# Heating the workshop



## boggy

My workshop consists of a wooden shed 4mX4m. I want to instal a small woodburner stove - a Frontier stove sold by anevaystoves.com.
The flue is to pass through the wall rather than the felt roof. The stove has a 60mm O/D outlet and I am having problems finding a supplier of obtuse bends of this diameter, preferably in stainless steel.
Any ideas?


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## Phil Pascoe

It's a portable stove - it's not designed to "plumbed" in, that's why you're unlikely to find anything to fit it. be aware that if you fit a stove in a 'shop you will get condensation problems and rust on your tools. Damhikt. I would consider infra red heaters (assuming you've power) that heat you rather than all the surroundings.


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## Cabinetman

And of course if you do use it without a chimney to the outside you’ll wake up dead! Or not.
If lt was me, insulate and plug in an oil filled radiator that has a thermostat, in that space it would hardly be on for very long. Ian


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## Rorschach

Cabinetman said:


> And of course if you do use it without a chimney to the outside you’ll wake up dead! Or not.
> If lt was me, insulate and plug in an oil filled radiator that has a thermostat, in that space it would hardly be on for very long. Ian



You would have to do an amazing job of insulation and draught proofing before an oil filled rad would even remotely make any kind of sense.


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## artie

In a 4m by 4m shed you'll be opening the door to cool down if you apply that much heat and you're doing any work at all.
Be ok if you're reading or something.
Only time I've had heat in "the shap" was a few years ago when it got down to -18 for a few days.


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## Cabinetman

Rorschach, No sorry you’re wrong, my reasonably insulated workshop is twice the size and is heated by one, it clicks on every now and again. It’s not sit and be comfy, but you wouldn’t want that temperature to work in anyway. Ian


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## Rorschach

Cabinetman said:


> Rorschach, No sorry you’re wrong, my reasonably insulated workshop is twice the size and is heated by one, it clicks on every now and again. It’s not sit and be comfy, but you wouldn’t want that temperature to work in anyway. Ian



What is the temperature difference between outside and inside? How much is the rad costing to run?


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## Sandyn

Is this the kind of thing you are looking for? Angled & Straight 60mm Stove Flue Pipe Connections


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## Phil Pascoe

I have an oil filler rad in my bedroom for when it gets really cold overnight (that's 0c here  ) and it makes a difference ............ of about 2c.


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## Cabinetman

It’s warmer inside, perfect working temperature never any condensation, never any rust, it costs what it costs which as it’s very low powered and not on very often is fine by me. End of.


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## Rorschach

Cabinetman said:


> It’s warmer inside, perfect working temperature never any condensation, never any rust, it costs what it costs which as it’s very low powered and not on very often is fine by me. End of.



If it suits you and you are happy, that's fine, but with nothing more than your own anecdotal evidence it is probably not wise to recommend it as a solution for the OP


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## Phil Pascoe

The same logic of course applies to all our recommendations.


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## Cabinetman

Absolutely right, I suppose Phil it’s bound to be cold where you are in Lapland anyway. Ha


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## Felix

If you do decide to use a woodburner in your workshop you need to make yourself aware of the requirements regarding routing flues through flammable structures. If you use a single skin flue you should leave a minimum of 100mm clearance around the flue (it may be 125mm). You now have a 260mm hole in the side of your workshop that you need to cover with some non-flammable material! Added to that, single skin exterior flues build up creosote much quicker than double skinned flues. A double skinned flue only requires 50mm clearance when passing through flammable structures.

On the condensation issue I have found that keeping your workshop warm on a regular basis helps to reduce condensation. Before I put in a woodburner, during the winters I used to get a lot of it - particularly after a cold spell where all your metal got very cold and then the temperature rose in a mild spell. Subsequently all the metal surfaces were covered in condensation - which was a real pain if I was away for a few days as it meant a few hours of rust removal. In short - a warm shop is a rust free shop and much nicer.... It takes a lot of motivation to stand in your workshop when it's -1 on the inside - believe me..food for thought anyway

Cheers

Dean


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## Sandyn

Has anyone used a diesel heater to heat their workshop? The type you get in large trucks and some camper vans? do any regulations cover that type of heater in domestic premises? I'm not trying to get round regulations, the very opposite, I will only fit a heating system which is included in regulations, so it can be fitted 'legally'


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## Rorschach

Diesel heaters seem to be getting more common with the prevalence of cheap Chinese models. From a cost perspective they only really make sense if you have access to red diesel.


