# A couple of sightings of note...



## Alf (21 Apr 2005)

... from around the forums. Firstly the Mk2 Veritas honing guide in reality here. Alas, no wooden knobs...

Secondly, an interesting L-N prototype spokeshave. Pretty, and presumably actually going to go into production as they've made the toe piece casting.

Cheers, Alf


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## Anonymous (22 Apr 2005)

Alf":klcfgcmk said:


> ... from around the forums. Firstly the Mk2 Veritas honing guide in reality here. Alas, no wooden knobs...
> Cheers, Alf



Now that's gotta cost #-o 

Thansk Alf :wink:


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## Anonymous (22 Apr 2005)

Alf":2mnzgu0o said:


> Firstly the Mk2 Veritas honing guide in reality here. Alas, no wooden knobs...



Someone's nicked the traffic lights!


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## Chris Knight (22 Apr 2005)

The sharpening guide is a serious looking bit of kit! (I want one )

Another LN shave, low angle this time - I need it!


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## Alf (22 Apr 2005)

waterhead37":31jjgby6 said:


> I need it!


Of course you do, Chris... :^o :roll: 

Cheers, Alf

Who needs one as well - obviously. Spokeshaves are like clamps, right? You can never have enough... 8-[


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## Rob Lee (22 Apr 2005)

Espedair Street":3rxm7f40 said:


> Alf":3rxm7f40 said:
> 
> 
> > Firstly the Mk2 Veritas honing guide in reality here. Alas, no wooden knobs...
> ...



No worries there - the traffic lights get applied later.

Still working out some finish problems (as in the black won't stick :evil: ) - so we're not set on the final appearance. Accuracy is dead on though - both in repeatabilty, and squaring.

To test - we set a blade in - measure everything on a CMM... then remove the blade, disassemle the jig, give it to someone else to reassemble - and set/square the same blade. Spot on.

It's still planned for the back cover of the catalogue mailing in 4 weeks...

Cheers - 

Rob


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## Alf (22 Apr 2005)

Rob Lee":109n1lyz said:


> on a CMM...


Wazzat den? :-k Acronym Finder gives me such alternatives as "Cargo Movement Module" and "Calvert Marine Museum (Maryland)", but they seem somehow unlikely...

Cheers, Alf


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## Taffy Turner (22 Apr 2005)

Coordinate Measuring Machine


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## Alf (22 Apr 2005)

Ah, my day has not been wasted - I've learnt something. Thanks Gary.


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## Rob Lee (22 Apr 2005)

Alf":1bt7y2zy said:


> Rob Lee":1bt7y2zy said:
> 
> 
> > on a CMM...
> ...



One of these....

http://www.starrett.com/pages/828_cmm_systems.cfm

Decently cool.... 8) 

Cheers - 

Rob


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## Pete W (22 Apr 2005)

Alf":3dietnsm said:


> Secondly, an interesting L-N prototype spokeshave.



That blade will never cut wood!


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## ydb1md (22 Apr 2005)

more pics of the mkII . . . .
http://www.leevalley.com/home/temprl/hg1_side.jpg

http://www.leevalley.com/home/temprl/hg1_side2.jpg


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## Rob Lee (22 Apr 2005)

ydb1md":3bds8q0x said:


> more pics of the mkII . . . .
> http://www.leevalley.com/home/temprl/hg1_side.jpg
> 
> http://www.leevalley.com/home/temprl/hg1_side2.jpg



Hmmm...guessing at file names are we [-X ? :lol: 

Cheers - 

Rob
(who wouldn't put it there, If he didn't want it found... 8) )


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## Taffy Turner (22 Apr 2005)

Alf":1nd76341 said:


> Ah, my day has not been wasted - I've learnt something. Thanks Gary.



No problem! In return, please can you tell me what exactly is a scrub plane?  

Thanks

Gary


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## ydb1md (22 Apr 2005)

> Hmmm...guessing at file names are we [-X ? :lol:
> 
> Cheers -
> 
> ...



