# Obsession with sharpness



## Muina (9 Mar 2011)

Ok, so I have an obsession with sharpness, everybody I know realised this when I started going out with almost no hair on my left arm 

This had led to quite a few tips and tricks I've discovered from reading old magazines, scouring the internet and experimenting (P.S. Some are a little bit risky and I honestly wouldn't recommend trying them unless you're really desperate... I am)

1. I got a couple of old magazines to look at from my girlfriend's next door neighbour, one of them was open on a particular page (I'm not sure if I'm allowed to scan it due to copyright so I'll try my hardest to describe it): Sharpen your blades on a normal sharpening stone, from experience I'd recommend sharpening to your finest grit stone, don't remove any guides you may be using. Then using a piece of window glass glued securely onto a FLAT block of wood, hone with a little smidgen of Brasso or similar fine abrasive paste. If you want a seriously polished edge then you can use toothpaste afterwards but it won't make that much of a difference to the quality of cut you'll get.

2. This one I saw from a Youtube video for sharpening a straight razor: Using a leather strop actually produces a convex surface to your bevel and in extreme cases this can reduce the quality of the edge, instead use a piece of newspaper of equally coarse paper on a flat surface to strop your blades as if you were trying to produce a very small microbevel, this will remove the burr and create the tiniest microbevel which will be flat. (This one I can swear to, my blades are so sharp I can actually plane Iroko cleanly with a freshly sharpened blade)

3. This one's quite risky but it doesn't half work! I learned it from the same guy who gave me the magazines but I'd heard of it before: For bandsaw blades that have become blunt due to overuse or hitting a staple etc. using a sacrificial coarse stone (DON'T USE A GOOD ONE!), reverse the blade so the teeth are facing the wrong way, to do this put gloves on and twist the blade inside out, and remount on the bandsaw. Whilst the bandsaw is running (this bit's why it's risky) hold the stone gently against the teeth of the blade so that it starts sharpening the backs of the teeth, and keep it there for about 3-4 seconds. When you've safely stopped the bandsaw, unplug and rotate the blade by hand to chack the backs of the teeth are sharpened, you should see a small patch of shiny metal on the backs of the teeth and it'll cut like new (if it wasn't a very good blade to start with it'll probably cut even better than new). *ALWAYS REMEMBER SAFETY, IF YOU WANT TO TRY THIS PLEASE BE AS CAREFUL AS YOU POSSIBLY CAN, USE YOUR LONGEST SACRIFICIAL STONE SO YOUR HANDS ARE AS FAR AWAY FROM THE BLADE AS POSSIBLE, NEVER STAND TO THE SIDE OF A RUNNING BANDSAW BLADE AND KEEP THE AREA AROUND YOU CLEAN AT ALL TIMES*

Thanks

Anthony

P.S. If I've done bad putting people's safety at risk let me know and I'll remove the last one


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## bugbear (10 Mar 2011)

Muina":1cpz4asw said:


> Ok, so I have an obsession with sharpness, everybody I know realised this when I started going out with almost no hair on my left arm
> 
> This had led to quite a few tips and tricks I've discovered from reading old magazines, scouring the internet and experimenting (P.S. Some are a little bit risky and I honestly wouldn't recommend trying them unless you're really desperate... I am)
> 
> 1. I got a couple of old magazines to look at from my girlfriend's next door neighbour, one of them was open on a particular page (I'm not sure if I'm allowed to scan it due to copyright so I'll try my hardest to describe it): Sharpen your blades on a normal sharpening stone, from experience I'd recommend sharpening to your finest grit stone, don't remove any guides you may be using. Then using a piece of window glass glued securely onto a FLAT block of wood, hone with a little smidgen of Brasso or similar fine abrasive paste. If you want a seriously polished edge then you can use toothpaste afterwards but it won't make that much of a difference to the quality of cut you'll get.



That sounds like an idea popularised by Jeff Gorman - I'm sure he used chrome polish, not brasso though.

That would make the magazine "Good Woodworking" if I'm right.

BugBear


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## Muina (10 Mar 2011)

bugbear":zzj3o86q said:


> Muina":zzj3o86q said:
> 
> 
> > Ok, so I have an obsession with sharpness, everybody I know realised this when I started going out with almost no hair on my left arm
> ...



