# am I becoming a plane nut?



## condeesteso (15 Jul 2011)

What is one? I've just been wondering, having decided to go after a US Stanley No7 with corrugated sole.
Is there a test to determine if I am becoming one?

- do I have more planes than I really need to make things with? (I'm on the cusp)

- do i spend significant time tuning them, then testing on pieces of scrap? Do we all do that anyway? (I definitely spend more time sharpening and tuning than is necessary)

- do I buy planes when there are other tool gaps in the workshop that would be better filled? (probably).

Someone out there will know of some really serious cases...


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## Racers (15 Jul 2011)

Hi, Douglas

You are on the slope and there is no way of getting off (well no easy way) just hang on and enjoy the ride.

Pete


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## Mike Wingate (15 Jul 2011)

Enjoy it. Is it better than train/plane spotting?


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## SteveB43 (15 Jul 2011)

It's the whole workings vs machining wood debate to me, they're addictive those planes...
(Stanley 4, 50, 71, 78, 79) Record 5 & 6, Clifton 3in1. it's only the fiscal barrier stopping a flood of Veritas and Toms' finest....


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## woodbloke (15 Jul 2011)

Mike Wingate":34r6zqow said:


> Enjoy it. Is it better than train/plane spotting?


You've forgotton Stobbart spotting 8-[  - Rob


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## Scouse (15 Jul 2011)

condeesteso":1x6h65ii said:


> What is one? I've just been wondering, having decided to go after a US Stanley No7 with corrugated sole.
> Is there a test to determine if I am becoming one?



There is no test, because there is no such thing as a plane nut. Just ignore it, the urge (wink) will go away and you will be able (twitch) to carry on with your normal (WAYHEY!!!) life.

It's really not a problem, as the opening few seconds of this video of a plane aficionado will demonstrate.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BJVmecTLQ0k

See? Perfectly normal in every way.


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## jimi43 (15 Jul 2011)

I have so many planes I am in need of an ATC! :mrgreen: 

Of all the hand tools...planes are the most diverse, useful, beautiful, tactile and simply gorgeous extensions of the craftsman's hands.

And that whoosh of a finely tuned plane with a sharpened iron has simply no equal in the "relaxing sounds to make you happy" stakes. It's out there alongside whales. :wink: 

As I said earlier today...I don't like the No.7C....I don't know why...the sole reminds me of a cheap shed! :mrgreen: I think they are a bit quirky..but whatever rocks your boat. Personally...I would go for a lovely old Record...one of the first ones...Stay Set if possible and upgrade the iron.....oops...hang on...I've got one...scrub that!  

Good luck with your disease...hope you manage it with care...it's terminal I'm afraid! :mrgreen: 

Jim


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## markturner (15 Jul 2011)

hey Doug, I think you know the answer to the question...it's like the old anti heroin adverts from the eighties ( you remember.." I'm not an addict..I've just got a bit of a cold..." :wink: 

You are soooo busted!!!

But you are amongst friends! Sheesh, i only got started in January, and thought then " well, there's only numbers 1 -8, and 1 & 2 are out of the question, so that's only 6 planes to maybe collect... then I discovered that there were types for each number. I have now started collecting the types.... Oh woe is me........and I am only on the Stanleys......


Cheers, Mark


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## jimi43 (15 Jul 2011)

Ha Mark! I think it is thee that be busted! Good on ya mate! :mrgreen: 

I think the EUREKA moment for me was when I started to pick up the right plane for the right job instinctively. Ok, I'm not talking about a jointer instead of a block plane...but just knowing when a No.4 would be better than a No.5 or relying on my chariot rather than the 60 1/2 for certain endgrain work....

Of course close types will all do similar jobs ok...but one will do it superbly.

Don't forget Mark...once you get all the numbers...you will start to branch out into the specialist planes...then the spokeshaves...different makers...antiques....woodies....

