# Has anyone made the PantoRouter ?



## mpooley

I would like to know if anyone has made this tool ? http://woodgears.ca/pantorouter/index.html
I am intending to make one and would like to benefit from others experience   

Thanks

Mike


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## Eric The Viking

I haven't, but it looks like a lot of fun. 

If you do, let us know how you get on!


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## mpooley

Oh I'm definitely going to make it :shock: 
I have ordered a special round bodied router just for it so I have got to make it now !

I've just got to get all the bits of hardware together and order the plywood so should be starting it next week I hope  

Mike


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## angelboy

That looks pretty great really!


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## mpooley

I'm getting on ith it quite well. done a fair bit of work now. 
My only real problem is drilling straight holes! i thought my drill press was fairly good until now but this thing needs very precise and well aligned holes so have had to re- do a few of them and i still dont know yet wether they will be good enough.


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## tisdai

Keep up the good work Mike  , and any chance of a few pickies to go with the build.

CHeers

Dave


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## MickCheese

I find if I need really precise straight holes I can use a plunge router with a suitable straight bit.

The plunge body makes everything very accurate.

Mick


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## urbanarcher

oh i cant wait to see the WIP for this one mike? i was thinking about giving it a bash myself but then i realised i should learn the basics of how to use the tools i have first!! lol :lol:


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## woodshavings

I made the 3D pantograph (http://woodgears.ca/pantograph/index.html) earlier this year. That works fine and have been using it for simple engraving.
I was wondering about the PantoRouter so look forward to your progress.

The author/designer, Matthias Wandel, is a really interesting guy and maybe a little eccentric, but would recommend his website " An Engineers Approach to Woodworking" (http://woodgears.ca) to anyone with an interest in things mechanical. His latest wheeze is building a bandsaw from mainly scrap parts!

John


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## mpooley

MickCheese I am still having problems with my drill holes but cant find a 5mm router cutter over 19mm long, which would not really be long enough, also I wonder about setting up the router to plunge cut on some of these parts as they are so fiddly! have you any ideas how it could be done?
I am getting on well but I dont think it will be accurate enough and there is no way of knowing that till i have got it assembled. :shock: 

any hoo these are a few pics I have taken during the build and the last one is where I am now.


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## tisdai

I will have a look arround for you to see what I can come up with for the precise drilling of the holes, looks great upto now, please keep posting.

Cheers

Dave


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## xy mosian

If you have a 'standard' drill, with tail, this might help.

http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-ax ... prod22269/

Clamp the piece to be drilled in some way to make the surface larger, think wormate top. This so that the guide has a large bearing surface. Using brad point drills will help keep the bit on the straight and narrow.

xy


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## mpooley

Thanks xy although I think that its the drill bits that are the main problem.

Using normal drills I can actually see the blimmin things wander as they bite into the wood. (especially plywood)
I am using lip and spur bits at the moment and they are definitely better but i do wonder if its the quality of the bits that is the main problem.
I bought a set of hundreds of bits from axminster and I think they are probably rubbish lol

Mike


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## xy mosian

Interesting thing about drill bits. In a 'standard' two flute drill bit the minimum thickness of the web must be quite thin, therefore not very stiff. I have found that, certainly in smaller sizes, a speed, flat or paddle bit, or whatever you call it, is very much stiffer. They also come with a very nice centre point, some even have spurs to mimic 'brad point' drills. Most of the ones I have come across have a shaft of 6mm, or so, this may be too big for you, but it may be possible to make one from say 4mm silver steel bar.

xy


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## mpooley

I have spent a lot more time on this and am finally getting the feeling I am getting there!

still a lot more to do though :? 

I have made the frame for the template Holder . It took me ages to cut all the box joints on the bandsaw and I wouldnt do this again unless i make the box joint jig. I dont think it's nessacary. but it does make it nice and stiff.

I have also been working on the base and have taken my drawer runners to bits and cleaned my balls lol :wink:


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## mpooley

Finally finished it today  except for the springs
and did a small test cut which seemed promising. only about .5mm out over about 4 inches in the horizontal axis.
Found that I wasn't getting the full range of movement so had to make adjustments where the router body was catching the frame and some of the Panto Mechanism doing the same.

