# joint help please



## sunnybob (11 Mar 2018)

I've been offered a project.
Its a bit above my pay grade but its interesting enough for me to investigate.

I've been asked to make a kneeling stool of the ceremonial kind. 50 cm wide, 30cm front to back, 50 cm high to the top of the cushion (10cm). Its to be a dark wood and I'm favouring iroku because its available to me.
I can make something sturdy enough for a workshop, but not pretty enough for a cermony. Theres also an added complication that they want it sloping, 5 cm lower at the front than the back.

Can anyone suggest a VERY SIMPLE way of making this strong without complex angle tenons please?


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## custard (11 Mar 2018)

sunnybob":268f26wy said:


> Can anyone suggest a VERY SIMPLE way of making this strong without complex angle tenons please?



You've lots of options Bob, the simplest way is probably to start with the assumption that the legs will be two solid boards.







The legs are attached with dowels or loose tenons. The legs can be made a bit more appealing with a curve cut out on the lower edge (to get the two cut outs identical I'd make a female template from 9 or 12mm MDF, bandsaw to within 1mm of a pencilled line, then copy route with the template).

The legs have an angle on the top surface which automatically gives you your slope. Personally I'd plane the front and back edges of the top with the same angle so that they're plumb.

To prevent the cushion sliding off add a bead or moulding on the front edge of the top.

If you want a bit more strength a couple of curved wooden brackets could be glued and screwed to the underside. 

With the grain of the legs running vertically, and the grain of the top running from side to side, you'll have no differential shrinkage problems.


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## NickN (11 Mar 2018)

This sort of thing?


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## sunnybob (11 Mar 2018)

Nick, looking at that stool I've been grossly over engineering my plans. But i do like to over engineer to make up for my ignorance  :lol: 

Custard, The very brief sketch I was given had 4 actual legs.

My plan (!) was on the lines of using a 22 mm board, making the legs out of 4 x 22 m square pieces glued together to give 44 mm square. Then I was trying to get the walls to run with the grain the same way, but that got hard fast and from what you say isnt a good thing anyway.
I'm fully with you on making it level and then cutting the slope into the boards.

Bearing in mind my very basic equipment I cant work with any board wider than 180 mm, So now I'm still with the square legs, but the tops let in to allow 22 mm boards to meet with a 45 degree mitre so there will still be one 22 mm square piece supporting the back of the mitre.
As I have not made a tenon joint since secondary school woodwork class (OVER 50 years ago, and I failed the exam), I dont really want to start practising on this project. I have used dowels, so I could put dowels between the upright leg and the side walls?

My thinking on the top was more 22 mm planks edge glued and then screwed down, but is that over engineered again?


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## sunnybob (11 Mar 2018)

Or maybe just copy Nicks example? Even i could make that fairly easily.


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## Tasky (12 Mar 2018)

sunnybob":3ettiu90 said:


> Or maybe just copy Nicks example? Even i could make that fairly easily.


I think even *I* could possibly manage a reasonable copy of it!! :lol:


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## sunnybob (12 Mar 2018)

I've decided to be ambitious and build a proper one.
Giving him the quote tomorrow, will report back on what happens.


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## sunnybob (14 Mar 2018)

Oh well, didnt want to build a stool anyway.

He wanted hard wood furniture at plywood prices.
Said he could buy cheaper at ikea.
If he finds an iroku sloping stool with velvet cushion at ikea, regardless of price, he's a better shopper than I am.

I think he was angling for a free donation, but as I look silly in an apron I passed this by.
Slightly annoying really as I had quite gotten into the design of it. But it wouldnt fit in my house decoration scheme.


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## NickN (14 Mar 2018)

sunnybob":1b92u613 said:


> He wanted hard wood furniture at plywood prices.
> Said he could buy cheaper at ikea.
> If he finds an iroku sloping stool with velvet cushion at ikea, regardless of price, he's a better shopper than I am.



His loss, unless he strikes it lucky on Ebay with a vintage one - of which there are actually a few.

Anyone who says they can buy better (than handmade, hardwood) at Ikea has got rather poor taste, I'd say, so you may never have pleased him anyway.


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## Ttrees (14 Mar 2018)

Curious how you came up with a figure Sunnybob
Did you roughly estimate how much time it would take to build it, 
and give yourself whatever per hour on top of what the iroko costs?

Or did you look around on the bay to compare?

Sorry if its off topic,
I just find this interesting 
Agreed with NickN

Tom


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## sunnybob (14 Mar 2018)

I dont work for wages and barely make a profit on what I do so not much use if you do, but I suggested ply and he poo poohed it. He wanted varnished dark wood. He wanted it sloped and with a padded cushion.

Iroku is the most suitable wood I can get, and I would have needed a plank of it at about 40 euro. But then i had to buy a couple meters of velvet material, the cushion foam, and pay someone to make it. I reckoned over 70 in materials and outlay, without counting consumables, so I said around a 100 (bearing in mind I have NO skills and it would most likely take me a fortnight, and thats assuming I dont screw it up and have to start again).

He felt that 30 was a good price. So we parted friends.


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## Ttrees (14 Mar 2018)

Thanks for your reply
I find it interesting on what the price of "Iroko" is ...(what its called where I live)but in Cyprus instead.
I don't sell things or buy timber as its all reclaimed stuff I have.
Its nice to get an idea of the price of timber in small quantity's though...
I was wondering if the price has changed... It seems about the same as a few years ago to me.
Regards 
Tom


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## sunnybob (14 Mar 2018)

The clue is in the the word "Cyprus". Completely different supply chain and customer base.

I can buy really good "superior steamed" beech for less than 10 euro for a 2.5 metre x 170mm x 22mm plank.

Walnut is almost double that, bubinga is three times the price of beech.

but perversely, I only started woodworking here 3 years ago, I have absolutely no idea of UK wood prices.


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