He he he! :mrgreen: 

Jimi


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## Fat ferret (15 Jul 2011)

How many planes does one actually need? I have 5 and considere that one too many, I have 2 no4s, one I use, 1950's record and one was given to me, a 60's stanley. I decided I prefer records to stanleys and so I got a record no5 and a double ended block plane to go with them. Recently I bought a record no 50s combi plane to go with them. I am not an experienced wood worker but I have made a few bits of furniture with them and I don't really think I need any others. Although my no 5 still needs a new sole if anybodys got one going spare? The local blacksmith had a bash at welding the broken sole, did a good job considering but its not exactly flat, works ok though. 

I supose if I wanted to make mouldings a few wooden moulding planes would be good and if I wanted to join long edges a no 7 might be handy but I get by with four planes. How many planes can be justified before you are a colector? One of each number? And while we are at it what do the wide ones, no4 1/2 for instance do that the standard ones can't? Any thoughts.


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## jimi43 (15 Jul 2011)

I don't use my No.3 much but I use all the others...and enjoy them all.

Jim


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## condeesteso (15 Jul 2011)

Hi all, and Mr Turner in particular... I am consoled by the possibility that others are in deeper trouble than me. I do have a bit of a cold, but for my cold, your pneumonia!!

Anyway, I made a breakthrough tonight... sort of. I was playing with a block plane (again) and suddenly realised - never mind the shavings, look at the stock. The shavings are thrown away, it's the piece you cut that matters. So from now on, I will attend to the stock, not the shavings... it's a start I feel.

Am I on the way to correction?? (and I will get that No7 corrugated Rule and Level, circa 1920... oh yes.) Fixed you see. Truly fixed.

ps - re the 4 1/2 - you need one of those otherwise the gap between the 4 and 5 is too big. More seriously ask Jim - he has a small plane problem, and a very fine 4 1/2 Record. Actually I'd just say it's a great heavier smoother with a tads more width. But Jim'll set you on the road to recovery.


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## dibs (16 Jul 2011)

I have a single Stanley, no idea if it has a number, from memory, the sole is 10-12"long, bought it 25 years ago whilst living in Canada. "Jack plane comes to mind, don't know if that's right though. Tried it once, put it back in its box. Been there ever since, though the box is much faded now. I have 2 electric planes, can't get on with them either and they too gather dust. I do have a thicknesser and surface planer, various routers/cutters that meet my needs. Can't understand this plane thing, though, according to the wife, the 12 various corded/cordless drills I have are far too many. I haven't told her about the other drills, she'd only worry. Planes? Not for me, but each to their own. Rick.


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## jimi43 (16 Jul 2011)

Don't worry Rick...we won't tell anyone! :mrgreen: 

You are actually doing the future generations a service. 

Without your forefathers in 1932, some would not be able to say "got it at a bootfair for a quid....bloke said his grandad just bought it and stuck it in a cupboard....it's been there ever since!"

My grandkids will be happy..... :wink: 

Jim


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## Alf (16 Jul 2011)

Fat ferret":11d91xm7 said:


> How many planes does one actually need?


Just as many as you have to have in order to make the voices stop suggesting things like "If you wanted to make mouldings a few wooden moulding planes would be good, and if you wanted to join long edges a no 7 might be handy." That's in the early stages though. Later the voices tend to say things more like "My precious. My precious. Must have precious" :wink:


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## Sawyer (16 Jul 2011)

Planophilia is incurable, I'm afraid. It's not too difficult to live with though!



jimi43":g1rrpmlk said:


> I have so many planes I am in need of an ATC! :mrgreen:
> 
> Of all the hand tools...planes are the most diverse, useful, beautiful, tactile and simply gorgeous extensions of the craftsman's hands.
> 
> ...



I don't disagree, Jim, but at this point must put in a word for saws. Not as diverse perhaps, but the song of a good quality, well sharpened hand saw, is right up there with the planing experience.

By the way, despite my username, I love planes too and they outnumber my collection of saws.


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## Fat ferret (16 Jul 2011)

Alf":3ahcedok said:


> Fat ferret":3ahcedok said:
> 
> 
> > How many planes does one actually need?
> ...



