# Wadkin Planer/Jointer restoration project



## Karl

Hi all

Dan Tovey kindly (?) put me in contact with a chap who wanted to get rid of this little "beauty"












:shock: 

Well, where to start ??????

As you can see, there is a lot of rust, which seems to be mainly surface rust. It is fully cast iron and weighs an absolute ton. It took 3 of us to get it in the back of my people carrier (!) - and I then had to fathom a way of getting it out again without either damaging the machine, the car or my feet! :lol: 

It is 3 phase, converted to single phase. 6" blades on a 3 knife cutterblock. I don't even know if the motor is working (although apparently it used to!). The cutter guard is missing, as well as the knurled wheel used to adjust the outfeed table.

Anyway, I have never attempted anything like this before. Does anybody know of a good source of info on restoring machines like these?

Hope somebody out there can help.

Cheers

Karl


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## wizer

Brave man! Looking forward to seeing the story unfold. Your first stop should probably be Scrit.


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## ginsters

oh,the memoreys this brings back still remember the first time i used it(scared the hell out of me) :lol:


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## 9fingers

Lots of elbow grease should sort out the tables.
If you have any pitting on smaller detachable parts you could try electrolytic rust removal (google for details) It works well. It does not put metal back but does get rid of rust ready for filling and paint.

Bearings could well be imperial sizes. These are still available. One supplier I have had good service from is arc euro trade.

Good luck

Bob


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## Blister

silly question time  

why do they call them jointers , when it looks like a plainer ? :?


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## 9fingers

Merkins call them jointers as it helps remind them what jobs they are used for. 
We call them planers cos it took less effort naming the first one made. 

Is that plain? 

Bob :lol: :lol:


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## Karl

It's ALIVE !!!!! (he says in a Dr Frankenstein voice.....)

Slapped a 3 pin plug on the cable, plugged it in, and cutter block spins. But not very fast. HHhhhmmmm. .......

Another problem - no switch on the machine to turn the thing on or off.......

Cheers

Karl


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## Blister

9fingers":adi1fvky said:


> Merkins call them jointers as it helps remind them what jobs they are used for.
> We call them planers cos it took less effort naming the first one made.
> 
> Is that plain?
> 
> Bob :lol: :lol:



So it is a plainer and not a jointer ?

clear as mud , just typed this on my printer / keyboard :lol:


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## 9fingers

It is a planer to some and a jointer to others largely depending on which side of the Atlantic you live.
But no way is it a plainer- ever to anyone!

Bob


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## bjm

I thought a 'jointer' differed from a 'surface planer' in terms of the former's ability to cut joints such as tenons - the reason for the short side extension on the infeed table (such as you see on this model) and the greater depth of cut. The Wadkin above doesn't have that so I would say it was a surface planer, not a jointer. 

I don't think I'm going to try this but hereis the sort of thing you can do with a jointer that you cannot do with a surface planer. I'm not sure this is still advisable today given there are safer methods of producing such joints but the possibility is still there if you have a jointer!

Brian


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## Blister

:? 

So its not a plainer :? 

its a jointer :? 

I know , I will call it a " Plainter " 

Sorted


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## Digit

You say there is no on/off switch. What is that box on the end of the stand?

Roy.


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## 9fingers

Blister,

In your attempts to make it PLAINER you keep mis spelling PLANER!

Bob :roll:


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## 9fingers

Digit":hml8f6ek said:


> You say there is no on/off switch. What is that box on the end of the stand?
> 
> Roy.



I suspect that the box you see is the home rolled phase converter?

Bob


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## Karl

Yes, I believe it is the 3 phase converter. At any rate, a load of wires from the motor go into it, and a single lead comes out of (which I then put a 3 pin plug on).

I've also been told that it may be the reason why the machine doesn't get up to speed. 

Cheers

Karl


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## 9fingers

karl":31mnij94 said:


> Yes, I believe it is the 3 phase converter. At any rate, a load of wires from the motor go into it, and a single lead comes out of (which I then put a 3 pin plug on).
> 
> I've also been told that it may be the reason why the machine doesn't get up to speed.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Karl


Karl, unless someone has made quite a nice job of the converter and put in automatic starting, the basic home brew designs will have a button or switch that needs to be operated until the motor gets up to speed, and then released.

Jim Cox's book on electric motors gives details of simple converters in chapter 3
ISBN 0-85242-914-2 published by Argus.

Bob


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## Digit

Good grief Bob, that'd be an old 'un!

Roy.


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## BradNaylor

karl":14zxc737 said:


> Hi all
> 
> Dan Tovey kindly (?) put me in contact with a chap who wanted to get rid of this little "beauty"



Bloody ingrate!

:lol: 

Glad to see you got it home ok!

The thing obviously works - I suspect the phase converter is the problem with the slow motion. It must be 30 years old!

I'd have a look at one of these.

http://www.drivesdirect.co.uk/

There are other firms doing them but this outfit appear to be the most prominant.

I look forward to seeing it polished to a gleaming shine and painted in the authentic colour that it was done in originally. Scrit would no doubt be able to tell you what that was.

Cheers
Dan


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## 9fingers

Digit":eqslfohu said:


> Good grief Bob, that'd be an old 'un!
> 
> Roy.


