# My 'Friday Afternoon' Clifton 5-1/2



## Benchwayze (18 May 2010)

Just my luck.  

My Clifton 5-1/2 arrived yesterday. Wow! Problem is, it won't 'cut straight out of the box'!

Not because it isn't sharp enough, but because the blade adjuster doesn't move the blade. There must be more backlash in the adjuster than in a modern 'run of the Mill' Stanley. The frog is about 1/8" back from the rear of the mouth and won't move forwards. 

The lateral adjuster needs to be 1/2" to the right to get the blade square. 
The Green enamel is a dull, mucky green more like khaki then 'British Racing Green'. It's packed in a lovely Blue Box though! 

No, I haven't got the lever cap too tight, because I expected it to be so for transit, and I checked. No difference. The blade won't adjust and I better not fiddle with it. (I shouldn't have to really.) 

I am sorely disappointed, and it's going back. So much for buying British.

Regards
John


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## woodbloke (18 May 2010)

Now that's got to be a big disappointment John. Out of interest, where did you get it from? - Rob


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## OPJ (18 May 2010)

John, even if you bought this second-hand (?), I think it's worth e-mailing Mick Hudson ([email protected]) before giving up on it. I don't own any Clifton planes myself but, both Alan and him have been more than happy to assist when I've had difficult fitting a Clifton iron to a Stanley plane, for example. :wink:


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## Benchwayze (18 May 2010)

Thanks fellas, 

Rob, 

It is a bit of a 'bummer' of course. I see it as a fault in manufacture though, so I don't feel I can blame the distributor, who probably didn't even open the box. Thus it wouldn't be fair of me to divulge who it was. I shall see what I can do without damaging the plane, but it does specifically say in the manufacturer's letter that there is little or no backlash. This plane is full of backlash! 

Olly, 

It's a new plane, and to put it in context, the last brand new plane I bought was a 1980's Stanley No 5. I had that out of the box, honed and planing sweet as a nut, in less than 10 minutes. So, if I can't get any joy, I'll follow that link, and thanks for that of course.

regards

John


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## Paul Chapman (18 May 2010)

As Olly said, contact Mike Hudson - he'll make sure it's sorted out to your satisfaction. Clico's phone number is 0114 243 3007.

Cheers :wink: 

Paul


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## Chems (18 May 2010)

You don't get that with an LN. Bet your gutted.


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## Benchwayze (18 May 2010)

Chems":2nt7jbot said:


> You don't get that with an LN. Bet your gutted.




My Woodwork fund took a bashing too! 

Thanks too PAul... I will keep posted.. 

:? 
John


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## jimi43 (18 May 2010)

That is such a shame John...but I hear tell their customer service is second to none.

I do hope their quality control is like the old days at Leyland...

In fact...I am quite shocked...not good...and not good especially if we intend to export anything!

Let us know how you get on...simply send it back with a report and copy Clifton in on the letter..

Jim


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## Vann (19 May 2010)

Hi John.

You had me worried. I rushed out to my workshop to check my Cliffie 4½, which arrived from CHT a few weeks ago.

The depth adjuster wheel has less than ¼ turn of backlash, and the lateral adjuster sits just slightly off-centre. Phew !!

The reason I haven't checked out the plane earlier is the cutting edge was fairly rough out of the box, and I haven't honed it yet. I started to flatten the back of the iron (the beautiful hand-forged O1 cutting iron 8) ) but it's got some fairly deep machining marks that go right down to the cutting edge, then I got interrupted, then I reassembled it to show a mate (sometimes you just have to gloat to a mate), then I got interrupted again.....

I'd send yours straight back if I were in your shoes.

Cheers, Vann.


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## Benchwayze (19 May 2010)

Hi Jim, Vann,

Thanks for the replies.

The claim is that a Clifton plane will 'cut straight from the box'. 

I wouldn't try to use any plane before I have at least eye-balled it, and honed a secondary bevel. However, I shouldn't have to 'fiddle' with a new jack-plane, costing over £200.00. Indeed I am a 'little upset'. 

So, if I can't get this plane to adjust smoothly, I might well visit the 'City of Steel', and _*take* _the plane back! My car could do with a good run!

Finally, if the colour of the enamel is British Racing Green, I've never been to Donnington!

Regards and thanks everyone. 

John


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## matthewwh (19 May 2010)

Hi John,

I've probably had more out of the box Clifton experiences than most, we open every single one before it goes out, clean it with corrosion inhibiting fluid, lightly hone the iron, wax the sole and sides, polish the brass and check for free and correct movement of everything that needs to move before they go off to the customer. 

