# Thinking about getting a lap-top computer



## johnelliott (5 Aug 2004)

Now that it is obvious that there is a great deal of computer expertise on this forum-
Maybe it would be a good idea to invest in a new computer. It ought to be portable so that I could take it when I visit potential customers. These are the things I want to be able to do with it
1. Show customers images of previous jobs
2. Have some kind of simple estimating program, perhaps a spreadsheet, so that I can quickly calculate the cost of doing their work, and perhaps impress them that I'm not just guessing
3. I would really like some voice recognition software so as to speed up the process of writing estimates and other business stuff. This isn't essential but desirable
4. Do internet stuff, including downloading music, but ideally without picking up a load of unwanted stuff along the way such as viruses , spy programs etc
5. Normal word processing and accounting programs
I think thats it, the only games I would want to play are FreeCell and Minesweeper
Look forward to receiving suggestions as to what I should be looking for. eg is it worth paying the extra and getting a Sony?
John


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## Adam (5 Aug 2004)

I think most laptops could do the tasks you mention easily, the only thing I'd definately suggest, if you are not really "in" to computers, is to make sure the CR-drive can "write" to CD's. This allows you to burn all the data on it to disk, providing a backup. Any new computer will come with the functionality you describe, although you may find voice recognition software far from ideal.

I've been reasonably successfull with 

www.dell.co.uk

(it's worth noting what you call a laptop, they call a "notebook").

Adam


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## Anonymous (5 Aug 2004)

Sony are stylish and funky but you do pay over the odds for them. Ditto Apple

most businesses use well-known and established brands like toshiba, HP and IBM as they are reliable and easy to get spare parts for if they get damaged

A lot of independents in the IT industry buy Dell as good value for money. Only down side is that if anything breaks physically they can be difficult or expensive to get repaired as you have to ship it back to Dell instead of beng able to go back to the local retailer.

Agree with Adam that a CD burner is a good idea for backing up data and being able to provide people with copies of large image files

Voice recognition is still not really mainstream - it may be Ok for dictating prose text if you are in a very quiet background environment, but for something like quotes where the data is very random and needs a lot of formatting it will almost certainly be quicker and more accurate to use the keyboard

other than that, most of the stuff that is on the market should be suitable, and if you don't want to edit movies and play fast graphics-intensive games then there is little point paying top dollar for the latest, highest spec machine....go for something a bit off the cutting edge for a lot less money.

If it doesn't come with a virus scanner bundled buy one, make sure it regularly updates, enable microsoft auto-update for their security patches (of which there is an almost daily stream) and look at getting one of the spyware scanners....your machine will get infected, so you have to make the effort to keep the protection up to date and regularly clean it up

m


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## Anonymous (5 Aug 2004)

John

I have been using Notebooks/Laptops as my main machine for about 6 years now.

In industry one usually gets given a Toshiba or IBM as both are tough as nails. Unfortunately, their price is very high for what you get

I (and most of my colleagues) only ever buy Dell Inspiron 8xxx or 5xxx now and am on my 2nd which is a 3.02GHz P4 with 15"screen, NVidia 3D graphics 512 MB RAM 60GB Disk and internal CD writer - £900 + VAT.

First Dell Inspiron is still going strong after 3 1/2 years and my wife uses it - never a problem with it. Never tried the Dell Latititude.

If I were to buy another Notebook, there is only one place I would look. www.dell.co.uk

Edited to be more specific about the Dell model - I wouldn't consider the latitude, only the Inspiron


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## Neil (5 Aug 2004)

I was never very fond of Dell, but at work it is all I recommend nowadays - they have obviously beaten me into submission over the years :roll: To be honest, they are so in bed with Intel & Microsoft that it is difficult for anyone else to compete with them on price.

In terms of reliability (an important consideration in a laptop) they are pretty run-of-the-mill - if you don't want to be fixing these things yourself, I would recommend that you pay the extra for the 3-yr warranty.

IBM Thinkpads are generally regarded as the most reliable machines if you want to look at another brand. They also have the best keyboards. Toshiba are second in the reliablity stakes, but tend to be overpriced as Tony said.