"Practical Wood Working", November 1993 issue, nearly there though 

Anthony


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## Jacob (10 Mar 2011)

bugbear":fe61ybwf said:


> .....
> 
> That sounds like an idea popularised by Jeff Gorman - I'm sure he used chrome polish, not brasso though.,,,,,


Solvol Autosol is the carvers favourite it seems. Mainly because it's a paste and doesn't run off like Brasso.



> ALWAYS REMEMBER SAFETY, IF YOU WANT TO TRY THIS PLEASE BE AS CAREFUL AS YOU POSSIBLY CAN, USE YOUR LONGEST SACRIFICIAL STONE SO YOUR HANDS ARE AS FAR AWAY FROM THE BLADE AS POSSIBLE, NEVER STAND TO THE SIDE OF A RUNNING BANDSAW BLADE AND KEEP THE AREA AROUND YOU CLEAN AT ALL TIMES


A bit over cautious this! I've been doing it for years. Can't see any hazard particularly, compared to just cutting wood. Band saw is pretty safe, as powered saws go.


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## Stoday (10 Mar 2011)

The preparation of specimens for mounting on microscope slides requires an instrument for cutting very thin slices. I used to use a Cambridge Rocking Microtome for this. The blade had to be sharpened particularly well and Tip (1) is the method I used to achieve the final sharpness.

This is a short article on microtiomes and the method of sharpening their blade: Click

I don't do any microscopy any more — eyes deteriorate when you pass 60. Still have my old Cambridge Rocker though. Any offers?


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## Mike Wingate (10 Mar 2011)

Solvol Autosol for me. I use it on the leather wheels on the Tormek, and on a leather strop.


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## Muina (10 Mar 2011)

Jacob":36ecg5lb said:


> A bit over cautious this! I've been doing it for years. Can't see any hazard particularly, compared to just cutting wood. Band saw is pretty safe, as powered saws go.



Just wanted to make sure I covered my own back  I know they are probably the safest powered saw most of us would ever use but there's always the risk there, wouldn't want anybody doing anything I would!



Stoday":36ecg5lb said:


> The preparation of specimens for mounting on microscope slides requires an instrument for cutting very thin slices. I used to use a Cambridge Rocking Microtome for this. The blade had to be sharpened particularly well and Tip (1) is the method I used to achieve the final sharpness.
> 
> This is a short article on microtiomes and the method of sharpening their blade: Click
> 
> I don't do any microscopy any more — eyes deteriorate when you pass 60. Still have my old Cambridge Rocker though. Any offers?



That's really interesting that, I reckon my brother'd love to read this. He's just about to finish his pHd in Entomology (I think it's Entomology anyways ) so he works quite extensively with microscopes and I reckon he'd like giving Microtomy a go!

Thanks

Anthony


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## CroppyBoy1798 (14 Mar 2011)

The bandsaw one sounds interesting! Going to have to give that a go!! I rather stupidy made a mess of a new 1" blade I had only bought for resawing!! When sawing some timber I overlooked the fact that there was an old screw snapped off in it.......not a good move!! I was positively dissapointed over having done such a stupid thing!! #-o 

You hold the stone to both sides of the blade I assume?


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## Muina (14 Mar 2011)

I think we've all done that at some point, I tried resawing a piece of pine and was wondering why it wasn't cutting as well as beech, then I realised there was a nail in it 

You hold the stone as if you were trying to saw through it, just with the blade reversed. That's why it's important not to use a good stone because you do end up with a saw cut in it (those cheap ones you get with cheap sets of chisels or from B&Q are perfect because they're quite coarse and really indispensable).

Seriously though, I think you'll be pleasantly surprised at the results!

