# Narex chisels not happy



## matjos26 (14 Nov 2013)

After doing a bit of research and asking advise i bought one beveled edge Narex chisel to see what they were like for myself and i though it was rubbish the metal had machine marks on and the ferule was sort of blemished, the printing was not strait and the narex name on the handle was not complete it was rusty and just felt like a cheap tool the Stanley 5002 i have are much better quality. after reading newer reviews it seems that Narex have lowered their standards. pity


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## JustBen (14 Nov 2013)

That's a shame. I was hoping to get a set soon. 
Glad you mentioned it.

Was it the 8116 or the 8105?


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## matjos26 (14 Nov 2013)

8116 beveled edge chisel, it cut well but im very disappointed with it for the price i was at least expecting something a bit better


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## Muina (14 Nov 2013)

To be honest the narex chisels have never appealed to me too much, although their 1 thou hollow back does interest me as something to try out


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## undergroundhunter (14 Nov 2013)

I have a set of the premium bevel edge and mortice chisels that I bought over a year ago now from Classic Hand tools, I have to agree about the ferules all mine do appear blemished and I don't think they are solid brass (plated maybe). The machine marks did take a little time to get out and in the process I lost most of the printed branding on the blades, but for the price the steel is good and they hold their edge well (mine do anyway I have heard some are better than others). So all in all I'm happy with them but then I'm a weekend woodworker not a pro so I don't mind spending an hour or so flattening the backs of chisels and sharpening them up. I would buy them again so I say buy one prep it and try it see how you get on if you like them buy more.

Matt


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## Peter Sefton (14 Nov 2013)

We sell and use the Narex chisels and for the price I feel they are very good, we have the 8116 Cabinet Makers chisels which are ground to a fine edge on the lands but will require work on the backs to bring them to a polished finish. The ferrules are strong but not as clean as English made brands from either Ashley Iles or Sorby. The AI are better finished and will take less fettling and will hold a keener edge for longer than the Narex but that's why they cost around £10 per chisel more. The printing on the Narex will normally wear or wipe off if cleaned with thinners. The Veritas O1 are very good and finding favour in my own tool kit our and do out perform the AI but are more than double the price. 

I am very keen on the Narex 8112 Mortice chisels and think that are excellent chisels for the price, the steel is hard working and they come with workman like handles with two ferrules. We refit them with Box handles which I feel makes them look and feel so much better - they still come in £10 less than the Sorby Sash Mortice chisels and less than half the price of the LN. 

I have never had any complaints about the Narex but I have never over sold them, they have a very good place in the market at their price point. 

I will be at Harrogate show next weekend demonstrating with them all, if you are going come along and see them all in the flesh.

In my opinion
The Narex are very good for a budget chisel
The Ashley Iles are a great all rounder for furniture making and the Veritas are on my Christmas list.

Cheers Peter


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## G S Haydon (14 Nov 2013)

I have a narex mortice chisel and it is a nice item for the price. I felt I got what I paid for, a good quality tool. I also recently bought a AI MKII Bevel Edge which is quite simply the most lovely tool to use. If you are not happy with the Narex give them a go, I don't think you would be disappointed.


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## markturner (14 Nov 2013)

Thing is, you get what you pay for generally with tools. If you want faultless finish, beautiful wood, lovely brass, a nice box, top quality steel, and excellent performance, then spend the money on Veritas or lie nielsen. There is a reason why they cost what they do.........

if you just want a good basic chisel, the Narex is fine. I have both, I use the Narex for site work and jobs where it will take a bit of abuse. For fine work I use my Lie Nielsen.........I also have a set of the Ashley Isles dovetail chisels and they are very nice...but not as pretty as the Lie Nielsens, which are the supermodel of chisels.......


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## bugbear (15 Nov 2013)

matjos26":2tlrfmdz said:


> After doing a bit of research and asking advise i bought one beveled edge Narex chisel to see what they were like for myself and i though it was rubbish the metal had machine marks on and the ferule was sort of blemished, the printing was not strait and the narex name on the handle was not complete it was rusty and just felt like a cheap tool the Stanley 5002 i have are much better quality. after reading newer reviews it seems that Narex have lowered their standards. pity



You comments seem to apply to the cosmetics and finish; how were they to fettle, sharpen and use?

