# Ummm. How do you deal with this one?



## flanajb (20 Nov 2015)

My daughter's boyfriend is a really nice guy, but has an annoying habit of not washing his hands after go to the toilet :-(

My wife and I have both noticed it, but no idea what to say. It's grosd and driving us both nuts.

They are with us for a week too.


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## Lons (20 Nov 2015)

flanajb":11d8x0ka said:


> My daughter's boyfriend is a really nice guy, but has an annoying habit of not washing his hands after go to the toilet :-(
> 
> My wife and I have both noticed it, but no idea what to say. It's grosd and driving us both nuts.
> 
> They are with us for a week too.



Stick up a notice in the bog saying "NOW WASH YOUR HANDS"


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## 8squared (20 Nov 2015)

Just come out and ask has he washed, I sure he'll be more embarrassed that he hasn't and you noticed than you will be by asking.


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## CHJ (20 Nov 2015)

Stick notice in the toilet.

'Now wash your hands'

Do you really want that standard of hygiene in the family, ructions yes, but it's better than it festering.


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## flanajb (20 Nov 2015)

I can't be blunt so will ask my daughter to sort it. Out he comes and then goes in the kitchen to help himself to food :-(


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## rafezetter (20 Nov 2015)

Take him to one side and tell him. There's no pretty way to do it, so do it straight with no waffle and you can be as polite or as blunt as you like - to the effect of "my wife and I aren't happy about touching things like door handles when your hands have been on your **** without being washed after you use the toilet" That'll hit him like a sledgehammer, but he won't do it again. Sometimes only a sledgehammer will get the point across in a way they won't forget. Caveat, if he does do it again, tell your daughter he's no longer welcome in the household and tell her why, getting ill because of his disgusting behaviour just isn't worth it. 

If he's not doing it after peeing - there's no guarentee he's doing it automatically after defecating, and if that isn't enough incentive, to get hard on him, then nothing is.


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## rafezetter (20 Nov 2015)

flanajb":3biycfkb said:


> I can't be blunt so will ask my daughter to sort it. Out he comes and then goes in the kitchen to help himself to food :-(



I'm sorry - I really am but you're going to have to man up and deal with this if he is still doing it tommorrow - which means your daughter has avoided the issue.

Straight from the toilet into the kitchen? sorry no - not now, not ever. Do you or anyone else in your family want to get sick? 

Here's an offer: give me his number and I'll be the hitman - wouldn't be the first time either, I've told people leaving public toilets to wash their hands after leaving a stall.. and I do it loud enough to make it stick.

I'm NOT a germophobe and sorry if this comes across so aggressive but I know they would not like it the other way, they just don't think of the possible consequences.


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## Phil Pascoe (20 Nov 2015)

I worked in a hotel for a few decades - I suspect 80% of people don't. It has never been known to cause an outbreak of food poisoning - every major outbreak has been caused by bad storage and refrigeration of foodstuffs. Don't panic - it might be an unpleasant thought, but it won't kill you.


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## Phil Pascoe (20 Nov 2015)

Just a thought - there is a much greater chance of my putting something unpleasant on my foreskin from my hands than there is on my putting something unpleasant on hands from my foreskin.


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## Fishandchips (20 Nov 2015)

Just tell him go back and wash your hands you mucky sod!

The straighter and more direct will through the embarrassment straight back on his shoulders where it belongs. 

Maybe it's northern thing


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## Phil Pascoe (20 Nov 2015)

What? Not washing them?


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## Mr_P (21 Nov 2015)

He means we don't do subtle, we tell it straight.

One of my exes was from Kent and it used to drive her mad. 
The subtle thing not the other, gross.


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## monkeybiter (21 Nov 2015)

IMHO....
Tell your daughter 'he's your guest in our home, ask him to start washing, in any style you want, blaming anyone you want, but if he doesn't you'll give him the 'do it or get out' ultimatum. I reckon that'll probably sort it.


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## Graham Orm (21 Nov 2015)

I find that stomach churning. Why not do a role play with your daughter. Let her in on it and get her to go from bathroom to kitchen, then say 'I hope you washed your hands!' while he is in ear shot.

I remember seeing something about it on TV. After wiping your bum, even with 3 sheets the bacteria stay on your hands and are left on everything you touch.


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## niagra (21 Nov 2015)

I'm sure it'll be grossing out your daughter, get her to tell him.


