# What's gotten into the wood dust?



## deserter (25 Apr 2012)

What is going on? This forum used to be such a happy and pleasant place to visit, with loads of really good knowledge. Of late however it seems to be that every second post contains arguments and name calling. 
Come on guys and girls let's all behave like adults and get along shall we, I mean who if someone does something different to you, why have a go at them, better to explain your own method and let others divide which is the best way to proceed. 
If we're not careful the place is going to dissolve and people will find elsewhere to go and be helpful, this is a UK based forum visited by people from all over the globe because of its quality, much more if the current behaviour and knowledge will leave followed closely by everyone else. 

There's an old saying which I think goes double for the Internet...

If you don't have anything nice to say don't say anything at all.


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## adidat (25 Apr 2012)

coughjacobcough


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## Cowboy _Builder (25 Apr 2012)

This is a problem in all forums , few people spoil it for the majority ,people post their experiences or methods of working usually when asked for help and because "Tom ,Dick or Harry" doesn't agree or are proven to been doing it wrong for years they then wage a hate campaign against the poster and their mates feel compelled to back them or more often than not move to another forum ....This has happened to me twice ,If I have nothing of value to offer to an argument then i say nothing, i don't profess to know everything about construction but having been in the industry for 45 years i do have a little knowledge of how things work , so now i only offer advice by PM and have never had a problem since .
By all means disagree,but please do it in a polite and constructive manner ... Allan


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## Dodge (25 Apr 2012)

deserter":2yvr7m3h said:


> If you don't have anything nice to say don't say anything at all.




Never a truer word said - maybe some individuals of this parish should read this, consider it and hang their heads in shame!


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## promhandicam (25 Apr 2012)

Dodge":ay4n89v5 said:


> deserter":ay4n89v5 said:
> 
> 
> > If you don't have anything nice to say don't say anything at all.
> ...



And what was 'nice' about that comment? 

Hope everyone reading this has a splendid evening :roll:


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## stevebuk (25 Apr 2012)

doesn't have to be 'Nice' just constructive..


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## Jacob (25 Apr 2012)

adidat":1nbqc9oo said:


> coughjacobcough


coughsaditwatcough
What's all this about? You lot really need to grow up a bit.


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## Jacob (25 Apr 2012)

deserter":24o77nqz said:


> ...
> 
> If you don't have anything nice to say don't say anything at all.


So why this post? Why this thread in fact?


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## Adam Mada (25 Apr 2012)

I try to avoid the more negative posts. On the flip side I have had some amazing chats with a lot of super helpful members here, for every negative person there seems to be 10 people who are really nice and are happy to offer help and advice freely.


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## No skills (25 Apr 2012)

As with any internet forum, you have to sift out the good from the bad - this is a fairly reserved place I think, there are some real crapfests out there pretending to be forums.


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## Lons (25 Apr 2012)

The vast majority of members on UKW are decent, knowledgeable, generous and very helpful people. Just check out the content of some of the many others "forums" on the internet, especially the car forums :shock: 

There will always be disagreements and ideally these should be conducted in a responsible and considerate manner but as in life there are also people who delight in lighting the touchpaper before hiding only to appear occasionally to fuel the fire. unfortunately, some of us, including me, are not strong enough to resist the teptation to fire back at times.  

Silly really as if ignored, these persons would soon become bored and seek their "jollies" elsewhere  

Bob


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## Blister (25 Apr 2012)

I have a way of doing this

If a subject is something I know about I will comment ( but it's only my view )

If its something I know nothing about I keep quiet but read others comments and then make my mind up

Seems to work


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## Lons (25 Apr 2012)

Blister":1jl07c1d said:


> I have a way of doing this
> 
> If a subject is something I know about I will comment ( but it's only my view )
> 
> ...



=D> =D> Well said that man


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## beech1948 (26 Apr 2012)

I have recently ( 10 days ago) finally given in to placing three people into my "please ignore list" that is provided on this forum. Their views and approach offends me.

It works well. I do not see any of their posts but I can still follow the threads. 

I don't think I have missed anything, I feel better for not having to contemplate the rubbish these people have been talking and can still contribute a few poor morsels occasionally.

Rather than slag off others I think its better to say nothing, keep my integrity and I hope my good manners.

Its a good, knowledgeable group of people who usually tolerate others. Lets keep it up.

Al


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## MickCheese (26 Apr 2012)

Jacob":3u0eg6io said:


> adidat":3u0eg6io said:
> 
> 
> > coughjacobcough
> ...




I agree with Jacob on that, totally unnecessary on a thread that is trying to stop just that.

