# Can I introduce myself?



## scrimper (27 May 2007)

Hello to all in the scrollsawing section, this morning I joined UK workshop forums and have only just got around to finding this noble section.

I think I have conversed with Gill in the Diamond forums, in fact I think it was her who gave me the url to this place some months ago, well I have finally arrived! Lol.

I have been a woodworker since a young lad when you could buy Fish and chips for one shilling, I have always been a fan of Fretwork since both my late Father and Grandfather were fretworkers, I have been interested in the original Hobbies company from Dereham and have a huge collection of their old patterns dating back to the 1920's up until their demise in the late 1960's.

I own a Hegner, Diamond and one of those cheap Wickes fretsaws (which was given to me) I like using the hegner best as it is so smooth and quiet running.

This is a little cupboard I made using the Hegner -:


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## CHJ (28 May 2007)

scrimper you are bringing back memories talking about the hobbies mag and with your cupboard, it is unbelievable how well worn those mags could get and still be passed around. I only had a hand fretsaw way back in the fiftys (we did not have electricity anyway) but I can still remember the aching arm from trying to master the art of keeping it upright and square to avoid jambing the blade and bending or breaking it. Wood came from salvaging broken fruit trays or boxes but many a model boat or plane engine/undercarriage rib was cut out that way.


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## scrimper (28 May 2007)

CHJ":2vf8gekb said:


> scrimper you are bringing back memories talking about the hobbies mag and with your cupboard, it is unbelievable how well worn those mags could get and still be passed around. I only had a hand fretsaw way back in the fiftys (we did not have electricity anyway) but I can still remember the aching arm from trying to master the art of keeping it upright and square to avoid jambing the blade and bending or breaking it. Wood came from salvaging broken fruit trays or boxes but many a model boat or plane engine/undercarriage rib was cut out that way.



My dad worked at the RAF central flying school Little Rissington as a barrack warden and he used to brink old *'tea chests' home for use with his fretwork, He used a Hobbies A1 Machine which I still have whilst I used the hand frames (I still have these too).

My Grandfather used to teach fretwork at Chipping Norton when it was 'all the rage' and later had a small shop selling Hobbies and Handicrafts ranges plus wireless stuff he was really good at fretwork, far better than I could ever be.

I remember as a boy seeing the Lords Prayer plaque that he made from a Handicrafts plan hanging on the wall off his house, it was superb, not too long ago I bought box of old plans via ebay and included was the very plan for this plaque, I was really pleased to have it but think it is too intricate for me to make.

* _For the benefit of 'youngsters' here tea chests were plentiful in the old days they were a decent source of plywood being around 18" square, the plywood was decent 3 ply unlike the rubbishy stuff one can buy today with 'piffy' centres!_


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## Gill (28 May 2007)

Hi Scrimper

It's nice to have you with us  . Although I rarely make projects from the Hobbies patterns myself, I do like them a lot and I'm hoping you'll show us some more examples of your work. The box you posted earlier is lovely. What woods did you use?

I noted from your post in the general woodworking section that you are also a turner. Have you ever combined scrolling... errr... _fretwork_    and turning to good effect?

Gill


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## CHJ (28 May 2007)

scrimper":1xqrc1jx said:


> _For the benefit of 'youngsters' here tea chests were plentiful in the old days they were a decent source of plywood being around 18" square, the plywood was decent 3 ply unlike the rubbishy stuff one can buy today with 'piffy' centres!_



There is still one of the larger, about 36" cube, in our store area packed with stuff that has not seen the light of day since 1976, about time it was turfed out I think, it was never unpacked at the last house let alone this one. :lol: 
Always a problem trying to get the metal reinforcing corners off without damaging the wood :!:


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## scrimper (28 May 2007)

Gill":27kjsg6e said:


> Hi Scrimper
> 
> It's nice to have you with us  . Although I rarely make projects from the Hobbies patterns myself, I do like them a lot and I'm hoping you'll show us some more examples of your work. The box you posted earlier is lovely. What woods did you use?
> 
> ...



Hi Gill, Thanks for the welcome.

I don't know why I like the Hobbies patterns, maybe it's because my Grandfather had them, I do have a lot of respect for the people at Hobbies who turned these plans out week after week without the benefit of computers and drawing stuff we have today, I just seem to have an addiction for Hobbies stuff! :shock: 

All the wood comes from salvaged stuff, the basic box is a sort of Mahogany (don't know what it's real name is but it's offcuts from a place that used to make hardwood doors and frames in Gloucester, they used to chuck the offcuts in a skip for firewood!) The overlay is some oak that came from those storage trays that they used to use in shops for keeping socks and stuff in, they came from Debenhams in Gloucester when they were modernising years ago!