Finally set up a test to run the bit at the table height. just a straight cut about 175mm long but found that even thought the bearing was following a straight template, the cut moved up away from the table in the middle leaving a curved cut in my test piece probably 3 to 4 mm so quite a bad error. :? 

will post some pictures tomorrow.

Looks like I will have to go back and take the mechanism apart again and try to get my bearing holes better aligned.

Mike


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## studders

I've just bought the plans for one of these, so... it's all your fault. 

Just got to find a suitable router.


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## mpooley

studders":ktcaeozi said:


> I've just bought the plans for one of these, so... it's all your fault.
> 
> Just got to find a suitable router.



Thats great !

I used a draper expert.
I have also just ordered a Colt HSS-M2 5 Star Lip & Spur Precision Wood Drill
hoping to at least get a few straight holes.

That has been my biggest problem. its amazing how far brand new bits wander!

Mike


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## studders

mpooley":2g28ifaj said:


> I used a draper expert.
> 
> Mike



Yes I've seen that one, one of the very few available over here that would be suitable I think, though I'm also considering the Trend T4 (I think it was) but it may be a little under powered.




mpooley":2g28ifaj said:


> I have also just ordered a Colt HSS-M2 5 Star Lip & Spur Precision Wood Drill
> hoping to at least get a few straight holes.



They're not cheap are they. :shock: 
If they do the job though...


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## mpooley

studders":3ueokeq8 said:


> mpooley":3ueokeq8 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I used a draper expert.
> 
> Mike
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Yes I've seen that one, one of the very few available over here that would be suitable I think, though I'm also considering the Trend T4 (I think it was) but it may be a little under powered.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> mpooley":3ueokeq8 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I have also just ordered a Colt HSS-M2 5 Star Lip & Spur Precision Wood Drill
> hoping to at least get a few straight holes.
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> They're not cheap are they. :shock:
> If they do the job though...
Click to expand...


yes and axminsters delivery charges dont help I think they were dearer than the drill bit !
blimmin extortion  
it's what puts me off of buying small items from them But i didn't have a local stockist and I'm getting desperate .

you wouldnt think it would be difficult to drill a straight hole through 18 mm of Oak or Ply would you.
Maybe its my drill stand? I have been experimenting by using all my 5mm drills and every one is off !
I drill a hole and then stand the wood on my bench with a 150mm rod through the hole and measure the distance between the tips of the rod and the bench. 
I am amazed how far out they are !! #-o 
I have thought about using a router with a spiral bit in but cant find a 5mm one anywhere. I would have to build a very accurate jig for some very odd shaped bits of wood too ! which I cant really work out how to do.

I hope that not being able to drill a few holes isn't going to scupper my pantorouter  


Mike


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## studders

mpooley":1diwwvty said:


> I hope that not being able to drill a few holes isn't going to scupper my pantorouter
> 
> 
> Mike


I'm sure it will all come out in the wash.


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## jordec66

That is so cool.


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## mpooley

studders":vc94f5m5 said:


> mpooley":vc94f5m5 said:
> 
> 
> 
> I hope that not being able to drill a few holes isn't going to scupper my pantorouter
> 
> 
> Mike
> 
> 
> 
> I'm sure it will all come out in the wash.
Click to expand...


I think I have solved it !
My drill press can pivot so although I had checked many times that the bits are held vertical, I adjusted it off of vertical in the opposite direction to the one it was wandering off to!
that amazingly gives me as near as damn it a perfectly vertical hole ! Hurray!

I have dissassembled the main mechanism today (its very easy you just pull the rods out)
I found some racking problems caused by the holes not lining up which I have been tackling.
I am taking more time over it this time round so hope it will all work out ok.

studders let us know when you start on yours! and let me know if you want bad advice lol (homer) 

Mike


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## studders

mpooley":xj80wzr8 said:


> I think I have solved it !


Good Man. 


> studders let us know when you start on yours!


Keeping my eyes peeled for a suitable S/H Router; too tight to buy new, but I may have to if nothing turns up by the time I've finished my Wardrobes, which is when I want to start this project.


> and let me know if you want bad advice lol (homer)
> Mike


Oh I will, I will.


