Any old saw and plane

[8squared]

Now I'm starting to get more involved with the craft its only right that I now get a saw and plane.

However like many other things there is so much to consider and choose from especially when I've only thought that both were the same as others in their area but just different on price depending on brand.

Obviously I now know I'm wrong but what I don't know is what to get as they will only be getting moderate use.

So hoping some of you can fill me in on some good quality reasonably priced tools that will fit my needs.

Saw will be for dovetails
Plane will mostly be used on hardwood

Thanks

 

[Bod]

How much do you want to spend?
£200+, Thomas Flinn.
Less than £20, car-boot.

Thomas Flinn should work out of the box. (plane will need honing)
Car-boot, may need minor work to full restoration, depending on your luck!

Bod

 

[jimi43]

I think if you are starting out with hardwoods and wanting to make dovetails you are a tad more serious than the average DIYer who puts up a shelf when threatened to do so by "she who must be obeyed"!

Given that this can be quite an absorbing hobby...I will make the assumption that you may find you want to continue in the future so therefore getting something of cheap quality (not price!) is counterproductive on many levels...the least of which is being put off at the beginning by not realising the true ability of some tools over similar looking rubbish.

For £20 you could get yourself a nice little Huntley Oak Japanese saw...which is designed for hardwoods...has a fine kerf and works very well on dovetails.

For a plane..well I suppose you need two really...an all rounder for preparing the wood using different irons an old secondhand No 5 Bailey will do you good service and for tidying up small areas...I made do with an older Stanley 60 1/2 block plane which has an adjustable mouth and is rather nicely made.

Both can be fettled to perform superbly and in doing so...you get to know your way around the mechanism of the planes.

Just my 20p worth.

Jimi

 

[tobytools]

jimis hit the nail on the head as usual
if your not into japanese saws then i recommend a Canadian maker "Adria" they not only look go but are in my opinion the best especially their tenon saw, LN do a nice DT saw tho.
as far as planes go you will need a jack of some kind, either a 5 or 5 1/2 to cover the general woodworking area. if i could just have the one id go for a no5 clifton,
and a block plane is essential, either the Quangsheng with the 3 irons (optional) or the verities low angle block..

let us know what you decide....
hope this helps. I've used all the tools I've mentioned (several times ) as im attempting to talk from experience

cheers
TT

 

[deema]

What a difficult question!

If you new with little or no experience and are starting out and don't fully know if this is for you, I would recommend that you spend your money on some of the best tools available that will work exactly how they should straight out of the box. I spent a few years messing around with old planes and saws and nearly decided that this wasn't for me, until I was shown that the tools were actually rather closer to useless than myself.

If you were to buy a Thomas Flinn or a Veritas dovetail saw you will get an excellent saw that will last you a lifetime. I would get the TF as they offer a re sharpening service which is far better than trying to sharpen it yourself.

For a plane, if starting out a no 5 1/2 would be ideal. If you buy either a Clifton, Veritas or Lie Nielson it will do most things you need. An excellent quality properly setup Jack plane (which all three makers produce straight out of the box) will do most jobs from smoothing to straightening / flattening. It won't do anything as well as the specialist plane for the job, but it will do it to a level that most people will be happy with. I tend to use a 5 1/2 and a 4 1/2 for almost everything except jointing.

The reason I am pointing you to the exoensive end is that if you decide you don't want to pursue the hobby, and have kept the boxes, looked after the tools, at any point you will be able to sell them for c85% of the purchase price. That makes the tools very 'cheap' and you know that you will have the best start, and tools that will never need to be upgraded.

 

[8squared]

I am new to the craft just a month or two since my workshop was put up, before that I was only doing pallet work.

In doing pallet work I bought many cheap toolstation tools just to make do and yes they were good enough for the job and will still do the work I want them too I know the process of learning dovetails and so on will be a long and hard one and
with poor results hence why I'm looking at upgrading my tools starting with the two mentioned tools.

Ideally I would like a new saw, open to Japanese... but what are the good brands and ones to stay away from.

As like everybody else I like a good bargain so if I could get one on a second hand plane that needs some tlc that would be great.

My budget is around £45 each


Thanks for the advice so far

 

[jimi43]

I am new to the craft just a month or two since my workshop was put up, before that I was only doing pallet work.

