# WIP Small hand tools workshop - flooring and insulation now



## morfa (14 Mar 2014)

So I'm getting near to being finished with parts of the kitchen and the weather is improving slightly, so I'm looking to sort out my workshop / shed / mancave in the bottom of the garden. I can't keep on using the kitchen as a workshop and the utility room is far too small. There is a 8x6 shed currently in the garden, but again, it's a bit small. At the back of the garden there is a hard standing which is approx 14ft by 8ft (and a tidge).

So I'd like to put a small workshop on there. It'll be for hand tools mainly, so there's just going to be a workbench, toolchest, comfy chair and ideally a very small woodburning stove. And probably a few garden tools, but tbh, I'll make a small shelter for them down teh bottom of the garden, that'll actually be more useful.

I've got a budget of £2k (could spend a tidge more, but would rather spend less). I have wifely permission to widen the hard standing by a foot, so that I can get round the sides of the workshop.

The hard standing is in the corner of the garden at the back, so it's got a stone wall on the back and the right side. So if I'm going to build a wooden workshop, then I need to leave space to I can paint the sides from time to time. So my options are as I see it:

1 - Build a 12x8 shed, move it over by two feet so I can get round the sides to pain it. Make sure shed has a membrane and can be insulated internally. Have spoken to a local shed builder and they can do that well in budget. They'll also install it on the hard standing for a sensible price. I just need to extend it out for them.

2 - Another 12x8 building, but use SIPs and I'll do it all. Again, widen the hardstanding so I can get round the side for painting. I think I can buy all the SIPs in budget.

3 - Get the builders in and have them make me a shed out of breeze blocks. Put it right up against the boundary walls, so I can get something which is about 15 x 9 (externally). Build my own roof. Don't know if this would be in budget. Or if the water will pool between the boundary wall, which is approx 3/4ft tall, causing lots of damp.

4 - Bit left field here, but bear with me. Buy a shed. But put it on some kind of base that I can move so I can get to the sides / back so I can paint it every year or two.

I can't make the hard standing much bigger. I'm aware it's small, but my current space is minute (about 7ft by 4ft), so it'll have to do. All of these are under 15m2, so there is no need to worry about planning permission.


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## Grahamshed (14 Mar 2014)

There are planning regs etc to be taken into account as well. I think one of them says that if your building is less than 1 metre from a boundary it must be made of essentially fireproof materials.


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## morfa (14 Mar 2014)

Grahamshed":1a25rxkz said:


> There are planning regs etc to be taken into account as well. I think one of them says that if your building is less than 1 metre from a boundary it must be made of essentially fireproof materials.



If it's under 15m2, then that doesn't matter. I've already checked the planning regs. If it's between 15-30m2 then you have to either be 1m away or built of non-combustible material. If it's 14ft by 8ft, then it's under 15m2, so it's ok. 15ft by 10ft is slightly over 15m2 however.


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## Grahamshed (14 Mar 2014)

Ah, ok, I new about distance but not size. Well done.


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## Stu_2 (14 Mar 2014)

Pretty sure there's a limit on height, too, if it's less than a metre or 2 metres from the boundary. Can't remember the exact height limit but I think it's 2.5 metres. Not too sure if it applies to brick-built buildings only, or includes wooden buildings too.


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## carlb40 (14 Mar 2014)

Stu_2":3c8x8ff5 said:


> Pretty sure there's a limit on height, too, if it's less than a metre or 2 metres from the boundary. Can't remember the exact height limit but I think it's 2.5 metres. Not too sure if it applies to brick-built buildings only, or includes wooden buildings too.


From the planning portal

Outbuildings and garages to be single storey with maximum eaves height of 2.5 metres and maximum overall height of four metres with a dual pitched roof or three metres for any other roof


If i was closer i would help with the build. SIPs would be good IMO. However does the cost of the SIPs include the external coverings etc?


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## Stu_2 (14 Mar 2014)

Just checked my paperwork. In addition to the above, it also states that if the building is within 2 metres of the property boundary, the overall height should not exceed 2.5m.