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## rileytoolworks

If you're still looking for a 5mm spiral cutter, Trend do one that's intended for routing aluminium proflies (window frames etc).
I use these regularly on wood and they're the dogs kahonies.
Probably a bit late now though as it seems you have it sorted.

Adam.


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## mpooley

Aces and Eights":5ri60xlw said:


> If you're still looking for a 5mm spiral cutter, Trend do one that's intended for routing aluminium proflies (window frames etc).
> I use these regularly on wood and they're the dogs kahonies.
> Probably a bit late now though as it seems you have it sorted.
> 
> Adam.



Thanks thats always worth knowing for the future as there are a couple of this guys plans I like and will probably try out.

thanks

Mike


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## mpooley

I have been mucking about with the templates for a few days now grabbing a little time here and there.
I have had quite a bit of trouble working it out and I'm sorry to say the guy who sold the plans although he answers all email promptly has not been any help at all.
As I pointed out to him his method for adjusting the height works (I have improved on it though)
But his video making large tenons is the only place he mentions the horizontal axis and he does this by eye!!

I dont think that is good enough for making furniture. Yes it looks very impressive making the joints and is fine as long as you are willing to have them at random places on your timber. But unless you can set them up exactly (to the nearest mm) then I dont think it is good enough ! the only way is to set the fence by trial and error on a test piece first.
Not to bad if you are doing lots but annoying if you ar doing only 1 or 2.

Anyway to my Point!
I think I have a good way of solving the problem but I think you need to do away with his method of holding the templates it is too clumsy. Unless of course you have 2 pairs of hands.
you need a way to slide the template up or down then lock the height in. Then a way to slide it right or left without altering the vertical ajustment you have just made.

I am thinking of a T track set into the main template holder for left and right but would appreciate any thought you might have?

Thanks

Mike


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## marcros

Mike,

Would somethink like this help:

A right angled piece of material with pair of slots cut into each face. That way, you could adjust up and down, and clamp with some locking handles. You could then move left or right, and lock with another pair of handles, without that first axis moving. SAomebody suggested a similar idea to make a simple router table fence when I enquired, albeit that it only needed to move in a single plane.

The other way might be to butcher some old machinery- some form of x and y table and a height adjuster off a router?

Mark


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## mpooley

marcros":zdt4ldww said:


> Mike,
> 
> Would somethink like this help:
> 
> A right angled piece of material with pair of slots cut into each face. That way, you could adjust up and down, and clamp with some locking handles. You could then move left or right, and lock with another pair of handles, without that first axis moving. SAomebody suggested a similar idea to make a simple router table fence when I enquired, albeit that it only needed to move in a single plane.
> 
> The other way might be to butcher some old machinery- some form of x and y table and a height adjuster off a router?
> 
> Mark


I'm having trouble picturing what you mean but one limitation of this is that all the templates are made up of 6mm mdf backing board with a wood template stuck to it and i will need quite a few for different setups. so the 'device' to set it up must be seperate from the template backing board. And not get in the way of the router when its in action.
with a right angle ,if i am getting you right it would stick out into the pantorouters path wouldn't it ?

I have just had a little brainwave though so will be getting out t workshop as soon as possible top give it a try. 

thanks Mark

Mike


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## mpooley

Ok I think I have it worked out now. The photo's show the test template design not the final one.

The idea is to have two templates fixed to each backing piece so thats why there are upside down slots. The 2 sets at the bottom was a change during the design.

I have made two extra pieces of timber up the front of the template holder frame. And another one on the edge of the right hand side which is to be a backstop for the bearing.
Using this backstop you can ascertain the position where the bit will first reach the height of the table. you mark this and set the fence to this mark. (you only have to do this once for each bit/bearing combination)


this is the end result with all spacers etc removed.






Then for setting up I place the oak bar accross the other two uprights..
This sets the cutter to 'just' miss the bottom of the workpiece if you slide the bearing along the oak bar IYSWIM

then you work out for each tenon what size the tenon will be and taking your workpiece size into account you now know the offsets you need for vertical and and horizontal.

then say the vertical offset you want for the tenon is 7.5 mm as in the photo's you slide in a 15mm bar on top of the oak bar. then rest the mdf backing piece firmly on that.
Thats your height set. 
then as in this case you want 7.5mm offset horizontally you slide a 15mm bar at the far right between the side piece and the mdf backing and snug it up tight.
now you have both axis set up take all the bars out and off you go! 

