# Poor Man's Moxon Vice



## Glynne (10 Feb 2014)

Not a patch on Jimi43's Moxon but I thought I would go for a functional, if somewhat plain version.









Hardware is 20mm threaded bar (from Ebay) and the wood is oak I had in - moveable jaw 1.25" thick and the fixed one ~ 2.25" to give some weight.
Dimensions are 24" long (16" between threads) with jaws just under 5" high so as the whole vice will raise the work piece 6" above the bench.
Very basic handles (ash) with the nut glued in place.




Despite only being held to the bench by clamps, it is remarkably solid and the vice really grips - I just now need to practice cutting dovetails!

Glynne


----------



## MickCheese (10 Feb 2014)

Looks good but I bet you need to twirl those handles with the fine thread!

Mick


----------



## carlb40 (10 Feb 2014)

Excellent, i was thinking of using similar threaded rod for mine. Let us know hoe you get on with it.


----------



## Cheshirechappie (10 Feb 2014)

It may not be quite as pretty as the 'proper' one, but it looks eminently functional, and proves that a decent, functional job can be made with readily available materials.

I suspect the fine thread is not really a problem. Maybe a bit of twiddling to first adjust to size, but once adjusted not much more than a half-turn would be enough to release one component and nip the next as a batch of (say) drawer sides goes through. It will also give a firmer grip for less torque on the handle than a coarser-pitched thread will.


----------



## rafezetter (10 Feb 2014)

I'd never seen or heard of these before, but looks like the perfect solution rather than struggling to fit a "normal" quick release vice to my very customised bench top.

Fit it when I need it, take it off when I don't, no muss no fuss, and mostly made of stuff I've got laying about!

But bike gear cogs and an old stainless chain are in order I think.


----------



## bugbear (10 Feb 2014)

Looks a lot like Rob Wearing's DT'ing vice.

BugBear


----------



## Glynne (10 Feb 2014)

Just looked up Rob Wearing and yes it does.
The main inspiration came from Jimi's post and the design (if you can call it that) came after looking at http://www.benchcrafted.com (who do sell a vice pack, including hardware) and a few YouTube videos.
The only real decision was whether to have the threaded bar fixed and have the handles move along the thread or fix the handles to the thread and have the whole thing move through the back jaw. In the end I decided on the former as being easier to disassemble if needed. I added the base to give a larger surface to clamp to the bench but it also means that you could put additional boards underneath to raise the whole thing if necessary.
The handles spin pretty easily so no problems with the finer thread and yes they do lock up really tightly and very easily.
As yet I haven't elongated the holes on the front jaw (horizontally) to allow the jaws to rack as I'm not planning to work on anything other than flat stock for the moment but I can always do that if needed.


----------



## Glynne (11 Feb 2014)

I thought I would give the vice a proper test today so I started to make a dovetail box using some pear I've had in for a while.
A couple of very ordinary pictures just show that the work piece is held very firmly and at a good height and was fine for both tails and the start of the pins.












Not that I needed to move the front jaw very far but without elongating the thread holes (horizontally), it does catch a bit and you have to use both hands to make sure it remains parallel. I might just elongate slightly in due course?
Other than that, very pleased with the outcome.
That was the good news!

The bad news (always comes in 3's): -
1. Had to put my wellies to get to the workshop. Despite both liners and socks and the fact the workshop isn't that cold, my feet were freezing - due to the fact that my now wellies leak!
2. Yes we've all done it but . here has just done it for the second time in a row, marked out the waste area between tails and then cut the tail.




3. Rather than use the badsaw to shift most of the waste, thought I'd use the Xmas present my son bought me - without realising how hard the pear was: -




Now consoling myself with a beer and new wellies at the top of the shopping list as well as new blades for the fretsaw.
If anyone wants to know full dimensions and where I got the threaded bar from, just give me a shout.

Glynne


----------



## Vann (11 Feb 2014)

It's good to see that a "low-end" one works well too. I look at the really nice vices some people make, and it just gets put on my Tuit list (I almost feel intimidated by some of the beautiful workpieces some people make :duno: ).


Glynne":24w77pda said:


> ...and you have to use both hands to make sure it remains parallel. I might just elongate slightly in due course?


In a slightly similar situation, I've marked the clamping screw heads on my Mk11 honing guide, so I can be sure that both screws are tightened by the same amount. It helps.

Cheers, Vann.


----------



## rafezetter (11 Feb 2014)

Glynne":3czn4jv0 said:


> As yet I haven't elongated the holes on the front jaw (horizontally) to allow the jaws to rack as I'm not planning to work on anything other than flat stock for the moment but I can always do that if needed.



