ALF and other Boat Anchor Lovers

[Rob the Poser]

I'm this close to pulling the trigger on a 45 for $100USD. Then I read Leach's B&G and I'm waffling. So, 45 users, just how finicky is it? Mike Dunbar includes it in his basic hand tool list.

I'm going to use it to put fluting on the trim for my new office suite I'm building (long story, but three cheers that my boss is not buying me the veneered termite barf that every other office is getting) and also nosing on the bookcase shelves. I also like the idea of having a plough (plow, fellow 'Muricans) plane around. Stair saw and chisel has lost it's appeal.

Anyway, am I making a mistake I will regret every time I walk into my office at work, or will I regret more buying a routah bit and donning all the required protective gear? (Okay, I know no one here can really answer that, but some straightforward on the 45 would be appreciated).

 

[Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)]

Hi Rob

I have used my #45 successfully to make fluting in softer woods. However, I much prefer using a Stanley #66 (with LN blades) in both hard and soft woods.

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[Rob the Poser]

Anyone have any thoughts on the Veritas beading tool? It would run about half what I'm looking to pay for the 45. Of course, it won't plow...

 

[Alf]

Well I'm going to say "go for it" aren't I? :lol: It's not finicky IMO, at least no more finicky that a tailed router. You need to take a little more care in your stock selection sometimes, but it's amazing what you can get away with using a sharp cutter and light cut when you have to. I use mine, or variants on the theme, often. Viz: here, here and here to demonstrate a few occasions when I had the camera handy.

Cheers, Alf

 

[Alf]

Tsk, the question's moved on before I'd even finished posting... #-o FWIW, I rarely take my #66 out of its box in comparison to the #45. But your mileage may vary, as the saying goes.

Forget the beading tool and make yourself a scratch stock if you want to go down that road.

Cheers, Alf

 

[MikeW]

Hi Rob,

When I bought a #45 I went into it knowing all the bad press people like Leach write about it.

Knowing it can be difficult for some to adjust fine enough to cut well and consistent made me more conscious of adjustment. I own and use a #55 more than my Sargent 1080PB. The Sargent isn't as fine of a plane as was the #45 I owned.

Also, wood planes made for specific tasks like fluting, center and edge beads work better in more types of wood IMO. But the #45/55 work well enough that one doesn't need a drawer full of wood planes--if one gets use to the open "mouth" and finesse required to set blade projection fine enough. I think wood molding planes also handle reversing grain better.

But I do use them less than the #55.

My opinion is that owing to the condition of many of the #45/55s, what with missing bits and all, is that they were used a lot, not just relegated to a shelf suffering disuse. And look at it this way, if it doesn't work for you, you can always sell it.

As for use, look at a copy of Planecraft, usually available at Woodcraft, to see something about use. As Alf says, keep the cutters sharp. That's at least half the battle. Probably more so than depth.

Mike

 

[SlimShavings]

I'm in the middle of making a molding to repair a mirror right now. I'm using a combination 45 and 55. The molding profile couldn't be reproduced with a router. I will post pictures (for what there worth) tonight. I recently posted pictures of the beaded casing I made for a corner cabinet. check the completed project thread. "trying the picture thing"

I don't think they are any more probelm than fussing with a router and table. I did have some trouble with the 55 with keeping the blade from pushing sideways out of the slot when using it to form a cove. Maybe someone can address that. Part of the problem I think was that the flat sided bolt (what do you call it ??) that holes the blade in seemed to have a high spot on it after looking at it.

Two other points I might make. One having to do with your own personality . For me sometimes I have to take a deep breath and slow down and enjoy the moment as I generally am trying to "get it out"
THe other is the importance of the wax. To me its ablsolutely critical for the plane to work. Its almost like the magic missing alixer to make it work properly. L

Like anything else on the dark side there is a learning curve. i think the 55 will eventually give you the most rewards but the 45 is much easier to learn.

 

[Chris Knight]

Rob,

I think the size and position of the flutes and nosing are critical to a proper answer. Almost anything can make narrow beads and flutes close to the edge of a board - a scratch stock does a wonderful job and I use one a lot.

Bigger dimensions and the further the detail is from the edge demand other solutions. For a nosing, I might use a hollow moulding plane or a router - depending how much of it I had to do but I wouldn't fancy doing it with a scratch stock - although it's perfectly feasible (just takes longer)

The further from the edge, the less useful a scratch stock becomes and the more necessary a secondary fence or tool with adequate reach. I am happy to flute stuff a couple or three inches wide using a scratch stock - if I can get to it from both sides. For flutes in the middle of a wide board I usually set up a router, or latterly, tack a fence in place and use a round (moulding plane).

 

[Anonymous]

Use mine all the time with no problems. Keep the cutters sharp. I wouldn't be without it.

 

[Anonymous]

Rob I have the L-N bronze beading tool and I wouldn't be without it either. Tony Murland sells and kit of additional cutters that greatly expands this tool's utility - some nice profiles and a few hollows and rounds thrown in for good measure.

You can work curved project pieces with the Stanley 66 or L-N repro. unit but obviously not with a Stanley 45 or 55.

 

[SlimShavings]

Heres are pictures of a molding for the mirror frame

These are pics of the THIRD time. The first time was a dry run just to get and idea of what the set up would be and what would happen.

The second time I tried to start with a round over first, then the cove then the botttom roundover. That didn't work as I will explain further down.

THe third time

I glued up two boards extra long and wide to have some extra for holding.
I did the two roundovers first useing the 45. That left something for the fence to run against for the cove.

Then I cut the cove down to here with the 55 (The 45 won't cut a cove because you have to set the skates at different heights.) which left not much room for the fence to run against. There is a tendency for you to run off the right side (looking at the picture) (at least in my life) . There by ruining the work DAMHIKT
. Discression being the better part of valor. I decided to use both fences to finish and went slowly with a light cut. I had to cut the board to width to do this. This is when the cutter began to push sideways slightly. As you cut your way down it cut more on the side than on the bottom . I had to stop occasionally and put it back over.
This picture is where I started with both fences and didn't take a picture of the finished cove. ](*,) It had to be cut down to the top of the bottom roundover

Anyway a little scrapeing and sanding and The frame was back together. The reason I couldn't do this with the router was because the roundovers were small and not true parts of a circle. The cove was deep and the same way.

All in all it was a good learning experience and I enjoyed it all the time I cussed it. Hey it was 95 degrees and 95 % humidty. and the sweat was running in my eyes. Thats dedication and desire :lol:

Dave

Who realizes he probably wouldn't be a very good writer after editing this thing 37 times. :lol: :lol:

 

[bugbear]

Bigger dimensions and the further the detail is from the edge demand other solutions. For a nosing, I might use a hollow moulding plane or a router - depending how much of it I had to do but I wouldn't fancy doing it with a scratch stock - although it's perfectly feasible (just takes longer)

Part of the fine art of making mouldings (as opposed to flutes and beads) with a scratch stock is to remove as much waste as possible before scratching.

I especially recommend in this regard:

* #5 jack plane for all fully convex areas
* plough planes (with those helpful fences) for grooves (duh!)
* wooden skew rebates (sort of precision chisels) for convex areas that aren't fully convex (e.g. next to a quirk)

BugBear