# Newbie with many questions about building a shed.



## samcro1982 (1 Feb 2016)

Hi All.

Been a member for a while having a look around but never posted on here before.
I am in a position where I need a new shed/worshop as my current 8x6 shiplap shed is well rubbish/damp/unsuitable.

I have measured up and I can get 10x8 or even a 10x10 in the current space.

The current space in sunken below a patio approx 2 foot lower. so my thinking is to raise where the shed is to the same height as the patio on pads of breeze blocks.

So do I Buy a flat pack T+G shed/workshop or Build one?

As always money is a problem so looking online for around £500 I can get a flatpack 10x8 shed T+G variety.

My requirements are - I want something dry and sturdy/large enough to store bikes/tools/camping equipment and be a useable workshop for tinkering in. Im thinking no windows as better for security and easier to build.


My questions are if I build would costs be alot lower but better quality materials used? 

Are there online plans on the site I could follow ?

If I do build I would try and build so if I move I can take it with me. So build the wall pannels in sections. hows best to go about this/what materials.

Plan if build

Make frame then move to area and mark out as to where I will erect the concrete pads. What is then best to put on top of the pads before I place the floor frame onto it ?
Once frame in place add a waterproof membrane to the top of it then sheet out the floor with OSB or other (advice welcome). Any suggestions of a better way welcome. 

Could I build the walls with timber framing and then OSB board onto the outside ? would this withstand rain until I am able to afford to clad the outside or use a different sheeting material. Do I then bolt this to the floor or place something underneath to keep out the elements. ? 

insulate the walls do I also use a membrane here ? whats best for the inside walls ? 

Roofing - do I have a Apex roof or Pent roof ? again advice needed. im thinking to lay roofing felt at first and then maybe afterwards/money permitting use a corregated material so would last longer.


Basically im going into the unknown slightly here and all advice pointers links and pics would be greatly appreciated.

Thansk all in advance 

Craig


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## Roughcut (2 Feb 2016)

If you have an idea of your maximum budget you could then decide what spec materials you can afford to buy if building your own.
And then weigh that up against a flat pack shed cost.
The lower end shed's seem very competitive in price but the quality is probably a bit of a lottery.


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## Harbo (2 Feb 2016)

Do a search for Mike G's shed build
And over on the Woodhaven2 forum his workshop build.

You might need planning permission and there's been plenty about that on here too.
A shop bought T&G shed will give you an outer skin but no insulation but building a more substantial shed, insulated of your required size will cost a lot more than £500 (unless you have a cheap source of timber).
I built one this summer 3.6mx2.9m - the timber alone cost more than £600 using 4x2, 18mm & 11mm OSB - I reused my existing shed's Shiplap for the outer layer.
Plus 100mm Rockwool insulation and breather membrane.
The EPDM roof membrane cost £100
I used HD paving slabs for the base with the Shed walls sitting on a low brick wall. The timber floor was lifted off the base on brick piers

Rod


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## Fitzroy (2 Feb 2016)

Building a shed this year, big(ish) at 6m x 3m. My research has been that for the same price as a shed pack off the web (which you will have to build) you can build an equivalent shed but out of better quality (ie thicker section) timber. You will however have to work out the details for yourself, which is what it looks like you are doing. If in working out the details, you start to embellish, ie add insulation or building paper or an EPDM roof or electrics or a jukebox or dancing pole etc etc then before you know it you will have doubled/tripled the price of the diy-store item.

The internet is awash with shed 'plans' both free and to be paid for. My experience is that if you are going to build it yourself you should find a free plan then use it as a start point to draw your own plans. This will get you thinking about the details of the build and should help you on the day when you start cutting timber. IMHO following any 'build it by numbers' plans for a bespoke shed is asking for trouble.

F.

F.