Do you mean so that the jaws can take non parallel stock or rack as in side to side (which seems a bit daft but, maybe there's a perfectly good reason.)

are there any other possible things you might change if you did it again? I think I'm definitely going to make one of these and would appreciate any tips.


----------



## jimmyhenson (12 Feb 2014)

That's a job well done, I've just finished off my moxon, I got the benchcrafted kit for Christmas. The suede on the moveable jaw gives it an unbelievable grip.


----------



## Glynne (12 Feb 2014)

At the moment the jaws don't rack at all, but because of that sliding the moveable one is a bit fiddly as you have to keep it completely parallel to the fixed one in order to move it. By elongating the holes (slightly), I should be able to move it more easily. That is the only reason I would do it unless I decide to work on non-parallel stock.
In terms of improvements, I would make the handles more "gripable". By that I mean having a deeper bead or "knurls" so as you can get a stronger grip. Despite having no suede, the small thread gives the vice an incredible grip and at times I had to used two hands to undo the handles.
Other than that, I think I would do the same again. Still thinking about suede or perhaps a "V" groove for circular stock but to be honest, it does the job really well. Have a look at http://www.benchcrafted.com as the instructions for the Moxon Vice are very good and perhaps a few of the YouTube videos to see some of the small variations. If you use different benches, you might want to think about having the vice adjustable for height (as Jimi's).
As I said, I used 20mm threaded bar from EBay - I got 3 lengths of 300mm and 12 nuts & washers for about £12 delivered. Holes through the vices are obviously 20 mm and I recessed nuts in the handles and back vice by using a 22mm forstner bit, then chiselling the flats and dragging the nuts in using the bar and nut in the other side.
Glynne


----------



## Grahamshed (12 Feb 2014)

Very han dy to have a good reliable vice that you can use anywhere. My to do list is getting sooooo longgggg


----------



## AndyT (12 Feb 2014)

Glynne

Thanks for that. I'm sure it's useful to see examples that don't need any special tools at all. Even Scott Grandstaff's at http://wkfinetools.com/contrib/pScott/Moxon/moxon-1.asp needs a bit of welding. 

Looking at what he says about crank handles being usefully faster to spin makes me wonder if you might be better off with a handle on each of your round knobs? It could be just a dowel or else a bolt with some loose pipe on it. You would need to reverse your design decision and have the spare rod to the back.


----------



## bugbear (12 Feb 2014)

AndyT":vteyk5c3 said:


> Looking at what he says about crank handles being usefully faster to spin makes me wonder if you might be better off with a handle on each of your round knobs? It could be just a dowel or else a bolt with some loose pipe on it. You would need to reverse your design decision and have the spare rod to the back.



If I were going fancier, I'd go with q/r cams.

e.g.

http://www.leevalley.com/US/hardware/pa ... 1995,61993

BugBear


----------



## AndyT (12 Feb 2014)

Picking up on your suggestion BB, but going down market, I have a pair of quick release hold down clamps for a Workmate, made of very strong glass reinforced nylon, which I bought years ago for a few quid. They are available from Lea Valley here http://www.leevalley.com/US/wood/Page.aspx?p=31150&cat=1,43838,43845 but also from ebay and probably in the DIY sheds too.






They are probably a bit too short to use as they come but they are a metric thread of 18mm, 2.5mm pitch so could be used on some studding, but 18mm is not a common size and could be hard to find. 

One end has a quick release threaded knob which could work well as a front knob on a vice like Glynne's. The other end has a small cam, which would probably not be needed.


----------



## Glynne (12 Feb 2014)

Andy,
I did think about crank handles but the handles spin really quickly when not under load so I didn't think it was worth the effort. I'd also be a little cautious in using crank handles in wooden wheels when under-doing the tightened vice as I did in all seriousness have to use two hands on occasion and I'm not sure that my turned handles need to be challenged too much!
I'm also not sure about the need to reverse design because the Benchcrafted design uses metal cranked wheels and has the spare rod at the front. Incidentally, I do like the Benchcrafted system, it was just a bit expensive for the amount of use I'm likely to give it but it does look really nice.
Like everything, I think it is down to personal preference and, as you can see, I need to practice my dovetailing rather than making more and more elaborate jigs and tools - which I am very guilty of.
Glynne


----------



## Bedrock (12 Feb 2014)

Glynne
I made something very much like yours last year, and am pleased with the result. I turned handle wheels in some sort of alloy which has been kicking about in the workshop for more years than I care to remember, with a short offset spindle for leverage. The screw thread was bought at B&Q or similar, with the nut fixed to the back of the rear jaw. If I felt strongly enough, I might replace the handles with the Axminster product, as the ones I made are a bit fiddly. The biggest drawback is that when not in use, it is an awkward shape and a real pain to store in an already crowded workshop. Too many odd shaped pieces of metal sticking out at ankle height. I now need a w/shop extension, for storage but the lime tree under which it sits, is TPO'd.
Regards Mike


----------



## rafezetter (18 Feb 2014)

Would Meranti (I think) be any good for one of these or would it be too soft? 