Mick


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## henton49er (26 Apr 2012)

I agree 100% with Blister.

Mike


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## Benchwayze (26 Apr 2012)

Well Deserter, 

Firstly there is a point to your question and here's one answer; and it's one that some people aren't going to like. 

I've spent some happy years on this forum. I helped where I could. Some have even benefited from occasional bouts of my generosity.

I have never borne animosity toward anyone.
I have never wittingly tried to stir anything up.
I have never personally insulted anyone.

What I did do was make an ill-advised remark in a post.

Because my views were not unanimously welcomed, I was pounced upon, and left feeling very much to blame, and was in fact blamed, for the ensuing exchanges.

Unwisely, I was naïve enough to have the guts to try to defend myself..

Silly me then. 

I should have left things alone, and not responded to the initial 'challenge'. 
Unfortunately, on open Fora, this is what instigators want, because:

a) It draws attention to them. (Something which they love.)
b) In their eyes no response from the target means they have won, because the target has slunk away, 'tail between legs.' Ergo, it demonstrates to the rest of a forum, that they are right all along. Their behavior is a classic symptom of cyber-bullying, and it isn't confined to teen chat-rooms. I can stand up for myself, - believe me - when there is a physical challenge in front of me. Standing up to cyber-bullies though is difficult, because responses don't always come across in the manner intended, and ultimately matters are worsened. 

So my advice to anyone who feels intimidated by any other member is to physically ignore them. Not necessarily by placing them on the 'ignore list', because doing so doesn't remove them from the scene. They are still there, rejoicing in the fact that they hounded someone out. Also, as it says in the guidelines, placing someone on ignore, doesn't stop them posting PM's to you, So again, what is the point? (There's a 'talk-to-the-hand' symbol one can use, which should be all that's required.

So, I'd rather see what these people have to say, and just ignore them, regardless. If everyone did this they would get the message far more quickly. So from now on that's how I am 'standing up' to small-mindedness. 

*My apologies to anyone I might have inadvertently upset, in the exchanges on another thread. it wasn't intentional, and it won't happen again, because I am limiting myself to the subject of woodworking. *

Regards
John


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## gus3049 (26 Apr 2012)

Benchwayze":3hl8pjdn said:


> a) It draws attention to them. (Something which they love.)
> b) In their eyes no response from the target means they have won, because the target has slunk away, 'tail between legs.' Ergo, it demonstrates to the rest of a forum, that they are right all along. Their behavior is a classic symptom of cyber-bullying, and it isn't confined to teen chat-rooms. I can stand up for myself, - believe me - when there is a physical challenge in front of me. Standing up to cyber-bullies though is difficult, because responses don't always come across in the manner intended, and ultimately matters are worsened.
> 
> So my advice to anyone who feels intimidated by any other member is to physically ignore them. Not necessarily by placing them on the 'ignore list', because doing so doesn't remove them from the scene. They are still there, rejoicing in the fact that they hounded someone out. Also, as it says in the guidelines, placing someone on ignore, doesn't stop them posting PM's to you, So again, what is the point? (There's a 'talk-to-the-hand' symbol one can use, which should be all that's required.



Indeed, the ignore list also doesn't hide their posts if they are quoted by someone else so its a bit of a waste of time although I have a couple of people on mine. The temptation to join in is overwhelming at times but John is right and we should just be strong and ignore them if we can, we do after all have the right to ignore pointless and self justifying PMs too. If they think they've scored points so be it.

The hand beckons. =;


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## woodbloke (26 Apr 2012)

gus3049":icy0kzs8 said:


> Indeed, the ignore list also doesn't hide their posts if they are quoted by someone else so its a bit of a waste of time although I have a couple of people on mine. The temptation to join in is overwhelming at times but John is right and we should just be strong and ignore them if we can, we do after all have the right to ignore pointless and self justifying PMs too. If they think they've scored points so be it.
> 
> The hand beckons. =;


Sometimes though, the thread (together with the contentious information) is aimed directly at the individual (it's happened to me) and it's almost impossible _not_ to respond but I agree, it fans the flames, which is exactly what the protagonist is after. Putting such individuals on the ignore list simply doesn't work...what might be better is to use the 'Report a Post' every time something abusive happens and hopefully, if it happened enough times, then the UKW '_powers that be_' might do something about it - Rob


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## 9fingers (26 Apr 2012)

There are one or two places where behaviour seems to be better. A little searching might turn up such a safe haven where there is rarely the need to for any active moderation.