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## ColeyS1 (21 Nov 2015)

I wash my hands after having a dump but not so much after taking a pee. It's only skin, the same as what covers the rest of your body. When I take a leak it comes out a hole in the end.Its not like it's a high pressure watering can rose and the stuffs going in all directions getting all over my hands, in my eyes over the walls. It'd be quite entertaining if it did, but generally it goes from a to b and I hold the bit that transports it to its final destination. 
If it bothers you enough I'd deliberately give him food poisoning then say 'perhaps it's cause you don't wash your hands after having a pee' or words to that effect 

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


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## flanajb (21 Nov 2015)

Graham Orm":2tyufvu6 said:


> Why not do a role play with your daughter. Let her in on it and get her to go from bathroom to kitchen, then say 'I hope you washed your hands!' while he is in ear shot.



That's a subtle approach. I'll give that a try later.


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## RobinBHM (21 Nov 2015)

It always bugs me that all public toilets have open in, inner doors. The only way out is to use the handle, which totally negates the hand washing. If its a busy place, I often wait until somebody comes in.

back on topic....does he also leave the toilet seat up? (mind you Ive known some just leave it down and pee through it).


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## RobinBHM (21 Nov 2015)

You could just ask him to read this thread!


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## JSW (21 Nov 2015)

RobinBHM":rr89c8y7 said:


> You could just ask him to read this thread!



Problem solved. Quite brilliant actually.

Or. As Jimmy Carr would say ... "I wash Mr. Tinkle first thing in the morning .. then I'm good for eight hours"


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## Lons (21 Nov 2015)

It's disgusting and absolutely no excuse except for being downright lazy imho. Takes 30 seconds so what's the problem with anyone failing to do so?

I certainly wouldn't put up with it and I'd be blunt hence my suggestion to stick up a notice and if that didn't work I'd tell him straight. easy to be blunt without being nasty.
If he's a decent lad he'll be anxious to make a good impression on his partners' parents, so do him and yourselves a favour and help him do that - by telling him. (hammer).

I also get annoyed when people walk out of public toilets without washing their hands and have been known to tell them. No bl**dy wonder we're using far to many antibiotics! :evil: 

Rant over


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## ColeyS1 (21 Nov 2015)

This is 100% true, I've just watched my dog take a number 2 on the lawn and come straight back in and eat his breakfast . The filthy mut didn't even wipe his backside! Tonight that backside will probably be sat on my lap watching t.v- absolutely disgusting 
I've seen a full blown family argument whilst visiting a zoo before because the father had forgot to pack the disinfectant spray.Crikey how did we ever manage before everything became so sterile !
When I was a kid I'd be eating wild strawberries and blackberry's from the hedges, other kids had to wait for them to be washed when they got home. We're only on this earth a very short time, live dangerously 

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


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## dzj (21 Nov 2015)

In a hotel restroom, I once saw a guy washing his thumb and index finger only.
Talk about minimalism...


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## JandK (21 Nov 2015)

There is less bacteria on toilet seats than on lift buttons..........


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## Lons (21 Nov 2015)

JandK":1siolqna said:


> There is less bacteria on toilet seats than on lift buttons..........



That's because some pr**k has come straight from the toilet into the lift #-o


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## Woody2Shoes (21 Nov 2015)

I've always thought that you can tell quite a lot about someone based on whether they wash hands before/during/after/not-at-all when relieving themselves...


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## Phil Pascoe (21 Nov 2015)

I wonder how many people getting neurotic about hand washing use dishcloths? They are proven in many cases to be absolutely loaded with germs, as are unclean tea towels.


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## Phil Pascoe (21 Nov 2015)

"No bl**dy wonder we're using far to many antibiotics! :evil:" - Bob.
Maybe it's because we're obsessively clean?


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## KevM (21 Nov 2015)

Probably apocryphal, but:

Young man [after seeing Churchill leave the bathroom without washing his hands]: 
At Eton, they taught us to wash our hands after using the toilet.

Churchill: At Harrow, they taught us not to water on our hands.


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## Tom K (21 Nov 2015)

I thinks it's bloody disgusting and I hope you don't kiss your daughter when you greet her either!


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## Lons (21 Nov 2015)

phil.p":3osojcm3 said:


> Maybe it's because we're obsessively clean?



There is of course some truth in that Phil.

