# Started the workshop at last



## garywayne (8 Feb 2008)

Hi everyone.

Its been a while, but I have been quite busy the last few months.

As the heading says. I have started the workshop with the help of Sheela (the wife to those who don't know).

So far we have a concrete base 10M X 3M with a 2M X 3M hard standing at the front. We are building the walls in 2440mm (8ft) square sections. The four frames that will be next to the garden fence have been built apart from the noggins. The four frames with the windows, on the opposite wall have been partially built awaiting windows. So far we have built 9 roof trusses. All out of 2" x 4" (47mm x 100mm) pressure treated timber.

I am about to make my next order. I have a query on the roofing.
On the rafters I was thinking of using a breathable membrane, then 18mm OSB, and covered with Wicks felt shingles.
Should there be anything in-between the OSB and the shingles?

If I can remember how, I will post some pics later.

It's nice to be back. I hope you are all well, and had a good crimbo and new year. Talk to you soon.

ATB Gary.


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## Paul Chapman (8 Feb 2008)

Hi Gary,

Good to see you back and that you've got the workshop started.

Cheers :wink: 

Paul


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## Waka (8 Feb 2008)

Gary

Nice tosee another workshop build coming along. Lets have the pictorial evidence.


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## OLD (8 Feb 2008)

'breathable membrane, then 18mm OSB, and covered with Wicks felt shingles'
Should be osb, breathable membrane then shingles .So that water vapour passes through osb and membrane then dissipates around the shingles.


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## garywayne (9 Feb 2008)

Hi Paul. Thanks for the welcome back. It's good to see you to.

Waka. I was hoping to put up some pics today, just to prove to you that I am actually doing something. :lol: :lol: Unfortunately, since returning from holiday I have mislaid the camera to pc cable. Will have pics up on Monday.

Old. 
I am so grateful that you put me right with the sequence of materials. The complete roof construction will go something like this:-
1) Internal roof paneling - 12mm OSB.
2) Vapour barrier.
3) Insulation within framework.
4) 18mm OSB.
5) Breathable membrane.
6) Felt shingles.

Through the summer months the shingles become tacky and stick together. So I have read. I have one concern. With the felt shingles next to the breathable membrane, wont the shingles adhere to the membrane and restrict it from doing what it is meant to do?

It's nice to be back.
ATB Gary.


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## garywayne (11 Feb 2008)

Hi.

Here are the pics I mentioned.

The first is a concrete base 3M X 10M with a 2M X 3M hard standing, which is in the process of being layed.






This is just some of the timber.





This is the first wall frame. The side walls are being constructed with four 8' X 8' frames each side.





This picture shows the panels of the two side walls complete, except for the noggins and windows. Also Sheela working on a roof truss.





In this pic I have snuck into the conservatory due to dodgy weather. Still working on roof trusses.





After a full day employment, Sheela makes us a cuppa, then straight to work on, yes, more roof trusses.





Here I am just showing that all the freshly cut timber in being treated with wood preserve.





Yesterday we started on the back wall, cutting the tenons. Work had to stop for a day or two due to an accident with a hand saw. Now I have a saw hand.

ATB Gary.


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## OPJ (12 Feb 2008)

Looks like you're making very good progress. Hope your hand isn't too bad as I think the weather's due to change over the next few days. :shock: 

Are you cutting the trusses before you've fixed the walls, just out of interest?

Oh, and it's actually *noggings*, by the way. :wink:


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## garywayne (13 Feb 2008)

Hi Olly.

Cor, you sound just like me mum. :lol: Thanks for pointing that out though. :wink: 



> Are you cutting the trusses before you've fixed the walls, just out of interest?



Yes. My reasoning for making the trusses before erecting the walls is to keep the tops of the walls the same spacing to the bottom. Plus, once i've built all the parts I can erect the whole thing in one go. [-o< 

I am still unable to use the hand as it just opens up again. Looking on the good side, I have the most keen wife anybody could hope for. She comes home from work, I explain, she does.

Thanks for your interest.


