# Three-pin plug advice. Any 'Sparkies' out there please?'



## Benchwayze (2 Dec 2011)

I know it sounds like a stupid question.
But:

Why does the three-pin plug on my electric kettle get hot. The pins become too hot to touch, and the lead itself gets quite warm, almost as if there's too much resistance. 

I don't leave it plugged in after use, and I always stay in the kitchen while it's plugged in. 
I suspect a new lead is called for, as the pins are quite worn and maybe need a clean? Or maybe it's over-fused? (Not by me, I should add.) The socket doesn't get warm, nor does the two way adapter. 

Is there an electrician who can advise please?

Thanks in anticipation. 

Regards
John :?:


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## Blister (2 Dec 2011)

Sounds like it time for a new Kettle not just the lead 

They are cheap now days 

Not worth taking a risk with it :wink:


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## henton49er (2 Dec 2011)

I agree with Blister's comments. 

Mike


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## studders (2 Dec 2011)

Possibly the element on its way out?

+1 New Kettle.


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## Racers (2 Dec 2011)

Hi,

You have a bad connection thats why its getting hot, it won't get better, you need to replace it sooner rather than later.

We recently replaced ours with an Alessi Hot It, not cheap but we have only had 3 kettles in 28 years by buying good ones.

Pete


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## mbartlett99 (2 Dec 2011)

Is the plug moulded on, or can it be removed? If the latter you may be able to cut it back, but if you're not sure its new lead time - and perhaps I should inject a small note of urgency, low power connections getting that hot will very certainly end in tears.


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## flying haggis (2 Dec 2011)

From what you say it sounds as though the brass plug pins are a tiny bit undersized and aren't making as good a contact with the socket. It also sounds as though the cable itself is undersized for the load. Does the cable have any writing on it and what is the wattage of the kettle? If you have one try a different lead.


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## newt (2 Dec 2011)

Can't see how the element can take more power but still work ok, I suspect high resistance at the plug pins or around the fuse connector if the sockets are ok.


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## Racers (2 Dec 2011)

Hi, 

Last one I took to bits for the same sort of problem had a badly crimped connection, and the wire was discoloured for a way down the cable. So its best to get a new one unless you can cut off enough to get to clean copper.


Pete


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## Benchwayze (2 Dec 2011)

(For some reason I had no notifications on this thread.)

So Thanks fellas, 

It's new kettle time. Away to Curry's or some-such tomorrow.
Thanks one and all =D> 

John :ho2


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## Steve Maskery (2 Dec 2011)

It may be new socket time, not just new kettle time.
The problem is that the contact between the pin and the socket is very poor. UK sockets are, apparently, not very well designed, despite being around for ever. That poor connection leads to overheating in the plug,, can cause melting, which damages the plug thus reducing the quality of the connection further.
I had one where the plug ended up literally being welded into the wall.
S


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## Jonzjob (2 Dec 2011)

If there is a bad connection that is causing the plug to get hot you will see it on the plug pins. It will look burned. If not then there is nothing wrong with the socket. Heat is caused by arcing across a bad connection. If the bad connection is in the plug then it will get hot.

Unless the kettle is quite old it will have a moulded plug and the only thing that you can get at in that is the fuse. For a kettle it should be a 13 amp fuse.

It's easy to sort out what size fuse you need for anything. 

For example you have a 235 volt single phase supply and a kettle that has a element of 2,500 watt. The kettle will take a fraction over 10 amps because you divide the wattage by the voltage to find the amperage. Sorry if this is a lesson on egg sucking :mrgreen: 

By the way, if you think that U.K. sockets are a bad designe you should see the French ones. Pony poo comes to mind

Slightly off thread, but I thought you might like to see how the French do thier wiring? This is one of many junction boxes around the walls in my house here. The transparent thing on the right is the relay for the kitchen 4 way light switches.