Steer clear of Sony - they look very stylish, but woe betide you if it breaks after the (1-yr) warranty period - it costs €20 just to tell someone what the problem is, and that it just the start it - €200 for a new keyboard, anyone? :evil: 

Agree with Adam on the CD-writer, although as he says, you'd be hard pushed to buy a new laptop without one now. Also agree on Adam's comment on voice recognition software - if you go down this route, I hope patience is one of your virtues!

NeilCFD


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## Charley (5 Aug 2004)

I bought a baby Sony Vaio at the airport the other week. It's a great little machine and great for on the move but I wouldn't recommend it if it's going to be your main computer as it isn't powerful enough at 1.ghz,512mb ram and a baby 40gb hard drive. It seems you pay more money for the smaller laptops that are less powerful then you do for the bigger laptops are faster.

Sorry I can't help much as laptops aren't really my thing but if you want a PC building I'm your man


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## Anonymous (5 Aug 2004)

my company's standard lap-top is a dell splatitude - build quality on these leaves quite a lot to be desired - the keyboard WILL go, and fairly soon too! The battery WILL go, also fairly soon. Power supplies are odd - with the recent models, you need a different supply for a docking station to what you need when on-the-move. Lots of the bits are Dell proprietary - locks you in.

Experience has shown me that Tosh are pretty indestructible - IBM too, but I have a personal thing against stink-pads 

Virus scanner, firewall, spy-ware remover vital. Recommend Ad-aware as a spy-ware killer - http://www.lavasoft.de


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## Anonymous (5 Aug 2004)

Espedair Street":irpq73pb said:


> Lots of the bits are Dell proprietary - locks you in.



This is the case with *ALL* notebooks and their only real disadvantage when compared to desktops


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## cambournepete (5 Aug 2004)

My company has standardised on Compaq, having used Dell and Toshiba, as they are supposedly easier for IT to maintain. That said, they're pretty inept so their opinion is probably worthless  .

If I were in your position I'd look at getting a known make with proper on-site service, so that leaves Dell as the obvious choice, but Sony do a commercial on-site extended warranty for £239 extra for a full 3 years.

HTH


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## thomaskennedy (7 Aug 2004)

A good program for downloading music is Shareaza

It has no spy/adware etc.

NOT that i know anything about these sorts of things :roll: :wink: ...errr...a *friend* told me about it :wink: :wink: 

hope this helps, gosh, i sound like that Who wants to be a millionaire game :? 

Ta

Tom


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## Anonymous (8 Aug 2004)

There have been a number of recommendations for Dell in this thread. I have to say that my wife's Inspiron has been pretty average.

From personal experience I found the following company very helpful with regard to repairing hers when out of Dell warranty. They also provided the port replicator we wanted after being sold one that didn't really do what we wanted by Dell themselves.

www.portables.co.uk/index.htm

They also seem to do reconditioned, trade ins etc. May be worth a look.

Regards

Roy


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## Anonymous (8 Aug 2004)

John

One thing worth adding is that when asking this type of question, one should always consider the experience and level of knowledge of respondants. Also, the type of use they get eg. mainly internet + email, graphic work, Office apps (excel, Word), 3 D grpahics work, CAD, numerical analysis etc.

I have no 'real' problems what-so-ever with any of my 3 laptops and 4 desktops but then I would class myself as a very accomplished expert who has built in excess of 100 machines since 1989 and I use 2 of my PCs all day every day at work for all of the things I listed above.

My father in law hasn't a clue about PCs and constantly phones me up with this problem and that problem. One of my desktop PCs is the same as his and whilst I would say it is great + i have had no trouble at all. He would say it is rubbish and always going wrong! :roll: 

Food for thought, eh?


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## Anonymous (9 Aug 2004)

One thing to be aware of with a laptop (or notebook) is the facilities for backing it up so that if something goes awry you can get it back into operation with the minimum delay. This often gets overlooked as a potential problem area.

Some people say "I'm okay, I copy my important data to floppy disk". Okay, fine. But what are they going to do if the hard disk crashes and needs to be replaced?

Basically you need a means of copying the contents of the hard disk verbatim, including operating system, program files AND data. And this needs to be done frequently enough for you not to lose more than you have to (say monthly at the outside).

To do this job you need a product such as Exact Image:

http://ei.drive-backup.com/

This will allow you to create the recovery image on writable CD's.