Phew! it sounds more complicated than it is :shock: 

the base bar and the spacer sitting on the two uprights.





close up





the horizontal spacer snugged up to the plywood end stop.




Hope you all followed that #-o 

Mike Pooley


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## Tinbasher

Does anyone know of a supplier of this type of plywood? All I can get locally is full of voids.

Tin


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## mpooley

Tinbasher":pc1tggim said:


> Does anyone know of a supplier of this type of plywood? All I can get locally is full of voids.
> 
> Tin


I used far eastern Hardwood ply - you can get baltic birch ply but i think it will be a lot more expensive.
Having said that, if I was to start over I would at least find out the prices of Baltic Birch. as even the far eastern hardwood is not perfect. (mine wasnt very flat either!)

Mike


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## Allylearm

I like using Birch Ply for my jigs also as they last longer and stop vacumn leak on edge or face on my CNC Router. But you get varied grades of Birch that I have found out from varied suppliers.


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## alexmorley1

i was thinking about making one of these during my spare time. how long did it take you to make it do you recon, and do you think my bosch palm router would be a suitable router? or will i also have to by the draper one.
lol


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## mpooley

alexmorley1":3ucy4vob said:


> i was thinking about making one of these during my spare time. how long did it take you to make it do you recon, and do you think my bosch palm router would be a suitable router? or will i also have to by the draper one.
> lol



It took me a long time really. I am retired so I could spend quite a few hours out in the workshop every day, nearly , for a couple of weeks.
You might be a bit quicker than me but its certainly not a 1 day job.
I would happily help by giving you the benefit of my experience though, which might shave a couple of minutes off  
Its very rewarding when you make your first double mortice and tenon though and it fits ! :shock: 

Mike


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## studders

alexmorley1":1bqdrh7n said:


> do you think my bosch palm router would be a suitable router? or will i also have to by the draper one.
> lol


That's probably the one I was thinking of using if the old(very) fixed Black+Decker that I found on the bay turns out to be no good.
Still can't start yet though, still got a Mountain of outside 'Jobbies' to get done first, and the recent weather hasn't helped as it means I've no excuse for not doing them.


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## mpooley

Oh I forgot - the bosch palm router. yes i nearly went for that one myself but was worried that i'd need to use half inch bits.
I want one anyway


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## Templatetom

I have watched the Video on you tube of this veryinteresting and complex Jig producing triple tenons and wondered if I could produce the same joint on the super Jig I have been developing and here are the results


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## mpooley

ah!
where can we see your device tom?

Mike


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## Templatetom

mpooley":o5542dte said:


> ah!
> where can we see your device tom?
> 
> Mike


http://youtu.be/_JPsZIC3RO0

I have submitted a number of youtube videos some were presented on one of the six Mini Super Jigs I took to the woodshow along with 14 routers all set up for a number of demonstrations of the many processes that can achieved with the super Jig 
newtorouting.com
Tom


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## samurai

neat work!! i have also made pantorouter though its made from steel.


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## mpooley

Made from steel ... nice
pictures please


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## samurai

mpooley":5k7im5tt said:


> Made from steel ... nice
> pictures please


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## mpooley

wow it looks good. does it work well?
how hard do you find setting up a template for a job?


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## samurai

mpooley":yp8tjy4f said:


> wow it looks good. does it work well?
> how hard do you find setting up a template for a job?


actually i made this pantorouter using welding and drilling jig made by japanese cnc milling machine so everything was so precise and allign that there was no problem setting template.i use template method from leigh fmt jig.i use bushing for bearing guide.you can check this machine fuction on youtube, search pantorouter made from steel
or check on woodgears facebook page.if you have any question please ask me.i would be more than happy


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## marcy marc

No i hav'nt in fact this is the first time ive seen one and looks intriguing , and very impressive . 
I shall look forward to reading and seeing more .


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## Benchwayze

Wealden tools make special Router drill-bits. 

