A bigger shoulder plane

[GarF]

I have a Stanley 90 shoulder plane which I have found very useful for tidying up joinery. But the last task I attempted was cutting a rebate 40mm wide and 12mm deep in some oak. I used my combination plane to plough the bulk of the waste out in sections leaving a strip in between then finished and neatened up with the shoulder plane.

For this kind of task I really could do with something easier to grip, so I'm looking at larger shoulder planes. I referred to the 'ATC' where Schwartz suggests 1 1/4" wide- I usually consider his advice reasonable for my needs since it assumes similar hobbyist type use. Could anyone share some experience of the pros/cons of going larger/narrower- I'm aiming for max usefulness out of the two planes rather than a complete set- so what's the best compromise.
Cheers
G

 

[custard]

I've had a few shoulder planes but they've almost all been 1 1/4". I use that size on everything from tiny delicate jewellery boxes to oak doors.

Maybe there are advantages with smaller shoulder planes, and if people feel comfortable using them then by all means, but I know plenty of very talented craftsmen building a diverse range of products who have never felt the need for anything other than one whopper of a shoulder plane!

It's a tool where you need to be able to set it up, in a variety of different cut configurations, quickly and with absolute precision. There are also subtle errors (like azimuth error) that can be caused or corrected at the sharpening/honing stage. In situations like that it helps to stick to just one tool and get to know it inside out, if you spread yourself too thin with several shoulder planes there's a real risk you'll never get the best out of any of them.

Good luck.

 

[GarF]

That's just it isn't it? I've found a shortcoming in one tool, and need ideally to replace (supplement) it with a more useful one which I can apply to more situations. I'd rather use the time I have in the shed making stuff than curating and maintaining a tool collection! I'll go with the large and see how it goes. I remember getting my first SLR camera- the extra weight was a pain to lug around, but it was a heck of a lot easier to hold steady on a subject.

 

[D_W]

What you need is a rabbet plane and not a shoulder plane. Shoulder planes are good at shoulder work and tiny cleanup jobs (i.e., precise removal of a couple of thousandths), but they are not good at the type of job you're doing (removing what remains, or even removing the whole amount).

That's the job of a rabbet plane. Something you can make fairly easily, or buy over there for a song, refurbish and maybe at worst need to make a new wedge.

It will be much faster and much much easier on your hands.

 

[Racers]

A wooden skew mouthed rebate plane can usually be picked up for peanuts and work well.

Pete

 

[undergroundhunter]

A wooden skew mouthed rebate plane can usually be picked up for peanuts and work well.

Pete

+1

 

[Jacob]

A wooden skew mouthed rebate plane can usually be picked up for peanuts and work well.

Pete

+1

Or a Stanley 78. Usually cheap second hand. Even cheaper if it doesn't have the bits (fence etc) and is still highly usable as a rebate plane - the extras aren't essential.
Very versatile and under-valued plane IMHO. Also usable as a shoulder plane if you get it very sharp and use it carefully.

 

[Trafalgar]

I've had a few shoulder planes but they've almost all been 1 1/4". I use that size on everything from tiny delicate jewellery boxes to oak doors.

Maybe there are advantages with smaller shoulder planes, and if people feel comfortable using them then by all means, but I know plenty of very talented craftsmen building a diverse range of products who have never felt the need for anything other than one whopper of a shoulder plane!

It's a tool where you need to be able to set it up, in a variety of different cut configurations, quickly and with absolute precision. There are also subtle errors (like azimuth error) that can be caused or corrected at the sharpening/honing stage. In situations like that it helps to stick to just one tool and get to know it inside out, if you spread yourself too thin with several shoulder planes there's a real risk you'll never get the best out of any of them.

Good luck.

Great advice that applies to all tools I'd say.

 

[Jacob]

I've had a few shoulder planes but they've almost all been 1 1/4". I use that size on everything from tiny delicate jewellery boxes to oak doors.

Maybe there are advantages with smaller shoulder planes, and if people feel comfortable using them then by all means, but I know plenty of very talented craftsmen building a diverse range of products who have never felt the need for anything other than one whopper of a shoulder plane!

It's a tool where you need to be able to set it up, in a variety of different cut configurations, quickly and with absolute precision. There are also subtle errors (like azimuth error) that can be caused or corrected at the sharpening/honing stage. In situations like that it helps to stick to just one tool and get to know it inside out, if you spread yourself too thin with several shoulder planes there's a real risk you'll never get the best out of any of them.

Good luck.

Great advice that applies to all tools I'd say.

Yes.
But small shoulder planes have their uses where space is restricted. Even the much derided Stanley 75 can suddenly become the perfect tool for fettling a rebate near a corner.

 

[Derek Cohen (Perth Oz)]

G

How wide are your typical rebates? Decide on that basis.

The Veritas 3/4" wide shoulder plane is an good size and excellent plane for this work - I refine my rebates as you do.

A couple of points: firstly, after your bullnose #90 you will really enjoy using a shoulder plane with the extra registration. I hated that #90 and got rid of it. Secondly, you can open up the mouth quickly and easily on the Veritas and other modern shoulder planes, and take thick shavings without any difficulty.

Regards from Perth

Derek

 

[lurker]

G

How wide are your typical rebates? Decide on that basis.

The Veritas 3/4" wide shoulder plane is an good size and excellent plane for this work - I refine my rebates as you do.

A couple of points: firstly, after your bullnose #90 you will really enjoy using a shoulder plane with the extra registration. I hated that #90 and got rid of it. Secondly, you can open up the mouth quickly and easily on the Veritas and other modern shoulder planes, and take thick shavings without any difficulty.

Regards from Perth

Derek

Would you like to declare your interest ?

 

[lurker]

A wooden skew mouthed rebate plane can usually be picked up for peanuts and work well.

Pete

+2

I can never understand why these are not snapped up.
50p seems to be the going rate at boot sales.... I guess because people don't know what they are
A really manky one can easily be fettled into something nice

 

[D_W]

A wooden skew mouthed rebate plane can usually be picked up for peanuts and work well.

Pete

+2

I can never understand why these are not snapped up.
50p seems to be the going rate at boot sales.... I guess because people don't know what they are
A really manky one can easily be fettled into something nice

I agree, all parts of that. They bury a shoulder plane very quickly in working rabbets, too, and especially for cleanup work where the fact that they can:
* exhaust/eject thick shavings of stuff like the OP is talking about (a shoulder plane quickly becomes jammed unless you stop and pull shavings out very frequently)
* avoid the friction that exists in a rabbet with metal planes that are not constantly waxed

I have to assume people are afraid of them because they sometimes require more care before the first use than just taking them out of the box.

 

[Eric The Viking]

Just stumbled on this (fed up with scraping old paint off the covings again!). Really interesting, thanks all.

I know what Derek means about the #90. It was my first and only pocket plane for many years and I had a devil of a job getting it to behave. The "Sweetheart" #92 isn't much better as it's hard to set accurately, because the mouth can't be set easily and works loose, and crucially it's too narrow for lots of jobs. You can always do narrow rebates with wide planes, but the other way round it's easy to mess up.

I'm considering an Axminster "Rider" #92 instead at the moment, as it looks good value. I'm guessing it's a QS originally so there may be alternatives.

A wooden skewed rebate would be nice, except that, being a leftie, most/all of them are really the wrong way round for me to get the best from them. I ought to try harder tie 'right' way round, I guess, but it feels so unwieldy.

E.

 

[bugbear]

50p seems to be the going rate at boot sales.... I guess because people don't know what they are
A really manky one can easily be fettled into something nice

If you're extravagant, you can splurge a whole quid on a super-clean Preston one.



BugBear