Hi Roy,

Do you mean me, the converter or the book is an old 'un/ :lol: :lol: 

Bob

I'm 1953, the book is 1988


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## Digit

I remember that type of starter from when I first started work. The bandsaw it was fitted to took about a week to run up and nearly as long to stop.

Roy.


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## Scrit

It looks like a Wadkin RA (or RAA) 6in _overhand_ planer (as opposed to a _panel_ planer, aka a thicknesser), but it almost looks as though somebody has been messing about with it. The factory normally supplied these machines with the motor mounted onto a frame at the front/rear of the main base casting (see below) or sometimes on a cradle inside the main base. Yours appears to have the motor mounted directly to the end of the cutterblock, which on an induction motor on standard mains power (50Hz) would give at best only 3000 rpm (as opposed to the 4500 to 6000 rpm afforded by a 4-pole motor 3:1 or 4:1 pulley ratio). It may be, however, that the factory did supply this machine with a 3-cutter block (most were 2-cutter blocks) to compensate for the low block speed, but I can't see the smoothness of cut being any better trhan a standard machine (in fact it's possibly a lot worse). Another possibility is that the motor is a DC motor, or possibly one designed to run on what would nowadays be a non-standard frequency (quite common before the National Grid of the 1930s) on which it might well run at the correct speed of 5000 rpm. There's even the possibility that the machine has a slip ring motor capable of running at 5000 rpm on standard 50Hz power. wadkin did fit these onto a number of machines in the late 1920s although it was mainly spindle moulders. The machine is _very_ old because its' plate states the manufacturer name "Wadkin & Co". Wadkin became a limited company in 1931 so your machine is at least 77 years old as it pre-dates the formation of the limited company.

As to what needs looking at I'd suggest starting be removing the rear fence, then both of the tables to allow you to examine the gibs and ways (what the table slides on) before looking at the state of the ball bearings on the ends of the cutter blocks. the main things wrong with the machine appear to be that it has no crown guard (although it does still have the bracket) and it is missing a DoL starter. As to converting the machine to single phase I'd consider taking the motor off and replacing it with a pulley. The whole affair can then be powered with an off-the shelf single-phase motor mounted underneath on the floor and driving via a v-belt with a ratio of 1:3.33 if you want to reproduce the stated 5000 rpm from a 4-pole (1500 rpm) motor, o 1:1.66 for a 2-pole (2#3000 rpm) motor. Do remember to guard the belt.

To give you an idea of what the machine looked like when newer, here's a 1949 Wadkin catalogue page:







Before you ask the machine would originally have been painted daek grey or black - but be careful of the original paint as it is a lead-based finish

Scrit


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## Karl

Thanks Scrit - lots of food for thought there. 

The model number (according to the front plate) is RAA188, 3 phase, 50 Cycles.

I believe the motor was factory mounted in its current position. The castings of the motor casing and the main body are a perfect fit and were obviously made to fit together (the motor housing fits into a rebate on the main frame), and the fence assebmley again attaches directly to the motor casing.

I will spend some time disassembling the parts you suggest, and perhaps investigate further the question of what to do with the motor.

Final point - do you know of anywhere I can get spare parts??? As you say, the cutter guard is missing, and the wheel to adjust the outfeed table is also missing. 

Thanks again.

Karl


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## BradNaylor

Karl,

Brian says he's sure he's got the guard somewhere and it will turn up as he sorts his garage out. He's going to drop it in with me when he finds it.

I'll ask him about the outfeed table knob.

Looks like its a bit older than we thought, then! What amazes me is how little the basic design of a planer has changed in all that time.


Cheers
Dan


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## Karl

Nice one Dan.

And in case you inferred from my OP that I wasn't grateful to receive this machine, I am. Cheers.

Karl


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## Digit

Anybody who has taken the time to read any of my posts will know that I have a passion for history, including machines, and wood planers have a long development history Dan.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Portsmouth_Block_Mills

Having read Dan's posts Karl I don't believe he thought that for one moment, note the smiley. I confess I would have said the same thing and added the smiley as well.
It's nice to see an old timer being brought back into use, and I had to pay for mine!

Roy.


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## Jake

Hmm - I wonder what the _"Portable machines - both the 6" and 9" machines are available"_ means on the ad Scrit posted?


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## BradNaylor

Jake":mirn19mk said:


> Hmm - I wonder what the _"Portable machines - both the 6" and 9" machines are available"_ means on the ad Scrit posted?



We proved the portability of this, the 6" machine.

We got it in the back of Karl's VW, and he drove it from Stockport to Winsford.

Never again, though! It must have weighed 3 cwt.

Portable my ****!

Dan


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## Jake

Ha ha, I bet. Everything is relative - it is a Wadkin, after all. It looks a little more portable than the one with the socking great big motor and belt cover.


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## Karl

Managed to squeeze an hour in the 'shop tonight, and did a bit of dismantling work....











So it is now broken down into its constituent parts.

Motor






Tables






Cutter block & assembly






and the fence






It came apart surprisingly easily. I was just glad I had an Imperial socket set :lol: 

Everything looks great, apart from the motor.






Now, I don't know the first thing about motors. But I was surprised at how this looked when I opened it up. There were even a few shavings in there! I think this project is going to revolve around what to do with this motor or, more the point, whether to replace it. 

