# Anima - Box WIP



## Anima (14 Feb 2013)

Well here it is.

*The plan*

Having read an article recently on making a small jewelery box with a coopered lid made from mahogany I hope to replicate it with dovetails included somewhere (I can't find the original article). My box will either be used for storing candles or tea, I haven't quite decided yet.

I was intending to build this box even before the competition cam up so I thought about it a bit and decided I didn't really want to see the joints so came up with a a mitered blind dovetail joint as a solution.

Just like this






*The Inspiration*
The look I want is something like this but with out the dark wood sides:




Combined with this:





This is the rough plan I'm working to. I haven't quite decided whether it will have trays but If I do they will be walnut.





The problem is I didn't quite have all the tools I needed so went on a miniature spending spree.


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## Anima (14 Feb 2013)

*The Timber*
And this is the rippled sycamore that I picked up today.
Its 20mm thick which is a tad thicker than I wanted but it felt criminal just planning it down to 15/16mm so it will have to be a chunky box.











There is enough here to make two or three more projects so keep your eyes on this section.


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## Tierney (14 Feb 2013)

Hi, can't really see the plan picture. Timber looks nice though.

DT


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## Anima (14 Feb 2013)

Sorry about that ill try again tomorrow.I was having trouble photographing the white paper. It either came out too bright or too dark.


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## carlb40 (15 Feb 2013)

The white balance on your camera needs to be changed for the plan pic 

Nice plan and timber btw 

PS I hope the price for the handles is £12 not £1200 as it looks on the plan :shock: 
:lol:


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## Anima (15 Feb 2013)

*The Tools*
I took another one of the plan today and it seemed to turn out better, I'm afraid you will to zoom in a bit though.

No definitely £12.00 from Hawthorne crafts although from the reaction I got from the missus at the "expensive pile of sticks" you could be forgiven for thinking they cost £12000000000000000000.

The pile of tools I've bought so far:
Zona 24tpi Gents saw
Quengsheng low angle from aces&eights
Two quickgrips
Two hinges from Ian Hawthorne





I could still do with a very slim skew or fishtail chisel but I'm in no great rush.


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## marcros (15 Feb 2013)

lovely looking timber.


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## AndyT (15 Feb 2013)

I do love a project at the early, optimistic stage!

I know how you feel about wasting the wood, but think hard about what makes your inspiration boxes look good - they would not look nearly as nice with chunky, clumsy sides.


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## marcros (15 Feb 2013)

i was about to comment with the same as Andy- personally i think that 20mm wiuld be too chunky for a box of that size. If you had a bandsaw, you could cut a veneer or two off to save wasting it, but it would look far better at 15/16mm.


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## Anima (15 Feb 2013)

I tamed this down from the original dream box. After your post in my tea chest design thread I was originally going to do compound miter joints to get that oriental house shape, when the competition rules came out necessitating dovetails I got rid of the compound bit and inserted dovetails. I've also made a very rough mock up in some offcut oak to get the feel of the joint. I might need to cut some corners (get it hahahaha :? ) but we I'll see when I get there.

A veneer on the bandsaw is exactly the solution I came up with as well, its just that 150mm is approaching the max throat on my saw so it struggles a bit. I think a scraper will be my best friend on this as rippled syc has a tendency to tear as you can probably see in the picture.

Ian's hinges are 9mm wide otherwise I would go for 10-12mm (see handy picture of one of his boxes), basic miters and put a token dovetail in a tray somewhere. The chance are this will end as a candle box for the missus (to pacify her after the expense and the time I'm going to spend hiding away doing it) so trays will be unnecessary meaning the dovetails have to go in the corners.




If my box looks even 10% as good as that I'll be well happy.

I might have a cunning plan for the top but I'm keeping that to myself for now.
The bottom I'm still not decided on and will depend on the finish/lining/tray/time/budget and whether I do indeed give it to the better half or whether I keep it for myself. 

*Laying out*
Anyway heres a pic of the templates for the sides laid out on the living room floor so I could get an idea of what and where the grain is going and how the ripples will line up. The two curved sides are perfect where they are as the grain there curves almost identically to my rough template so should look good.


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## Anima (15 Feb 2013)

*The lid*

Before cutting up the sycamore I decided to make a mock up of the lid.

First off some plywood formers. Using some basic trigonometry and a router I made up accurate curves for a 40mm height over a 200mm span however it quickly became apparent that 30mm is a better height.