By the sound of things your cutting iron is not seating correctly, possibly because the frog is set too far back.

Take the iron out and slacken off the two outside screws on the back of the frog by two full turns. Tighten the centre screw to advance the frog, and reinstall the blade, try to give it a wiggle and you should feel it lock into place when the two precision ground surfaces meet. 

You can tweak the mouth opening now by adjusting the centre screw, when you are happy with it, lock the frog by tightening up the outer screws again and install the end of the cap iron and the lever cap. The blade will now sit square to the mouth and all the adjusters will work correctly.

The dull mucky colour is a protective spray that they put on at the factory, I have asked them to start using metalguard ultra which doesn't turn mucky and make the brass go green but so far to no avail. Just wipe it over with a clean rag and it will all come off, as will the graphite that seeps out of the freshly machined casting. 

Rub some plane wax into the sole, leave for a minute then buff up to a shine, wipe sharpen the iron on 15 and 5 micron lapping film and it's ready to go!


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## Benchwayze (19 May 2010)

Hi Matthew, 

Thank you for your post.

I had typed out a full post on what I thought was wrong. I was going to see if I can get the frog to move before I posted, but yes, the frog is too far back, and exactly as you say, the blade assembly is being distorted due to the pressure of the lever-cap. 

I'll give all of this a go and maybe I will get the plane performing well. 
I just feel that if the 'out of the box' claim is worth anything, at the very least the frog should have been adjusted by the manufacturer. 

If you don't mind, I will cut and paste your post to Word, so I can take it into the workshop for reference. In case I missed anything.

So thanks again. I do have one more plane to buy, so I might just be travelling down to see you, for a look at a Lie Nielsen!  

Regards
John


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## matthewwh (19 May 2010)

Hi John,

Sorry we don't sell LN's, the Cliftons may not be 'retail ready' straight from the factory but I believe they are a better interpretation of the original design and significantly better made. 

It wouldn't be worth all that extra effort if the result was an ordinary bench plane.


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## jhwbigley (19 May 2010)

I'd give Mike a ring, he will be happy to help. 


The only american plane i own is a usa stanley no 7, none of that LN rubbish  

JH


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## Benchwayze (19 May 2010)

Thanks again Matthew and JHW.

I do own a Lie Nielsen low angle plane and I haven't found it wanting so far. I tend to use it where I would otherwise use my old Stanley No. 4. 

I chose the Clifton, as I didn't have a decent, heavy jack-plane - that and the fact it is British!

Anyhow, I'll take note of everything and Matthew; should I decide to go for another Clifton can I assume it's okay to pay you a visit? 

Thanks again for everyone's comments. 

John


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## matthewwh (19 May 2010)

Of course, let me know when you're coming and we'll have the kettle on for you.


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## Benchwayze (19 May 2010)

matthewwh":20a3n3k4 said:


> Of course, let me know when you're coming and we'll have the kettle on for you.



 Great... No milk and one sweetener....
Thanks Matthew!

John :wink:


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## Vann (19 May 2010)

Benchwayze":24afcmbn said:


> So, if I can't get this plane to adjust smoothly, I might well visit the 'City of Steel', and _*take* _the plane back!


 Hey wow. Take your camera and post some pictures if you do !!

I'd like to come too, but it's a bit far...

Cheers, Vann


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## Benchwayze (19 May 2010)

I went to Clico about 20 years ago, with the 'Woodworkers Guild' (Or was it the 'Guild of Woodworkers'?) 

Clico didn't make bench-planes then. As I recall they made just the shoulder plane. All in all, an interesting tour. 

Also had a great meal in one of Sheffield's best hotels, courtesy of a certain chisel manufacturer! Great day out.
 

Re the Camera, will do; if it becomes necessary to go, providing I am still on good terms with the company... :shock: 

John


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## woodbloke (19 May 2010)

John - you're making excuses now...get in your motor! :lol: :lol: We need pics of your day out - Rob


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## Benchwayze (19 May 2010)

Hi Rob, 

Well, so far the plane is cutting. The shavings are not yet of the 'gossamer' variety, but it leaves a reasonable finish on mahogany. The back of the blade is far from flat. So that's the first job. 

I planed another piece of mahogany with a very old plane that definitely needs a lot of attention, and without honing the blade. I have to say the finish is comparable. :shock: And there's still more backlash than I'd like. 

Pics on Friday, which is the next available free day! 