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## morfa (14 Mar 2014)

Carl - Yeah, I'd just worked out the cost of the SIPs, no coverings. I don't recall them being that close to the 2k, so should be able to afford the rest of it.

Stu - Yeah, saw that as well, it would be well with in all the height and size restrictions. No planning issues (I've checked).


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## morfa (15 Mar 2014)

Going back to the SIP costings, it seems they can be had for around £100 per 8x4 sheet. Very roughly, that's two sheets for each end and four for each side. So that's (very roughly) about 12 sheets, which is about £1200. I suspect I'll be able to do a roof, cladding and a base for £800. I would obviously have to shorten them a bit to make sure they come inside the planning permission dimensions.


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## nathandavies (15 Mar 2014)

you don't like the idea of doing it all yourself with raw materials morfa?


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## Woodchips2 (15 Mar 2014)

morfa":eca0u6d0 said:


> Grahamshed":eca0u6d0 said:
> 
> 
> > There are planning regs etc to be taken into account as well. I think one of them says that if your building is less than 1 metre from a boundary it must be made of essentially fireproof materials.
> ...


Hi Morfa
15x10 sq ft is only 13.935m2. 15m2 is roughly 161 sq ft.

Regards Keith


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## JustBen (15 Mar 2014)

A comfy chair?! You don't have time to sit!....


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## morfa (15 Mar 2014)

nathandavies - yes, it does appeal. However I'm currently doing up the kitchen and I'm signed up to doing major garden works. There's a limit to how much stuff I can do myself.

eriba - Thanks for correcting me. I was rounding up a lot. Least I'm under and not over.

JustBen - I'll have plenty of time to sit, I'm sure.


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## morfa (24 Mar 2014)

Some rough cost for the SIPs, assuming a 16ft by 8ft shed.

£810 + delivery / pick-up for 12, 8x4, 100mm thick SIPs - so say £900
£310 for T&G cladding
£50 for battens to affix the cladding to
£30 for membrane to cover shed in

So far £1300 (rounding up a bit)

Roof:
£160 - joists (budgeted for 1 joist per 1ft, probably too many)
£150 - roof shingles
£30 - roofing mebrane
£50 - soffits/fascia stuff

So far £1700 (rounding up again)

Base:
£200 - bricks
£50 - concrete and rubble to extend concrete base
£100 - ply flooring
£50 - joists 

Or I could probably do it out of breeze blocks/railway sleepers for half that.

Finally a tidge over £2100 all in for a SIP building. Plus at least a week of my time and I'd imagine I'll make a pigs ear of something first time round. Prices are all either from Wickes or ebay for the SIPs. I reckon if I went to the local timber yard, it'd be a bit cheaper. They'd also deliver the lot for me.


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## morfa (2 Apr 2014)

Have just been looking at prices for concrete buildings. Does anyone have one? Are they any good?


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## n0legs (2 Apr 2014)

morfa":6bju4hl7 said:


> Have just been looking at prices for concrete buildings. Does anyone have one? Are they any good?


 Dad's got a concrete garage by Compton and to be honest it's great. There were a few options available when he had it done ie, side doors, double doors, extra height and windows.
A word of warning though, he moans like hell about trying to fix anything to the walls. He's drilled right through a few times, especially when it was wired for lights and power but that could be cured (if he'd listen to me) by lining it with 3/4 ply and using the fixing points that it's constructed with.
Went up in a day and the panels were easily managed between 2 of us.


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## n0legs (2 Apr 2014)

Just had a quick look at their site :- http://www.lidget.co.uk/ and I must say I'm really impressed with the options that are available now.
Got me thinking :idea:


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## RobinBHM (2 Apr 2014)

The SIPS option seems interesting, I notice quite a few people mention it as a build option.

secondsandco have 142mm SIPS for £80.00 

Robin


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## spg (10 Apr 2014)

I just been through exactly the same process as you, debating the various options and in the end opted for a log cabin kit. I upgraded the base so it could sit on pier foundations instead of a concrete slab, put felt shingles on the roof and I've ended up with a 5m x 4m 44mm double glazed cabin for £2350.

It took just over 2 weeks to arrive, 1.5 days to build and a day to shingle the roof.