Ah but see I don't want to make mouldings or join long edges just yet, if I do I will get them. I can see planes are interesting and if people want to collect them good for them but I can't envisage any situation that would require any other planes than the ones I mentioned. 

Still not quite sure why I need a 4 1/2, or a 5 1/2 for that matter?


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## Corset (16 Jul 2011)

Its not just planes.. I have about 2 mitre boxes by stanley, some by millers fall, and a craftsman and about six saws that I have aquired. I have no idea why i need them. I just do.
The only down side is the saws take a long time to sharpen due to the size of them.
Mind you I am selling my festool saw as i have bought to many planes by veritas


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## jimi43 (16 Jul 2011)

Corset":1tkqx44n said:


> Its not just planes.. I have about 2 mitre boxes by stanley, some by millers fall, and a craftsman and about six saws that I have aquired. I have no idea why i need them. I just do.
> The only down side is the saws take a long time to sharpen due to the size of them.
> Mind you I am selling my festool saw as i have bought to many planes by veritas



Good man! =D> 

Jim


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## Alf (16 Jul 2011)

Corset":30dzq79h said:


> Its not just planes.. I have about 2 mitre boxes by stanley, some by millers fall, and a craftsman


So _that's_ where they all are!


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## Vann (17 Jul 2011)

Fat ferret":2lh3ip0z said:


> Still not quite sure why I need a 4 1/2, or a 5 1/2 for that matter?


Look, there's no point in fighting the inevitable - you just NEED a 4½ and a 5½.

You said it yourself


Fat ferret":2lh3ip0z said:


> ...I need a 4 1/2, or a 5 1/2...


 (hammer) 

Cheers, Vann.


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## Fat ferret (17 Jul 2011)

Vann":1ugqkuw8 said:


> Fat ferret":1ugqkuw8 said:
> 
> 
> > Still not quite sure why I need a 4 1/2, or a 5 1/2 for that matter?
> ...


 (hammer) 

Cheers, Vann.[/quote

:lol: Seriously though what do the extra wide planes do that the standard ones don't? Ok so you remove more with one swipe but what else?


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## Racers (17 Jul 2011)

Hi, Mr ferret

They have mass so knots etc don't slow them down they carry on regardless (wasn't that a film) just wait untill you get a No8.

4 1/2 and 5 1/2 are my go to planes, or my No8.

Pete


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## condeesteso (19 Jul 2011)

re thread title... it appears I am. Just nicked a No6 SS Record for £36. The devil is just around the corner. I plan to hot it up a little... but that sounds like an excuse, doesn't it?


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## jimi43 (20 Jul 2011)

condeesteso":2hqbfz82 said:


> re thread title... it appears I am. Just nicked a No6 SS Record for £36. The devil is just around the corner. I plan to hot it up a little... but that sounds like an excuse, doesn't it?



I think you should also list the other planes you have....it's no use just pretending you have two you know.

Every collector worth his salt has at _*least*_ three No.4s and one in bits in the workshop!

:mrgreen: 

Well done on your find...it is an older one...SS which is always a premium.

Don't forget to get steel toecap boots because the Stay-Set caps do fall on your feet...a _*major*_ drawback of this type of cap iron! :roll: :mrgreen: 

Jim


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## Alf (20 Jul 2011)

jimi43":10zk2ont said:


> Every collector worth his salt has at _*least*_ three No.4s and one in bits in the workshop!


There, I knew I wasn't a collector. :wink: 

SS? Bad luck - as Jim says, watch your toes.


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## Mike Wingate (20 Jul 2011)

True, I just found another no 4 in a toolbox of mine carrying my Laminated Japanese laminated blade. , maybe 5 no 4's. 3 5's, 2 short 5's one with the Cosman blade,1 x 3, 1 x 4 /2, 1 x 5 1/2, 1 x 6 and 1 x 7. I am a user not a collector.