If you have some way of using the router overhead, then this might be a more accurate alternative. 
Problem is, once you've used a router overhead, (the way it was designed to be used) it kinda spoils you for anything else. :mrgreen: 

The old 'stand-up and beg', round bodied routers that Bosch used to make will come away from their plunge mechanism, and the 43mm collar means they will fit into a drill-stand such as the Record. (Trend still make a router of the same design. I have used mine in the drill-stand in the past without any wandering problems. Using proper router-drill bits, you get accurate and clean holes. Superb for morticing too. 

http://www.wealdentool.com/cgi-bin/sh00 ... 04#aDA1004

HTH


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## siggy_7

I'd love to build one of these one day; I have so much other stuff to do first - like building a router table around my table saw, and building a work bench. I've also hankered after the Woodgears' slot morticer, but I had a brainwave last night. Functionally the Pantorouter can do everything the slot morticer can; what the morticer adds is a precise height control via the winder. So my plan is to build the Pantorouter but to add in a height adjustment mechanism similar to the slot morticer onto the template mount. That way, I can fit a template with a horizontal slot to match the guide bearing and adjustable width stops, which would give the same capability as the slot morticer, and then just use a different template for cutting any other joint. I think from the specs that I might wish to enlarge the size of the pantograph from the Woodgears design so that I have more movement. I'd also like a bigger table and a removeable centre insert in the table so that I can lock the router in place and use it like a more conventional horizontal router table with the bit well supported, for example to use with horizontal panel raisers.

If I do get round to building this, I would be tempted to change the design over so that it uses a plunge base router, setting the cut depth via the plunge mechanism (thinking of using the Triton at the moment as that's what I have and it seems a great tool) and then build the cut-depth axis movement into the table rather than the router, which would allow a large cut to be taken in stages when in use. I guess the main reason that the Woodgears design doesn't do this is the desire to use a fixed base router as that is more common in North America and cheaper - what are other's opinions on the advantages/disadvantages of changing to this configuration?


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## samurai

if you will tempted design to plunge router then it's mean you have to use much longer and wider as well otherwise you will get too much error in mechanism. you have to make much higher table base but this way you don't need slide table i guess which i would say is good idea. i like your idea of removeble table insert which i gonna put in my new hybrid pantorouter.why i m saying hybrid coz i will use plywood and maple for table and base but steel for pantograph mechanism to give it more strength.i could find THK slide pack from nearest used machine shop cost me 1500 yen for 5 slide.these slides are dust proof so i don't need to worry about getting it stuck with wood chips.soon i will share my pix of pantorouter.
i also tempted the tamplate design of matthias.this way i don't need two template for tenon and mortise.one template can make tenon and mortise.please have a look of my youtube video of Demonstrating steel pantorouter making mortise and tenon joint(HD) 
i made this pantorouter in india for my friend with very poor quality raw material


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## samurai

just finished my hybrid pantorouter.please have a look on http://youtu.be/7zUch0BYiak


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## mpooley

samurai":gpm8o9iz said:


> just finished my hybrid pantorouter.please have a look on http://youtu.be/7zUch0BYiak



Very nice job 

I'm interested in the way you fit the templates. In my opinion this is the big weakness of the Panto router as designed. It looks wonderful but Mathias never shows it in a real life use. it is easy to get a tenon and a mortice that fit but getting them in the exact position you want is not so easy.
I have developed a way of adjusting the vertical and horizontal positioning of the template using spacers bars. Its still awkward but i get good results unless I do the math wrong and put the wrong spacer in. which i do a lot  
I have not used it over the winter so I was going to put some more thought into a better system.
You say your template runs in a parallel guide. How does this work please? I'm assuming you mean that it always stays parallel with the table?.

