# Jet 260 Planer Thicknesser Problem - NOW FIXED!



## wizer (28 Feb 2010)

I can't quite believe this. But just days after advising Karl that the Jet 260 doesn't have a lock on the thicknessing bed and that I've never felt the need for one.... It's started to drop?

Today I was thicknessing a whole bunch of sycamore, about 40 x 40mm long planks. As I was getting up to half way through, each pass seemed to not take off as much as the last. To the point where the last 5 or 6 boards just fed through without touching the knives. When I looked at the wheel, I could visibly see it turning backwards. 

I've never had anything like this happen before. It's weird because when I was surfacing the boards in planing mode yesterday, I was having problems keeping a board flat. It seemed to want to make the board crowned, even if I started with a cupped board?

I'm sure the two problems are not related... But help, PLEASE !!


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## misterfish (28 Feb 2010)

I have the same problem with my Record 'Former RD 26'. I now feed the stock into the thicknesser and then hold the height control crank handle to stop it rotating. It's a right pain in the ar**! I would also like to know how to 'stiffen it up'

Misterfish


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## wizer (28 Feb 2010)

The only thing I can think of is to use a wedge to hold the handle in place. But there must be a reason it's started to drop after three years. It's right in the middle of a big job too :evil:


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## Nick Laguna UK (28 Feb 2010)

Hi Tom, I've never heard of this before but will call our service dept in the morning to ask if they come across it or have any ideas?

I take it your knives are sharp enough? Not that blunt knives should be able to force the bed down, but just one possible cause?

Hope all is well too, and I'll get back to you tomorrow morning

Cheers
Nick


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## wizer (28 Feb 2010)

Cheers Nick. I'd appreciate some help. Did I say three years? I meant three months 

The knives are probably near to needing a sharpen. Not least because I nicked the blades this afternoon :x 

Cheers. Let me know what they say.


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## Karl (28 Feb 2010)

It'd be interesting to see if there's an outcome to this problem Tom. 

I was surprised that there was no table lock on the Jet. It's a simple (and presumably) cheap feature to add, and it just doesn't make sense to not have one. 

Might see how feasible it'd be to add your own :wink: 

Cheers

Karl


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## wizer (28 Feb 2010)

Yes, as I say, it's never been a problem before. I do wonder why they didn't include it on the 260. 

I've had a quick look at the 310 manual to see how the locking mechanism works. It's certainly beyond my feeble skills.


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## 9fingers (28 Feb 2010)

Tom,

I think the US version of the planer is the JJP12 -ok yours is 260mm but I think it is basically the same.

Manual here http://content.wmhtoolgroup.com/manuals/708475_m.pdf

On page 10 you can see there is a lock for the table adjustment.

I'm very surprised that Jet have not fitted on the UK model. IMHO, unless there is a worm drive used which is inherently self locking, every adjustment on a machine should lock positively.

Maybe Jetman can get you some US parts to modify it to the US standard.

Bob


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## wizer (28 Feb 2010)

No Bob. It's on the 12" UK Version (and 14"). But not the 10"/260 version.

EDIT: It looks like the 10" isn't available in the US


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## Karl (28 Feb 2010)

Tom - I wasn't thinking of anything as lavish as the spindle lock shown on the 12" models. More some kind of device which sits on the machine body underneath the thicknessing table and, using a bristol lever, clamps onto the rise and fall column to stop it moving. 

Does that make sense?

Cheers

Karl


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## 9fingers (28 Feb 2010)

Ah! So it looks like it was left off to get the 10" model down to a price.

Not the sort of trick I expect from Jet

At least you could investigate the mechanism on the larger models and copy it for your machine.

Good luck

Bob


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## would not (28 Feb 2010)

Seems like an easy fix from the parts drawings. It looks like a threaded shaft with a brass/plastic end that presses against the column. If you can't get the parts from the USA then I can't see it being a major job to make one.

The other way to retro fit a lock is to alter the winding hadle with a locking ring.

The winding handle is connected to bevel gears so with no lock they will shake and allow the table to drop. It's probably held until now from being new and stiff, now it's loosened up it's moving

EDIT. On looking at the drawings again I think the better way is to put a locking ring on the winding handle.


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## wizer (28 Feb 2010)

I'm trying to think of a way to get the rest of this stock prepped. Would something like a scissor jack hold the table in place while the problem is investigated?


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## Ironballs (1 Mar 2010)

You could try some quick style clamps in spreader mode, that may hold it in place. Usual caveats/warnings about having anything loose and/or metal near your thicknesser when using it


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## wizer (1 Mar 2010)

yes that could work. I'd probably need four tho wouldn't i? Just one might skew the table.


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## Ironballs (1 Mar 2010)

Indeed, and you'd want them well out of the way at the sides to avoid timber sliding into them and jamming


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## 9fingers (1 Mar 2010)

How about a pair of wide folding wedges with a U shaped slot cut from the narrow edge in each. use these to wedge the hub of the adjusting handle with respect to the casing.

Bob


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## wizer (1 Mar 2010)

mm not impressed now I've thought about it. I hope Nick can give me an answer. I really don't feel like mucking about with Heath Robinson devices to use a P/T which is barely three years old.


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## 9fingers (1 Mar 2010)

Tom you asked for a solution to get the current batch done.
It was in that context that I suggested folding wedges.

Bob


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## Karl (1 Mar 2010)

I'd certainly be interested to find out whether the table locking mechanism could be retro fitted to the 260. I can't see why it wouldn't be possible.

Cheers

Karl


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## Richard T (1 Mar 2010)

On the Jet website the 260 is pictured with the locking lever fitted (at least the picture that is labled 260) If this indeed _is_ the 260, it should be fitable. 
What I can't understand is why they don't all have worm drive - it would solve all the problems (except the cash flow ones.)


