A few questions about Planer Thicknesser's

[DannyEssex]

Sorry for asking this as there seems to be loads of threads on this, but each one I read seems to contradict the last and I feel as if I'm going round in circles.


I have decided that I want to get a Planer Thicknesser. My budget is £300-£400, but obviously would like to keep it as low as possible.

My work space is only a small 10x8 shed which is already filling up fast so, will get one of the bench machines, which I can then store under my bench or somewhere else out of the way. I have looked on the net a lot and the names that keep cropping up are SIP, Woodstar, and Fox.

I dont have a extraction system set up at the moment and after reading quite a bit it seems it will be needed. The SIP comes with a dust bag so will that do the job?

My main questions are

1. If I have some PAR timber which has a bow, cup or twist in it, could I put that through the planer, get one face straight and square, turn it on its edge, get that straight and square. And then put it through the thicknesser and end up with a true square PAR board?

2. Will I need to set up a dust extraction system? Or if I got the SIP which comes with a bag, would that be OK?
http://cpc.farnell.com/jsp/displayProdu ... tAodACEACg

Im not fussed about noise as I will only be using it during the day when needed. I have seen a couple online and was hoping some of you guys will have any experience of any of them?

SIP
FOX
Woodstar
Charnwood
Erbauer
Triton

I understand that the majority are basically the same just a different badge, but some have different specs, I have no problems going second hand


Thanks for any advice given, I really appreciate it

Cheers
Danny

 

[blackrodd]

I can't comment on the P/Thicknesser's you have mentioned, as i never owned or used one. Most advice here will probably be to buy a second hand machine from when quality was better for you're quidlets.
personally I would keep away, if possible, from most of the sheet steel and plastic items on sale today.

I have been using an old kity 6" X 10" P/T today and allowing for the scale size, it has performed well,
Although spares could be a problem on older machinery, it rarely seems to go wrong!
Second hand may not be a good idea if you have no idea at all about a planer thicknesser so a newer, light weight item could be good for you personally, which is what it,s all about, what suits you!

Generally speaking, weight is quality with machinery, so anything good tends to weigh just that little bit more.
You can easily take the twist's and cupping from timber using the "over" part of the planer, just keep the workpiece flat on the "out" table you will get better the more you do, and then thickness to any desired size.

As regards the dust, the big problem is the 5 microns and below size that is regarded as the dangerous stuff and the bags that have to allow air out are allowing the size 5 micron and under to blow free.
The way to go seems to be a home built Thein Separator or a vortex system
There are several ingenious models and variations of both on here and u tube.
HTH Regards Rodders

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

Hi Danny

Using the planar you can get one flat side. When you place that now flat side against the fence and hold securely you will get a flat edge perpendicular to it. You now have a face side and edge, both of which are reference surfaces off which you can set fences of either a table saw (or well setup bandsaw) or typically a thicknesser which will create a parallel board by placing the planed side against the thicknessing bed and taking successive passes until the high spots are all gone. The final edge can then be trimmed on the table saw or planed back on the surface planar. Now you have PAR stock.

The amount of shavings being taken even from one pass is a **** of a lot and therefore you will need extraction or your workspace will become a dust ridden hazard in about 10 minutes flat.

I have a larger P/T so am not familiar with the brands you mention but like you I believe most of them are the same Chinese clone that they rebadge/paint differently etc. Thus would it not make sense to buy from the most reputable distributor that offers the best guarantee/after sales service reputation?

 

[Mar_mite]

Hi Danny, I have the Charnwood version. It's ok, very loud though. Don't expect to true up long boards over the top, about 4' is the maximum due to the short tables. On the plus side, it does give a good finish, I put lots of walnut through it for a job and it didn't miss a beat. If space is tight then they are a good compromise. They do the job. I think those bags on the SIP are there to catch chippings, not dust.

 

[SteveF]

Hi Danny

I have the woodstar

really noisy
blades are £20 disposable
the reinforced plate on feed came unwelded but doesnt seem to make a lot of difference
without an extractor ...expect to clear it out after every other board
it works...but thats about it
would I buy another cheap one ? Never Never Ever

Steve

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

I will say one thing in defence of the less expensive P/T's. My first ever was this from Record. (Also a Chinese clone)

http://www.recordpower.co.uk/product/10 ... wXM5MLiseE

I found this to be surprisingly good quality in terms of both finish and power ie it gave great results even with a 2 cutter block and it would easily deal with hardwoods. It was accurate and despite the total absence of cast iron it wasn't a bad little tool. What I hated was the fiddly changeover from planing to thicknessing. It took about a minute and a half (I timed it). And that became a drag after a while. Also, long boards.....forget it. Those short beds are fine for smaller stock but cant cope with longer boards. But I was always pleasantly surprised with its performance in the round.