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## newt (2 Dec 2011)

Jonzjob":1kvzh016 said:


> If there is a bad connection that is causing the plug to get hot you will see it on the plug pins. It will look burned. If not then there is nothing wrong with the socket. Heat is caused by arcing across a bad connection. If the bad connection is in the plug then it will get hot.
> 
> Unless the kettle is quite old it will have a moulded plug and the only thing that you can get at in that is the fuse. For a kettle it should be a 13 amp fuse.
> 
> ...




John not really in the spirit of the IEE regs


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## Jonzjob (2 Dec 2011)

Well, at least there is something that you can be sure of. Line is either red, blue, orange, yellow, green, white or any other colour you can find, but earth is always green/yellow and pigs fly :shock: Also, the left hand socket in a wall socket is either line or neutral and if you have a double socket they are normally mirror image to each other and the left is bussed together as is the right. So a plug in the bottom one is the opposite sense to the one in the top! Get my drift :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: 

I was trying to find a fault. I took the top off that box and promptly put it back again :? :?


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## Ateallthepies (2 Dec 2011)

Unless you want to buy a new kettle then just chop off the old plug top and connect a new 13A plug top to the kettle lead. If the thing still heats up the problem will be within the kettle or the socket and you will have wasted £1 on a plug, if not then jobs a goodun!!

Not sure if UK socket outlets are poor but one thing is certain, adding weight on the connections by the use of multi-socket adaptors will eventually cause problems. One plug in one socket is the way.

Steve.


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## Benchwayze (2 Dec 2011)

Thanks again folks, 

I tried a computer lead with the kettle. (13a fuse John!) Not a problem, so I suspect the lead and or plug is the culprit. 
However, not being a cheap-skate, and admitting the kettle is about 15 years old, I will buy a new one tomorrow; a decent make of course. 

Thanks again everyone.  

John


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## Jonzjob (2 Dec 2011)

I would agree with that. If you want/need to plug any high current device to a socket then 1 and 1 is the best and safe way. If you have to connect any medium to low current devices to the same socket then an extention cable with a multi socket is really the only way to go, as long as you don't go over the capicity of that socket, which for normal sockets is 13 amps.

Multi adaptors are at best a temporary solution.

Just don't exceed the limit of the socket and make sure that all of the connections are good ones.

When I lived in Astley, N/W Manchester, in the 70s, Woolworths had a BIG fire in the centre of Manchester and a LOT of people lost their lives. The cause was sorted to a couple of sockets that had several adaptors pluged into them and they had been overloaded. They caught fire and KILLED! It wasn't helped by the fact that the safety exits had been chained and locked, but the fire started by the overloading!

Please remember that.

Edit : - Just read your post John. Good choice. As a matter of interest your 'puter lead is quite adequate for the job, but with a kekkle that old, not a bad bet mate. Ours was designed by Porsche, nought to sixty in 10 seconds. 60 to 210 another couple of minutes :mrgreen:


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## Ateallthepies (2 Dec 2011)

Yep the 'trailing' multi-adaptors are fine, I meant those terrible 'block' style adaptors. I have seen two of these together in one single socket outlet with five things plugged in :shock: looking like a drooping cigarette end that needs a flick and almost as hot :wink: 

Steve.


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## Benchwayze (2 Dec 2011)

Ateallthepies":jhjl2mck said:


> Yep the 'trailing' multi-adaptors are fine, I meant those terrible 'block' style adaptors. I have seen two of these together in one single socket outlet with five things plugged in :shock: looking like a drooping cigarette end that needs a flick and almost as hot :wink:
> 
> Steve.



Errr... No... Not at all! I have one, but it's never used. Always use just the kettle or the Microwave direct into the wall. That is I remove the adapter before I use the socket. Just a habit, and I think tomorrow I should take it to the local quarry pool and see how far I can throw the ruddy thing.. (The adapter, not the pool!) Wouldn't be the green thing to do though would it? 
:mrgreen:


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## Jonzjob (2 Dec 2011)

Adaptors aren't bad things, just misused. 