I love your idea for the adjustable bearing so that you can have 1 template for both tenon and mortice! very good 

Mike


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## samurai

well mpooley!! you are absoulutely right.major fall of pantorouter is template setting but i could decode this problem.well my template plate is parallel with table.so how i can make it parallel each time?it's very easy,just buy measure tape with glue on.cut it and paste both side of the template holder,so whenever you raise or down the template plate it will go parallel as you can see exact numerical number on the measure tape.well i will make another dedicated video how i setup template as my english is not good so difficult for me to explain in english.
well about exact measurement of template,first i made it from wood and found it was very cool idea to just change bearing location but there were some little bit error so i made it from steel which cost me 1200 japanese yen but it was worth paying for cnc millling machine.
well if you wanna make the same way what i did so exact measurement for 1/2 x2 inch tenon and mortise is outerdia 32mm x 109mm for tenon and 96.5mm for mortise.bearing size 19mm and router bit 1/2 inch,i will make more template and post here exact dimensions.
best regards
singh


mpooley":3pnw1ya5 said:


> samurai":3pnw1ya5 said:
> 
> 
> 
> just finished my hybrid pantorouter.please have a look on http://youtu.be/7zUch0BYiak
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Very nice job
> 
> I'm interested in the way you fit the templates. In my opinion this is the big weakness of the Panto router as designed. It looks wonderful but Mathias never shows it in a real life use. it is easy to get a tenon and a mortice that fit but getting them in the exact position you want is not so easy.
> I have developed a way of adjusting the vertical and horizontal positioning of the template using spacers bars. Its still awkward but i get good results unless I do the math wrong and put the wrong spacer in. which i do a lot
> I have not used it over the winter so I was going to put some more thought into a better system.
> You say your template runs in a parallel guide. How does this work please? I'm assuming you mean that it always stays parallel with the table?.
> 
> I love your idea for the adjustable bearing so that you can have 1 template for both tenon and mortice! very good
> 
> Mike
Click to expand...


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## Templatetom

http://youtu.be/V9JV4qddMNA Routing Tenons

Congratulations on your achievement I too have been looking at producing tenons (Mortices are quite easy) and I have developed the Super Jig from material that was not so complicated to produce. Not only will I be able to rout the srtaight forward Tenons I can produce the tenons on a mitre I doubt if I would be going to the expense of producing the pantorouter Jig
Tom


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## adzeman

I am very interested in Matthias Wandel's projects and look forward to a new item every Monday I am not suprised this long thread only attracted a dozen contributers and only a couple having actualy made one, which was Mikes original question. Mike Pooley who must be congraulated in his persiverance.in competing a difficult project.

Matthias Wandle is unique, the type of bloke you need with you in a post apocolypst or shipwrecked on a desert island I give him three weeks to generating electricity and another three to watching footy on Sky

I am building up courage to send off for his router table lift

My question is "would there have been a greater responce if this thread had been posted in the General Forum?


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## mpooley

hard to answer that one! and not many people will reply cos no one is reading it lol
shame though
I'd prefer it if more people had made it. It would help to exchange ideas about improving it.

I did ask Matthias why he hadn't got any forums but he said it would be too much work!

BTY do send off for the plans they are very well done and certainly the best I have ever seen.

Mike


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## RogerBoyle

mpooley":3or8sdag said:


> hard to answer that one! and not many people will reply cos no one is reading it lol
> shame though
> I'd prefer it if more people had made it. It would help to exchange ideas about improving it.
> 
> I did ask Matthias why he hadn't got any forums but he said it would be too much work!
> 
> BTY do send off for the plans they are very well done and certainly the best I have ever seen.
> 
> Mike



The answer is simple 
Most don't want to build one as they do not believe that they are capable of the precision that it requires and/or they think it's outside their comfort zone.
But they do like to see WIP on things (nosey pippers LOL ) :mrgreen: hence the very high view count In excess of 4K


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## JakeS

RogerBoyle":2vgza9gt said:


> The answer is simple
> Most don't want to build one as they do not believe that they are capable of the precision that it requires and/or they think it's outside their comfort zone.



I'd be interested in building one just because it's really cool, but I don't know whether I can justify the time and expense it would take in terms of utility it would bring! It's a neat machine, sure, but I'd probably just use it for cutting M&T joints, and I can already do those with a router on a workmate without building a giant frame and pantograph mechanism.

So to me, it's like - I don't know, having a robot arm to fetch me beer. It may be a high-precision beer-fetching device, but it's probably marginally less safe than doing it myself and it would definitely cost a lot more. But I'd still be utterly fascinated to see someone build one from scratch!