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## R1chard

If you use a fuel to generate heat you require incoming air to ensure a proper combustion. Aside from any CO and CO2 issues outside air is required to sustain a good burn, possibly compromising your room temp unless you can deliver this directly to your combustion chamber. This is often made difficult by the design of traditional pot stoves.
These type of stoves measure their output in kW, designed to heat a large mass and will probably overwhelm the space you propose heating until the fuel is spent and then leave you cold once more. 
However if you could design and build a suitable slow burn floor height external fire box, well insulated and flue’d around your workshop at low level in a heavy-er walled tube you could collect the heat internally and slow burn by limiting the air flow into your shed to maintain a cozy temperature....
Maybe?


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## Rorschach

R1chard said:


> However if you could design and build a suitable slow burn floor height external fire box, well insulated and flue’d around your workshop at low level in a heavy-er walled tube you could collect the heat internally and slow burn by limiting the air flow into your shed to maintain a cozy temperature....
> Maybe?



In principle that sounds good, but in practical terms it doesn't work, maintaining a slow burn s very difficult and very inefficient. You also get a build up of various combustion by products.
The solution to the problem is found in thermal mass. You surround the fire box with as much thermal mass as space allows and you burn a really hot fire for a short amount of time and then let the thermal mass radiate the stored heat over a long period. 
Is this practical in a small workshop though? Unlikely.


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## Felix

Phil Pascoe said:


> I have an oil filler rad in my bedroom for when it gets really cold overnight (that's 0c here  ) and it makes a difference ............ of about 2c.


0c - that's totally Mediterranean...


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## Bob Chapman

I agree with the advice given by Bowmaster and hope he will not be offended by one small, but potentially vital, correction. In his post he mentions flammable and inflammable materials in contexts which make it clear that he thinks these two words are opposites - flammable = burns, inflammable = won't burn.

Unfortunately this is _not correct_. Strangely enough they both mean _exactly the same thing_ - it burns! The dangers of thinking that a can marked 'inflammable liquid' means it won't burn are obvious and don't need me to spell them out.


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## Lard

boggy said:


> My workshop consists of a wooden shed 4mX4m. I want to instal a small woodburner stove - a Frontier stove sold by anevaystoves.com.
> The flue is to pass through the wall rather than the felt roof. The stove has a 60mm O/D outlet and I am having problems finding a supplier of obtuse bends of this diameter, preferably in stainless steel.
> Any ideas?


The responses appears typical in that the majority of you ‘once again’ treat the questioner as a small child who must be scolded....for gods‘s sake either answer him or assume that if he’s bright enough to operate a computer and old enough to own a shed and operate machinery that he’s able to come up with his own decisions and plans instead of being made to face, what is simply, a barrage your own criticisms and opinions on stuff he didn’t ask for.

Boggy....I had a similar problem some years ago when I installed my own small log burner (with something like a 60mm diameter flue) through the side of my timber workshop. A mate of mine, who runs a transport company, suggested HGV flexible exhaust pipework (stainless too) that can withstand something like 500 degrees. I ended up leaving the stove with a local welder who fabricated the pipework, including 2 bends, from off cuts of pipe he had in his unit. Didn’t cost me that much at all. Worked for me although it wasn’t stainless I’m afraid but then again no one is ever likely to see it anyway.

I won’t go into detail about how I ensured safety, because you didn’t ask for that, apart from saying the obvious in that, apart from how it was installed, I monitor it.....just as I do with my large wood stove in the house.


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## Jelly

Rorschach said:


> You would have to do an amazing job of insulation and draught proofing before an oil filled rad would even remotely make any kind of sense.



I've been quite successful in draught proofing an uninsulated concrete garage to the extent that I can maintain it at a reasonable temperature and RH to prevent rust with an oil filled radiator.