With that done I set about cutting up an old softwood scrap that I had loafing. It used to be one of those £20 canvas wardrobes from ARGOS, useful for storing clothes in lofts but not much else. Handily though it was a similar width and thickness to the sycamore so fairly representative.





After setting up the bandsaw for 85deg bevel and running the bits through I smoothed them out with my new plane and put them in the former. 

They still need adjusting slightly as I need to re-calculate the required bevel. As you can see from my first drawing for a 40mm curve it was Tan X 20/40 but now will be tan X 20/30.

Thats all for today folks


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## ColeyS1 (15 Feb 2013)

Looking good so far ! Looks like you building up quite a collection of tools


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## Anima (16 Feb 2013)

*The lid continued*
With the lid and the joints rehearsed I decided it was time to cut some sycamore. I figured the lid and its curve are the pivotal parts of the design as it will decide where the the sides and their rebates will go, so that is where I started.

Initially I was looking into ripping the highly figured smaller part in the first photos into bookmatched boards, joining them edge on and slicing them crossways for the coopering. However as the board is only 20mm the resultant bookmatched parts would only be 8mm after finishing which clearly isn't enough for a strong joint.

So I resolve to having non matching halves but still retaining the 'V' shape in the grain. 

First I ripped the board down to 16mm leaving a thin veneer. Apart form a small wobble as I changed position of my hands and used a push stick the boards are uniform +-0.3mm. I was quite chuffed with the veneer as this is the smallest I've tried to rip off.





I've kept the veneer as it may come in handy for the base. I'm also keeping all the offcuts so that when I'm done there should be some pen blanks up for grabs.

When I researched the timber I knew it would be hard to plane and get a smooth finish but I didn't expect it to be this hard!!! The plane wouldn't touch it so I resorted to sand paper...and would you believe it I got tear out...with sand paper! In the end I had to use medium paper to anywhere near a smooth face before moving on to the finer stuff.




Now I'm sure some more experienced people will say "you can't get tear out with sand paper" but I promise you I did.

I played around with the grain and I think it looked OK. Finer adjustments would obviously come later when I glued it up.





Because of the coopering running cross-ways and this join running forward-back the lid would essentially be a patchwork of rectangles. This means the joins would have to be pretty strong to withstand the planning and finishing to get the smooth look so I decided to add a spline to this join. I probably won't do it for the cross-ways coopering as the angles are a bit much for me to cope with. Any way out comes the router table.





I used some of the offcut sycamore for the spline so a)expansion/contraction should match and b) if for any far fetched reason some of it gets exposed it shouldn't look as bad as if I used something else.
And heres the final board glued up in clamps





And yes I'm a firm believer in "there's no such thing as too much glue".

Hopefully tomorrow I can start the coopering, fingers crossed.

I'm off to sharpen my plane irons, thats it for today folks.


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## rileytoolworks (16 Feb 2013)

You're making good progress on the box mate. That timber looks lovely.
Can't wait to see the progress.

Adam.


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## No skills (16 Feb 2013)

Cool, another wip and your making progress! 

Coopered lid looks interesting.


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## Apache_sim (16 Feb 2013)

How will the pieces of the lid be joined?


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## Anima (16 Feb 2013)

Ill cut the glued up board into strips crossways to the vertical joint. Ill the saw/plane a bevel of approx 85deg (calculations yet to be done). The strips will the be glued and strap clamped into the plywood templates I made.

Once dry I'll plane and sand it into an external curve. The internal curve is a problem as I don't have the appropriate plane and the prospect of sanding it round is too much. I'm open to suggestions or if anyone wants to loan me the plane...

Hope that helps apache_sim


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## Apache_sim (17 Feb 2013)

I really wish I could help with a plane the box looks great.
I was wondering if you would have to somehow strengthen the joins but I suppose the lid ends will provide suitable support.
As you can guess I am quite new to woodworking but have just started making boxes so am very interested in what you have created. But way too advance for me just now


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## carlb40 (17 Feb 2013)

Anima":2qpsp83t said:


> The internal curve is a problem as I don't have the appropriate plane and the prospect of sanding it round is too much. I'm open to suggestions or if anyone wants to loan me the plane...
> 
> Hope that helps apache_sim




Old wooden planes are not that expensive on ebay 

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Old-Wooden-Pl ... 257ab24759

Or something similar will help with the internal coopering. 

Or you could do what i am doing and making a Krenov style round bottom plane to do the curves on my box


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## Anima (17 Feb 2013)

The eBay option is tempting. 