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## garywayne (19 Feb 2008)

If I have a 5 feet opening in my workshop with two 30 in. doors, what would your recommendation for hinges be? 

The doors are going to be built the same way as the walls. From the inside out:-

1) 18mm ply/OSB.
2) Vapour barrier.
3) Insulation within a 4x2 framework.
4) Breathable membrane.
5) Shiplap/T&G.


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## garywayne (21 Feb 2008)

OK. A bit short on answers. Might as well call it a day then. :?


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## motownmartin (21 Feb 2008)

garywayne":167nkgu6 said:


> OK. A bit short on answers. Might as well call it a day then. :?


Try starting a thread entitled Door hinges  and you'll still get no answers :lol: seriously though you will get a response from someone


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## Adam (21 Feb 2008)

garywayne":3gbpmffg said:


> If I have a 5 feet opening in my workshop with two 30 in. doors, what would your recommendation for hinges be?



Big ones. That sounds heavy. I bought some gate hinges from Wickes. See here (make sure you get captive ones so someone can't simply lift the doors off). I modified a few coach bolts to really secure them right through the frame. (for some reason the holes weren't big enough to accept 6mm coachbolts.)






I went for 4, as I wanted to be able to have a split "stable" style door. Which is more obvious from this: (I've already made the cut)






Adam


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## garywayne (26 Feb 2008)

Would have been in touch earlier, but have been away.

A bit late but, thanks Martin. :wink: 

Adam, good looking w/shop.
Those hinges look just the job. cheers Adam.


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## garywayne (1 Mar 2008)

I have built the roof trusses like this, but without the orange uprights:-




[/img]

When it comes to cladding the outside I realise that the span from side to side is to long.
If I insert where the orange bit are, would that be enough?

Another thought I have had is instead of cutting the roofing ply to size, is to build a overhang a bit like this:-






With an overhang of just over 1M, would I need the middle truss, or could I do without it?

All comments gratefully received.


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## garywayne (7 Apr 2008)

Hi all.

I have all the cladding coming later in the week, which is un-treated. I was wondering what you would recommend to treat the wood with, to protect from the weather.

One other thing.
I have bought some polythene tape for the waterproof membrane joints. Should I use tape for the breathable membrane joints? If so, what should be used?


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## Shultzy (7 Apr 2008)

I used a wood preservative from Wickes, available from other outlets as well.


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## OLD (7 Apr 2008)

No tape required just correct overlaps fix with staples.


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## garywayne (9 Apr 2008)

*Thanks Shultzy.*

I have used Wickes's fence preserve/stain, and to be honest, I thought it was [email protected] If you are recommending there wood preserve I take it it is a different solution. 
Do you remember if it has a guarantee? If so, how long? I believe Cuprinol has a 5 year guarantee.

*Old.*

Thanks for your reply. If there was no reply I would have taped the joints.

One other thing. Earlyer in the thread you recommended that I lay the felt shingles over the breathable membrane.
Wont the stickiness of the shingles prevent the membrane from breathing?

I will put up some more pictures, but I keep forgetting to take them.


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## OLD (9 Apr 2008)

My understanding of felt shingles is that they are nailed and any stickiness is to hold the tabs down, so tab is stuck to shingle under not the background.This allows the breathing to dissipate out from under the shingles.


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## Shultzy (9 Apr 2008)

This is what I've used 2 coats and it's been ok for 3 years.

link


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## garywayne (9 Apr 2008)

*Old.*
Thanks for explaining. I was a bit concerned.

*Shultzy.*
Thanks for the link.
There are so many types of treatment I just get confused. I'll have to get some first thing, before the delivery.


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## garywayne (24 Apr 2008)

Hi all.

When it comes to securing the OSB onto the roof. 

Is it best to use screws or ring shank nails?


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## Digit (24 Apr 2008)

Screws! Driving nails through OSB tends to have the same result as a bullet wound, small entry large exit.

Roy.


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## iwood (25 Apr 2008)

Hi Gary

Just saw the drawing of your planned overhang. Are you still planning on doing this?

