# How to Line Boxes & Drawers



## custard

Properly lining boxes or drawers, ideally with suede but many fabrics are also suitable, totally transforms the item, adding a great deal of value and hugely lifting the perception of quality. Furthermore, for many applications, such as jewellery, musical instruments, valuable writing instruments, coins, etc, it's pretty much mandatory to provide the client with a neatly lined compartment.

However, even though I see lots of boxes on this forum it's rare that I'll see a properly lined box. The irony is that it's all quite straightforward and it doesn't require much in the way of specialist tools or techniques. Don't get me wrong, if you're slapdash or rush the job it'll look rubbish, but if you're patient and methodical (and if you're not then the hard truth is that you're never going to make much progress with woodworking) then you can genuinely expect to produce fully professional results.

So if you'd like to learn how to go from this,







to this,






or to this,






then read on and I'll show you how I go about the task. You'll probably be surprised at how simple it is.

First let's look at the tools and materials that you'll need.

Personally I prefer to use good quality pig suede. It's widely available from any leather merchant, although if you want to buy on line you can easily find it on Ebay,

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PIG-SKIN-SUED ... rkt%3D1%26

You should look for suede that's about 0.5mm thick. Much thicker and the folds won't be clean, much thinner and it'll stretch and crease or wear through too quickly. I'd advise you to get an entire skin which usually comes in at about 8-10 sq foot. This will give you plenty for three or four boxes complete with a lift out tray, so in terms of material costs it'll cost you about £7-£10 to line a box with suede. You will find stuff cheaper than this, especially if you buy part skins, but I'd strongly advise you to give it a miss. If you run out of materials part way through then you really are stuffed, you're unlikely to get an accurate colour match from one piece to another and the skin and dye quality on the cheaper scraps can be very poor. This advice also holds true for materials like felt, stay well away from the really cheap stuff, it's just a frustrating false economy.

You'll also need some decent quality card that is about 175-200 gsm, look for something smooth and white. The ideal card will come in at about 0.3mm thick. Anything thicker is unnecessary as it will be fully supported by being glued to the substrate of the box, and if it's much thicker then it'll add to the problems of accurate cutting. You'll get smaller boxes out of A4 card stock, but for larger boxes you'll need A3.

The final materials you'll need are double sided tape (ideally in both 50mm or 75mm width and also in 12mm or 15mm width) and some Copydex adhesive. Don't try using PVA, the moisture content will cause too much wrinkling and ruin your work. I'd also recommend that if your Copydex is more than a year old then replace with fresh, old Copydex goes stringy and is a pain to use.

In terms of tools you really don't need much, you can see pretty much everything you'll need in this photo,






An A3 self healing cutting mat is really useful, not just because it protects your bench and is kind on your tools, but also because of the accurate grid pattern printed on the surface which will really help you cut square and avoid gaps. You'll need a decent straight edge (Axminster do a good value one), personally I use both a thick heavy 600mm cutting straight edge and also a heavy 300mm ruler. I find it really useful to use double stick tape to attach some 240 grit abrasive paper to the backs of your cutting straight edges, that helps hold them stable on suede, fabrics, and card, which can otherwise slip and ruin your work as well as endangering your fingers! The final thing you'll need is a scalpel together with plenty of replacement blades. I normally go through at least four or five blades when lining a box. As soon as the blade stops cutting really cleanly then change it immediately. if you don't you'll regret it, as it will drag and ruck up the suede causing ragged cuts. You can re-hone scalpel blades, but given how cheap they are if you buy in bulk I don't see the point. The only critical thing is never use a blunt blade. You may want to wear safety goggles when using or changing blades, remember they can and do break or spring off. They're your eyes so it's your choice.

Next post I'll go through the actual lining process.


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## banjerbill

Interesting post Custard, I await the next installment with anticipation.

Bill


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## dynax

Thanks Custard, very useful post, and timely for some projects i am considering,


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## MrTeroo

Thanks for this walkthrough. Very useful.

I'm reading it in the voice of Lesley Judd, so if you could include a 'here's one I made earlier' somewhere in the text, it would be much appreciated


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## custard

The fundamental principle in lining is that you never attach the lining material directly to the box or drawer, in other words you don't "wallpaper" the inside of your box. Suede or fabric is just too floppy to allow this to be done accurately, so you always attach the suede to card with double sided tape in order to stiffen it up and allow really precise cutting to size, and then you glue the card/suede composite in place with Copydex. 

In one or two sentences that's pretty much the entire secret to successful box lining!

Let's go through a typical job in more detail. 

The starting point is to take your 0.3mm thick card and completely cover one side in double sided tape, which is why 50mm or 75mm wide tape is a big advantage, in fact if you get really serious about lining you'll probably want to get the product that picture framers use, dry transfer tape which comes in 300mm wide rolls. Leave the backing paper on, in fact some people go over the backing paper with a roller to press it down hard on the card and ensure a really good bond.

Then you accurately measure the base of your box and transfer those measurements to your card, trim it to size with your scalpel and offer it up to fit in the base of your box. Do all of this _before_ removing the backing paper. You're looking for a really accurate fit and to that end it's useful to put a pencil cross on the card indicating where the back or hinge edge should be. This is in case the box is fractionally off from square. You certainly don't want the card bunching up if it's too large in any dimension, but you can get away with it being about 0.2mm or 0.3mm undersize as the side linings will cover any small gaps. Aim for perfection but tolerate the merest sliver of a gap all around.