Bob


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## woodbloke (26 Apr 2012)

9fingers":39seozsb said:


> There are one or two places where behaviour seems to be better. A little searching might turn up such a safe haven where there is rarely the need to for any active moderation.
> 
> Bob


Totally agree Bob, simply because individual(s) who '_fan the flames_' and delight in doing so are just not tolerated...end of - Rob


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## Jacob (26 Apr 2012)

You keep dropping hints; I'm surprised you don't all go there. 2 or 3 posts a day - it's very quiet and peaceful. Not unlike an old folks home. I'm sure you'd be welcome! :lol:


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## stevebuk (26 Apr 2012)

Jacob":2vbr7vza said:


> You keep dropping hints; I'm surprised you don't all go there. 2 or 3 posts a day - it's very quiet and peaceful. Not unlike an old folks home. I'm sure you'd be welcome! :lol:




Totally agree, stay over there then..

Come on Noel stop another one of these 'Why does it happen threads' before it becomes personal again..


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## deserter (26 Apr 2012)

I think one of the biggest problems, is that the written word carries no real emotion. So when a post is made maybe in jest, the way others interpret it is as a personal attack, I think this leads to a lot of arguments on forums. 
I guess we're all AI used to talking to people verbally where we can convey emotion that we assume others understand the meaning of our writings in the same way. 

And yes I also agree that some people will always try to provoke arguments/heated debates as often as possible, from now on I think I too shall be adopting the tactic of ignoring these types of people.


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## Jacob (26 Apr 2012)

deserter":2y6q17cq said:


> .....yes I also agree that some people will always try to provoke arguments/heated debates as often as possible, from now on I think I too shall be adopting the tactic of ignoring these types of people.


But you are one of them - you started this thread!!!!


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## Lons (26 Apr 2012)

Jacob":2qr2vt14 said:


> But you are one of them - you started this thread!!!!



POT / KETTLE / BLACK (hammer) (hammer)


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## Noel (27 Apr 2012)

stevebuk":6ycn5pih said:


> Jacob":6ycn5pih said:
> 
> 
> > You keep dropping hints; I'm surprised you don't all go there. 2 or 3 posts a day - it's very quiet and peaceful. Not unlike an old folks home. I'm sure you'd be welcome! :lol:
> ...



Anything you say Steve............

Seriously, there's a few folk around here who take this internet lark just a bit too seriously. Lighten up. If you do tend to come over all annoyed and offended use the ignore function, if your screen sneakily presents a quote from somebody on your ignore list just do this- don't read it, it's not hard to do. 
Sure, there's other places that are more of a happy clappy nature and I imagine that sort of environment might suit a few. Lastly there does seem to be a degree of hypocrisy exhibited in this thread by some members, suppose there's nowt queer as folk.

There's good comment from Beech earlier:



> I have recently ( 10 days ago) finally given in to placing three people into my "please ignore list" that is provided on this forum. Their views and approach offends me.
> 
> It works well. I do not see any of their posts but I can still follow the threads.
> 
> ...



And with that, goodnight.


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## DrPhill (27 Apr 2012)

I have noticed that the 'temperature' of several fora that I monitor tends to increase in spring when the sap is rising. Things return to normal after a few weeks. 

Has anyone else noticed a correlation? Does anyone have a theory?


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## Jacob (27 Apr 2012)

Lons":24l09k0d said:


> Jacob":24l09k0d said:
> 
> 
> > But you are one of them - you started this thread!!!!
> ...


Maybe I should keep quiet but it's difficult when you are being accused, but in point of fact I have never started a thread like this one; moaning and whingeing about other people. 
I'm only interested in woodwork and the disagreements I have are about how things are done, not personalities (except when I have to be defensive on occasions).
The last few thread I started are as follows, boring and uncontroversial IMHO:
why-are-they-called-dividers-t59439.html
saw-sharpening-problem-t59889.html
ecofan-any-good-t58929.html
rounded-bevels-you-know-it-makes-sense-t58083.html


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## dickm (27 Apr 2012)

DrPhill":1535drrk said:


> I have noticed that the 'temperature' of several fora that I monitor tends to increase in spring when the sap is rising. Things return to normal after a few weeks.
> 
> Has anyone else noticed a correlation? Does anyone have a theory?



Well, assuming the Dr in your name implies something medical, would the word "testosterone" offer any explanatory power?


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## DrPhill (27 Apr 2012)

dickm":j26zv4du said:


> Well, assuming the Dr in your name implies something medical, would the word "testosterone" offer any explanatory power?



My doctorate was gained by scientific thesis, not medical study, but I do know a little science. 

The testosterone theory may be attractive on some levels but it would be depressing if it turned out to be true. It might imply that some people believe that reproductive success could result from winning arguments on a forum about woodworking. I do hope not.


