# Shooting



## Jamie Copeland (8 Apr 2016)

Any of you lot shoot?

I'm going to a clay shooting taster to see if I enjoy it.

Ideally I'd like to shoot small game and know folk who'd take me wildfowling and pest shooting.

Just interested in how folk get started. Shotguns seem bloody expensive.


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## Harbo (8 Apr 2016)

Just Rats with my air rifle 

Rod


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## t8hants (8 Apr 2016)

I only put expensive holes in cardboard, ranging from just under 1/4" up to just over 1/2"


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## mailee (8 Apr 2016)

I used to be into shooting before Hungerford, full bore pistols and rifles but gave up after the aforementioned to avoid having my guns confiscated. During that time I did a little clay shooting and really enjoyed it. Only drawback was the cost compared to pistol and rifle shooting. I used to load my own cartridges so making it cheaper but never really got into shotguns other than occasional shoots. i found it strange not having a front sight when I started. :lol:


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## Water-Mark (8 Apr 2016)

Just targets and arrows.

I found firearms shooting to expensive, i get my "bullets" back.


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## Benchwayze (8 Apr 2016)

You should be able to book a day's shoot at a clay pigeon range. The guns and cartridges etc are usually supplied. You would enjoy it I'm sure. I did this a few years ago. The only targets I missed were the 'clay 'rabbits' that are rolled along the ground. My first attempt too, and I found it much easier hitting a flying target. 

It was great fun, and it got me hooked. Every so often I get the urge to go again, but I can't cope with the walking these days. (hammer) 

HTH

Cheers


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## Claymore (8 Apr 2016)

They are recruiting for soldiers at the moment and you even get to see the world, and best of all you don't have to buy your own gun. Better to shoot people than critters who can shoot back.


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## Zeddedhed (9 Apr 2016)

You don't need to spend a fortune to get a gun good enough for clay shooting.

I shoot on several local farms (pest control and some pheasant/partridge) and shoot clays fairly often.

None of my guns cost me more than £200 and they are all perfectly adequate for the job. Granted they are not as beautifully crafted as a Purdy or a Holland & Holland, or as well balanced as a competition grade Beretta, but they've put many 100's of kilos of food on the table and won me several £K at local clay shoots.

It's the cartridges that'll get you in the end - £250 per 1000 for an average load.

Having said that I love it. It gets me out, meet some interesting people and I do like a nice rabbit and pheasant casserole!!


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## rafezetter (9 Apr 2016)

I used to do clay pigeon in my mid teens with a 4/10 side by side. but the first time I went on an actual game shoot put me off, I guess I'm just too squeamish for the mess a shotgun can make of a small critter. I 've thought about trying clays again many a time but never really got around to it.


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## adidat (9 Apr 2016)

Oh yes. .410 - .44 magnum

Excellent hobbie but very expensive as above really. 

As I don't yet reaload .44 special costs me almost 50p a bang!

Adidat


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## sunnybob (9 Apr 2016)

over 20 years of pistol and rifle shooting, 100's of 1000's of rounds fired. Used to reload 8 different calibers on a dillon 650 press.
Now I live in a country that allows only shotgun, so i do that.
As zedhead says, you dont need a multi thousand pound gun. I bought one brand new for £700, and that has won me a medal and will see me out.
Ammo here is 20 euro a 100. An afternoons shooting cost around 25 euro with all fees (but not including the beer afterwards)


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## AJB Temple (9 Apr 2016)

Yep. Have shot clays for years. Bought a second hand Beretta o/u many years ago which has served me very well after some stock mods. Not fanatical about it, but a clay shoot is a social occasion and good fun. Oddly enough I have never shot live game although currently I am tempted to deal that way with the endless rabbits that dig their way into our garden.


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## Benchwayze (9 Apr 2016)

Claymore":1d7eg1kf said:


> They are recruiting for soldiers at the moment and you even get to see the world, and best of all you don't have to buy your own gun. Better to shoot people than critters who can shoot back.



I've heard of Army Veterans Clay, but I think at 77 I am finally over the hill! :lol:


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## sunnybob (9 Apr 2016)

The only thing I ever killed was a rabbit, with a shotgun. It was a vermin control thing, didnt want to eat it. I went to see if i would "enjoy" it. It did nothing for me so never went again.
i used to live next door to a hunter. He shot wood pigeon and rabbits by the hundred for farmers as vermin control, and deer for the meat.