However: If somebody perversley want me to touch their d*ck, Id much rather be asked (so I can refuse :lol: ) than be forced to indirectly without my knowledge with a shake of the hand. #-o 

I'm part of a medical family, in fact the only 2 who aren't are myself and my son. With 3 nurses plus my wife now retired, 1 GP and a retired surgeon and his wife a retired matron. I think you'd get short shrift from all of them. Maybe the surgeon shouldn't have bothered washing his hands before carrying out heart operations! 



> I wonder how many people getting neurotic about hand washing use dishcloths? They are proven in many cases to be absolutely loaded with germs, as are unclean tea towels.



Absolutely spot on Phil but it doesn't change things, one wrong doesn't make a right! My missus changes dishcloths and tea towels every day, drives me nuts 'cos she often forgets to put out the new ones. :lol: I usually don't notice until I've washed my hands and find no handtowel within reach. :roll: 

Generally in my experience, people who I consider have poor hygene in one area often have the same attitude across the board.


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## Phil Pascoe (21 Nov 2015)

We always use the cheap throwaway sponge scourers (which are useful in a 'shop sometimes). My sister was a theatre sister and she always said the worst people for not keeping their hands clean were ... consultants.


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## Lons (21 Nov 2015)

phil.p":2wgeqcao said:


> We always use the cheap throwaway sponge scourers (which are useful in a 'shop sometimes). My sister was a theatre sister and she always said the worst people for not keeping their hands clean were ... consultants.



We do the same as you Phil and I pinch all the scrubbers well before they're worn out. The dishcloths are used for wiping surfaces with the appropriate spray stuff but she uses disposable cloths as well.

Interesting about consultants as I've met a lot socially over the years and it's not my experience. The worst people by a country mile though are the "overseas" docs in the hospitals. One example was a junior doc from Malaya who shared a kitchen with my daughter in the nurses home. She would cook a huge pan of rice at a weekend and it would last her the whole week. It stood on the bench and she'd warm up the whole pan every time she wanted some. Must have had a cast iron stomach. It's a culture difference in attitudes. Some of the cleanest I've come across are Indians and the worst by far the Chinese.

I was in the plastics industry many moons ago and the local authority would tip me the wink in advance of them raiding all the local takaways so I'd stock up with wall cladding materials. The establishments I was called out to afterwards were stomach churning and put me off for life. :shock:


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## n0legs (21 Nov 2015)

Take him by the scruff and sort him out.


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## RogerS (21 Nov 2015)

One thing I'm still trying to get to grips with and that is ...



flanajb":2vx8op4d said:


> My daughter's boyfriend is a really nice guy, but has an annoying habit of not washing his hands after go to the toilet :-(
> 
> *My wife and* I have both noticed it, but no idea what to say. It's grosd and driving us both nuts.
> 
> They are with us for a week too.



...what is your wife doing in the loo at the same time as he is ? :lol:


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## DrPhill (21 Nov 2015)

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-20324304


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## Phil Pascoe (21 Nov 2015)

We used to have a guy repair commercial kitchen equipment who had a tripod rigged up over an incinerator in his back garden. He used to replace motors on kebab spits in the takeaways and take the old one and hang it over a smokey fire to get the cockroaches out before stripping it down. He reckoned he'd never had a motor from a takeaway that wasn't full of cockroaches. My friend mentioned this to his cousin, who was an EHO and his cousin said they didn't bother with the takeaways as they were immediately accused of racism. (This was a few years ago).


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## Phil Pascoe (21 Nov 2015)

Bob - One of the commonest causes of food poisoning in takeaways is reheated rice due to the protein content being high. We had several cases in our area 12 or 13 years ago of food poisoning caused by lettuce. They were Spanish, and as there was a water shortage in Spain some farmers had decided it was a good idea to water their lettuce with raw sewage.


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## Lons (21 Nov 2015)

phil.p":3f7s9xff said:


> Bob - One of the commonest causes of food poisoning in takeaways is reheated rice due to the protein content being high. We had several cases in our area 12 or 13 years ago of food poisoning caused by lettuce. They were Spanish, and as there was a water shortage in Spain some farmers had decided it was a good idea to water their lettuce with raw sewage.



Agreed rice is one of the main culprits unfortunately as the spores present are not always killed during cooking and when left at room temp they grow dangerous bacteria. From memory though I thought rice was quite low in protein, must look that up.