My other plan was to make one myself. I was fortunate enough to receive a scrub plane from speeder1987 in the hand tool secret Santa. If I use the iron from that then make the body out of a sandwich of the pine I used for the practice lid I could then thread a coach bolt (or similar) through to hold the wedge and iron. Shape the sole etc etc. it wouldn't be very pleasant to look at nor would it last very long but it might just get the job done.


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## carlb40 (18 Feb 2013)

Sounds like a plan. As you have the blade already you may aswell make use of it


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## Gary Morris (18 Feb 2013)

looks lovely so far 

Gary


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## Anima (20 Feb 2013)

*The Plane.*
As discussed in a previous post I've decided to try and bodge a curved scraping plane. I glued a couple of pieces of scrap pine together and squared them up on the bandsaw. After cutting in half at different angles for the mouth and sandwiching between two full pieces of scrap I'm all glued up and just waiting for it to dry.





I know its a poor photo but hopefully with some imagination and my Secret Santa gift next to it you can see what I'm trying to achieve.

*The lid cont...*
Anyway back to the important bit.

The jointed lid boards are now dry so its time to take the plunge and cut it in to strips.
I decided the best way to go was to cut it into 6 x 40mm pieces and then cut the bevels after. Here you can see my home made rip fence; its a drastic improvement improvement on the silly little thing that came with it.





All six pieces laid out and numbered





You can see the amount of bevel required to get them to fit once in the former. I reckon its just over 85deg so thats what I set the bandsaw for and the remaining fractions of degrees would be planed off.





This is what happens if you forget that a rebate plane blade goes all the way across the sole and you catch it between the plane, vice and wood. I didn't even notice until blood was all of the wood. All I need now is some tears and the judges might award me some bonus points.









Planing was an absolute F***er. I never want to do it again. This timber fought me every inch of the way but in the end I got there and clamped it up dry. 





Hopefully you can still see the grain and pattern intact.





One small area on the inside where the boards don't quite fit so a little fettling needed which with this timber is a lot harder than it sounds. (another poor photo sorry)





All glued up and drying.





I haven't decided yet whether I want the 'V' in the lid heading towards me as you look at the box or away, I suspect it will be towards. 

The next step will be to smooth out the lid and route a small rebate around the edges so I can measure up precisely for the sides of the box. Currently I'm on track for the mandated size but there isn't any room for router disasters.

I'm also testing a square finished with danish oil. Whilst the ripple is great it also yellows the timber a fair bit so I'm thinking lacquer might be the way forward. I'm only 2 coats in at the moment so once the last ones on I'll post a pic for everyone.

Thats all folks.


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## barkwindjammer (20 Feb 2013)

A couple of nice old planes here Anima

http://www.oldtools.co.uk/tools/Emes_Ho ... o._18.html


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## marcros (20 Feb 2013)

the Americans seem to be a fan of wiping over an amber water based stain to pop the grain on maples. might be worth researching- it would be a shame to yellow it. Transtint is one that i have seen mentioned, but you cannot get it this side of the pond! here is one link http://www.targetcoatings.com/forum/vie ... t=1268,you either love the effect or hate it.


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## Anima (20 Feb 2013)

Cheers barkwind, there's a few on the bay as well. I'm just trying to bodge my own as an experiment really, in the likely event that it doesn't work Ill have to investigate buying one.

Marcros, Iv just bought some clear (supper blonde) shellac flakes to get that high gloss look on the image I posted at the beginning of the thread. Dying the wood underneath it hadn't occurred to me... Ummmmm ill give it some thought. To be honest finishing is not really something I do alot of. Most of projects stay as bare wood as I find it messy, tedious and fickle so like a coward I tend to just avoid it. I am well and truly out of my comfort zone on finishing this project.


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## Anima (22 Feb 2013)

*The plane finished*

The scrap pine sandwich is dry so I decided to trim and plane it to shape using the plywood formers as a guide.





I used a coach bolt to assist in wedging the blade in with a scrap piece of waney. I don't think mr Philly has anything to worry about.





Ugly as sin but hey, its about the wood not the tools.





Anyway enough of that distraction, back to the box to give it a test drive...

*The lid cont...*
Believe it or not but it worked and heres the proof.





Now don't get me wrong it isn't perfect and it does behaves like a scrub plane (no surprise) but it does get the job done. Mind you the blade has to be blindingly sharp to stop it tearing chunks out. I had to hone it 3 times in total just to do the inside. 