Sorry about that Rob, I'm the kid that always tried to peel back the corners of the Christmas package wrapping paper. :roll:


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## Rob Lee (22 Apr 2005)

ydb1md":3g99movq said:


> > Hmmm...guessing at file names are we [-X ? :lol:
> >
> > Cheers -
> >
> ...



That's ok - I'll even help you out....

With a bit of effort you could probably find the other 3 images... :wink: 

Cheers - 

Rob


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## ydb1md (22 Apr 2005)

woohoo! :shock: 



http://www.leevalley.com/home/temprl/hg1_rear.jpg

http://www.leevalley.com/home/temprl/hg1_rear2.jpg


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## Alf (22 Apr 2005)

Taffy Turner":22qsbq2m said:


> No problem! In return, please can you tell me what exactly is a scrub plane?


Better than I can explain it here. 


Have we had http://www.leevalley.com/home/temprl/hg1_top.jpg yet? :-k 

Cheers, Alf


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## ydb1md (22 Apr 2005)

Alf":om2fkuk8 said:


> Have we had http://www.leevalley.com/home/temprl/hg1_top.jpg yet? :-k
> 
> Cheers, Alf



Alf come through!


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## Rob Lee (22 Apr 2005)

Alf":2nm6r9kr said:


> Taffy Turner":2nm6r9kr said:
> 
> 
> > No problem! In return, please can you tell me what exactly is a scrub plane?
> ...



Now that was funny...!

Before everyone wastes too much bandwidth.... that's all there is...!! :lol: 

Cheers - 

Rob


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## Alf (22 Apr 2005)

ydb1md, I've just realised we're both pawns in _el Presidente's_ plan to drown us all in our own drool... #-o :roll: 

Cheers, Alf

Edit: we're also giving him altogether too much entertainment. :evil:


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## ydb1md (22 Apr 2005)

alf, I think you've hit the nail on the head =P~


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## ydb1md (22 Apr 2005)

Alf":1m7ojhx6 said:


> Edit: we're also giving him altogether too much entertainment. :evil:



I don't know, I feel kind of bad for Rob. He's stuck inside all day designing new tools.  I'm hoping that he opens up a design shop in Maryland sometime soon. :roll:  

I assume that occasionally he gets to venture into a woodshop . . . .


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## Taffy Turner (22 Apr 2005)

Alf":1poqvfhj said:


> Taffy Turner":1poqvfhj said:
> 
> 
> > No problem! In return, please can you tell me what exactly is a scrub plane?
> ...



Thank you. #-o


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## Alf (22 Apr 2005)

ydb1md":3oqw2a0c said:


> I don't know, I feel kind of bad for Rob.


Hmm... maybe I'd feel sympathy too, if he didn't do stuff like emailing me with the subject line "Chuck..." trying to make me think it was the scoop on some new product when really it was about Chuck and Millie*... #-o [-X 

Cheers, Alf 

*Prince of Wales and the Duchess of Cornwall. Esoteric correspondence, no? :roll: :lol:


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## Anonymous (24 Apr 2005)

Can I have the first of the guides off the production line please? Brown paper wrapped parcel will be accepted.


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## Anonymous (24 Apr 2005)

Rob

How much will it cost (roughly)?


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## mudman (24 Apr 2005)

Rob Lee":104bw7m5 said:


> It's still planned for the back cover of the catalogue mailing in 4 weeks...
> 
> Cheers -
> 
> Rob



I was asking a certain chap at Woodex and he reckoned it should be any time before the start of the next millenium! :shock:


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## mudman (25 Apr 2005)

Rob Lee":2oc19hwe said:


> One of these....
> 
> http://www.starrett.com/pages/828_cmm_systems.cfm
> 
> ...



Ooh, a Starrett. Is that as good as the Starett 6" rule I picked up for a quid (£1 Rob) in the market last week?


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## ydb1md (25 Apr 2005)

Tony":1i1tepav said:


> Rob
> 
> How much will it cost (roughly)?



The rumour was, 5 to 8 pounds more than the current one. I'm guessing around $50 -- not sure what that is in pounds. 

If the dollar's value keeps heading south, Rob is going to have to raise his US prices soon.


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## Rob Lee (25 Apr 2005)

mudman":3g44pvmw said:


> Rob Lee":3g44pvmw said:
> 
> 
> > One of these....
> ...



