Cooling chisel or plane blade when sharpening

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Mark18PLL

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I have a Sorby Pro Edge for sharpening. I am wary of overheating the steel, especially when getting to a higher grit, what is the best way to cool them? i have read its best to avoid water cooling.

Thanks
Mark
 
Not heard that one.
I use a 2l bleach container cut in half with something heavy inside (old grindstone)
Its just about the right size for dunking, should you not have something a bit more suitable.

Note to be more/twice as careful with laminated irons!
Well for me anyways, I'll leave more secondary on those, as they are soft enough to finish off that primary with some hand work, especially if one has a lap handy.

Not sure if it's more so the case of bluing edges in a cold workshop, but I don't seem to have have noticed this happening in summer?

All the best

Tom
 
Only just copped it does seem like the intention was to sharpen using the tool,
which I missed, as I was thinking it was just for primary bevel grinding.
Thanks for pointing that out @Blister
 
Once it's sharp, proper sharp the iron should only need a minor re sharpen / hone by hand on a stone
No way would I use a pro edge on my irons :eek:
Thanks for the reply but not really an answer to the question i was asking. As my chisels and planes are primarily used for carpentry they get a nick on them now and then and it seems to take forever to get them back to what i want. This is why i use the Sorby, it also has 1200 and 3000 grit belts which does a great job and is quick to get them nice and sharp.
 
For me the belt speed it to fast and the time taken to get worryingly hot is not worth the risk even when using a ceramic belt , I mainly use my pro edge for turning tools , However each to their own ;)
 
A dunk in water, or hold them on a block of aluminium or steel as a heat sink, if you don't like to use water on your tools, or in your shop.
 
Carbon steels (plane and chisels) loose their hardness if you blue the steels so use sharp belts and dip in water frequently. High Speed Steel (HSS) is used on most modern turning tools and the blueing doesn't have an effect on the hardness. HSS was developed to cut metals while close to red hot without loosing hardness. However dipping HSS in water when it is hot enough to blue it causes microscopic cracks in the metal which dulls them more quickly in use. Set the HSS on a metal block as per Adam and let them cool slowly.

Pete
 
Carbon steels (plane and chisels) loose their hardness if you blue the steels so use sharp belts and dip in water frequently. High Speed Steel (HSS) is used on most modern turning tools and the blueing doesn't have an effect on the hardness. HSS was developed to cut metals while close to red hot without loosing hardness. However dipping HSS in water when it is hot enough to blue it causes microscopic cracks in the metal which dulls them more quickly in use. Set the HSS on a metal block as per Adam and let them cool slowly.

Pete
Thanks Inspector 👍🏻
 
If you’ve got it hot enough that water cooling causes issues you’ve already got it too hot.

Frequent dunks in water will give a nice visual clue to heat, once the moisture near the edge you’re grinding has dried it’s time to dunk again

Also bare hands and when getting too hot to handle that’s a sign to cool it
 
If you’ve got it hot enough that water cooling causes issues you’ve already got it too hot.

Frequent dunks in water will give a nice visual clue to heat, once the moisture near the edge you’re grinding has dried it’s time to dunk again

Also bare hands and when getting too hot to handle that’s a sign to cool it
Makes sense, thanks Tom 👍🏻
 
keep a folded paper towel and dip it in water. Lay it on the back of whatever you're sharpening near the tip to keep the steel near the tip cool and drawing heat away.

Otherwise develop a "count" and a dip so that you don't lose track and burn an edge after getting it on and off of a belt 10 times. As in, if you burn it on the 11th, you might as well have burned it on the first.

I make stuff like this -

all of the bevels that you see (including sides) are ground after it's already hardened. high speed belts and ceramic are far cooler than anything else (you need the high speed to make the ceramic part work right - it'll just wear out fast at lower speed).

Coarse - keep the belts in coarse grit for grinding. If you decide at some point to use a wheel, coarseness is aspect one.

When I'm done with a tool, I will sometimes clean up the bevel one final time on a CBN wheel, which is far hotter than a 36 grit ceramic belt (but not nearly as brash) and it's easy to get impatient with it. I fairly often if lots of grinding is needed will use a paper towel folded (and soaking wet) into a very small rectangle, lay it on the back of the tool and then apply pressure to the paper towel, thus to the tool, thus into the belt.