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## doctor Bob (27 Apr 2012)

My doctorate is made up.....


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## DrPhill (27 Apr 2012)

doctor Bob":4rca1wxc said:


> My doctorate is made up.....


And it is probably just as useful as mine.......


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## Lons (27 Apr 2012)

Jacob":8ltxjeq4 said:


> Lons":8ltxjeq4 said:
> 
> 
> > POT / KETTLE / BLACK (hammer) (hammer)
> ...



Aw Come on Jacob :roll: 

You may not have started them but you are quite happy to throw in some very pointed and extreme (IMO) views which are almost guaranteed to solicit a response and rightly or not, the perception is that this is a deliberate attempt to "stir things up".
I've seen comments from you on religion, human rights, socialism, guns, the boatrace and even a throw away line on F1 - Now what have they to do with "I'm only interested in woodwork" (hammer) :lol: I certainly am not going to trawl through your posts to prove a point and You have every right to air your views on any subject but you seem to have a knack of seeming at best blunt and worst downright abusive which reminds me of politicians trying to shout down their oponents.
You seem to upset a number of people, does that not suggest some of the reason must be your attitude?

I don't know you and it 's not my place to judge Jacob but as I've said previously I read your woodworking posts with interest, learn from some and don't agree with others but you are clearly a tallented woodworker and it's sad you manage to provoke people like me to write posts like this.

Now I don't particularly want to enter into an argument with you or anyone else and assure you that my comments aren't intended as an attack on you rather just my impression of you from your posts, just as you surely have made one of me  

I look forward to your next WOODWORKING post.

cheers

Bob


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## Jacob (27 Apr 2012)

Lons":20bzpb2y said:


> ........
> You may not have started them but you are quite happy to throw in some very pointed and extreme (IMO) views which are almost guaranteed to solicit a response and rightly or not, the perception is that this is a deliberate attempt to "stir things up".
> I've seen comments from you on religion, human rights, socialism, guns, the boatrace and even a throw away line on F1


I never launch any of these topics myself (except the F1 thing which was to make an obtuse point) I'm only here for the woodwork, but I insist on the right to reply to some of the weird political stuff which keeps cropping up. If people don't want replies they shouldn't post comments. I'm not extreme - I'm a middle of the road lefty true, but there are a lot of us. Some people obviously lead quiet lives and are unaware of other opinions and seem genuinely surprised to read them!


> ........
> You seem to upset a number of people, does that not suggest some of the reason must be your attitude.


 Er no of course not - it's they who get upset. Maybe they shouldn't come out on their own? They don't have a divine right to utter weird opinions on guns, politics etc, without them being discussed. 
Maybe they should all move over to the Haven? If they don't like frank exchanges of opinion they should keep put of public forums like this one. Personally I quite often don't like some of the stuff I read but I don't get upset and I certainly don't suggest they should shut up.


> I don't know you and it 's not my place to judge Jacob but as I've said previously I read your woodworking posts with interest, learn from some and don't agree with others but you are clearly a tallented woodworker and it's sad you manage to provoke people like me to write posts like this.


Nobody asked you to write it. What's "sadness" got to do with it? Don't write these things if they make you sad. Don't read them if you don't like my posts.


> Now I don't particularly want to enter into an argument


Well you have done haven't you! If you don't want to do it - just don't do it!

I think these personal attack threads are appalling, dull, dreary and infantile. I would never start one myself and I make no personal attacks on anybody (except occasionally in self defence). Note - I am not attacking anybody here except insofar as I am replying to unsolicited posts which refer to me.


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## Lons (27 Apr 2012)

> Maybe they shouldn't come out on their own? They don't have a divine right to utter weird opinions on guns, politics etc, without them being discussed.
> Maybe they should all move over to the Haven? If they don't like frank exchanges of opinion they should keep put of public forums like this one.



*Prima-Facie*

That's the last post I'll make on this thread, you aren't worth the effort. Don't lose any sleep - I certainly won't :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## soulboy (28 Apr 2012)

DrPhill":18g3vvbf said:


> doctor Bob":18g3vvbf said:
> 
> 
> > My doctorate is made up.....
> ...



:lol: thanks for this, med i larf


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## jettagreg (28 Apr 2012)

Hey, I'm a noob on this forum and I have to say I found this thread highly entertaining =D>

people need chill and smoke a spliff or something :lol:


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## promhandicam (28 Apr 2012)

jettagreg":nrr9iopx said:


> Hey, I'm a noob on this forum and I have to say I found this thread highly entertaining =D>
> 
> people need chill and smoke a spliff or something :lol:



Well said, but you don't have to be a noob to find this sort of thread entertaining - in a slightly perverse way. Sadly, IMHO, these threads are one of the few remaining highlights of UKW. 

