# The late, late birthday project



## Alf (14 Jul 2004)

Well this was supposed to be done for a good friend's birthday in mid-April, but hey, it's only July...  Possibly the only project ever featured in FWW that ordinary, mortal woodworkers such as myself have ever felt they could make too. :roll: 







Maple with paper-lined poplar base, ebony handle and brass pins. Apart from the initial stock prep and the stopped grooves, all done exclusively by hand. I decided to be daring and used Patina as the finish on the outside, with blonde shellac inside, and it's worked really very well.






Not the biggest project in the world, but what the heck. At least I managed to make something this year! :roll: 

Cheers, Alf


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## Anonymous (14 Jul 2004)

Very attractive

Boxing clever I guess


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## Philly (14 Jul 2004)

Nice work Alf!
This forum has now officially headed off on a project finishing rush! :shock: 
Tell us more on your experiences with Patina (please)
cheers,
Philly


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## Neil (14 Jul 2004)

Very nice, Alf - love the ebony handle  

Nice use of Patina - that was thinking outside the box, wasn't it? (sorry...)

NeilCFD


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## dedee (14 Jul 2004)

Philly,

I have used Patina a lot on table and cabinet tops and like it a lot. Recently discovering (from this forum) that it is readily available from screwfix solved the only problem I ever had with it - sourcing.

It is a jelly like substance that can be used over spirit based stains without any problems (that I've seen). I used about 6 or more coats on my dining table (10 years ago) and it certainly copes very well with water spills and is not affected by heat (from tea/coffee cups). Applied with a lint free cloth & rubbed with the grain with a very fine sandpaper between coats works for me. 

In order to keep it fresh in the tin (a skin forms after a while that cannot be mixed back in) I cover it with cling film before I put the lid back on and store it upside-down. 

AndyP


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## Chris Knight (14 Jul 2004)

Alf,
It looks very, very good. I like the nice crisp joints too. 

I am glad the patina worked for you. I bought some and tried it after people mentioned it here and i thought it was horrible. It tooks ages to dry and looked vile. Perhaps I had an old tin, I don't knwo but it went in the bin!

Your friend will just have to reschedule their birthday I guess - or at least have a second party!


You will have to watch it - hand cut dovetails and now this all in the same year? :shock:


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## ike (14 Jul 2004)

I agree with Waterhead, I've tried Patina but can't get a satisfactory finish. I've used a cloth etc as recommended, so what's the knack with this stuff? I've gone back to shellac based sanding sealer and wax.

Ike


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## Aragorn (14 Jul 2004)

Lovely box Alf!

Re Patina: Chris & Ike - can you say how the finish was horrible? I might then be able to say what's going on. Drying times are comparable to varnish - I usually get 3 coats done in a day.
I do rub down in between coats contrary to the instructions. I apply it with a cloth rubbing it _hard _into the wood until it's all rubbed out.

The finish is on the plastic side - but it can be rubbed out to a more natural look and waxed if necessary.


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## Alf (14 Jul 2004)

Regarding Patina:

AndyP, darn, I wish I'd had that tip earlier.  I had to break through the skin, which seems to get quite thick.

Now I thought this stuff was pretty fool proof, but perhaps it's proof against fools, and you guys are too clever for it. :lol: I can only tell you what I did, and it tallies in with what Aragorn and Andy describe. I used clean cotton rag in a pad, rather like a polishing rubber, and not much actual Patina. Just wipe over the jelly and that should be fine; you can always add more if required. Then a quick wipe over to get coverage and then hard, burnishing rubbing along the grain until the finish feels dry to the touch. I actually managed to get the wood warm, if that gives you an idea of how hard to rub it in. Don't stint on this step, 'cos if it starts to cure in a thick film it goes nasty and rubbery. DAMHIKT... Despite the instructions, I also rub down between coats (I used 500g PSF in the end). The finish does vary between woods; I found it didn't come out too plasticky on the maple in this case, so I left it as is. I've also found rubbing back with grey (guess what) Webrax and neutral wax cuts that back a bit, if desired. Rubbing it back for a finish without any kind of lubricant just results in 'orrible scratches, even using very fine paper or non-woven abrasive of your choice. Despite myself, I'm impressed with the stuff, even given its weirdness, and I can see it being the finish of choice for table tops and so forth. While it was out, I refinished the ledge of a shooting board with it too, as I'm not entirely satisfied with straight wax. Time will tell if that was a bad idea...

Anyway, thanks for the kind words. As regards the joints, the camera's doing me some favours again. :roll: 

Cheers, Alf


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## Chris Knight (14 Jul 2004)

Aragorn,

It took more like 24 hours to be really dry and the finish was rather yellow and rough.

I don't think I rubbed it in hard enough re-reading your post and it may have been old. However, on present evidence I can apply virtually any finish I can think of with less fuss and much better results.


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## Pete W (14 Jul 2004)

Very nice, Alf.

I can't quite tell from the pictures - is there a curve in the ends of the box?


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## Aragorn (14 Jul 2004)

Chris

It may be worth trying it again some time. I too would choose virtually any other finish with the exception of those projects that require a really tough heat/liquid proof finish (table tops).
Patina really does give an incredibly tough finish. On a recent table top projet I got the customer to heat a pan on the hob and place it directly on the newly installed table..... :shock: 
No worries!


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## Alf (15 Jul 2004)

Pete, they're curved top to botttom, but straight across in the horizontal. Clear as mud... :roll: 

Aragorn, I dunno. I think if the stuff's applied sufficiently sparingly it doesn't come out nearly so plasticky. Not my first choice for the box, I admit, but it was quick  and the result is a _lot_ better than I'd expected. Further investigation and experiment with it is required, I reckon, but don't necessarily relegate it to table tops alone just yet.

Cheers, Alf


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## Aragorn (15 Jul 2004)

OK  
I don't apply it particularly sparingly, so that's something to try next time. It must need many coats for maximum protection.


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## ike (16 Jul 2004)

I think maybe I've got it wrong by applying too much Patina and not working it in enough. And that's probably why it stays tacky for so long. If that's what it takes, it's sounds like a lot more elbow grease is used up compared to more traditional finishing. I'll try it again and follow the Alf method this time. 

Ike


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## Anonymous (16 Jul 2004)

Late seeing this one too - London trip.

Lovely box Alf

I think I'll have to steal the handle for my current box if you don't mind :wink: I like the nice crisp joints too. 

This Patina finish has me confused. I agree with Chris that it appears (from various posts) to be the case that almost any other finish is easier to apply, easier to store and gives a superior finish. So why use Patina?

However, I have never seen Patina nor used it so what do I know!!

Cheers

Tony


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## Brooky (9 Sep 2010)

very nice box alf ,good practicle shape and good choice of contrasting timbers


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## stewart (9 Sep 2010)

Inspiring stuff, Alf - heck, it might even get me back in the workshop after more than a year of sitting on my heels prevaricating and wondering where me enthusiasm had gone...
I really like the crispness of the box and the finish - yep, I've tried Patina too and guess I'll have to rub harder next time too!


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## Alf (9 Sep 2010)

Good grief, this is a blast from the past. :shock: I've made a few variations on the same theme in the intervening years, and they always seem to go down well. 

Stewart, been in those woodworking doldrums myself, and it's no fun. Hope you get the mojo back soon as.


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## stewart (9 Sep 2010)

I hope so too, Alf - see what you mean about blast from the past...just noticed the original posting date!!


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