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## samcro1982 (2 Feb 2016)

Hi all thanks for the input. I've decided that I want to attempt a build my workshop/shed. The size for ease will be 8x8ft and approx 7ft high at the front and slightly lower at the back. I've decide on a flat pent roof as I believe it will be cheaper and easier to build (please advice if wrong, so far I've tried to come up with a plan for the frame/base including breeze blocks for the frame to sit on and this is coming to around the £100 mark using treated 4x2 timber. Could I get away with 3x2? I will still have to then buy board for the floor. Which underneath will have some form of membrane on top of the frame which I believe is the right way to do it.Any advice on best board to use I believe 18mm is needed. The build itself won't be done all at once so it will be done in stages due to not having a bottomless pit of spare cash. So the build at points will be covered with tarp until I can get the next stage built. Could you clad the outside with a form of corrugated sheeting instead of wooden cladding would this prove to be cheaper? Inside can be done out at a later stage with insulation electrics etc main aim at first will be to get floor walls and roof on so at least it's water tight.


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## samcro1982 (2 Feb 2016)

Quick note - do I need to use treated timber as it does work out more expensive.


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## cammy9r (4 Feb 2016)

Hi, are you using a local timber merchant or B&Q/homebase as a merchant will be cheaper.
A quick calculation using my local merchant would put the frame, roof and floor sheeting for 2.4x2.4m shed around £213, this includes treated tanalised 4x2 for the floor. The wall frame 3x2 treated cls (not greeny blue tanalised stuff ) and the roof 4x2 treated cls. 11mm osb for roof sheeting and 18mm osb for floor.
This would leave £287 for the rest.
I used sarking board to clad the outside of my shed it is just tanalised planks 15mmx150mm and I just overlapped them like feather edge. You would need just over 200 linear metres so that works out at £158.
So Main frame/roof/floor £213
Cladding £158
Counter battens £30
That's you up to £401
Plus another £30 for breather membrane to wrap the frame and say £35 for B&Q garage felt then nails/screws at extra cost.
I guess if you could up the budget another £100 it should be possible to get a sturdy shed better than a pre bought one for around £600. If you are building in stages then maybe this could work.


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## samcro1982 (4 Feb 2016)

cammy9r":2mdq7ymr said:


> Hi, are you using a local timber merchant or B&Q/homebase as a merchant will be cheaper.
> A quick calculation using my local merchant would put the frame, roof and floor sheeting for 2.4x2.4m shed around £213, this includes treated tanalised 4x2 for the floor. The wall frame 3x2 treated cls (not greeny blue tanalised stuff ) and the roof 4x2 treated cls. 11mm osb for roof sheeting and 18mm osb for floor.
> This would leave £287 for the rest.
> I used sarking board to clad the outside of my shed it is just tanalised planks 15mmx150mm and I just overlapped them like feather edge. You would need just over 200 linear metres so that works out at £158.
> ...



Thank you for the above.
I am using a local merchant and I ordered the stuff for the base yesterday.
Concrete Blocks	30	£30.24
47x100mm x2.4M Treated	10 lengths	£62.21
Polythene DPM 3x3M £8.82
Spax Screws 70x5mm Qty 100	£10.20
OSB3 18mm 2.4x1.22M	2	£40.56
Joist Hangers	10	£8.28
Delivery £12
Total	£172.31
Which I know is a few quid but considering Im building this to last I dont think its a bad price. Once Ive emptied and moved the old shed from the site I can then start to build out the frame and then work out where to place the concrete pads it will be sitting on. 

Question can OSB board be sat outside covered as to not get wet without any major problems ?

I may ask alot of daft or stupid questions so I appologise in advance for this.


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## samcro1982 (4 Feb 2016)

Ive looked at featherboard for the outside anyone else used different ? Tanslised boards have come up a couple of times when searching and come in 2.4M lengths maybe can make these into a form of ongue and groove boards ?
What do these Sarking boards consist of are they easy enough to get hold of ? any pics of finsihed product on your shed?


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## cammy9r (4 Feb 2016)

sarking is just square edged rough sawn planks around 150mm wide and 15mm thick. I find it best to use cladding that overlaps rather than tongue and grooved. The latter usually opens up in really dry weather and does not always reseat when it swells again, leaving gaps.
Osb3 will be fine outside if covered. It would be good for a few months if not covered but the surfaces will raise a good bit.
When constructing the floor just make up the joists with noggins in between and build the wall framing onto that. Use boards to make the floor safer to walk on. Leave the osb flooring until the roof is on and watertight. The wall frame can be wrapped with Permavent (on ebay kind of cheap) or another breather membrane. You can leave this exposed to direct uv light for a few months and it will keep the structure dry if you don't have any cladding at that point. Once the roof sheathing is on the membrane can be put onto there also.