BugBear


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## Graham Orm (15 Nov 2013)

I've just taken delivery of a set of six 8116's from Workshop Heaven. They all have straight lettering and look fine. The grinding marks are to be expected and dealt with before sharpening. The only let down is the ferrules which are clearly plated and let the look of the tools down but i won't be letting that stop me. I've not tried them or sharpened them as they are an xmas present from SWIMBO, I had to twist her arm to let me open the box and 'check them' :mrgreen: 

Can you post a picture Matt?


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## Graham Orm (15 Nov 2013)

G S Haydon":28yhxzuq said:


> I have a narex mortice chisel and it is a nice item for the price. I felt I got what I paid for, a good quality tool. I also recently bought a AI MKII Bevel Edge which is quite simply the most lovely tool to use. If you are not happy with the Narex give them a go, I don't think you would be disappointed.



Graham..........can you say why the A.I chisel feels so much better? I would hope they do for the price, but how?


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## Graham Orm (15 Nov 2013)

matjos26":1y6z0kw6 said:


> After doing a bit of research and asking advise i bought one beveled edge Narex chisel to see what they were like for myself and i though it was rubbish the metal had machine marks on and the ferule was sort of blemished, the printing was not strait and the narex name on the handle was not complete it was rusty and just felt like a cheap tool the Stanley 5002 i have are much better quality. after reading newer reviews it seems that Narex have lowered their standards. pity



Just re-read this. You say it was rusty??? My new ones all have a layer of fine oil on them.....did you buy it new?

What reviews???


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## Cheshirechappie (15 Nov 2013)

Grayorm":38pt7abp said:


> G S Haydon":38pt7abp said:
> 
> 
> > I have a narex mortice chisel and it is a nice item for the price. I felt I got what I paid for, a good quality tool. I also recently bought a AI MKII Bevel Edge which is quite simply the most lovely tool to use. If you are not happy with the Narex give them a go, I don't think you would be disappointed.
> ...



Not wanting to tread on (either) Graham's toes, but I thought I'd add my comments on the AI chisels. I've had some for about 18 months, and I love 'em. Why? Well, there's nothing flashy or fancy about them; no gimmicks. They are just a proper, old-fashioned top quality cabinetmaker's bench chisel. I think the reason for that is that the makers have just done the basics, but done them really well. The steel is good, takes a good edge and holds it well. Probably not as well as some of the fancy new steels, but as well as my vintage Sheffield chisels. The grinding is superb - good finish all over with no 'machining marks', nice fine even bevels as thin as the best vintage examples, and the flat back very slightly concave so initial honing was very quick and easy. The ferrules are nice and tight. The handles are nicely finished, comfortable to the hand, and suit the blade size well so the chisels balance nicely. They're not too heavy, either, so they can be used quite comfortably in paring mode, in chopping holding handle mode, or in chopping holding blade close to the edge mode without undue finger-strain or fatigue. All in all, just a joy to use.

They are definitely bench chisels rather than heavy duty or site chisels. I have some 1980s Marples firmers I use for chopping duties, and save the AIs for fitting and trimming work.

I see good things said about Narex, LN, Veritas and Stanley Sweetheart, and I'm certainly not going to knock any of those (can't - never tried any of them). However, I wouldn't swap the AIs I've got for the above - I don't see how they could be better as a cabinetmaker's bench chisel (except possibly on edge life for the expensive fancy steels) for what I need. I don't really need the extra edge life - I'll never wear out the AIs in my lifetime, and since they sharpen easily, touching the edge up is no real hardship; edge-holding is at least as good as the vintage ones.

They're not cheap, but you don't need many. They are probably the nicest 'new' tools I've ever had - LN planes included - just because they are simple, basic, no frills but VERY well made.


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## Kalimna (15 Nov 2013)

I think, if I was in the market for some new chisels (which I'm not, unfortunately) then I would most likely go with the AI. I can't imagine that they perform any better than the Narex, but they look nicer and they are British.

Going slightly off topic, has anyone any experience of the Aussie Harold and Saxon chisels?