It's costly, and I aim to insulate it to a standard equivalent to my house in the next month or so, but as an interim solution still much cheaper than replacement/reconditioning of thousands of pounds worth of tools due to rust damage.


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## Yojevol

Lard said:


> The responses appears typical in that the majority of you ‘once again’ treat the questioner as a small child who must be scolded....for gods‘s sake either answer him or assume that if he’s bright enough to operate a computer and old enough to own a shed and operate machinery that he’s able to come up with his own decisions and plans instead of being made to face, what is simply, a barrage your own criticisms and opinions on stuff he didn’t ask for.
> 
> Boggy....I had a similar problem some years ago when I installed my own small log burner (with something like a 60mm diameter flue) through the side of my timber workshop. A mate of mine, who runs a transport company, suggested HGV flexible exhaust pipework (stainless too) that can withstand something like 500 degrees. I ended up leaving the stove with a local welder who fabricated the pipework, including 2 bends, from off cuts of pipe he had in his unit. Didn’t cost me that much at all. Worked for me although it wasn’t stainless I’m afraid but then again no one is ever likely to see it anyway.
> 
> I won’t go into detail about how I ensured safety, because you didn’t ask for that, apart from saying the obvious in that, apart from how it was installed, I monitor it.....just as I do with my large wood stove in the house.


Re 1st para, my sentiments entirely but I didn't have the guts to put it into words. Well said. 
Brian


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## Cabinetman

Point taken and noted.


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## RGIvy

An engineer told me recently that in order to reduce rust to an acceptable level all you need to do is keep your workshop 1 degree above ambient. If it's well sealed even an on incandescent bulb helps to reduce rust due to the heat it generates. That's what he does anyway. I did that last year for a 3x3 plastic shed and it worked for me (only used the heat from the light bulb).


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## minilathe22

I have a small "industrial" fan heater I got on ebay for £30. This quickly heats up the air, and once you are working in the shed you do not normally need alot of heat. I think oil filled radiator in a very cold space would take a long time to raise the temperature.

I love the sight of a woodburning stove, and can see why you would want one in the shed, but it does seem that alot of effort is involved. You can get fan heaters shaped like a woodburner with a little animated fire type thing in the front. That would look nice and by a lot easier to use.


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## Felix

Bob Chapman said:


> I agree with the advice given by Bowmaster and hope he will not be offended by one small, but potentially vital, correction. In his post he mentions flammable and inflammable materials in contexts which make it clear that he thinks these two words are opposites - flammable = burns, inflammable = won't burn.
> 
> Unfortunately this is _not correct_. Strangely enough they both mean _exactly the same thing_ - it burns! The dangers of thinking that a can marked 'inflammable liquid' means it won't burn are obvious and don't need me to spell them out.


Oops One day I'm going to master the English language...... I had 4 conversations going on at the same time.... you say flammable - I say inflammable - let's burn the whole place down....no offence taken


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## timothyedoran

I have a frontier stove that I use in my 4m bell tent and it heats that up brilliantly. However I think it is completely inappropriate for permanent installation and definitely not with any bends in the flue. The flue is really narrow and as such requires cleaning every day or two. Secondly the construction is not robust enough for daily use. Thirdly an electric oil rad is more sensible. I have one in my 3x4 shed/office/workshop and it's great.

Im being blunt here but at best you will achieve a temporary and expensive poor preforming solution. At worst you will kill yourself.


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## Roland

It’s traditional for woodworkers to burn scrap wood, but the fire risk always worries me. Any flame is also going to put water vapour into the air, so I’d rather use electricity. 

My workshop heating is three fold. First there’s a chest freezer. The workshop is 4m x 3m. The freezer keeps the temperature just above ambient, preventing condensation and rust. Secondly the dust extractor vents into the room. Yes, there a micron particle risk if the filters fail, but otherwise it’s delivering slightly heated air rather than venting to atmosphere and sucking in cold. When it’s really cold I use an infra-red heater. It’s expensive, but doesn’t stir up the dust like a fan heater would.


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## boggy

Sandyn said:


> Is this the kind of thing you are looking for? Angled & Straight 60mm Stove Flue Pipe Connections


Exactly what I want, thank you.


