Couple of wooden planes to ID/age etc

[woodenstx]

Hi

While in a somewhat MCW flower/"vintage" shop locally I stumbled across a pair of wooden planes. One is what appears to be a Jointer (or atleast of that lenght) and the other a simple coffin smoother.

Pics:
Longer one looks to be an A Mathieson & sons effort

smaller one,has T W Soames stamped into the wedge and a couple of places on the body, so can only assume that was the tool owner
Has 72 Columbia Road E London where a maker mark might be, this is next to a pub now in an area of london which is likely to have had workshops/"units" between 1890-1920ish

Any info about them would be greatly recieved.
I've set about fine wirewool and Meths'ing the larger one to get all the years of grime off and its looking lovely despite a crack in the sole at the front (I'll chuck epoxy in there unless someone has a better idea)

Both took a new edge well and are a total joy to use, I've never used wooden planes before, and with a bit of youtube trial and error with tapping they are fun to use with a great finish. Not bad for £30 imho

 

[AndyT]

Nice to see these appreciated and put to use.

The Mathieson plane is more likely to be a Jack. These were from 12 to 18" long and generally had the open style of handle like yours. Try planes were generally 20" or more and often had closed handles.

A jack would also have a cambered iron.

Mathieson were huge - they must have supplied tools to the huge Scottish shipbuilding industry when it ruled the Clyde and a chunk of the world. According to the standard reference book, the mark on your plane was used from 1876 until well into the twentieth century.

Your smoother is by E Hall - the name is visible above the address - but the book has no more information except an estimate of late nineteenth or early twentieth century.

You might find some of the info under the cleaning and restoration sticky useful but they look ok from your pictures.

 

[MusicMan]

Here's a woodie jointer, 30" long:

Set me back a fiver at a big car boot sale. Lovely beast.

 

[woodenstx]

The iron on the Mathieson wasnt cambered, then again it was chipped to death.... I dont have a grinder so "honed" it on an 80 grit belt sander belt that was cut and stuck to a sheet of mdf for a long run to keep the temperature down (yes crontrived but achieved exactly what was needed before hitting the diamond plates)
One small issue is that as the weather was warmer last week, its taken to releasing some sap :s

so its a nice jack plane, still good to have a longer plane than the No4 stanley I've got
I need to get to more boot sales to find some more woodies

 

[DonMc]

The only information I've been able to find concerning the E. Hall mark is an 1884 London Directory listing for Ernest A. Hall, pawnbroker, 72 Columbia Rd. E. As far as I can tell, he doesn't appear in the 1882 directory and by 1891 a Charles Johns, cabinetmaker, is listed at the 72 Columbia Rd. E address. So, despite Ernest A. Hall not being listed as a tool or plane maker, it seems your coffin smoother may date from the mid-to-late 1880's. Not definitive, but a starting point, at least.

Don McConnell
Eureka Springs, AR

 

[woodenstx]

The only information I've been able to find concerning the E. Hall mark is an 1884 London Directory listing for Ernest A. Hall, pawnbroker, 72 Columbia Rd. E. As far as I can tell, he doesn't appear in the 1882 directory and by 1891 a Charles Johns, cabinetmaker, is listed at the 72 Columbia Rd. E address. So, despite Ernest A. Hall not being listed as a tool or plane maker, it seems your coffin smoother may date from the mid-to-late 1880's. Not definitive, but a starting point, at least.

Don McConnell
Eureka Springs, AR

Thankyou for that.
Could be that the plane was panwed at some time then... kinda sad but gives it a shade more history

 

[AndyT]

Another possibility is that the directory printer misread "planemaker" as "pawnbroker" when setting the type. It must have been a terrible job, setting directories by hand by gaslight and a few errors would hardly be surprising.

 

[Dr W]

I know I'm very late to the party but came across this thread while investigating the "E. Hall 72 Columbia Rd" stamp on one of my rebate planes and thought I'd add my pennyworth - not that there's much more.
FWIW, here's what I found on Ancestry.com and elsewhere...

1. "Columbia Rd" only got that name in 1874 - so that's the earliest possible date for the mark (before that it was Crabtree Row at this end, and Birdcage Walk to the eastern end)
   
   
2. 1881 Census has "Ernest A Hall", Pawnbroker, living at number 72. And yes - definitely says "pawnbroker", not "planemaker" - the handwriting's quite clear there. Also lists a "pawnbroker's assistant" at same address. As further evidence, in an 1886 Old Baily trial transcript, some bloke who was nabbed carrying a stolen sewing machine down Columbia Rd initially claimed he was taking it to number 72 for payment of a debt, suggesting it was still a pawnshop. Though not relevant I can't help quoting the Constable's account to the court here, just cos it made me smile:
   I said, "Where are you going with that [sewing] machine?"—he said, "I am engaged to remove some furniture for a woman who owes some rent"—I said, "Where are you going with it?"—he said, "To 72, Columbia Road"—I said I should accompany him to see if it was correct—when he got on about 600 yards farther he threw the machine down and said, "Now you have got me, carry the f—thing yourself"
   
   
3. As noted by Don, in the 1891 census, the address is occupied by Charles Johns, cabinetmaker - not long arrived from Germany (in 1901, it's home to another German emigree, Christian Kuhn, who's a 'Dining table maker')
   
   
4. In all the censuses, the whole area was awash with cabinet makers, joiners and other woodworking trades, as well as all the signs of Victorian urban poverty. Hence a local pawnbroker would almost certainly have done a roaring trade in wooden tools.

So... on balance, it certainly looks like the "E. Hall 72 Columbia Rd" stamp reported by Stuart's original post (and shown without comment on p.346 of the 4th Ed of "British Plane Makers") was not a planemaker or owner but a pawnbroker, who would have used this to re-brand any unredeemed pledges before selling them on.

 

[JobandKnock]

Could be that the plane was panwed at some time then... kinda sad but gives it a shade more history

I well remember a shop one place I worked in the early 1980s which was still a sort of ironmonger/hardware/tool dealer business but also acted as a pawnbroker. In the days when people had little or no job security pawning your tools would be a way to keep yourself afloat whilst you were waiting for a building contractor to pay you (things haven't changed that much - some of the lads I worked with were forced to use pawnbrokers after the 2007/08 crash when the building trades went to **** in a handbasket). It was also where retired tradesmen would sometimes sell their kit after they had retired, especially before the state pension came into being. Some of my early tools were bought from just such an establishment