BOWL GOUGE.

[Paul.J]

Hello everyone.This is my first posting and i'm afraid it is for help.
I have recently started to try and do some bowl turning and other little projects for the first time,using an home made chuck made of Oak.
The chuck seems to work well but i am having trouble with my bowl gouge,it keeps wanting to dig in.
Is there a certain way you have to use these gouges.I have tried working from the centre out and inside edge in, trying to hold the gouge at varying angles but it still wants to dig in.
The other problem i am finding is vibration.I manage to turn the piece nice and round,no problems their,but when i get so far the piece starts to vibrate as though it as gone out of alignment.Is this usual or am i doing something wrong.
Thank you.

PAUL.J

 

[OLD]

Its a long time since i did any turning but you need sharp tools and they need sharpening alot turn from large dia to small the single bevel should rest/rub on the wood you then steer and push.The toolrest below center line and close to job ,you get a nice sound when the tool is cutting well the above is just a start its actually quite difficult.

 

[Anonymous]

Hi and welcome aboard Paul

Is there a certain way you have to use these gouges.

The short answer is yes! The long answer is that the angle of presentation is dpenedent upon several factors... take a look at the late Keith Rowley's book and video prob at your local library. It will give you some pointers but...

It's a poor substitute for watching and questioning someone as they show you the 'hows'

The other problem i am finding is vibration.I manage to turn the piece nice and round,no problems their,but when i get so far the piece starts to vibrate as though it as gone out of alignment.

Here again several factors may be at play... without watching you work I would have to guesstimate whta's happening... I'm not going to try 'cos that could add to the problem rather than be of help to you.

You'll find the usual (almost standard ) advice is to join a club and watch
other turners ... don't be afraid to ask "Why do it that way?" (beware some (very few in reality) are miserable sods who wouldn't give you the time of day)

Another solution would be to attend a course (No! I'm not advertising )
3 hours will put you at the start of the right road... ( a full day would be better)

 

[Roger]

Hi Paul

As Graham says - get yourself some good videos / DVD's to work through, or better still, take a short course from a good turner.

If you put your location in your profile, it would help others here to give you advice. I've got Jimmy Clewes 15 minutes from me .....

 

[CHJ]

...snip...The other problem i am finding is vibration.I manage to turn the piece nice and round,no problems their,but when i get so far the piece starts to vibrate as though it as gone out of alignment.Is this usual or am i doing something wrong.
Thank you.
PAUL.J

Paul, it may be that the Bowl is going out of round due to the wood warping as you release the stresses.

If you do not complete the piece in a reasonable timescale and leave it on the lathe for any period of time it WILL BE out of round by an amount dependant on the wood type and moisture content.

Another thing that may cause your vibration is the varying density of the piece of wood.

As has been said if you indicate your location, someone near may be able to help diagnose your problems.

I am assuming your lathe does not develope vibrations after the same period of time with nothing in the chuck.

 

[Paul.J]

Hello everyone.
Thanks for the advice and help.Much appreciated.
I suppose a course would be the answer seeing as i have read books and looked at videos.
Seeing as how i have got a lathe thats redundant i just thought i would have a go at doing something different,i used it for turning the posts for the rocking horses i used to make.
This is the first time that i have tried turning a bowl since i left school and that's thirty years ago.
I did spend most of yesterday trying varying ways of using the bowl gouge but after a couple of nice cuts it still wanted to dig in.I managed to finish the bowl though using a round nose scraper.???This cut nice and smooth.I must say that i really have enjoyed doing this bowl and can't wait to do another or someting similar.I think i'm hooked.
I have been looking at some of the pieces on here and i can see that i have a looooooong way to go to get to those standards.Fantastic.

Chas.My lathe which is a Record DML24 runs nice and smooth with no vibration.
Roger.Sorry i don't mean to be ignorant,but who's Jimmy Clewes??

Paul J.

 

[Roger]

Jimmy Clewes - probably one of the best there is:

Jimmy Clewes

If you are using a long grind fingernail profile, it 'sounds' like you're using the tip or getting too perpendicular with the tip of the gouge and getting the dig in. That's only a guess w/o seeing how you're holding it.

 

[Anonymous]

Paul, take another look at the video(s) of a bowl gouge in use...

pay particular attention to the starting position of the cut and it's subsequent travel across the face of the bowl...

note also, the position of the flute relative to the vertical as it traverses...

compare what you see with what you do...