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## NazNomad (9 Apr 2016)

Harbo":oqiudfsl said:


> Just Rats with my air rifle
> 
> Rod





Same ... and squirrels.


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## Claymore (9 Apr 2016)

Hey Naz....... try shooting our Squirrels lol
https://www.flickr.com/photos/[email protected] ... 696100555/


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## NazNomad (9 Apr 2016)

I wouldn't shoot a red one, even an unarmed red one. :-D


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## finneyb (9 Apr 2016)

I converse by email with a Vietnam vet and woodturner who makes hunting calls (duck, turkey etc) his strapline is 

Old style calls for today's outdoorsman.
Combat Infantryman, the ultimate hunter where the prey shoots back.
"Illegitimus non carborundum est"


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## Wildman (9 Apr 2016)

Rats, squirrels, wabbits, and pigeon with an air rifle, don't eat the rats but do everything else.


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## blackrodd (9 Apr 2016)

22 rimfire and a 22 air rifle for pests, rats rabbits etc
Rodders


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## LancsRick (10 Apr 2016)

Air rifle (HFT, rabbits)
Air Pistol (targets)
Firearms (rabbits, some target)
Shotguns (clays, game)

Shoot for leisure and for hunting with all (except the pistol), have shot for many years. More than happy to answer any questions!


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## woodfarmer (10 Apr 2016)

NazNomad":2blyaay3 said:


> Harbo":2blyaay3 said:
> 
> 
> > Just Rats with my air rifle
> ...



I hope you mean American grey tree rats 

the little brownish orangey coloured ones are just too cute.

Oddly I have nearly always hunted with a rifle, rabbits and woodpigeons. and always for meat.


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## BearTricks (10 Apr 2016)

The council removed a bin just up the path from my house because they didn't have the budget for it. The resulting rubbish thrown in to the bushes because people can't be bothered to walk an extra 50 feet before throwing it away has caused what seems like thousands of rats to move in.

I think my dad's old air rifle would get some serious use, but there's probably laws about shooting in built up areas.


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## n0legs (10 Apr 2016)

BearTricks":17t7xmzh said:


> I think my dad's old air rifle would get some serious use, but there's probably laws about shooting in built up areas.



50 feet from the centre of a highway for starters.


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## sunnybob (10 Apr 2016)

good air rifle, silencer (oops, sorry, sound moderator) and an upstairs window at night, No danger of the pellet flying down the road if you miss.


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## LancsRick (10 Apr 2016)

woodfarmer":3qlacvyx said:


> NazNomad":3qlacvyx said:
> 
> 
> > Harbo":3qlacvyx said:
> ...



Not to mention protected!


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## n0legs (10 Apr 2016)

sunnybob":3lb7eb30 said:


> good air rifle, silencer (oops, sorry, sound moderator) and an upstairs window at night, No danger of the pellet flying down the road if you miss.



Wow , real responsible comment Bob. 
Give the public, government, campaigners and anti gun crowd the chance and air weapons will be gone as well.


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## sunnybob (10 Apr 2016)

no legs....
being PC didnt help in 88 when they took away the rifles. it didnt help in 97 when they took away the pistols. Both of those as a result of Police incompetence and mismanagement. Do you think ANY politician is going to let air rifles get away with being?


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## n0legs (10 Apr 2016)

sunnybob":37nhz981 said:


> no legs....
> being PC didnt help in 88 when they took away the rifles. it didnt help in 97 when they took away the pistols. Both of those as a result of Police incompetence and mismanagement. Do you think ANY politician is going to let air rifles get away with being?



Sorry Bob, I wasn't trying to be PC. If you really are a gun enthusiast it surprises me you would make the comment in the first place.
We're not in '88 or '97, we've all moved on and learned to live with what we have left. I for one used to love the shooting meets of old and don't want the sport/interest diminished any further.
Just don't give anyone any more, and excuse the pun, ammo than needed.
Projecting an impression of responsibility and competence would be more like it. 

Not looking for a row mate, just disappointed to read a comment like that.


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## sunnybob (10 Apr 2016)

I was being safe. Note I took into account the possibility of overshoot (lol).

Sadly, nothing that you or I say or do will have any effect on anyones point of view. Its a subject that youre either for or against and in over 30 years of shooting I have never heard of anyone changing sides.