FWIW, I think that things have gone down hill gradually over the last couple of years primarily due to the intolerance of a few resulting in the stifling of real discussion allowing a range of views and opinions to be expressed. In the past, before The Shaven and Woodwork UK started UKW was *the* best UK based woodworking forum to come for advise and encouragement. In part I blame the introduction of the ignore button which I believe enables those who use it to remain ignorant of opinions that for whatever reason they are unable or unwilling to accommodate. Perhaps they think they have nothing else to learn, which if this is the case is rather sad. As Henry Ford once said,


> Anyone who stops learning is old, whether at twenty or eighty. Anyone who keeps learning stays young. The greatest thing in life is to keep your mind young.



I have received good advise and learnt a lot in the past from many who post or have posted and hopefully have been able to contribute something too. I will continue to try to contribute but I find it is becoming more and more time consuming wading through increasing levels of non woodwork related posts or posts made by people too lazy to do a simple search. 

I know that this post will be seen by some as not fitting into the 'nice' category - if you feel that way then perhaps you should go and spend a bit of time in your real workshop - away from the internet for a while. 

Feel free to reply to my comments and be assured that whatever you write I will read it although that doesn't mean to say that I will necessarily agree :wink: 

Cheers, 

Steve


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## Jacob (28 Apr 2012)

jettagreg":2izxiwza said:


> Hey, I'm a noob on this forum and I have to say I found this thread highly entertaining =D>
> 
> people need chill and smoke a spliff or something :lol:


 :lol: Agree.


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## Jacob (28 Apr 2012)

Lons":232rgbao said:


> > Maybe they shouldn't come out on their own? They don't have a divine right to utter weird opinions on guns, politics etc, without them being discussed.
> > Maybe they should all move over to the Haven? If they don't like frank exchanges of opinion they should keep put of public forums like this one.
> 
> 
> ...


Promises, promises! :lol: 
Heard it before; all those threats to leave us and go over to the old folks haven. :roll: 
It's here BTW http://thewoodhaven.co.uk/phpBB3/index.php get in there quickly you might be in time for Allbran and the morning Bingo session. 
NB mobility aids to be left at the door; they are trying to reduce the stick fights and slipper throwing (they had to ban P bottles :roll: ).

Cheerio have a nice time.

PS just had a look in. No posts this morning I think they are all still in bed. Friday night is Valium night.


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## Benchwayze (28 Apr 2012)

jettagreg":i6bbbmds said:


> people need chill and smoke a spliff or something :lol:



Welcome aboard Jetta, 

As for the spliff, :duno: whatever ticks your clock!  

John


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## gus3049 (28 Apr 2012)

This will also be my last post to this thread.

This forum is still, in general, the place it was when I joined. The general atmosphere is one of support and encouragement.

I think that to say there is more disagreement is wrong. Without getting too personal, most of the flack seems to be aimed in one direction, at one individual. As I have said before, maybe that individual could consider why this is as there is not usually smoke without fire.

Yes, I am sure it provides some entertainment but in the end becomes tiresome. Out here in the real world we, no doubt, just avoid any individual that we don't like/agree with/ can't tolerate. But, we inhabit this forum for the positive things it offers and frankly, its a pain in the bum to have to filter out those whose sole reason for living seems to be the wind up or controversy. Its very difficult to avoid and the 'ignore' feature doesn't really work.

Saying we should avoid a forum that offers so much is not helpful. I'm sure most of us are quite capable of looking after ourselves and there are times when something or somebody just becomes so annoying that we have to react. So it looks like we are just going to have to carry on the way we are, ignore where we can but put our point of view where we feel we must.

Rather like real life in fact.


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## Jacob (28 Apr 2012)

gus3049":lrk3keq2 said:


> ..... So it looks like we are just going to have to carry on the way we are, ignore where we can but put our point of view where we feel we must.
> 
> Rather like real life in fact.


Yes I think you have got it. Welcome to the world!
Although maybe there should be a "Do not disturb" button as well as "Ignore" ?


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## SammyQ (28 Apr 2012)

John Benchwayze said it all for me and his point seems to have been totally lost in the welter of wooden spoon weilding*. I have better things to do with my time than read provocative, inflammatory posts with no real object other than to position the poster at the centre of attention and (presumably) entertain, amuse and (God Help Us!) satisfy some need in the poster. The last series of slights on another forum - which, I agree, is moribund at present - is little short of the verbal bullying and cat-calling I see every day in my 'real job'. But, the difference is, it's perpetrated *there* by immature, spoilt little boys, who have not yet learned the qualities we call dignity and restraint. Jacob? You're back on my "foe" list. 