 

[Gerard Scanlan]

I have a secondhand scheppach and I waited for nearly 2 years to find one. If this is for your hobby I would say a good quality secondhand one is the way to go. I hand planed everything up to the point that I found a good planer-thicknesser for the right price. A higher spec planer has an induction motor which is noisy but doesn't come near a little brush motor on the smaller machines, they really are deafening. However if Bob says that he has had good experience with Record Power machine then it might be the right choice for you. Ideally you only ever want to have to buy one PT. If you spend a couple of hundred pounds now and have to replace it in 5 years time you will not be pleased. They stand around unused most of the time but save a lot of time on bigger projects.

Good luck

 

[morfa]

Danny, bearing in mind your serious size limitations and fairly strict budget, then I personally wouldn't bother with buying a PT. I'd either find a local yard who'll PT your timber for you (my local yard are thankfully really nice and will do it for free or for a modest price) or ask around (on here?) till you can find a friendly local woodworker who has all the kit, if you bring plenty of tea and biccies (or bung them the odd tenner), they might let you use their kit from time to time.

If it's just a small job, then I'd break out the hand planes and do it that way. Cheaper, quieter and not much slower once you've factored in all the faff moving things around to use the machines.

 

[Random Orbital Bob]

that's pretty good advice

 

[DannyEssex]

Thanks for the tips guys,

To be honest I dont know if I should get one or not. It's the fact that I'm having such a hard time squaring up any work with my hand planes. Try as I might I just end up going around in circles! I am on a evening course at the moment and was hoping I would get shown or at least a little advice on preparing my timber, but its not happening. I spent two hours at my last class and the tutor gave me about 15 minuets of his time and didn't really show or tell me anything. At the end of the class he said "I would just use the P/T which is out the back" . pineappled me off a bit TBH

Iv'e watched loads of videos on youtube, but I still cant get the hang of it. I seem to take too much off at one point and then have to try an rectify that and then end up going round and round. I had a 22mm thick board and but the time im nearly close the thickness is 14mm

I started doubting weather I would ever get the hang of it and thought maybe Im not cut out for it :?
I wont give up though, I just thought a P/T would help me out :lol:

 

[morfa]

I started doubting weather I would ever get the hang of it and thought maybe Im not cut out for it :?
I wont give up though, I just thought a P/T would help me out :lol:

Honestly I still can't really do it either. I'm just aiming for 'good enough' and volume of projects. Eventually I figure it'll get better. I have the same thoughts about machinery as well tbh. But speaking to my Dad about his machines he says that there's just as much of a knack to using the machines as there is to the hand tools stuff. It's just quicker with machines.

If you've got the PT at the college available, then that's a good route to getting some stuff sorted out. Just tell the tutor, that you really want to learn how to do it by hand and can he give you some advice.

 

[rspsteve]

Danny i bought a used schappach 2600ci from here in your budget, its not massive but is great spec .

One just went for around a £1000 ! seems to work great allthough not done to much with it yet apart from clean up some 4x4`s for my bench legs and take a few mill off my router table top so i can fit it into the table saw flush .

You can allways pop over and use mine till you get sorted .

Steve

 

[Ian down london way]

Danny,
I started off with something like the SIP model, although it was called something different then. I did find it so much more convenient to be able to prepare my own wood, as well as making salvaging easier. Certainly hand planing even a moderatly wide board (wider then the width of the hand plane blade (is not easy).

I used my SIP type device for quite large projects. I made a welsh dresser, for example (although I had to create the panels from 4 widths of 5 inch wide sycamore). The advantage of having anything is great, and the size was also very useful.

I did find I had to have a means of attaching it to the surface though. I also built a longer table for the thicknesser, which also allowed me to thickness pieces down to just a few mm (on my model, the table didn't go high enough.

As to dust, yes, that's a real problem. I bought a shop vac recently from one of the discount plaes (Aldi? or the other one) which I think would work well with that. There is no way a bag will last long, as the machines take of alot of material in one pass - especially off a long bit of wood.

The last one on the list (the triton) appears to be just a thicknesser, not a planer. I think the name indicates a confusion rather than a clear statement of capability.

Should you get more space, of course, I'd suggest two separate devices. I now have a portable thicknesser from Dewalt (like the Triton, but I think better quality) and a floor mounted planer, with much longer tables, from Axminster (which was suprisingly cheap).

 

[Gerard Scanlan]

A good teacher is essential.
If you can spare the time why don't you go to Paul Sellers for a weekend course. He will show you how to square up timber with a hand plane. It is true unless you are doing a lot of surfacing that a single hand plane can do it all and more. By the time you have set up the machine, hooked up the extractor and adjusted the bed or thicknesser, pluged in the extension, you will have long since finshed preparing your timber. Investing in your skills and abilities is one of those things that does not depreciate.

Paul Sellers has a video on youtube where he squares up a piece of timber.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cl5Srx-Ru_U
Hope this helps.