Everything else looks in really good nick - the fence assembly works great, the tables are lovely and flat, and will slide on their runners really nicely when they've been cleaned up and a bit of fresh grease is applied.

So - any views on the motor? 

Scrit - you mentioned checking the bearings on the cutter block - I have loosened the access panel to check them over. Now, what am I looking for?

All input greatly appreciated.

Cheers

Karl


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## BradNaylor

karl":gcnx5740 said:


> Nice one Dan.
> 
> And in case you inferred from my OP that I wasn't grateful to receive this machine, I am. Cheers.
> 
> Karl



You soft pipper!
:lol:


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## DaveL

I think the 'phase converter' looks to bit of a problem, I don't think there are enough connections to the motor for it to work correctly, but the rest of the machine looks great, but then I am biased having a Wadkin AGS in pride of place in my shop.


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## punkrockdad

I wonder how many axministers will still be around in 80 odd years.

Fantastic post and keep up the progress reports.


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## Karl

Been doing a fair bit of cleaning up this week, primarily on the base unit. Pics to follow (once all other parts are cleaned up).

I'm going shopping tomorrow, so which paint - 3 options:

1) Black Hammerite smooth finish.
2) Black Hammerite hammered finish.
3) A completely non-standard colour (silver, red, Clifton Green), either smooth or hammered.

I can't decide, so opinions please. I am erring towards a non-standard colour, in a smooth finish.

And does anybody have any idea on which areas are actually painted (I know the tables and fence aren't.........). It is really hard to establish which parts were originally painted. May have to wing it if there isn't an example out there.

Cheers

Karl


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## 9fingers

Hammerite paints came up in discussion on a lathe group where I lurk recently.
The conclusion was that the pseudo hammer finish looked awful and that compared to proper machinery paint, the hammerite smooth was a poor substitute too.
Trimite make excellent enamels for machinery which seem very resistance to chipping but I doubt you will find them in the high street and possibly not in places that open on a Saturday!


hth

Bob


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## p111dom

Might sound daft but a friend is restoring an old motorbike and took the frame off to be shotblasted and powder coated. There were a few other bits as well and all in he was charged £100 cash. This would obviously be more expensive than painting it yourself but concidering the cost of the machine its still cheap. He went for black but I guess they would do it in any colour for the same price and I doubt you would get a more durable finish. Would save a mountain of time in prepwork as well.


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## the_g_ster

That would get my vote too.

You could even get them just to do in an agreeable run out colour of a production run they are doing. Getting it shot blasted will get a great finish, you will have a real gem on your hands then.


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## Anonymous

Presuming this is going to be a 'user' and not a show piece, aren't we going just a tad OTT? Good stiff wire brushing and paint the bu**er, that should do it.

I use car Engine brush on enamel, easier to apply than hammerite and gives just as good a result.


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## Karl

I had considered having the machine professionally sprayed, but ruled it out on a cost issue. There are quite a few little bits (handles etc) and I didn't think it'd cost anything less than £150/£200 to get it all sprayed up. That's just not worthwhile, when you allow for the fact that the motor needs to be sorted and could cost a few quid.

For now (ie until i've decided on what colour to go for) I am going to clean all the parts up and give it a coat or two of primer. The base is done - starting on the rest this week.

Need to deal with the motor/converter soon. 

Cheers

Karl


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## bob_c

You can buy coloured enamel on ebay ,the type for machines like myford lathes.


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## Jake

or here http://www.decoratingdirect.co.uk/viewprod/t/TORMACHEN/


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## 9fingers

Karl,
I've been having a bit of a think about your motor and converter.

I wonder if the phase converter block is simply a capacitor with two terminals on the top. Is there anything written on it you can photo and show us?

The motor internals look a bit nasty. Either the insulation is melted/burnt or something else has happened - not too clear from the picture.

I suspect that it is a special motor in as much as I can't see a bearing on the outboard end.
This could be deliberate as the integrated cutter block and motor shaft would otherwise have 3 bearings in a line. A feature normally avoided unless absolutely essential (such as a car crankshaft) as the fine tolerances needed make manufacture difficult.

The observation of your motor turning but slowly is surprising. i would expect little or no rotation but a lot of buzzing/grumbling with the lights dimming or it eventually to pick up speed to normal revs (2850 at a guess) but perhaps not have much power due to dodgy third phase.
Normally the speed would be governed by the layout of the windings and the mains frequency hence it is not natural just to go slowly without the smoke being let out!!

Lets assume you need a new motor. I don't think you will find a direct replacement and trying to graft a new conventional motor on the end will give you 4 bearing in a line - Not Good!

I'd be tempted to saw off the rotor leaving a shaft stub sticking out, fit a pulley and a belt drive to a newly positioned single phase motor like in the picture that Scrit posted earlier in the thread.
Using a normal 1425 rpm motor, the belt drive could speed up to 2850 or even a little bit more at the cutter head.
You would need a belt guard but this could be made from plywood etc - more than adequate for domestic use.


It is a pity you are so far away from me as I'm intrigued by the machine and would like to see it in the flesh.
Hope my comments are of some help.

Good Luck

Bob


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## Digit

Good point. A capacitor of that age would well past its sell by date.

Roy.


