# 'Bare-faced' tenons - good or bad on work bench?



## Bodgers (28 Jun 2018)

I was going to ask this on my main workbench thread build in the Projects section, but it might make more sense here.

So in Hayward's workbench plan, he shows the rails on the 'A frame' sections as having a tenons with only one full shoulder , the other side being flush. I read in various places that this is potentially weaker. It looks to be done here so that the thinner rail stock meets flush to the thicker leg stock on the outsides. 







I was basically going to copy this, but will I regret it?


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## custard (28 Jun 2018)

I'm sure it'll be strong enough, bare faced tenons rarely look quite as neat as shouldered tenons (the edges of mortices often get slightly dubbed over, and with bare faced tenons this then looks like a gap). For a bench I wouldn't worry about it, but if you're aiming for a super clean appearance then adjust the design and add some shoulders.


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## Bodgers (28 Jun 2018)

custard":1aspb0x4 said:


> I'm sure it'll be strong enough, bare faced tenons rarely look quite as neat as shouldered tenons (the edges of mortices often get slightly dubbed over, and with bare faced tenons this then looks like a gap). For a bench I wouldn't worry about it, but if you're aiming for a super clean appearance then adjust the design and add some shoulders.



Thanks Custard. On the aesthetic side I was actually planning on painting the legs and frame, so I am sure that will hide my amateurish skills anyways


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## Phil Pascoe (28 Jun 2018)

If the bare face is on the inside it doesn't show anyway.


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## johnnyb (29 Jun 2018)

I think bare faced tenon's are a timesaver in this type of work. We used them in pine kitchen tables. On doors they really come into there own.framed ledge and brace middle and bottom rails.


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## johnnyb (29 Jun 2018)

Even in this application it moves the mortice further in the leg though.you have to imagine the timesaving aspect as a more important thing if you were marking and cutting by hand. I doubt any old school men would have spent excessive time on a bench.
We used it because we didn't want to wait for the tenoner.


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## Steve Maskery (29 Jun 2018)

"Proper" tenons will always look better, especially if you are at the early stages of the learning curve. As custard says, the shoulder covers the edges of the mortice and hides any embarrassments.

But that second shoulder does not have to be very wide, 2 or 3mm will be enough, so it doesn't have to push the mortices uncomfortably close to the side of the leg. It just means that the tenon will be off-centre, but there is nothing wrong with that.

I'd probably just make the rails the same thickness as the legs and keep it all simple.


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## ColeyS1 (29 Jun 2018)

It's easy to overclamp a bare-faced tenon. 

I'm making a flight of stairs at the moment and for a split second thought of having one.




Because the wood was so twisted it ended up being much thinner than usual, still worth the extra time having an extra shoulder.

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