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## Eric The Viking (1 Mar 2010)

If it's the large handwheel below the table that's turning, can you attach a G-clamp to the lowest edge (once you've set the thickness), so that the extra weight stops it rotating? Pro tem, that is.

I'd have thought a cam on a post next to the wheel ought to do it permanently, or the equivalent of a band brake on the circumference, fixed in similar style (giant Jubilee clip? I've got a few at 110mm nominal diameter that came with extractor fan fittings). 

It sounds like an infuriating problem.


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## 9fingers (1 Mar 2010)

Richard T":1mny280l said:


> it would solve all the problems (except the cash flow ones.)



You have hit the nail right on the head there Richard!

Bob


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## wizer (1 Mar 2010)

9fingers":1ur6h3u5 said:


> Tom you asked for a solution to get the current batch done.
> It was in that context that I suggested folding wedges.
> 
> Bob



Sorry Bob. Bit grumpy this morning.

Today I used a short plank standing upright from the floor and a G cramp to prevent the wheel from turning back. It seemed to work but it didn't 'feel' right. If I wasn't half way through a big(ish) job I'd take time to investigate what's going on. As it stands this 'solution' will have to do for now.

I managed to forget about nicking the blades and promptly sent the same board through earlier :evil: Let's just say that offsetting the blades didn't work, much. So I also need to replace the blades. :roll:


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## Ironballs (1 Mar 2010)

Properly Wizered then :wink:


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## dicktimber (1 Mar 2010)

Tom
I have the jet....purchased on your recommendations!!!!!
I can see this being a serious problem and have to say a Heath robinson fix does not appeal.
I have fired off a letter to Axminster asking what they can do, because if it is a manufacturing cock up based on cost savings then it should be addressed by the maker. My table rise and fall is very stiff, and I wonder if there is some sort of adjustment you can make on the main pillar?

I had a kity before the Jet. It also did not have a table lock, but worked slightly differently, with four screwed bars at the corners to lift the table.
So the problem should not have occurred anyway.

I know it's a daft question, but are you surfacing the planks to get a face side before you stick them through the thicknesser, as any bow will just be replicated in the thicknesser if you don't?
Are you taking a huge cut?
The only other thing I could think of is if your knives need to be resharpened?
I would also see if you are having the same problem if you stick through a different type of timber.
I am not trying to teach you to suck eggs...just trying to give some constructive help.

Will advise when Axminster come back.


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## Ironballs (1 Mar 2010)

Think he said earlier on that he could see the handle winding as the timber went through, which points to the mechanism not locking


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## dicktimber (1 Mar 2010)

So it's 
'Not fit for purpose'


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## wizer (1 Mar 2010)

Dick I had no way of knowing this problem would arise. Up until now, this machine has been my most treasured. It just worked, and worked well. Not owning a P/T before this or having an engineering background, the fact that the table didn't lock did not look like a problem to me. As I say, for three years it's worked perfectly. No problems with the resulting boards at all. I've used it a lot.

I think the other problems I am having are down to the knives. It must be as it's never happened before. Yes, I always face the boards before thicknessing. The more I think about, the more I'm certain it's the knives. I have a sharp set ready and they will be installed next time I'm in the workshop.


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## 9fingers (1 Mar 2010)

wizer":2vjcaubr said:


> 9fingers":2vjcaubr said:
> 
> 
> > Tom you asked for a solution to get the current batch done.
> ...



No problems Tom.
Provided you have not bitten too much out of the knives, I could sharpen them for you. Bring them with you on saturday and I can bring them back home, sharpen and post back.

I've got a pair of plain blades to fit the Kity I no longer have. They are 260mm x 20 x3 mm brand spanking new. Any good to you??

Bob


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## dicktimber (1 Mar 2010)

Tom
Never the less what you describe is wanting a reply from the manufacturers.
To this end I have contacted Switzerland asking why a lock isn't provided on this machine, and why this would happen.

No doubt someone with a physics? degree will explain to us exactly what forces are at play when timber is passed through a thicknesser and how much down force there is as opposed to longitudinal force when cutting, which is in fact trying to lift the timber up, not pressing it down...and the rollers are sprung ...so how much down force may be a lot less than we expect.......not enough to move the table??.....who knows....

Hope some one can explain?


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## wizer (1 Mar 2010)

9fingers":gar7cdom said:


> , I could sharpen them for you. Bring them with you on saturday and I can bring them back home, sharpen and post back.
> 
> I've got a pair of plain blades to fit the Kity I no longer have. They are 260mm x 20 x3 mm brand spanking new. Any good to you??
> 
> Bob



Very kind on both counts Bob. Bring them along on Sat and I'll see if they match mine. The specs sound right.

Dick, thanks for contacting Jet. I'm sure Nick is on the case, but it doesn't hurt to reinforce the fact.

The only thing I can think of is that my 260 is on a wheeled base. But because my floor is to horribly uneven, it doesn't sit down properly. I really must get a new base made up as it's literally breaking my back to shuffle it in and out when I need it. The machine needs a service as it's started taking 3-4 seconds before the motor gets up to speed. 

Perhaps I was too quick to sing this machine's praises. I hope not.

I'm off to mutter something about "this is all I need"....


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## RogerS (2 Mar 2010)

Is this the same wizer who in another thread said ...

Fiddly? Are you kidding? Flimsy? Are you sure?

Seriously Roger, you need to see one in the flesh. I'm not saying your sedgewick isn't a good machine. But don't knock the Jet til you've seen it. It's a very substantial machine and since it's been setup has served me very well. It's not unusual for me to water and moan about a tool/machine is it? This thing is really good, fact.

The Sedgwick MB naturally comes with a lock on the thicknesser bed. Boys toys...huh...who'd have 'em. :wink:


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## 9fingers (2 Mar 2010)

How many knives does your machine have Tom?