HTH

Steve


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## morfa (10 Apr 2014)

spg - Where did you buy your kit from?


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## spg (14 Apr 2014)

morfa":2xk75qyy said:


> spg - Where did you buy your kit from?



It is a Eurovudas cabin and I bought mine online from Garden Adventure. I got the Rumus/Rumak style.

HTH
Steve


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## morfa (23 Apr 2014)

The man cave is go!

After a chat with Bern and my experience with the kitchen the man cave is being outsourced. I'd love to have more space and have a man cave made of SIPs, but at the same time I'd really love to stop working in my kitchen. So as the weather was nice on Monday I cracked on with widening the base a bit. The local shed makers will do me a 12x8 shed for £1200 and installation is about £60. So here's a few pics, firstly clearing the wood and stuff off the base:







Then the woodpile once it'd been moved.






Then dug the channel out and filled it with gravel:






Then put some (not enough) concrete in to the hole:




#

Just need to make a small drain on the other side of the hard standing and add a bit more concrete to the current batch. That's a job for the weekend I guess. I'm going to check out and order the shed this evening.


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## morfa (28 Apr 2014)

The old shed went this weekend. Couple of hours work in the morning to haul it down. I trod on a nail which was nice and painful as well. I'll post pictures of the pile of rubbish (it's a bigun) later on.

Bought a Titan 5kg SDS drill which was excellent for cutting the ditch on the side of the shed slab. Just got to get some breeze blocks ready to put the shed on when it's delivered next week. Normally I'd be wary of such a cheap drill, but it's ace. For the few jobs I need it for, it's cheaper than hiring a proper breaker.


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## morfa (2 Jun 2014)

The shed is now up. Finally. It has been painted now. Just got to line it, put a decent lock on it and start moving stuff in to it.


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## n0legs (2 Jun 2014)

Good looking workshop you've got there =D> 
Get it sorted, get making :lol:


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## Berncarpenter (3 Jun 2014)

Well done Morfa, nice looking shed and far enough away from the house so you can make plenty of noise. 

Cheers Bern


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## No skills (3 Jun 2014)

Good for you. If you haven't already - put some coach bolts through the door hinges, no point having locks if thieving scum can just un-screw the door hinges.


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## morfa (3 Jun 2014)

No Skills - yes, good point, that's on the list of stuff to do as well.


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## Stimpi (4 Jun 2014)

I think you should consider building it your self the cost savings are substantial, Its not difficult. Look out for builders carrying out extensions. They skip good timber because the rules say cant use untreated timber. I have just built a shed for my daughter out of reclaimed storm damaged wood. I have a fridge in my man shed, it takes up room but visitors don't complain.


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## MMUK (4 Jun 2014)

morfa":3vobykf1 said:


> Base:
> £200 - bricks
> £50 - concrete and rubble to extend concrete base
> £100 - ply flooring
> £50 - joists



£200 for bricks? :shock: You planning a dwarf wall? You should not be paying any more than £0.35 for a best stock Class B engineering brick with the VAT.


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## morfa (4 Jun 2014)

Stimpi - I got someone else to build it for me in the end. Too many other big jobs on at the moment otherwise, including a big garden re-landscape and a kitchen build.

MMUK - I might(*) have stuffed up the costings. But I was going to build a small wall 2 courses high and two bricks wide, with pillars in the middle. Also that included mortar as well. Apparently costs of such things can vary by up to 30% tho.    (yes, I'm being cheeky, hope you don't mind). However I've had someone else build the shed in the end.

I just did the base out of bricks we had in the garden and about £50's worth of breeze blocks and mortar. Wickes is generally cheap, but it seems a lot just for some bricks and fancy sand. But hey. maybe I ought to be going to a proper merchants. The installation was a bit of a faff really. I put the blocks on the base and went 'ace job done'. The guys came along and went 'that's not level, we can't install it'. So I had to buy more blocks, mortar and then spend a morning making the base properly level. I spent a lot of time swearing and wishing I'd made the shed myself. Still it's all done now. But I am going to have to put better flooring in as it's a bit bouncy. Kind of annoying for £1200 that it's so bouncy.

