# Camber Unit for Veritas MkII Honing guide - Animated Review!



## Alf (28 Apr 2006)

Well kinda animated anyway. One bit of it at least... Oh, just read the blasted thing. :roll:

Question: What's the major drawback to the MkII?

Answer: That wide roller.

What? I hear you protest. But that's what makes my blades nice and square. P'shaw, say I. (Yes I do, really.) But then I'm heavily in favour of using a cambered or _crowned_ iron in the majority of my bench planes. If you are too, this is an addition to the MkII you're going to want to have. If you don't know what in blazes I'm talking about, you don't need it. *Yet.* Move along, nothing to see here. 







The cambered roller comes already mounted in a separate lower assembly, so it's simply a matter of removing the one with the wide roller and mounting the cambered one instead. 10 second job. Nice. Apart from the camber-iness, the rest is identical as you can see below. From left to right, the original straight roller, production cambered roller and the tester one I've been using for the past months. 






Except, no, wait, the knob for adding a degree or two of micro bevel is shorter. Hmm, now why...? :-k A quick trial on the workbench reveals the old tester roller won't tilt to its full extent to the right 'cos the longer knob hits the benchtop first. Now why didn't I have any trouble with that? Ah ha, because I use narrow stones. For the Scary Sharp-ists and the like, that could be a problem. So the production roller is improved – good catch someone (irritating that it wasn't me... #-o :lol






A close look at the roller reveals it's a normal “flat” cylinder in the middle section, like the wide roller, before it curves away. This is handy, 'cos it makes honing straight with the cambered roller really a doddle too. Observe proper honing guide use, applying the pressure to the tip of the blade and _not_ the roller, and it's easy peasy. The only problematic blades are the narrow chisels, but as they're problematic with the MkII anyway...

What can I say? It works. Look:






_<Homer> Guide goes straight. Guide goes tilt. Guide goes straight. Guide goes tilt.</Homer>_

That was the animated bit, btw...

You don't have to fight the wide roller problem when you want to tip your blade to create the camber of your desires, making Camber Creation much more controlled. And that's also why I haven't bothered you with pics of “Cambers I Have Made”; it's still down to the user to provide the control, and that's exactly what I like. This isn't going to make a perfect camber with no effort on your part, so don't delude yourself on that score. I've been using it these past, ooo, six months? and the original roller's been gathering dust pretty much the whole time. To sum up then:

*Want to easily create cambers on your plane irons while using the MkII? 

Get a MkII camber roller unit doodah.*

Sheesh, I could have just said that at the beginning and saved us all some time really, couldn't I? :roll:

When's it coming out? – No idea
What's it going to cost? – No idea of that either
Next week's lotto numbers? - You're just being silly now...


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## Nick W (28 Apr 2006)

Alf,

Nice review, thank you for doing it.

One thing that has been bothering me about this idea is how it copes with low bed angle blades (i.e. BU jobs). To get the same effective radius on these you need to pare the corners further back than you would on a 'normal' plane where the blade is held at a higher angle - if you catch my drift. 8-[ 

Have you found this to be a problem? Do LV have any plans to bring out rollers with varying radii (and even shorter knobs  ) to cope?


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## Paul Chapman (28 Apr 2006)

Nice review, Alf. Up to your usual high standard.

I like the movie bit :wink: 

Paul


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## Alf (28 Apr 2006)

Nick W":1lbc8hul said:


> Have you found this to be a problem?


Nope, seems to be plenty of lattitude for aggressive cambers. To be honest it could just have easily been a narrow roller as curved - it's the absence of roller more than the curve of it that's the key as far as I can see.

Cheers, Alf


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## MikeW (28 Apr 2006)

Nice pics, Alf.

Oh, nice write up too  

Nick, I don't know how Alf does hers, but for the BU planes I have, I first carefully shaped the blades as I wanted them using my stationary belt sander. Which is what I am accustom to if my wife's Tormek is not set up. But I've used both.

Then using the guide with the cambered wheel can maintain it. Otherwise it is a bunch of honing to get it ready by hand. I don't have the patience.

My guess is because LV was hesitant to meet this "need" for a cambering plane blades using the MK.II--remember the original is still in production and works well--they would not be producing rollers with different cambers.

But, with this cambered lower unit, you can go quite tight on the radius. My LN scrub has a 3" radius, my pattern maker's planes and rounds from my hollows and rounds all can be easily honed using it.

The picture below is my scrub plane blade. If you notice, the honing was more even than my grinding as there is a flat spot or two the honing took out.






Take care, Mike


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## Alf (28 Apr 2006)

MikeW":24g70a3p said:


> Nick, I don't know how Alf does hers


Serious jack/scrub camber on the grinder first, smoother/jointer camber with the guide from a straight grind. Serious stock removal is never fun with any form of honing.

Cheers, Alf


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## Shady (28 Apr 2006)

Hmmm... So, looking at that picture - how long have you been using gold plated scrub plane blades Mike? Typical - you decadent wealthy Americans... :wink:


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## Alf (28 Apr 2006)

That's just the reflected glow from the golden aura of the Shaptons... :wink: :lol: 

Cheers, Alf


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## Waka (29 Apr 2006)

Alf

Thanks for the review, excellent as always.


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## Philly (29 Apr 2006)

Great review, Alf-animated clips? Whatever next? "The Frampton Workshop" series on TV?? :wink: 
So no idea when this little beauty might be available in the shops, then? Why does Rob taunt us so? :lol: 
Cheers
Philly


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## Derek Cohen (Perth Oz) (29 Apr 2006)

Hi Alf (and all)

Excellent review as usual.