Cheers,
Adam


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## matjos26 (15 Nov 2013)

i have contacted the seller and they have assured me this is a one off and offered to replace it but ive already sharpened it and wire brushed the rust of and tried to polish the ferules, there was a waxy film on the metal but still rust there. it cuts good enough just expected more of a quality tool £14 for one chisel is enough to pay to expect a reasonable amount of quality. maybe i was unlucky and got a bad one i hope this is the case i think i will go to the tool shop and have a look at the narex they have there


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## morfa (15 Nov 2013)

I just bought a mortice chisel from Workshopheaven.com and it's great. It's not as swanky as an Ashley Isles (and I do have one of them) but it's a nice chisel. Honestly tho (and I know I'm being a heretic here) it's just a chisel, they're not complex and it'll get bashed around a bit anyway, so who cares about the name. Rust is easily fixed as well.


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## matthewwh (18 Nov 2013)

Are we talking about the same tools?

We handle a fair few Narex chisels and I've yet to see a single speck of rust on any of them, the blades should be covered in a very thin lacquer and then lightly oiled. The photo above was taken a few minutes ago and is just the next chisel out of the box, it hasn't been selected as a particularly perfect example.

The grinding marks should be consistent, fine enough that they can barely be detected with a fingernail and the surfaces true enough that the backs can be polished out with minimal effort.

The self-tightening, splitproof cup ferrules are made out of steel, an appropriate material, and plated to protect the surface. Yes, they are bigger than we are used to on a western European chisel and look a bit different, but in purely functional terms they work extremely well - much more reliable than brass ones in fact.

As Peter said, the lettering on the blades is printed and will come off if you remove the lacquer (warm sodium hydroxide solution). They print them because chrome manganese steel is resistant to etching, like the paler layers in pattern welded damascus steel. Engraving would push the price up and slow production to a crawl, hot stamping would require delicate lettering in the forging die reducing their working life. Other suggestions welcome...

The ethos of Czech manufacturing is all about producing things that work well, last a long time and lots of people can afford. 

In a world full of far eastern 'first minimise the unit cost, then decide what the product will be', and far western 'flawlessly finished, hugely expensive, oober desirable, sorry, what's the product again?', a straightforward, well made, functional item stands out like absolute silence.


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## Duncan Murray (19 Nov 2013)

I bought a set of six Narex cabinet makers chisels (8116) from Matthew about a year ago and they are exactly as he described. Minimal set up, in terms of honing the back and the bevel, and have been excellent chisels. Certainly none of the issues described.


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## Dodge (28 Nov 2013)

I have Narex chisels and am using them daily and have done so since receiving them from Matthew at WH getting on for a couple of years ago - you may recall in an earlier thread how I re-handled them with London Pattern handles.

Personally I think the chisels are excellent value for money, hold an excellent edge and I would be happy to recommend them to anyone!


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## G S Haydon (28 Nov 2013)

They are stunning! I just bought a set from WSH and they seem incredibly good value. Will report back when I have had some time with them.


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## Graham Orm (28 Nov 2013)

Dodge":3mtwmm0t said:


> I have Narex chisels and am using them daily and have done so since receiving them from Matthew at WH getting on for a couple of years ago - you may recall in an earlier thread how I re-handled them with London Pattern handles.
> 
> Personally I think the chisels are excellent value for money, hold an excellent edge and I would be happy to recommend them to anyone!



Mice been nibbling at them larger two Dodge?


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## G S Haydon (29 Nov 2013)

I really liked the London pattern handles Dodge had made which look to be very finely crafted. I always like to see some top notch work whether on a tool handle or a flight of stairs ;-)


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## Harbo (29 Nov 2013)

Lovely handles - stunning work!

Rod


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## heimlaga (29 Nov 2013)

In my oppinion a good chisel has:
-A blade with good overall shape and ballance and a good tang opr socket.
-Steel that holds an edge as long as possible and sharpens well when it has been dulled.
-A back that is reasonably straight and where the machining marks and/or rust pits aren't too deep to remove easily.

If it has a usable handle I wiew it as an extra....... The hypothetic finish of that optional handle is something that I have never thought about.......

Just to put things straight.......


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## matjos26 (1 Dec 2013)

by the look of things it looks like ive just bought from a bad dealer my comments and experience are not consistent with them on here. i think ill go to the other recommended sites like workshop heaven.


