# My lathe is ticking :( DML305



## pickledegg (2 Oct 2017)

Hi all,

I'm a lurker who has just signed up, apologies that my first post isn't the best - I figured you chaps might be the people to ask though.

I bought a Record Power DML305 back in June and I've been really happy with it so far, learning to turn and spending lots of time working at the lathe. 

Last week though my lathe has developed a disconcerting noise. I made a video to send to Record Power (awaiting response) looking for support but I'm worried I might have a bad bearing.

edit: Video is here, uploaded elsewhere since forum doesn't accept the file type: https://streamable.com/9vpyw

I have made sure the pulley setscrews (top and bottom pulleys) are tight and the pulleys are aligned. I have made sure the knob on the end of the spindle is tightly attached with its set screws.

The noise can be made slightly quieter with extra (excess) belt tension, the noise can be made slightly quieter with tailstock pressure (excessive though). The noise is present with the belt removed and turning the spindle by hand, very quiet though. Feels almost as if there's a point in the rotation where a sort of click happens, can't feel anything noticeable though. The spindle shaft doesn't feel like it has any play in any direction. No grumbling/rumbling like I'd expect of a bad bearing, just this click once every rotation.

I have tried removing the spindle lock, noise is still there. Noise seems to be coming from within the headstock assembly which unfortunately leads me to think I might have a bearing going bad already. 

I have contacted Record Power with the same video and asked their opinion. Anyone experienced the Record Power guarantee? Specifically how are repairs handled? The prospect of having to send this heavy lathe somewhere isn't great, was wondering if repair/replacement can be handled by authorised dealer as I have one relatively near me.

Any help would be much appreciated,

Thanks


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## pickledegg (2 Oct 2017)

Ah apologies just found the rule mandating 3 posts before I can post links!


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## CHJ (2 Oct 2017)

To try and pinpoint the source of the noise (horrendous isn't it) can yo place a large screwdriver blade to the headstock at various points with the end of the handle pressed against your ear, (poor mans stethoscope) and it should narrow down which end it is loudest for starters.


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## Making Shavings (2 Oct 2017)

I had something similar. Turned out one of the grub screws on my chuck wasn't quite tight. Check that, maybe....


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## pickledegg (2 Oct 2017)

CHJ":2po7tcrv said:


> To try and pinpoint the source of the noise (horrendous isn't it) can yo place a large screwdriver blade to the headstock at various points with the end of the handle pressed against your ear, (poor mans stethoscope) and it should narrow down which end it is loudest for starters.



Just been out and checked, noise can be heard across the headstock but definitely louder through the screwdriver towards the thread end.


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## pickledegg (2 Oct 2017)

Making Shavings":3r6uhizx said:


> I had something similar. Turned out one of the grub screws on my chuck wasn't quite tight. Check that, maybe....



Unfortunately this is the noise with nothing fitted to spindle threads. Was hoping it would just be a setscrew loose or something but I've made sure everything on the spindle (pulley and knob) is tight and located properly.


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## finneyb (2 Oct 2017)

Does it have a rev counter? 
If so does the sensor need adjusting inside the headstock?

Brian


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## kirso (2 Oct 2017)

if the speed is changed via the pulleys does the noise speed up/down. Try same to make sure its not at motor side. (fan cowl damage sounds like that when fan blades catch)
You could also try removing belt and manually turn output shaft to feel for any binding or roughness.
Sorry, just read all of post. forget above.
Is it 1 per rev always. If so it sounds like what has already been mentioned, A pick up sensor or something.


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## pickledegg (2 Oct 2017)

kirso":3i8x6bx2 said:


> if the speed is changed via the pulleys does the noise speed up/down. Try same to make sure its not at motor side. (fan cowl damage sounds like that when fan blades catch)
> You could also try removing belt and manually turn output shaft to feel for any binding or roughness.
> Sorry, just read all of post. forget above.
> Is it 1 per rev always. If so it sounds like what has already been mentioned, A pick up sensor or something.



No such sensors on this model I'm afraid


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## pickledegg (2 Oct 2017)

finneyb":1bp0r3xc said:


> Does it have a rev counter?
> If so does the sensor need adjusting inside the headstock?
> 
> Brian



Hi Brian,

No rev counter, it's just a basic model really. I've attached an exploded diagram of it.