I wonder how many people here have a proper backup/restore arrangement even for their PC? It tends to be overlooked by most people until such time as they need to recover, when it's too late.

Andrew


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## Newbie_Neil (9 Aug 2004)

If you only do one thing with a laptop, make sure it is to buy the extended three year warranty.

If anything goes wrong they can be very expensive to repair.

Cheers
Neil


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## Anonymous (9 Aug 2004)

Generally backup is not a problem as most half decent new laptops have a CD writer on board. 

However, my 'data' and research material has reached over 3GB which fits very easily onto modern HDs, nut not a CD or two.

The solution was a USB2 DVD writer from PC World for £120. I now backup everything to a DVD from my laptop on the USB 2 interface.

Note that USB2 transfers at 480MBS whereas USB1.1 'only' managed 12MBS - thus USB2 is the only interface that can be used in this way (OK, firewire and PCMICA will do it too of course but are less commonly supported)


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## AlanG (11 Dec 2004)

Just to breath a bit of life into an old thread:
I took Tony ‘s advice and ordered a Dell inspiron over the internet, that was a week ago and I am still waiting for a order confirmation from Dell ! 
The site allowed me to start the order, but when it reached the payment page and the details were entered, the connection timed out and would not let me finish the order.
The next day I finished the order over the phone with a helpful Dell employee who assured me that the order would be confirmed by E-mail later that day. It was not, nor the next day. I found that it was just like buying a new car; as soon as you sign on the dotted line they don’t give a ……. 

I have been bounced around their Indian call centres, ignored on their voice mail: Finally after an E-mail to the boss, I got a reply and was told that they had lost my order and they would re order for me and confirm the order that afternoon by E-mail: What I got was a customer satisfaction survey! And still no order!

I have never had so much trouble spending £1300. :evil: 

Alan


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## Anonymous (11 Dec 2004)

Alan that stinks!!! The PC will be great but can you put up with the rubbish customer service???

Neither of my Dell laptops have had any error at all and so after sales did not come into it for me


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## trevtheturner (11 Dec 2004)

I recently purchased my replacement computer, plus extras, from Dell. Placed my order by 'phone through their India call centre, received confirmation of order by snail mail three days later and all the kit arrived on the seventh day, as promised, after placing the order. Pleased with the kit and the excellent service. Call centre operator even supplied me with his name and dedicated 'phone number, without me asking, in case I wanted to go back to him for any reason.

You seem to have been unlucky, Alan.  

Trev.


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## Alf (12 Dec 2004)

trevtheturner":7b5y81r9 said:


> You seem to have been unlucky, Alan.


Not that it's going to make you feel any better, Alan, but I agree. I had no trouble with Dell at all; the 'puter even turned up earlier than expected. Might be a Christmas rush problem?






Cheers, Alf


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## AlanG (12 Dec 2004)

Thank you for the reassuring words Tony, Alf and Trevor.
The computer is a Christmas present for my Daughter so I am concerned about the delivery date.
I do believe it was the right choice of system (thanks again Tony) just hope it gets here in time.

Alan.


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## trevtheturner (13 Dec 2004)

Alan,

Dell have been advertising heavily for the last few weeks and do seem to offer good value-for-money specifications, so I suspect Alf has hit the nail on the head.

Fingers crossed for you.

Cheers,

Trev.


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## Vormulac (14 Dec 2004)

I hope you get your new kit quickly, unfortunately my experiences of dealing with Dell have not been good. Replacing all the kit (desktop machines and server) for one of my customers through Dell (their old kit was Dell, so they insisted) resulted in *months* of problems including lost orders, orders being incorrectly filled and sluggish delivery.

And this was for a very high profile London restaurant! Ok, I wasn't ordering an entire warehouse full of goods, but for the money I expected better service than that.

Still, others here seem to have had more positive experiences Alan, so fingers crossed you get your daugher's machine without trouble. They're pretty good machines too 

V.


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## Anonymous (21 Dec 2004)

The only Dell I ever had was really heavy (at Virgin's check-in desk at Gatwick the basic bag of laptop bits was heavier than their economy carry-on allowance of 6Kg :shock: !!!) and I quickly dumped it in favour of a Thinkpad (IBM). Even that is heavy once you add the power supply, plug-in CD, carry bag and a few bits of paper, mobile phone charger.... I've avoided a PDA so far.