In doing pallet work I bought many cheap toolstation tools just to make do and yes they were good enough for the job and will still do the work I want them too I know the process of learning dovetails and so on will be a long and hard one and
with poor results hence why I'm looking at upgrading my tools starting with the two mentioned tools.

Ideally I would like a new saw, open to Japanese... but what are the good brands and ones to stay away from.

As like everybody else I like a good bargain so if I could get one on a second hand plane that needs some tlc that would be great.

My budget is around £45 each


Thanks for the advice so far

The advice from Deema is spot on with the proviso that you have the disposable income to justify the outlay but if your budget is £45 each then you are better served going the route I suggested with advice from here as to what is good to get and learn to fettle your tools.

Dismantling and tuning a plane is a perfect way to get to know the various parts...how they function...how they can be tuned to optimum and the satisfaction from knowing that you took something ordinary and turned it into something better cannot be beaten.

As for Japanese saws...I mentioned the Huntley Oak specifically because it has been designed for use on hardwoods...but most are pretty good for that now anyway. The old traditional ones would just shed teeth on hardwoods as they were designed for use on softwoods...but modern ones are not like that so much anymore.

Amazon have a couple of those saws for less than £30 so well within your budget HERE

That's complete with handle but if you want to save even more money you can make your own handle..it's not that difficult.

And if you want to see how it cuts...

...and that's English boxwood!

Try doing that with a backsaw!!

Good luck with whatever you choose...and if you need further help.... just shout!

Cheers

Jimi

 

[Mr_P]

Most of my woodworking involves small parquet flooring 9"x3" so I'm most at home with the smaller block planes and chariots.

I've had a few 60 1/2's and this is my current fave

http://www.axminster.co.uk/rider-no-60- ... bronze-cap

Disclaimer: However its not for everyone as its quite heavy (I'm a tall chap with big hands) and some reviews on here suggest some aren't perfect out of the box (mine was).

 

[jimi43]

Most of my woodworking involves small parquet flooring 9"x3" so I'm most at home with the smaller block planes and chariots.

I've had a few 60 1/2's and this is my current fave

http://www.axminster.co.uk/rider-no-60- ... bronze-cap

Disclaimer: However its not for everyone as its quite heavy (I'm a tall chap with big hands) and some reviews on here suggest some aren't perfect out of the box (mine was).

I saw one of these at a demo at Axminster when they first came out and the quality was amazing. But I hear tell it is very variable so I guess the only way to check is to go into a store and try it out. Had I not already got a few of this size I would have bought one there and then.

Better than most at this price bracket.

Jimi

 

[8squared]

Just out of interest what saw or plane do you think is the most beautiful.


I've been reading through jimi43's blog (kt productions) and found the Richard Tomes memorial infill plane... absolutely stunning piece of work.

http://www.ktproductions.co.uk/blog/?page_id=119

 

[Mr_P]

That is indeed one of the best planes made this century and you might enjoy the longer 35 page thread here

the-ukw-infill-project-t64219.html

I'm rather partial to my Scottish infill, which came in a job lot (something for you to consider ?)

scottish-infill-smoothing-plane-help-advice-needed-t69147.html

Jim restored a complete basket case into a stunner here
scottish-infill-smoother-restoration-t64459.html

This is my best dovetail saw.

dovetail-saw-who-was-mr-grimes-t53773.html

 

[J_SAMa]

Saw:

For your budget, definitely Veritas, no other saw of the same style quite compares to it at this price. I wouldn't buy an old saw if I were a beginner. Restoring them is difficult, especially if you're not quite sure what you're looking for.

You could also look into frame saws.
http://fine-tools.com/gestell.htm
Long-term speaking, they are the most economical solution. You only need one or two frame and an assortment of blades (which are available at a low price) to cover all types of work. When I first started using them it took me a while to get used to, but I suspect that if you, as a newcomer, haven't gotten used to a particular style of saw yet, they may be just as easy/difficult to learn on as backsaws.

Plane:
Any old No. 4 or 4 1/2 by Record or Stanley will work. The single most important feature is a (relatively) flat sole.
There are type studies of planes on the internet which may help you determine when a particular plane was manufactured. Typically, for an English-made Record or Stanley, anything manufactured before the mid 80s would serve you well. For an American Stanley, try to buy pre-WWII models.
Some may suggest the No.5 or 5 1/2 as the most versatile planes, but I think shorter planes are easier to learn on. YMMV.