# Why is Healthy Food So expensive in UK?



## owsnap (31 Aug 2016)

Stuff is just unbearable, all of your shelfs are mostly full of processed junk food in huge packagings,let's not even start with the huuuuge variety of ready-made meals which taste like cardboard, I'm used to eating just simple vegetable based food with lots of fishes/ nuts etc- the stuff you call super healthy ( mediterranean diet as you would say).

However over there in UK it's marketed as something really luxury and posh and a must-have thing yet It's not affordable although it should be as it's the cheapest most basic form of food.
I have started to hate all of your supermarkets except Lidl/aldi because all you can buy there is just bunch of rubbish, If you want to buy some simple vegetables/fruits and make food yourself they are insanely expensive. I have seen cookies get sold there for like £0.5 per kg, wtf..It's cheaper to buy cookies than some basic vegetables.

brb £2 for a kg of potatoes which doesn't tastes like just water, what's going on?


----------



## Phil Pascoe (31 Aug 2016)

I manage perfectly well, you can feel free to buy your groceries in Finland.


----------



## Random Orbital Bob (31 Aug 2016)

It's a secret conspiracy to try and deter annoying moaners from shopping here!


----------



## Fitzroy (31 Aug 2016)

Then don't buy the processed junk, and not sure what potatoes you're buying but on Tesco there are currently five different ones on sale for <£1/kg, you can have, plane whites, Maris Piper, Charlotte, King Edwards, or jackets. Your choice should be influenced by whether you want, roast, mashed, chipped, boiled, baked or fried. Personally i'd go with the Charlottes, boiled then tossed in butter and chopped chives.

Honestly I think fruit and veg are very reasonably priced, yes your soft fruit can get expensive, but overall in my experience prices are lower in the UK than in other European countries I've shopped in. Obviously fruits (peaches, oranges etc) will be cheaper in sunny Spain but root vegetables are more expensive etc etc.

F.


----------



## AJB Temple (31 Aug 2016)

All of the better supermarkets have fresh fruit and vegetables readily available and cheap in season. Meat and fish counters likewise - quality wise you get what you pay for with proteins. You can also go to markets in many towns. Seek and ye shall find. Oddly enough we have managed to survive and thrive over here reasonably well....


----------



## iNewbie (31 Aug 2016)

owsnap":2tox1j7m said:


> Stuff is just unbearable, all of your shelfs are mostly full of processed junk food in huge packagings,let's not even start with the huuuuge variety of ready-made meals which taste like cardboard, I'm used to eating just simple vegetable based food with lots of fishes/ nuts etc- the stuff you call super healthy ( mediterranean diet as you would say).
> 
> However over there in UK it's marketed as something really luxury and posh and a must-have thing yet It's not affordable although it should be as it's the cheapest most basic form of food.
> I have started to hate all of your supermarkets except Lidl/aldi because all you can buy there is just bunch of rubbish, If you want to buy some simple vegetables/fruits and make food yourself they are insanely expensive. I have seen cookies get sold there for like £0.5 per kg, wtf..It's cheaper to buy cookies than some basic vegetables.
> ...



That diet you're on is affecting your mind.


----------



## No skills (31 Aug 2016)

What do you think about the quality and price of pine and spruce in the UK?


----------



## doctor Bob (31 Aug 2016)

I like your style, I have spend years gradually upsetting most of the forum members, you have gone for the "upset everyone whilst settling in tactic". Very effective.


----------



## Fitzroy (31 Aug 2016)

doctor Bob":3f51k4ve said:


> I like your style, I have spend years gradually upsetting most of the forum members, you have gone for the "upset everyone whilst settling in tactic". Very effective.



I think there has to be a lost in translation element to the post, else indeed he has pinned his colours to the mast early on!


----------



## DiscoStu (31 Aug 2016)

So you don't like ready meals - then don't buy them. We are fortunate enough to have a huge selection of foods to buy in the UK so you can buy fresh fruit and veg. As for cost, I don't think it's bad but it's no doubt cheaper abroad I'd expect oranges to be cheaper in Spain etc. I also think our meet is the best in the world. 


