# Will this work or am I barking (up the wrong tree)



## Zeddedhed (11 Mar 2016)

Having recently made my first crosscut sled for the TS (no, I don't know why I didn't do it sooner) I've become something of a convert.

Sled MK I was knocked up in 20mins to do a particular job and worked very well. Then it was adapted for tilted blade mitres. Also worked great.
Then the 'prentice raised the blade a bit too high whilst mitring some stock and it became two sleds..oops!!

So it's time for Sled MK II.

I like the idea of a sled that extends well beyond the blade (aka all the 'murican vids on Youtube). Most of them seem to extend the mitre slots out onto their outfield table.

This is where I started thinking...

My outfeed table is also my assembly bench/painting table/chainsaw servicing bench etc etc. It quite quickly gets carved up and seriously mucky but as the top is just a sheet of 25mm MDF I just flip it over and when both sides are knackered it goes to the flames. Therefore the idea of precisely lining up mitre slots and routing them into what is at best a temporary/consumable surface is not an appealing one.

The lightbulb moment came to me whilst pottering around having a tidy up after finishing a run of seven staircases for a builder.

If I made the usual tightly fitted runners for the mitre slots so that they sat proud of the saw table by 10mm and then made the corresponding grooves on the underside of the sled I could continue pushing through with the sled but the runners would stay on the saw table. The sled would slide out over the outfield table and voila!! Problem solved.

Or am I missing something?


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## Random Orbital Bob (11 Mar 2016)

I'm struggling to see in my minds eye how housing the runners in a groove in the base of the sled would make any difference?

Surely all you need is to extend the runners out in front of the sled by say 6-12 inches?


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## Wizard9999 (11 Mar 2016)

Random Orbital Bob":1tpestom said:


> I'm struggling to see in my minds eye how housing the runners in a groove in the base of the sled would make any difference?
> 
> Surely all you need is to extend the runners out in front of the sled by say 6-12 inches?



Wrong end of stick I think Bob. If I understand the proposal it is to fit standalone runners into the mitre slots of the table and then slide a sled with slots on those runners.

If my understanding is correct the material would need to be very stable as the tolerances would be very tight. Whereas on a normal sled the runners are fixed to the underside of the sled here they would be a push fit into the mitre slots on the table, this would have to be tight enough that they did not move. The sled slots would have to allow it to slide, but not be lose enough to allow any slop.

Terry.


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## Random Orbital Bob (11 Mar 2016)

Oh I see...sort of the negative (film negative) of normal mitre slots. That's an interesting idea. It might work if a) you could add some kind of cam/wedge that could be moved to jam them tight in the mitre slots and that the sled housings were very slick.

That the sort of thing I would want to prototype to play about with materials/design


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## Monkey Mark (11 Mar 2016)

I think it would be cumbersome having to get the runners back in place again. 

How about having the outfeed table a little lower so the sled, including runners, can slide over.


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## Zeddedhed (11 Mar 2016)

Monkey Mark":2dto4l2r said:


> How about having the outfeed table a little lower so the sled, including runners, can slide over.



I did think about this but it would involve a lot of Cucumbering about for all sorts of reasons that I won't bore you with.

I was thinking that the runners would be free to slide in both slots - the ones on the saw table and the ones on the sled. Once the sled has been pushed a certain distance the runners would hit the outfield table but the sled would continue moving - at least that's the plan.

MK I sled was made from Melamine faced MDF (18mm) as would MK II be. A piece of timber let into the underside of the MDF in the slot position, with the slot then machined into the timber (rather than the fluffy grabby non slidey MDF) would allow for smooth running.

I guess the answer is to try it and see - it should only take half and hour or so to create a 'proof of concept' prototype which if all goes well can go on to be the real deal.

I guess that's what I'll be doing tomorrow (I've got one more staircase to make first though - getting fed up with them now!!)


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## Random Orbital Bob (12 Mar 2016)

Monkey Mark":2zl0k9gu said:


> I think it would be cumbersome having to get the runners back in place again.
> 
> How about having the outfeed table a little lower so the sled, including runners, can slide over.



Or the corollary - jack the TS up enough to clear the outfeed if it's in a static position or make a heavy weight dolly that facilitates both movement and the height raising in one. I made my sister turned oak bed feet to raise her bed once. Different reason of course but they worked just fine.


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## MusicMan (12 Mar 2016)

I just have the outfield table ending on the right of the lefthand slot. That gives enough to support the sled or outfit timber. I normally rip with the fence and final piece on the right of the blade; with a sled the final piece will stay on the sled, which just needs enough support not to fall off.


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## Beau (12 Mar 2016)

Zeddedhed":186yevoz said:


> My outfeed table is also my assembly bench/painting table/chainsaw servicing bench etc etc. It quite quickly gets carved up and seriously mucky but as the top is just a sheet of 25mm MDF I just flip it over and when both sides are knackered it goes to the flames. Therefore the idea of precisely lining up mitre slots and routing them into what is at best a temporary/consumable surface is not an appealing one.



Could you not build a tougher out feed table or an interchangeable table with a location system?


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## Owl (12 Mar 2016)

Could you not set the runners back from the leading edge of the sled enough so that they don't come into contact with the outfeed table until the workpiece is clear of the saw blade ?


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## Zeddedhed (12 Mar 2016)

Beau":1x4uzsas said:


> Zeddedhed":1x4uzsas said:
> 
> 
> > My outfeed table is also my assembly bench/painting table/chainsaw servicing bench etc etc. It quite quickly gets carved up and seriously mucky but as the top is just a sheet of 25mm MDF I just flip it over and when both sides are knackered it goes to the flames. Therefore the idea of precisely lining up mitre slots and routing them into what is at best a temporary/consumable surface is not an appealing one.
> ...



Altering the outfeed table is a no-no for various reasons. The solution has to be efficient as it's a working shop and time is money.


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## paulm (12 Mar 2016)

Have a separate narrower board as part of the outfeed table, routed with a groove to suit, and the rest of the outfeed table surface just butted up either side of the routed piece. 

Flip and/or replace the major pieces either side as needed without messing with the routed section ?

Cheers, Paul


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## Zeddedhed (13 Mar 2016)

paulm":110pa0ot said:


> Have a separate narrower board as part of the outfeed table, routed with a groove to suit, and the rest of the outfeed table surface just butted up either side of the routed piece.
> 
> Flip and/or replace the major pieces either side as needed without messing with the routed section ?
> 
> Cheers, Paul



Like your thinking there Paul.

I'm in the workshop tomorrow to finish off a staircase and will hopefully have some time to have a go at making Sled MK II. I may well have a go at a variation of your suggestion. Will post results (if there are any!!)


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## Random Orbital Bob (13 Mar 2016)

Mind you, on the subject of efficiency....given your outfeed is sacrificial, how difficult is it to just clamp a straight edge, allowing for the offset and re-route the groove for the runners every time you replace the bench top?

How often do you replace it incidentally?


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## Graham Orm (13 Mar 2016)

Zeddedhed":2ud37wm6 said:


> paulm":2ud37wm6 said:
> 
> 
> > Have a separate narrower board as part of the outfeed table, routed with a groove to suit, and the rest of the outfeed table surface just butted up either side of the routed piece.
> ...



Fit 2 of these to the outfeed table and fit your replaceable MDF either side of them so the tracks remain when you change your now 3 piece work top.


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