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## jimi43 (20 Jul 2011)

Mike Wingate":2zg9wxrc said:


> True, I just found another no 4 in a toolbox of mine carrying my Laminated Japanese laminated blade. , maybe 5 no 4's. 3 5's, 2 short 5's one with the Cosman blade,1 x 3, 1 x 4 /2, 1 x 5 1/2, 1 x 6 and 1 x 7. I am a user not a collector.



Hey Mike..if I agree you aren't a collector...will you support me in my case against the cause! :mrgreen: 

I fear though...that with that list above...you may have to plea bargain!!

Question for you though...is the No.6 ever used or is it as Patrick would say..."I am not a plane...I'm a number!" :mrgreen: 

Jim


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## condeesteso (20 Jul 2011)

OK, so we've had: " I'm not an addict..I've just got a bit of a cold..." and then we have: I'm a user, not a collector"
There's an undercurrent running here... remember the Shakespeare "Thou doest protest too much"??

Question - what actually is a No6 for? I've bought one and I'm a 'user' of course, so I need to be able to tell people (maybe just myself) what I needed it for.


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## markturner (20 Jul 2011)

The Number 6? It's for when a 7 is just too big and a five is just too small......easy :wink:


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## condeesteso (20 Jul 2011)

Mark - I have to thank you for your considerable help this evening  So the 6 fills the gap between the 5 and 7 (no s**t Sherlock), and you have likely cost me a few hundred on a tail vice that I did know I wanted, but could never explain why. A good evening's work, I'd say. Beer sometime, by way of thanks?


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## Alf (21 Jul 2011)

I think you'll find the #6 fills the gap between the #5 1/2 and the #7. Let's not neglect the fractions, kids. [-X 

More seriously, there is some mildly convincing argument that the #6 is the ideal plane for the shooting board.


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## dunbarhamlin (21 Jul 2011)

I use my 7 as a joinery and finishing plane, and my 6 as a roughing and truing plane.
I use my 3, 4 1/2, 5 1/2 and CS88 as finishing planes (mmm just might be couple more than necessary there - but they're GREEN and so politically correct.)
I use my 4 and 5 for roughing and truing smaller stuff. I'll justify both by admitting a preference for the largest tool suitable for the job at hand. The green argument also applies.
My T5 gets used for shooting. It isn't green 
Titchy planes are like gouges. the more the merrier. But I admit nothing. And anyway they're shiny. But with thumb prints.


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## woodbloke (21 Jul 2011)

Alf":3ud7zicc said:


> SS? Bad luck - as Jim says, watch your toes.


 [-( :-# :-" :mrgreen: - Rob


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## Mike Wingate (21 Jul 2011)

I use my no.6 as a jointer for guitar bodies and laminated necks as well as other stuff. I have only just got the no.7 and will use it as a proper jointer when it is restored, with a Japanese Laminated steel blade and undecided about the chipbreaker.


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## condeesteso (21 Jul 2011)

Hi Woodbloke - re the often stated 'mind your toes' - are we referring to the loose bit of the 2 part cap iron?? Damn, I drop toast on me toes that weighs more than that. Experts on the hazards of SS Records, please explain.


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## jimi43 (21 Jul 2011)

condeesteso":1m1gx3w6 said:


> Hi Woodbloke - re the often stated 'mind your toes' - are we referring to the loose bit of the 2 part cap iron?? Damn, I drop toast on me toes that weighs more than that. Experts on the hazards of SS Records, please explain.



Douglas...please rearrange the following words:

Can a opening you worms of are.... :mrgreen: #-o 

Jim


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## matthewwh (21 Jul 2011)

Simple steps to establish whether you are a collector or a user:

Check out Aces and Eights recent post of a trainwrecked 604 with a sidewing smashed off and a crack extending across the side of the mouth that sold for $235.38 on eBay.

If words like 'Bargain', 'Drat' and 'Jammy Buyer' spring into your mind - you are a collector. 

If you are thinking - 'How Much...?', 'Jammy Seller' or 'I'll keep an eye out for one of those, flog it to collector and buy a whole suite of gooduns' - you're a user.

Just because you have a couple of duplicates doesn't make you a collector - just an enthusiatically acquisitive user.