And yes, I did it again. In my excitement at the success I 'juggled' it from one hand to the other and caught it in the other. Like a tit I cut the finger next to the one I cut last time. Typing this update is very difficult.





Using the plane carcass as a sanding block I tidied up the the inside with super rough paper.




And yes my bench is an old TV unit on stilts. Ugly but functional.

I then planed up the outside of the lid. 




As you can see the joins are still visible but I gave them a quick sand and they faded a bit. The lesson here is that coopering is really a technique for darker woods...obvious now I think about it but hey I'm learning. 

Here is the inside planed up but before sanding. Notice the joins again look horrendous in the photo but no where near as bad in real life, I promise. I only have one light source hence the one camera angle in the pics and shadows along join lines.





Heres a pic showing the grain pattern complete with tear out marks and shadows. Rough sanding only half done.





I've decided to leave the bulk of the sanding till the end so I can do the whole box in one. 

If I'm honest, I'm a little worried about the join marks. I was aware that they would always be visible but didn't really appreciate the extent of it. Thankfullly the more I sand the more the disappear so we will see. We live and learn I spose.

*The finish*

Here is the piece of scrap with 3 coats of danish oil. Slight yellowing but not too bad. I'm kind of keen on the smooth finish achieved with shellac so I've got a bag of clear stuff awaiting mixing. I need some advice on combining finishes but thats for the finish forum.









Thats all folks.


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## carlb40 (22 Feb 2013)

Looking good here now 

I will see if i can find the link again. I came across on finishing curly maple. I can't post the pic of the finished article as it doesn't belong to me. But think they just mentioned using clear lacquer to finish the maple. And it was a damn fine finish on it and the maple was certainly popped 

EDIT

Found it 

http://www.google.co.uk/url?sa=i&rct=j& ... 6245083869


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## Anima (22 Feb 2013)

I'm sold on that finish. 

I'll mix up my shellac tomorrow, give it a couple of days to dissolve and maybe I'll have a test bit going by next weekend.


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## carlb40 (22 Feb 2013)

I found what equates to a 1/2 lb cut built up with about 5 applications gave me better results than 3applications of a 1lb cut 

Nice depth and shine to my plane handles


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## DMF (23 Feb 2013)

Great WIP with blood and guts! Less blood now please but carry on with the guts bit, curved lid, making a plane, the timber you have chosen etc its all beyond what i'd of attempted for my first box so thanks for making me reconsider that defeatist attitude!

Dean


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## Anima (23 Feb 2013)

Don't be put off. If I was a diver I would be one that aims for technical scores as opposed to execution. I added the blood for sympathy.

There are already mistakes but I've learnt a lesson from each of them. When I'm done I intend to post a cut list and the pointers so you(or anyone) can do it better than I have managed.


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## Melinda_dd (23 Feb 2013)

Anima":1bdo2my3 said:


> Don't be put off. If I was a diver I would be one that aims for technical scores as opposed to execution. I added the blood for sympathy.
> 
> There are already mistakes but I've learnt a lesson from each of them. When I'm done I intend to post a cut list and the pointers so you(or anyone) can do it better than I have managed.



That is a great idea. thank you for thinking of the other members


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## DMF (24 Feb 2013)

Anima":11mkacmu said:


> Don't be put off. .



Quite the oposite! In my head i was going to get a few bits of scrap and just try a couple of joints out, the more i read posts like yours though it's clear that's a silly idea!

Anyway looking forward to the next bit........


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## carlb40 (24 Feb 2013)

DMF":31q9zb8v said:


> Anima":31q9zb8v said:
> 
> 
> > Don't be put off. .
> ...



I always say the best way to learn is do.

So get those scraps and practice. In fact if the other members/mods don't mind? I suggest you join in ( unofficially) and build a box along side us, letting us help you as you go


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## stoatyboy (24 Feb 2013)

looking good and loving the wip

for the body - have you thought about mitres with dovetailed splines?

i've not read the rules but it might count and that way you could keep your original mitre plan

i've never done them myself though!!

cheers


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## Melinda_dd (24 Feb 2013)

stoatyboy":1keymnov said:


> looking good and loving the wip
> 
> for the body - have you thought about mitres with dovetailed splines?
> 
> ...