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## jimi43 (2 Dec 2013)

At the risk of repetition, I think that I wouldn't entertain a modern chisel however good the steel is professed to be.

The world of bootfairs, fleaBay and other old tool suppliers is full of beautiful examples of classic old masterpieces that have stood the test of time, often for over a century and are still cutting beautifully.

Careful selection can result in a set for the price of one good new one.







Most have fine box or ash handles, have brass ferrules that wouldn't split in a reactor and the cutting edge is not prone to rodent damage!

Just my 2p worth :mrgreen: 

Jimi


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## Jacob (2 Dec 2013)

heimlaga":3dduor7d said:


> In my oppinion a good chisel has:
> -A blade with good overall shape and ballance and a good tang opr socket.
> -Steel that holds an edge as long as possible and sharpens well when it has been dulled.
> -A back that is reasonably straight and where the machining marks and/or rust pits aren't too deep to remove easily.
> ...


I've never really met a chisel which _doesn't_ fit this bill! Some are nicer than others but they all are usable. 
Machine marks aren't a problem - a quick pass over a fine stone or paper will take the friction off, if not the marks themselves. 
Even rust pits can be dealt with simply - by applying a bit of back bevel so you get into sound metal. This is against the majority opinion I know, but it still gives you a usable chisel. Or just bin it, they are cheap and another one will be along!
A so-called "bellied" face is no problem either, I don't know why it worries people. A hollow concave face could be a problem but would usually be reduced enough after a few honings, without any special effort being required, but in any case helps with sharpening.


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## Graham Orm (2 Dec 2013)

And we're off!


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## Jacob (2 Dec 2013)

matjos26":2hlwqdrk said:


> by the look of things it looks like ive just bought from a bad dealer my comments and experience are not consistent with them on here. i think ill go to the other recommended sites like workshop heaven.


Same brand same chisels it won't make any difference. If you want quality it's best to go 2nd hand there's tons of old tools out there, often dirt cheap.


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## Jacob (2 Dec 2013)

Grayorm":38ts4pxp said:


> And we're off!


My opinion based on some experience - and bear in mind that I'm not selling anything or promoting anybody else (except Ebay and car boots perhaps)


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## wizard (2 Dec 2013)

this is a chisle no name and lots of rust


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## jimi43 (2 Dec 2013)

wizard":3evlipz8 said:


> this is a chisle no name and lots of rust



I see you're using one of those new-fangled catalyst rust removers! :mrgreen: 

Coat?

Jimi


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## wizard (2 Dec 2013)

Malcolm is a ferret not a cat, and a famous ferret as seen on ITV.


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## RogerP (2 Dec 2013)

I've had a small set of Narex chisels for a while (from Matthew I think) and they have been fine in all regards - except one. The sides were so sharp that in use I cut myself on them several times. A bit of stoning did the trick.


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## jimi43 (2 Dec 2013)

wizard":18jkugm9 said:


> Malcolm is a ferret not a cat, and a famous ferret as seen on ITV.



My sincere apologies Malcolm!!! :mrgreen: 

I can only assume then he's getting rid of ferret oxide! :mrgreen: 

Jim


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## MMUK (2 Dec 2013)

I may look at a set of Narex Mortice chisels in the New Year. I had a set once until some scrote relieved me of ownership on a site in Dudley. I've been finding it extremely difficult to find a full set of mortice chisels 


I'm quite happy with my Stanley DynaGrip BE chisels, they're as good as my old 1960's Marples ones were (again, lost in Dudley). They hold their edge well enough and seem to stay sharp for ages.


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## Graham Orm (2 Dec 2013)

MMUK":34hmy3iu said:


> I may look at a set of Narex Mortice chisels in the New Year. I had a set once until some scrote relieved me of ownership on a site in Dudley. I've been finding it extremely difficult to find a full set of mortice chisels
> 
> 
> I'm quite happy with my Stanley DynaGrip BE chisels, they're as good as my old 1960's Marples ones were (again, lost in Dudley). They hold their edge well enough and seem to stay sharp for ages.



Dudley is right off my list now!


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## Mike Wingate (2 Dec 2013)

There may be different steel qualities in Narex Paring chisels.