Anthony


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## bosshogg (15 Mar 2011)

Interesting post Anthony...The way I learned as an apprentice Patternmaker also achieves a sharpness that you can shave by...first grind/course hone as required (I'm assuming that any reader will be able to do this...sorry) then fine hone it on a carborundum oil stone. This produces the edge you want but not the perfection you can get. Hone on a water stone next, I use an "escher stone"





which was originally used to hone flat blade razors, this gives you an edge that you could be proud of, but if you want perfection... next strop the blade with a leather strop (I prefer the leather glued onto a hardwood, ergonomically shaped handle for comfort) mine is about 6" long x 1 7/8" wide from a broken drive belt, from our belt driven lathe if memory serves, anyway as with the honing this should start with about 10 firm strokes dropping off to 1 soft stroke, progressively. The result should be a very sharp blade and unless you have applied some form of powder or liquid abrasive agent, with no micro bevels (keep the face of your strop fresh with a sharp cabinet scraper, like sued) Now to produce that beater of all comers edge that will shave the ?x!c xx? off you need to strop it on the palm of your hand. Pick the blade up nestled between the crux of your thumb and index finger spit a small amount on your free hand,then holding the blade with a positive but gentle grip strop the blade first down your palm holding the flat side of the blade down, then strop in the opposite direction, up the palm of your hand with the bevel side down, your hand gripping the blade needs to be stopping upwards with the back of your hand uppermost to do this. At first the blade will slide quite easily over your hand until some of the spit evaporates/works off your hand at which point the blade starts to drag as it's being stropped, this is when you achieve that wonders of wonders...a razor sharp edge. when the blade dulls it's quite sufficient to re strop from the leather stage though to the end grain and hand strop stages..."voila."

bosshogg


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## Muina (15 Mar 2011)

I never thought your hand could be used as a strop! That's incredible! I'll definitely have to try that sometime

The leather strop I've got is a wide strip of medium thickness leather glued onto a block of hardwood, this way I can strop plane blades and wider things by just clamping the block in a vice. I never bother to use the newspaper trick unless I'm cutting into softwood, hardwood'll just destroy a really fine edge and the extra sharpness helps prevent breakout if you slip or go too near the edge of endgrain.

So would this technique create an edge sharp enough to shave facial hair? Obviously the angles will be different on a woodworking blade compared to a straight razor blade, but I am looking into making my own straight razor. The only way I've seen people getting a straight rzor blade seriously sharp is with the newspaper method but by the sounds of it this method will get an edge sharp enough to split hairs, never mind shave them!

Thanks

Anthony


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## bugbear (16 Mar 2011)

Stoday":2909loze said:


> I don't do any microscopy any more — eyes deteriorate when you pass 60.



You can get microscope with digital cameras attached, and view on a PC display - as big as ya' like.

So no need to give up yet.

BugBear


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## CroppyBoy1798 (16 Mar 2011)

Muina":3fuhui7p said:


> I think we've all done that at some point, I tried resawing a piece of pine and was wondering why it wasn't cutting as well as beech, then I realised there was a nail in it
> 
> You hold the stone as if you were trying to saw through it, just with the blade reversed. That's why it's important not to use a good stone because you do end up with a saw cut in it (those cheap ones you get with cheap sets of chisels or from B&Q are perfect because they're quite coarse and really indispensable).
> 
> ...




Good stuff, thanks, I'll give this a go, just figured it out!  I was wondering why you'd turn the blade inside out and then put it on with the teeth facing to the rear of the saw and then try cut a stone with the back edge of the blade......... #-o #-o Read it all wrong.

Just one of them days! (hammer)


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## Muina (17 Mar 2011)

Lol, it is actually really difficult to explain, it's the most useful trick I've heard for bandsaws though. At first I was trying to sharpen my blades with a dremel tool but that did virtually nothing and it takes absolutely ages! This only takes about a minute.

I just resharpened my blade a couple of days ago actually and it's still cutting Iroko like butter!

Anthony


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## CroppyBoy1798 (17 Mar 2011)

Muina":3vq5w3p0 said:


> Lol, it is actually really difficult to explain, it's the most useful trick I've heard for bandsaws though. At first I was trying to sharpen my blades with a dremel tool but that did virtually nothing and it takes absolutely ages! This only takes about a minute.
> 
> I just resharpened my blade a couple of days ago actually and it's still cutting Iroko like butter!
> 
> Anthony




Ok, so I gave this a go....

Flipped the blade the other way round so the teeth are facing upward. Put it back into the saw, tensioned it up, fired up the saw and introduced the stone, slowly, head on (ie straight into) to the blade for a few seconds. The blade cut into the stone a couple of mm and produced a lot of sparks.

What I found though was the blade has lost its 'point', ie the teeth appeared to be more stubby than anything else, as if I'd had (and I suppose I did) grind away some of the tip and I cant say that cut quality has improved really.