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


----------



## thetyreman (31 Aug 2016)

owsnap":19yyur3x said:


> Stuff is just unbearable, all of your shelfs are mostly full of processed junk food in huge packagings,let's not even start with the huuuuge variety of ready-made meals which taste like cardboard, I'm used to eating just simple vegetable based food with lots of fishes/ nuts etc- the stuff you call super healthy ( mediterranean diet as you would say).
> 
> However over there in UK it's marketed as something really luxury and posh and a must-have thing yet It's not affordable although it should be as it's the cheapest most basic form of food.
> I have started to hate all of your supermarkets except Lidl/aldi because all you can buy there is just bunch of rubbish, If you want to buy some simple vegetables/fruits and make food yourself they are insanely expensive. I have seen cookies get sold there for like £0.5 per kg, wtf..It's cheaper to buy cookies than some basic vegetables.
> ...



it's time that you went to a market then! seriously, it's where I get almost 100% of my food, it's ridiculously cheap and far better quality. I only get a few things from supermarkets.


----------



## Phil Pascoe (31 Aug 2016)

My niece is over from the Land of the Long White Cloud and she can't believe how cheap our food is.


----------



## dynax (31 Aug 2016)

plenty of good food about if you look for it, local farm shops are good for seasonal veggies, fresh eggs, fresh fruit, for meat and fish you can't beat the markets for freshness,


----------



## NickWelford (31 Aug 2016)

Yes, lidl and aldi have cheap veg, but it isn't high quality and doesn't keep. I'd rather pay a little more and not throw any away. Waitrose for me!


----------



## Harbo (31 Aug 2016)

If you buy things in season then prices are very good - but buying generally available foreign strawberries in winter, is a big no no. Expensive and generally tasteless.

We have a tremendous choice of fresh produce from all parts of the world but I always try to buy seasonal UK grown products as far as possible.
They are cheaper and taste much better.
Of course lots of stuff, like bananas, cannot be grown over here so if you like them there has to be a few exceptions.

Rod


----------



## Phil Pascoe (31 Aug 2016)

NickWelford":36qk1w7t said:


> Yes, lidl and aldi have cheap veg, but it isn't high quality and doesn't keep. I'd rather pay a little more and not throw any away. Waitrose for me!


I've not had any problem with Lidl fruit, I go there from choice. I bought £20s worth this afternoon. Three of us - by Sunday there'll be none left.


----------



## Roughcut (31 Aug 2016)

owsnap":61b1uxzd said:


> Stuff is just unbearable, all of your shelfs are mostly full of processed junk food in huge packagings,let's not even start with the huuuuge variety of ready-made meals which taste like cardboard, I'm used to eating just simple vegetable based food with lots of fishes/ nuts etc- the stuff you call super healthy ( mediterranean diet as you would say).
> 
> However over there in UK it's marketed as something really luxury and posh and a must-have thing yet It's not affordable although it should be as it's the cheapest most basic form of food.
> I have started to hate all of your supermarkets except Lidl/aldi because all you can buy there is just bunch of rubbish, If you want to buy some simple vegetables/fruits and make food yourself they are insanely expensive. I have seen cookies get sold there for like £0.5 per kg, wtf..It's cheaper to buy cookies than some basic vegetables.
> ...



As has already been said there are plenty of establishments (Farm shops, Markets, quality supermarkets and independent stores) that sell good quality wholesome foods that are readily available.
If you know how to inspect foods for freshness and quality you can pick the best quality from them. 
Stop being lazy and go and look for them.


----------



## Selwyn (31 Aug 2016)

You can buy a 25kg bag of spuds for about a fiver. 

They really are the cheapest things about.


----------



## Woodchips2 (31 Aug 2016)

Another vote for Charlotte potatoes (hammer) 

I've also found Lidl's fruit and veg doesn't keep as well as Sainsbury's. Sainsbury's have also brought a lot of their prices down recently and on many items they are as cheap as Lidl's. Lidl's have the edge on tools though :lol: 

Regards Keith


----------



## owsnap (31 Aug 2016)

I realize I can't compare your prices VS some eastern european/asian country prices where the cost to grow stuff is cheaper.
but what I don't get around is why the Processed Junk food which you have full shelves of costs so little compared to the normal stuff, those rich tea cookies which comes in packs of 400-500grams cost like what, 20p? #-o .
800grams loaf of bread which is just nasty nasty thing (not sure why are they making it so terrible) costs like what, 35p?
Everywhere else it's the other way around, the vegetetables/fruits where there is no cost in making them other than growing them cost so little compared to processed cra.p which is more like a treat.
But in UK I have noticed it's the other way around , Your Junk food is your Regular Everyday food, but the Normal food is an occasional treat #-o


----------



## owsnap (31 Aug 2016)

Selwyn":29fuyabs said:


> You can buy a 25kg bag of spuds for about a fiver.
> 
> They really are the cheapest things about.