Next you should lay out your suede pig skin. It will have a slightly rougher side which is the glue side, and a smoother side which is the show face. Check it carefully for blemishes and holes and avoid these. You also need to be aware that on any pig skin the areas around the neck, groin, and arm pits will likely be slightly thinner and _much_ stretchier. These more stretchy, elastic areas are very useful if you need to cover 3D shapes like buffer pieces for musical instruments or even ring traps in a jewellery box, so you'll probably want to save these areas for those specific applications.

Then layout your pig skin on a clean flat surface such as your self healing cutting mat (suede holds dust so hoover your bench before starting) show face down/glue face up. Don't overly stretch it, just smooth it flat. Remove the backing paper from the double sided tape and lay the card glue side down on top of the suede, press it flat with a roller or burnisher. Now all you have to is cut through the suede with your scalpel at the exact edge of the card, personally I lay the straight edge on the card and bump it along until it's precisely in line with the card edge. You should be able to cut through 0.5mm suede with a single stroke without pressing too hard. If you're not familiar with a scalpel you should definitely practise with some suede off-cuts until you've got the feel of it. If you see bits of adhesive stuck to the scalpel blade then clean them off or change the blade, because otherwise these will drag the suede and cause a ragged cut.

Next you put a thin coat of Copydex on the card, working all around the edges and a few dabs in the middle. Try and stay about 3mm away from the edges and use thin coats of Copydex not thick blobs. This is critical as any squeeze out which gets onto the suede ruins the job, so be slow and methodical during application, you'll have a few minutes before the Copydex cures so there's no particular rush. Finally carefully lay the card into the box, pressing it down with clean (Copydex free!) hands, respecting the pencil cross orientation you previously marked to show the back or hinge edge.

The next job is to line one pair of opposite sides. And here the method changes slightly. On the base you just have a layer of suede on top of the card. On the sides you need to wrap the suede around the top edge of the card. 

You start by measuring the width of the inside of the box precisely and cutting your card accordingly. However, the height of the card needs adjusting for the folded over suede. So check the suede thickness with a calliper and if it's 0.5mm thick suede then cut the card 0.5mm _less_ than the measured height. Test fit your card in the box, and if looks good then remove the backing paper from the double sided tape and attach the card to a slightly oversize piece of suede, you'll need about 25mm of overhang at the top for the fold over. Put a strip of double sided tape on the reverse side of the card to take the fold over, this is where it's useful to have some 12 or 15mm wide tape as well as the 50 or 75mm wide roll you used previously. This is what the job should look like now,






Trim the edges of the suede so they're flush with the card, note that the lines on the cutting mat are a great help in ensuring you're square,






Then trim the corners off the top flap of suede as shown, this is because the suede will stretch as you fold it over and smooth it down and you don't want an overhang (although if you do get and overhang you can always trim it off).






Remove the backing paper from the double sided tape and you're ready to stick down the flooded over flap of suede on the reverse of the card.






Now for a really critical tip, either fold over the card and lay it flat (my preference), or if you choose to fold over the suede then you absolutely must start in the centre and work out towards each end. See the following photo, I promise you that if start at one end you'll be in a complete mess by the time you reach the other end!


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## custard

Next job is to offer up this card/suede composite to the box and check the fit. You want it snug from side to side (but not bowing out because it's too wide) and you want it uniformly flush along the top edge. You can live with it being 0.2-0.3mm less wide as the next lining pieces will cover any gaps. But it is absolutely essential that these side pieces do not protrude above the sides of the box because if they do the lid won't close! So, aim for flush, but tolerate anything up to 0.2-0.3mm below the top. This is such an important step that you must do this test fit with each piece, and if it does protrude above the top trim the card by a whisker at the bottom. 

Now that the suede/card is precisely sized there's one more job before gluing it in place. The card is now thicker at the top than at the bottom because of the folded over suede. It has to be folded over because otherwise you'd see the edge of the card which would look awful! Astonishingly the eye can discern this difference in thickness so you need to attach balancing strips of suede at the bottom, and if the box is taller than about three inches, in the middle as well. It's an easy task and you can use up any damaged or soiled off-cuts of suede. Use double sided tape. This is what the job should look like when the balancing piece is attached, incidentally, you can see the abrasive paper attached to the reverse of my cutting straight edge in this photo.






I'd give one more test fit and then apply the Copydex, again staying 3mm away from the edges and applying only thin coats to prevent squeeze out. This is what it should look like with Copydex applied.






Apply this piece and this is how things will appear,






You're in the home straight now!

Follow exactly the same procedure to line the opposite side. Then move on the the final two sides. These final sides will be your last chance to cover any tiny gaps, so I measure very carefully and even then will often cut slightly over wide and progressively cut back with a fresh scalpel blade until it's a really snug fit.






On the lid I'll have sometimes used a highly decorative veneer on both the interior and exterior (the base is normally ply or MDF covered with a fairly utilitarian veneer), so I'd then just line the lid edges. But if the lid interior veneer is nothing special then I'd line that with suede too, see the photos at the very beginning of this thread for examples of both. 

The same technique is used for lining a lift out tray, because the tray sides are so narrow you can sometimes save time by making up the tray side linings double width and then slicing them down to size.

One thing worth mentioning though is that a lift out tray will need some support. There are many different methods of achieving this, but one of the simplest is to use double stick tape to attach a 6mm thick strip of MDF to the card running from the bottom to whatever height you want the base of the lift out tray to be. It's normal practise to size this so the lift out tray sits proud of the box base, in other words it's partly housed inside the lid. You have to be careful to align the MDF precisely with the bottom edge of the card, and you have to be even more careful to fold the suede carefully over the card and the MDF support without any creases, but it's perfectly possible and it works a treat. You would do this on the final part of linings that you attach in the box, so you'd probably do the long sides first then finish with the two short sides.

