Trend T4 versus Bosch POF 500A

[Eric The Viking]

I know the purists will probably wince, but I've had a little Bosch for probably 15 years. I've used it and used it. It's been mounted in a home-made table, it's done countless DIY jobs without complaint, and if it wasn't for a few niggles, it's basically still going strong. It's been undoubtedly one of the most useful Christmas pressies I've ever had.

Sadly though bits are beginning to wear out: the base long ago ceased to be flat - even though it's solid aluminium, it's worn slightly convex. The plunge guides stick annoyingly (have tried practically everything except goat's blood), and the collet is worn (I should replace it if I can get one -note to self: try Miles). I have to say though that the bearings and motor are still fine, and I really have hammered it down the years. It doesn't owe me anything.

The clinching frustration though is that, although I could probably fettle it carefully to keep it going, it doesn't take standard guide bushes. This is a serious limitation for lots of hand-held routing applications. I know I can make up adaptor plates, etc., but it's a lot of messing about without access to a proper workshop, and the accuracy would always be suspect. A Trend base I guess would work, but it adds thickness I really don't want on the bottom.

So, the favourite replacement in the frame as a like-for-like is the Trend T4. On the plus side it's varispeed (my Bosch isn't, although some are), and it takes standard bushes (I think). It's also deeply discounted at the moment, which helps too.

I'm guessing people have been buying bigger routers as a first tool. That doesn't bother me: for my application I don't want big (got that), I want lightweight, handy and well made (the Bosch is Swiss, and the build quality has been evident).

I guess negatives would come from people's experiences. Are the T4s any good as a lightweight, light duty router? I'm not looking for weight and power, but occasional rounding-over and bevelling in situ, trimming, simple grooving and small (1/4") dovetails box joints on the jig.

Are there other, better alternatives out there too that I haven't noticed?

The budget is up to £75, 80 tops. Otherwise it's worth fettling the Bosh for a few more years.

All comments welcome...

 

[Chems]

You can get a Bosch Palm Router for 68 which is similar to yours?

 

[Eric The Viking]

You can get a Bosch Palm Router for 68 which is similar to yours?

Yes, it does look very nice.

I think I'd need the full kit to match what I can presently do with the 500A though, which puts it over the budget for the moment.

As a stopgap, I've ordered a Trend Unibase, that should fit the Bosch and let me use standard bushes. It won't fix the sticky plunge issue (currently operating without any springs, as it's too awkward), but it will keep it useful for a bit longer.

And I'm most probably saving for a Bosch palm router too. If Porter Cable did 240v versions, I have to say I wouldn't consider the Bosch though...

 

[misterfish]

I see that Axminster have 4 brand new on Ebay at the moment for £109.96 rather than the usual £130ish http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/BOSCH-NEW-GKF60-P ... 0275970721

Misterfish

 

[Eric The Viking]

I see that Axminster have 4 brand new on Ebay at the moment for £109.96 rather than the usual £130ish http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/BOSCH-NEW-GKF60-P ... 0275970721

Misterfish

Yes, I noticed those too. The trouble is that I think I'd need the full kit with all the attachments to get the value from it, and they don't seem to be discounting those at the moment

I've ordered a Unibase from D+M as a stopgap measure, which should put a new lease of life into the Bosch for the time being and give me a chance to look for a bargain. It's done amazingly well really: ten years or so of pretty hard graft (heavy domestic as they say in the carpet trade), and the motor and bearings are still pretty solid. It's only really the plunge action and the base (the metal is rather worn now) that let it down, and I ought to source a new collet really, but even that isn't very worn, as far as I can see.

 

[Tim Nott]

I've got a T4 and dislike it. The fine depth adjustment, apart from being very fiddly, uses the turret depth stop hole, so you can't use it to set a plunge depth. For its power its very tall with the cable shroud sticking out the top, so hard to get in tight spaces (eg narrow window frames). There's no fine fence adjustment - though you can by a T5 fence which fits. I think I got oe from Miles.
Changing a cutter has good points and bad.
Good point is that there's no 'second pressure' - slacken the collet half a turn and the cutter comes free. You also get 6mm, 1/4" and 8mm collets.
Bad point is that the shaft lock thing is hideous to use - you have to press it in, lean on the router to stop the whole shebang moving as you manipulate the spanner. I removed it and use two spanners. Newton's third law - the router stays put.
And it vibrates, the switch is awkward, but it is light enough to use, for example, sinking hinges or lack plates in door frames.

 

[Eric The Viking]

I've got a T4 and dislike it. The fine depth adjustment, apart from being very fiddly, uses the turret depth stop hole, so you can't use it to set a plunge depth. For its power its very tall with the cable shroud sticking out the top, so hard to get in tight spaces (eg narrow window frames).

I have similar problems with the Bosch, but looking it last night, it's actually no taller than the 1/2" Performance Power (B+Q's finest) that
I've had in the router table until recently. I suspect it's shorter than the T4, and I can live with it.

There's no fine fence adjustment - though you can by a T5 fence which fits. I think I got oe from Miles.

Same with the Bosch, but maybe I'm expecting a lot from an inexpensive router. It strikes me too that these fences are a bit of a con really - just a 10mm bolt - it ought to be possible to do something fairly easily with a coach bolt and hardwood. I have two fences that fit the Bosch, as the PP one (which I never use with a fence) has the same gauge and spacing on the bars, so I shall experiment.

(later)
I spent the evening listening to telly whilst fettling the Bosch. The motor and bearings feel as-new, and the insides are pretty much clean as a whistle. The plunge issue is wear on the motor plate, as the slides aren't bushed, just white metal, and there is some roughness in the plunge rods from the clamp mechanism.

(goes surfing) Miles - yeeeha! They have the parts to effectively renew the whole bottom end of the router for <£48. If I add a new collet (will get 8mm too for good measure), for £8 it's a good-value refurb job. It also leaves me with the old motor plate gash: although the slides are shot, there's a flat surface to screw to: it might be re-usable for a pantograph or overhead mount of some sort.

I think I've a plan coming together at long last!

Changing a cutter has good points and bad.
Good point is that there's no 'second pressure' - slacken the collet half a turn and the cutter comes free. You also get 6mm, 1/4" and 8mm collets.
Bad point is that the shaft lock thing is hideous to use - you have to press it in, lean on the router to stop the whole shebang moving as you manipulate the spanner. I removed it and use two spanners. Newton's third law - the router stays put.

The Bosch has a simple hole bored through the shaft: you put a 4mm pin through to lock it. Anything will do, including old drill bits and electrical screwdrivers, and it has the advantage of acting as a depth stop for inserting cutters.

I thought it was crude when I first got the machine, but I've come to like it. Like yourself, I prefer its simplicity over the alternatives: the PP has a rotating spring-loaded lever/dog, and the T11 is push-button like the T4. Neither are very nice. You can at least spanner the T11 (the shaft flats are roughly 16mm by eye, but I haven't tried this yet). The locking pin holes are through drilled, but frustratingly, the motor shaft is too stubby, and the collet blocks them when it's in place.

And it vibrates, the switch is awkward, but it is light enough to use, for example, sinking hinges or lack plates in door frames.

Mine gets a lot of use for jobs like that. It's been vibrating slightly recently, but the collet is a bit worn. My £50 refurb includes a new collet nut too, so we'll see. I'm guessing it'll be fine, as the conical surface in the shaft looked pretty good last night. You could see a bit of shine on the inside of the nut, but the blueing on the shaft's cone wasn't especially worn. I'll see when the new parts arrive.

Thanks for the thoughts.

Cheers,

S.