Mind Sharing where is such a thing possible? I only go to UK for few weeks at a time from time to time and when there are no special-extra-clearance prices the cheapest potatoes are right around £1 per kg(but they are nasty, tastes like water),
the good Maris piper ones which I really like you can rarely ever get for that price.


----------



## woodfarmer (1 Sep 2016)

I actually visit UK from time to time and always come back to France loaded with basic foodstuffs .

Many years ago I had a boat and went fishing and have thrown away fish that are now fetching £10-15 a kilo  truth is they are getting scarce as most of the fish stocks have been industrially fished to death. Nature will fix it because all the big expensive boats that trawl or net 100's of tons at a time often destroying the sea bed will go bust as the big shoals are also the breeding stock. Soon the only people fishing, will be amateurs and some small time inshore fishing. By the time the fish recover all the big industrial killing machines will have rotted away. Hopefully sunk to create reefs to provide habitat. The wrecks will discourage future trawling


----------



## sunnybob (1 Sep 2016)

"I have seen cookies get sold there for like £0.5 per kg, wtf..It's cheaper to buy cookies than some basic vegetables."

Well DUH!
A factory turns out 10 million cookies (I think he means biscuits) a day and they need no special keeping. A farm produces (at best) 2 crops per year, which need refrigerated and speedy transport and have a minimal shelf life. So whats not to understand about pricing?

I live in farmland in the med. I can actually buy a bag of potatoes from the guy whos pulling them out the ground, WHILE he is still pulling them. Yes, all cyprus spuds are still hand collected from the ground.
The UK has to have those potatoes shipped by land and sea container, about 2 or 3 weeks before they reach the shelves. Guess why my chips taste nicer than in the UK? 

By starting this thread, youre either a troll, or someone who has the most basic grasp of the food chain.


----------



## Harbo (1 Sep 2016)

Most supermarkets sell uk grown spuds and the bags are marked accordingly often with the farmers name on them.
There's lots of varieties to chose from, some are better for chipping, boiling, baking, roasting etc.
At the moment Charlottes are my favourite boiled for salads or boiled, lightly crushed, sprinkled with olive oil, a pinch of salt and roasted for a short time to gently brown.
Maris Piper are good for chips, baking and roasting. I haven't seen them lately but again I haven't needed them.
Jersey Royals are very nice but only available for a short early season.
King Edwards are great for roasting especially at Christmas.
Pink Fir potatoes are an Autumn salad variety available in Autumn and taste great. 
Desiree is an old variety and good for mash and other cooking methods it has a red skin and light yellow flesh.
None of the above are tasteless so where are you buying yours from?

Rod


----------



## Benchwayze (1 Sep 2016)

Owsnap.

I empathise but have you tried growing your own veg? Mind you, that works out to be quite expensive in the end, because of all the stuff you need to buy to keep your veg healthy! It serves to remind that the farmers have the same problem. I think organic growing is more labour intensive, so maybe that's why the stuff they grow isn't cheap.

As for the Med diet, when I was young I spent a lot of time in the Mediterranean. That was where I started to put on weight! All that spaghetti ( don't like seafood, unless its crab or lobster.) When I got home things soon returned to normal. Now, later in life I am on the same struggle as most of us. Trying to sustain a healthy weight. 

Regards

John


----------



## Woody2Shoes (1 Sep 2016)

I'm guessing that there is a much smaller proportion of overweight people in Finland compared to the UK!

It is possible to buy good quality, wholesome food inexpensively in the UK - we have much more diversity of supply with better quality than a generation or so ago, post-war - but it requires either time and/or money, plus knowledge (of where to go [often in multiple places, like "old-fashioned shopping" before supermarkets], what to look for and what to do with it when you get it home).

