Crowned bandsaw tyres

[pgrbff]

Does anyone know of a UK or European source of crowned bandsaw tyres? Easy enough to get from the US but postage and taxes make them quite expensive.

 

[Ttrees]

Not hard to do by yourself, maybe a bit of effort involved in hand turning those wheels, but very simple, using just a plane iron which is honed on its edge using a block to keep square, will flatten an oil stone very well also.

This process is made a lot easier if you have better clamps.
(if you don't, then get a square of ply to protect the base of the machine from falling clamps)
I tried crowning my saws old tires as there was large chunks missing from spots,
I probably should have tried filling them instead, and dressing afterwards, as the saw wasn't as happy with them so I dressed them flat after much faffing about.
Just about enough meat left on this bottom wheel now.

Just incase you don't actually need new tires.
Many tires are vulcanised rather than glued on, some simply stretchered on which have a rib to fit into a track in the wheels.
I would definitely try to dress them if I could first, especially if vulcanised.
Or if you decide to replace make sure there is no track in the wheels like on Minimax saws for example.

The new tires you get might not be as good, or as thick, so bear that in mind if just intending to buy just one.
All the best
Tom

 

[Terrytpot]

I can't remember what the type of rubber is called but I did the same as this guy to replace the knackered tyres on the 14" model I scooped up..

In my case, as with quite a few machines, the crown is actually part of the wheel casting and the tyre just conforms to it so your rubber only needs to fit inside the rim edges of the wheel and be the correct length.

 

[pgrbff]

The wheels have cork on them, which is breaking up in places and niether the wheel or cork is crowned.

 

[Ttrees]

Did you get that 20" machine?
Having never seen a decent Italian machine with crowned tires, I would follow suit
and get flat ones, unless your running extremely narrow bands on it.
If your doing heavy resawing then I would choose flat tires.
ACM spares might be available locally, maybe SCM/Centauro either ...
newer models of the former have the rib design.

I bought a tire for the Centauro/SCM machine, but will dress off the rib with the tire inside out.
I got one from ScottandSargeant, ( not near as thick as the vulcanised tires on my ACM)

Not sure if I would want urethane tires, as I haven't seen anyone dress them before.

Another option is gasket material which looks like good stuff to use.
Someone posted a link to the stuff on ebay before, available in different thicknesses and lengths for very cheap.

Hope we get to see some more photos if you did get that old iron beast.
All the best
Tom

 

[pgrbff]

You can buy cork on a roll on ebay from what seems to be the multico outlet? Not cheap, and flat. From France.
everything I have read says go for crowned, especialy as you say if you are using narrower blades.
are the centauro/SCM crowned?
Youcan buy crowned urethane replacements from the US. Is urethane better?

I have picked up the machine, 250kg ish.
It is difficult to bring home so it is in a friends wharehouse, it runs.
I have started stripping it to bring it home.
I have also bought a new inverter, 1.5 kw. More than I need.

 

[Ttrees]

Great to hear you have the machine, and it runs!
Make sure to post some juicy pics!

All of the largish Italian machines that I've seen have flat tires, as these are more for resawing or heavy ripping.
I had a look for your machine but couldn't find it, some similar ones from Centauro
was as close as I found.
I found the thread called... anyone had success with homemade bandsaw tires.
This link is in it for what could be the cheapest solution.
https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/SOLID-PL...hash=item567e4b8309:m:mUBFCz8Jxwq0-QA__JbPwtg
Not sure if you can get it there, but 3m do a rubber and gasket material glue for the job, one of the Creekers who's an absolute bandsaw fanatic, (Vanhusky look him up) recommends the stuff.
Quite expensive though, make sure you have well enough open time whatever you use!

Good luck with gettin her home!
Tom

 

[pgrbff]

So are flat tyres categoricaly better than crowned for ripping?

 

[Peter Sefton]

I would say crowned are better, my old Hammer 4400 had yellow crowned Urethane tyres, they were still going strong 14 years later. I set up the bandsaw in the first week and never adjusted the tracking again.