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## Woodmouse

+1 on the oil filled rad. Pop it on 20 mins before going to the shop and its warm and toasty and can be turned down so that it doesn't get overly hot.

Biggest upside is it substantially reduces the chance of anything catching fire.


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## Rorschach

Woodmouse said:


> +1 on the oil filled rad. Pop it on 20 mins before going to the shop and its warm and toasty and can be turned down so that it doesn't get overly hot.
> 
> Biggest upside is it substantially reduces the chance of anything catching fire.



What oil filled rad are you using? 20 minutes they barely get warm to the touch, let alone heat the room.


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## space.dandy

Rorschach said:


> What oil filled rad are you using? 20 minutes they barely get warm to the touch, let alone heat the room.


One that works? I’ve been using a cheap £30 (at the time) B&Q one to heat mine for over ten years now and it’s brilliant. It heats up quickly and does a good job of heating the space. I also have it on a smart plug that keeps it above 10C when I’m not working.


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## Sandyn

Diesel heaters vent to the outside and could be installed external to the heated space. They are processor controlled with a micro diesel pump to control flow. They are in widespread use to as overnight heaters for trucks and camper vans and are perfectly safe as long as they are installed/maintained correctly. There is also a gas heater of a similar design. After doing more research, I have gone off the idea. they require maintenance annually and unless you buy a cheap Chinese clone, they are quite expensive to buy. 

I would love to have a rocket mass stove in the workshop. They are very efficient if designed properly, there is complete combustion, so no smoke. some of the designs with a huge thermal mass are amazing. They are very popular in the US. I did build a prototype a few years ago and it worked very well.


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## RichardG

space.dandy said:


> One that works? I’ve been using a cheap £30 (at the time) B&Q one to heat mine for over ten years now and it’s brilliant. It heats up quickly and does a good job of heating the space. I also have it on a smart plug that keeps it above 10C when I’m not working.



Either you’ve been lucky or I have been very unlucky. I have 2 oil radiators, both dimplex models though, and they take 30 minutes to even get luke warm.

I have now gone down the quartz wall heater route.

MH-10-1 Wall-Mounted Quartz Heater 600 / 1200W

I have placed these where I tend to stand and work and I think the work really well.


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## Rorschach

space.dandy said:


> One that works? I’ve been using a cheap £30 (at the time) B&Q one to heat mine for over ten years now and it’s brilliant. It heats up quickly and does a good job of heating the space. I also have it on a smart plug that keeps it above 10C when I’m not working.



Are you sure it's oil filled and not just a standard electric radiator?


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## Cabinetman

My oil filled radiator has a thermostat as I think most do, I leave it on all year if it’s below about 12° c it clicks on.
As I see it, the reason I put all that money into good insulation was to save money over the years on heating. The radiator uses very little power, I keep an eye on it and it’s not on all that often at all. Ian


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## space.dandy

Rorschach said:


> Are you sure it's oil filled and not just a standard electric radiator?


I’m positive, but not at home to check. Search for ‘oil filled radiators’ on Wickes, that’s what I have an older version of.


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## space.dandy

Cabinetman said:


> My oil filled radiator has a thermostat as I think most do, I leave it on all year if it’s below about 12° c it clicks on.
> As I see it, the reason I put all that money into good insulation was to save money over the years on heating. The radiator uses very little power, I keep an eye on it and it’s not on all that often at all. Ian


Mine has a thermostat but it doesn’t work for my usage, which is why I use a smart plug so I can create a heating profile.


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## Lons

space.dandy said:


> One that works? I’ve been using a cheap £30 (at the time) B&Q one to heat mine for over ten years now and it’s brilliant. It heats up quickly and does a good job of heating the space. I also have it on a smart plug that keeps it above 10C when I’m not working.


+1
I have 3 small oil filled heaters all cheapos one I bought and the others from MIL house clearance and all are pretty hot to the touch within 5 minutes, I just move them around close to where I'm working.

My experience of diesel heaters is limited though I have used one and found it very efficient at heating a large caravan but it was damned noisy even though installed in a sound deadening box. It was a decent brand and the reports of faults and overheating concerning very cheap Chiwanese copies would stop me buying one of those.