Re the turning, I have 2 lathes but I wouldn't call myself a turner TBH, I am not very good at wood turning in fact I mostly use the lathe for making knobs for my projects!


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## scrimper (28 May 2007)

CHJ":23gnsj9n said:


> scrimper":23gnsj9n said:
> 
> 
> > _For the benefit of 'youngsters' here tea chests were plentiful in the old days they were a decent source of plywood being around 18" square, the plywood was decent 3 ply unlike the rubbishy stuff one can buy today with 'piffy' centres!_
> ...



Lol That's the ones!


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## Gill (28 May 2007)

It sounds as if a certain newcomer to this forum might enjoy a visit to the turning mini-bash near Stroud in mid-July. Apparently there'll be a bit of scrolling going on too  .

Gill


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## scrimper (28 May 2007)

Gill is that a German Shepherd in your Avatar?

As you can see from my Avatar we have beautiful German Shepherd called Max.

I would love to do a Scroll saw portrait of him like the one in your Avatar but don't know how!
:shock:


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## Gill (28 May 2007)

Hi Scrimper

Yes, it's a German Shepherd; although it isn't a portrait of any dog I have owned, it does look remarkably similar to one who passed away this time last year aged 14. If you've spent most of your time cutting Hobbies type patterns, I suppose it's possible that you haven't encountered much of this sort of fretwork before? It's not that difficult. You use a temporary adhesive to fix a pattern to a wooden board, cut out the waste wood, then fasten a piece of dark backing board behind the area you've cut to create a shadow effect.

This pattern came from one of the MSN free pattern groups. Like so many of the free patterns you get there, it needed a little bit more work to be 'cuttable' but the original designer (Rick Desmier) had made a pretty good job. I've got a handful of different German Shepherd patterns that I've downloaded from free pattern groups and it would be no trouble to forward them on to you by email if you wish.

Hmmm... perhaps one of us (it'll probably be me :roll:  ) ought to start a tutorial thread describing how to cut a shadow portrait. It's a long time since I saw anyone explain how it's done; we seem to take this form of fretwork/scrolling for granted.

Incidentally, there's a very good tutorial by Andy Deane here which tells you how to convert a picture or photograph into a shadow portrait pattern. It's geared towards Paint Shop Pro graphics software, but it's easily adaptable to other software including the Gimp (which is free  ) .

Gill


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## scrimper (28 May 2007)

Gill":jkti6kfl said:


> This pattern came from one of the MSN free pattern groups. Like so many of the free patterns you get there, it needed a little bit more work to be 'cuttable' but the original designer (Rick Desmier) had made a pretty good job. I've got a handful of different German Shepherd patterns that I've downloaded from free pattern groups and it would be no trouble to forward them on to you by email if you wish.



I have not heard of these groups, can anyone join? I went to a msn group that I found via google and applied to join but I never got any email allowing me to log in?


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## scrimper (29 May 2007)

Well I tried to join the Absolutely Free Scrollsaw Patterns group on MSN but just received an email denying me membership for some reason! 

I don't know what I have done to upset them, I have not been in any MSN groups before so I don't have a history of trouble making or anything.


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## Gill (29 May 2007)

The "Free Scrollsaw Pattern" forum is here. I'm not a member so I can't vouch for it. There's also the MSN "Absolutely Free Scrollsaw Pattern" group here, which you're already aware of. In the past, both these forums were one on MSN but they split. I never did find out why but I believe it had something to do with plagiarism. There have been other sites offering free patterns too, which have come and gone.

It would be wise to treat groups such as these with caution. The patterns they make available are often untested and have errors. It's very frustrating to be nearing the completion of a project only to find that the designer hasn't spotted a critical pattern defect. That said, a number of pattern designers who have since gone on to be published in reputable magazines cut their teeth on forums such as these, so there are certainly some quality designers present.

My big concern, however, is that some pattern designers have been known to generate patterns from images without having secured proper permission from the copyright owners. If you cut one of these images, you will also be in breach of copyright and the consequences can be devastating, as one very popular pattern designer found out to his cost earlier this year. I wouldn't like to say that plagiarism is endemic on the free forums; I'm confident that those who run the forums try their best to keep everything above board. The problem is that it is very difficult to police pattern production, so I now like to stick only to those patterns which have established provenance. That's one of the reasons why I prefer to produce my own patterns.

If you can persuade someone to convert one of your own photographs into a pattern, though, copyright won't be an issue and the free forums could quite possibly be useful to you.

Gill


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## Lin (29 May 2007)

The only reason normally that you would not be allowed to join one of the MSN scrollsaw group is that if when filling out the application for membership you failed to fill in why you wanted to join. Blank applications are denied. If this was the case...try again and fill in Why you want to join the group.
Lin


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