transport is seen as an integral part of life and not something that poor people use.

If fuel reaches £5 a litre I think it would happen much quicker but public transport needs massive investment and to be seen as critical infrastructure rather than a route to making a fast buck. I think the Japanese have the right idea, transportation is key to getting people to and from work efficently and without stress and that is great for the economy overall so don't treat the infrastructure as a means to make money, run it at cost.

 

[ian33a]

The big problem with lease is that if you do high mileage then it becomes less attractive as you are penalised but for the right person it saves so much hassle with associated running cost. There is nothing wrong with not owning something providing it works out financially and maybe this attitude will move us in the direction of property rental rather than purchase as it will give people more spending money providing the regulations for landlords are regulated.



If fuel reaches £5 a litre I think it would happen much quicker but public transport needs massive investment and to be seen as critical infrastructure rather than a route to making a fast buck. I think the Japanese have the right idea, transportation is key to getting people to and from work efficently and without stress and that is great for the economy overall so don't treat the infrastructure as a means to make money, run it at cost.

Generally, lease, rental, whatever, funds the depreciation plus administration charges so, if you do high mileages and buy your own car, it's value drops accordingly in the same way that by signing up for a lease, you need to state your mileages.

I've always tended to buy our vehicles (since leaving a company car scheme about a dozen years ago). It's always worked out well buying stuff which was owned by the manufacturer and then leased to employees for six months or so. We've generally paid outright for them on purchase but our mileages are low.

Used EV's may end up being a different proposition until we reach a point where people trust longevity of batteries and there is some way to replace them, recondition them, whatever, and not have to scrap the car.

At the moment, our lifestyle suits remaining with ICE. This gives time for the technology, the costs and sustainability of the power trains to become more mature.

Agree with the public transport though - we've a monumental curve to climb in order for our systems to become world class and this probably needs unleashing companies from franchising models and union strangle holding. - won't happen any time soon!

 

[Jester129]

We get one bus per hour, each way, in our village. Better than some around here that get one bus PER DAY.
You could say the infrastructure needs to improve!

 

[clogs]

as a kid (now 73) I remember the 2 bob ticket at the weekend where u could use the buses or the underground for 24hrs in London....to go anywhere.....
Fast forward living in Greece...they have a good metro system in Athens plus a decent bus service...
the cost when I was there was €1,50 for I think 2hrs travel and a fiver for all day.....all tickets transferable....but it was all one company.....prob state owned ......
If u make pricing and timetables realistic and affordable people will use the system....
as for inner London, all private vehicles should be banned, buses, taxi's, del trucks and emergency vehicles ONLY...then the transport system would have to be upgraded....
and like the flight controllers, contractually no strikes......

Last time I wanted to go to Manchester from Colchester it was £260 one way on the train...
on 24 hours notice.
2 coaches but on offer £30 and if I could get to Ipswitch airport it was £75....all one way....

as for HS2, what a load of dogs dangly's.....it's only for those at the top to steal/cream all the money they can....
What about wifi conferencing....??
It'd be cheaper for the gov to pay for a ticket for anyone who wants to travel up there than fund this disaster.....
How about spending the money on new SAFER signaling system and better flood defences of the railway....

among other reasons this is why I and so many skilled people are leaving the UK....
who can blame them.....
as for electric cars, no probs at all for my needs but for the initial costs....
as for recharging and the inevitable taxes for the same I would actually have my own solar system on the roof, so stuff em....
those B''s have been planning this for years, smart meters ....what a con....
good day....I'm of to the garden.......

 

[johna.clements]

and like the flight controllers, contractually no strikes......

Last time I wanted to go to Manchester from Colchester it was £260 one way on the train...
on 24 hours notice.

What do you mean about flight controllers?

There is a train leaving Colchester in 7 minutes for £85.50 which appears to be the normal price for off peak. If you wait until11.12 you can do it for £66.50 one way. First class is £197.50 or £144.30 at 11.12 but there are only 7 tickets left.

 

[johna.clements]

We get one bus per hour, each way, in our village. Better than some around here that get one bus PER DAY.
You could say the infrastructure needs to improve!

One bus a day the luxury.

There are some villages around here that a bus one day a week. Once in the morning to take you into town then latter to return you to the village. Unless someone can drive you or you can walk to the main road your stuck.

Self driving cars could well end up cheaper and more frequent than buses or taxi type buses that follow routes in rural areas.

 

[lexfurther]

One bus a day the luxury.