I should have said earlier... make very fine cuts, not only does it develop your skill but it also minimises any catch damage... with the bonus that you may be able to work out why the catch happened

If you're passing peterborough anytime, get in touch... no charge for a quick demo :wink:

 

[Paul.J]

Thanks for the offer Graham,but i now no longer am able to drive,otherwise i would take you up on your offer.
I do do fine cuts with the gouge and have tried watching why it digs in,maybe it's just the timber.I will try another piece soon and see how i get on with that.I'm sure i am doing everything right.
I have read the books on this particular problem time and time again.Which is why i think i am doing it right.

Paul.J.

 

[Anonymous]

Paul, I'll leave you in the capable hands of my old mate;

Percy Vere :lol:

 

[Paul.J]

I've heared a lot of him though.

 

[Steve620]

Paul
I'm in exactly the same boat and have tried the same things. If you get a result please let me know. I'm just off to get some more knocks and try different angles of tool over the rest

Steve

 

[Paul.J]

Hello Steve.
I thought it was just me.
I am planning to turn another bowl soon and i will let you know how i get on.
In the mean time though i have managed to turn a small trinket box and an egg-hollowed out,and an egg cup with no problems.
I thought these three would have been more difficult and the bowl been the easier.Just shows.

Paul.J.

 

[PowerTool]

Paul - what timbers have you been using ? Some are easier to work than others.
Or have all these smaller items been automatically making you take smaller,more controlled cuts ?

Just a couple of thoughts,

Andrew

 

[Paul.J]

Hello Andrew.
I used Hawthorne for the egg and trinket box and Ash for the cup.
I used a smaller bowl gouge 6mm using it the same way as the 12mm one which i was having trouble with.
They both look to be ground at the same angle.
The Oak i was using for the bowl was well seasoned,off cuts i have had for years,where as the Ash and the Hawthorne were cut down 3-4 years ago.So perhaps these are still green???
Can i ask how long is a timber like i have used green for? :-k

Cheers.

Paul. J.

 

[Russell]

Paul can you photograph your bowl gouge including a close up of the tip, It will help with suggestions as to the best way to use it. It is difficult to advise without knowing how it is set up.

 

[PowerTool]

General rule-of-thumb for air drying is one year per inch thickness,and anything thicker than four inches is difficult to air dry.
If the timber was left in the round,it could still be a little green.Also,were you turning them all cross-grain (like a conventional bowl blank) or hollowing into end-grain (like a spindle between centres)?

Sorry I've got questions and no answers ,but sometimes I think too much :wink:

Andrew

 

[Paul.J]

Hello.
Russel. I have had a look at how to put photos on here and i think it is beyond me to put a photo on here.it seems quite complicated.
Is this proceedure as complicated as it seems.I am no computer whizz far from it. i'm amazed at what i do do on here.
The gouge though is a brand new Record 3/8" bowl gouge (i thought it was 1/2") my mistake.Model No ch 602.
I haven't tried re- grounding it as it does cut nice when i can get it to cut.

Andrew.The bowl was turned cross grain,but the smaller items were turned end grain.

Cheers.

Paul.J.

 

[Russell]

If its a standard grind Record CH602 it does in my opinion need grinding. The gouge its self is OK nothing wrong with Record tools. The ears on the gouge need to be removed and the gring swept back a little. I would not put a fingernail grind on the gouge yet. I will post a couple of pictures but can't at the moment. If you check my web site there are some images under sorby chisels that may show the kind of grind I would put on. Im sure it is the ears of the chisel that cause you to dig in.

 

[Paul.J]

Hello Russell.
I see what you mean.
I think you might have solved my problem :lol: ..I did think it might have been that as looking at the books and videos those gouges did seem ground back more,i just thought it was the turners choice,and with this being a new gouge i had to learn how to use it properly.
It did seem to be the corner that was catching but it happens that fast that you can't really be sure.
I was just blaming myself thinking i was doing something wrong.
I will be turning another bowl next week and i will grind the gouge back a little and let you know how i get on.

Having looked at your website Russell i was thinking of upgrading my DML 24 with the Record upgrades so i could have the swivel head to turn larger bowls.
Would it be worth me doing this or just buying the DML 36 which already have the new features.

Paul. J.