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## condeesteso (21 Jul 2011)

Jim - funny, yes. Explanation, no.


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## jimi43 (21 Jul 2011)

condeesteso":192uqacv said:


> Jim - funny, yes. Explanation, no.



Hang around a while Douglas and Rob will be along with an explanation....

8) 

Jim


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## Vann (22 Jul 2011)

condeesteso":lnrd6zq2 said:


> Hi Woodbloke - re the often stated 'mind your toes' - are we referring to the loose bit of the 2 part cap iron?? Damn, I drop toast on me toes that weighs more than that. Experts on the hazards of SS Records, please explain.


Can't wait for Woodbloke, he'll only have bad things to say.

SS Records (and Cliftons) - some people love 'em, some hate 'em. 

The downside of the "stay-set" cap iron is, when you pull out the irons, the 'deflector' will probably fall off and get lost in the shaving under your bench. That can be avoided by training yourself to put a finger on the 'deflector' as you pull out the irons (thanks for that tip Paul C.). Also, I don't believe you can retain the 'set' of your plane - but some people claim to be able to.

The upside is the good thickness (also obtainable with L-N, LV, etc. one-piece cap-irons), and the flat, hinged, design which is probably the single best design out there to hold yoiur cutting iron flat onto the frog.

Or at least that's my take on the matter...

Cheers, Vann.


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## bugbear (22 Jul 2011)

matthewwh":2z3u6inp said:


> If you are thinking - 'How Much...?', 'Jammy Seller' or 'I'll keep an eye out for one of those, flog it to collector and buy a whole suite of gooduns' - you're a user.



"Dealer", I think.

BugBear


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## Paul Chapman (22 Jul 2011)

condeesteso":py74edix said:


> Experts on the hazards of SS Records, please explain.



The two-piece (as Clifton call it) or Stay-set (as Record call it) cap iron was designed by Record many years ago. Record and Stanley plane blades are thin and the conventional cap iron, which is a crudely-made piece of bent metal, can bend thin blades as the cap iron nut is screwed tight. This prevents the blade from seating properly on the plane frog and can lead to chatter when planing. The Stay-set cap iron is in two pieces and is much thicker than the bent metal type. There is a fixed piece which is screwed to the blade and a removable part which locates on the fixed part via a couple of slots and a location pin. The slots and the pin prevent the removable part from "falling off" unless you turn the blade upside down and don't put a finger on the removable part. The whole arrangement helps to keep the blade nice and flat and well seated on the frog, thereby avoiding any chatter. The advantages of the cap iron are most noticeable if you use thin blades. 

I have Stay-set cap irons fitted to all my bench planes because I reckon it's the best-designed cap iron out there. I've never dropped one but there are some who like to create the impression that the removable part has a way of somehow leaping up and crashing to the floor, injuring their toes on the way. Derek in Oz and Woodbloke over here seem to hate them with a passion but I don't know why.

Hope this explanation is helpful.

Cheers :wink: 

Paul


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## GazPal (22 Jul 2011)

Paul Chapman":f5evyg7y said:


> condeesteso":f5evyg7y said:
> 
> 
> > Experts on the hazards of SS Records, please explain.
> ...



An excellent explanation Paul and another vote for Stay-Set cap irons from me too.  I've been using Stay-Set for quite a number of years now and find them the most effective cap iron to use and far less fussy than other types of cap iron when it boils down to touching up an edge, regrinding a primary bevel and adding a good degree of heft to manufacturer's stock blades.


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## Alf (22 Jul 2011)

matthewwh":1eoz3nl0 said:


> Simple steps to establish whether you are a collector or a user:
> 
> Check out Aces and Eights recent post of a trainwrecked 604 with a sidewing smashed off and a crack extending across the side of the mouth that sold for $235.38 on eBay.
> 
> ...


What are you if you can't actually bear to look at the poor thing and have to turn away? 8-[ 

As for two-piece cap irons, they have a magnetic attraction to the floor and the deepest covering of shavings; it's a proven fact. 