If it is three, then my offer of two knives won't be a lot of good to you.

I could still sharpen for you though.

Bob


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## dicktimber (3 Mar 2010)

Wizzer
Axminster are saying the following

Would more likely be the height adjustment handle is vibrating round rather than the table being physically pushed down.
Also there gut feeling is that dull blades could have changed the harmonics of the machine and that is having an effect.
They have contacted Nick who is at a show, so will wait till he replys...

I know it doesn't help you but at least they appear to be on the case.

Nothing from switzerland !


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## wizer (7 Mar 2010)

Dick I missed this reply. Thanks.

Nick did contact me and suggest changing the blades. The blades were certainly not blunt, in fact had little use since their last sharpen and the finish on the timber was good. No obvious sounds of stress when the timber was going through the thicknesser.

However, I think I know what the problem might be. It's the base. It's sitting in a (Dakota) wheeled base and it does vibrate significantly. The other problem with this base is because of the small wheels it fouls the floor which ever position I put it in.

So as well as changing the knives I want a proper rolling base made up for it with good quality castors.

I'm going to copy Waka's design:







Can anyone recommend _very _good quality 100mm castors? In the past I've always used axminster's castors but they do have some play in them when locked. I'd like this one to be rock solid when the wheels are locked for the above reasons. Any help would be much appreciated.


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## llangatwgnedd (7 Mar 2010)

A suspended base just magnifys M/C vibration. 

Cut four cheese wedges and pack them under that base, and see if that makes a difference.


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## dicktimber (12 Mar 2010)

Tom,
Just had a reply from switzerland tech dept.
They say they know that the friction locking( as they describe it) can be loose because there is no locking mechanism!!!!
( I know, they stated the obvious!)
but there is a locking mechanism on the 12" model.......(don't scream)

However they say that if a digital display is attached the problem should be fixed!!!*****
I have no idea how this fixes the problem but this is what they are saying.

I hope the mods to the base cure the problem....will you let me know, please?


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## wizer (12 Mar 2010)

Thanks Dick.... I have the digital display fitted!!! :roll: 

I've not been back in the workshop since I discovered the problem. I'm going to try new knives (Thanks Bob) and see if that helps in any way (doubt it) then the only options I have is either to take it off the mobile base (don't think so!) or do as Sawdust Producer suggests and make a new base that some wedges can fit under, or some such like solution.

I do wonder what has caused it to start happening, whether it's unusual or if they're all going to start doing it after 3yrs? 

I'm never going to rave about a tool again! :roll:


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## WellsWood (12 Mar 2010)

wizer":3grr0n3k said:


> Thanks Dick.... I have the digital display fitted!!! :roll:
> 
> I do wonder what has caused it to start happening, whether it's unusual or if they're all going to start doing it after 3yrs?
> 
> I'm never going to rave about a tool again! :roll:



Probably time to chuck it out and buy the 12" then :wink:


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## wizer (12 Mar 2010)

Pipe down you. It's all YOUR fault


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## 9fingers (12 Mar 2010)

Tom, 

Given your table saw fettling expertise, I'm sure you could devise a solution.

As i've said before - you could look at the 12" solution and pinch ideas from that.

Have the knives arrived OK?

Cheers

Bob


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## wizer (12 Mar 2010)

Thanks Bob, they dropped on the matt this morning.


I'm hoping not to have to fettle the machine. I'll stop the vibration first and see if that helps.


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## 9fingers (12 Mar 2010)

wizer":l5x657gj said:


> Thanks Bob, they dropped on the matt this morning.
> 
> 
> I'm hoping not to have to fettle the machine. I'll stop the vibration first and see if that helps.



The cause will still be there and be a nagging doubt whenever you put stock though. Go on - fix it you will feel much happier knowing that it _can't_ happen again.

Bob


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## wizer (12 Mar 2010)

What's that Bob? You'd like to help me do it? Cool, see you in about 4 weeks. :lol:


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## 9fingers (12 Mar 2010)

wizer":3juulwmy said:


> What's that Bob? You'd like to help me do it? Cool, see you in about 4 weeks. :lol:



If I could find a way to assist then YES! 

Since post that previous comment, I have been trying to find the downloadable versions of the manuals for the260 and the 310 so I could suggest something.

So I do want to try and help.

Bob


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## wizer (12 Mar 2010)

Well that was tongue in cheek, but we all know how much engineering savvy I have. So some help would be very much appreciated. I'm sure WellsWood would love to join in too.  

You posted the American manual for the 12" version in the first page of this thread.

I wouldn't bother with the UK versions, they're not worth the paper, etc. I imagine the inside of the machines are all the same with the difference that the 260 has the locking lever missing?


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## WellsWood (12 Mar 2010)

wizer":qso02dlz said:


> Well that was tongue in cheek, but we all know how much engineering savvy I have. So some help would be very much appreciated. I'm sure WellsWood would love to join in too.
> 
> ... I imagine the inside of the machines are all the same with the difference that the 260 has the locking lever missing?



Reading my mind there...
I was wondering if the locking mechanism for the 310 was obtainable as a spare, and whether it was possible to retrofit it to the 260. It would require drilling the relevant holes in the cabinet side at the very least, but if there's nothing too clever going on inside it may very well be feasable.
I'm in the workshop all day tomorrow, I'll pull the inspection panel off mine and have a look how it actually works - can't be that complicated.


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## Oryxdesign (12 Mar 2010)

WellsWood":3o6uq6wp said:


> wizer":3o6uq6wp said:
> 
> 
> > Well that was tongue in cheek, but we all know how much engineering savvy I have. So some help would be very much appreciated. I'm sure WellsWood would love to join in too.
> ...



Is yours a 310 Mark?