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## 9fingers

Quite agree Roy,
I suspect that the only reason the converter worked at all without extra switched starter capacitance ( I tend to use 40 mfd per hp run and 6 to 10 x the run value to start) is the direct drive and low rolling friction of the direct coupling to the cutter block.

Bob


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## Karl

Bob

Many thanks for your input. The motor/converter are going to be what makes or breaks this project.

I'll get some photo's posted up over the next few days of the motor, converter and casing etc. I'm also going to re-attach the motor and get the beast fired up again and report on the outcome. Is there an easy way of determining the rpm of the cutter block?

I have no experience of motors or such, so am really feeling my way. but I would love to keep the original motor - the housing is obviously part of the original machine, and it'd seem a shame to have to scrap it. But if needs must....

Cheers

Karl

ps - is there any way of posting a video onto the forum? I could capture a video of the motor/cutterblock in action, and then you could see it for yourself. Or could I upload a video to say Photobucket, and post a link to it?


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## 9fingers

Karl, motors running on 50 Hz have fundamental speeds of 

2850, 1425 950 710 etc. Very rare to go below 710 (8pole) and impossible to go faster than 2850 (2 pole)
Anything slower than 2850 for a planer would be very slow rate of work to get a good finish.

For posting video, photobucket plus a link is best although the frame update rate distorts any sense of speed.

You might be able to keep the motor housing in situ with a couple of slots for a belt drive to 'escape'

Bob


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## bugbear

I note this site hasn't been mentioned, which is a serious omission!

http://www.owwm.com/

especially

http://wiki.owwm.com/Default.aspx?AspxA ... eSupport=1

BugBear


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## Blister

karl":1ukhs5nm said:


> Been doing a fair bit of cleaning up this week, primarily on the base unit. Pics to follow (once all other parts are cleaned up).
> 
> I'm going shopping tomorrow, so which paint - 3 options:
> 
> 1) Black Hammerite smooth finish.
> 2) Black Hammerite hammered finish.
> 3) A completely non-standard colour (silver, red, Clifton Green), either smooth or hammered.
> 
> I can't decide, so opinions please. I am erring towards a non-standard colour, in a smooth finish.
> 
> And does anybody have any idea on which areas are actually painted (I know the tables and fence aren't.........). It is really hard to establish which parts were originally painted. May have to wing it if there isn't an example out there.
> 
> Cheers
> 
> Karl



NO PLEASE NOT HAMMERITE " VOMIT " 

Please a nice light grey smooth paint , arr my sanity has returned 


:wink: :wink:


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## Blister

Karl

Re your question " So - any views on the motor? " 

If I were you I would take the motor to a motor rewind specialist 

you will probably find that when they remove the field coil and clean it all out , scrape the armature recesses and give it a good once over it will be fine 

Worked for me on a Union wood turning lathe :wink:


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## woody67

Bugbear - OWWM is one interesting site :shock: are there any similar UK based ones? Reason being, my dad had lots of old machinery - TS, bandsaw and even a buffing machine that once resided in his shed which was a former cloggers shop made from old ammo boxes - hence the tons of brass screws I removed as a kid when it was being dismantled!! :shock: 

Mark


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## seaco

9fingers":3m0unadt said:


> Lots of elbow grease should sort out the tables.
> If you have any pitting on smaller detachable parts you could try electrolytic rust removal (google for details) It works well. It does not put metal back but does get rid of rust ready for filling and paint.
> 
> Bearings could well be imperial sizes. These are still available. One supplier I have had good service from is arc euro trade.
> 
> Good luck
> 
> Bob



I did a bit of a tutorial on electrolytic rust removal here it works a treat...

https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/view ... highlight=

Lee


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## GraemeD

Karl,

I just came across your thread and was amazed to see you are restoring pretty much the same machine as I am!! I bought my Wadkin RA planer on Ebay for £70 a while back.....really as a kind of challenge. It seems it was in slightly better nick than yours with no missing parts, and maybe slightly newer (having asked Wadkin they reckon the serial number equates to about 1938!), but still very much in need of a full strip down, paint and rebuild.....which I am in the process of doing right now.

I too was amazed how similar it is to a modern machine in design....in many ways the safety features are the only major difference, and these can be brought up to date if necessary. I was particularly impressed by how smoothly it came apart and the great condition of the machined surfaces....it truly is a quality machine and worth I think of bringing back to life. Much better than something made in China today.

Interestingly in mine (a 2 cutter block version) the knives are slightly angled (ie. not at 90 degrees to the axis of rotation) to give a slight skew cut. Hopefully better for finish on difficult woods? Dunno, but I was impressed!

Anyway, I have some pics of what the planer looked like when I got it, which may help you....plus I really should take some pics as it is now, in pieces but fully painted. It's been a "parked" project for a bit now, while I do some real woodwork (I was getting withdrawl symptoms!), but I'll be picking it up shortly. We can compare notes perhaps!

(Also need to work out how to post images....I'm new to this!).

Looking forward to seeing your further progress!

Cheers
Graeme

[/img]


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## Karl

Hi Graeme 

I'd love to see photos of your Wadkin - may help me to decide what to do with mine. 

Mine is "parked" on a temporary workbench in about 15 bits..... :lol: Been quite busy with work, and not really had much time to do anything in the shop for a little while.