Regards
John


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## Eric The Viking (19 May 2010)

Benchwayze":24uluf0j said:


> And there's still more backlash than I'd like.



That's hard to fix: 

- The lumps on the ends of the adjuster stirrup wear down, and I can't see how to rebuild them easily. I suppose you could fit an adjuster knob with a narrower groove, but it's usually a left-hand thread.

- it's also determined by the slot in the chip-breaker and the thickness of the peg.

Bright ideas would be welcome here too!


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## woodbloke (19 May 2010)

Eric The Viking":h4466kh3 said:


> Bright ideas would be welcome here too!









:lol: :lol: - Rob


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## Racers (19 May 2010)

Hi,

I removed most of the backlash in my new Stanley 9 with a plastic washer, if you cut a V out you force it over the shaft. with the adjuster being larger in a bench plane you would only need a slit cut.

Pete


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## AndyT (19 May 2010)

Racers":62qwwm2n said:


> Hi,
> 
> I removed most of the backlash in my new Stanley 9 with a plastic washer, if you cut a V out you force it over the shaft. with the adjuster being larger in a bench plane you would only need a slit cut.
> 
> Pete



Now that's a bright idea!

(Maybe Stanley could do it themselves and launch another 'premium range'!)


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## wizer (19 May 2010)

Hang on. You've received a plane that doesn't work as it should? Send it back to the retailer and get another. Problem solved. That's what I'd do if I received a TV that had a faulty switch or a laptop with a dodgy hinge mechanism. The issue of exactly what is wrong with it is between the retailer and the factory.


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## Benchwayze (19 May 2010)

Yes Tom, I agree. 

I finally decided that if an eBay wonder that hasn't been fettled does almost as good a job, then the plane would need a lot of rectification. So, I have just packed it ready for despatch! 

I'll keep it posted. 
John


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## wizer (19 May 2010)

No Drama John. Just because a bit of a dodgy one comes off the factory line, doesn't mean the company is damned to hell. Clifton have a good rep, you'll get your 'Works out of the box plane', it just might be a bit delayed. No need to panic, Mr Manwearing. :wink:


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## Benchwayze (19 May 2010)

Man-wearing-out more like Tom! :lol: :wink:


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## woodbloke (19 May 2010)

Benchwayze":12nmq92e said:


> Man-wearing-out more like Tom! :lol: :wink:


You need to get yourself to a good Bash John :wink: ...PM sent - Rob


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## Karl (19 May 2010)

wizer":nsgg7jb6 said:


> Hang on. You've received a plane that doesn't work as it should? Send it back to the retailer and get another. Problem solved.



Yeah, i'd go along with this. 

I got an LN 62 which had a sizeable lump around the mouth, meaning that it wouldn't cut nicely. Sent it back and the replacement was perfect.

Cheers

Karl


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## matthewwh (20 May 2010)

wizer":acdb0z47 said:


> ...Send it back to the retailer and get another.. That's what I'd do if I received a TV that had a faulty switch or a laptop with a dodgy hinge mechanism. The issue of exactly what is wrong with it is between the retailer and the factory.



I haven't seen anything yet that suggests there is an actual manufacturing fault with this tool. You wouldn't describe a new car as faulty because the seat was too far back and the dealer hadn't taken the plastic film off the bumpers would you?

John, if you do stop in for a cuppa please bring the plane with you and I'll put it through our pre-delivery process. If there is anything wrong with it that can't be fixed on the spot I'll replace the plane out of my stock and then square things up with Clico or the other dealer.


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## woodbloke (20 May 2010)

matthewwh":gmanacbq said:


> ... I'll replace the plane out of my stock and then square things up with Clico or the other dealer.


...and you won't get better than that John. Nice one Matthew - Rob


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## Benchwayze (20 May 2010)

matthewwh":puvf8dfo said:


> I'll put it through our pre-delivery process. If there is anything wrong with it that can't be fixed on the spot I'll replace the plane out of my stock and then square things up with Clico or the other dealer.



I can't ask for fairer than that Matthew, and it's an extremely generous offer. I am most obliged. Can you give me a couple of weeks please? I have a number of routine NHS appointments for the next few days. I could let you know when I could get under-weigh for Oxon! 

Cheers and thanks again. You are a 'gold brick' Sir.. 

Regards
John


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## bugbear (20 May 2010)

matthewwh":2g2l1pix said:


> wizer":2g2l1pix said:
> 
> 
> > ...Send it back to the retailer and get another.. That's what I'd do if I received a TV that had a faulty switch or a laptop with a dodgy hinge mechanism. The issue of exactly what is wrong with it is between the retailer and the factory.
> ...