My experiences with the restaurants and takeaways was a long time ago but the main causes were several.

A serious lack of cleanliness with build up of grease and dirty cloths.
Waste food not cleaned up or disposed of properly leading to cockroach and rat infestations.
Raw meat in contact with cooked food
Stored food left in the open instead of a fridge, they were often broken anyway.
AND.... poor or non existant hand washing and toilet facilities.

I forgot to mention my medical family also has two microbiologists who at that time worked in the Newcastle labs. We had a black list of where not to eat some of which would have raised a few eyebrows.

Not surprised at the bbc report as surely the wc is the most cleaned place in most households as it should be. Still doesn't make me want to "shake hands" with yours or anyone elses' penis though. No offence intended Phil. :lol: :lol:

_Edit: More than I thought tbh but still only around 5 grams per 150 so not that high._


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## Sporky McGuffin (22 Nov 2015)

Lons":1cyt2k1p said:


> Agreed rice is one of the main culprits unfortunately as the spores present are not always killed during cooking and when left at room temp they grow dangerous bacteria. From memory though I thought rice was quite low in protein, must look that up.



As I recall the spores need much higher temperatures to destroy them, and the toxins the bacteria produce aren't affected by heat at all. If you're going to reheat rice it needs to be cooled very quickly after the first cooking.

I thought rice had about the same protein content as potatoes - around 2-3%.


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## doorframe (22 Nov 2015)

Not washing his hands after draining the lizard isn't so bad. The main question is, does he pick his nose at the dinner table?


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## Phil Pascoe (22 Nov 2015)

Iirc rice isn't particularly high in protein, but high enough to cause a problem. I remember listening to Professor Sir Hugh Pennington being interviewed on the radio a long while ago during a government campaign to get people to wash their hands after going to the toilet. He said he had been involved with every major major food poisoning case in the UK for n amount of years, and every one had all been cause by either bad storage or bad refrigeration. In the greater scheme of things, unpleasant as the thought was, hand washing made little difference.


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## Jonzjob (22 Nov 2015)

Another thought for all the ranting?

How many of you actually use a bidet after a no2?? 

How many just spread it all around with a bit of toilet paper and then go about ranting at folk who don't wash their hands??

I often heard the 2 theories on washing after a pee. One was that you should always wash them after and the second was you shouldn't pee on them in the first place :mrgreen: The first was often used by our IBM salesmen and the other was by us IBM hardware service engineers :twisted:


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## RogerS (22 Nov 2015)

Urine is aseptic. You can drink it. Preferably chilled.


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## bugbear (22 Nov 2015)

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hygiene_hypothesis

BugBear (grew up on a farm, immune to everything)


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## Phil Pascoe (22 Nov 2015)

Jonzjob":1z6afmou said:


> Another thought for all the ranting?
> 
> How many of you actually use a bidet after a no2??
> 
> ...


What's a bidet?


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## Jonzjob (22 Nov 2015)

RogerS":ikdub26v said:


> Urine is aseptic. You can drink it. Preferably chilled.



It's called lager init?? :wink: :wink:


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## Phil Pascoe (22 Nov 2015)

French wine.


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## Doug B (22 Nov 2015)

Jonzjob":3ss95cm1 said:


> RogerS":3ss95cm1 said:
> 
> 
> > Urine is aseptic. You can drink it. Preferably chilled.
> ...



Watneys Red Barrel when I was a youth ccasion5:


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## Jonzjob (22 Nov 2015)

phil.p":3tsjp194 said:


> French wine.



Well, maybe bo-jolly-newvau :shock: :shock: What a marketing success that was and a way to get c r a p wine sold to the British :twisted: :twisted:


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## Graham Orm (22 Nov 2015)

flanajb":1882c8e4 said:


> Graham Orm":1882c8e4 said:
> 
> 
> > Why not do a role play with your daughter. Let her in on it and get her to go from bathroom to kitchen, then say 'I hope you washed your hands!' while he is in ear shot.
> ...



Did it work?


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## Sporky McGuffin (22 Nov 2015)

Jonzjob":17eocvcr said:


> just spread it all around with a bit of toilet paper



Are you sure you know how to use toilet paper?


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## Phil Pascoe (22 Nov 2015)

Jonzjob":2wk0ql6y said:


> phil.p":2wk0ql6y said:
> 
> 
> > French wine.
> ...