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## kirso (3 Oct 2017)

Looking at the drawing I would say 2 areas look like the possible causes.
First is the what looks like possibly a locking pin for the shaft ? Parts 17, 18 19. If it is a locking pin then is it fouling the recess where it should fit on every rev ?
Second is parts 7 and 22. Don't know what its for other than looks like a tooth wheel if there was a speed pick up via a sensor. But again it looks like this could be getting fouled by either part 22 or possibly 21. But due to the number of teeth, I suspect you would hear more than one tick per rev. But it could just be one tooth that is proud.
Be interesting to see what the outcome is though when you finally solve it.


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## pickledegg (3 Oct 2017)

kirso":20idxl6f said:


> Looking at the drawing I would say 2 areas look like the possible causes.
> First is the what looks like possibly a locking pin for the shaft ? Parts 17, 18 19. If it is a locking pin then is it fouling the recess where it should fit on every rev ?
> Second is parts 7 and 22. Don't know what its for other than looks like a tooth wheel if there was a speed pick up via a sensor. But again it looks like this could be getting fouled by either part 22 or possibly 21. But due to the number of teeth, I suspect you would hear more than one tick per rev. But it could just be one tooth that is proud.
> Be interesting to see what the outcome is though when you finally solve it.



I've tried taking 17,18 & 19 out - its the spindle lock, no difference to noise. 

7 and 22 are a sort of gear that the spindle lock drops in to to lock the spindle, I don't know the terminology well but I believe this is the indexing gear or something like that. I've not disassembled the lathe since it's still under warranty and I don't want to risk voiding that but having read around this could well be my problem.

The lathe is identical to the Rikon 70-100 and I presume a number of other models under different brands, just a Record Power rebranding job. Someone with the Rikon version in another forum reported that gear 7 had come loose on the spindle shaft, others reporting a clicking noise as being bearing issues though.


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## pickledegg (3 Oct 2017)

Update:

I got the go-ahead from Record Power to take the headstock off and check inside. The indexing gear is secure and not fouling anything, can hear better though and the noise is a creak followed by a click. Seems like one of the bearings to me but can't determine which one exactly.

Hopefully they'll just send me a couple of bearings and I can change them myself - we'll see. Apparently their techy people are going to decide what to do.


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## Deejay (4 Oct 2017)

Morning all

Looks like a shaft and /or bearing problem to me.

Had any dramatic catches recently?

* Anyone experienced the Record Power guarantee? Specifically how are repairs handled? *

I had a problem with the speed controller on my CL4. RP arranged for a courier to pick it up the day after I spoke to them. The following day they repaired it and the day after that, the courier returned it to me.

Cheers

Dave


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## pickledegg (4 Oct 2017)

Deejay":2at4yphg said:


> Morning all
> 
> Looks like a shaft and /or bearing problem to me.
> 
> ...



Nothing dramatic at all, I mean I had a few catches in my first few attempts at turning but after sticking to what books and internet have told me I can't remember the last time I had a catch. 

Good news is that Record Power are going to post me two new bearings which is great, I've had a look around and this model is the same as a Rikon 70-100 which seems quite popular in the USA so there's at least one video I've found with tips on replacing them - seems simple enough.


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## pickledegg (6 Oct 2017)

Today I decided to get a head start on the bearings arriving and did the disassembly part. Everything came apart easily enough, it's a simple design but now I have the spindle shaft out I have noticed what looks like wear on the outboard (pulley) end of the shaft.

Picture attached and I'll send Record Power the picture to see what they think but having never taken apart a lathe before I'm unsure if this kind of wear is normal. It would seem to me that there has been some movement of the shaft independent of the bearing that would cause that sort of wear though?

Anyone seen anything like this? not sure if its to be expected or not. You can't feel the wear with fingernail or anything, just visually it stands out.


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## Deejay (6 Oct 2017)

Afternoon all

What were the bearings like when you removed the shaft?

The mark on the shaft shown in the picture looks as though the inner race might have been moved round the shaft. If that was the case, I'd expect the bearing to be badly damaged by a seizure.