My experiences with IBM have all been excellent -- they go on and on and on until the software eventually kills the system performance. My old iSeries 1480 is still a trusty backup and would do everything you need. If you shop around they're no more expensive than others -- and certainly less than £1300 (sorry!).

For most people who want to do a bit of word processing, quote generation and store a few pictures (and maybe browse UKW fora using broadband) an old 300MHz Pentium 2 will actually run quite fast enough so that you'd hardly notice the difference from a new machine running at 3 GHz. The Internet down't run at 3 GHz, so you're instantly limited by the speed of your connection. Even LAN's at work are usually 100MHz maximum. The only reason most people really need anything faster is to download music and play online games or DVD's....... unless you're a designer who uses complex CAD and graphics packages. Even then most systems have problems because the storage and memory transfer rates become the limiting factor, regardless of whether it's a Pentium 1 or a Mega-Giga-Pentium X-Squared. The rest is all marketing to an uninformed consumer public. Finally, beware of 'media' systems. They're nothing more than a standard system with a bigger hard drive and a £20 bit of software -- only they cost 50% to 100% more !


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## AlanG (23 Dec 2004)

Thanks V , Brian, everyone.

Dell finally delivered! But not without multiple phone calls, threats, complaints. 

The machine arrived on Wednesday morning; luckily there was someone at home:

I was getting a little worked up about it, but it is a Christmas present for my daughter as a

reward for all her hard work at school this year. Hopefully she will remember me on her

way to fame and fortune. 

This will be my first Christmas for a long time, without any toys ..er. Tools.


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## tim (24 Dec 2004)

Alan

I bought my wife an Inspiron for Christmas and I had exactly the same problem on the customer service side - being bounced around various Indian call centres, having to resort to threatening emails etc. I hope this is not the way Dell is going. It could be put down to Xmas overload but I did all this in October!

I hope nothing goes wrong with it because I don't have much faith in their back up now.

Merry Christmas

Tim


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## PitBull (24 Dec 2004)

I thought I'd read somewhere that Dell had decided to take their call centres back on-shore/in-company as the savings didn't make up for the loss of sales & reputation etc. I though it was Dell, but might have been somebody else ?

I've never owned a laptop, but have had a number of them assigned to me by various companies over the years. Nortel used to be big on Dells - the Latitudes pre-2001 were pretty good, but later ones (at Catapult) were more fragile, as were the Inspirons. Our sales team had Sony Vaio's - spent more time under repair than on the road. MataSolv put me back on Dell Latitudes - I had several of these and they all had keyboard and screen problems. Credit Suisse have just given me a new IBM ThinkPad - can't comment on robustness obviously, but the keyboard has the best feel of any laptop keyboard I've used in the past. Sadly it has WinXP and only 512MB RAM, so runs like a slug in treacle. If you want XP, get 1MB RAM minimum.


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## PitBull (24 Dec 2004)

Since some people have mentioned Dell customer service:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2004/12/15 ... r_selloff/

Sounds like the Hoover/Kodak situations all over again


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## llangatwgnedd (24 Dec 2004)

> Sadly it has WinXP and only 512MB RAM, so runs like a slug in treacle. If you want XP, get 1MB RAM minimum.



Thanks for that PB

Thats what my laptop has and I find it much slower than my old desktop with nearly half the specs.

More ram will be on order next Month


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## AlanG (27 Dec 2004)

Happy Christmas everyone,
The new dell arrived and so far so good , much faster then my desktop (IBM Aptiva ). 
The next challenge is to install a wireless router. I thought I was about average when it came to installing computer hardware but perhaps it takes a little more intelligence than I can muster. I spent several hours trying to get the better of a Belkin router, and in the end it won, I’m back on wires again .
Still, at least I’m in the house instead of trying to keep warm in the workshop. :wink: 

Alan


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## llangatwgnedd (27 Dec 2004)

Alan,
I had no problem installing my wi fi I just picked the phone up and told my oldest son to get his butt around here. :lol: 

The hic up he had was changing the password from admin to a new one and not realizing that he had to do it on both apparatuss (well he does work in the DVLA in Swansea) :roll:

The only thing I dislike with this laptop (Toshiba satellite A60 pro) is the inbuilt speakers so tinny other that *Brill*


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