Beginners Plane advice

[Quadie]

I tried searching the site but couldn't find a direct answer so I thought I'd ask direct.

I'm looking to buy a couple of planes. These are being bought as a complete hand tool beginner with a (very) tight budget. I just want to make sure I am not making a bad decision here. I have read on a couple of other posts I searched that the cheaper planes need more tuning / tweaking, but if it helps me learn more about them I'm not bothered about that.

The two I'm looking at are:
http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-axminster-no-5-jack-plane-prod377654/
http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-axminster-no-9-1-2-block-plane-prod453694/

I will admit that I've been helped to this decision by the 'Star Rating' hence why I'm asking here.

It would also be helpful to get info on what to buy for sharpening. Over and above the new plane, my Dad likes to collect old tools and I said I would get his planes back into tip top condition as part of me learning all this.

Any help much appreciated.

Cheers,

Keith.

 

[dunbarhamlin]

Would be inclined to contact Ray Iles ( http://www.oldtools.free-online.co.uk/ but phone would be better - Tel: 01507 525697 ) about a good user vintage Record or Stanley. Price would be in the same ballpark, unless you added one of his super aftermarket blades.

If you can find a local sharpening mentor, then go with whatever method they use. Otherwise, lowest cost of entry would probably be Matthew's scary sharp films rather than actual stones. Also, if no mentor available, a cheap eclipse clone honing guide would probably be a good idea (no, I can't believe I said that either)

 

[Vann]

I'm with dumbarhamblin. Don't but a new plane unless you can afford a good one.

Pick up an old (read:OLD) Record or Stanley. Fettle it. Tart it up as much as you feel you want to. Replace the cutting iron with a thicker iron if it's even slightly pitted - consider replacing the cap-iron with a thicker item if the cutting iron is fine.

Buy some sharpening gear.

Good luck.

Cheers, Vann.

 

[Jensmith]

You might want to put a 'Wanted' ad in the 'for sale' section on here to see if anyone has an old one for sale as there were a couple of No 5's available when I was looking a few weeks ago and the one I got is great.

 

[condeesteso]

Totally agree - I'm afraid you will end up disappointed with the planes you mention. Find an old Stanley or Record, and tune it. Start with just one, say the jack. Some may say be careful of ebay, but there are some really good old ones around and look for one with plenty of decent pics. If the sole is clean, tote not chipped (common), and plenty of blade you are very likely to have a good one. Later you can replace the blade and chip-breaker. You might try the Quangsheng ones from Workshop Heaven. I reckon you could end up with a really excellent jack for about £25 for the plane, and say the same again later for a new blade (less with the Quangsheng). But don't dismiss the original blade, it's almost all down to the sharpening.
This way, you get to really know what makes a plane work well, how to tune it (not hard) and how to sharpen and hone a blade to razor-sharp etc - and you will have a great plane for life.
Unless you can afford the premium ones, they don't make planes the way they used to!
p.s. sometimes you see a U.S. Stanley (Stanley Rule & Level Inc) plane in the UK on ebay. They are my personal favourites.

and sorry - SHARPENING: a big topic, well discussed here often. Best take a look at the 'sharpening chisels' thread here for example. It's too big a subject to summarise! And beware there is no one perfect way or system.

 

[markturner]

I agree with the above. Just found this one: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Stanley-Bailey-No ... 577wt_1139

Its an English one, but looks nice and a good plane to start with. A size 4.5 is probably the best if you only get one plane to start

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/Stanley-Bailey-No ... 555wt_1139

Good luck

 

[woodbloke]

Some excellent adivce from all, nothing really to add to it, except that whatever you, don't buy a new one! - Rob

 

[Quadie]

Thanks for all your help. I will say that I thought it strange that there was no steady progression of prices when it came to planes - all or nothing. Which did concern me a bit - hence the post.

As mentioned, my Dad has a load of old tools. I'll have a look through what he's got and post some picks here. He could be sitting on a gold mine. Unfortunately, he's wise to my brother and I when we ask to 'borrow' his tools.

I'll let you know how I got on.

Keith.

 

[Vann]

Dammit, seeing as you're just starting on the slope, I'll give you an old Stanley if you want to pop 'round.

Cheers, Vann. :twisted:

 

[woodbloke]

Dammit, seeing as you're just starting on the slope, I'll give you an old Stanley if you want to pop 'round.

Cheers, Vann. :twisted:

...and the chances of that happening? Remote :lol: :lol: - Rob

 

[Quadie]

Dammit, seeing as you're just starting on the slope, I'll give you an old Stanley if you want to pop 'round.

Cheers, Vann. :twisted:

...and the chances of that happening? Remote :lol: :lol: - Rob

What are you talking about? I'm on my way!

I might have to change buses though...

K.

 

[bugbear]

I'll just repeat my recommendation for Records with square cornered blades. See previous posts for detailed reasoning.

Even Grim follows this advice!

BugBear

 

[tekno.mage]

I also agree with the above go with old rather than new unless you have *loads* of money to spend.

I was a total plane newbie a year or so ago, and having done some reading on this forum found an early 1930s Stanley number 5 at a boot sale for £12. Although in reasonable condition (very ittle rust), it needed a bit of "fettling", which wasn't at all difficult even for a total beginner, and in the process I discovered it had lovely rosewood handles underneath the old chipped and paint-spattered varnish. I had no trouble setting it up to work very nicely indeed. I suppose I had one advantage, as a woodturner, I already had a wet sharpening system which works just as well on plane blades as it does on woodturning tools!

I've since accumulated further planes from bootfairs - a couple of which I do currently use, while others (which were real bargains, despite me not having a current use for them...) are still awaiting fettling.

 

[jimi43]

Some excellent adivce from all, nothing really to add to it, except that whatever you, don't buy a new one! - Rob

Says it all really....

Also tekno's comments are just the way I started many moons ago.

The benefit of this system of acquisition is that you can get real bargains for next to nothing...and you can end up with a box of examples...some of which are tat...some are fit for spares....some are fit for restoration and some...just occasionally will be real gems.

Things to research before you wander....check here for threads on planes and their subsequent fettling....check on the various specialist "Old Tools" sites...see what goes for that extra few pounds over standard examples and learn which models are more sought after...they tend to be the ones that work better too!

Records are generally thought better than Stanleys....some of the old Stanleys are beautiful too...

Try to avoid highly pitted irons as they will not take a keen edge...ok if the pitting is up on the far end though...which it tends to be...above the cap iron.

Look for rosewood or stained hardwood handles...these are older and better quality.

Take a straight edge with you if you are keen to get a good one without much work...the metal surrounding the mouth should be at least in line with the front and back edges and the bit in between level or with a slight concave dip. Convex soles are a nightmare.

Dig in boxes....don't just go with dealers...and finally my old boring mantra...

Get there when it opens! Beat the dealers....! :mrgreen: \/

Jim

 

[Dangermouse]

All the above is very good advice, I prefer older Record planes, better I think than most stanleys. I only ever purchased a new plane and that was a no 10. Just because I could get a reasonable new one for a lot less than the silly prices the old planes make on e-bay etc. I purchased a Faithfull and surprisingly it's pretty good quality, needed a bit of fettling, but not much and its made and finished better than a new Record or Stanley.
Here is a photo of a Record no6 I bought on ebay and restored, put in new thick blade and chipbreaker from Workshop Heaven and for a plane that cost me in total £46.00 I have one thats just as good as a las or clifton.