Sam

*= 'stirring it up'.


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## Jacob (28 Apr 2012)

SammyQ":38a4bbkq said:


> ..... no real object other than to position the poster at the centre of attention ....'.


I didn't choose to be here - it was our OP who put me at the centre of attention. I'd prefer to be ignored.


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## Benchwayze (28 Apr 2012)

deserter":14u09iu8 said:


> What is going on? This forum used to be such a happy and pleasant place to visit, with loads of really good knowledge. Of late however it seems to be that every second post contains arguments and name calling.
> Come on guys and girls let's all behave like adults and get along shall we, I mean who if someone does something different to you, why have a go at them, better to explain your own method and let others divide which is the best way to proceed.
> If we're not careful the place is going to dissolve and people will find elsewhere to go and be helpful, this is a UK based forum visited by people from all over the globe because of its quality, much more if the current behaviour and knowledge will leave followed closely by everyone else.
> 
> ...



Quoted:
The original post. 

Jacob. 
You weren't mentioned. 

Obviously you found a cap that fits. 

=;


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## Jacob (28 Apr 2012)

Benchwayze":3pxpj1db said:


> ...
> Quoted:
> The original post.
> 
> ...


2nd post down, from saditwat:


adidat":3pxpj1db said:


> coughjacobcough


Nobody demurred so I took it as a deliberate personal attack thread. Or was it aimed at someone else and saditwat got it wrong?


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## Benchwayze (28 Apr 2012)

Jacob":2jy465hs said:


> Benchwayze":2jy465hs said:
> 
> 
> > ...
> ...




Oh Dear... I think I'd better go see the Doc. I must be closer to senility than I though, because I'm sure I vowed not to respond to Jacob again. I might have to go and get some new reading glasses too. I thought for a moment, Jacob was calling adidat a 'tw*t'! 

Nah! it must be my eyes. Jacob would never deliberately insult anyone like that. He couldn't get away with it. The Mods wouldn't allow it. Would they? 8)

PS And second post down, isn't the Original Poster Jacob. :roll:


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## Jacob (28 Apr 2012)

Benchwayze":1r40vtn9 said:


> Jacob":1r40vtn9 said:
> 
> 
> > Benchwayze":1r40vtn9 said:
> ...


Typo!
Could have been worse - I might inadvertently have used the other "T" word :shock: ( TWERP )


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## Benchwayze (28 Apr 2012)

Jacob? Making a typing error; making ANY kind of error? 

Well now... :-"


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## doctor Bob (28 Apr 2012)

Benchwayze":3pvsroll said:


> Oh Dear... I think I'd better go see the Doc.



Anytime, always happy to help ...... 



As a side note, not aimed at any side of this arguement, but it's very easy to "quote" people and twist the original meaning, or select bits to discredit one side without taking the whole post as the complete content (i'm an expert at it)


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## studders (28 Apr 2012)

'gotten' gee I sure do hate that word.


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## Benchwayze (28 Apr 2012)

studders":3hy6ihu9 said:


> 'gotten' gee I sure do hate that word.



Nearly as bad as 'Swell!' :lol:


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## studders (28 Apr 2012)

Benchwayze":30axnhf3 said:


> studders":30axnhf3 said:
> 
> 
> > 'gotten' gee I sure do hate that word.
> ...



Sure enough got that damn right John.


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## Benchwayze (28 Apr 2012)

studders":w0o08yh5 said:


> Benchwayze":w0o08yh5 said:
> 
> 
> > studders":w0o08yh5 said:
> ...



Well I was "incentivized" you see! (Even the US spell-check doesn't recognise that one; with a z or an s! )


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## studders (28 Apr 2012)

Benchwayze":4okqs5qs said:


> Even the US spell-check doesn't recognise that one; with a z or an s! )



Probably written by some cock-a-maime, God damn SOB, God dammit. (blimey, dammit seems ok :? )


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## Benchwayze (28 Apr 2012)

studders":1zqh2rkc said:


> Benchwayze":1zqh2rkc said:
> 
> 
> > Even the US spell-check doesn't recognise that one; with a z or an s! )
> ...



Heard incentivise used on the Beeb a couple of nights ago Studders. 
I suppose it's too difficult to say encourage, or give someone an incentive! :roll:


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## DrPhill (28 Apr 2012)

Benchwayze":1fhe7grh said:


> studders":1fhe7grh said:
> 
> 
> > Benchwayze":1fhe7grh said:
> ...



Ah, but any noun can be verbed these days.