By way of general update, i've decided on a matt smooth black painted finish. Got the base cleaned up and undercoated, just trying to get the other bits sorted. Might get it finished before Xmas...... When it's painted up i'll post some further pics.

Cheers

Karl


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## GraemeD

Hi Karl,

I'm just pleased to hear that I'm not the only one doing this kind of rebuild! It takes a lot of time and is often quite tedious, but I just can't resist sometimes, as I know the end result will be worth it.

I made a huge mistake with my paint! I spent a lot of time prepping it, as my old paint was totally shot. Used an angle grinder with abrasive flap discs to strip it down to bare metal, filled in some of the worst blemishes in the castings with car body filler, and then primed with a zinc based metal primer. So far so good.

Then I had some kind of brainstorm and decided to use a domestic type gloss paint...a la Dulux. I managed to get what I believed to be an authentic colour match with the original (blue/grey), but the paint itself was simply not appropriate....far too soft, so it scratches and chips at the slightest thing. I really wish I'd used a proper machine enamel of some kind, which are admittedly harder to get hold of, but not that hard. So unless I re-strip it all down again (and life is too short for that), I will be continuing with what I have. 

That kind of spoiled my momentum, but I am keen to complete it soon....it requires re-assembly, the main bearings cleaning out and looking at, and then electrics. Mine came with a modern motor but it was very underpowered (the original had been 3 phase and replaced by a previous owner with a 1/4 HP motor). I managed to pick up a decent and more appropriately powered motor off Ebay from a local source, so I will have to make up some kind of fixing for that when the time comes around.

Pics to follow when I get a chance!

Cheers
Graeme


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## GraemeD

Hi Karl,

Pics as promised. First, a general picture taken as it arrived.







And a close up.....






And how it is today....painted (and not cleaned up) and still in pieces.






The main body....






The base....






And finally a box of bearing housings, supports, and general parts






Now I just need the imputus to get it finished. The paint prep nearly finished off all my enthusiasm, so I guess I'm just recharging that with some proper woodworking. I am keen to see this up and running....my initial indication when I ran it up as it arrived was that it ran pretty sweetly, so it should be a great little machine to have around.

Hope these help to inspire you!
Graeme


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## Chems

Takes some serious moxie to get a project like this going and to do such a fine job. You'll have so much satisfaction when your using it!


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## GraemeD

You're not wrong, Chems! I started this with huge enthusiasm, and now need a short rest whilst I recharge. I will complete it however as it is a truly fine machine and deserves to be put back into use. I know I will enjoy using it when it's done, and the light is at the end of the tunnel!

One thing I would be interested to hear opinions about is the "repaired" table edge. In my second pic you can see that the nearside edge of the left hand table has been repaired with a fillet of silver weld material. My theory is that this was a machine made during wartime restrictions, and they made good any slightly less than perfect castings rather than wasting them.....it surely is not an after factory fix, as it makes no sense. This carries on through the machine where the critical machined faces are perfect, but some of the other cast surfaces (which are cosmetic) were pretty much unfettled. I used my angle grinder to remove a lot of rough patches and car body filler to level out depressions. I was surprised how rough some of it was, yet how fantastic the parts were where it does matter to operation. Is this normal for Wadkin, or could it be my theory of wartime measures holds water?

Any thoughts?

Graeme


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## Chems

Short rest is up, lets see it together!


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## GraemeD

You're probably right!! Unfortunately I'm about to leave on holiday, but on my return I think I will have no excuses but to pick this up and run with it again....particularly if Karl is catching me up!!

Cheers
Graeme


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## Karl

GraemeD":nsp58mbo said:


> particularly if Karl is catching me up!!



Chance would be a fine thing ! Work and family commitments are keeping me out of the 'shop at the moment. Not made any progress on mine since I stripped it down, cleaned up the base and primed it. But I am hoping to get back to it in a couple of weeks.

Cheers

Karl


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## Scrit

GraemeD":mh7gwvwy said:


> I too was amazed how similar it is to a modern machine in design....in many ways the safety features are the only major difference, and these can be brought up to date if necessary.


Why are you so amazed? The design of the round block rotary cut planer goes back to the mid 19th century and is fundamentally unchanged except for details since about the 1870s. Modern industrial machines since the 1960s have some improvements not seen on Far Eastern home shop clones including parallel lifting devices on the tables (White of Paisley introduced this to the UK just after WWII, Wadkin took until 1978 to adopt it) and serrated or finger type steel table inserts at the inboard ends of the table to reduce noise, but even the wedge-type cutter block was introduced to the UK about 1930 or so and became standard on all Wadkin planers for the home market around 1951. The most amazing thing is that very little in the way of significant new concepts have appeared since around WWII. 



GraemeD":mh7gwvwy said:


> Interestingly in mine (a 2 cutter block version) the knives are slightly angled (ie. not at 90 degrees to the axis of rotation) to give a slight skew cut. Hopefully better for finish on difficult woods?


It's actually to generate a slightly skewed cut which makes the cutting action more progressive, partly because it requires less power and results in the machine slowing down less when starting the cut. 



GraemeD":mh7gwvwy said:


> My theory is that this was a machine made during wartime restrictions, and they made good any slightly less than perfect castings rather than wasting them.....