I'm building the slowest workshop in the world with a similar roof construction to yours and my shed will also (eventually) have an overhang though in my case no more than a foot or so.

I'd be a bit nervous about your design. That's a fair bit of weight to suspend - trusses, ply, and shingles are not exactly lightweight. It'll catch the wind too. 

Maybe you could build a smaller one with perhaps just a single suspended truss connected to the gable end truss with noggings rather than sat on an extended wall plate. That would be much stronger and safer arrangement.


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## Benchwayze (25 Apr 2008)

Finishing?

What's wrong with good old creosote?

Okay you need eye protection, gloves and a mask maybe, but we all have those. And these days creosote isn't just in 'Nut Brown'... 

The odd rose might get a few burned leaves, but you can't make an omelette etc.. Plus, if you do get lax and a bit of moss grows, the next layer of creosote sorts it no problem

And yes, creosote stinks... But not for long. (My feather-board fence has been going strong, for 20 Years. 

Regards

John


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## Digit (25 Apr 2008)

The timber cladding used on my house was cut in 1938, and throwing the annual bucket of Creosote at it is a damned sight easier than pointing brickwork for example.

Roy


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## Anonymous (25 Apr 2008)

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## Anonymous (25 Apr 2008)

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## Digit (25 Apr 2008)

For a first coat I would recommend Bituminous paint then Creoste as required. The paint doesn't fade as badly as the creosote either.

Roy


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## Benchwayze (25 Apr 2008)

MDF_HAKA":3nzu9wgh said:


> Benchwayze":3nzu9wgh said:
> 
> 
> > Finishing?
> ...



Is it really?
I didn't know that. I did hear the powers that be had banned Jeye's Fluid, which is a similar product from almost identical sources. However, it's still possible to buy both here.

I don't get it! :lol: 

Regards John


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## Digit (25 Apr 2008)

Jeye's fluid isn't banned, just its use and as a steriliser for horticultural use. 
And I can't tell Creosote substitute from butter, looks the same, smells the same----. 

Roy.


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## Benchwayze (25 Apr 2008)

If you can't use it it's banned as far as I reason!  

It sure kills disease in the soil! So I better not use it then.
John


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## Digit (25 Apr 2008)

Not so! You can still use it as a household disinfectant etc.

Roy.


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## Benchwayze (25 Apr 2008)

The world is going crazy! 

Just a few minutes ago, I saw an advert on ITV for a 'completely, chemical free, organic plant food'. Am I going mad along with the world? 

Plants get their nutriment from chemicals! Organic manure is full of chemicals; isn't it? I get the feeling, I just don't know anything anymore. 
](*,) 

Thanks for the info on Jeyes Fluid all the same. 
Regards 
 
John


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## Anonymous (25 Apr 2008)

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## Anonymous (26 Apr 2008)

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## Benchwayze (26 Apr 2008)

Ahh well.. I can still use Jeyes as a disinfectant, when I want to freshen up the front porch. That's good. I hope it doen't kill those ants at the same time though; although it was always pretty ineffective at that. 
The chemist won't sell me arsenic either, so gradually my porch is sinking! 

That will give me chance to use all that cedarwood I bought for the green house that SWIMBO never let me build! 
 
John


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## garywayne (26 Apr 2008)

*Roy*. Thanks for your reply.

I have been offered the use of one of those gas nailguns, which without your reply I would have used. Thank you.

*Ken.*
The overhang is now only 800mm with one truss and two angled down supports plus noggings. I have had a swing on it and I weigh 15st. It seems strong enough. Time will tell.

*Ken* said,


> I'm building the slowest workshop in the world



If you live anywhere near me, I would be happy to lend a hand.

*John*.

My neighbor uses creosote substitute on his fences. There is no way that my wife would allow me to use it. hmm, that smells good  
Also I have already bought Wick's stuff, and wy wife has already started to cover the cladding.
Thanks for your response.


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## Benchwayze (26 Apr 2008)

Hi Gary, 

I think that's the way to go about it.
If SWIMBO won't let you use it, get her to do the job!  