I say I think as I'm still struggling with identifying meranti and mahogany but it's from some window frames and doors that were replaced by the UPVC ones we sell (SCORE!!  the wood not the sale) bit's turn up in our skip service all the time if anyone is interested in bagging some, just PM me.

If it's too soft what about if I managed to face it with some oak strips?


----------



## rafezetter (21 Feb 2014)

*bump* anyone able to answer my question?


----------



## carlb40 (22 Feb 2014)

I think meranti is more a pale pinky colour and is softer than pine? So might be too soft for a moxon vice?


----------



## Juz (7 Mar 2014)

I'm interested in making one of these myself - wondering how you chose the fix the handle/nut assembly to the rod?


----------



## Glynne (7 Mar 2014)

Hi Juz.
The handle (inc the nut) on mine isn't fixed to the rod, it rotates on the rod which is fixed to the back jaw with an imbedded nut and then further secured with an extra lock nut. 
The design is as per the Benchcrafted kit but it would also work if you wanted to fix your handles to the threaded bar, it would just mean that you were turning both handles and bar ever time you adjusted it. 
Hope that makes sense?
Glynne


----------



## AndyT (7 Mar 2014)

Hi Rafezetter. I'm no expert on naming hardwoods either but I have used various bits of salvaged timber so I think I recognise what you have.

I reckon it would be fine. When clamping onto a piece of wood, you will always be clamping one flat surface against another. The areas will be fairly large, so the pressure won't be concentrated enough to crush the fibres. (And even if it was, it could be better to mar the vice than the work.)

So use what you have. If it does get battered quickly, which I doubt, it would be easy to add a new lining of oak, or anything else.


----------



## Juz (7 Mar 2014)

Glynne":3c5cqk73 said:


> Hi Juz.
> The handle (inc the nut) on mine isn't fixed to the rod, it rotates on the rod which is fixed to the back jaw with an imbedded nut and then further secured with an extra lock nut.
> The design is as per the Benchcrafted kit but it would also work if you wanted to fix your handles to the threaded bar, it would just mean that you were turning both handles and bar ever time you adjusted it.
> Hope that makes sense?
> Glynne



Ah ok - I hadn't spotted there were 2 nuts on each rod at the back. That makes sense, thanks.


----------



## Bedrock (7 Mar 2014)

The nice thing about these is that you can make them any size. It may be some 10 years ago, but F&C had a series of articles by Robert Ingham, one of which had what I might call a "mini-Moxon", specifically for cleaning out the bottom line of d/tails absolutely square with the face. If all you want to do is cut dovetails, up to say about a maximum of 1-1/2" jaw gap, these can be made up from scrap MDF or ply. I made a couple very quickly for different projects, both using steel thread from one or other of the usual sheds. I used wing nuts for one, very successfully, and the fine thread for a drawer side of say 12mm. really isn't a problem. Robert Ingham brings precision engineering to cabinet making, and I think it is always worth seeing the jigs he makes for his work, even if you are not into his designs.
One of the things he uses on his dovetails vises, is a slave back board, again MDF or ply, behind the workpiece, taller than the bottom line of the d/tail. Slipping this behind the workpiece, after you have completed all the saw cuts, allows you to chisel to the base line, without risk of breakout.

Before you make one of these, I think it is worth giving some thought to the size of the jobs you are likely to want to do. If you are only likely to use it for say drawer sides, then a smaller size viz. Mr. Ingham, is worth considering, particularly if you have a small workshop. When not in use the "full" Moxon is somewhat cumbersome to store, and if you use steel bar, rather than the original wooden threads, can be a real pain.
I can't see a problem with a softer hardwood, because if the top of the front jaw wears, it can always be cleaned up square to the vertical jaw face, and reinforced with a Perspex or aluminium strip glued or screwed to the top face, to give a flat harder wearing surface to use as a register.


----------