* probably/definitely


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## Stimpi (5 Jun 2014)

Well done Morfa it looks fine happy days ahead Did the guys you got in manufacture the shed or they just put a bought one up? I forgot to mention the founds or base. It dose not matter which route you go down build your own or buy the base is a cost and its better to get a good one. I will rephrase, a substantial one.

Next job electrics?

Enjoy
Mike B


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## morfa (5 Jun 2014)

Mike - I'm not entirely sure if they made it themselves or got it from elsewhere. I suspect that they got it from elsewhere. Apart from the floor being a bit poorly designed, the rest of it is good.

No electrics, I don't have any powertools of note. I've got a tracksaw, but I don't use that often anyway. I've found a place you can get solar panels from and I'm going to hook them up to batteries for lighting. A kelly kettle will do the tea and coffee making functions. I would like to put a small woodburner in, but I'm not convinced it's the safest idea in the world.

Next job is to finish the kitchen, then I'll get back to lining and insulate the shed.


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## morfa (14 Nov 2014)

Ok I'm back to having some time and money, so I'd like to get this finished off. Two main things need doing and I'd like opinions on both. 

Firstly the floor isn't the most solid thing and I was hoping to improve that a bit. Would it be good enough just to put 22mm chipboard flooring on top of what's there? Or should I remove part of the flooring and put some bigger and stronger bracing underneath the current floor, replace that and then add the chipboard flooring?

Secondly, what's the best way to line it? I've worked out that it'll take 10 sheets of 2.4x1.2m sheet goods. So I can put a 1 inch batten on to the current frame, install my 2" kingspan insulation in the gap, cover that with a vapour barrier. Then put something on top. But what? I would really like to put a small woodburner in there. So I'd been thinking 11mm OSB with fireproof plasterboard on top. The expensive route (but then I could screw into anything) would be 18mm ply. I was thinking that a OSB/plasterboard mix would work in terms of being able to screw into anything? Obviously MDF wouldn't be suitable and I don't think chipboard would be a good idea either?

Also should the vapour barrier go down before the insulation or after?


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## mindthatwhatouch (19 Nov 2014)

Re Flooring, definitely be inclined to up the support/bracing before boarding over.

Re Cladding. Run strips of 25mm ply around the shed, 600mm strips one at head height one at benchtop height. this is in addition to the battens. you can the plasterboard over the top and also have something nice and solid to fix to. Vapour barrier warm side of the insulation.


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## SteveB43 (20 Nov 2014)

Hi, hope shed build is progressing well morfa, and weather hasnt delayed progress down there...
interested in an earlier comment from noskills



No skills":1enrn9dg said:


> Good for you. If you haven't already - put some coach bolts through the door hinges, no point having locks if thieving scum can just un-screw the door hinges.



you would do this by drilling through and in across the hinges to secure them to the door, otherwise it wouldnt shut he said obviously...  coach bolt heads being quite large....
my garage door opens out so slightly stronger from being kicked in point of view, and hinges go into the frame and door and to unscrew, you'd need to open the door somehow?
any clues,, much apprciated. my spatial visualisation letting me down a bit on this one..
Cheers!


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## morfa (14 May 2015)

SteveB43":2yghhw2h said:


> Hi, hope shed build is progressing well morfa, and weather hasnt delayed progress down there...
> interested in an earlier comment from noskills
> 
> 
> ...



Probably too late for you now. This is for the cheapo shed doors, which have the hinges on the outside. Like this:

http://www.secrets-of-shed-building.com ... CF1738.jpg

What you're describing there has the hinges hidden in the door, so you shouldn't need to do anything.

I've finished the floor. After a bit of dithering, I just built a frame out of 2x4s, put polystyrene insulation between the frame and covered it with 18mm T&G chipboard floor. There's still a bit of bounce when it's empty, but once it's loaded and everything has sunk down, it's all good. Certainly good enough for me. I've just got to finish insulating the walls and I'm good. I'm going to plasterboard the one side, which won't have much hung on it. The side where the tools are going to go will be plywood, so I can screw into that where ever.


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