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## Rorschach

I am guessing then that the cheapo oil filled have very little oil in them. I only have experience of a decent one (Dimplex I think) and it was very heavy, very slow to heat up.
If I am right about very little oil then they are just acting as a standard electric rad and the supposed benefits are being oil filled are negated.


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## Lons

Rorschach said:


> I am guessing



They are the only words you should ever post.


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## Rorschach

Lons said:


> They are the only words you should ever post.



Is that really necessary?


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## Lons

Rorschach said:


> Is that really necessary?


Probably not but then why do you make guessing statements when you don't know which models I have unless you're suggesting that I'm not being truthful which I assume you're not.


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## Rorschach

Lons said:


> Probably not but then why do you make guessing statements when you don't know which models I have unless you're suggesting that I'm not being truthful which I assume you're not.



Everyone who said they used a high quality unit said they are slow to heat, the people who use cheap units (including you) say they are fast to heat. So what does that imply?

There is no need for you to be rude.


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## Lons

Have a good day.


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## AdrianUK

I use a Honeywell 2KW oil filled rad. I find it easy and efficient in use, yes it takes 10 mins to warm up, however, it retains and continues to radiate heat long after its turned off either manually or by thermostatic control. I have thought about a solid fuel stove, and when I do, I know I am seeing with ‘rose tinted specs’ syndrome, looks great, burns scrap wood, cosy etc, but there are also drawbacks, such as initial cost, maintenance, safety, mess. Stoves require good airflow both for efficiency and to negate carbon monoxide risk.

For me, the cost of running a good oil rad is not expensive, mine cost me £15.00 a few years ago, bought it second hand just to test whether it would suffice, with the intention of buying a new one if it worked out, however, never needed to.


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## space.dandy

Lard said:


> The responses appears typical in that the majority of you ‘once again’ treat the questioner as a small child who must be scolded....for gods‘s sake either answer him or assume that if he’s bright enough to operate a computer and old enough to own a shed and operate machinery that he’s able to come up with his own decisions and plans instead of being made to face, what is simply, a barrage your own criticisms and opinions on stuff he didn’t ask for.



Sometimes people (particularly beginners) ask on these fora questions that are based on misconception or invalid assumption. I know this firsthand because I have been in that situation. I think one of my first posts here was to ask advice on which table saw to buy -- like most beginners, I guess, I had watched a lot of (predominantly American) YouTube videos and was convinced that the table saw was the centre of any good workshop. Some people here suggested that I didn't want or need a table saw at all, most notably Custard, who was kind enough to give me a tour of his workshop and demonstrate the pros and cons of various machines with advice on which would be most suitable for my needs. That was a valuable learning experience and I am indebted to Custard for taking the time out of his day to help me. If everyone had simply answered my question I would probably now be the owner of a regrettably expensive mistake.

Whether you agree with them or not, I would ask you to consider that those who have responded have done so in good faith with the intention of helping the OP and, while you are entitled to your opinion, I do not feel your criticism is deserved.


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## Sandyn

Oil filled radiators vary from a few hundred watts to about 2.5kW, so the power and surface area will determine how quickly they heat and how hot they get. Some are low powered are designed for low background heat. They will never get very hot, so ideal for a kids bedroom, for example. If you want a lower powered appliances, look at tube heaters, They go down to tens of watts. Good for exposed bathrooms etc where you want to prevent freezing, but not really heat the room


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## artie

Sandyn said:


> If you want a lower powered appliances, look at tube heaters, They go down to tens of watts. Good for exposed bathrooms etc where you want to prevent freezing, but not really heat the room


I have a wardrobe, or sliderobe if you go by the advertising it's 3 compartment, I put a 40w tube heater in each bay, in hopes of keeping the damp out.
I actually have to touch them to see if they are on. So as Sandyn says deffo not for heat but may just keep the frost at bay in a small area.


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## Rorschach

An incandescent light bulb in a non flammable housing can be an excellent heater for small spaces.


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## Sandyn

Incandescent bulb........ah!! the good old days, when you could get a light bulb for pennies and they stopped the bathroom freezing in winter.