And we are talking about vermin control, doing the councils job for them.


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## Skeety (11 Apr 2016)

I used to shoot a LOT of clays, 20-25k a year, not so much recently due to Family issues and a massive cut in income  Also use to shoot rifles from .22LR through 7.62mm and .308 at target and vermin.

It is very enjoyable, safe and I have made a lot of great friends whilst shooting and refereeing on the circuit.

You can get started very cheaply; however make sure you have lessons with a Coach who will help you find a gun that suits you. The most important thing is that the gun fits you. You will shoot better with a sub £200 gun that fits you than with a £10k gun that doesn't!

Shotgun cartridges vary widely in price but you can pick up decent cartridges for well less than £200 a thousand for clays.

Have a look at www.cpsa.co.uk who are the UK governing body and you will find local clubs and coaches on there to get you started. Once you start you will get chatting to people and find smaller grounds that operate once a fortnight or monthly.

Main thing you need to get started are lessons to see if you like it; if you do, which i'm sure you will  you then look at the next steps:

Apply for your Shotgun Certificate £60
Get a gun cabinet and install it £130+ Go for a 3 or 5 gun cabinet as you will end up with more than 1 gun 
Join the CPSA for insurance etc.
Get some decent glasses & hearing protection.
Once your SGC is granted you can go out and shoot without being accompanied at a ground.

Once you progress you will upgrade bits, glasses, hearing protection, shooting bag etc. I started with a £125 Baikal 28" O\U which I no longer have but my main Competition Guns are Beretta AL391 Semi Auto's which have been fitted to me.

Good luck and enjoy!

If you need any help locating a ground or Coach local to you PM me as I know quite a few APSI and CPSA Coaches and Instructors who will no doubt know someone near you 

Cheers,

Jon.


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## Claymore (11 Apr 2016)

and don't forget to point the end with the hole in! 9-)


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## pollys13 (13 Apr 2016)

Claymore":1t12wm4d said:


> They are recruiting for soldiers at the moment and you even get to see the world, and best of all you don't have to buy your own gun. Better to shoot people than critters who can shoot back.


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## Zeddedhed (13 Apr 2016)

And if you live in Kent be prepared to wait for nine months for your certificate. There's a huge backlog at the moment


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## Cinimod (15 Apr 2016)

Im glad i'm not the only one who enjoys shooting, i have done for years but only as a back garden plinker. It also means that i can join two of my hobbies together as over the years I have made stocks for my airguns aswell as for other UKCAF members guns.........dom


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## monkeybiter (15 Apr 2016)

Cinimod":28dytisq said:


> over the years I have made stocks for my airguns aswell as for other UKCAF members guns.........dom



Pictures required....


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## sunnybob (15 Apr 2016)

Funny you should say "pictures", I've just been sorting out my 1000's of pics and came across this one.
My competition rig pre 1997.


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## Cinimod (15 Apr 2016)

monkeybiter":116bkqta said:


> Cinimod":116bkqta said:
> 
> 
> > over the years I have made stocks for my airguns aswell as for other UKCAF members guns.........dom
> ...



Hi Mike, I like pics aswell but the depth of my tech knowledge is turning on my ipad1.

Does anyone know if it is possible to copy, cut and paste an image from one forum to this one direct if you have them both open at once :?: :?: :?: ............dom


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## sunnybob (15 Apr 2016)

The simplest way on this forum is to post your pictures online at something like photobucket, or picassa. Once they are online, you just have to open them, right click and copy the img box, then left click and paste in this forum message box.
I dont think it works if the other forum is just taking the pic from your computer each time you log on, at least I havent managed that.

Oh, and looking at your post, DO NOT "cut" anything, youll never see it again


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## Cinimod (15 Apr 2016)

sunnybob":3rnzwb1c said:


> Oh, and looking at your post, DO NOT "cut" anything, youll never see it again



Told you I didn't have a clue   :sign3: :sign3: . I'll try to follow and see what happens, I just wondered if there was a quicker way rather than going via photo bucket........dom


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## sunnybob (16 Apr 2016)

Some sites let you load direct from your computer. So far I havent found that facility on this place.


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## Cinimod (13 Jul 2016)

Some of my own gunstocks, just to see if I can get pics to work.........Dom


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## monkeybiter (13 Jul 2016)

Some nice work there, very impressive! There isn't one I don't like.