As long as they are for temporary use or low power, reading lights, etc. and DON'T exceed the ring main loading they are fine. But remember, buy cheap, get cheap.


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## Eric The Viking (3 Dec 2011)

Sorry - late to this:

The 13A plug+socket is the worst possible design for it's job - awkward, bulky and expensive to make, and p**spoor at actually mking a connection. Steve Maskery's right - the metal blades don't work at all well. They were introduced post war as it was thought that the ring circuits they enabled would save scarce copper over the earlier fused-spur systems. They probably did, but in terms of a low resistance, reliable connection, the old 15A round-pin ones are far better (as long as they're not Indian!).

Anyway, there are several reasons why stuff gets hot: 

Firstly there's the poor connection between plug+socket, as Steve said. You can help this by either replacing the socket altogether, or carefully dismantling it , cleaning and re-bending the two brassed grips for each pin (yup - take the power off first!!!).

The other one is inside the plug itself. Run the kettle to boil a full load of water. Whip the plug out and feel which pin is hot. If it's the live pin, chances are it's either the fuse in the plug itself, or the contacts for the fuse making a bad connection. This is VERY common, especially with powerful kettles (3kW) and fan heaters (also usually 3kW). The obvious thing is to clean the fuseholder and fuse ends, and make sure the fuse is gripped well.

It may also help to change the fuse, even if that's still working. At 3kW power they do get quite hot, and the filament gets 'tired' like a light bulb filament does. A new one will have a lower resistance.

It's probably too late to be helpful but might yet be useful to someone.

E.


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## Paul Hannaby (4 Dec 2011)

I would be very wary of using a computer lead with a kettle. Although the socket looks the same as the one on the kettle lead, the ones used for computers are usually rated at 6 amps only. There are two (or more) identical looking types of these plugs but the internal conductors are of different thicknesses, giving different current ratings.


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## Lons (4 Dec 2011)

Steve Maskery":1vwat1e9 said:


> It may be new socket time, not just new kettle time.
> The problem is that the contact between the pin and the socket is very poor. UK sockets are, apparently, not very well designed, despite being around for ever. That poor connection leads to overheating in the plug,, can cause melting, which damages the plug thus reducing the quality of the connection further.
> I had one where the plug ended up literally being welded into the wall.
> S



Steve may well be right.

I've seen a number of sockets fail (a couploe of them mine  ), as they have been cheap, poor quality items.

You get what you pay for. Mine were crappos from Toolstation but you can buy them anywhere - even Aldi or Lidl sometimes for as little as a quid.

Any doubt and I'd spend a fiver and change it for a goodun - cheaper than a fire!

Bob


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## knappers (4 Dec 2011)

As Paul said, computer "kettle leads" are generally insufficiently rated for use with a kettle. There's a reason why the plug and socket for a kettle have a corresponding indent and "lump" in the long side - its supposed to prevent you being able to use a computer lead (which don't have the corresponding cutout).
There's no reason not to use a genuine kettle lead with a computer, however - apart from the fuse rating.
Si


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## devonwoody (4 Dec 2011)

Our property wiring is 48 years old and the socket in the kitchen which is solely connected to the kettle (MK) is never touched or switched.

I know its old so I rely on the kettle switch and carry water to the kettle to refill.

I think that's a safer way whatever the wiring/plug ages are. 
( I have got a new ring main in the kitchen of course)


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## RogerS (4 Dec 2011)

There's nowt wrong with my set-up!


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## devonwoody (4 Dec 2011)

Roger, I suppose it no different from one of those 6 gang blocks on a lead.


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## devonwoody (4 Dec 2011)

devonwoody":17h8qfsm said:


> Roger, I suppose it no different from one of those 6 gang blocks on a lead.




I used to use something similar to above before they arrived. :roll:


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