# the lords prayer



## james coleman (22 Feb 2014)

hi all,
new too the group,
i am looking for this pattern ,if anyone can help,i believe it was published by hobbies of dereham ,norfolk,
i have spent the whole day searching,but no joy,i had the pattern years ago,and here is a picture of the piece i made then,i had no scrollsaw,only a hand fretsaw,but since then i have moved on too a hegener saw,.
unfortunatly i dont have the pattern anymore,and i wish too make this piece again,i have searched everywhere for it,please help


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## ChrisR (22 Feb 2014)

Hi James.

Welcome to the forum.

Sorry I can’t help with the pattern you require, but this post will help to keep your thread to the top of the listings. :wink: 

I am sure somebody will come in with help, as this is a very active and helpful forum.


Take care.

Chris R.


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## bugbear (22 Feb 2014)

http://thewoodhaven.co.uk/phpBB3/viewto ... ayer#p9615

I dont think it was by Hobbies.

BugBear


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## Bryan Bennett (22 Feb 2014)

Hi James a very warm welcome to a great site,with some very nice Gals and Guys in attendance.I must say that you made a very good job in cutting something like that by hand,and must have taken you quite some time.There was a post by Steve on the other day,they looked like old fretwork patterns from Hobbies in the early days,they were green like the old patterns.I have the pattern of a old fort in the same colour.It would be nice if you are lucky enough to find it.Look lower down on this page ( a pattern link ) by Steve.

Bryan


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## Chippygeoff (22 Feb 2014)

I may have this pattern but it will take me a while to search through thousands of patterns. I really must spend some time putting them into different folders. If and when I find it I will PM you. A brilliant piece of work by the way, especially by hand.


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## martinka (22 Feb 2014)

I did a bit of searching for the pattern without success. I found another Lord's Prayer that someone had cut 24 times. If a copy of the same pattern was used every time, 'temptation' was spelled without a 'p' a lot of times.


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## scrimper (22 Feb 2014)

This pattern was created not by Hobbies but by a company founded by two ex employees of Hobbies called Handicrafts, the design first appeared in Handicrafts fretwork magazine in August 1919, ( Vol 15 No 269) there were two versions and this one was the biggest and finest, it measured 32" x 23" The design was certainly still available from Handicrafts in 1931, the price of the pattern in 1931 was 1/- (5pence today) There are a few of these panels about as in it's time it held the record for the greatest number of exhibition awards.

My late grandfather was brilliant at fretwork and actually taught local lads the art of fretwork and supplied them with fretwork tools and stuff that he bought wholesale from Hobbies.

He actually made one of these and it was hanging in his bungalow and as a young man I always admired his workmanship, when he died in 1965 the Lord's Prayer panel disappeared I have a feeling his live in carer had it but I would have loved it myself.

It has always been my ambition to make one although it is so intricate I am not sure I would live long enough to complete it!

A few years ago I bought a box of tatty designs off ebay and to my joy this pattern was among them however the paper had deteriorated so much it is in many pieces and very fragile so is not usable ATM, I have considered trying to glue it onto some backing paper but not sure if it would work.


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## n0legs (23 Feb 2014)

Just an idea, 
Could you not take a hi res photo, enlarge it and then photocopy it up to a size that you could use ?


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## Grahamshed (23 Feb 2014)

Cutting that would have to be the pinnacle of any career. It would take an age to do.


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## dt-crafts (23 Feb 2014)

HI ALL
been watching in the wings for a while ever since I spotted martins Lambretta that I made the pattern for, but thought I should jump in on this one.
Not sure if you can do anything with these they are a pattern made from the picture you posted, its a little distorted due to the angle of the picture.
If I can help any more just shout up


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## james coleman (23 Feb 2014)

thanks for all yere replies people,i do have some of the pattern,but unfortunatly after a lot of use ,the lines have become distorted and are not as crisp as i would like,all i have ,was drawn on a sheet of paper and need redoing,i am missing the patterns for the frame,and all the overlays,geoff if you ever do come across it,i do hope you give us a buzz,thanks again all.


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## james coleman (23 Feb 2014)

well,ive spent a few more hours trawling through ebay and google and still no joy,
looks like this is going too be harder than i thaught.


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## scrimper (23 Feb 2014)

In this page taken from a 1931 Handicrafts magazine this lady says she has made 5 Lords prayer plaques and is now making her 6th and 7th! 

People had a lot more time on their hands then also it's nice to see a lady fretworker!


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## james coleman (23 Feb 2014)

the woman is holding a hand fretsaw exactlt like the one i used when i made mine,also have you noticed the age written under the bottom left piece,interesting article..