I don't have the production roller, only the pre-production version that LV sent me for feedback/opinion back in October last year. So I though I would just piggyback here and supply a few additional comments and pictures. 

Until your comments, I was not aware that there was a modification to the knob - all my honing is on Japanese waterstones, and the knob rides clear on these.

As I mentioned elsewhere, the straight roller has a definite place to play - not only is it easier for novice sharpeners to maintain a straight edge (a bit like training wheels), but it is near-essential for the straight edges on shoulder planes and chisels. 

The cambered roller does require a little more experience/technique if a straight edge is to be maintained (and a camberd one is inadvertantly not to be created). 

Firstly, I had no difficulty honing a straight blade with the camber roller. My technique is to maintain even pressure on the central section of the blade (two fingers forming a "V"). Picture is attached. I honed several straight edges with the roller, including three blades (25/33/50 degree bevels) when assessing the BU Jointer, as well as the above. The BD Stanley and LN blades were honed at 25 degrees (with a 1 degree microbevel), and the LAS at 50 degrees. 






For markedly cambered blades, such as those for scrub planes, I first grind the desired radius on my belt sander. 

Honing the scrub plane blade demonstrated that the camber roller could follow the complete arc of the blade. This had a primary bevel of 30 degrees and a 1 degree microbevel. In the picture below you can see the glint of the microbevel. I believe most who use this roller to hone a scrub blade will find its performance satisfactory.






The method I follow when honing cambers on smoother blades is a slightly simplified version that David Charlesworth used in his sharpening video. While the A2 LV blade required greater effort to hone than the HCS of the Stanley and LN (pre-A2 blade), all were honed with a fine camber. The camber could just be seen with a straight edge against the light, and planing failed to create any train tracks when using these planes. 






I suggested to LV that my upside-down Honing Guide method is still easier to rotate than the roller (which, in hindsight, may have represented the limitations of the knob), but overall the roller is simpler to use (e.g. it does not need a card scraper blade to protect the sharpening medium).






The bottom line is that the camber roller works very satisfactorally. 

Regards from Perth

Derek


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## Anonymous (29 Apr 2006)

Nice reviews Alf and Derek

What can I say, I asked for this many times on here, I plane tested for Veritas BUT this is the first time I've seen this and I want one NOW.

Rob, when can I get one????????


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## engineer one (29 Apr 2006)

come on tony, surely you actually wanted it yesterday? :lol: :lol: 

i still think that the only flaw with the mk11 is that there is no
real sideways location on the actual guide, rather than the jig.

with the two screws, it is difficult for some, (i.e me ) to be 
sure that the blade is solidly located in a square way all the time.

the idea is great, it just needs fine tuning.

thanks for looking after the customer Rob,
paul :wink:


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## MikeW (30 Apr 2006)

Tony":3m2mgxza said:


> Nice reviews Alf and Derek
> 
> What can I say, I asked for this many times on here, I plane tested for Veritas BUT this is the first time I've seen this and I want one NOW.
> 
> Rob, when can I get one????????


Remember this thread from July-August of 2005?

This response in particular?

Sorry, couldn't resist :lol: 

Take care, Mike


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## Anonymous (30 Apr 2006)

MikeW":3752b8ee said:


> Tony":3752b8ee said:
> 
> 
> > Nice reviews Alf and Derek
> ...



That was not the first time of asking either :wink:


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## Alf (1 May 2006)

Bet you didn't helpfully suggest people wanting a camber roller should email Rob to ask though, did you? That _was_ helpful, wasn't it Rob?  :lol: 

Cheers, Alf


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## bugbear (4 May 2006)

Alf":1291e6ti said:


> I've been using it [cambered roller] these past, ooo, six months? and the original roller's been gathering dust pretty much the whole time.



Hmm. Depending on the depth of the users pockets, this appears to imply that a 'umble wood butcher might ONLY want the cambered roller (as opposed to adding the cambered roller to an existing straight roller).

Over to your marketing/shipping option department, Rob?

BugBear (who uses a Veritas Mk II, an Eclipse #36 and a Marples #7418)


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## Rob Lee (4 May 2006)

Alf":2bt321qv said:


> Bet you didn't helpfully suggest people wanting a camber roller should email Rob to ask though, did you? That _was_ helpful, wasn't it Rob?  :lol:
> 
> Cheers, Alf



Who am I to ignore what people want.... we made the winding sticks, didn't we???
:roll: :roll:


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## Rob Lee (4 May 2006)

bugbear":k4ubj5ik said:


> Alf":k4ubj5ik said:
> 
> 
> > I've been using it [cambered roller] these past, ooo, six months? and the original roller's been gathering dust pretty much the whole time.
> ...



Hi Paul - 

We're going to wait and see on that...

We're busy right now trying to implement choice of blade across the plane line.... A2 vs O1....

Cheers - 

Rob


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## Steve Maskery (7 May 2006)

Gimme, gimme, gimme!

Excellent, Rob.

Cheers
Steve


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## Mirboo (20 May 2006)

The cambered roller unit is now available on the Lee Valley website (refer link below).

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx ... at=51&ap=1


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## George_N (22 May 2006)

I know this has been asked before, but now that the cambered roller is officially out, when can we expect to see it in the UK?

cheers

George


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## Martin Brown (22 May 2006)

We are just checking and will have an answer today. Thanks for your patience. Martin


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## George_N (22 May 2006)

Martin Brown":lam6c5nz said:


> We are just checking and will have an answer today. Thanks for your patience. Martin



Cheers Martin, looking forward to hearing from you.

George


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