# Dovetail jigs



## TBay-Paul (30 Jul 2022)

Hi all 
looking for advice on a good dovetailing jig? I’m very new to jointing but looking to make more accurate dovetail joints. Appreciate any feedback.


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## recipio (30 Jul 2022)

Consider a secondhand Woodrat. You can use any dovetail bit you like with it unlike all the others which have dedicated bits. They seem to have fallen out of of fashion but I think they make nice elegant dovetails.


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## Sideways (30 Jul 2022)

Don't rush to buy the usual suspects. Yo'll get bored with them very quickly
A used woodrat is a very different proposition. It's far more flexible.


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## Spectric (30 Jul 2022)

Yes the rat is a handy machine and can cut dovetails that look hand cut, very fine and look good once you have mastered it. I don't use mine as often as I should but it has certainly got me out of some problem situations. One cut is done with the dovetail cutter and the other is done using a straight cutter, and they are HSS not carbide. Also take a look at this thread because if you get a rat then I have attached some files that may be helpful.









Woodrat user


Hi, I am in the Wirral (near Liverpool). I have a Woodrat but using only the very basics of this machine, but know that it is capable of a lot, lot more. Are there any regular Woodrat users in the Northwest who have the patience and time to teach me in how to make full use of the machine? I...




www.ukworkshop.co.uk


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## Jacob (31 Jul 2022)

Hand cut DTs not difficult and probably about the same length of learning curve, but no expensive kit or noisy routers needed.


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## recipio (31 Jul 2022)

Martin Godfrey makes a persuasive case for the HSS cutters but TCT cutters are now available in the same slim profile - more or less. Once mastered the Woodrat is surprisingly satisfying to use. The only downside is the need to wall mount it and dust extraction can be problematic. I used to see Martin at the shows in the 1990's but not in the past few years. There is an alternative version called ' Router Boss' available in the US which uses peg settings instead of the spiral cams. Worth a look if you have the funds for a new dovetailer.


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## misterfish (1 Aug 2022)

Most of the cheap dovelail jigs are very limited both in size and flexibility. Another option is a Leigh D4 series which is quite flexible and well engieered. These are often available second hand.

If you look at some of The New Yankee Workshop episodes Norm Abram uses one quite frequently. However, remember this is a US program with a different woodworking ethos and approach to safety. Despite this shortcoming you will be able to see the jig being set up and used, and the results obtainable.
Misterfish


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## poshpaws (2 Aug 2022)

the Kats Moses jigs I found were are a good gateway drug to get you into fairly decent hand cut DT's and use it from time to time

the woodrat does look interesting , I was thinking about going down the Incra route (or Gifkins) except both need a table too


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## Jacob (2 Aug 2022)

Who needs jigs? It really is this easy:


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## TRITON (2 Aug 2022)

Jacob said:


> Who needs jigs? It really is this easy:



Pro's use jigs Jacob,thats why leigh are so expensive.


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## Jacob (2 Aug 2022)

TRITON said:


> Pro's use jigs Jacob,thats why leigh are so expensive.


_Some_ pros use jigs.


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## TRITON (2 Aug 2022)

Jacob said:


> _Some_ pros use jigs.


Yup, correct Jacob. The ones who like to make a living at it.


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## Jacob (2 Aug 2022)

TRITON said:


> Yup, correct Jacob. The ones who like to make a living at it.


But not if you are in to trad design and craft, which sells very well. Hand cut DTs are seen as sine qua non, perhaps for no good reason - that's not why they were used in the past, they were just a practical joint.


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## Spectric (2 Aug 2022)

Jacob said:


> Who needs jigs? It really is this easy


But you need sharp chiesels!


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## TRITON (2 Aug 2022)

Spectric said:


> But you need sharp chiesels!



Anyone know a good sharpening technique ?

......


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## Jacob (2 Aug 2022)

TRITON said:


> Anyone know a good sharpening technique ?
> 
> ......


Actually very much to the point - if you do a lot of hand DTs there can be 100 or more in a chest of drawer and more chiselling than in any other op, other than carving perhaps.
So it has to be freehand sharpening, a little and often, or you'd be effed.
And wooden handles - lighter than plastic and the weight starts mattering if you are at it for long.


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## TRITON (2 Aug 2022)

Jacob said:


> Actually very much to the point - if you do a lot of hand DTs there can be 100 or more in a chest of drawer and more chiselling than in any other op, other than carving perhaps.
> So it has to be freehand sharpening a little and often or you'd be effed.
> And wooden handles - lighter than plastic and the weight starts mattering if you are at it for long.


My twin deco drawer units were 280 DT's.
Final year piece, had approximately 6h to cut all the joints.

I used a machine 

I even stopped for a couple


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## Ollie78 (2 Aug 2022)

The Gifkins jig always looked simple enough to me and I think you could probably make your own if so inclined.
I have an incra router table and have used that with good results before, but mostly if I do dovetails now its for a decorative box or something so I do them by hand.

Ollie


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## rogxwhit (2 Aug 2022)

A trouble with jigs is that you often seem to need a degree in mathematics - which isn't my aptitude! I've never had a jig, but I've made quite a lot of dovetails that I had to get out of the door to a quoted price ... all different ...







(Corner of chest in native oak)


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## TBay-Paul (18 Aug 2022)

Thanks for all the information, I’ll probably look out for the Leigh and in the meantime keep my chisels sharp.


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## SLM (20 Aug 2022)

Spectric said:


> But you need sharp chiesels!


Oh, don’t go there!


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## rogxwhit (20 Aug 2022)

I suspect that by the time you've farted about setting up the jig, you could've done half the job without it. Dovetails aren't produced by a sort of secret magic, using knowledge and skill only available to initiates after a long apprenticeship. There's only one trick involved - which is cutting accurately to a line. And if you can't do that, you might as well forget about woodwork altogether ... because it crops up all the time.