Any work in progress pics [wip] ?


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## mailee (13 Jul 2016)

sunnybob":ui0ppe6d said:


> Funny you should say "pictures", I've just been sorting out my 1000's of pics and came across this one.
> My competition rig pre 1997.



Is that a S&W 686 by any chance? I used to have one of those and a few speed loaders too.


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## Cinimod (13 Jul 2016)

monkeybiter":3i5k2jr9 said:


> Some nice work there, very impressive! There isn't one I don't like.
> 
> Any work in progress pics [wip] ?



Hi Mike, glad you like. With regards to WIPs I always seem to get carried away and forget to take photos.   .
I have a stock on the go over the coming weeks so perhaps I'll remember :wink: ..........Dom


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## sunnybob (13 Jul 2016)

Mailee, it was. 
686 with a davis windmaster barrel, aristocrat 3 position sight rib and full trigger tune. Hogue rubber custom grip.
I shot many 1500 and police pistol comps back in the day.
Heres a side pic. sorry its not good, but its a scan of a 20 year old real photo.






I had quite a lot of handguns before 97. Kept a couple of rifles afterwards.
Cant own anything here except double barrel shotgun or 177 air rifle.
i wish I was as good at clays as I was at handgunning.


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## whiskywill (14 Jul 2016)

rafezetter":p9poyxzk said:


> I'm just too squeamish for the mess a shotgun can make of a small critter.



Wow! That must have been a very long distance shot. I thought "critters" only lived in the U.S.A. :wink:


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## mailee (14 Jul 2016)

Ah, yes, I thought it was Sunnybob and I did recognise the Hogue grip although mine had the original grips. Strangely enough I used to shoot Police pistol too and did win a Turkey at one of our Christmas shoots. It has brought back some good memories for me and I will have to see if I can dig out my photos of those years although they were all before the advent of digital photography. I also owned a Colt Comander, Walter PPK, A Ruger Red hawk, along with a 30/30 Winchester and a 7.62 Shultz & Larsen rifle which was based on the old Lee Enfield action. Happy days.


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## sunnybob (15 Jul 2016)

Found another one that showed my guns from around 1994;





from the top clockwise, Marlin 357 magnum lever action carbine.
Webley MkVI in 455 webley.
S&W 686 357 magnum stock apart from the hogue grip.
Ruger redhawk in 44 magnum.
S&W 65 in 357 magnum.
Fiochhi spe target pistol in 22 long.
S&W 686 (again) with a nottingham shooting centre slab barrel and goncalo alves exotic wood grips.
And my all time favourite, A Colt gold cup 70's series national match in 45acp calber, with a gary clark compensater.

I start to cry every time I look at this pic. Dont get me started on Blair.


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## mailee (15 Jul 2016)

Oh Sunnybob, that is some collection you had there. Those Webley's were one hell of a gun in .455 calibre, I seem to remember reading that they were invented for shooting the Fussy wuzzies in the Boar war. Not sure if this was a true fact or not, had to sympathise with the poor devils if they were. :lol: That Colt gold cup was a gun I often drooled over having fired one once. Very nice with the compensator fitted too. You certainly liked the Smith's didn't you? :lol: Got to admit the precision of build on those were fantastic, I remember taking the side plate off mine once and wondering how they could make two parts fit so closely that the join was invisible to the naked eye! I did like my Ruger Redhawk and often used it on the police pistol shoots as it was such a nice accurate gun to shoot. Now that Marlin does bring back a funny thing that happened at a local range when a guy turned up with the .444 version also fitted with a telescopic sight which perked our interests. One of our members asked if he could have a look at it to which the owner replied you can have a go if you like. Tim a friend of mine took him up on his word and raised the rifle cocked it and took a shot.....with his eye very close to the scope, you can imagine what happened next as Tim placed the gun down on the counter and crumpled into a heap on the floor! I doubled with laughter as the owner calmly stated "Glad he put the rifle down first" The rest of us didn't make the same mistake. :lol: I look back on those times with happy memories as we did have so much fun and none of it dangerous despite the nature of the hobby. Unfortunately it is the small few that spoil things for the masses. I gave up mine just after Hungerford managing to sell them before they were taken! Brilliant memories thanks. :wink:


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## t8hants (15 Jul 2016)

One of the few pistols I have ever shot was a long range thing chambering 30-06 rifle rounds. 
It had a long barrel as I recall to comply with the recently introduced ban, and you shot it sitting down in bench they called a 'flying machine' using a scope mounted on the thing.
My score was 9 bulls and an inner at 300yards, and my mate was disgusted as he was some sort of record holder with the beast.
Funny thing is I doubt if I could do it with a rifle.