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## 9fingers (12 Mar 2010)

Studying the US manual here
http://content.wmhtoolgroup.com/manuals/708475_m.pdf
the lock acts directly on the rise and fall column under the table.
The column is then driven by a vertical leadscrew which in turn is driven by a pair of bevel gears from the external handwheel.
From an engineering point of view, the lock as designed is the best method. However, if we are considering a retrofit kit, an adequate solution would be provided by locking the handwheel. All the backlash will be taken out by the weight of the table.

Tom, Please can you take some photos of the handwheel both face on to the output side of the machine and side on with as much detail as possible.

Cheers

Bob


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## WellsWood (12 Mar 2010)

Oryxdesign":3jkh9pyg said:


> Is yours a 310 Mark?



Yep


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## wizer (12 Mar 2010)

Will get those pics in the morning Bob. I do wonder why the manufacturers have said the problem should not exist with the digital display? Maybe that's at fault? I won't have time tomorrow, but on Monday I will take that off, put the new knives in and test it. If the problem is still there then I'd like to see if it still does it when on terra firma. But I do agree, now it's happened, I'll always be paranoid of it and if I'm not then I may get error creep into my projects which might not be obvious until it's too late.


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## 9fingers (12 Mar 2010)

WellsWood":2633h5f3 said:


> Oryxdesign":2633h5f3 said:
> 
> 
> > Is yours a 310 Mark?
> ...



I should have paid more attention last week. Simon, I think P/T is a 310 and has a table lock? 
Also Mark if yours is a 310 does it have the lock too? ( that means Tom's comment about Mark being interested in the solution is a bit strange??)

So many questions  

Bob


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## wizer (12 Mar 2010)

Bob I meant Mark being willing/forced to help 

Mark has a 310 and Simon has the 410, i.e 12" and 14". Both have the table lock function. I cheaped and went for the 260/10" :roll: Which is why I blame it all on Mark, who's a very bad and naughty man!


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## WellsWood (13 Mar 2010)

wizer":cnj4xq28 said:


> ... Which is why I blame it all on Mark, ....



It was only a matter of time............. :-({|=


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## Oryxdesign (13 Mar 2010)

wizer":2tkc83ed said:


> Simon has the 410, i.e 14"



I'l have you know mines 16", the extra 2" is sometimes important :wink:


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## dicktimber (13 Mar 2010)

Tom
What worries me is that the manufacturer knows about the problem, and the only offer of a fix is to attach the digital readout mechanism.?
So in reality there isn't one?

I am surprised that Nick has not come back with a more specific fix....because trading standards would class this as, not fit for purpose.
As soon as you try a retrofit you will probably face warranty invalidation, although it is probably out of warranty, this problem should not occur given the little use it has had.

I would think hard before taking up the offer of carrying out any work, although the help offered is in good faith.

If you are confident there is a mechanical problem...you could always try the small claims court, which take claims up to £5000 if my memory serves me well, but you should ensure that the company you have bought the machine from is given the opportunity to correct the problem first.
If they don't or wont, I think you would have a strong case for the machinebeing, not fit for purpose.

I would contact Axminster, if this is who you purchased it from and get them to check it out.

What also seems strange is that at our local college we had a planer thicknesser that had the locking mechanism removed because the students kept forgetting to unlock the table, and put too much strain on the rise and fall drives when forgetting to unlock it.
But I can't recall the table ever dropping because there was no lock on it.

I hope you get it sorted out whichever way you go.


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## 9fingers (13 Mar 2010)

The plan I have in the back of my mind is to try and find an easy to fit solution for Tom (ok that is a challenge too far - I should say -a solution for Tom's planer :lol: )

Then I would make a few more kits for those forum members who want one.

I'm guessing that Jet know there is a design shortcoming in the 260 model but it would be commercial madness to admit it publicly.

There are no doubt compromises in most machine design made to get the works cost price down to meet a market. Maybe this one has backfired a bit. At least it is not a Toyota!

Bob


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## newt (13 Mar 2010)

dicktimber":zop5qb1b said:


> Tom,
> Just had a
> However they say that if a digital display is attached the problem should be fixed!!!*****
> I have no idea how this fixes the problem but this is what they are saying.



I assume they mean you can see how much it has dropped with the digital display and reset to the correct height. If that is the case they need there a---- kicking. I suspect you need some more friction in the rise and fall mech, can the bevel gears be adjusted for a tighter mesh?


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## dicktimber (13 Mar 2010)

Bob...that sounds like about right


peter
And that info was from the technical director!!!!!


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## Eric The Viking (13 Mar 2010)

OK, I agree with the consensus that this is a big mistake on the part of the manufacturer, but you may or may not get a fix from them. Assuming this ends up as DIY, I've a thought developing (been watching too much of Steve M. jig-making recently!):

@Tom: Behind the adjustment handwheel, is the machine's cover reasonably flat? Also,do you know what's directly behind the cover (the bit that's behind the wheel)?

My reason for asking is that, assuming it's a flat piece of thin steel sheet, it ought to be possible to make a friction lock. Whether it would stay locked with all the vibration is another matter, but I had in mind something like this:







With a bit of thick steel plate and an M8 tap you could make a lever instead of the locking nut, eliminating the need for a spanner on-hand.

It looks from the Axy pictures though that the handwheel is some distance from the panel - this would be a PITA because of the twisting forces on the stud, and might not work for that reason. 

Also, what about clamping the shaft tightly?

This can't be an insurmountable problem, and TBH I'm really surprised the manufacturers aren't helping more - they ought at least to be interested in why it's slipping, and to offer a solution. IMHO, you're being fobbed-off with the comment about the shaft encoder (or whatever it is)...


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## wizer (13 Mar 2010)

I've only skimmed these replies, will come back later when my brain is wired up right. Eric, that looks like a reasonable solution.