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## adzeman

I have to have a router table and the self build ones give good value the question is what system for height adjustement? Mr wandles is neat as well as sophisticated. Steve Ramsey made a router table but shied at the Wandle one and built one on a screw thread. Not bad, works but does not have that finess. I have looked at others, sliding wedges. car jacks but I cant get the Mathias Wandle one out of my head. A peice of kit I would like is the Bandsaw I have one which cost me very little (£50.00) from B & Q It was in a sale at a knock down price, I had some vouchers and bought it on a Wednesday and got my OAP discount. I bought new blades and it does for what I use it for. Does take a bit of time to tune but I would like a more profesional saw. The Woodgear No 3 home made bandsaw also really impresses me and I was impressed with his article comparing his machine with his bought one. Just amazing!
I have a morticer which has more than paid for itself and I cut tenons on the DeWalt radial but they do not go plop!
The peice of kit I am saving up for is a thicknesser and the truth is a peice of kit must earn its corn and I think a thicknesser would save me money I cant see me saying to someone, I have made your gate and saying these are good mortises and do you know, when you pull it apart they go plop.

I have bought a Makita palm router. I have bought micro vernier calipers and a dial test indicator h dear.


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## JakeS

adzeman":2bh4jpmk said:


> The Woodgear No 3 home made bandsaw also really impresses me and I was impressed with his article comparing his machine with his bought one. Just amazing!



I'd have to say, if I were ever to build any of the Woodgears plans, the Bandsaw or the router lift are probably the ones I'd go for! Both things that would probably end up cheaper (and more satisfying, naturally!) to build than to just purchase or make do with an equivalent.


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## samurai

i just upload a new video of my hybrid pantorouter showing the best and easiest way to setup template for mortise and tenon.this way you can't go wrong.it's simple,easy,fastest and more important accuate.hope you guys would like my video please have a look.http://youtu.be/M7h-NKv7uas


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## bugbear

JakeS":19iyscbf said:


> RogerBoyle":19iyscbf said:
> 
> 
> 
> The answer is simple
> Most don't want to build one as they do not believe that they are capable of the precision that it requires and/or they think it's outside their comfort zone.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I'd be interested in building one just because it's really cool, but I don't know whether I can justify the time and expense it would take in terms of utility it would bring! It's a neat machine, sure, but I'd probably just use it for cutting M&T joints, and I can already do those with a router on a workmate without building a giant frame and pantograph mechanism.
> 
> So to me, it's like - I don't know, having a robot arm to fetch me beer. It may be a high-precision beer-fetching device, but it's probably marginally less safe than doing it myself and it would definitely cost a lot more. But I'd still be utterly fascinated to see someone build one from scratch!
Click to expand...


Agreed on all points, and well put sir!

BugBear


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## scott25

i think i going to make one off these babys i have far easten ply in the shed/workshop wot size would i need


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## mpooley

scott25":7w9jpjkq said:


> i think i going to make one off these babys i have far easten ply in the shed/workshop wot size would i need



Not sure exactly but not more than half a sheet if i remember correctly.

Mike


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## tsg

This is more of a reply about Woodgears rather than the original post. I have made the box joint jig, and I have the plans for the band saw and the pantorouter. I need (would like) a band saw so I think that will be next, but I am so fascinated (not sure if that is a word or if it is, whether it is spelt correctly) with the pantorouter, it has just got to be done. I've got an old bosch 500W router that would be ideal, I think.


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## mpooley

tsg":3ke66in9 said:


> This is more of a reply about Woodgears rather than the original post. I have made the box joint jig, and I have the plans for the band saw and the pantorouter. I need (would like) a band saw so I think that will be next, but I am so fascinated (not sure if that is a word or if it is, whether it is spelt correctly) with the pantorouter, it has just got to be done. I've got an old bosch 500W router that would be ideal, I think.



Do it - you know you want to lol

I look forward to seiing it =D> 

mike


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## Hutzul

I found this topic/thread very interesting, and thanks for the photos and general advice of those who have built one, you are very inspirational =D> =D> 
This is in my list of stuff to make, but still setting up my workshop and getting rid of clutter or useful junk as I prefer to call it :roll:


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