Cheers

Dave


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## pickledegg (6 Oct 2017)

Deejay":y6xwsxmi said:


> Afternoon all
> 
> What were the bearings like when you removed the shaft?
> 
> ...



Strangely... fine. I've spun them all in my fingers and don't feel any flat spots or anything. Kinda hard to tell with them out if they were the source of the problem though since no load on them. Listening closely as they rotate all I hear is ball bearings on steel insulated with grease. My only frame of reference is car wheel bearings and I don't detect any obvious failure with these, they spin smoothly and without any sort of notchy feel or noise.

Definitely does seem like the shaft had managed to rotate inside the inner race of that bearing though going by the wear although it's not enough to feel any sort of groove or anything.


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## hawkeyefxr (8 Oct 2017)

mmm first off i was going to say the belt was loose as this happened to me on my DML305 when i did not tighten it enough, but then you removed the cover and that ended that.

Now having read ALL the posts lol. Can i ask hoe you got the bearing out? I have had the hand wheel off and pulley and the bearing and indexing cog are on there kin tight!


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## Deejay (9 Oct 2017)

Morning all

All you can do now is reassemble it. Hopefully the problem will disappear when the new bearings are in.

Please let us now how you get on. Good luck with it.

Cheers

Dave


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## pickledegg (9 Oct 2017)

New bearings arrived today - different brands to the ones it came fitted with, made in Japan this time  We'll see if they do the trick, just need to go pick up some external circlip pliers as can't seem to find mine anywhere.

I'll report back


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## pickledegg (9 Oct 2017)

hawkeyefxr":yn4utobc said:


> mmm first off i was going to say the belt was loose as this happened to me on my DML305 when i did not tighten it enough, but then you removed the cover and that ended that.
> 
> Now having read ALL the posts lol. Can i ask hoe you got the bearing out? I have had the hand wheel off and pulley and the bearing and indexing cog are on there kin tight!



If it's still under warranty and Record Power are okay with you doing this (just inc case of warranty issues later) then this is how I did it, might not be their specific procedure but it seemed to work out for me:

1. Remove hand wheel and pulley
2. Remove power switch, unplug the cables and remove them all from the headstock. Take a photo of wiring to avoid any problems later.
3. Unbolt headstock from bed with the 4 socket cap allen screws at its base.
4. Take headstock off, reach inside and loosen the 4mm allen key holding the indexing gear to the shaft - I needed the wiring out of the way to do this .
5. Remove the 25mm external circlip from the exposed pulley end of the shaft.
6. Tap out the shaft on the pulley end with a soft mallet, will be a bit tight but it slides out.
7. With the shaft out put the headstock on it's side and use a dowel or similar to reach through the pulley end bearing to the other bearings - tap them out. There are two to come out stacked in front of each other, will need a bit of tapping since they're a tight fit in the headstock casting. Only tap them by the inner race, try not to damage the rubber dust seals if you want to reuse the bearings.
8. With the two front bearings out the pulley end one is easy, flip headstock over and tap it out the same way as the others. 

To reassemble it's pretty self explanatory but

1. Tap the bearings into place first using a soft mallet/lump of wood to get them to go in square and then push the shaft through them, remembering to slip on the indexing gear (and make sure it's facing the right way... don't be like me and do it wrong twice).
2. Re-fit the external circlip, swear a bit and make sure you can find your external circlip pliers. Optional: trash the circlip using the wrong tool, find a shop open this evening that sells circlips and external circlip pliers...
3. Refit power switch and wiring, bolt headstock back to the bed.
4. Refit pulley, refit hand knob.


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## pickledegg (9 Oct 2017)

Update:

Back together and it's working great - noise has gone.

Either it was one of the bearings or I fixed something by taking it apart and putting it back together again, whatever it was has gone. Back to work!

Have to say Record Power were great, getting new bearings out to me quickly and saving me from sending it away for repair - I appreciate a company that trusts people to fix something.

Thanks for all the replies.


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## Deejay (10 Oct 2017)

Deep joy.

Cheers

Dave


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## JimB (15 Oct 2017)

Well done Pickledegg 
That sort of noise can be a real problem to pinpoint. I've even had a paper template making a noise on the lathe bed, never mind two tools clicking together.
All's well (until next time )


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