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## Sandyn

> My experience of diesel heaters is limited though I have used one and found it very efficient at heating a large caravan but it was damned noisy even though installed in a sound deadening box. It was a decent brand and the reports of faults and overheating concerning very cheap Chiwanese copies would stop me buying one of those.


Me neither. Just too risky to buy something which almost certainly hasn't been certified correctly, if at all.


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## cowie122

Sandyn said:


> Diesel heaters vent to the outside and could be installed external to the heated space. They are processor controlled with a micro diesel pump to control flow. They are in widespread use to as overnight heaters for trucks and camper vans and are perfectly safe as long as they are installed/maintained correctly. There is also a gas heater of a similar design. After doing more research, I have gone off the idea. they require maintenance annually and unless you buy a cheap Chinese clone, they are quite expensive to buy.
> 
> I would love to have a rocket mass stove in the workshop. They are very efficient if designed properly, there is complete combustion, so no smoke. some of the designs with a huge thermal mass are amazing. They are very popular in the US. I did build a prototype a few years ago and it worked very well.


I started out with a couple of electric radiant wall mounted patio heaters which did not really work, Next I had a propane space heater which did heat the space but I was conscious of the moisture that these emit plus tools getting rusty , Now I have one of the diesel heaters which is brilliant, it sits on a bench with the exhaust and the combustion air intake piped outside Very controllable


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## Lard

space.dandy said:


> Sometimes people (particularly beginners) ask on these fora questions that are based on misconception or invalid assumption. I know this firsthand because I have been in that situation. I think one of my first posts here was to ask advice on which table saw to buy -- like most beginners, I guess, I had watched a lot of (predominantly American) YouTube videos and was convinced that the table saw was the centre of any good workshop. Some people here suggested that I didn't want or need a table saw at all, most notably Custard, who was kind enough to give me a tour of his workshop and demonstrate the pros and cons of various machines with advice on which would be most suitable for my needs. That was a valuable learning experience and I am indebted to Custard for taking the time out of his day to help me. If everyone had simply answered my question I would probably now be the owner of a regrettably expensive mistake.
> 
> Whether you agree with them or not, I would ask you to consider that those who have responded have done so in good faith with the intention of helping the OP and, while you are entitled to your opinion, I do not feel your criticism is deserved.



“If everyone had simply answered my question....”

I’m not sure whether to laugh or be despondent at that one


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## Spectric

Hi

If you have a large workshop and the height then one good way of heating is using a gas tube radiant heater, Tube Heaters | Schwank and there are others around. If not and the workshop gets a lot of use then fit a gas boiler and radiators, thats what I ended up with in a previous workshop. For most other applications oil filled rads offer a good solution to the home hobby shed/garage and once upto temperature do not run continous as the oil acts as a heat mass and so are reasonably efficient.


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## Woody2Shoes

space.dandy said:


> Sometimes people (particularly beginners) ask on these fora questions that are based on misconception or invalid assumption. I know this firsthand because I have been in that situation. I think one of my first posts here was to ask advice on which table saw to buy -- like most beginners, I guess, I had watched a lot of (predominantly American) YouTube videos and was convinced that the table saw was the centre of any good workshop. Some people here suggested that I didn't want or need a table saw at all, most notably Custard, who was kind enough to give me a tour of his workshop and demonstrate the pros and cons of various machines with advice on which would be most suitable for my needs. That was a valuable learning experience and I am indebted to Custard for taking the time out of his day to help me. If everyone had simply answered my question I would probably now be the owner of a regrettably expensive mistake.
> 
> Whether you agree with them or not, I would ask you to consider that those who have responded have done so in good faith with the intention of helping the OP and, while you are entitled to your opinion, I do not feel your criticism is deserved.


Yes. On the internet it's basically hard to gauge the extent to which someone knows how much they don't know - and with power tools and the like the stakes are higher than usual. There are some posters on here who can sometimes come across as a bit condescending, but for every one of those there are several who ask questions in a (and no offence meant to anyone here, nobody knows everything) naive-seeming way. A couple of examples in this case would be what mimimum separation between flammable materials in the shed structure and the flue should the OP aim for, and have they thought about air supply requirements (getting either wrong could be expensive or worse).