I spoke with Nick (JetMan) at Ally Pally today and he genuinely has not seen this before on any UK unit. He will be actively looking at ways to fix it and will send out an engineer if needs be. We both agreed that I first need to irradiate as much vibration as possible. i.e we need to try it off the wheeled base.

Going forward, if the problem still persists then the only option is to retrofit a solution.


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## Chems (13 Mar 2010)

Eric The Viking":3td6z4vp said:


>




The Thicknessing height handle comes out at an angle on the 260. 






Borrowed that from Wobblyclogs but you can see the angle just about.


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## would not (13 Mar 2010)

If the central column has a threaded hole in it to take the locking shaft I'd try and get the parts to retro fit the locking handle.
Looking at the drawings again the locking handle is basically a screw that pushes a brass or plastic part to lock the shaft.

There's only two fix's to your problem stop the height adjustment handle moving or lock the table shaft (335) in the bore of (331).


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## rileytoolworks (13 Mar 2010)

misterfish":1zysc2e6 said:


> I have the same problem with my Record 'Former RD 26'. I now feed the stock into the thicknesser and then hold the height control crank handle to stop it rotating. It's a right pain in the ar**! I would also like to know how to 'stiffen it up'
> 
> Misterfish



VIAGRA :wink: :wink: :wink:


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## Eric The Viking (14 Mar 2010)

Chems":d2fow4kp said:


> The Thicknessing height handle comes out at an angle on the 260.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



That's a pain. You could still do it, just about, but it's not very simple, and very much depends on what's behind the end panel. 's a shame.


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## dickm (14 Mar 2010)

On my elderly Lurem, there is a tapped hole through the side of the collar that holds the axle of the adjusting handle. There's a bent, threaded rod passes through that and (presumably) bears on a pad which presses against the axle. If that's not tightened up, the table does sink a bit in use, but it's an almost instant job to loosen/tighten the lock between adjustments to the depth of cut.
Not suggesting you should do this, but I'm guessing you could make something similar for your m/c?


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## Karl (18 Mar 2010)

Well, my machine too has started exhibiting the problems which Tom has identified. I thicknessed about 50 components, and noticed (on the final pass through the thicknesser :evil: ) that the depth of cut had dropped by about 0.25mm between the first and last pieces. 

Surely the parts must be available from Jet to get the table locking mechanism retro-fitted. 

Cheers

Karl (cheesed off)


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## wizer (18 Mar 2010)

As I said above, I can't help feeling a little responsible for this. I've sung the praises of this machine since I got it and really believed it was a good machine. My profuse apologies to all whom got this machine off my recommendation. I hope this isn't a problem on all machines and just a niggle with a few.

I have still not had a chance to get out there and fit the new blades. Taking it off of the wheel kit will be interesting if not impossible. But I might be able to jack\wedge it up some how. 

Maybe tomorrow, if the moon is aligned with Jupiter...


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## Ed68 (18 Mar 2010)

Wizer,
If its any help I also have the Jet 260 and it sits in a Dakota mobile base that lowers onto rubber feet once you've positioned it, and when I went to look for the part number it happens to be reduced in price from £49.00 to £29.99. (PS I've no connection to Rutlands or any other shops)
It may be more stable than ones constantly on 4 wheels.

I've had it a few years with no problems so far, I also fitted the digital height thing due to this thread did a few hours thicknessing some timber I bought with no movement from the handle. From time to time I do check the chain tension and adjust as required also oil it taking care not to get any on the rubber belts. 

I hope theres a fix soon


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## wizer (18 Mar 2010)

Cheers Ed. Mine is also in the same Dakota wheeled base. It's my floor that's the problem.

It's good to hear you've not had any problems. But do keep an eye on it.


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## dicktimber (18 Mar 2010)

Karl
0.25mm is only 10thou!

I think we should have some perspective put into this problem.
If you took a cut of 4 or 5 mm on 50 pieces for instance 8 inches long you are going to get some sort of clunk as the wood exits the cutters and rollers.IMO
and 50 pieces???

I bet there would be very little slippage if the final cut was half a mil (20 thou).....

never the less as i said earlier we are debating this problem and trying to fix this problem on a piece of kit which costs in excess of £1000, when it is only just out of warranty, and been used only lightly,and not as a production machine.

It's about time that the manufactures are brought in and held to account as they have told me they are aware of this problem, and the only recourse is to fit the digital height adjuster. Which is intended to do what exactly?

Having said that Iam not having any problems at the moment.
I take several small cuts, max 1.00mm, because with these super saws we are all buying, the accuracy of them lets you cut to within a few mm before planing.
At any rate it is something that needs sorting out and by the manufacturers IMO.

SO TOM get on the phone!!!! :wink: :wink: :wink:


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## Karl (18 Mar 2010)

Dick - I understand your point. But think about this.

All the pieces thicknessed were the rails and stiles for some kitchen doors. If they are not all uniform thickness, then setting out for further machining becomes much more difficult. 

The "final cut" I took was 0.5mm, not 4 or 5mm. I generally don't take more than 1mm off in any one pass at any rate (once i've got past the rough sawn face).

Movement of that level is not acceptable IMO.

Cheers

Karl


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## 9fingers (18 Mar 2010)

IF someone will post the detailed pics i asked for then i'm happy to help find a solution. 

I too am mystified by any improvement that the digital readout can offer so pics of that will be helpful too

Bob


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## Karl (18 Mar 2010)

Hi Bob

I'd missed your request - pics below.


























Let me know if you want any more shots.

Cheers

Karl


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## 9fingers (18 Mar 2010)

Thank Karl.

Do you know where the digital readout goes? Anything to do with the vacant tapped hole above the handwheel shaft?

I think Tom has the readout on his - maybe he could chip in?

Bob


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## wizer (18 Mar 2010)

give me ten mins...