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## llangatwgnedd (15 Jul 2016)

Here's just one of my three firearms I own.

1969-1972 BSA Martini International MK IV


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## MarkDennehy (16 Jul 2016)

Mine might be a little less traditional...






Since replaced (as spare parts were becoming an issue) with an upgrade:


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## sunnybob (16 Jul 2016)

Mailee, you have the gist of the 455 story. The previous calibre used by the British army was 38. (not special, just 38).
It was ok at injuring an enemy at close range but couldnt actually penetrate an army great coat if the coat was soaking wet.
When the "fuzzie wuzzie" war broke out, the 38 was totally inadequate as it was the first time the army had fought people who were high on drugs. The enemy warriors would not feel the pain of the small bullets, and could still fight after being hit many times.

So the 455 was hastily engineered in to the officers revolvers. Even then, because the original bullets were quite long and tapered, they tended to pass through flesh without too much of what the yanks call "shock and awe". Better than the 38, but not so much when a machete weilding drug crazed warrior was running at you.
So the final bullet became the 455 webley manstopper. This was a flat nosed bullet (think miniature tin can) of soft lead. When that hit flesh the lead expanded to almost twice its size and produced massive hydraulic shock waves which put down anyone who was in the way, regardless of any painkillers.

When war became civilised and rules of engagement were drawn up (geneva convention), the manstopper was ruled to be "cheating" and therefore the calibre was withdrawn from the army arsenal. 

I once got shot by a manstopper bullet. Fired from my gun, by me!

I reloaded my own ammo back then, and was using quite soft target loads on a 25 metre indoor range that had rubber curtains behind the targets to stop splash backs.
I fired the shot and then felt a strong "sting" in my ankle, that made me hop about a bit. The flat nosed bullet had failed to penetrate the rubber and bounced 25 metres back to me.


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## heimlaga (16 Jul 2016)

Sounds like the British army would need a supply of Vetterli riffles;-)

Those were bought cheap through some middlemen from Swiss army surplus stores and smuggled into Finland in great numbers in 1905 and thereabout to fight the Russians. They are still pretty common in the countryside and usually kept hidden because our stupid government doesn't allow people to apply for a licence on a riffle that doesn't have a paper trail leading to a legal importer.
A Vetterli makes some magnificent holes in things....... a big slow rather fat soft lead bullet..... though the munition supply run dry in the 60-ies so they cannot be used for moose hunting anymore.

By the way we could fit out half an army with the riffles kept hidden in Österbotten. A rather outdated army though. Mosin Nagant and Mauser from the independence war/civil war of 1917-1918. More Mosin Nagant and some Pystykorva from the second world war. Even more Mosin-Nagant and Pystykorva that "disappeared" from army stores after the peace with the intention to fit out a guerilla after the expected (planned but cancelled) Soviet invasion.

As usual with Finnish governments they uphold the official version of reality and pretend that none of this exists......... instead of sorting out the problem once and for all by issuing licenses for de-facto existing old riffles and keeping them under normal gun-control after that.


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## sunnybob (16 Jul 2016)

Casting your own bullets is not difficult, even for rifles.
I'm sure you could buy moulds from america (LEE, RCBS, possibly DILLON) or an engineer could make some.

Old wheel weights are superb for casting, and a small copper disc on the bottom of the bullet (called a gas check) will stop the expanding gases from eating the lead away as it travels down the barrel.

I once fired a 458 weatherby magnum elephant rifle that had home cast bullets. (in fact I still have 1) At that time i was 6ft 2" and about 14 stone and well used to all sorts of guns, but that thing recoiled so bad I had one shot and passed it back to the owner very quickly despite him telling me to keep going. Those big game hunters were TOUGH!!

Single shot rifles in the hands of experienced shots are far more effective than the current "spray and pray" type of shooting.