My new Hammer 4400 has black flat rubber tyres and needs more tracking when changing blades sizes.

Just found these on line but have not used them.

https://bandsawparts.co.uk/

 

[pgrbff]

I would say crowned are better, my old Hammer 4400 had yellow crowned Urethane tyres, they were still going strong 14 years later. I set up the bandsaw in the first week and never adjusted the tracking again.

My new Hammer 4400 has black flat rubber tyres and needs more tracking when changing blades sizes.

Just found these on line but have not used them.

https://bandsawparts.co.uk/

Thank you. I know of Sulphur Grove, they are one of the US suppliers I was considering.
I'm finding it very difficult to decide, and I simply have no experience when it comes to bandsaws.
There are definitely 2 different approaches, crowned for better tracking, flat for more contact on wide blades for re-sawing.
I had just changed my mind again, as it will be used mostly for re-sawing, and decided maybe keeping the tyres flat. Here we go again!

 

[john swett]

Vinyl Flooring makes excellent bandsaw tires. I have used regular 1/16" thick flooring with good results. Cut the tires strips and glue them to the wheels with contact cement. I have never been able to make flat belts work; they must be crowned. The rule of thumb is crown height is 1/32" per 1" width. Mine were less than that (about 1/64") but worked fine. You must have enough tire thickness at the edges to cushion the blade teeth. There is a brand called Manington, which is 1/8" thick and is what I would use if available. The crown is easily formed using an electric handheld belt sander. Hold the sander against the wheel edge at a 45 degree angle. The running sander will cause the wheel to rotate. The crown is made by tilting the ends of the belt sander in and out. CARFULLY sand from the edgess towrd the middle of the wheel. The sanded sreas do not have to meet in the middle. As long as they are reanonably equal in width and curve they will be fine. Lay a straightedge across the crown to check for evenness and depth. If yoiu can see a bit of light at each edge, you're good to go. Once again, be sure to leave enough material to cushion the teeth. For traction and visibility I scuffed up the glossy side and glued that side to the wheel. When cutting the tire strips, just cut the ends square; no need for a scarfed joint. Good luck!
Atinkerer1

 

[Ttrees]

Thanks to John for bumping this old thread,
as I must clear up my misconceptions regarding the Italian saws having flat tires.
I should'a looked at the spare Centauro CO 600 tire I had closer

The gap between the blocks to allow for the tongue

Bit better of an impression of the camber, slightly more gradual on the back

The apex of the camber is 17.5mm from the front edge, so 1mm off centre on the rubber.

Turns out peoples impression of flat tires, is due to anticlastic curvature.
(the sides curl upwards when something flat is bent into a circumference)

So that's the end of that misinformation, should one consider the offset camber,
as if it were centered, then there could possibly be some argument there.

Though one could just read the Centauro SP manual...
The only Italian manual I've seen mentioning this, but not only that, but also the
importance of the camber in relation to beam tension
i.e the ability of the blade to resist rubbing of the thrust guide(s)

I've documented this in detail on the bandsaw forum,
and one can see that a blade with compressed set
(due to a combination of flat tires/misaligned wheels)
will simply refuse to cut, so makes a great test to see the difference it makes
when the tires are crowned thereafter.

might be worth noting the faces of these cast iron wheels are dressed to within 0.2mm,
and not 0.5mm
(just incase one makes a profiled scraper to do the lot in one)

As the upper wheel needs a suitable blade (not too wide)
in order for the wheel not to tip,
and one needs to keep an eye on it with a beam incase it shifts,
as it's very easy to wipe out the apex otherwise.

I've mentioned before, on my 24" saw, the 0.5 discrepancy of the face of the wheels
gave a projected variance of 4mm, so using a beam like such won't give an honest measurement
without doing so.
Seeing as one would likely be checking alignment at the same time, or beforehand.

That should set the record straight.

Tom