Are theese combination machines any good?

[heimlaga]

Does anybody know anything about this type of combination machines. Are they practical? Or to awkward to move from one use to another?
There were three makers of them in Sweden back in the 1950-ies. Jonsered, Stenberg and Sajo. A machine of this type could be a solution for my cramped shop and enable me to take on some woodworking jobs that would earn me some money in winters when construction is slow.
http://www.blocket.se/dalarna/Snickerim ... m?ca=2&w=3
http://www.blocket.se/jonkoping/Stenber ... ?ca=14&w=2
http://www.blocket.se/blekinge/Snickeri ... m?ca=2&w=3

I am not afraid of secondhand because I have refurbished machinery before and know some skilled machinists and welders who could help me if needed.

 

[beech1948]

I don't think that moving from one function to another is an issue at all. Most of the myths about combination machines vs separates are just that myths. Combinations save some space but not as much as you expect.

The real issue is how much space do you need to have around them to use all of the functions.ie. Saw, planer, thicknesser, spindle etc. If you are handling a 2.4m long plank then you need 2.4m in front and 2.4m behind the machine to allow for feeding the plank. You will need about1.5m all round the sides to manouver yourself + wood and to get down to adjust the machine. So thats a big space.

My Felder needs about a 4m square to work in comfortably.

Hope this helps
regards
Alan

 

[heimlaga]

The real issue is how much space do you need to have around them to use all of the functions.ie. Saw, planer, thicknesser, spindle etc. If you are handling a 2.4m long plank then you need 2.4m in front and 2.4m behind the machine to allow for feeding the plank. You will need about1.5m all round the sides to manouver yourself + wood and to get down to adjust the machine. So thats a big space.

Theese machines apparently can stand back against a wall and be worked from the front. That would make the needed width 1m+1,5m=2.5m
I normally open the garage doors when handling long planks.

 

[eoinsgaff]

My immediate reaction was that combination machines only save you space in a large shop. Separates can be stored away in a smaller shop.

However, that thought process is based on modern machines. Those machines look like they might actually save space, especially in a long, narrow shop. The second model in particular. Planer, spindle moulder and table saw all in line. Interesting, very interesting.

I would add the following though - these do not look like very safe machines, it looks like there is no thicknesser function and to use the spindle moulder some in-feed table adjustment might be required. Also, is there an angle adjustment for the table saw function?

Again, these are damn interesting machines.

Eoin

 

[Guggs]

Looking at your pictures of the machines the thing that struck me about them was the fact they are all made from decent solid metal . No plastic handles ,no flimsy guards and i bet the quality of the finish would be good . The old machines are very simple for maintenance ,solid ,heavy and reliable . I would rather have that than a pile of modern hardened lead . Good luck !

 

[SurreyHills]

I think that if you expect to do a reasonable amount of sawing the machines will be somewhat limited. They look OK for ripping but not for cross cutting. You would need to construct some form of support tables for crosscutting and there are no mitre slots that make using a cross sut sled or mitre fence for standard and angled cuts easy.

 

[Lord Kitchener]

A lot will depend on what sort of work you plan to do, and how you see that work progressing through the workshop. Supposing, for instance, you are making some doors. You are near the end of the various processes, and you discover one of the pieces has gone wrong. How long will it take to run another peice through from start to finish, and, more importantly, how long will it take you to set-up and adjust each cutting operation so that your new piece exactly matches the pieces you already made in the first batch?

This is one of the worst problems with combination machines, and the reason why every other possibilty should be carefully investigated first. When you are doing production work, the abilty to leave separate machines set-up until the work is completed can be a huge time-saver

 

[heimlaga]

Thanks for your replies.

Theese combination machines actually have a thicknesser in them. The thicknesser table is flipped down on top of the cutter and the feedwork rollers are cranked up besides the cutter. The thicknessing action is upside down compared to modern machines.
My present planer/thicknesser has that kind of upside down thicknessing function.

The problem is that I have absolutely no experience with this very type of machines and have never seen one in person. They were not imported to Finland in any greater number though very common in Sweden.

Lord Kitchener
That is exactly my main worry. If I had room enough for them I could get separate machines secondhand for a reasonable cost. Those 50 or 60 years old cast iron machines that fit within my budget cannot be lugged around and stored away in a corner when not in use.

 

[Lord Kitchener]

What sort of work do you anticipate doing? Sometimes there is more than one way to approach a problem.

 

[heimlaga]

Well.....there are two parts of it. Work for profit and hobby.
Right now I have orders for two entirely new double glazed windows and 4 ord windows needing new parts. Door jambs for 4 or 5 doors and all wodwork for a staircase. Two large cabinet doors and very likely a kitchen bench with cabinets in it.
The hobby part could be just about anything but mostly smaller stuff.