This may imply that either other dealers need to do the same "pre-sale" routine as Matthew, or that Clifton need to put a "please read this" document onto each box, detailing how to prepare your newly purchased plane for use.

BugBear


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## Benchwayze (20 May 2010)

You have a point BB. But I would not automatically expect 'use straight out of the box' with any plane, because I always hone a secondary bevel. But from all I'd heard about Cliftons, any other work required is minimal if any, and that wasn't my experience with this one. Maybe my expectations were too high? 

Matthew has made me an offer I can't refuse, and I'll take him up on it; if only for peace of mind that it's me and not the plane! Doubtless I shall take my plastic with me! 

Regards
John


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## Modernist (20 May 2010)

This concept of working "out of the box" is a pointless diversion. You have to sharpen all woodwork tools frequently and what matters is the quality of design, construction and materials. Blades and other surfaces should certainly be ground flat and square with a finish appropriate to their purpose but you should expect to have to hone the blade for a satisfactory result.


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## wizer (20 May 2010)

Sorry, I haven't read the thread fully. Didn't realise it wasn't an actual fault.


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## woodbloke (20 May 2010)

Benchwayze":3brjy2wr said:


> Doubtless I shall take my plastic with me!
> 
> Regards
> John


Good point John... 
Now then, _not_ being a 'Slope' pusher _extraordiare_  :^o I'd get Matthew to show you the Kell honing guides and 3M papers (if you don't use them already). What about a properly set up and presented Cliffi No7 as well...it would sit very well with the other one :lol: :lol: - Rob, hasty exit!


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## bugbear (20 May 2010)

Benchwayze":131j35ck said:


> You have a point BB. But I would not automatically expect 'use straight out of the box' with any plane, because I always hone a secondary bevel. But from all I'd heard about Cliftons, any other work required is minimal if any, and that wasn't my experience with this one. Maybe my expectations were too high?



Given the other facts gleaned from the thread: I would not regard final setting of the frog position, or removal of "warehouse" preservative, or (as mentioned) final honing of the blade to be unreasonable.

If the retailer does it for you, so that the plane is fully "bench ready" that's great.

The main difficulty here seems to be that no-one knows what level of "final setup" Clifton expect the end user to (have to) do, hence my suggestion of a leaflet.

BugBear


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## Benchwayze (20 May 2010)

bugbear":55gehsks said:


> Benchwayze":55gehsks said:
> 
> 
> > You have a point BB. But I would not automatically expect 'use straight out of the box' with any plane, because I always hone a secondary bevel. But from all I'd heard about Cliftons, any other work required is minimal if any, and that wasn't my experience with this one. Maybe my expectations were too high?
> ...



Okay BB. 

The claim by Clifton is 'Ready to use straight out of the box'. 

That is a bit of hyperbole, because I don't expect a new plane to have an iron in the condition I prefer, with regard to a bevel. 

However, I would at least expect the frog to be far enough forward to allow easy mouth adjustment. This wasn't possible because the frog was too far back. No sensible woodworker uses a plane with the frog set back from the rear of the mouth.

Matthew obviously knows the planes can be supplied like this, and makes sure everything is right before it leaves for a purchaser. So Clifton are being a bit optimistic in claiming their planes are ready to use out of the box.

The plane I received was unusable, because the frog was preventing proper adjustment of the blade. Also, there was way too much backlash, which is one point that Clifton are emphatic about. Given Clifton's claims, wouldn't you feel aggrieved?

If not, then you are decidedly easier to please than I am, given the claim that a Clifton is 'Ready to use straight out of the box.' 

Apart from honing a secondary bevel, I expected the plane to live up to Clifton's claims. It didn't. I was disappointed. This exaggerated claim is something which Clifton should address.

No More to be said.

Regards
John :x


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## big soft moose (20 May 2010)

Benchwayze":ysi0errq said:


> matthewwh":ysi0errq said:
> 
> 
> > I'll put it through our pre-delivery process. If there is anything wrong with it that can't be fixed on the spot I'll replace the plane out of my stock and then square things up with Clico or the other dealer.
> ...



an exceptional offer, particularly as (I presume) WH didnt supply the plane and shows why matthew is a cut above most other dealers.

one point i'd make is that if you havent been to matthew's before get extremely detailed directions as sat nav sends you to the wrong place , and despite knowing oxfordshire well i got lost twice en route - i'd also note that hes about as far north as you can get in oxon and is damn nearly in warwickshire.

also on the out of the box thing i'd note that the QS 6 i got from matthew was damn nearly ready to use OOB, just needing a teeny bit of honing.