We gave up on that after we had to cut it 50 - 50 with plonk before our chefs would use the surplus for cooking because it was so acidic.
I always think of the Australian chef who said that there was nothing at all wrong with French wine, he wouldn't cook with anything else.


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## RogerS (22 Nov 2015)

Doug B":20h47nlk said:


> Jonzjob":20h47nlk said:
> 
> 
> > RogerS":20h47nlk said:
> ...



I thought that Red Barrel was like making love in a canoe?


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## Phil Pascoe (22 Nov 2015)

No, that was Watney's Starlight.


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## Jonzjob (22 Nov 2015)

Sporky McGuffin":9fpdep5d said:


> Jonzjob":9fpdep5d said:
> 
> 
> > just spread it all around with a bit of toilet paper
> ...



A question? 

:wink: If you get mud on yer hands and wipe it with a tissue does it all come off or do you have to wash it off :twisted:


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## Sporky McGuffin (22 Nov 2015)

I thought we were talking about bums. If you've got it on your hands you definitely aren't using the paper right!


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## Tom K (22 Nov 2015)

Jonzjob":3tm4xiut said:


> Sporky McGuffin":3tm4xiut said:
> 
> 
> > Jonzjob":3tm4xiut said:
> ...



Depends on the consistency of the mud besides I bet your Mum told you "what you can't see won't harm yer"

As an aside do you remember school toilet paper? Like wiping your arsch on bit of greaseproof paper :shock:


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## Jonzjob (22 Nov 2015)

Commonly known as the death of a thousand cuts in the R.A.F. :shock:


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## Tom K (22 Nov 2015)

Jonzjob":zfqv01uy said:


> Commonly known as the death of a thousand cuts in the R.A.F. :shock:



No bidet back then strictly hand stands in the shower (homer) and then worry about the runoff!


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## Woodchips2 (22 Nov 2015)

Tom K":3ijum34h said:


> As an aside do you remember school toilet paper? Like wiping your arsch on bit of greaseproof paper :shock:



I went to a junior school where the toilets were in the school yard miles away from the school :lol: The toilet paper was kept in a holder outside the headmaster's room and you had to knock on the door and ask for the toiler paper. He begrudgingly gave you two sheets :roll: Times were 'ard in them days (hammer) 

Regards Keith


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## doorframe (22 Nov 2015)

All this talk about toilet paper is getting too much. I was watching an astronomy programme the other night and the presenter asked his guest "_Is There a Ring of Debris around Uranus?_" #-o


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## Lons (22 Nov 2015)

doorframe":3e6zj0ls said:


> All this talk about toilet paper is getting too much. I was watching an astronomy programme the other night and the presenter asked his guest "_Is There a Ring of Debris around Uranus?_" #-o



:lol: :lol: :lol: 

There are a few people on here taking the p*ss (excuse the pun). Wonder if the op has had a word in the lads' lughole? :wink:


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## DrPhill (22 Nov 2015)

Tom K":28dn5666 said:


> As an aside do you remember school toilet paper? Like wiping your arsch on bit of greaseproof paper :shock:



Best description that I heard was "like trying to mop up coffee with a record sleeve"........


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## Bm101 (22 Nov 2015)

I'd just take him aside and say it. Job done. Get it over with.
'Do me a favour son, wash your hands when you've been to the toilet. We all need to watch our hygiene around food and so on. There's a good lad' Then move on to something else like it never happened. He knows hes been told. He respects you for moving on and not making an issue of it.
10 seconds he'll be embarrassed and then he'll do it.
Don't forget. 
Dad Power.
He's a young lad. We all need to learn sometimes. And sometimes we learn by being told. My house. That ain't acceptable. But do it the right way and he'll respect you for it.


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## Graham Orm (22 Nov 2015)

DrPhill":8rwe1lh0 said:


> Tom K":8rwe1lh0 said:
> 
> 
> > As an aside do you remember school toilet paper? Like wiping your arsch on bit of greaseproof paper :shock:
> ...



Izal


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## Bm101 (22 Nov 2015)

Still got the scars.


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## Sporky McGuffin (22 Nov 2015)

Bm101":25d2xys9 said:


> I'd just take him aside and say it. Job done. Get it over with.



I concur.