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## artie

Very amusing.
We have a poster asking for information.
We have answers + information not asked for but if not required can be easily ignored.
Then we have a contributor telling off the posters who provided unasked for information who seems totally oblivious to the fact that his contribution was not asked for either.
I am aware my contribution was not asked for either but why buck the trend.


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## Glitch

Drawn to this thread by the title.

The OP only answered post #8 when he got the answer he wanted.

No idea why he would want to use a portable wood burning camp stove to heat his 'shop. Maybe he also wants to cook on it and also use it in a tent at weekends?.

Without the background info it's bound to trigger people's imaginations and lead to unsolicited advice and 'banter' between the posters.

If you start a thread asking for advice it always helps to respond to posters to keep the thread focused.

Anyway, I think I'll get an oil filled rad and a smart plug to keep the chill off my little shed.


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## Lard

artie said:


> Very amusing.
> We have a poster asking for information.
> We have answers + information not asked for but if not required can be easily ignored.
> Then we have a contributor telling off the posters who provided unasked for information who seems totally oblivious to the fact that his contribution was not asked for either.
> I am aware my contribution was not asked for either but why buck the trend.



So sorry, I forgot I’m not in the inner circle and should not have tried to actually answer the OP‘s question.


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## stevek

Hi, read these posts and remembered a brand new Infrared heater I was given many years ago for my shed but I never used it, looked up infrared heating on the internet and found this company, lots of relevent info.
Industrial Infrared Heater I should say that Ive no connection with them nor do I know anyone thats used them, but worth a read if your thinking about heating,,I might get my infrared heater out too and have a proper look at it.
Steve.


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## space.dandy

Lard said:


> “If everyone had simply answered my question....”
> 
> I’m not sure whether to laugh or be despondent at that one


If you have the choice, why not choose the happier option? Surely there’s enough misery in the world right now without looking for more.

Also, it wasn’t clear from my earlier reply but I’d like to point out that many people did answer my question as posted. I’d like to think that anyone stumbling across that thread with a similar question would find a fairly balanced discussion, not only of the comparative merits of particular saws but also when a table saw may or may not be a suitable choice. I think similar can be said of this thread too.


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## space.dandy

Lard said:


> So sorry, I forgot I’m not in the inner circle and should not have tried to actually answer the OP‘s question.


What is this inner circle you speak of? And more importantly, is there a jig for it?

You gave a useful, concrete answer to OP’s question. There’s nothing to apologise for in that.


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## BillK

@boggy no idea if there is anyone near you or if this could be done by a remote order, but custom exhaust fabricators sprang to mind.
60mm (or 2 3/8") is a normal size and stainless tube bending is part of their game of course.

Also you can get pre-made bends of various shapes & sizes, to build exhausts from, elbows and different angles etc. Might just find something to suit. as a starter -


https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=60mm+stainless+exhaust+bends&oq=60mm+stainless+exhaust+bends



Good luck. I'd love a burner in my workshop but have a wall-mount leccy heater rescued from an office refurb (so takes almost no space up), and those cheapo 1600w halogen heaters for moving around.


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## Lard

space.dandy said:


> What is this inner circle you speak of? And more importantly, is there a jig for it?
> 
> You gave a useful, concrete answer to OP’s question. There’s nothing to apologise for in that.



“What is this inner circle you speak of? And more importantly, is there a jig for it?”

Now that is very clever!


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## stevek

Oh dear, hes started quite a kerfuffle!
My old mate now retired was renting a unit on a farm, where he had a joinery shop, it was a cold drafty old place and he picked up an old wood stove, used to crank it up and stand over it for a bit of warmth, anyway the landlord made him stop useing it because of complaints from the other units about the accrid smell of smoke,,worth bearing in mind esp if you have a single story shed and a consequently low flue terminal, I read some more about the infrared heaters and to my mind they do seem to be the way to go, instant heat onto you where your mostly working.


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## pops92

I took the plunge and bought a Chinese air diesel heater for my single garage. Decided no more cold garage in the winter. Been in 3 days and it's brilliant,local garage has red deisel so even better. Should have done this last year when we moved here,no matter now sorted.