Tinned food is often very good value, and often overlooked, it usually retains its vitamin and mineral contents well. About forty years ago I met an old boy in the Scottish highlands - he told me he preferred tinned peaches to fresh ones, which I initially found hard to understand - until I realised that he probably had not seen many fresh peaches, and by the time they'd got up to the Highlands they would perhaps not be that fresh anyway! Of course, tinned peaches are perfectly wholesome and relatively inexpensive....

We have, despite the popularity of cooking/baking TV programmes, very largely bred a generation (not many home economics classes are now taught in school, for example) that does not know how to cook a meal from scratch and probably doesn't recognise that it can be cheaper and just as easy, quick and often better for you, than processed food (or takeaways, which are nearly always packed with cheap and nasty ingredients and very expensive for what they are).

My teenagers "like" Domino's pizza (they like it for the same reason my then three-year-old daughter knew she wanted a Barbie - before she knew what a Barbie actually was - cunning advertising). Personally I think it's the worst kind of food - delivered, it costs probably ten or twenty times what it costs to make pizza/garlic bread at home from scratch (including the dough).

The food industry in this country has done some positive things, but it also does some pretty cynical things too. I won't start on the topics of food waste and the other environmental impacts of our food supply chains (palm oil anyone?).

Cheers, and good health, W2S


----------



## MIGNAL (1 Sep 2016)

I'm often disappointed with the taste of fruit and vegetables from supermarkets. Actually tinned fruit often tastes much better, presumably because it's canned nearer to the fruits natural ripeness. Usually the local shop has better tasting fruit but then I guess that he buys from the wholesale market. It's no more expensive than the supermarket and often cheaper. I suspect that some of the bland tasting supermarket fruit and veg is down to the particular varieties, partly chosen for their looks and shelf longevity. Buy in season locally produced fruit and the taste does seem to improve dramatically, even in supermarkets. Don't get me started on Picota cherries!


----------



## sunnybob (1 Sep 2016)

Supermarkets dont rate taste very highly on their "need" list.
They want looks, first and foremost. A customer cant taste the fruit or veg ib the shop, but they can and will pick the largest, shiniest and most pleasingly shaped items first.
Thats the same the world over, UK, finland, america.
If you can get past the blemishes on the outer surface, and the non uniform sizes, then nuy from local producers if at all possible, and re discover the taste.


----------



## Random Orbital Bob (1 Sep 2016)

Dam right Sunnybob. On that very note, I will shortly be meandering into my back garden to water my toms, French beans and runners and I might just accidentally wolf the odd sungold direct off the plant. The difference between home grown tomatoes and supermarket bought is kind of like the difference between water and something that actually has some flavour! You pop one of my sungold's in your chops and basically your head explodes with flavour, do the same with any variety from the supermarket and you might get an eye roll if you're lucky.

The flavour of organically home grown is simply off the chart. I guess it's because there's no intensive farming method behind it, causing it to grow at a hundred miles an hour and it's straight from the plant into my face. But whatever the differences, they're big and I would strongly encourage anybody to grow their own on whatever scale they can manage because its really one of life's little joys.


----------



## sunnybob (1 Sep 2016)

When I was very young, my dad had two allotments in south london, and we didnt grow anything unless we could eat it.

When I started a family, I tried to work an allotment, but with both of us working and two small kids there wasnt enough hours in the day, so we bought from supermarkets.
Nowadays almost everybody HAS to buy from supermarkets because they dont have time for anything else.

You cant blame supermarkets for making a profit, so they buy in only what they can sell on. Its the customer who leaves the mis shaped veg and picks the straight banana that is to blame. But thats well over 9/10ths of the population, so get used to it.

Anyone who can grow even some of their own veg should try it.


----------



## Phil Pascoe (1 Sep 2016)

Don't forget that more often than not you're not growing the same varieties at home. Ever wonder why your supermarket tomatoes have thick skins? It's so they don't bruise or split when picked by machine. Ever wondered why they have woody stalks? It's because they are bred to hang onto the vine and not fall off when ripening so they can all be picked at the same time. You will have consumed more earth by accident than they will have ever seen - most of them are grown hydroponically. Uniformity of colour and size are far more important to a supermarket than taste.
Have a look at - http://www.realseeds.co.uk/tomatoes_vines.html