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## DennisCA (16 Jul 2016)

sunnybob":ijppruqn said:


> Mailee, it was.
> 686 with a davis windmaster barrel, aristocrat 3 position sight rib and full trigger tune. Hogue rubber custom grip.
> I shot many 1500 and police pistol comps back in the day.
> Heres a side pic. sorry its not good, but its a scan of a 20 year old real photo.
> ...



Still allowed in Finland, I have a gun safe that I don't think I'd be safe posting on a UK board, you guys are worse than the americans when it comes to guns, except in an inverse way. 

Part of the reason I'm happy the UK made a brexit. They stood for a huge portion of the attempts at banning or burying people in red tape that are coming from the EU...


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## sunnybob (16 Jul 2016)

we cant get into the "allowed" issue, it will very quickly become political and nasty and then the thread will be closed.

30 years ago I did know a man who served time for attempted murder with a 44 magnum pistol. He was a well respected man, even a gun dealer. But he found his wife had been cheating on him with his best friend and he lost the plot.
He knocked on the guys door with the 44 in his hand. He actually shot the guy 3 times as the man was trying to run back into the house.

He survived, albeit with less internal organs than he started the day with. So much for Dirty Harry and the "worlds most powerful handgun" The shooter got 8 years, reduced for good behaviour.


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## DennisCA (17 Jul 2016)

You're right about that, the what not to talk about stuff. I learned a long time ago nobodys mind will be changed. I do own a .44 revolver myself, and a lever action rifle in the same caliber. I use them to shoot at metal plates, using home cast bullets mostly.

One of the best mold makers around nowadays is MP-molds, a slovenian guy who makes his molds from brass. I have only his molds. But there are others of course.


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## No skills (17 Jul 2016)

Sunnybob 

Where abouts did you used to shoot? We had an indoor 25m range at coal house fort in East Tilbury with rubber matt backing. There also used to be a rotund gun dealer with a .44


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## sunnybob (17 Jul 2016)

Dennis, I havent heard of those moulds. It must be slow work with brass moulds, they would take a long time to cool down.
I used the Lee double moulds, but even they were prone to overheating. As I shot more than 1 calibre, I was rotating a half dozen moulds, keeping them just right temps.
But then I couldnt keep up so I started buying from KT bullets in Hereford. Kevin is long gone now, but by '96 I was buying a 100,000 a year off him.
I had a try at Bisley one year of the marlin 44 long colt octagonal barrel. I really wanted one of those, but was spending too much on competing with the pistols. Is that the model you have?


No skills, My main club was Taunton in Somerset. For several years I also belonged to Ham and Petersham in Richmond, which was where I first shot a real pistol, I was travelling between the two for work for several years so it was good. but then the work changed so I stayed at my home town club. But I competed all over the south west, right up to Birmigham, and across to Bisley.


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## sunnybob (17 Jul 2016)

Just looked at those moulds, man things have come a long way in the last 20 years. Got me quite nostalgic.


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## mailee (17 Jul 2016)

I managed to find some of the photos of my guns although they are scans of old ones and I was never a David Bailey so excuse the
quality.



At the top left was an Uberti copy of a Colt 45 which was a cheap Italian copy. Top right is a CZ75 in 9mm, Centre is the Shultz & larsen in .762, this was a very accurate rifle which I often used at Sheffield,
at the bottom is my 686. Here is a photo of yours truly at our outdoor range practising with the Uberti.



I also used to cast my own bullets and load my own rounds. I worked in a garage at the time so had access to lots of free wheel weights. These would be melted down with some Antimony and cast in a 
set of moulds. I had a good selection of loading equipment. If my memory serves me well most of the equipment was RCBS although I did have one of the Lee progressive units which made re-loading a lot faster.
I mainly cast Wad cutters as those gave a good clear impression in the targets. I do have some more photos somewhere with my PPK, Colt and Winchester, There is another showing me shooting a Luger and the aftermath as I dug 6 cases from the hood of my parka where the Luger had deposited them! :lol: Now that was a beautiful gun to shoot, just like pointing your finger.


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## sunnybob (17 Jul 2016)

I never had the patience for single action revolvers (lol) My passion was fast draw multiple target comps.
Memories are bitter sweet now. I would rather still be shooting pistols than just a shotgun.