If the paper towel touches the belt (or a wheel) you get sprayed, but nothing catches or flies. When the water gets warm, you get a sense that you're maybe being a little too aggressive. (it must be close to the tip, though - very close, if you have a heavy hand).

What I've found in the last couple of years grinding is the contribution of the supporting steel to the bevel in terms of overheating. As in, a cold tool will grind for a long while before you have heat issues (being reasonable with touch). If you can manage to keep the supporting steel relatively cool, this remains true. If you allow the supporting steel to get warm but not that hot, it's less efficient drawing heat away from the edge and the edge will heat faster.

This is two faceted:
1) if you let the steel even seeming far from the edge (1/4th 1/2 inch away) get hot, you'll have heat problems at the edge
2) if you can manage to cool that part efficiently, even if you're not keeping the very tip as cool as the rest, the heat will leave the tip at a reasonable rate looking for somewhere cooler to be absorbed (thus, try to get wet paper towel near or at the edge, but even if it's back just a skosh, it'll still help).

if you use my count tip with a reasonable amount of pressure, always abide by the count, don't cheat. I grind the chisel bevels above (on the ends) from square in no more than two minutes without ever getting the tip hot enough to boil water - be the dude with the count. the dude abides.
 
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keep a folded paper towel and dip it in water. Lay it on the back of whatever you're sharpening near the tip to keep the steel near the tip cool and drawing heat away.

Otherwise develop a "count" and a dip so that you don't lose track and burn an edge after getting it on and off of a belt 10 times. As in, if you burn it on the 11th, you might as well have burned it on the first.

I make stuff like this -

all of the bevels that you see (including sides) are ground after it's already hardened. high speed belts and ceramic are far cooler than anything else (you need the high speed to make the ceramic part work right - it'll just wear out fast at lower speed).

Coarse - keep the belts in coarse grit for grinding. If you decide at some point to use a wheel, coarseness is aspect one.

When I'm done with a tool, I will sometimes clean up the bevel one final time on a CBN wheel, which is far hotter than a 36 grit ceramic belt (but not nearly as brash) and it's easy to get impatient with it. I fairly often if lots of grinding is needed will use a paper towel folded (and soaking wet) into a very small rectangle, lay it on the back of the tool and then apply pressure to the paper towel, thus to the tool, thus into the belt.

If the paper towel touches the belt (or a wheel) you get sprayed, but nothing catches or flies. When the water gets warm, you get a sense that you're maybe being a little too aggressive. (it must be close to the tip, though - very close, if you have a heavy hand).

What I've found in the last couple of years grinding is the contribution of the supporting steel to the bevel in terms of overheating. As in, a cold tool will grind for a long while before you have heat issues (being reasonable with touch). If you can manage to keep the supporting steel relatively cool, this remains true. If you allow the supporting steel to get warm but not that hot, it's less efficient drawing heat away from the edge and the edge will heat faster.

This is two faceted:
1) if you let the steel even seeming far from the edge (1/4th 1/2 inch away) get hot, you'll have heat problems at the edge
2) if you can manage to cool that part efficiently, even if you're not keeping the very tip as cool as the rest, the heat will leave the tip at a reasonable rate looking for somewhere cooler to be absorbed (thus, try to get wet paper towel near or at the edge, but even if it's back just a skosh, it'll still help).

if you use my count tip with a reasonable amount of pressure, always abide by the count, don't cheat. I grind the chisel bevels above (on the ends) from square in no more than two minutes without ever getting the tip hot enough to boil water - be the dude with the count. the dude abides.

Great advice DW, thank tyou very much for taking the time to write such a detailed explanation, it helps a lot. 👍🏻
 
I was an apprentice-boy in New Zealand in the 1980s. Back in those unionised days we were allocated 1/2 an hour a week for saw and chisel sharpening which new apprentices were encouraged to take to learn to sharpen their own gear. Right at the beginning of my time my most important job was actually making the tea for our entire crew: this was the minimum task an apprentice was expected to undertake without f**king it up. In our firm the bench grinder was in the same room we had our smoko in. I must have been a right little 5h!t because I used to fill with water the tea mug of whoever was currently mistreating me to dunk my chisels into when sharpening. I can’t remember ever getting caught doing this either.
 
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