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## stevebuk (23 Feb 2014)

The only picture of this particular lords prayer i could find was the one you have cut here, however there was one other cutting, not the same but...
http://www.scrollsawvillage.com/gallery ... ds-prayer/


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## scrimper (23 Feb 2014)

Another one, this time from 1927!


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## martinka (24 Feb 2014)

dt-crafts":20zf14le said:


> HI ALL
> been watching in the wings for a while ever since I spotted martins Lambretta that I made the pattern for, but thought I should jump in on this one.
> Not sure if you can do anything with these they are a pattern made from the picture you posted, its a little distorted due to the angle of the picture.
> If I can help any more just shout up



Hi Dave, welcome to the forum. My sister said the Lambretta was well liked when she gave it to her friend.


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## james coleman (24 Feb 2014)

i know the one,the person who cut it used the picture of my one and developed the drawing from it,,looks good but not what im looking for .


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## scrimper (24 Feb 2014)

james coleman":113r6rkw said:


> i know the one,the person who cut it used the picture of my one and developed the drawing from it,,looks good but not what im looking for .



Not sure if you read my first post in this thread? I do have this plan although it is in poor condition, however if you have some parts of the plan I may be able to scan some parts that may be missing.

Because the plan is in poor condition I avoid looking at it as each time it falls apart more (the paper is sort of brittle), what I have been hoping to do when time allows is to copy the various bits of the plan and try to reassemble them.

I will try to find the plan later and if possible post a sample scan.


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## bugbear (24 Feb 2014)

scrimper":1j6llb6x said:


> This pattern was created not by Hobbies but by a company founded by two ex employees of Hobbies called Handicrafts, the design first appeared in Handicrafts fretwork magazine in August 1919, ( Vol 15 No 269) there were two versions and this one was the biggest and finest, it measured 32" x 23" The design was certainly still available from Handicrafts in 1931, the price of the pattern in 1931 was 1/- (5pence today) There are a few of these panels about as in it's time it held the record for the greatest number of exhibition awards.



The example at Debenham Church is captioned "Made by the late E.A. Read, 1911, Presented by his wife Lily".

Are you sure that 1919 date was the earliest appearance?

BugBear


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## scrimper (24 Feb 2014)

bugbear":nbxknvpq said:


> scrimper":nbxknvpq said:
> 
> 
> > This pattern was created not by Hobbies but by a company founded by two ex employees of Hobbies called Handicrafts, the design first appeared in Handicrafts fretwork magazine in August 1919, ( Vol 15 No 269) there were two versions and this one was the biggest and finest, it measured 32" x 23" The design was certainly still available from Handicrafts in 1931, the price of the pattern in 1931 was 1/- (5pence today) There are a few of these panels about as in it's time it held the record for the greatest number of exhibition awards.
> ...



No, it could quite well have been available earlier, but 1919 was I believe the first time it was issued with Handicrafts magazine, I would suggest that it's earliest appearance would be after 1907 though as that is the year Frank Skinner resigned from Hobbies Ltd and founded the Handicrafts company in opposition!


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## james coleman (24 Feb 2014)

scrimper,if you could scan parts for me ,that would be great,i have the pattern for the main plaque,i am missing the frame,and all the overlays,includinng the wording overlays that hide the joint in the plaque.....fingers crossed.


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## bugbear (24 Feb 2014)

james coleman":1poynrq8 said:


> scrimper,if you could scan parts for me ,that would be great,i have the pattern for the main plaque,i am missing the frame,and all the overlays,includinng the wording overlays that hide the *joint* in the plaque.....fingers crossed.



I was wondering how such a large piece was cut with a hand frame!

BugBear


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## scrimper (24 Feb 2014)

Large fretwork designs both by Hobbies and Handicrafts often use a sort of surface dovetail joint to join the pieces then hid them with a moulding or fretted panel/overlay,
I do this sometimes on pieces I make even smallish ones, it makes the work easier to handle you don't waste so much wood and if you make a serious mistake you don't have to cut the whole thing again! 
In the piece I made below the hardwood frame was made as 2 pieces otherwise I would have needed a hardwood panel 9" wide.


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## james coleman (24 Feb 2014)

in the lordw prayer,the main panel is made up of 3 pieces,where the joints are covered by the overlays,i used a 18 inch fretsaw when i cut mine originaly


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## boysie39 (1 Mar 2014)

Hey James ,a belated welcome to you ,I have been missing for a while . Although I don't contribute anything anymore I find the pieces on here are great pieces of art . 
I hate missing any of the pieces shown and the discussion that follows ,. Its great having another from this side of the water to keep the flag flying .

A great bunch of folk who go to great lengths to help one another .Enjoy yourself .


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## Grahamshed (1 Mar 2014)

The swan on the plate it truly lovely. That would look great hung on a wall


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