Hey - I'm sittin here with my Strongbow....I know what a quid is... :lol: 

We're still working on the costing - but in the UK it should be about £30 ...

Since the USD isn't what it used to be... I'll guess the price is $12-14 more than the current one in that market...

Ta - 

Rob


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## ydb1md (25 Apr 2005)

It's ok, you can say it, the US dollar Sucks right now.  

Strongbow eh? We'll have to do an off-topic poll about everyone's top 5 imbibements.


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## Rob Lee (25 Apr 2005)

ydb1md":72zd8mre said:


> It's ok, you can say it, the US dollar Sucks right now.
> 
> Strongbow eh? We'll have to do an off-topic poll about everyone's top 5 imbibements.



Well - the LCBO seems to have run out of Blackthorn.... been more than 3 weeks now...

Usually it's Grolsch.... but not on Sunday's....

Cheers - 

Rob


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## ydb1md (25 Apr 2005)

Right now I'm enjoying a Sam Adams lager. If I had any Guiness, I'd be drinking that. It is a "school night," so I'll have to limit it to one . . . . . maybe two. :lol:


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## Alf (9 May 2005)

Picked this up over at another forum that I won't name 'cos they're dog-in-the-manger about mentioning other forums over there and two can play at that game. :wink: 



> Tom (LN) had a box of proto type tools for us to drool over. It included his new medium shoulder plane, skew chisels, marking knife and an improved #71 plane. The #71 is a beautiful tool , as you would expect. The Neatest thing in Tom's goody box was 3 different sharpening jigs. They will register off of the flat side of the blade rather than the top of the blade.



Ach, typical. Flippin' duplication. #-o It's as bad as rival telly channels putting stuff that'd appeal to the same people on at the _same time_. :roll: 

Cheers, Alf


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## ydb1md (9 May 2005)

Alf":iblkeh13 said:


> Ach, typical. Flippin' duplication. #-o It's as bad as rival telly channels putting stuff that'd appeal to the same people on at the _same time_. :roll:
> 
> Cheers, Alf



This is actually a great time for woodworkers -- neanders in general. Have you read the newest issue of Popular Woodworking? Great article on Lie Nielsen / Veritas. With Rob Lee coming out with so many new designs that combine quality and innovation, I think that Lie Nielsen has been spurred on to improve his game as well. The ones that benefit are all of us. At the beginning of the last century, Stanley dominated the iron plane market. Now, we have _*two*_ great manufacturers to choose from, in addition to the plethora of vintage tools available to us.

I'm excited by a bunch of new tool releases by small manufacturers such as Glen Drake -- I _*have*_ to get myself a set of his Tite hammers. The variety of new tools really speaks to the resurgence of hand tools' popularity.


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## Alf (9 May 2005)

ydb1md":2e970blp said:


> This is actually a great time for woodworkers -- neanders in general.


In general? Or in particular?  I don't disagree; I just wish, with so many types of plane (in particular :wink: ) to consider making, they were making _different_ ones. And before Rob starts; I know, I know, they're quite different, you're not in competition, yadda yadda. :roll: Tell that to Neander X who wants a router plane (f'rinstance); is he/she _really_ gonna say "I can fully justify having one of each 'cos they're both so different". I'd like to see them try that one of their S/HWMBO... :lol: Not to mention the untold thousands of old ones there are available, and for not much money, which actually _work_ anyway. How can you really improve it? More to the point _why bother_? Tsk, I'm ranting again; it's the fact a grooving/dadoing/rebating whatevering doesn't seem to be under consideration - seriously - by either of them that gets me. Now a skewed dado plane, f'rinstance, that'd be worth making. Not exactly easily had at the moment, are they?



ydb1md":2e970blp said:


> Have you read the newest issue of Popular Woodworking?


Chuckle. I dare say it may turn up some time before next Christmas, but that may be a triumph of hope over experience...



ydb1md":2e970blp said:


> With Rob Lee coming out with so many new designs that combine quality and innovation, I think that Lie Nielsen has been spurred on to improve his game as well.