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## dicktimber (18 Mar 2010)

Karl

BUT TEN THOU OVER 50 Pieces IMO is bu...all..
An orbital sand will make a bigger variance when sanding
granted it should *not *happen.

Will you be contacting the manufacturer?


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## dicktimber (18 Mar 2010)

15 mins Tom where are you!!!!!! :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## wizer (18 Mar 2010)

ooops got way laid by the temptation of desert....






















Maybe it's because I bought The Limited Edition Wood Whisperer Machine?






:lol:


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## Karl (18 Mar 2010)

dicktimber":2zjejhwj said:


> Will you be contacting the manufacturer?



Yes - i'll be sending them an e-mail in the morning.


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## dicktimber (18 Mar 2010)

Karl
PM sent


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## 9fingers (18 Mar 2010)

That readout has really got in the way with what I was thinking of doing.

I wonder how much scope there is for fitting a block say 1/2" thick behind the readout?
i.e. is there enough shaft protruding to still allow the handwheel to grip the shaft adequately. 

Sorry to put the pressure on Tom but could you check how much of a gap yours will tolerate.

Bob


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## wizer (18 Mar 2010)

I'll try tomorrow Bob.


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## 9fingers (18 Mar 2010)

Thanks Tom

have another pudding eh? :lol: :lol: 

Cheers

Bob


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## wizer (18 Mar 2010)

hehe, you don't want to know what that delay was for


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## Aled Dafis (18 Mar 2010)

I thought you had a bad back? :wink: :wink:


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## wizer (18 Mar 2010)

haha that's very funny Aled. If only. No this was an altogether more uncomfortable situation. I'll say no more on the subject... :lol:


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## would not (18 Mar 2010)

I still think the problem is they have removed the locking lever, which I recon would not be too difficult to retro fit.
The lowering and lifting mech uses bevel gears that will bounce off one another and cause movement, someone said it uses worm drive but from the drawings it's clear it doesn't use.

I can't see what the fuss is about, I have a fox p/t and I managed to get that to cut within 0.1mm over the full width and it will repeat the size all day. 
If you want Tom I'll do you a swap? :lol:


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## wizer (18 Mar 2010)

Sure, I'll throw in a bandsaw and tablesaw too!


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## newt (19 Mar 2010)

As I said earlier the digital readout will tell you how much it has dropped, I cant see it can be a cure, unless the handel rubs against the readout.


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## Karl (19 Mar 2010)

I've e-mailed Jet direct and asked them if they can supply the table locking bits. 

I'll update you all once I receive a response.

Cheers

Karl


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## 9fingers (19 Mar 2010)

I've added a review of this machine on the Axi site.

It will be interesting to see if they publish it.

I think it is only fair that prospective purchasers are given the information.

The text I entered was:-

This otherwise excellent machine is let by not having a lock on the thicknessing table. Once the machine has had some use, the table can work itself down thus giving a variable cut. The manufacturers have been made aware but to date (march 2010) are not doing anything about it.
The lock is fitted to the larger models but presumably omitted on grounds of cost. Shame on you Jet.

Bob


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## newt (19 Mar 2010)

Bob you have left out a _*down *_in the first sentence, otherwise good move to assess response.


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## 9fingers (19 Mar 2010)

I think readers will be able to decode it though!

Bob


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## wizer (19 Mar 2010)

I had some time when daughter had her nap time today. The new knives were set and I took some pics here. The diameter of the shaft that the digi readout fits over is 20mm and the smaller section is 14mm with a flat for the wheel to lock on to.

After setting the new knives and giving everything a brush an dust I turned it on and let it idle for a bit to see if the problem still existed. It does, but it is not as bad. That's probably just because it was idling rather than eating bits of wood. It might also have been because I had the machine a bit further out into the room that normal (so I could get around the back. I also noticed that the pins that hold the fence to it's bracket had worked loose, so I put them back. This problem is definitely enhanced by vibration. But looking at it today, there's no way I can get it off the base on my own. Wedges?


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## 9fingers (19 Mar 2010)

So does the digital readout unit cover all the 20mm section of shaft?

How far can the handwheel be slid back away from the digital readout and yet still allow the set screw to grip the shaft properly.

Bob


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## wizer (19 Mar 2010)

grr I was all comfy then 







yes the digi readout takes up all the 20mm section. I can slide the wheel forward by about 8mm (couldn't get the calipers in there).


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## 9fingers (19 Mar 2010)

OK Thanks Tom and apologies for disturbing you.

I'll need to make an adaptor for machines with the readout as well as the brake mechanism which will fit the standard machines alone.

I might need some measurements of the collar on Karl's machine but we can sort those out later.

I'm off on holiday tomorrow and will get back onto this when I get back.

Then and subject to your approval, I'll ask you to send me the readout unit which will give me a pattern for most of the dimensions I need. In a few days I should be able to return you a kit of parts to evaluate.
Assuming all is well I can then handle requests from others who want a kit for their machine.

How does that sound??

Bob


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## wizer (19 Mar 2010)

Sounds absolutely brilliant to me Bob. Thanks very much.

Have a good time.


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## dicktimber (21 Mar 2010)

Tom, Bob,
just received the digital read out which the manufacturers sent free of charge and say it will fix the problem.
I thought there might be some engineering change to it to solve the problem, but it is exactly the same as the one in your photos.

Will be interested to see what bob comes up with.

In the meantime I will re email the manufacturers and tell them that this is not a fix, and see if they have a retro fit.......

will let you know what they say


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## wizer (21 Mar 2010)

I really don't see how it can be a fix, unless I am affixing it wrong?


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## dicktimber (21 Mar 2010)

After messing about with it I agree, it is not a fix at all.  

will keep you posted.