My Gawd you should see the things my wife allows me to get away with. But then she's more old-fashioned than me. 

Instance, when I landscaped the garden, in the eighties, I was working away during the week. She made all the concrete blocks with this mould I'd bought, and I used to come home at the weekend and build the walls! 
She did a good job. The bricks are still there and not one shows any sign of falling apart!

Great Missus I got. 

John


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## garywayne (26 Apr 2008)

John said,


> Great Missus I got.



You and me both John, you and me both. :wink:


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## Digit (26 Apr 2008)

Same here! And she's great at lawn mowing, which I detest!

Roy.


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## Benchwayze (26 Apr 2008)

Digit":1y5c3a3c said:


> Same here! And she's great at lawn mowing, which I detest!
> 
> Roy.



So my Missus will be pleased to know she's not the only wife who got a Flymow for Christmas!


ccasion5: 

John


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## Anonymous (26 Apr 2008)

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## Benchwayze (26 Apr 2008)

> You romantic ol' sausage you. :lol:



Yes I know. It was the super deluxe model too. After all, she is paying for my first Lie Nielsen plane! 

Regards.
John

\/


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## Anonymous (27 Apr 2008)

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## Benchwayze (27 Apr 2008)

Well Steve, 
It's part of the perks of 45 years of married life. 
We call it tolerance and a trouser-leg each. It worked for us, because I honestly can't say we ever 'worked' at it. 

I think it was my furniture that she couldn't resist. 8) 

Although most of that is showing its age now, so I am winding down by reverting to hand-work for most of the replacements. (Except the ruddy kitchen!!!) 


Regards 
John


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## Digit (27 Apr 2008)

Well I bought my wife a motor mower, strimmer, chain saw, hedge trimmer and garden vac and I haven't got anything! Am I doing something wrong? :lol: 

Roy.


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## Benchwayze (27 Apr 2008)

You got some funny looks didn't you Roy?
And maybe some pointed remarks? 
 
Maybe it's the way you packaged them? 

John


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## Digit (27 Apr 2008)

You mean, like I ripped the stocking trying to get 'em in?

Roy.


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## Benchwayze (27 Apr 2008)

ccasion5: 

John


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## garywayne (14 May 2008)

Just a quick update, and a question.

My beloved, now wants a clear finnish on the shed. Any recommendations on a clear/clearish timber preservative for the cladding.

I have been given a secondhand double glazed upvc window unit. To fix it to the shed frame I have to remove the plastic beading from around the glass to get to the fixing holes. Can someone explain to me how I remove and replace the beading.


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## Racers (14 May 2008)

Hi, garywayne 

To get the beeding out you will need a paint scraper or something broad and flat to prise the beading out, usually away from the frame ie inwards but it depends on the window. 

Pete


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## Digit (14 May 2008)

Any clear finish that I'm aware of is a job for life mate.
Talk her into Creosote.

Roy.


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## skipdiver (15 May 2008)

I thought creosote had been banned by the safety police.


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## Digit (15 May 2008)

Only if they catch you! 
If you by 25ltrs from agricultural suppliers, for example, it's obtainable. 

Roy.


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## skipdiver (15 May 2008)

Nice one Roy.Didn't think you could get it any more.I miss the smell of creosote.


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## Digit (15 May 2008)

I live in an ex-POW timber building Skip and years ago I painted the whole damn lot with bituminous paint, then we Creosote every few years. Beats re-pointing, rendering etc.

Roy.


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## skipdiver (15 May 2008)

Sounds interesting.Ex POW gaffe.


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## Digit (15 May 2008)

We bought the place with detailed planning consent for a brick and tile bungalow and a half acre plot.
My son and I moved in with no electricity, no hot or cold water, and no drainage.
The kitchen floor moved up and down with the water table, the windows had all been nailed shut, there were so many spiders in the place that when the electricity suppliers arrived to reconnect us the chap would do the job till after I had removed the offending wildlife.
We had Bats in the loft, Blackberry's in the kitchen, Foxes, Badgers and Grey Squirrels running around all over the place, Toads hopping in the back door, Wasp nests and one year a swarm of Bees.
We've got a Rookery in the garden as well and the noise at this time of the year is deafening!
Oh, and the house was painted bright yellow!