Though I might go for a more blunt "In this house we wash our hands. You are in this house."


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## Claymore (22 Nov 2015)

The locals around don't even use paper ..... no wonder they filmed The Wicker Man here lol some strange goings on and its more like a documentary than a fictional movie 9-)
As for the boyfriend just stick a notice up in the bathroom to remind him and if he doesn't improve...... don't eat any sandwiches he prepares


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## Phil Pascoe (22 Nov 2015)

I wash my hands before touching or preparing other people's food. That's it. In the greater scheme of things, it doesn't matter one iota.


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## thick_mike (23 Nov 2015)

I'm a chemist. With the stuff I use in the lab, I wash my hands before I go to the loo.


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## rafezetter (23 Nov 2015)

Jonzjob":nhwk5cau said:


> Another thought for all the ranting?
> 
> How many of you actually use a bidet after a no2??
> 
> ...



As I've had a quite acerbic /rant about this I'll say my method of dealing with the necessary - I use toilet paper, then a couple of wetwipes designed for babies, wash my hands with antibacterial (carex etc) then a squidge of the alcohol based gel you get in hospitals. It doesn't take that much longer, and I'm confident I'm 99% safe when eating my sandwiches etc and it's 1 less person passing their germs around.

Even if you shower everyday your groin is still a place for bacteria to grow and there's nothing nice nor acceptable about spreading around your betty swallocks.


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## ColeyS1 (23 Nov 2015)

What happens if you get took short somewhere and have to take a leak by the hedge?


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## Phil Pascoe (23 Nov 2015)

You die a very nasty death, of course.


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## Graham Orm (23 Nov 2015)

Happened to me on holiday in Austria once. We went with a walking party in the forest. We were supposed to be skiing no idea why we went walking. My darling ex wife had packed only fruit in our lunch!! It went straight through me and I had to go....we were in a young part of the forest and the only hiding place was a narrow tree, my only paper was my underpants......embarrassed? Noooooooo. It was 25 years ago and I still cringe at the thought. And no I didn't wash my hands until we got back.


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## DrPhill (23 Nov 2015)

Interestingly, in some parts of the world it is better to wash a wound in urine (fresh from the spiggot) than it is to wash the wound in water. IIRC, barring a urinary tract infection urine is sterile. It has just been biologically microfiltered.

What lives on Betty Swallocks (or Mary Hinge come to that) is another matter entirely.


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## doorframe (23 Nov 2015)

I have always struggled to get in touch with my inner self....... until today.

That's the last time I buy Tesco Value toilet roll (hammer)


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## ColeyS1 (23 Nov 2015)

Sounds like you had a bit of a breakthrough 

Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk


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## RogerS (23 Nov 2015)

ColeyS1":3ikkkn4h said:


> Sounds like you had a bit of a breakthrough
> 
> Sent from my SM-G900F using Tapatalk



No, he was finally able to put his finger on it.


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## Claymore (23 Nov 2015)

LOL


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## mind_the_goat (23 Nov 2015)

Before worrying too much about about bacteria growing in those little nooks and crannies it's worth remembering that, by numbers, the human body contains up to 10 times more non human cells than human ones. 
Also out of variations in gut bacteria is being linked to many diseases and conditions, a Fecal Transplant is a real thing, obviously under strictly controlled conditions, which has been shown to help help in some cases.


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## doorframe (24 Nov 2015)

What have Captain Kirk, and loo roll, got in common?
.
.
.
They both wipe-out Klingons!




Ok, it's an oldie, but it always makes me chortle.


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## RobinBHM (24 Nov 2015)

The origins of the bacteria used in live yogurt are slightly disturbing!

http://www.meghantelpner.com/blog/is-th ... -rat-poop/


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## flh801978 (25 Nov 2015)

Come on Flana were all on tenterhooks wondering what happened?


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## John Brown (26 Nov 2015)

RobinBHM":2lvzwfwe said:


> The origins of the bacteria used in live yogurt are slightly disturbing!
> 
> http://www.meghantelpner.com/blog/is-th ... -rat-poop/



I thought the whole probiotic thing had now been consigned to the total pineapples folder.


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## Dovetaildave (29 Nov 2015)

Nearly 9AM, morning dump due................followed quickly by few steps to breakfast table and cross contamination to begin "pass the jam please". :twisted: 

Great been looking for a chance to use the Evil" ......emoticon


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