Fine-grained chrome-moly steel or Rc59 chrome-manganese steel?

Workshop Heaven. Narex 8132 paring chisels are forged from CrMn high carbon steel and isothermally hardened to RC59

Lee Valley. Forged from silicon-chrome steel (Rc58-60)

?


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## Jacob (2 Dec 2013)

"Narex chisels not happy" is the title. Have to say I am not happy - in fact bored stiff with reading about Narex bloody chisels. We all know now that they are so so and are sold by Matthew (and a lot of other people, usually cheaper). We've been told a thousand times.
Haven't we done enough to promote these cheapo imported chisels? There's obviously nothing special about them. Neither particularly cheap nor particularly good. When will this promo end?


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## David C (2 Dec 2013)

A thousand times !!

Well, well. Now you know how we feel about convex bevels.

David


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## Graham Orm (2 Dec 2013)

But Jacob, you're missing the point, it's *ALL* about the tools.


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## MMUK (2 Dec 2013)

Is this a good point to ask about pots and kettles?


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## Cheshirechappie (2 Dec 2013)

Jacob":3azj4rvt said:


> "Narex chisels not happy" is the title. Have to say I am not happy - in fact bored stiff with reading about Narex bloody chisels. We all know now that they are so so and are sold by Matthew (and a lot of other people, usually cheaper). We've been told a thousand times.
> Haven't we done enough to promote these cheapo imported chisels? There's obviously nothing special about them. Neither particularly cheap nor particularly good. When will this promo end?



But.....but.....but.....we thought you were all for cheapo tools?

What we really REALLY need to know is how to go about sharpening Narex chisels with rounded bevels using an oilstone shaped like a soup ladle. 

Go on - tell us. I'm sure the Mods will see the sense in a post of that importance.


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## MMUK (2 Dec 2013)

Cheshirechappie":ssr55ddl said:


> But.....but.....but.....we thought you were all for cheapo tools?
> 
> What we really REALLY need to know is how to go about sharpening Narex chisels with rounded bevels using an oilstone shaped like a soup ladle.
> 
> Go on - tell us. I'm sure the Mods will see the sense in a post of that importance.




Also, do you have to use a specific oil to sharpen Narex chisels on said oilstone? :mrgreen:


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## dann (2 Dec 2013)

MMUK":2fylob2q said:


> Cheshirechappie":2fylob2q said:
> 
> 
> > But.....but.....but.....we thought you were all for cheapo tools?
> ...


 Its best to spit on the stone, spit works just fine


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## Cheshirechappie (2 Dec 2013)

MMUK":1yz016cz said:


> Cheshirechappie":1yz016cz said:
> 
> 
> > But.....but.....but.....we thought you were all for cheapo tools?
> ...



But of course! Nothing less than virgin olive oil will do!

(Assuming you can find a virgin, that is!) :lol:


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## MMUK (2 Dec 2013)

Cheshirechappie":zwjzp0jc said:


> But of course! Nothing less than virgin olive oil will do!
> 
> (Assuming you can find a virgin, that is!) :lol:




A virgin? In Blackburn? :shock:


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## Cheshirechappie (2 Dec 2013)

Well, this thread is now virgin' on the ridiculous - that's probably close enough!


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## wizard (2 Dec 2013)

Malcolm knows a good chisel when he sees one and he is not bothered how its sharpened.


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## Phil Pascoe (2 Dec 2013)

MMUK":1zr48hks said:


> Cheshirechappie":1zr48hks said:
> 
> 
> > But of course! Nothing less than virgin olive oil will do!
> ...


Is that why Jesus wasn't born there? ... because they couldn't find three wise men and a virgin?


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## wizard (2 Dec 2013)

phil.p":2844dqkj said:


> MMUK":2844dqkj said:
> 
> 
> > Cheshirechappie":2844dqkj said:
> ...


no that was redruth


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## MMUK (2 Dec 2013)

I thought it was Bradford :s


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## Cheshirechappie (2 Dec 2013)

wizard":1in8qfck said:


> Malcolm knows a good chisel when he sees one and he is not bothered how its sharpened.



Wouldn't Malcolm prefer a rabbit plane? :mrgreen:


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