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## Rorschach

pops92 said:


> I took the plunge and bought a Chinese air diesel heater for my single garage. Decided no more cold garage in the winter. Been in 3 days and it's brilliant,local garage has red deisel so even better. Should have done this last year when we moved here,no matter now sorted.View attachment 97063



Would love a bit more info on this if possible. Costings, installation etc.


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## pops92

Rorschach said:


> Would love a bit more info on this if possible. Costings, installation etc.


Will get back to you with a few photos and links to the items needed for my setup


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## pops92

Bought this heater off Amazon delivered in 3 days nothing missing except pop rivets on the spring clasps. Worked perfect no nightmares like I have read.
The carbonmonoxide alarm is a must no cheapies wanted.
I picked this transformer as I dont want a battery.
I needed 120cm pipe you only get 60cm with the kit plus needed a silencer. There isn't in opinion much noise to me. But I have severe hearing loss. 
Oh yeah diesel I use red as there is a local supplier.
More info tomorrow. I got all info I needed off YouTube and Facebook. Spent quite a while gathering info b4 taking the plunge.
This setup works perfect for my needs.


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## artie

You probably have plenty to keep you busy setting up etc, but once it's done you might want to try heating oil / Kerosene. Might be cheaper and cleaner.


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## pops92

It's all set up now working fine. I will stay with red deisel suits me fine.


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## Marfor

Been sitting on the fence about heating and what’s stopped me is the heating of the workshop and the cooling and maybe condensation due to heating and cooling at this time of the year. Don’t want rusty tools.
So is that a possibility when heating the workshop with either a diesel heater like above or a small wood stove?
At the moment I use a small electric fan heater.
Should also add it is fully insulted.


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## Rorschach

Any kind of heating brings with it a risk of condensation and rust. That being said I heat my workshop with paraffin which one would normally avoid due to the moisture produced but there is sufficient ventilation (and oil and dust all over the my tools) that I don't have an issue with rust at all.


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## Sandyn

I would love to fit one of these diesel heaters, but the potential problem I see is that you are fitting an un-approved heating device in your home, so there are no regulations to control fitting. 
The Far east heaters:- I would be very surprised if they are CE approved, but if they are, it will be for fitting in a motor home or a truck and not in domestic premises. Which is OK, people do things like that all the time, me included, probably nothing will go wrong, but if it does and worst case it causes a fire and your house suffers damage, the investigation shows that the diesel heater caused the fire. You can guarantee that your insurance company will limit the payout by a considerable amount. It's a huge risk I won't take. I have suffered insurance companies before. Every claim I have made (there haven't been many) was disputed by the insurance company. When I had roof damage, they chanced their hand saying ....well it's an old house, the slates must have been slack, Lack of maintenance, so we aren't paying out. I obviously fought that stupidity and they paid out. Then when my old garage collapsed after 2+ft of snow fell, they (different company) said...well it was an old garage, even though the bits which failed were as fresh as the day it was installed....(probably only 50 years before  ) I fought that but they would not budge. It was due for replacement, but was still OK.


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## pops92

Not really going to get into this. Good luck to you.


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## Sandyn

pops92 said:


> Not really going to get into this. Good luck to you.


I would still be really interested in how you get on with it, how much fuel it uses and what temperature you can get the workshop up to. As I said, I would love to fit one.


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## pops92

Okay this is for members interested in these air heaters. The photos show my set up which is still being refined. I have changed the fuel line to motorcycle clear fuel line and included a diesel filter . The fuel line fitted is not fuel line it cheap sh*t not fit for purpose. The air intake and exhaust go through the wall to the outside. Will show a photo tomorrow as it's dark now. I got this one as which they call portable as it suited my purpose. Dont know fuel consumption and don't care really again suits my purpose. In the shed today from 1100 to 1400rs I set it to 12°c and I am happy that. YouTube has tons of stuff on there about fuel consumption etc. 
I watched loads of stuff on YouTube and decided I go for that. Dont regret it.
Not interested what if. I am happy with it so far.


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## Rorschach

Looks good, glad it is working out for you.


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