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## Roughcut (4 Feb 2016)

samcro1982":26bx0ocn said:


> cammy9r":26bx0ocn said:
> 
> 
> > Hi, are you using a local timber merchant or B&Q/homebase as a merchant will be cheaper.
> ...




May I recommend you purchase at least one DPM Sheet to cover your base from wet weather while building your shed.
I recommend one of these, they are far superior to normal tarpaulins and well worth the money in my opinion: 
http://www.toolstation.com/shop/Constru ... ane/p54683


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## samcro1982 (4 Feb 2016)

I have purchased a DPM which I was going to put ontop of the base frame that I build is this correct ? then I was going to lay the OSB boards ontop of the but as cammy9r has stated I believe I am best to put them in last is the right ?
So build base frame/cover with DPM/build walls and roof/cover walls with Permavent or similiar once roof complete install OSB3 floor clad outside ......


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## RobinBHM (4 Feb 2016)

If you want to make the job really weathrtight and last a long time, I would do as the progress shots by cammy9r, which is studwork covered with breathable membrane, then vertical tiling battens and then the feather edge. A bit more expense but you have then created a vented cavity so any water getting behind the featheredge runs down and out of the bottom. It makes the job much more weather tight and the feather edge will have a much longer life. Ive done this on my shed and it has stayed bone dry inside, no hint of condensation or leaks anywhere. I used tyvek housewrap which is quite expensive, but toolstation sell cromar 3 which is cheaper.

With 4 x 2 studwork, you are making a shed much much stronger than a ready made one.

you can store osb3 outside covered but its worth putting some sheeting down underneath first and wrapping right over, if you just cover over the top, you may get the bottom section wet from splashing.


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## samcro1982 (4 Feb 2016)

cammy9r":3q3a2f5s said:


> sarking is just square edged rough sawn planks around 150mm wide and 15mm thick. I find it best to use cladding that overlaps rather than tongue and grooved. The latter usually opens up in really dry weather and does not always reseat when it swells again, leaving gaps.
> Osb3 will be fine outside if covered. It would be good for a few months if not covered but the surfaces will raise a good bit.
> When constructing the floor just make up the joists with noggins in between and build the wall framing onto that. Use boards to make the floor safer to walk on. Leave the osb flooring until the roof is on and watertight. The wall frame can be wrapped with Permavent (on ebay kind of cheap) or another breather membrane. You can leave this exposed to direct uv light for a few months and it will keep the structure dry if you don't have any cladding at that point. Once the roof sheathing is on the membrane can be put onto there also.




really like the finish they give - pretty similiar to Featherboard look wise then. ive been quoted £1.84 for a 2.4x150mm treated featherboard - not sure how this compares to what you used.


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## sitefive (4 Feb 2016)

Is that all the space you got?
if not why not build something a bit better? I did some calculations last year ( with lots of 2nd hand materials,mainly the windows/doors) you can build a ''shed'' like this at 30square meters large for right around 2.5k , thats with proper roof/insulation/flooring so its a real workshop not yet another terrible looking shed.





see the guy even has listed what kind of materials he has used,
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/6m-x-4m-Garde ... SwpDdU-c8h


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## samcro1982 (4 Feb 2016)

sitefive":uz1sdu75 said:


> Is that all the space you got?
> if not why not build something a bit better? I did some calculations last year ( with lots of 2nd hand materials,mainly the windows/doors) you can build a ''shed'' like this at 30square meters large for right around 2.5k , thats with proper roof/insulation/flooring so its a real workshop not yet another terrible looking shed.




Maybe oneday I can build upto that but 2.5k aint something I can justify right now. although using 2nd hand doors/window could maybe be incorporated.