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## wizer (21 Mar 2010)

It just fits over the shaft and a grub screw secures it so that it can rotate the numbers. There's absolutely nothing about it that would prevent the wheel from moving backwards. I'm surprised that they are essentially trying to fob you off with such a 'solution'. Keep complaining dick, I bet you get a new machine out of it and I'll have to pay Bob to fix mine :roll:


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## dicktimber (21 Mar 2010)

Yeh, and pigs will fly :roll:


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## Shrubby (21 Mar 2010)

Tom
Could you rig a lock to work on the guide bar running down from the table into the body of the machine(next to the height scale)
Cooksley thicknessers have this.
A quick test with scraps of wood and G clamp would prove whether this works on the Jet
Matt


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## Karl (24 Mar 2010)

Had a reply from Brimarc (Jet had forwarded my e-mail onto them) offering me a, you guessed it, digital height gauge.

Actually, not offering it, but suggesting that I contact them if I would like to buy one. :roll: 

I've sent a polite e-mail back declining the offer as I don't see it as a fix to the fault, and asking if I could have an answer to my original question of whether the the table locking parts fitted to the 310 are available separately to be retro-fitted to the 260.

I'll let you know when I get a response.

Cheers

Karl


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## dicktimber (24 Mar 2010)

Karl, Tom

Had a reply from the factory today from Tech director, after asking again what he was doing to fix the problem.
He apologises for the delay and says he has passed the problem to the engineering dept.
He says it will take a little time, and to be patient, but they are working on it.

I still have nothing back from Axminster and have to say Nick from Jet has gone quiet on this one.

Seems to be a standard, 'hope it shuts 'em,' up offering the digital read out, doesn't it?
Will keep you informed.
If you need the guys e mail address let me know.


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## wizer (24 Mar 2010)

Thanks Dick. Let us know how you get on. I know Nick said he was very busy with shows at the moment and not in the office much. There is probably a limit to mow much Jet UK (Brimarc\Axi) can do. It's a manufacturing fault at the end of the day.


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## dicktimber (24 Mar 2010)

I understand what you are saying Tom, problem is that if I am not mistaken, and I stand to be corrected if I am mistaken, the seller is the responsible party if goods are not not fit for purpose.

I don't know how long the 260 has been on the market, but if it is a recent introduction, say three or four years, then this problem could only just be surfacing, with time and usage.
If this model is sold in the US, I would expect them to get it sorted out ASAP, because of the possible ramifications.
It is also rated as TRADE by axminster, and this should not be happening on a Trade rated M/c.


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## llangatwgnedd (24 Mar 2010)

Do you know if they are they talking about this design fault on American forums?

To stop it walking, try putting a elastic luggage strap from the bottom of the height adjustment wheel, to the bottom edge of the panel below.


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## wizer (24 Mar 2010)

You're probably right Dick. I've never owned anything that was expensive enough to make such a fuss about. But I couldn't afford to replace this so whatever happens it needs to be fixed. I'm happy to go with Bob's retrofit invention if it's cheap and quick. I'm all for kicking up a fuss, but I've got no beef with Jet or Axminster. I think it's highly unlikely they will 'recall' all the 260's and I also doubt they would suggest modifying their machines with kit that wasn't designed for them. 'Getting on their case' might help to change the design, but will probably raise the price. I'd be happy to send an email to Jet to 'reinforce' the problem and let them know there's more than one person with the problem. PM me their email addy Dick. Although, if Jet and Axi aren't reading this thread, then they're really out of touch with their customers. This place is basically free marketing and R&D for woodworking companies!


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## wizer (24 Mar 2010)

Sawdust Producer":14eykqp1 said:


> To stop it walking, try putting a elastic luggage strap from the bottom of the height adjustment wheel, to the bottom edge of the panel below.



That's not a bad idea. To be honest, my initial fix is fine for now. That is, using a small plank of wood between the floor and the wheel and a G-Cramp. But it's not the sort of fix I'd like to do permanently. Despite the 'tolerances' thread, I still want all 40 pieces to be as close to 15mm as possible, or should I say as close to being equal thicknesses.


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## 9fingers (29 Mar 2010)

wizer":ty46r1dz said:


> It just fits over the shaft and a grub screw secures it so that it can rotate the numbers. There's absolutely nothing about it that would prevent the wheel from moving backwards. I'm surprised that they are essentially trying to fob you off with such a 'solution'. Keep complaining dick, I bet you get a new machine out of it and I'll have to pay Bob to fix mine :roll:



Hey Tom! I told you that I would not charge you for the mods to try and improve your planer!!!!

After all, you will be being my guinea pig for the design.

pm sent to make the arrangements.

Bob


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## dicktimber (29 Mar 2010)

Bob
you should get a patent on it and sell it back to Jet :wink: :wink: :lol: :lol:


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## dicktimber (9 Apr 2010)

Just to let you know nothing from Jet engineers yet.
Will wait till next week and re e mail them.
Have you heard anything?


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## 9fingers (9 Apr 2010)

I now have a design for a locking system with optional parts for versions with and without the digital readout.

I expect to start cutting metal over the weekend. If successful, I will be offering kits of parts to forum members.

Watch this space.

Bob


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## wizer (9 Apr 2010)

Sorry Bob I haven't got the pic you asked for yet. Are none of the previous ones of any use? I'm at Yandles tomorrow so I'll try to get pics on Sunday.

Thanks for all your help thus far.


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## Karl (9 Apr 2010)

dicktimber":bveg1qmi said:


> Just to let you know nothing from Jet engineers yet.
> Will wait till next week and re e mail them.
> Have you heard anything?



I haven't heard anything either DT.

Cheers

Karl


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## 9fingers (9 Apr 2010)

wizer":1jcqkskj said:


> Sorry Bob I haven't got the pic you asked for yet. Are none of the previous ones of any use? I'm at Yandles tomorrow so I'll try to get pics on Sunday.
> 
> Thanks for all your help thus far.