Sadly no. You've said that Wadkin dated your machine at circa 1938 - WWII started in 1939 but Wartime restrictions really only came into force around early 1941 and as Wadkin turned over Green Lane in Leicester (their factory) to war munitions production at about that time a wartime machine would probably have a plate stamped "Manufactured by R.O.F. Nottingham", who continued to manufacture many Wadkin machines until the mid 1950s. It is much more likely that a casting was cracked and nickel brazed to repair it at some time in the past, the table surfaces being reground before reassembly. I've seen a lot of old machines repaired in this way. It's not an uncommon technique. 



karl":mh7gwvwy said:


> Final point - do you know of anywhere I can get spare parts??? As you say, the cutter guard is missing, and the wheel to adjust the outfeed table is also missing.


Hopefully you'll have gotten those items sorted out by now. Otherwise you may need to get the existing handwheel copy cast (we have a foundry called Hargreaves opposite the old Sagar works in Canal Lane, Halifax who can do that but you're bound to have someone nearer) and a thread turned on it (standard Whitworth thread I'd have thought so not a killer) whilst the guard is simply a roll-formed piece of flat brass or 1.5mm thick steel (local sheet metal fabricator?) 



karl":mh7gwvwy said:


> So - any views on the motor?


Yes. It all depends on whether or not you want the machine to look original, or you want it to work better. If it's not working having a 70 odd year old motor rewound is going to cost a lot of money. It's also not going to deliver the best performing machines. Machines with in-built electric motors first appeared (this design was apparently introduced around 1927/28 ). V-belt drives were in their infancy (and unreliable) so motors were seen as a direct replacement for the earlier overhead line shaft and flat belt drive, hence direct connection to the cutterblock. During the 1930s experience and research showed that planers ideally need to run with a cutter block periphery speed of about (or above) 1,525 m/min or circa 5,000 ft/min (which is the speed about which many modern planers run). For a 5in cutter block (which is what the later machine has, I'm assuming yours is similar) that translates to the block spinning at a minimum 3,900rpm. If your motor is a two-pole design it will be nominally rated to run at 3,000 rpm, however a phenomenon which I believe electrical engineers call field slip (and if I've expressed that incorrectly I apologise) reduces that figure by around 5% to 2,850 rpm in the real world. At 2,850 rpm the cutterblock has a surface speed of only 1,100 m/min (or circa 3,700 ft/min). The slower speed means that the machine is more prone to slowing or stalling in cut and that the machine is more likely to snatch or tear out when dealing with awkward timbers. Wadkin changed the design of the RA early in its life and retained a separate motor with a belt drive running the block at at 4,500 rpm until production ceased in about 1956 or 1957 (giving a tool speed of 1,750 m/min or 5,790 ft/min) which makes for a much smoother running machine. 

Converting to a belt drive would probably mean having a pulley wheel machined to attach to the end of the cutterblock (and I'm assuming that the motor and cutterblock are not a single piece here) but other than that you could probably make-up your own motor mountings from steel.



karl":mh7gwvwy said:


> Scrit - you mentioned checking the bearings on the cutter block - I have loosened the access panel to check them over. Now, what am I looking for?


The cutter block should have a reduced diameter shaft at either end sitting in a plummer block, not like this: 






These plummer blocks hold the ball bearing races (and the date of this machine means it should have ball bearing races rather than flat bearings) and normally have a Stauffer cup or grease nipple (probably the former on an old machine) at the top. I'd carefully refill the bearings with an acid-free machine bearing grease until you are just starting to push out some of the old grease past the bearing seals then turn the block over by hand listening for clicking, rumbling and roughness. If there is no clicking the bearings may well be OK, but as you're stripping it down having a new set of bearings pressed on is probably going to extend the life of the machine well past yours! (and despite what some people say modern dust sealed ball bearings are often superior to those made in the 1920s and 30s) 

Scrit


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## GraemeD

Know the feeling, Karl! I think we might both be back on task at about the same time, so at least we can compare notes and keep each other's enthusiasm up!

Cheers
Graeme


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## woodyone

Thats going to be a right beaut when its finished, can't wait to see the finished result  .

Woody.


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## Green

Any progress guys?

I am about to start work restoring an 9"BFT so have been reading this thread with interest. 

This is mine:

https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/view ... ght=wadkin

It doesnt look like much but im sure she will scub up nicely.

Please keep us updated on your progress.


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## GraemeD

I've just come back from holiday and have some other catching up to do.....but I'm planning on picking up my refurb in the next few weeks. I'll keep you posted!

Cheers
Graeme


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## Green

Im finding it hard to decide what to do with mine e.g whether I should go to the effort of a full strip down and re-paint or just a quick clean up and bearing/blade change.

Karl,

Are you going to stay with three phase? If so I will be changing the 3hp three phase on mine for a single phase job. Its yours if you want it.


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## GraemeD

I've bought and renovated quite a few old machines, varying greatly in condition when I got them. The Wadkin was by far the worst....and oldest....and in that case I had no choice but to do a full strip-down. 

However, if a machine is usable without re-doing the paintwork, then I'd be tempted to think about that option. To me, repainting is a huge step up in effort level....maybe because I have to do it by hand (ie. no spraying available)....and maybe because it is tedious and deceptively easy to get a poor result. 