Well it's a fact.

Okay, so it always happens to me anyway. That makes it a proven fact in my book. :wink: Anyway cap irons are so last century. Bevel-up and you need never endanger your tootsies ever again.


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## condeesteso (22 Jul 2011)

Excellent Paul - I have one (Clifton) on a record No4 and rate it, there's one on the No6 coming any day now (original Record). If the only down-side is it comes off, I think I can deal with that! The structural arguments in favour make me a supporter.
(See Jim... that's how it's done, that explaining thing


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## Paul Chapman (22 Jul 2011)

Alf":zr2riyx2 said:


> Anyway cap irons are so last century.



OK, I know I'm old but no need to rub it in........ :lol: 

Cheers :wink: 

Paul


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## jimi43 (22 Jul 2011)

condeesteso":2evz4m30 said:


> (See Jim... that's how it's done, that explaining thing



You just wait...if you think such a bland reasoning is going to get you off lightly with this lot you are sadly mistaken! :mrgreen: :mrgreen: :mrgreen: 

Jim


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## condeesteso (22 Jul 2011)

Right, we need some pics to lift this a bit.
Got the No6 SS Record (£36 remember). Note that I plan to use it as a semi-scrub. So a fair camber, and aggressive cuts.
Blade has loads on it... probably because no-one has ever really known what to use a 6 for. The primary was 'multi-bevel', which is apparently in vogue again these days (not down my way).
Sole was / is super-flat (again, why did the guy even buy a 6 in the first place?).
So a 25 degree primary, with a jig so it's all 25 degrees, I just like them like that. Fair bit of camber on the primary too.
Then, radical (??) a 35 secondary, and a widish one at that. Reasons: got bored making the perfect all-through primary, and the steeper and deeper secondary should support the edge better.
Had to carefully hone the chipbreaker - it had a nick in it, but I think I kept the angles, and polished the upper to aid free flow of chips.
Bit of a clean-up, the tote was split and repaired in the usual place, but the repair was good, so a re-finish on knob and tote (this is not a collector piece, and we are all users, remember).
It's good. Rips deep cuts off pine, cuts wild grain v well (oak) and the mouth is wide at the moment. And it can do the wafery stuff too (see pic).
Conclusion - nice, if you like that kind of thing.


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## jimi43 (22 Jul 2011)

Bit of radical engineering there Douglas my friend!

And for that price...it's an open field for play really...

I have a feeling that you have plans for this little Record....and the iron is a good one so I am sure it will be fit for purpose....

It might take a bit more to convince me of the purpose of that particular cardinal but a scrub seems the most appropriate.

Cheers for sharing....mind yer toes! And remember to sweep the shavings from under the bench before you hone it :mrgreen: :wink: 

Jim


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## matthewwh (22 Jul 2011)

Alf":12bg69ws said:


> What are you if you can't actually bear to look at the poor thing and have to turn away?



A desperately incurable romantic???

Glad I'm not the only one who will be buried with their planes and a toolguard VCI clenched between their teeth lest they should rust before some future Baldrick and his merry chums come along to enquire what you did with your life!


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## condeesteso (22 Jul 2011)

re steel toe caps etc - I was taught many years ago that when removing or refitting a blade to a plane, rest the heel of sole on bench, hold toe in left hand (assuming right-handed). tilt plane to 45 degrees then release lever cap, lift blade assembly out WITHOUT blade edge touching mouth / frog.
Not dropped a 2 part cap yet (but it's still early days for me on the 2 part thing). Good practice nevertheless, says so in the Bible.


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## woodbloke (23 Jul 2011)

jimi43":1somvgd7 said:


> condeesteso":1somvgd7 said:
> 
> 
> > Jim - funny, yes. Explanation, no.
> ...