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## marcros (28 Apr 2012)

how many of out athletes are expected "to medal" this summer? The BBC seem to love that "verb"


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## studders (28 Apr 2012)

Surely it's 'Medalize' ?


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## Benchwayze (28 Apr 2012)

Now Dr.Phill, I really didn't know that. 
Thanks you.


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## Benchwayze (28 Apr 2012)

And it's nice to be updativated too!


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## Lons (28 Apr 2012)

:lol:


Jacob":pcjg7wgt said:


> Lons":pcjg7wgt said:
> 
> 
> > > Maybe they shouldn't come out on their own? They don't have a divine right to utter weird opinions on guns, politics etc, without them being discussed.
> ...



You must have had a few bevies too many to write such cr*p :roll: 
In not one of my posts have I ever intimated or suggested that I or anyone else would go over to the Haven whereas you have said it several times to more than one member and in a rude and abusive manner (as above, the first 2 quote lines are yours).
Apart from attacking other members you are attacking another forum. They have every right to exist also whether or not you disagree with their policies.
Clearly demonstrates your true character for all to see (hammer).

Yes you have succeeded in provoking a response to your latest b******t so I'm sure that will make you happy :lol: - Ah well little things please little minds!
Bye


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## Jacob (28 Apr 2012)

Lons":3kd98npv said:


> :lol:
> 
> 
> Jacob":3kd98npv said:
> ...


So is _this_ the last post you'll make on this thread? :lol: :lol:


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## Lons (28 Apr 2012)

Jacob":1anngc1y said:


> So is _this_ the last post you'll make on this thread? :lol: :lol:



Never said so in that post you p**** :roll: 

Read it again


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## xy mosian (28 Apr 2012)

studders":bn0zm4iv said:


> Surely it's 'Medalize' ?



Funny that I thought to 'Medalise' was to flatten, cover with some imitation precious metal and hang on a ribbon.
xy


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## Doug B (28 Apr 2012)

Lons":3div10qh said:


> I don't know you and it 's not my place to judge Jacob





Lons":3div10qh said:


> and assure you that my comments aren't intended as an attack on you





& then




Lons":3div10qh said:


> Never said so in that post you p**** :roll:


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## stevebuk (28 Apr 2012)

Totally agree doug, it always amazes me that the folks that blame everyone else for attacks are usually at it themselves..


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## Jake (28 Apr 2012)

This goes on and on and on over the years. Forums are funny places, and they develop cliques and group-think, and then dissenters end up like splinters - slowly going septic and being violently rejected by the body politic. Jacob, of course, is a rambunctious highly opinionated buttocks - but over time is clearly actually very open minded in an auto-didactic iconoclastic way. I happen to be quite fond of him for that, for some unknown reason, which may be that he reminds me of my grandfather, well he's the same age at least. But anyway, the people who cling closest to the core, and reject the "splinter" most violently, do not seem to recognise what they are doing or why, or how aggressive and nasty it looks from the outside. It is like they genuinely cannot see that other people might have different approaches or views, and genuinely do not venerate the same things they do. Jacob, again of course, confuses this by having a mischievous sense of humour, which when combined with about ten times the intelligence of most of his foes, does make it slightly inevitable that toys will exit prams.


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## doctor Bob (28 Apr 2012)

Jake":396tt3bc said:


> in an auto-didactic iconoclastic way.




Yep, got it all apart from this bit ..... just say this again in Essex


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## Lons (28 Apr 2012)

Steve and Doug

You've taken that in isolation and completely ignored Jacobs posts in between have you not?

I haven't made a comment of any kind on either of you and I respect your right to an opinion as I would hope you respect mine.
If you review the posts honestly then you may understand why I said that (or not as the case may be).

neither as far (as I can recollect) ever "attacked" any other member of ukw in any of my 1500+ posts.

Unfortunately, the person in question has managed to irritate me which probably pleases him no end :lol: 

Anyway, hopefully Noel will kill this thread as it's gone far enough.

cheers

bob


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## Jake (28 Apr 2012)

doctor Bob":3r8nparp said:


> Jake":3r8nparp said:
> 
> 
> > in an auto-didactic iconoclastic way.
> ...



Self-taught inquiring mind and does not give a pineapple about accepted "truths"


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## Jake (28 Apr 2012)

Pineapples are very Essex, right?


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## andy king (28 Apr 2012)

Jake":11hpxlfb said:


> ...about ten times the intelligence of most of his foes...