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## sitefive (4 Feb 2016)

samcro1982":bkywpckd said:


> sitefive":bkywpckd said:
> 
> 
> > Is that all the space you got?
> ...



that was for 30m2 large one, You had plans for 10m2 large ,not gonna cost that for smaller one but at least you won't have another terrible looking shed in neighbourhood.
takes not much more effort to build it properly if you got lots of spare time.


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## Roughcut (4 Feb 2016)

sitefive":1hgpjofe said:


> Is that all the space you got?
> if not why not build something a bit better? I did some calculations last year ( with lots of 2nd hand materials,mainly the windows/doors) you can build a ''shed'' like this at 30square meters large for right around 2.5k , thats with proper roof/insulation/flooring so its a real workshop not yet another terrible looking shed.
> 
> 
> ...



Being realistic in 99.9% of cases you won't build a 30 sq mtr fully lined and insulated workshop for £2500.
In fact I would say there's probably more chance of Lord Lucan riding Shergar in this years Grand National!


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## sitefive (4 Feb 2016)

Roughcut":3fbnawho said:


> sitefive":3fbnawho said:
> 
> 
> > Is that all the space you got?
> ...


I believe when I calculated the costs I did it to the last screw, of course that is as I said with the doors/windows being 2nd hand and not using the expensive insulation boards that you just have to cut but with the regular loft roll insulation and some cheap laminate flooring. I can do all of the stuff myself so don't even need to hire anyone to wire it up, of course if you hire someone to build it for you 'the proper way'' be ready to pay 10x that.


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## samcro1982 (4 Feb 2016)

Full time job and 2 kids = not much time but something will be built and if I can incorporate something of a shed/workshop then win win


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## sitefive (4 Feb 2016)

samcro1982":27v2s9cd said:


> Full time job and 2 kids = not much time but something will be built and if I can incorporate something of a shed/workshop then win win


Give your kids some timber and let them start building it?


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## cammy9r (4 Feb 2016)

Hi, there is only pennies in the cost difference. Did the suppliers tell you the dimensions of the feather edge, some can be really thin.


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## samcro1982 (4 Feb 2016)

cammy9r":3swfv4zd said:


> Hi, there is only pennies in the cost difference. Did the suppliers tell you the dimensions of the feather edge, some can be really thin.



I'm not too sure so will need to find that out before I order as thicker the better right


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## cammy9r (5 Feb 2016)

Hi, yes thicker is better for cladding i think. Feather edge is usually given in an odd expression as 2ex 32mm for example. This means the original size of the board was 32mm thick then split giving two tapered boards with actual size of about 20mm tapering down to maybe 9mm. 
That example is a good size but can be expensive, at least locally to me. It was my first choice but over budget thats why i picked the square edged board. In Scotland it is called sarking board but that i think is a regional term


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## doctor Bob (5 Feb 2016)

sitefive":3begsw2c said:


> Is that all the space you got?
> if not why not build something a bit better? I did some calculations last year ( with lots of 2nd hand materials,mainly the windows/doors) you can build a ''shed'' like this at 30square meters large for right around 2.5k , thats with proper roof/insulation/flooring so its a real workshop not yet another terrible looking shed.
> 
> 
> ...




Complete and utter nonsense, probably the greatest example of bullshite on this forum, this millennium (trust me that is quite an achievement).

I see later you have changed the spec, however if my Auntie had pinapples she'd be my uncle and all that.


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## tomf (5 Feb 2016)

This is my 7.5x4m workshop.
It'll cost about £5k with all the electrics, bathroom, kitchen and stove in... I hope.
There is about another £200 worth of misc that's notincluded, such as dpm, dpc screws etc but I had all of those anyway.
I'll be making the doors and windows myself, no way you could get it all in for £2500, maybe if you knicked all the stuff of site.