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## Jacob (20 Aug 2022)

rogxwhit said:


> I suspect that by the time you've farted about setting up the jig, you could've done half the job without it. Dovetails aren't produced by a sort of secret magic, using knowledge and skill only available to initiates after a long apprenticeship. There's only one trick involved - which is cutting accurately to a line. And if you can't do that, you might as well forget about woodwork altogether ... because it crops up all the time.


Or you can't do it maybe just a bit more practice?
Hand and eye skills aren't instantly available in the sense of just do A and get result B.
Nor for machines and gadgets for that matter, but people have more faith in sales patter than their own ability, and they don't give up so quickly on gadgets!


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## mattsutton29 (21 Aug 2022)

I recently bought the lumberjack jig. It uses guided bearing cutters. Very limited success and very poor quality machining. Wish I’d paid a bit more for a second hand Leigh or learnt to hand cut. But patience is not my strong point.


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## dzj (21 Aug 2022)

For many years, I've been using a Trend type of DTJ. It has served me well. With a depth gauge, the setup time is very short.
It takes about 2 minutes, maybe less, to do all 4 corners of a drawer/ box. 
It does have its downsides. You are limited to ~1/2" increments of the height of the drawer sides, some complain as to the aesthetic 
appearance...
When speed and functionality is what you are concerned with most, it is a pretty good choice.


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## Jarno (22 Aug 2022)

rogxwhit said:


> A trouble with jigs is that you often seem to need a degree in mathematics - which isn't my aptitude! I've never had a jig, but I've made quite a lot of dovetails that I had to get out of the door to a quoted price ... all different ...
> 
> View attachment 140918
> 
> ...


Usually sand them flush myself, but those dovetails look great! Am going to try that as well, really classy.


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## rogxwhit (22 Aug 2022)

It adds a bit of sculptural interest. Thank-you, Jarno.


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## Spectric (22 Aug 2022)

Buy a used Woodrat, once learnt they deliver fine dovetails that look hand cut apparently. Now for some sacrilage, I would like stick on dovetails so once you have used a lock mitre joint or something similar then you can just stick them on so it looks like dovetails, maybe a stick on veneer!


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## pgrbff (22 Aug 2022)

I was probably one of the first to buy a Leigh jig back in the early 80's. Never made anything with it, keep saying I should try and sell it but I don't think there will be a market for it here in Italy.


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## dzj (22 Aug 2022)

Spectric said:


> Buy a used Woodrat, once learnt they deliver fine dovetails that look hand cut apparently. Now for some sacrilage, I would like stick on dovetails so once you have used a lock mitre joint or something similar then you can just stick them on so it looks like dovetails, maybe a stick on veneer!


He he, cool idea! No one notices them anyway. 
Maybe the odd woodworker. Good luck trying to impress that lot, eh.


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## TRITON (22 Aug 2022)

At least when you use a jig, you dont end up with crazy angle joints like these. What are they ? 45 degrees


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## MikeJhn (23 Aug 2022)

The Leigh jigs are the RR of dovetails, once set up for a particular depth/thickness of timber you can play with spacing and dovetail size to your hearts content, make a setting block for that thickness timber and you can set up in minutes, think carefully on what width timber you really want to dovetail as the Leigh jigs come in different widths and the large one can be quite cumbersome in a small workshop, I lament selling mine with my workshop.


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## recipio (23 Aug 2022)

Spectric said:


> Buy a used Woodrat, once learnt they deliver fine dovetails that look hand cut apparently. Now for some sacrilage, I would like stick on dovetails so once you have used a lock mitre joint or something similar then you can just stick them on so it looks like dovetails, maybe a stick on veneer!


Oh.....sacrilege for sure. One trick I've used is to rip off a 4 mm thick board at the front of a drawer, make all the dovetails front and back as through dovetails and then glue on the 4 mm piece . You have instant half blind dovetails. Having used the same board the joint is virtually invisible.


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## MikeJhn (24 Aug 2022)

Half Blinds are easy enough on a Leigh jig, just one adjustment after setting up, why did I sell mine????

The instruction manual is what every machine manufacturer should aspier too, clear concise and comprehensive.


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## Jacob (24 Aug 2022)

TRITON said:


> At least when you use a jig, you dont end up with crazy angle joints like these. What are they ? 45 degrees
> View attachment 142100


Hey that's my table!
The angles are freehand chosen - not sure what they are but they seem to have settled down and come out fairly uniformly nowadays!
I showed that table some years back and attracted attention from every passing woodworker. They all seemed more interested in dovetails than anything else.
They complained that the angles were "wrong"! 
One complained that they were not only wrong but also too perfect and must have been machine made!
You can't please anybody nowadays.
PS have tried 45º, works OK, looks interesting and original, but might cause heart attacks in older woodworkers - they tend to be very timid and dependent on gadgets: pacemakers, honing/dovetail jigs, hearing aids, incontinence underwear, etc


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## MJ80 (24 Aug 2022)

I've got one of the Leigh jigs. Once you are setup its easy to bash out loads of drawers


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## TRITON (24 Aug 2022)

Jacob said:


> Hey that's my table!





And very nice it is too Jacob 

The pitch is fine, i was just joshing with you.


Jacob said:


> PS have tried 45º, works OK, looks interesting and original, but might cause heart attacks in older woodworkers - they tend to be very timid and dependent on gadgets: pacemakers, honing/dovetail jigs, hearing aids, incontinence underwear, etc



I've tried a few, kind of doing it by eye really. But Im a liar to myself. Reason is I've been looking at the Sunrise design of dovetail and I've yet to summon the courage to even attempt it.


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