Am I doing something wrong?? #-o


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## Muina (18 Mar 2011)

Hmmm, you did everything right, I can't think why it hasn't worked.

What size blade did you use it on? The blade I used it on is a 3/4" 4tpi skip tooth.

It works (or is supposed to) because you're sharpening the backs of every tooth and therefore regrinding the zero radius point. The only thing I can think of is you maybe left the stone on a little bit too long.

Sorry if I've ruined one of your blades #-o but I can assure you it does work, I'll give it another go tonight on a couple of different blades and post back after I've experimented

Sowwy  

Anthony


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## CroppyBoy1798 (18 Mar 2011)

Jeez, dont worry about it!  Perhaps I used the wrong sort of blade, I think it was an 8tpi, 1/2" wide, may have been too fine or perhaps the stone was too hard, it was a particularly fine norton stone, must root out one of the old cheap ones and give that a go :wink: It was a well worn blade anyway, firgured if I was gonna screw it up I might as well do it with that one.

Sometimes the only way to learn is through your mistakes!


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## Muina (19 Mar 2011)

Lol, I just get a bit paranoid sometimes 

It might be the stone actually, if the stone's too hard it might be knocking too much of the tooth off instead of gradually sharpening the very tip. I used quite a soft stone to start with so it didn't do that much damage to the teeth but still enough to hone the ends of them.

Anthony


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## Muina (21 Mar 2011)

I tried stropping my plane iron on my palm... that's amazing!

I used my wooden plane's iron and before it was JUST cutting hair, but now it just glides through it like nothing's there! I think I actually cut myself it's that sharp but I can't decide whether it was the iron or I've caught my arm on something lol.

Although I did try it on my High Carbon Steel Mora knife and it barely did anything, maybe the steel's too hard? I guess I'll just have to keep trying it! (Somebody stop me!)

I also tried the bandsaw trick on a couple of blades with different stones, I found that the coarser and harder the stone the less it sharpened. I used a coarse hard stone, a fine hard stone and a coarse soft stone.

The coarse hard stone barely did a thing;
The coarse soft stone made a big difference;
The fine hard stone made a huge difference, in fact this blade was much better than when I got it.

All the blades I tried were the type you get in Screwfix, Machine Mart etc. So they were certainly nothing special. I know you can't sharpen some blades because they're the equivalent of harpoint handsaws, which the teeth are hardened seriously hard, but these are usually the big 2" resaw blades and metal cutting I think.

Anthony


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## dh7892 (30 Mar 2011)

On the subject of straight razors: I use a straight razor and I just use the traditional leather strop which seems to keep it plenty sharp enough. Just make sure you roll the blade over on its spine when changing direction of stroke during stropping. The "spreading butter" action that you see them use in the films can round over the cutting edge so avoid this. 

Every so often I use my 3M micro abrasives on glass to tidy up the blade. If you go down to the 0.3 micron paper, it's sharper than stropping on leather. That film feels very much like a glossy magazine cover to the touch so I can see how some paper or similar would work too. 

Dave


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## Muina (30 Mar 2011)

Yea, the video I watched that taught me to strop on a piece of paper stated that the newspaper is actually an extremely fine abrasive, think of the thousands of tiny wood fibres that make the paper abrading a minuscule amount from the blade.

I've never fully understood the purpose of stropping though, I thought it was to remove the burr but I've been told so many different things by so many different people that I don't know what to believe anymore lol

Anthony


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## Anonymous (30 Mar 2011)

but if you cut paper with your newly sharpened blade you will take the edge off straight away.

Stropping on the palm of your hand is easiest and quickest way.


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## Muina (31 Mar 2011)

Yea, you will take the edge off but I think it'll still be uber sharp. It's like cutting wood with a newly sharpened blade, the shaving sharp edge'll come off after a couple of strokes but it'll stay more than sharp enough for quite a while if your steel's good enough.

Plus as long as it doesn't take too long it's always best to aim for the sharpest you can, at the end of the day a sharp blade is a safe blade so it's better to be overly sharp than blunt.

Anthony


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## greggy (1 May 2011)

Mike Wingate":bku60tkp said:


> Solvol Autosol for me. I use it on the leather wheels on the Tormek, and on a leather strop.




same here, and done it for years.


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