It's a me thing! Two piece cap irons are just about the most irritating thing :twisted: :twisted: on God's green earth...apart from drivers with mobiles stuck to their ears - Rob


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## Alf (23 Jul 2011)

condeesteso":3khcht5m said:


> re steel toe caps etc - I was taught many years ago that when removing or refitting a blade to a plane, rest the heel of sole on bench, hold toe in left hand (assuming right-handed). tilt plane to 45 degrees then release lever cap, lift blade assembly out WITHOUT blade edge touching mouth / frog.


Then turn over iron and two-piece cap iron assembly to loosen screw and... Damn, I forgot and it's dropped off again. #-o 

At least that's how I remember it going.

Matthew, desperately incurable romantic? Yeah, probably.


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## dunbarhamlin (23 Jul 2011)

Alf":uilw00hi said:


> Then turn over iron and two-piece cap iron assembly to loosen screw and... Damn, I forgot _I don't need to do that_


Fixed


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## Sawyer (23 Jul 2011)

Paul Chapman said:


> I have Stay-set cap irons fitted to all my bench planes because I reckon it's the best-designed cap iron out there. I've never dropped one but there are some who like to create the impression that the removable part has a way of somehow leaping up and crashing to the floor, injuring their toes on the way. Derek in Oz and Woodbloke over here seem to hate them with a passion but I don't know why.
> Paul



I have a mixture so sometimes forget and end up dropping the stay set. My toes are none the worse for it though. :lol:


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## matthewwh (23 Jul 2011)




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## Paul Chapman (23 Jul 2011)

:lol: :lol:


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## condeesteso (24 Jul 2011)

"apart from drivers with mobiles stuck to their ears"

Rob, down my way they're breeding. And they are almost all so called yummy mummies, driving auto 4 x 4s, blonde (they cannot all really be blonde surely... matching collar and cuffs and everything?). And the worst time of day is on the way back from their school run in the morning, planning the golf, shopping etc with their pals. The guys in the white vans are saints compared to that lot.
Give me a 2-piece any day.

p.s.... and here's another thing. Just how wide do you think an XC90 is, I mean just roughly?


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## woodbloke (24 Jul 2011)

condeesteso":3h5fcsoi said:


> "apart from drivers with mobiles stuck to their ears"
> 
> Rob, down my way they're breeding. And they are almost all so called yummy mummies, driving auto 4 x 4s, blonde (they cannot all really be blonde surely... matching collar and cuffs and everything?). And the worst time of day is on the way back from their school run in the morning, planning the golf, shopping etc with their pals. The guys in the white vans are saints compared to that lot.
> Give me a 2-piece any day.
> ...


A little bit OT but I did some research on this through ROSPRA (in connection with work) and if it can be proved that a death was caused by the use of a hand held mobile whilst driving, the sentence, depending on the circumstances and how the CPS bring charges, can be either a max of 2 or 5 years at HM pleasure _and_ an unlimited fine...if only they knew - Rob


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## Alf (24 Jul 2011)

dunbarhamlin":2dyezkcr said:


> Alf":2dyezkcr said:
> 
> 
> > Then turn over iron and two-piece cap iron assembly to loosen screw and... Damn, I forgot _I don't need to do that_
> ...


See? That's it exactly. It's unnatural. Every other cap iron in the world conforms, but these two-piece monstrosities? Tsk. 

And I like Marmite, but I don't _love_ it. I'm not _that_ desperately incurably romantic... :lol:


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## dunbarhamlin (24 Jul 2011)

Hehehe - perhaps every cap iron in the world beyond the confines of my bench.
Can't deny having the opposite flash of confusion when going to touch up an iron with an oldy woldy cap.


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## woodbloke (28 Jul 2011)

vwjetta":aymycf0g said:


> hey condeesteso, you mention you nicked a number 6 record ss, on ebay was it? was it from greg141279 on 07/19/11
> if so you are infact a complete barsteward hows that for my first post :twisted:


Distincntly unimpressive...post reported - Rob


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## CHJ (28 Jul 2011)

vwjetta":288ud1g0 said:


> ******* hows that for my first post :twisted:


Good enough for your last.


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## condeesteso (28 Jul 2011)

a quiet retrospective. That might have been me, placing the highest bid. A fine plane will find its true home.