Good luck!


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## MusicMan

Many thanks, Custard for a wonderful tutorial!

Keith


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## ColeyS1

That's a great guide ! Looking forward go having a go at it now. Thanks Custard 

Coley

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


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## Sailormantom

Many thanks for taking the time to show the techniques so thoroughly

Regards, Tom


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## Alexam

A superb layout tha i easy to follow. I have kept a copy for reference later. Many thanks Custard.
This should be a STICKEY ?


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## galleywood

Custard

Could you please clarify the last paragraph of your second post with some pictures.
Thanks


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## Chris152

Thanks for posting this - my first real project is a jewellery box for my daughter and I'll be following your advice closely - perfect timing!


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## Tealeaf

Great post on something I have never tried. Thanks for the tips!


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## Racers

Nice work custard.

My tip is to use Hemostats/clamps when changing the scalpel blades.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Surgical-Hemo ... SwiDFYRHDg


Pete


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## Blockplane

Can l second the request for this to be a sticky, please.


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## SVB

Great post. 

This is just the method I was taught when I did my box making with Andrew Crawford and is really worth the effort to to made a good box in the eyes of fellow cabinetmakers truly superb in the eyes of everyone. 

https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/box-making-course-review-t32335.html?hilit=Andrew Crawford

https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums...ots-of-pics-t36834.html?hilit=Andrew Crawford


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## SteveF

Thankyou Custard
Really appreciate your spent time on this

one question though, Is it attached to bare wood?
will the copydex stick to a finish?

Steve


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## devonwoody

Thanks Custard, you make me feel so young. :wink:


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## woodbrains

Hello,

Many thanks Custard, an excellent set of posts!

Mike.


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## custard

SVB":1ir10j3z said:


> Great post.
> 
> This is just the method I was taught when I did my box making with Andrew Crawford



It's pretty much the same method I was taught when I first trained as an antique restorer and cabinet maker about forty years ago. The fundamental principle is that you almost never attach fabric or fine leather direct to timber, there are one or two small exceptions (such as the skiver to a writing table, although even there it's sometimes canvass backed). I've replaced silk drawer linings in Georgian furniture and found them wrapped around ancient book end plates and all manner of scavenged card!

It's also pretty much the method that's used today by the amazing craftsmen and women who fit out super yachts, which is one of the hot beds of high end British craftsmanship today. There's a developing design trend towards having fairly plain and unassuming furniture exteriors but with dazzlingly sumptuous interiors. I think we'll see a resurgence in elaborate linings and personally I'm very much looking forward to it.


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## custard

SteveF":31e8ev3x said:


> Thankyou Custard
> Really appreciate your spent time on this
> 
> one question though, Is it attached to bare wood?
> will the copydex stick to a finish?
> 
> Steve



I always work on bare wood but I guess Copydex might stick to many finishes, I'd recommend testing first though. 

The general principle with boxes is that you do all the finishing before lining, maybe a final exterior wax is left until afterwards but no more than that because getting finish on lining would ruin it. If there was a risk of finish getting on glue surfaces I'd normally just mask it off.


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## custard

Racers":7e62w42o said:


> Nice work custard.
> 
> My tip is to use Hemostats/clamps when changing the scalpel blades.
> 
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Surgical-Hemo ... SwiDFYRHDg
> 
> 
> Pete




Wise advice, personally I use pliers but it's the same principle.


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## custard

galleywood":2sb5hec4 said:


> Custard
> 
> Could you please clarify the last paragraph of your second post with some pictures.
> Thanks



If you look at the penultimate photo you can see the shiny band of double sided tape (after removing the backing band), and you can see the flap of suede waiting to be pressed down onto it. There are two ways of going about this. Firstly you can fold over the card (therefore pressing the double stick tape down onto the suede), or secondly you can fold over the suede (therefore pressing the suede down onto the double stick tape).

In a simple situation like that photographed my preference is to fold over the card. However, you will meet situations (for example the situation where you have an MDF strip on the card to support a lift out tray) where you have no choice but to fold over the suede. Consequently there's merit in practising folding over the suede even on a simple example like this. The key issue is this, suede (along with most fabrics that you'll likely use for lining) is stretchy, so much that it's easy to get creasing which ruins the job, that's why I emphasised starting in the middle and working out from there towards the two ends.

Hope that clears it up.


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## galleywood

Custard

Yes it does - thanks.
It was the reference to mdf to support a lift out tray that I could not follow.
Now I see it in the pic of the box with the green lining.


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## custard

galleywood":2ecayyru said:


> Custard
> 
> Yes it does - thanks.
> It was the reference to mdf to support a lift out tray that I could not follow.
> Now I see it in the pic of the box with the green lining.



Okay. Incidentally, when you're wrapping a lining around the "step" of the card and MDF support, I find it works better to approach it one "flat" at a time, I use a credit card to push the suede or felt well into the corner before laying it down across the next "flat". If you try it you'll instantly see what I mean.


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## thetyreman

great article custard, as usual very high quality content and information, I will put it to use on my next box project.


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## SteveF

sorry to ask more questions, I understand your time is precious
how would you approach my situation of cutlery box?
I am thinking of a sort of dental molding to separate the knives forks etc

Steve


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## Garno

Great post Custard and very easy to follow for a complete novice. How simple it will be to do remains to be seen, I now have my hides, copydex, card, green mat and rulers along with some double sided tape.