There are some villages around here that a bus one day a week. Once in the morning to take you into town then latter to return you to the village. Unless someone can drive you or you can walk to the main road your stuck.

Self driving cars could well end up cheaper and more frequent than buses or taxi type buses that follow routes in rural areas.

Completely agree

 

[MikeJhn]

 

[TomGW]

What do you mean about flight controllers?

There is a train leaving Colchester in 7 minutes for £85.50 which appears to be the normal price for off peak. If you wait until11.12 you can do it for £66.50 one way. First class is £197.50 or £144.30 at 11.12 but there are only 7 tickets left.

I live in Northern Ireland and we have a scheme that provides free travel on public transport (bus & rail), within NI for over 60s and anywhere within the whole island of Ireland for over 65s. This is for any train or bus at any time, anywhere - no restrictions.
The bus service through our village is 11 times/day, each direction, and 200m from our house, connecting to the rail network 12 mins away. At age 66 we both have our travel passes and I have only used mine twice this year. My wife hasn't ever used hers in 6 years. Abandoning the cars and changing habits isn't easy.

 

[Ozi]

There are a few 4x4 electric vehicles coming out (https://www.fleetcarma.com/electric-pic ... ck-market/) and the mainstream manufacturers are all working on it, although battery life will be an issue for a couple of years yet. But that <<should>> solve the caravan and towing market. Maybe.

The UK consumed 47.1 billion litres of petrol/diesel in 2018. If you say petrol and diesel both contain the same amount of energy - 10kWh/litre (it's close enough for ***-packet calculations, but they don't), then that would equate to 471 billion kWh of new electricity required annually, in the new, green economy. Given the inefficiency of battery storage, it will need to be more than that, but never mind. If you pretend that the energy will be delivered evenly, 24 hours per day, then you need an extra 1.2 billion kWh per day. Sounds like a lot. A billion kWh is, I think, one TerraWatt hour (10¹² Watts), and the average nuclear power station puts out, let's say, 1,000 MWh, or one GigaWatt. You need 1,000 GigaWatts to make a TerraWatt, so the UK will need one thousand nuclear reactors, or equivalent solar/wind/wave installations, all running 24/7. No problem.

The above is just me thinking out loud, and I may have lost track of zeros, so feel free to put me right on the maths.

We have a current capability of generating around 400 TWh, although we shouldn't. One part of the solution, and I know I sound like a stuck record is using appropriate vehicles for the current need - don't drive a 2.5 ton 4 x 4 all year so you can pull a caravan 400 miles for your two week holiday etc. We must use less than the 471 TWh. Personally I would be surprised if we can't halve that IF we have the will to do so.

 

[eribaMotters]

Unfortunately the example of the Kia EV6 towing a caravan is still unrealistic for the vast majority of caravan owners. I would like an electric car, but it is simply not a realistic option or financially sensible choice at present.
They cost a lot to buy, are severely limited by range when towing, [I tow up to 600 miles which would mean a minimum of 4 potentially stressful recharges] expensive to charge on the run, use a charging network that is still not fit for purpose and you need to unhitch the van to charge.
Fortunately we do not all resort to large cars to tow our caravans. With some thought it is possible. I typically tow 3,000+ miles of my annual 7-8,000 miles, more than half of this is in Europe. This summer I sold my previous van, a low profile Eriba. This was compact but still had all we needed including a very comfortable fixed double bed. At 1200kg I had several times towed 400 miles before needing to re-fuel. 34mpg was normal but 40mpg achievable.
My new van is heavier, running at around 1350kg and my mpg is down a few miles per gallon.
My car is not what you would consider a typical tow-car and weighs in a lot less than 2.5 ton. It is an Audi A3 1.5L petrol. It is easily up to the job. Solo it returns 48-52mpg on non rush hour runabouts and 70+mpg on long runs.

Colin

 

[Jim Davis]

We presented our son with one of those Kids VIP electric ride-on cars and he asked me why I don't drive the same car
If seriously, I don't think that an EV can be suitable for towing (maybe for someone, Idk). Also, I've recently seen several YouTube videos about how EVs catch on fire and the firefighters find that they are very hard to put out once they start. This is because lithium-ion batteries burn hot and fast. To be honest, it looks frightening.

 

[Spectric]

This is because lithium-ion batteries burn hot and fast. To be honest, it looks frightening.

It will reduce the energy consumption of some crematoriums but you won't have a say in who you are mixed with when they sweep you all up.