----------



## Benchwayze (1 Sep 2016)

Sunny, 

The taste quality of supermarket fruit is why I don't eat apples any more, unless I can pick from the tree. Asda's fruit is watery, or sour, and tastes of nothing resembling apple! Not even the apples. :mrgreen: 

Surely you grew nasturtium flowers on your allotment! Lovely in a salad. :wink: 

John


----------



## Sheffield Tony (1 Sep 2016)

owsnap":6zi7wzp4 said:


> I realize I can't compare your prices VS some eastern european/asian country prices where the cost to grow stuff is cheaper.
> but what I don't get around is why the Processed Junk food which you have full shelves of costs so little compared to the normal stuff, those rich tea cookies which comes in packs of 400-500grams cost like what, 20p? #-o .
> 800grams loaf of bread which is just nasty nasty thing (not sure why are they making it so terrible) costs like what, 35p?
> Everywhere else it's the other way around, the vegetetables/fruits where there is no cost in making them other than growing them cost so little compared to processed cra.p which is more like a treat.
> But in UK I have noticed it's the other way around , Your Junk food is your Regular Everyday food, but the Normal food is an occasional treat #-o



There is a bit of truth in this. "Food" that is manufactured is made to be cheap. I have heard it from the horse's mouth that the aim of the food industry is to sell you as much air and water as possible. And low grade ingredients enhanced with cheap salt, sugar and worse. The horsemeat scandal - that even supposedly reputable manufacturers couldn't even trace what animal their meat came from, much less what farm or how it was reared - tells a lot.

On the other hand, producing good looking and tasty vegetables, available all year round, in quantities that depend on the weather, is an expensive and difficult job.

This does need to be resolved. Pouring money into the NHS as a way of undoing the harm that a lifetime of eating rubbish inflicts can't be the right approach.


----------



## Phil Pascoe (1 Sep 2016)

I assume the supermarkets in Finland are stacked to ceiling height with fish, wholemeal bread, fruit and organic vegetables, nary a biscuit to be seen ... :? 
If so, they are the only supermarkets in the world that are.


----------



## Benchwayze (1 Sep 2016)

Sheffield Tony":32kvxerf said:


> owsnap":32kvxerf said:
> 
> 
> > Your Junk food is your Regular Everyday food, but the Normal food is an occasional treat #-o
> ...



Not in 'our 'ouse'!
If you'd class a nice Chinese meal as junk food, then very occasionally we indulge. Same with Fish and Chips; now and again. 

In a kitchen, nothing beats the satisfaction of preparing, cooking and eating a nice fillet of lamb-neck, slow-cooked with fresh veg. Well maybe a fillet steak with pepper sauce! 

John


----------



## Sheffield Tony (1 Sep 2016)

Benchwayze":2jxeqeq2 said:


> Sheffield Tony":2jxeqeq2 said:
> 
> 
> > owsnap":2jxeqeq2 said:
> ...



Not ours either, but really I was meaning the earlier part of the post, about junk food being cheaper than fresh ingredients.


----------



## JohnPW (1 Sep 2016)

There's been a lot of good points made so far but to a casual visitor to a typical UK supermarket, it might seem odd that well over half (maybe even two thirds) of the food there is junk food. 

You see entire aisles of crisps, fizzy drinks, sweets, cakes, biscuits, desserts, nasty manufactured foods. Whilst the fresh food sections (fruit and veg, meats etc) takes up small proportion of the supermarket.

Supermarket (except for Lidl and Aldi) fruit and veg is definitely a lot more expensive than from a market, what you're paying for is convenience.

You can eat well for relatively modest sums but it takes time and effort.


----------



## BRYAN (1 Sep 2016)

Is it Finland where they eat putrid rotting fish from barrels?
As for our own junk food,well that's there fot the "modern"housewives who wouldn't know what to do with a spud.

Finland provided me with lovely Sako in 6.5x55. If anything similar were made in this country it would be beyond the powers of my wallet.


----------



## lurker (1 Sep 2016)

Why does this post........... All the food in the uk is carp and expensive ..... remind me of dear old departed site five.


----------



## ColeyS1 (1 Sep 2016)

I want some decent paint from u.k. All rubbish and expensive

Coley


----------



## Benchwayze (2 Sep 2016)

ColeyS1":1hbjomh2 said:


> I want some decent paint from u.k. All rubbish and expensive
> 
> Coley



Do we still actually make paint in the UK? Or is that something else we ship in by the tank-load, and fill the cans here? :roll:


----------



## MarkDennehy (2 Sep 2016)

BRYAN":1ivekh3p said:


> Is it Finland where they eat putrid rotting fish from barrels?