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## samcro1982 (5 Feb 2016)

Ok so today I emptied the old 8x6 excuse for a shed that is crammed to the rafters with everything including the kitchen sink. I then moved the old shed onto the patio and then put it back together to store everything again. Now with the site a little clearer I set about cleaning the whole area. I then moved the new materials into the back garden for safe keeping and dry laid the concret pads and forming out to get an idea of the size and what I'm facing. I've tried to upload some pics but saying too large to upload on my phone. I'll try again at some point this weekend to show what I'm on about. Having to work on the car tomorro morning so may have to return to the workshop Sunday. Thanks again for all the input.


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## samcro1982 (16 Feb 2016)

Hi All a little update - I have built the base now and included a DPM. (Pics to follow) 
I started yesterday on the walls building each one in 2 sections incase I ever move and I look to take the workshop with me. it is 7ft at the front and about 6ft 8'' to the rear. I managed to build the back and 2x sides and I mocked them up with the use of alot of clamps and help with the father in law. Work has now stopped until the weekend Whichj I then hope to have the stud walls up with noggins and have them securley attached to the base. Im having a flat roof so I need to order the roof wood next - anyone have input on best options to use ? ie felt/coregated roofing sheets etc ? pics and pointers always welcome. As always when I can find out how to easily upload my pics from my phone I can let everyone see my work so far.


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## Adam9453 (16 Feb 2016)

Don't make your roof absolutely flat, put at least a little fall on it.
You will need to go for a suitable flat roofing material as other systems like corrugated bitumen sheets are designed based on a pitched roof not a flat roof.
You can build a large shed cheaply but its a lot more labour intensive.
You will need to source as much used material as you can, this means buying used ply wood sheets and de-nailing them yourself.
find a local surplus building materials place as they are normally very cheap.


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## samcro1982 (16 Feb 2016)

So far all my materials have been new, so the costing isnt as cheap as it could have been if I had of used reclaimed but now most of the framework is done I may get reclaimed for the roofing beams and OSB (how thick is advisable for the roof ? it will sit on minimum 4x2 beams, my roof does have a fall on it approx 4 inches across a 8ft span which I think will be more than enough for any rain water we may get in this country.


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## Roughcut (16 Feb 2016)

samcro1982":1iy32hpi said:


> So far all my materials have been new, so the costing isnt as cheap as it could have been if I had of used reclaimed but now most of the framework is done I may get reclaimed for the roofing beams and OSB (how thick is advisable for the roof ? it will sit on minimum 4x2 beams, my roof does have a fall on it approx 4 inches across a 8ft span which I think will be more than enough for any rain water we may get in this country.



You shouldn't need anything more than 11mm OSB otherwise it becomes hard work hauling it up and on to the roof, especially if working on your own.


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## samcro1982 (16 Feb 2016)

I was thinking 11mm so thank for confirming - is it adviseable to put a DPM on the roof ? So 4x2 then DPM then batterns then OSB then a waterproof covering on that ?


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## Roughcut (16 Feb 2016)

samcro1982":26kir9ly said:


> I was thinking 11mm so thank for confirming - is it adviseable to put a DPM on the roof ? So 4x2 then DPM then batterns then OSB then a waterproof covering on that ?



I'm no expert but I don't think that a DPM sheet will be needed as your roof covering will keep the roof structure waterproof and the OSB should provide a vapour barrier for the inside.


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## cammy9r (16 Feb 2016)

That's good you are getting on with the build. I used 11mm osb for my roof, the rafters being 400mm on centre. Im sure if rafter spacing is larger then thicker sheet material is needed. However as already said 18mm is heavy and a pain to handle if on your own. I have a smaller hut with 9mm osb on the roof, again rafters on 400mm and this has been fine for many years but you feel it flex a good bit if walking over it.
You will not need a dpm under the osb, might even create a space for condensation if unlucky. If you want an extra layer of protection then use the breather membrane instead, then osb then felt or other roof covering.


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## samcro1982 (25 Feb 2016)

Just tried to upload pics again and still saying files too big grrrrrrrrrrrr
Anyway - Ive decided on felt roof, with a breather membrane .

Tomorrow I am off so Im hoping to be up at the crack of dawn and bolt all the walls together and then fix them to the base ready for the roof to go on. Im hoping all 4 walls and roof to be on before close of play tomorrow then I have the weekend to try and get the Featherboard on.


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