I have a question for you though,
Why use scalpels and not a Stanley knife? ( I don't have a scalpel ) Is it just personal choice? One thing I have learnt from your posts is that you very rarely include something that would not make a difference to the task in hand, therefore I can only assume there is some importance in using the scalpel. On the other hand I could be reading far too much into it and a Stanley knife would be fine. 

Who was that man on the grassy knoll?


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## Paul200

Funnily enough Garno, I've just been lining a jewellery box. I've done this plenty of times in the past but always used a Stanley knife. Having read Custards sticky I used a scalpel instead and I found it to be far more accurate. A Stanley knife can snag the material you're cutting - presumably a scalpel is sharper so makes the job a lot easier. (The reason I have a scalpel to hand is because I had a mate who worked in a cartographic office and he gave it to me to use when I was making very tiny ships in miniature whisky bottles :roll: - they're not expensive though)

Paul


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## MikeG.

I've been woodworking for about 40 years now, and I've never made a box! (Well, smaller than a blanket box, I mean). However, there is one on the distant horizon: a cutlery canteen. Can anyone offer any insights into the lining of a canteen? I mean, the outer lining as per custard's excellent instructions looks straightforward, but what about the fiddly stuff which actually holds the cutlery? In bought canteens this is covered in the same stuff the box is lined with, and I haven't a clue how I might set about doing that.


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## custard

I've never made a cutlery box, but I have made boxes for sextants and for musical instruments with curved support blocks, so I guess it's the same principle. With pig suede you normally reserve the parts of the skin from around the neck and armpits, these are a bit thinner and much stretchier, so they can be formed into compound curves without wrinkling.

I think cutlery boxes are often lined with felt. I'm less experienced with working with felt but I get the impression that proper wool felt (as opposed to the tat you'll find on Ebay) is also a bit more elastic and can be shaped into curves.


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## Harbo

I think Malee?? of this Parish, made one years back using spray applied felting.

Rod


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## Garno

Paul200":1dril9de said:


> Funnily enough Garno, I've just been lining a jewellery box. I've done this plenty of times in the past but always used a Stanley knife. Having read Custards sticky I used a scalpel instead and I found it to be far more accurate. A Stanley knife can snag the material you're cutting - presumably a scalpel is sharper so makes the job a lot easier. (The reason I have a scalpel to hand is because I had a mate who worked in a cartographic office and he gave it to me to use when I was making very tiny ships in miniature whisky bottles :roll: - they're not expensive though)
> 
> Paul




Thanks Paul,

That makes perfect sense, Looks like I need to get one then.

Being tight-fisted was hoping to save those precious pennies


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## JJ1

Thank you very much indeed Custard for an extremely useful and easy to follow article. Very much appreciated.


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## Myfordman

I've just finished my first box lined by Custard's method. Thanks for posting.


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## custard

Very tidy and professional result.

The hardware all looks nicely fitted too, clean and even shut lines and a smoothly operating lock that is neither pushing the lid up nor distorting the box.

=D>


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## Myfordman

Thanks for your kind words. I'm not a conventional wood worker but an engineer who machines wood as just another engineering material. Precision fits do it for me!
Apart from a screwdriver and a paint brush, not a single hand tool was used on the job.

Even the lock recess was done on a milling machine!


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## Just4Fun

I have just followed this (excellent) guide to line a box I made. Just thought I would pass on a tip re lining material, if your box is small (mine was about 250x170x100mm). I used a chamois leather which I bought from a car spares place, sold as a cleaning product. I was a bit concerned that the quality might not be good enough to line a box but it produced a nice result that I was happy with.


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## MattyT

Thanks for posting this guide. I'm going to use this method to line a large jewelry box that I'm currently making.


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## thetyreman

if you line the inside of the box, I take it you line it with suede or felt first then make the trays so they fit perfectly to that new slightly reduced size?


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## custard

thetyreman":o7orwi3x said:


> if you line the inside of the box, I take it you line it with suede or felt first then make the trays so they fit perfectly to that new slightly reduced size?



Generally yes, but if necessary you can do it "by the numbers" and pre-make the components. In that case I generally allow 0.5mm for a single thickness of top quality suede and that's always worked out pretty well for me.


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## oobaa

Thanks for the guidance... first attempt completed - really like the contrast in colour and texture that suede delivers


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## CoolNik

Congrats on a lovely box!

I live in New Zealand and we are unable to purchase Copydex. Would someone who knows what the properties of Copydex are let me know so I can choose something available here with similar features, please?
Cheers
CoolNik


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## Myfordman

I think it is just a water based latex adhesive. Often used for fabric based craft projects. 
Hth


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## CHJ

The Product description ,


> Copydex Latex Adhesive is a versatile, multi-purpose adhesive for crafts, hobbies and repairs. You can use it to stick together paper, card, fabric, leather, upholstery and carpet, making it great for home repairs and DIY projects. Because it''s latex based, Copydex is solvent-free: safer both for users and the environment.



Try a google search for alternate brands. " copydex alternative "


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## CoolNik

Thanks CHJ for the description. I think it will be quite easy to locate here.  

I will now look for the leather to finish my box.