By releasing an iron version of the #102, which appears to be a direct competitor to the Veritas apron plane*, and a medium shoulder plane... :-k

*_pace_ Rob; I know. No competition going on etc etc :-$ :wink:



ydb1md":2e970blp said:


> The ones that benefit are all of us. At the beginning of the last century, Stanley dominated the iron plane market. Now, we have _*two*_ great manufacturers to choose from, in addition to the plethora of vintage tools available to us.


I really do hope it'll carry on like that, but I worry that the market is really pretty small, and someone is going to suffer from the not-really-competition. But I hope I'm very, very wrong about that.

Cheers, Alf


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## ydb1md (9 May 2005)

Alf":1yf1e9le said:


> I really do hope it'll carry on like that, but I worry that the market is really pretty small, and someone is going to suffer from the not-really-competition. But I hope I'm very, very wrong about that.
> 
> Cheers, Alf



You're right about that, the market is pretty small. And, I can't imagine the development of "new" planes continuing at its current pace. 

But, after the development of whatever is in the works, I hope that LN and LV keep producing their entire line for a long time to come. Or at least until I have time (and the funds) to buy one of each :wink:


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## Alf (9 May 2005)

ydb1md":g8jf1zxn said:


> But, after the development of whatever is in the works, I hope that LN and LV keep producing their entire line for a long time to come. Or at least until I have time (and the funds) to buy one of each :wink:


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## MikeW (9 May 2005)

Alf":16jad3xm said:


> ...Tsk, I'm ranting again; it's the fact a grooving/dadoing/rebating whatevering doesn't seem to be under consideration - seriously - by either of them that gets me. Now a skewed dado plane, f'rinstance, that'd be worth making. Not exactly easily had at the moment, are they?...



As a handtool user, I too think there is a need for one of these companies to step forward and remake the #39s--and I hope it is LV. Rob, are you listening?

IMNSHO, I think LN would slavishly remake the #39s in every detail, great for traditionalists I suppose. Rob and Company would, I'm sure, make them a bit more comfortable to use.

I have two currently (was 3). I do use them. I have tried old woodies as well as one from Knight. I like the metal Stanleys better. The rear handle makes it easier for me to control the beginning of the cut.

While I would prefer a LV version, I would buy them from whoever did make them.

You know, as I walked back out to the shop I had a thought--dangerous I know--why not just remake the #47? Skewed with multiple blades of differing widths. That avoids the multiple #39 issue for both manufacturing and for the user to store...Ok, dangerous thought over I'm going back to work.


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## Rob Lee (9 May 2005)

Alf":26u24qzb said:


> (snip) No competition going on etc etc :-$ :wink:
> (snip)
> 
> Cheers, Alf



Hey -

We're marching to our own drummer here... can't help it others find the beat catchy...

Ta -

Rob


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## Alf (9 May 2005)

Rob Lee":2t4d1kyk said:


> Alf":2t4d1kyk said:
> 
> 
> > (snip) No competition going on etc etc :-$ :wink:
> ...


Hmm, that drummer swaps sides an awful lot; no loyalty at all... :roll: :wink: 'Course it's not really whether _you_ think you're in competition anyway, but what the customers (us) think. And I think it has become more competitive in the last year or so, and I worry. 

Cheers, Alf 

P.S. I think I may be entitled to murmur "edge trimming plane" in a mildly accusatory manner, but I'm not sufficiently certain of my facts to be sure. :-k


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## ydb1md (9 May 2005)

MikeW":8jczrdkr said:


> As a handtool user, I too think there is a need for one of these companies to step forward and remake the #39s



Saw this and had to go see what a #39 was. (shivering) That plane reminds me of something out of Alien. If the usual smoother or jack plane is beautiful, that #39 has a face that only a mother, a blind one at that, could love.