That is a bit sweeping without evidence of any of the members achievements or IQ's, but I will say that if calling people 'morons' amongst other such 'select' descriptions, accusing people of being racist when posting equally racist comments himself, trying to destroy a persons credibility by tearing apart his printed work when it was nothing like he was implying, telling people to 'f*ck off' on the forum, and elsewhere, calling another member 'a c*nt' by PM, and so on and so on, then i'm quite happy to remain 'thick'.

Andy


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## Jake (28 Apr 2012)

andy king":2ejtq0k1 said:


> Jake":2ejtq0k1 said:
> 
> 
> > ...about ten times the intelligence of most of his foes...
> ...



"Most" Andy, but I can't be bothered to disagree with your own self-selection as to whether you are (a) one of the foes (have to say you weren't one of the clique I was thinking of) or (b) if so, one of the most or one of the minority.

As to your examples, there are two sides to every story. Your own printed story grudge I recall vaguely, and I have to say that I don't recall it being particularly clear cut in your favour.


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## andy king (28 Apr 2012)

Jake":22mlchw1 said:


> ...have to say you weren't one of the clique I was thinking of...


the 'clique' works both ways - those who support him haven't been on the recieving end of the same diatribe.



Jake":22mlchw1 said:


> ...As to your examples, there are two sides to every story. Your own printed story grudge I recall vaguely, and I have to say that I don't recall it being particularly clear cut in your favour.


I was simply defending the particular member, not myself as such. What went on because of it was not of my making, but i did defend myself to a different accusation being made because of it.
However, that particular incident was damning and could have been very damaging to the particular member whose credibility was being attacked. The postings being made were simply untrue if you read the article in question.
I'll leave it at that.

Andy


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## Lons (28 Apr 2012)

Hi Jake

Just out of curiosity, which of the multitude of hypotheses did you use to measure and justify those intelligence levels? 
I don't remember being asked to divulge my academic qualifications, training or experience when joining the forum.

cheers

Bob


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## Jake (28 Apr 2012)

andy king":3k91txrv said:


> Jake":3k91txrv said:
> 
> 
> > ...have to say you weren't one of the clique I was thinking of...
> ...



Umm, why would they be? It wasn't a diatribe, it was a musing on life online in largely male groups. 

By the way, I disagree with Jacob on lots of things, but that's not the point. I like fancy tools, Veritas, Festool, diamond sharpening (oh he found that didn't he) etc.

If you look at when Jacob is actively rude it is generally after someone else has kicked off at him for saying something wood-related (or OT, but on-thread-OT). Personally, I think that the people that react most virulently to him either have an self-importance problem or a fragile ego, or (as is commonly the case) both.


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## Jake (28 Apr 2012)

Lons":2x17u2no said:


> Hi Jake
> 
> Just out of curiosity, which of the multitude of hypotheses did you use to measure and justify those intelligence levels?
> I don't remember being asked to divulge my academic qualifications, training or experience when joining the forum



You self-selected yourself into the "most", why?


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## Lons (28 Apr 2012)

Jake":37y1wxf2 said:


> You self-selected yourself into the "most", why?



Exactly how did I do that Jake? :lol: 

I made no self selection, in which case you must be making assumptions. - Fair enough - you have the right to so do if you wish. That is up to you!
I certainly have made no such judgement regarding your intelligence or that of anyone else for that matter.

I have no issues with and respect the views of everyone whether or not I agree with their point of view, as we all have freedom to think and express ourselves individually. What I object to is the abusive "ramming down ones throat" by certain persons when that view doesn't fall into line.

I accept that I was goaded into responding in kind when I posted "p****" ( though it probably is not the word you might think it is  ) and I regret that as it brought me down to a similar level to the person who caused it, but then is it not just human nature to respond in such a manner occasionally? I doubt many people have not done so whether verbal or in written at some stage in their life. Can you say you are the exception? 

I repeat - in upwards of 1500 posts, there is only one person I can recall who has managed to illicit such a response from me so perhaps that is part of the "2 sides to a story" that was mentioned and should be considered as such!

cheers

Bob


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## Jake (29 Apr 2012)

Lons":3kinvemh said:


> Jake":3kinvemh said:
> 
> 
> > You self-selected yourself into the "most", why?
> ...



Heh. Fair cop, I over-read.


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## Lons (29 Apr 2012)

Jake":1zk9vdb1 said:


> Heh. Fair cop, I over-read.



#-o :lol: :lol:


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## Noel (29 Apr 2012)

Well, I must say I've learned a few things (or in some cases confirmed) about the character and personality of a few of those who have engaged in discussion in this thread. As I said earlier, nowt queer as folk.

Anyway, time to put away the handbags, the jokes with the jags and the whataboutery.


In more interesting and serious news Katie Price has found another mug to marry her.


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