To be fair, that's Sweden, and what do you think worsterererershire sauce is made from?  



> As for our own junk food,well that's there fot the "modern"housewives who wouldn't know what to do with a spud.


What, you don't cook?


----------



## DennisCA (2 Sep 2016)

Isn't there a guy from the UK here that goes to Finland often, can't he tell about the differences between UK and finnish supermarkets? I mean I dunno how they stack up. Perhaps I could snap some from the rural S-market I often goto.


----------



## MarkDennehy (2 Sep 2016)

Y'all should come try Irish supermarkets. The screaming from your wallets would soon soften your cough 
(And Lidl here is the best quality produce in a supermarket for fruit and veg, if you want better here you have to go to an actual fruit and veg shop or grow your own, and they treat their staff a damn sight better than any of our domestic chains or chains like tesco).


----------



## Benchwayze (2 Sep 2016)

MarkDennehy":1ow90h5i said:


> BRYAN":1ow90h5i said:
> 
> 
> > Is it Finland where they eat putrid rotting fish from barrels?
> ...




Quote: and what do you think worsterererershire sauce is made from?  

Yep! =D> 

Although I don't know where worsterererershire is! :lol:


----------



## MarkDennehy (2 Sep 2016)

Worsterererershire sauce - the sauce you can't stop spelling


----------



## BRYAN (2 Sep 2016)

MarkDennehy":lmiriuc3 said:


> Worsterererershire sauce - the sauce you can't stop spelling



Or smelling if it's made from that rotting fish.


----------



## Benchwayze (2 Sep 2016)

MarkDennehy":kgavyc3i said:


> Worsterererershire sauce - the sauce you can't stop spelling



:lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## MarkDennehy (2 Sep 2016)

BRYAN":cv59ts6z said:


> MarkDennehy":cv59ts6z said:
> 
> 
> > Worsterererershire sauce - the sauce you can't stop spelling
> ...


No, it smells fine, and really doesn't so much taste of anything in the final dish so much as it enhances the taste of meat (it's like salt - in normal quantities in a dish, it doesn't taste like salt, it makes other things taste more strongly like what they are). 
Last surviving mainstream example of _garum_ sauce actually (the original Roman fish sauce).


----------



## iNewbie (2 Sep 2016)

I never buy Fresh Fruit/Veg from Aldi. I'm concerned by the time I get through the till it'll be out of date...


----------



## bugbear (2 Sep 2016)

MarkDennehy":3vztdum0 said:


> BRYAN":3vztdum0 said:
> 
> 
> > MarkDennehy":3vztdum0 said:
> ...



Nam Pla, surely (and it's probably what Lea & Perrins is based on).

It's always amusing when some history program (probably Tony Robinson) talks about garum, and makes a face like fermented fish sauce is obviously rotten and foul, forgetting all about the delicious modern equivalents.

BugBear


----------



## MarkDennehy (2 Sep 2016)

Nam Pla isn't really derived from garum though (a case of the same thing being invented in different places I think). 
Still delicious though (and you can add both to your chilli  )


----------



## rafezetter (3 Sep 2016)

phil.p":2a1m7q7q said:


> I assume the supermarkets in Finland are stacked to ceiling height with fish, wholemeal bread, fruit and organic vegetables, nary a biscuit to be seen ... :?
> If so, they are the only supermarkets in the world that are.



Out of curiosity - how many Finnish farmers are paid by their own Govt and EU to NOT GROW FOOD?

and as pointed out - do finnish supermarkets only have "nice looking" vegetables or do they sell them whatever they look like?

Because those are the two biggest reasons why UK produce is more expensive than it could be, and why manufactured food & and treats are so much cheaper, because instead of 80% being wasted - like farmed vegetables are - they might only waste 10%.

I'm not sure why more than a few of you said Owsnap is being a whiner and upset the community while settling in, he has raised a valid issue that Jamie Oliver himself has been trying to champion for YEARS (almost a decade in fact) to get reformed. I think several of you are suffering from a form of misplaced british pride in our supermarkets and owe Owsnap an apology.