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## Rob Lee (9 May 2005)

Alf":rskzgfee said:


> (snip)
> 
> P.S. I think I may be entitled to murmur "edge trimming plane" in a mildly accusatory manner, but I'm not sufficiently certain of my facts to be sure. :-k



Hmmm... and here I was thinking Ken Wisner was the first to make the 95 repro .... 'cause I know we carried his in 1978. 8) 

Tom LN did take over the Wisner business a few years after that... and continued to make the 95...which we also sold. Our edge trimming plane (which was available in iron OR bronze... and will be again soon) is a re-designed version of the Stanley, and not a reproduction (except for a very few, produced early on, and only in Iron)
Cheers - 

Rob


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## Alf (9 May 2005)

Did I not say I wasn't sure of my facts? Huh? Didn't I? Wasn't "maybe" employed? Tsk, and here we are without a spittoon for me to polish... I grovel in abject apology, if that helps at all. #-o 

Cheers, Alf


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## Rob Lee (9 May 2005)

Grovel ? :shock: Hah - wouldn't believe it... :roll: :wink:


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## Alf (10 May 2005)

Rob Lee":3mms52qj said:


> Grovel ? :shock: Hah - wouldn't believe it... :roll: :wink:


Very wise, 'cos I was thinking about it overnight, and I'm not so sure you haven't proved my point for me, so I may have to retract some of the grovelling...  Ah well, that's not the issue anyway <she says hurriedly 8-[ >. It's still duplicates to all intents and purposes, and that seems a bit of a waste of finite tool-making and R&D time. I can't believe this Golden Age will last forever, so it'd be nice to have as many bases covered as possible while it does, if you see what I mean. I know, I know. It's all "more, more, more" with me, isn't it? Sorry. 

ydb, it just dawned on me that calling the #39 ugly may be a very smart move. After all Rob does seem to like planes only their mother could love... :-k

Duckin' and runnin', Alf


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## Rob Lee (10 May 2005)

Alf":2vafhed7 said:


> (snip)
> 
> ydb, it just dawned on me that calling the #39 ugly may be a very smart move. After all Rob does seem to like planes only their mother could love... :-k
> 
> Duckin' and runnin', Alf



I prefer to to agree with the guy who said our products had "wabi"... 8) 

(and no - he wasn't talking about a "wabit" plane....)
[-X 

Cheers - 

Rob


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## Alf (10 May 2005)

Rob Lee":36eaksm9 said:


> I prefer to to agree with the guy who said our products had "wabi"... 8)


All right, I'll humour you. Who or what is "wabi"? :-s "Wow, Absolutely Bloomin' 'ideous"? :-k Funny thing is I wasn't even necessarily thinking of your own stuff, but if you feel the description fits...  :wink:

Cheers, Alf


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## MikeW (10 May 2005)

Alf":gsvulm24 said:


> Rob Lee":gsvulm24 said:
> 
> 
> > I prefer to to agree with the guy who said our products had "wabi"... 8)
> ...



Well, I'm not sure, Rob and Alf, but how about:
"wabi" is a Japanese word for "the imperfections that make an otherwise-perfect object beautiful and special".

Later...


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## dedee (10 May 2005)

A quick google came up with this

"Wabi" is the kind of perfect beauty that is seemingly-paradoxically caused by just the right kind of imperfection, such as an asymmetry in a ceramic bowl which reflects the handmade craftsmanship, as opposed to another bowl which is perfect, but soul-less and machine-made. 

and also a poem attributed to Leonard Cohen:-

Ring the bells that still can ring 
Forget your perfect offering 
There's a crack in everything 
That's how the light gets in

Andy


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## Rob Lee (10 May 2005)

dedee":3gd3i4f3 said:


> (snip)
> 
> and also a poem attributed to Leonard Cohen:-
> 
> ...



Ah - good Canadian chap, Leonard Cohen is...

I Believe the Mennonites have a similar concept - where they put a single small flaw in things like quilts - as to make something perfect is "an offense to God"...

Cheers - 

Rob


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## dedee (10 May 2005)

Rob Lee":1cgr10a3 said:


> (snip)
> 
> as to make something perfect is "an offense to God"...
> 
> ...




I'll use that everytime a make a missteak in my spelling.

Andy

I know, two countries separated by a common language.


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## Alf (10 May 2005)

Ah, like the imperfections in a carpet so as not to offend Allah? Heck of a useful excuse for us all when projects offer up Design Opportunities... :wink: :lol: 

Cheers, Alf


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