(OK, so I worry a little bit too much about the paint finish on my machines, instead of getting on with some woodwork....I admit it 

I recently renovated a MiniMax bandsaw which was borderline in the paint department as far as I was concerned. From afar, it looked ok....up close the paintwork was chipped and blistering with surface rust (actually the original paintjob was shocking, so even when new it had drips and dirt in the paint finish!). 

I was already part way into the Wadkin at this stage and did not want more painting to do, so I decided to leave it. In fact I touched up a few of the worst bits using a close colour match from Humbrol, and then cleaned the rest, using a car cutting compound followed by car silicone polish to improve what was there. The end result isn't actually too bad....and at least when I dink it in use with a lump of 2x4, I'm not cursing the hours I spent repainting it all.

Looking at your pics, the paint work ain't too bad, so it depends on how concerned you are with the finish at the end. I reckon you can probably get away with a strip-down and clean-up only....of course you can always change your mind later and paint it (it's not a one-time decision!).

Hope that helps?
Graeme


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## Digit

I have to admit that I'm with Graeme on this, my Wadkin planer is as received in the paint line, splashed with various colours from the years in various shops, but fully re-conned.

Roy.


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## Karl

Green":3cipkpej said:


> Im finding it hard to decide what to do with mine e.g whether I should go to the effort of a full strip down and re-paint or just a quick clean up and bearing/blade change.
> 
> Karl,
> 
> Are you going to stay with three phase? If so I will be changing the 3hp three phase on mine for a single phase job. Its yours if you want it.



Hi Green

Thanks for the offer, but mine is going to be single phase. 

Graeme - having stripped all the metalwork back, I am now beginning to realise what a massive task it is going to be to actually prime and paint it all up again. I get little enough time in my workshop as it is, and I am beginning to begrudge spending it painting! I think that, for now, i'm just going to give everything a nice clean up, make sure all the mechanicals are sorted (which they pretty much are - just need to check out the bearings) and get the motor "fixed". 

Should be done for Xmas...........

Cheers

Karl


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## Green

Karl, 

No problem. Where are you going to get your motor? I have had a search and the best I can come up with are MachineMart and Axminster. I will need a new pulley too as all the single phase motors I have seen have bigger shafts.

I think I will give the paintwork a tickle with a wire brush on an angle grinder and a quick slap of paint.
The fence, guards and anything else I can get off will be de-rusted in a electrolytic bath and sprayed.
Sorting the tables will be a bigger job, they have a good bit of rust on them from being stored in the damp.


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## GraemeD

Green,

I found my motor on Ebay; it was local to me, hence getting hold of it was not a problem. There are loads on there, so hopefully you could find something suitable.

In terms of derusting the tables, my best technique is to use a sharp razor blade in a holder to scrape the main rust and gunk off the tables, and then "polish" them with a random orbit sander, loaded with a scotchbrite pad. You can get these with velco fixings, designed for the job, and the results are absolutely superb! I have never found the need for electro baths and the like; I use a wire wheel in a grinder for the small parts, a wire wheel in an angle grinder for the larger parts, and the above method for ant flat surfaces....fences, tables etc.

As for the painting, it is a huge job and somewhat soul destroying...especially if you are short on time. As I said before however, you don't need to do it now; you can always clean it as best you can with something like scotchbrite, and worry abput repainting later if you love the machine once it's up and running.

Graeme


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## Green

Well I got a bit carried away...

I only popped out to the shed to fetch something and ended up doing this:






This is most of the fence mechanism and guarding after having been given the paint stripper and wire brush treatment.







Cutter block, bearing housing castings and a few other bits and bobs cooking away in my electric bath.


Call me a masochist but I really, really enjoy doing this and am already sniffing abouut for more old iron to fix up.

Cheers


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## Digit

The parts certainly look nice. I suppose someday I'll have to deal with my Wadkin now!

Roy.


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## Green

Cheers

It really didnt take that long to do, the hardest part was getting the bearings/pulley wheel off. In the end I got a car mechanic friend to take the whole cutter block to work and put it in the hydraulic puller.

On the subject of bearings, the ones I removed do not match, one is stamped - 205NPP C3, the other is - 3205 ZS. They appear to be same size but look slightly different (I assume someone has just replaced the easiest one at some point in the past). I can find 3205 ZZ online but not ZS nor the 205 NPP. Is the ZZ the same as a ZS but with different sheilding and will it be ok?

Hope that made sense, english aint my strong point.


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## Digit

If nobody can answer that Green I'll check with my bearing supplier for you.

Roy.


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## GraemeD

Nice work, Green.....I know what you mean about enjoying this kind of work. It's only when it outfaces you (like stripping and repainting a large machine) that I start to question myself!

Did you decide whether to paint the main body of the machine in the end? Did you manage to secure a suitable motor?

Graeme


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## Green

Roy

Thanks for the kind offer but I popped into a local engineering supply today (Forth Engineering - for anyone local) and was supplied some suitable bearings. Very helpful people.

Greame,

Yep I painted the whole thing. The stand was easy as it is mostly pressed steel and so was easy to move about and work with. The main body is getting another couple of coats tonight. Im not fussing with body filler and the like so its not all that time consuming.