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## Benchwayze (20 May 2010)

Exactly Moose, 

That was what I expected, according to Clifton's claims. I should have bought from Matthew, because the condition of your plane was down to his care and attention to detail. Not down to Clifton's claims! 

Thanks for the info ref travel directions. too. Glad I don't have Satnav then! :lol: :lol: 
John


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## big soft moose (20 May 2010)

Benchwayze":1k887hvy said:


> That was what I expected, according to Clifton's claims. I should have bought from Matthew, because the condition of your plane was down to his care and attention to detail. Not down to Clifton's claims!



given that my plane was a QS - i'd have been extremly suprised if it was anything to do with cliftons claims :lol:


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## xy mosian (20 May 2010)

Eric The Viking":29pd3513 said:


> Benchwayze":29pd3513 said:
> 
> 
> > And there's still more backlash than I'd like.
> ...



Don't know if this qualifies as bright? If the adjusting yoke is pressed steel, could the lugs be spread with a hammer in the manner of a rivet. The same could be applied t'other end to the lug. Of course the thing would need removing from the plane so it could present more problems. No, I'm beginning to think it's a dim idea.

xy


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## Benchwayze (20 May 2010)

big soft moose":1669ujf5 said:


> Benchwayze":1669ujf5 said:
> 
> 
> > That was what I expected, according to Clifton's claims. I should have bought from Matthew, because the condition of your plane was down to his care and attention to detail. Not down to Clifton's claims!
> ...



Yeah okay! No argument, my misreading... Age you see! :lol: 

Regards
John


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## Vann (20 May 2010)

Clico do put out an A4 sheet of instructions. (not as good as those put out by Veritas).

The second paragraph states _"The plane is ready for use straight from the box though many woodworkers will prefer to add their own personal honing touch to the cutting edge."_ So I guess John is justified in feeling aggrieved that his plane didn't live up to this.

What I'm interested to find out is: is the plane simply out of adjustment, or is there a manufacturing fault?

As I said in an earlier post, mine has less than 1/4 turn free play in the depth adjuster, whereas John seems to have more. Again from the instruction pamphlet _"...the cutter adjusting wheel engages positively - so no irritating "back-lash";..."_. So I would think that excessive play would be a fault.

If it's faulty John, send it back. If it's out of adjustment, readjust it and tell us how it goes. 

Even Anant claim their planes are _"...accurately machined..."_ :roll: but I think we have a right to expect better from Clico (considering the cost !!!)

Cheers, Vann.


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## big soft moose (21 May 2010)

Vann":365z4o7k said:


> Even Anant claim their planes are _"...accurately machined..."_ :roll: but I think we have a right to expect better from Clico (considering the cost !!!)
> 
> Cheers, Vann.



its all relative i guess, compared with a plane put together out of two by fours by a retarded chimp with a lump hammer they are accurately machined


after all they dont say how accurately machined they are - so a bag of rubbish annant could be "accurately" machined to plus minus several mm tolerance


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## Vann (21 May 2010)

big soft moose":20gywri0 said:


> ...they dont say how accurately machined they are - so a bag of rubbish annant could be "accurately" machined to plus minus several mm tolerance


Yes. I guess I was trying to say - all manufacturers make claims, but if you pay enough money you have a higher expectation that these claims will be met.

I'm waiting for some manufacturer to claim "machined to very low tolerances, with just a 10% chance this thing will actually work, but hey - what do you expect for that money!" (just buy 10 of them - one is sure to work ! :shock: ) 

I think I'll be waiting a long time :lol: 

Cheers, Vann.

ps These comments not aimed at Clifton.


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## bugbear (21 May 2010)

Benchwayze":3i0ycqpi said:


> The claim by Clifton is 'Ready to use straight out of the box'.



I know people on forums (nicluding this one) often state that Clifton/LN/LV are usable straight out of the box.

I don't recall Clifton directly making that claim. I'm perfectly ready to be proved wrong.

Hell, I don't remember Clifton advertising at all, but then I don't read magazines, and Clifton are web phobic.

BugBear


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## Vann (21 May 2010)

bugbear":3ner4fw9 said:


> Benchwayze":3ner4fw9 said:
> 
> 
> > The claim by Clifton is 'Ready to use straight out of the box'.
> ...


It's on the one page sheet that comes with each plane (2nd paragraph).