Don't worry Tom I have got the info I asked you for by other means.

Hope you have a good day at Yandles.

Bob


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## wizer (9 Apr 2010)

Karl":2nzvvr2i said:


> dicktimber":2nzvvr2i said:
> 
> 
> > Just to let you know nothing from Jet engineers yet.
> ...



I emailed the address that Dick gave me and was bluntly ignored. It seems they are now just ignoring this problem. Probably cheaper to act like it's not happening.


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## eoinsgaff (10 Apr 2010)

I've been following this post with interest. I noted 'Jetman' offering assistance. Did he get back to you?

I'm in the market for a quality PT and this forum will help me decide weather or not to splash the cash on a Hammer machine rather than a Jet one. 

Eoin


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## 9fingers (10 Apr 2010)

eoinsgaff":1miw0yrw said:


> I've been following this post with interest. I noted 'Jetman' offering assistance. Did he get back to you?
> 
> I'm in the market for a quality PT and this forum will help me decide weather or not to splash the cash on a Hammer machine rather than a Jet one.
> 
> Eoin



These Jet machines have lots of good points and on the 12" and above, have the table lock. It is only the 260 /10" that lets the brand down as far as I can see. If i were buying I'd get the 12" or 14" Jet.

Bob


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## Karl (10 Apr 2010)

wizer":slh8xqae said:


> Karl":slh8xqae said:
> 
> 
> > dicktimber":slh8xqae said:
> ...



I'm corresponding direct with Brimarc who, in turn, are liaising with the manufacturer.

I'm going to send a follow up e-mail on Monday.

Cheers

Karl


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## 9fingers (11 Apr 2010)

I have just finished machining the prototype locking mechanism for the Jet 260.







The allen screw will be replaced with a Bristol lever that is on order due Tuesday. When that comes in I will send it all off to Wizer to give it a test drive on his machine.

Subject to his findings, I may need to do some fine tuning to the design and then I will offer kits to forum members.

Watch this space

Bob


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## 9fingers (20 Apr 2010)

Wizer has now had a chance to evaluate the modification kit that I sent him.

There are a small number of changes that I need to make to dimensions etc but the good news is

IT WORKS!!

Wizer spent over an hour thicknessing boards and the table has stayed locked.

Here is a photo taken by Wizer of the fitted kit.






I'm checking with the Mods if I will be allowed to offer the kits on the forum so watch this space once I have had the benefit of their advice.

Bob


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## wizer (20 Apr 2010)

Yep I was going to give a full report when we'd finished testing. Today I thicknessed over thirty boards roughly 150mm x 400mm and the table didn't budge. The way that Bob has designed the lock makes it a doddle to lock it when you've set the depth. I want to test it some more before I can give it the WiZeR Seal of Approval  But so far so good. With new knives and a little maintenance, the machine and I have made friends again and I'm now feeling pretty positive about it once again. Today's results where flawless!


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## wizer (3 May 2010)

So here's a little write up of how Bob's solution to the Jet 260's thicknesser table problem. As a reminder of the problem. The table would very gradually fall over lengthy periods of use.

To start with I had to remove the hand wheel and, in my case, the digital gauge. If you don't have the digi-gauge then you need to remove the dial.











The first part in Bob's kit is a shaft extender. This is only needed if you have a digital height gauge. If not, just skip this step.






The shaft extender is secured in place by two grub screws. These are ever-so slightly proud of the surface and need light filing to make them flush.






Some filing of the extender itself maybe required to flush it with the shaft. Not much.






Then the planer lock is fitted over the shaft and a pin locates on the machine body.






If you don't have the digital height gauge, all you now need to do is replace the dial and secure, then fit the hand wheel.






If you have the digital gauge then it needs to be slipped over the shaft and located in a pre-drilled hole on the lock body.






Now the hand wheel can be replaced and the digi-gauge setup as per the manual. 

In use, to lock the table at the set depth, just tighten the lever up until it just bites.






.. and to unlock, just flick it down.






... set your depth, lock and so on.



It really is simplicity and works incredibly well. I've now had it three weeks and used it a great deal to prepare about 50 boards of mainly sycamore 120mm x 400mm. The dial doesn't move a thou! 

I Can't thank Bob enough for taking the time to help me with this. I believe Bob is interested in helping others out. Send him a PM if you have a problem with your Jet JTS-260


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## jimi43 (4 May 2010)

Nice one Bob!

Classy piece of engineering!

Jim


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## Boz62 (4 May 2010)

Nice Bob, a very elegant engineering solution 

Boz


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## woodbloke (4 May 2010)

Bob - excellent. This little mod has clearly moved the machine up into the realms of it's bigger brothers - Rob


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## wobblycogs (4 May 2010)

Excellent work Bob and a great review from Wizer too. I've not managed to get my 260 up and running yet but I could well be in the market for one of these in the future. Such a simple, elegant solution to a tricky problem. I had a look at mine to see if I could think of a simple solution should I suffer this problem in the future.

Bob, perhaps it's worth approaching Jet / Brimark to see if they want to buy the design? I'm sure there are probably plenty of people suffering this problem and only a tiny number will see this forum.


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## wizer (4 May 2010)

To be honest, even if you haven't noticed the problem yet, I'd still buy the lock. IMHO you need to lock a thicknessing table on any machine. I don't understand why my machine started doing it, but it must be due to wear and tear. If the lock was there from the start, perhaps those parts wouldn't have worn?


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## stevebuk (4 May 2010)

pleased to hear you got it sorted tom, will this lock be a one size fits all affair, or is it only for the jet, and lastly are you making any other model locks available??
I only have a sip 6" P/T.


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## 9fingers (4 May 2010)

Hi Steve,

Sorry but this design is exclusively for the Jet 260 P/T.

Bob


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