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## skipdiver (15 May 2008)

You never got round to building the bungalow then?

When i retire,would love a plot of land somewhere in the sticks and build a timber house.

What part of Wales you in?It's a very nice place.Been there quite a bit.


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## Digit (15 May 2008)

No, we looked at the building, studied the plans for its replacement, and came to the conclusion that we would be better off doing the necessary improvements to the timber one. 
We live just north of Cardigan and close to the coast, very mild but can be wet, but at least the rain is warm! :lol: 

Roy


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## skipdiver (15 May 2008)

Never been in that area.Last time i was in Wales(2002)i stayed near St.Davids.Beautiful coastline but it never stopped raining.


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## Digit (15 May 2008)

We're north of that Skip, it can be like that, it's raining here today but we've had two weeks of hot sunny weather till today.
At least we haven't got to water the garden!

Roy.


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## garywayne (15 May 2008)

*Pete.* 
Thanks for the tip. 
I wasn't sure which way the beading came off.
I also heard that some old beading can get brittle. So I thought I would heat it up with a heat gun first.

*Roy.*
You said:-


> Any clear finish that I'm aware of is a job for life mate.



Why would it be any different from the coloured stuff?

Thank you both for your replies.


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## garywayne (16 May 2008)

Another question about windows.

Do I install the window before the cladding?

Also. What do I do about the breathable membrane, and the waterproof membrane. Do they get raped around the opening where the window is going?

If this is not clear, don't hesitate to ask.


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## skipdiver (16 May 2008)

You can either fit the window sticking proud,clad round and seal edges or alternatively you could set the window back in the frame and put timber reveals round.In the first instance i would fit the window first and in the second instancce it could be done before or after.Personal choice really.I personally would wrap the membrane round behind the window jambs.


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## garywayne (16 May 2008)

Cheers Steve.

You have been most helpful.


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## dennyk (17 May 2008)

On my allotment ,

To protect the fencing, I mixed old engine oil and Paraffin, I then gave the fencing a liberal coat of the mixture, and it is about 6 years before I have to give it another coat, The fence posts are soaked in the mixture and a plastic bin bag wrapped around the bottom 24 inches before putting them in the ground after 11 years no sign of rot


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## Tom K (17 May 2008)

You really need to watch "This Old House" more often Tom DaSilva demonstrates how to do this best. I think its the Concorde Mass. New England L house project.

Tom


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## garywayne (5 Aug 2008)

HI all.

It's been a while, but I have been working on the shed, (weather permitting), as well as going to weddings all over the country.

Here are some pics of my progress.

*Studwork going up.*




[/img]

*Aprill showers in Hampshire. First window frame built.*





*Roof truss's going up.*
[/img]





*OSB roofing being covered with breathable membrane.*





*Breathable membrane completed.*
[/img]





*Starting to lay felt shingles.*





*Roof finished, all but the capping.*
[/img]





*Roof completed.*





*Spraying the cladding before fixing.*
[/img]





Well there you go. That's how far I have got so far, with the addition of having put in two windows and awaiting one window and sill.
My next step is to cover the walls with a waterproof membrane, then the cladding and build the doors.

Thats it for now kiddies. I will see you all again soon.....ish. Possibly, perhaps, maybe. TaTa for now.


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## DaveL (5 Aug 2008)

Gary,

Good to see the progress, it going to be a useful shop once you get the cladding on.


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## garywayne (5 Aug 2008)

Thanks Dave. I hope to start cladding some time this week. Weather permitting.


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## Paul Chapman (5 Aug 2008)

Looking good, Gary.

Cheers :wink: 

Paul


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## wizer (5 Aug 2008)

Coming on nicely. Here's a tip: When its completed, don't move! :roll: :wink:


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