----------



## Phil Pascoe (3 Sep 2016)

My cousin worked in the London school that Jamie Oliver first did the menu in - she told me they had to double the number of skips they usually had to get rid of the food waste. They just dumped 100s of nearly untouched plates of food every day. It was good for Oliver's ego, but not much else.
Having said that, if Owsnap had raised a perfectly valid point instead of having an out and out "everyone else is better than you" rant he might have had a lot of support.


----------



## MarkDennehy (3 Sep 2016)

phil.p":20ayihj3 said:


> My cousin worked in the London school that Jamie Oliver first did the menu in - she told me they had to double the number of skips they usually had to get rid of the food waste. They just dumped 100s of nearly untouched plates of food every day.


Well, if the nearby chip shops are selling through the bars of the school, you'd expect that, to be fair. Doesn't mean the food was bad, just that teenagers prefer lots of fat and salt.
Bet you that if they had a choice between milk and beer, you'd see a lot of milk going to waste too...


----------



## Woodchips2 (3 Sep 2016)

iNewbie":wgwetdiv said:


> I never buy Fresh Fruit/Veg from Aldi. I'm concerned by the time I get through the till it'll be out of date...



:lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## Phil Pascoe (3 Sep 2016)

MarkDennehy":1sll41yb said:


> phil.p":1sll41yb said:
> 
> 
> > My cousin worked in the London school that Jamie Oliver first did the menu in - she told me they had to double the number of skips they usually had to get rid of the food waste. They just dumped 100s of nearly untouched plates of food every day.
> ...


Yeah ... but they weren't doing it before J. O. got there. :lol:


----------



## MarkDennehy (3 Sep 2016)

No, but they were serving the chips straight up with the school lunch though.
It's just kids wanting to eat what tastes good rather than what's good for them. I don't remember being a fan of broccoli when I was that age either.


Then I learned you can deep fry broccoli...  







(Incidentally, if you've never tried deep fried broccoli... hooooo mama!)


----------



## Terry - Somerset (3 Sep 2016)

Another take on the cost of healthy food. 

Firstly a basic assumption - healthy foods tend to be purchased as unprocessed (fresh?) single ingredients - beef, chicken, fish, vegetables, fruit etc. Only main exception is likely to be bread.

By comparison most unhealthy food is processed - numerous ingredients including sugar, fats, additives. Typical examples are pies, cook chill and frozen ready meals, takeaways, cakes, biscuits etc. High sugar, salt and fat content to "enhance" flavour.

Many years ago I read that to make a car by purchasing individual components would cost 10 times the price of the showroom model. There is a connection with food here!

In selling individual ingredients, major supermarkets make a significant margin on the price they pay the farmer/importer. This is to cover their overhead costs, staffing, store sites, checkout operators, IT systems, marketing departments, profit etc etc. They also want food which matches very precise specifications in terms of size, weight, appearance etc - particularly things like fruit and vegetables.

But a processed food supplier buys the ingredients by the ton, not the kilo (as the consumers). They are unconcerned by appearance and size which reduces wastage and purchase costs - eg: fruit that falls outside the supermarket criteria are almost valueless. Recipes minimise the use of expensive ingredients and are replaced by "fillers". Typically production processes are highly industrialised. Finally producers are hammered by the supermarkets on selling price. 

It is no real surprise, therefore, that the price of processed food is so low compared to the alternative cost of the individual raw ingredients to prepare at home.


----------



## Phil Pascoe (3 Sep 2016)

Finally producers are hammered by the supermarkets on selling price? I wonder why that is? It wouldn't be anything to do with the people that moan about supermarkets, by any chance? ... their customers ... or would it? ... no, surely not ...  

(I tried to put a smilie in, but for some reason the page gets reduced to the left hand 40%. It happens regularly - anyone else get this?)
(I found the answer - post and quickly edit, then put the smilie in)


----------



## MarkDennehy (3 Sep 2016)

> It is no real surprise, therefore, that the price of processed food is so low compared to the alternative cost of the individual raw ingredients to prepare at home.