Regards
CoolNik


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## CoolNik

custard":1o87aizo said:


> Properly lining boxes or drawers, ideally with suede but many fabrics are also suitable, totally transforms the item, adding a great deal of value and hugely lifting the perception of quality. Furthermore, for many applications, such as jewellery, musical instruments, valuable writing instruments, coins, etc, it's pretty much mandatory to provide the client with a neatly lined compartment.
> 
> However, even though I see lots of boxes on this forum it's rare that I'll see a properly lined box. The irony is that it's all quite straightforward and it doesn't require much in the way of specialist tools or techniques. Don't get me wrong, if you're slapdash or rush the job it'll look rubbish, but if you're patient and methodical (and if you're not then the hard truth is that you're never going to make much progress with woodworking) then you can genuinely expect to produce fully professional results.
> 
> So if you'd like to learn how to go from this,
> 
> 
> 
> to this,
> 
> 
> 
> or to this,
> 
> 
> 
> then read on and I'll show you how I go about the task. You'll probably be surprised at how simple it is.
> 
> First let's look at the tools and materials that you'll need.
> 
> Personally I prefer to use good quality pig suede. It's widely available from any leather merchant, although if you want to buy on line you can easily find it on Ebay,
> 
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PIG-SKIN-SUED ... rkt%3D1%26
> 
> You should look for suede that's about 0.5mm thick. Much thicker and the folds won't be clean, much thinner and it'll stretch and crease or wear through too quickly. I'd advise you to get an entire skin which usually comes in at about 8-10 sq foot. This will give you plenty for three or four boxes complete with a lift out tray, so in terms of material costs it'll cost you about £7-£10 to line a box with suede. You will find stuff cheaper than this, especially if you buy part skins, but I'd strongly advise you to give it a miss. If you run out of materials part way through then you really are stuffed, you're unlikely to get an accurate colour match from one piece to another and the skin and dye quality on the cheaper scraps can be very poor. This advice also holds true for materials like felt, stay well away from the really cheap stuff, it's just a frustrating false economy.
> 
> You'll also need some decent quality card that is about 175-200 gsm, look for something smooth and white. The ideal card will come in at about 0.3mm thick. Anything thicker is unnecessary as it will be fully supported by being glued to the substrate of the box, and if it's much thicker then it'll add to the problems of accurate cutting. You'll get smaller boxes out of A4 card stock, but for larger boxes you'll need A3.
> 
> The final materials you'll need are double sided tape (ideally in both 50mm or 75mm width and also in 12mm or 15mm width) and some Copydex adhesive. Don't try using PVA, the moisture content will cause too much wrinkling and ruin your work. I'd also recommend that if your Copydex is more than a year old then replace with fresh, old Copydex goes stringy and is a pain to use.
> 
> In terms of tools you really don't need much, you can see pretty much everything you'll need in this photo,
> 
> 
> 
> An A3 self healing cutting mat is really useful, not just because it protects your bench and is kind on your tools, but also because of the accurate grid pattern printed on the surface which will really help you cut square and avoid gaps. You'll need a decent straight edge (Axminster do a good value one), personally I use both a thick heavy 600mm cutting straight edge and also a heavy 300mm ruler. I find it really useful to use double stick tape to attach some 240 grit abrasive paper to the backs of your cutting straight edges, that helps hold them stable on suede, fabrics, and card, which can otherwise slip and ruin your work as well as endangering your fingers! The final thing you'll need is a scalpel together with plenty of replacement blades. I normally go through at least four or five blades when lining a box. As soon as the blade stops cutting really cleanly then change it immediately. if you don't you'll regret it, as it will drag and ruck up the suede causing ragged cuts. You can re-hone scalpel blades, but given how cheap they are if you buy in bulk I don't see the point. The only critical thing is never use a blunt blade. You may want to wear safety goggles when using or changing blades, remember they can and do break or spring off. They're your eyes so it's your choice.
> 
> Next post I'll go through the actual lining process.



Hi, the link in this comment to the eBay pig skin site does not work, so I searched for “pig skin suede” and got a number of responses, most of which were sites for various skins, lamb, goat etc. from India. I am happy to purchase from India if some of you chaps have had success with skins from these sorts of vendors? Also, you mention using “pig skins” - do you use anything else? Such as cow, goat, lamb? Finally, my last question, for now, I have always used white card. Do you match the card to the colour of the skin?
Many thanks for taking the time to answer my questions.
CoolNik


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## Just4Fun

On the one and only occasion I followed these (excellent) instructions I used chamois leather. I bought it from a motor spares shop; it was sold as a car washing item. Of course it was relatively small so if you have a large box to do it might not be suitable. My project was about the size of a cigar box and one skin was enough for that with little waste.


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## marcros

You want a nice soft thin material for lining. The seller that I used for pig seems to now have various other animals instead but they look fine to me. I aim for about .6mm only based on what the pigskin was and that it felt about my right. 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/124121326186

Try that link and search his other items. 

As for cardboard, the pros may use white card but I use cereal box! It doesn't show through. For a touch of luxury, I use Kellogg's rather than own branded cereals.


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## Glynne

I can recommend this supplier after Macros kindly pointed me in his direction.
Fred used to work in the leather industry and appears to have quite a stock. He did send me a few small cut offs so as I could gauge what I wanted before I fully ordered.
Be warned, regardless of your age he will call you son - and I’m a Grandad!


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## Garno

A +1 for Fred also, he is a very nice bloke and the two times I have got stuff from him he has been open to a deal. If I recall he prefers payment through the paypal "send money to relatives" service :lol:


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## Roxie

Thank you Custard for you excellent instructions. I have recently used this method to line a couple of boxes with leather and they turned out great.
Only problem I had was getting the double sided sticky tape off the rule I used with abrasive paper, great idea but...…..

Thanks again, onto another lined box.

John


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## woodhutt

Great tutorial Custard. I've never felt (no pun intended) that I had the skill to try the 'real thing' when lining boxes and have always stuck with flocking. Your post has given me the confidence to have a go.
Pete


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## Woodmouse

Excellent tutorial thank you for posting it.