I think I will just call into Screwfix for the motor, pulley and starter. Im not sure I will be able to get the right mounting off the shelf so will probably just take the motor in and do a side by side comparison and pick the closest.

Cheers


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## Digit

You're more than welcome. You can start on mine when you're ready! :roll: 

Roy.


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## Green

Quick update for anyone who is interested...

Almost finished, just need to save up for a new motor and find the bolts (that I put away in a safe place) so I can bolt the fence back on :roll: 






Here is how it used to look:








Close up







Thanks for looking


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## DaveL

Well apart from being the the wrong colour :roll: you have made a very good job of this.  
I look forward to seeing it up and running, it should be a very useful machine. \/


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## MikeG.

I've been following this one from the start.......what a fantastic job! You must be very pleased with the result. 

I hope you are going to use it, and not just sell it!

Mike


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## shim20

top job, bet you pleased its nearly finished


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## Karl

Mike Garnham":20rggjad said:


> I've been following this one from the start.......



Hey Mike, I hope you're not confusing Greens finished Wadkin with my unfinished specimen....

Nice work Green - seems that every time I enter the 'shop lately the Wadkin is screaming out for some TLC. Sometime, maybe......

Thanks for sharing the pics. Let us know how you get on with your motor.

Cheers

Karl


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## Chris24

I recently aquired an old 9" planer. The make is Metalclad, Neath, Glamorgan.
The only hit on Google is an entry in Hansard from, 4th May 1938 stating that the company had closed, the previous December.
I'm inspired by the Wadkin projects, so may start my own refurb.
I will post some pics if requested, as the design is novel. The stand, which houses the motor, is open, with the base sitting on top. the tables move up and down by turning screws, but are carried in substantial dowels arranged so that the movement is tangential to the two knife cutter-block. It is a well made, professional machine. Like the Wadkins, the important parts are machined to close tolerances, while bits hidden from view were left rough.


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## DaveL

Hi Chris,

Welcome to the forum. 



Chris24":26y8ng9b said:


> The make is Metalclad, Neath, Glamorgan.


Never heard of them but that does not count for a lot.
I have a Wadkin Table saw and a Multico planer, old cast iron makes for solid machines and they are a pleasure to use.


Chris24":26y8ng9b said:


> I will post some pics if requested,


Er request made. :roll: 

It would be good to get the machine documented so anyone else can see what they are like if they find one in a barn somewhere.

A word of warning, we have a spam trap that will stop pictures and links until you have a few posts top your name, don't worry about it, one us will be along to sort it out if it kicks in.


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## wizer

Wow that looks fantastic! I'd love to have the time and inclination to do something like that. Well done.


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## Chris24

/Users//Desktop/Metalclad 9" jointer.jpeg

I hope that above this is a picture of the Metalclad planer, as it was when I first had it. Made not far away from here, in Neath, Glamorgan.
I last night found an entry in google for an old auction selling what I think is a similar machine.
The table arrangement is a bit like the General on Konrad Sauer's website, in that they are carried on carriages.
I think that it was cream originally.
The thing runs amazingly well considering that it all looks original. It winds up and up, but will never take off, so I don't think I will bother bolting it down.
My first project is to use all the space privided in the stand to construct a waste chute and connect to my extractor. I only took a few passes of some thick old pine and was knee deep! Then new switch gear and wiring?

thanks for the welcome.

Chris


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## Chris24

Well it looks as though my attempt to post a picture has failed, so PLEASE can I be let into the secret? 

Chris


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## DaveL

Chris,

Take a look here for some helpful stuff on posting pictures.


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## Green

Thanks for the kind words.

The machine is up and running and has given a good run in, it works brilliantly. I'll post some 'finished' pics if anyone wants.

Cheers


P.S sorry for hi-jacking your thread, Karl.


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## joiner_sim

Looking great! Hope it serves you well.


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## Karl

Green":39uzbvqk said:


> P.S sorry for hi-jacking your thread, Karl.



:lol: 

I think it might have been another few months before I got this thread up and running again!

Great job on your planer.

I will post some pics of my machine once completed - just don't know how long it'll be before it's finished.

Cheers

Karl


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## mick mcveigh

hi guys, have just joined site,some really good work going on restoring. i have just bought a wadkin rma 28 inch planer thicknesser she is a real beast and run perfectly will post pics later.she is of that old grey blue colour i would really appreciate if some one out there would know the colour code and type of paint as i hope to restore this beauty .hope i,m not standing on any toes by just jumping in .regards mick


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## wallace

Hi Mick, welcome to the forum. There are quite a few wadkin nuts about here. I have restored a few wadkin machines. Heres a link to my most recent 

wadkin-pillar-drill-resto-t56790.html

I found it quite hard to find a RAL number for the old colour paint so in the end I took a piece with the original paint on to a motor factors and they colour chipped it. I use machinery enamel its very durable and goes on really well either sprayed or brush. Are you planning on restoreing the planer you have, if so start a thread. Everyone likes a good machine tart up. 
Mark


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## Max Power

Did Karl ever finish his ?


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## wallace

I see the last post is from 2008 so he either got bored of it or did not post a completed pic :roll:


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## Chems

Karl gave it to someone else who finished it. 

wadkin-planer-restoration-almost-complete-t39039.html


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