Cubic foot of walnut costs ~€75 per cubic foot here. This small walnut side table would go for €500 normally, and even if that was solid chunks of walnut with no joinery (instead of being the more normal design that used a lot less wood), it'd be 2.75 cubic feet so say €210 'cos we're on the back of an envelope, and that's 138% profit over materials to use to pay for your labour and equipment. Now if you were buying, say, a few hundred cubic feet at a time, I'm guessing you're not going to be paying €75, you're going to be getting a better rate, and so you'd make more even profit over materials.

Same thing holds true for food. Or anything else you make from scratch with skill. 

And that's how you get the inside out of the egg so you can paint it, Grandma...


----------



## Phil Pascoe (3 Sep 2016)

Actually if you've ever done it, you blow eggs not suck them ... by the bye ...


----------



## MarkDennehy (3 Sep 2016)

Worst.
Easter.
Ever.


----------



## Phil Pascoe (3 Sep 2016)

1916?


----------



## MarkDennehy (4 Sep 2016)




----------



## RogerS (4 Sep 2016)

Processed food - simple rule of thumb. How many lines of ingredients. More then two lines, stick it back on the shelf. Better still, cook food using fresh ingredients. It's not rocket-science.


----------



## DennisCA (4 Sep 2016)

MarkDennehy":yaf1xidr said:


> It's just kids wanting to eat what tastes good rather than what's good for them. I don't remember being a fan of broccoli when I was that age either.



I have to hide the broccoli from my kids (age 3) or they won't eat the rest of the food. Steamed, then butter and fresh ground black pepper added. Simple and the kids love it.


----------



## MarkDennehy (4 Sep 2016)

Wait till they hit school age


----------



## acewoodturner (4 Sep 2016)

Kids (or adults for that matter as well) who have eaten mainly or only processed foods have to have their palettes educated when it comes to fresh fruit and vegetables etc. Ten years ago my youngest daughter was at nursery school during a couple of year scheme of free fruit and veg for nurseries and P1 and 2. All three of my children have eaten a good amount of fruit and veg from early days and for Molly this was brilliant. She spent all 4 hours helping herself to all sorts of fruit and veg, but not in a pigging out sort of way. To some of this kids this was totally alien but as the year went on gradually got used to it and the waste at the end of the day got less and less. At about 3 months in my wife and I had a meeting with her named nursery teacher/worker. She criticised Molly for eating too much fruit and veg and accused her of being greedy. I nearly fell of my chair and was pretty well lost for words. To this day I am still stunned that a 30 stone, obese so called educator could accuse my daughter of being greedy. At no point was she depriving any other child of fruit or veg, she is a very slim and very active dancer, twirler, guide and tap dancer and still loves her fruit and veg. Her nursery teacher was the biggest hippocrite I have ever had this misfortune to meet. The fact that she was in a such role as an educator despairs me and a good look in a big mirror was long overdue. 
For a project such as Jamie Oliver to go in and make radical changes to kids palettes was perhaps a touch over optimistic but you have to start somewhere. I would give him full marks for trying to make radical changes both here and in the States. Diet is a massively important subject and often brushed under the carpet by the PC brigade. I live next to my daughters former primary school and lots of kids walk past my door. At least 40 to 50% are overweight and something needs done about it sooner rather than later. Most of them are accompanied to school by their overweight parents. It is storing up massive problems for later life such as heart disease and type 2 diabetes. There is a thread on this forum by an incredibly brave and honest member who has detailed his health problems over the last few years. I wouldnt wish that on anyone. 
As a Ps Social workers in Dundee have started to take kids of parents who have ignored and dismissed all offers of help and assistance to morbidly obese parents with morbidly obese kids. They are killing their kids with food, its no different to any other form of neglect and abuse.
Sorry if anyone doesnt like my rant but as a former community educator I have rather strong views on this as obesity is in the main preventable.

Mike


----------



## Phil Pascoe (4 Sep 2016)

Having spent far too much time in hospital, I can't believe the number of grossly obese people work for the NHS. I don't mean plump or cuddly, although they would probably call themselves this, I mean fatter than fat. When the NHS preaches to hoi polloi about the dangers of being overweight, I find this unreal.


----------



## DennisCA (5 Sep 2016)

Kids love fruit, unfortunately they also love candy and chips (crisps). But we give them mainly fruit and berries. We have the freezer stuffed with bilberries right now after my parents went out and picked so much they filled their 2nd freezer and started giving it away.


----------