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## Shibby

custard said:


> Properly lining boxes or drawers, ideally with suede but many fabrics are also suitable, totally transforms the item, adding a great deal of value and hugely lifting the perception of quality. Furthermore, for many applications, such as jewellery, musical instruments, valuable writing instruments, coins, etc, it's pretty much mandatory to provide the client with a neatly lined compartment.
> 
> However, even though I see lots of boxes on this forum it's rare that I'll see a properly lined box. The irony is that it's all quite straightforward and it doesn't require much in the way of specialist tools or techniques. Don't get me wrong, if you're slapdash or rush the job it'll look rubbish, but if you're patient and methodical (and if you're not then the hard truth is that you're never going to make much progress with woodworking) then you can genuinely expect to produce fully professional results.
> 
> So if you'd like to learn how to go from this,
> 
> View attachment 58376
> 
> 
> to this,
> 
> View attachment 58377
> 
> 
> or to this,
> 
> View attachment 58380
> 
> 
> then read on and I'll show you how I go about the task. You'll probably be surprised at how simple it is.
> 
> First let's look at the tools and materials that you'll need.
> 
> Personally I prefer to use good quality pig suede. It's widely available from any leather merchant, although if you want to buy on line you can easily find it on Ebay,
> 
> http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/PIG-SKIN-SUED ... rkt%3D1%26
> 
> You should look for suede that's about 0.5mm thick. Much thicker and the folds won't be clean, much thinner and it'll stretch and crease or wear through too quickly. I'd advise you to get an entire skin which usually comes in at about 8-10 sq foot. This will give you plenty for three or four boxes complete with a lift out tray, so in terms of material costs it'll cost you about £7-£10 to line a box with suede. You will find stuff cheaper than this, especially if you buy part skins, but I'd strongly advise you to give it a miss. If you run out of materials part way through then you really are stuffed, you're unlikely to get an accurate colour match from one piece to another and the skin and dye quality on the cheaper scraps can be very poor. This advice also holds true for materials like felt, stay well away from the really cheap stuff, it's just a frustrating false economy.
> 
> You'll also need some decent quality card that is about 175-200 gsm, look for something smooth and white. The ideal card will come in at about 0.3mm thick. Anything thicker is unnecessary as it will be fully supported by being glued to the substrate of the box, and if it's much thicker then it'll add to the problems of accurate cutting. You'll get smaller boxes out of A4 card stock, but for larger boxes you'll need A3.
> 
> The final materials you'll need are double sided tape (ideally in both 50mm or 75mm width and also in 12mm or 15mm width) and some Copydex adhesive. Don't try using PVA, the moisture content will cause too much wrinkling and ruin your work. I'd also recommend that if your Copydex is more than a year old then replace with fresh, old Copydex goes stringy and is a pain to use.
> 
> In terms of tools you really don't need much, you can see pretty much everything you'll need in this photo,
> 
> View attachment 58381
> 
> 
> An A3 self healing cutting mat is really useful, not just because it protects your bench and is kind on your tools, but also because of the accurate grid pattern printed on the surface which will really help you cut square and avoid gaps. You'll need a decent straight edge (Axminster do a good value one), personally I use both a thick heavy 600mm cutting straight edge and also a heavy 300mm ruler. I find it really useful to use double stick tape to attach some 240 grit abrasive paper to the backs of your cutting straight edges, that helps hold them stable on suede, fabrics, and card, which can otherwise slip and ruin your work as well as endangering your fingers! The final thing you'll need is a scalpel together with plenty of replacement blades. I normally go through at least four or five blades when lining a box. As soon as the blade stops cutting really cleanly then change it immediately. if you don't you'll regret it, as it will drag and ruck up the suede causing ragged cuts. You can re-hone scalpel blades, but given how cheap they are if you buy in bulk I don't see the point. The only critical thing is never use a blunt blade. You may want to wear safety goggles when using or changing blades, remember they can and do break or spring off. They're your eyes so it's your choice.
> 
> Next post I'll go through the actual lining process.


Great post. Spot on how I line my boxes.


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## Andy F

What a great tutorial. I have never done this but reading it makes me want to give it a go. 

As for making it a sticky, wouldn't this be a suitable post for the new articles section? Not sure how to get it in there though.

I will buy some scalpels when I do this, but will second the idea of changing the blades regularly. When decorating a room I use snap-off blades to cut the ends off the wallpaper along ceiling/skirting board. Even though I think the blade will still be sharp, I always snap it off between each sheet, otherwise it WILL ruck the paper up.


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## AJB Temple

Superbly useful thread. Thank you.


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## NickM

It is very helpful. I took delivery of some very fine mulberry pig suede yesterday so could well be giving this ago in the next few weeks (I need to make a box first...). I'll report back!


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## Padster

Gents,

Any current recommendations for good suppliers of 'pig skin' all current links in here no longer valid :-(

Thanks in advance

Padster


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## pe2dave

@admin - could this go in 'articles' please? Very useful
Thanks @custard

Any known online leather supplies in the UK please?


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## bjm

pe2dave said:


> Any known online leather supplies in the UK please?



You may need to be more specific


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## pe2dave

bjm said:


> You may need to be more specific



My use is for a blade strop, though I would like to try a box lining!


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## TRITON

Just noticed how old this thread is

I'll use this stitched to the box/drawer technique again, it turned out very well and had a better overall look more I think in keeping. Should it become stained or filthy, you undo the knot, pull the thread out and replace with new if you cant clean it.