Cheers, Vann.


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## bugbear (21 May 2010)

Vann":3ra87p6f said:


> bugbear":3ra87p6f said:
> 
> 
> > Benchwayze":3ra87p6f said:
> ...



Yeah - my bad.

I posted without reading the overnight post in the thread. Sorry about that, and thanks for posting the detail.

BugBear


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## matthewwh (26 May 2010)

I mentioned the issues arising from this thread to Alan Reid, he has read the thread in full and asked me to post the following response on his behalf:

The letter enclosed with every Clifton plane clearly shows our phone no, fax no and email address as well as our postal address and is signed by me. We are always happy to discuss problems, issues or technical questions with end users by phone or in person at shows and to rectify any genuine issues. Customers are usually delighted with our attention to detail and the care we take of them.

The letter mentions that “The Bedrock design differs from the Bailey design …” and goes on to describe the mechanism for adjusting frog position and mouth opening as well. We believe these instructions to be clear and easy to follow. However if the frog was originally set too far back then we would have acknowledged a shortcoming on our part and offered guidance on how to correct it.

The rust preventative that we use does spread an opaque film over the paint work but, as Matthew points out, this can easily be removed to reveal British Racing Green. It should be borne in mind that our planes have to be protected from tropical humidity and transportation by sea as well as whatever the British climate can throw at them and us!

The reported backlash surprises me, but it is not outside the realms of possibility. I'm confident that Matthew will be able to help you with this when you visit him John, if not please feel free to give me a call.



Alan Reid

Managing Director

Clico (Sheffield) Tooling Ltd.


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## Benchwayze (26 May 2010)

Thanks you Matthew. 
PM sent.

Regards
John


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## jimi43 (26 May 2010)

Bloody brilliant from both Matthew and Alan....

I'm impressed and certainly one reason to buy British!

Bravo!

Jim


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## Routermonster (27 May 2010)

I thought it would be useful to add my own experience with Clifton planes.

Reading Matthew's posts and the care with which he prepares planes for sale, I am ashamed to say that I've never bought a Clifton from him. Instead I've always succumbed to temptation at the last three hand tool events I've attended, and parted with my cash at the CHT stand, partly from watching and talking to Mike Hudson and the inimitable Paul Chapman!

My first Cliffie was a No 7, which I ordered a couple of years ago at Westonbirt, When I got it home I discovered some problems. I phoned Mike, wrote to him with an explanation and photos. I returned the faulty plane, and from that point on he sorted everything out for me. Alan Reid also contacted me, apologised for the inconvenience, and sent me a complementary No 400 shoulder plane. When the replacement No 7 was delivered, it was nigh on perfect, and was soon pressed into service. I have to say that I received first class service from Mike and Alan!

Well, I couldn't stop there, could I, and so since then I have acquired a No 3, and this year I finally got my hands on a No 5 1/2 which I ordered at Yandles. It's absolutely awesome! In fact they all are, and get well used. These bench planes knock spots off my older Stanleys.

I do like the O-1 irons, which are easy to hone, and take a very keen edge, even even with my limited skills. I've even got used to the two-piece chipbreaker.

In fairness, I do have a LN 4 1/2, which does a good job as a smoother, and it's beautifully made and flawlessly finished, but my Cliffies are my 'go to' planes at the moment.

Hope this helps

Les


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## Paul Chapman (28 May 2010)

Routermonster":dt66tsc6 said:


> I've always succumbed to temptation at the last three hand tool events I've attended, and parted with my cash at the CHT stand, partly from watching and talking to Mike Hudson and the inimitable Paul Chapman!



Well, you were teetering on the edge of the slope, Les, so required only a gentle nudge :lol: 

Cheers :wink: 

Paul


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## woodbloke (28 May 2010)

Paul Chapman":vis1hpgf said:


> Routermonster":vis1hpgf said:
> 
> 
> > I've always succumbed to temptation at the last three hand tool events I've attended, and parted with my cash at the CHT stand, partly from watching and talking to Mike Hudson and the inimitable Paul Chapman!
> ...



Slope pusher '_extraordinaire_' :lol: - Rob


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## wizer (28 May 2010)

So I was just thinking. If Friday afternoon is bad for tools. When's good? Tuesday elevensies?


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## jimi43 (28 May 2010)

wizer":1j67w54y said:


> So I was just thinking. If Friday afternoon is bad for tools. When's good? Tuesday elevensies?



In Dakota...EVERY day is Friday....and nobody can hear you when you scream!

 :wink: 

Jim


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