Be interested to know how you'd do them


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## carlb40 (24 Feb 2013)

Melinda_dd":1r9qks64 said:


> stoatyboy":1r9qks64 said:
> 
> 
> > looking good and loving the wip
> ...


Shows you in this 

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fT_5fV2yMlA

Just don't fall asleep watching him :lol:


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## Anima (3 Mar 2013)

*The Shellac*

Well I've tested the shellac. I applied around 6 layers of a thin mix of shellac and meths with a rubber. I sanded down between layers with 600 grit wet and dry which enabled me to get a really smooth finish. I'm slightly put off by the yellowing which appears worse in the pictures than in real life, but the grain is 'popped' and the wood has a wet look. I've got no idea how that chap obtained the clear finish in the link that Carl posted.










I got the flakes from this site because it seemed the most reasonable price for an experiment. 
http://www.ockenden-timber.co.uk/

I'll give this some more thought...

*The box*
I finished off the lid for now by routing some rebates around the edges ready to be inserted into the sides. To make the transition in different grain directions easier on the eye I think I might put a thin band of walnut in the lid.

There is almost certainly an easier way of doing this but where the lid meets the sides at funny angles on the front and back I had to do some smaller rebates. I had a bit of a nightmare with the router if truth be told. The cutter was brand new but the timber blunted it straightaway.





It looks a bit messy but there is a plan I promise.

With the lid done I measured up and cut the sides. I then squared them up on the shooting board in preparation for ripping to thickness.





Ripped to thickness on the bandsaw I'm left with some veneers. Handy for the base I think.





I then planed the sides smooth.





This really chewed up the plane blades so frequent sharpening is key. I now have some scrapers prepared so the next post should include some pics of that.

The next stage now is start cutting the joints followed by routing the rebates for the base and lid to sit in. Progress is being made but I'm conscious of time running out.

As always comments and suggestions are most welcome, in particular getting a clear shellac finish.


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## carlb40 (3 Mar 2013)

Looking good still 

Which shellac are you using? You can get 2 types of clear. Blonde and a super blonde shellac. Not sure how clear the lemon shellac is?


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## marcros (3 Mar 2013)

this may be of interest finish-comparison-for-birds-eye-maple-t62229.html?hilit=%20maple


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## Anima (3 Mar 2013)

Marcros,
Thanks, I read through that post when I did some research on shellac. The finish I have I closest to no4 and the chatoyanance stands out. Even if you move your head by just an inch the darks become lights and the lights become darks; quite fascinating.


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## marcros (3 Mar 2013)

i might have a little job for an offcut when the time comes...

I fancy making a little shoulder plane, obviously in return for a few beer tokens!


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## Gerard Scanlan (3 Mar 2013)

Really great WIP. Glad to see for the time being you have stepped away from blood stain as a finish. It is at times like this that I wonder if we need an extra forum topic 'Home First Aid and A&E' or something. Avoiding injury is of course priority No1 but little accidents are usually lurking where you least expect to meet them. And when I cut myself by accident the last thing I think of is bleeding over the keyboard to search to see if any forum members have useful suggestions I just grab a plaster. Although watching experienced woodworkers and adopting their practices really helps. Anyway I am looking forward to seeing the next instalment.


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## Anima (3 Mar 2013)

marcros":2mgayhos said:


> i might have a little job for an offcut when the time comes...
> 
> I fancy making a little shoulder plane, obviously in return for a few beer tokens!



There will be plenty of offcuts. It's all 20mm thick so if that's any good, you are of course welcome to some. I should have some lumps suitable for pen blanks if the turners are interested.

Based on gasman's success with his butlers table I'm going to give finishing oil a go so watch this space.

My problem is I am too excitable. If something goes well I have a strange juggling impulse... (that caused the seconds cut). I must admit I'm a bit worried about the injuries I'm going to suffer when doing the dovetails next week.


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## riclepp (5 Mar 2013)

Gerard Scanlan":1fhde6ck said:


> Really great WIP. Glad to see for the time being you have stepped away from blood stain as a finish. It is at times like this that I wonder if we need an extra forum topic 'Home First Aid and A&E' or something. Avoiding injury is of course priority No1 but little accidents are usually lurking where you least expect to meet them. And when I cut myself by accident the last thing I think of is bleeding over the keyboard to search to see if any forum members have useful suggestions I just grab a plaster. Although watching experienced woodworkers and adopting their practices really helps. Anyway I am looking forward to seeing the next instalment.




Plaster, what are these? I thought it was either superglue or black electrical tape.


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