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## marcros

pe2dave said:


> My use is for a blade strop, though I would like to try a box lining!



Charity shop. Buy a belt!


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## NickM

pe2dave said:


> My use is for a blade strop, though I would like to try a box lining!



For box lining, I bought a whole skin of pig suede from GH Leathers. Cost £25 plus £9 delivery (delivery charge is a bit steep, but it's quite large parcel as it comes rolled on a card board tube and is around 3' long. I'll be able to get a few box lining out of that.


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## pe2dave

NickM said:


> For box lining, I bought a whole skin of pig suede from GH Leathers. Cost £25 plus £9 delivery (delivery charge is a bit steep, but it's quite large parcel as it comes rolled on a card board tube and is around 3' long. I'll be able to get a few box lining out of that.


Thanks Nick.
1.0mm cowhide seems about right.


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## marcros

I used this product 5 sq ft Blue Suede leather reenactments scout, crafts 0.6mm thick pig skin | eBay

0.6mm pig skin. 

I actually used this specific seller. LEATHER HIDES SKINS & SUEDE N0 855 A FINE PIG SKIN | eBay


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## pe2dave

marcros said:


> I used this product 5 sq ft Blue Suede leather reenactments scout, crafts 0.6mm thick pig skin | eBay
> 
> 0.6mm pig skin.
> 
> I actually used this specific seller. LEATHER HIDES SKINS & SUEDE N0 855 A FINE PIG SKIN | eBay


 I like the way it is marked as "used"  
Do you think that strong enough to stand up as a strop please?


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## marcros

No sorry, cross purposes. 

It is good for linings if boxes which is what I used it for. For a strop, I would use an old belt. Whilst you wait to get one you could use a piece of MDF. 

It might be ok as a strop- Phil used old sofa leather in a previous post, but is too expensive for that purpose and I would expect a bit soft.


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## pe2dave

Agreed Marcos. I'm using sleeve from an old jacket and yes, too thin for serious stropping.


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## NickM

pe2dave said:


> I like the way it is marked as "used"
> Do you think that strong enough to stand up as a strop please?



It would be too thin for a strop in my view.


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## Just4Fun

I bought an old leather bag (like a satchel) from a flea market and got plenty of material for a few strops. The leather is thick enough and works well.


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## Bogwot

Guys try leprevo.co.uk good range of leathers,suede and strop material. They are based in the North East of UK.


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## JonG

This is so perfectly timed. I am just coming to the end of a jewellery box build and I was wondering what to do with with the inside. Thank you.


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## Skingdom

Bogwot said:


> Guys try leprevo.co.uk good range of leathers,suede and strop material. They are based in the North East of UK.


Yeah, I know these guys they are really great


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## Rorton

Any tips on what scalpel to use? Saw a silverline one on Amazon for a few quid and had 24 blades but a few people said it wasn’t great. Could do with something I know I can get replacement blades for.


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## pe2dave

Follow the surgeons? Rather than a scalpel, I use this and buy Swann-Moren blades, boxes of 50, most common blade shape?
These are craft blades rather than surgical ones, but quite sharp.


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## Nelly111s

Try here
Scalpels


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## Rorton

Still procrastinating about which blade number to get. Is a number 10 the right one?


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## Blackswanwood

Rorton said:


> Still procrastinating about which blade number to get. Is a number 10 the right one?


I use 10A


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## Rorton

Thanks, I did look at that one and wonder. What sort of handle do you use, I seen some that are like a cylinder and you can screw the end to put the blade in, or the more normal flat handles


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## Blackswanwood

Rorton said:


> Thanks, I did look at that one and wonder. What sort of handle do you use, I seen some that are like a cylinder and you can screw the end to put the blade in, or the more normal flat handles


The basic one - I think it’s the number 3. It also makes a good marking knife for dovetails.


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## Rorton

If anyone is looking for online suppliers of Pig Skin, I've just purchased a full skin from GH Leathers - £25 plus £9.95 del

Worked out a bit cheaper than Identity leathers - they want £45 for the full skin and then £6 for delivery. 

The hide from GH is approx 14sq ft (same as Identity) Identity do sell a half skin for £24.50, plus £6 delivery, so that's £30.50 - for the extra £4.50 from GH your getting twice the amount. 

I ordered last night (Monday) and its shipped, to be delivered tomorrow (Wednesday)

I went with No10a blades and a No3 handle for the blades, 

Blades I got for £11.50 from eBay for Swann Moreton - each individually wrapped (there is a cheaper option of them in a box, but didn't know how that worked, im sure they couldn't just be loose in a box!) but for £1.50 extra I had the individual wrapped ones - seemed safer, 

Also found a scalpel blade remover, with built in storage box for £2.95 from amazon which looks good, and you can pull off your dull blade, and it goes straight in the box, no hands to get cut!






Swann Morton Non-Sterile Surgical Blade Remover Unit : Amazon.co.uk: Health & Personal Care


Swann Morton Non-Sterile Surgical Blade Remover Unit : Amazon.co.uk: Health & Personal Care



www.amazon.co.uk


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## Rorton

Any one have any tips on how to do a roll to store rings. 

I tried with a piece of packing foam rolled up, stuck a few of them down, and then draped over the suede and pushed it into the gaps with a credit card - its a poor attempt, and while im pleased with how ive managed to do the lining, this is letting it down. 


bit like this...








My poor attempt...