A friend had a broomhandle mouser with artillery wooden holster. When the 97 ban came in he was assuming we would get a £100 each gun like when the slr's went in 88. So he paid to have it deactivated. Later when the compensation list came out, he just about cried because as you know we all got full retail for everything.
(thank you George Stadden)


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## Droogs (17 Jul 2016)

I used to love shooting, started when I was 8 and carried on when I joined up. Had to give up competition shooting after I had a breech misfire in 1988, when we were getting ready for Bisley. We were on the outdoor range at Cultybraggin at 600m and was on a roll with a 3 shot grouping all inside the size of the old 50p and as I fired my 4th round the SMLE Mk4 had a misfire which sheered the bolt lug nut and it all came out the back end. I ended up about 12ft from the firing point and the Lee Enfield about 20ft down the range with a cracked stock and split forestock furniture. I had powder burns all down my face and a bad score across my left eye (left handed firer). After that I would always twich at the moment of squeezing the trigger. It also didn't help that just shortly after we swopped over from SLRs as personal weapons to SA 80 L1A1s. I found out I couldn't shoot for rubbish as a right handed firer, took me 3 years after that to pass my APWT. Was so dischuffed, especially as I had to take off my marksmans badge on my No2s and best dress uniforms.


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## sunnybob (17 Jul 2016)

Droogs, thats whats known as REALLY bad luck in one way, but incredibly good luck you didnt lose the eye. I've seen two pistols dissassemble themselves due to bad reloading, but luckily neither owner was injured, except some minor burns on his hand.
That SA 80 was a disaster wasnt it? I think theyre up to mk 77 or something now, and still no one else in the world will buy it.


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## Droogs (17 Jul 2016)

Yeah Bob. I feel I was lucky really, but '88 was a bad year for shooters. I had to get rid of my pride and joy at the time - a Sig Sauer P226. Heart went out of it then and just did the usual range days during training etc after that. The SA80 was a bag of carp. We were down the road from you at Akrotiri when we converted and had the pleasure of having 5000 rounds each to fire during the conversion. After a full day on the range the plastic foregrip had moulded (melted) to the shape of our hands and most of us had lost the dust cover during fire and manouver exercises as it kept getting caught on our webbing. HK seem to have got it sorted now. Though I wish we had opted for the G36 or the Steyr instead.


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## DennisCA (17 Jul 2016)

sunnybob":1elkgqxw said:


> Dennis, I havent heard of those moulds. It must be slow work with brass moulds, they would take a long time to cool down.
> I used the Lee double moulds, but even they were prone to overheating. As I shot more than 1 calibre, I was rotating a half dozen moulds, keeping them just right temps.
> But then I couldnt keep up so I started buying from KT bullets in Hereford. Kevin is long gone now, but by '96 I was buying a 100,000 a year off him.
> I had a try at Bisley one year of the marlin 44 long colt octagonal barrel. I really wanted one of those, but was spending too much on competing with the pistols. Is that the model you have?
> ...



On the contrary I find brass moulds are very fast to cast with, I use 4 cavity models almost exclusively. I have one 6 cavity mold in aluminum though, also an MP-mold.

I have a Smith & Wesson 629, some kind of german special edition made by a company called Wischo I think.


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## sunnybob (17 Jul 2016)

Can you keep the flow going? does the brass keep so much heat that you have to wait every so often for the bullets to solidify?

The Lee alli moulds could get hot, but I had one RCBS mould in steel and that was a pig to use. i had to wait every three or four cats for the mould to cool off enough for the bullet to solidify.

A S&W 629 is the old Dirty harry 44 magnum model 29, but the 6 at the front denotes its made from stainless. S&W numbering systems were as arcane as our plane numbering, but generally all S&W guns starting with 6 were stainless, and 4 denoted alloy. Wishco was a german main distributor for S&W in europe. They didnt make the guns, just imported and proofed them, but sometimes ordered special editions just for their market (different grips, decorations etc etc) so you could have an ordinary 629 but with german proofs.


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## DennisCA (17 Jul 2016)

Yes I'm familiar with the S&W numbering system. It had several modifications done by Wishco, different trigger with wide face, grips, unfluted cylinder, sights and a bead blasted finish.

As for the molds I fill it up using my bottom pour lee pot (fitted with thermostat) and then I wait for the sprue to haze over, then I cut it and open the mold, I can repeat this procedure for hours once I get the settings tuned in. Sometimes I find I have to slow my casting rate but no problem in doing hundreds of bullets in a session. Though now it has been years since I last cast. Not much time in my life for shooting anymore.


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