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## marcros

the way I do it is as follows. sorry no pics but if it isnt clear I will make one and photograph it. 

start with a piece of thin board a little bigger than the area that you want to fill. this would be the size of 3 rolls in your pic above, and I have typically used something like very thin ply or hardboard. think it was probably 1/8", it was packaging when I bought a framed picture. stick to this a layer of suitable foam. you will need to experiment here. it is a little while since I last did one but I think that bath sponge was a bit firm, and I think that I used washing up sponge with the scotchbrite part cut off. I use copydex because that is what I use for the lining. Note that when you experiment, you need to factor in the material that you use because it makes it a bit firmer. the foams that I borrowed from packaging because they looked ideal were too firm.

with the sponge stuck to the backing, cut to size allowing enough for material front and back but accurately to full width. I use a bandsaw. cut the foam to height too to fill the height of your gap (allowing for material), or slightly less.

now stand the item on its long edge and cut the slots for the rings. you are cutting through the foam down to the wood. You can make it a straight cut or you can make the top part of the cut a v shape and give the rolls a contoured shape. again, experiment but use a layer of material on top when you try it out because it changes things a bit.

Now, to line it you need a long strip of material, the exact width of the insert and (I think) about twice as long cut longer rather than shorter. turn over the foam/wood combo and glue a sort end to the wood, so that about an inch is glued and the majority overhangs the end of the piece. turn it over and bring the strip up over the end, covering the top of the insert. Take a steel ruler and press the material with the edge into the first cut that you made in the foam. you will need to judge so that it doesn't distort the foam too much. when that one is correct, do the next ones, making sure that the additional material is used from the loose end. make sure they are even. finish at the far end, gluing it underneath. trim the excess.

I have tried neatly rolling the material and individually wrapping pieces of foam. this way has produced by far the best results for me.


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## marcros

Rorton said:


> Any one have any tips on how to do a roll to store rings.
> 
> I tried with a piece of packing foam rolled up, stuck a few of them down, and then draped over the suede and pushed it into the gaps with a credit card - its a poor attempt, and while im pleased with how ive managed to do the lining, this is letting it down.
> 
> 
> bit like this...
> 
> 
> 
> 
> My poor attempt...
> 
> View attachment 111362



I think that your attempt is ok actually. the obvious way of getting a round shape is to use round foam underneath but I think that a square shape with possibly just the corners knocked off works better and gives a tighter gap between the "rolls".

if you dont use glue you can reuse the material for testing purposes. An hour spent with a piece of board (or even cardboard) plus a £1 worth of different sponge materials and you will soon see what you like and what doesn't work as well.


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## Rorton

thanks, I looked at a number of videos on YouTube, but most of them were 'craft' type where people were using fabric in recycled boxes, but the idea was the same, not sure if its more difficult as I have a smaller area. Some seemed to just roll up the fabric, but the suede is so thin it wouldn't have much of a sponging effect...

I used hot glue to secure it - couldn't see copydex doing it in such a small space, perhaps I just need a thin artist brush or something to apply it?

so with your method, your saying that I will in essence fill the whole of my gap with foam, and then cut out the foam to form the 'grooves' so im then left with what would look like 3 pieces of tall thin foam stuck to a board and them cover that with the suede? Then I should have a component that I can then drop into the 2 compartments in the tray?

We have some Ikea PAX wardrobes, and the jewellery inserts in there seem to use square foam - much to the wifes amusement ive removed her stuff and taken some pics. This seem to be a flat piece of foam, folded over/glued together to give the radius


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## marcros

Rorton said:


> thanks, I looked at a number of videos on YouTube, but most of them were 'craft' type where people were using fabric in recycled boxes, but the idea was the same, not sure if its more difficult as I have a smaller area. Some seemed to just roll up the fabric, but the suede is so thin it wouldn't have much of a sponging effect...
> 
> I used hot glue to secure it - couldn't see copydex doing it in such a small space, perhaps I just need a thin artist brush or something to apply it?
> 
> so with your method, your saying that I will in essence fill the whole of my gap with foam, and then cut out the foam to form the 'grooves' so im then left with what would look like 3 pieces of tall thin foam stuck to a board and them cover that with the suede? Then I should have a component that I can then drop into the 2 compartments in the tray?
> 
> We have some Ikea PAX wardrobes, and the jewellery inserts in there seem to use square foam - much to the wifes amusement ive removed her stuff and taken some pics. This seem to be a flat piece of foam, folded over/glued together to give the radius
> 
> View attachment 111378
> 
> 
> View attachment 111379
> 
> 
> View attachment 111380
> 
> 
> View attachment 111381



yes exactly. I cant see the scale of yours, but you will end up with 3 strips of foam say 1" x 1" x 3" glued to a backer board. This stops them separating when you try and put the material in between. I dont glue the material to the foam, only at the start and end point on the back of the board. I dont see why you cant but if the gap if the width of a bandsaw blade, I've never needed to. Then as you say, drop it in to the tray. if it is a perfect fit, I wouldn't glue it because the force of withdrawing a ring is negligible. if it is a fraction under sized or you are worried, a blob of hot glue will keep it in place.

there are probably numerous ways of doing it. I started similarly to you, and when I found the method I described I stuck with it. it wont be the only way.


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## Siggy

Great thread people, thanks for all the info!


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## pe2dave

@Rorton I'm thinking of a variant on this for a box holding pens, thanks for the ideas.


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## thetyreman

just finished my second commissioned box, lined it all using custards methods, the fabric is cotton velvet, it's off to the USA soon.


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## Siggy

Which Neumann is going into this? Looks great!


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## thetyreman

Siggy said:


> Which Neumann is going into this? Looks great!


an original U47 from the 1950s, the long body version, it's not my microphone but made for a studio owner in the USA.


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