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## Vann (28 Jul 2011)

Alf":snwv0pl8 said:


> condeesteso":snwv0pl8 said:
> 
> 
> > re steel toe caps etc - I was taught many years ago that when removing or refitting a blade to a plane, rest the heel of sole on bench, hold toe in left hand (assuming right-handed). tilt plane to 45 degrees then release lever cap, lift blade assembly out WITHOUT blade edge touching mouth / frog.
> ...


Well this one seems to have the opposite problem:



I bought this last evening (yes this is a gloat - $NZ36.50 = ~ £17). The previous owner has obviously kept the 'deflector' but had the upper section drop off into that void in the universe :? 

Cheers, Vann.

ps Photo from "Trademe" (NZ's e-bay). I still have to pay and arrange for my brother to collect and post to me - so I won't see it for a week or three...


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## jimi43 (28 Jul 2011)

Vann...you are officially now....totally and utterly bonkers!!!! :wink: 

Welcome to the club my friend! :mrgreen: 

Oh...and CHJ...class mate...pure unadulterated class! =D> 

Jimi


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## Vann (29 Jul 2011)

jimi43":28jheo5q said:


> Vann...you are officially now....totally and utterly bonkers!!!! :wink:


Thank jimi. In these circles I know that's a compliment  

Cheers, Vann.


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## jimi43 (29 Jul 2011)

Vann":2ssj2c8s said:


> jimi43":2ssj2c8s said:
> 
> 
> > Vann...you are officially now....totally and utterly bonkers!!!! :wink:
> ...



Indeed it is my antipodean buddy! :mrgreen: 

That has to be the "best" "before" picture I have ever seen....

Can hardly wait for the "after" pics!

Jim


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## condeesteso (4 Aug 2011)

Guilty... yes, I bought a Record 4 1/2 SS on ebay, today. Want it, not sure I need it, but certainly know I won it by offering the highest price. No hard feelings I hope 
An aside - I have discovered I really rate SS planes. The no6 I have has been working hard and very well.


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## condeesteso (7 Aug 2011)

(my thread now! Lonely like a long distance runner) - this is what they made 'em for. Never mind that girly stuff with air-thin shavings (oops, forgot to look at the stock). Bench-top needed a dressing... more to do, but the 6 with a semi-scrub on the original blade. The old blue was dropping off so nicked a bit of Hammerite Dark Blue from Jim. A bit dressed-up but it works so well it does not need to apologise.
Roll on the SS 4 1/2... will start by tuning it to super-smoother, original blade... see how I get on.


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## jimi43 (7 Aug 2011)

HI Douglas

That's looking smart! I think that the Hammerite Dark Blue is definitely the closest to what I think a Record plane should look like.

Strangely I was in B&Q today...(it's ok..I wasn't buying tools or wood...just a bulb!)....and I chanced upon the Irvin range of curdled Cheddar...which encompasses Marples and Record with the sub-branding added...and lo and behold...they are bright blue.

I think they lost the formula along with the directions to Sheffield! Yuck!

Anyway...it's looking good...

Jim


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## Recky33 (8 Aug 2011)

Halfords seem to be having a sale of Hammerite Dark Blue ATM,

http://www.halfords.com/webapp/wcs/stor ... yId_165495

Allan


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## condeesteso (6 Sep 2011)

Don't like to see a thread die. Here's a couple of U.S. Stanleys recently acquired because I need them. A basic No4 that was cheap (by my standards) at under a tenner. I need to date it but is it 30's-ish, with Stanley on the lever cap??
The closer one is a bit more exciting (and a few bob more) - a really clean well cared for Rule & Level 10 1/2... a stunner. Marked J W Lawson on the tote. In particular the knob and tote are really fine, loads of blade, nice sole etc. I wanted one because ages ago I watched Roy Underhill wielding one... that is a rather thin excuse, is it not?


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## jimi43 (6 Sep 2011)

Hi Douglas

That 10 1/2 is a nice example...I have never understood why they were not more popular...

Looking forward to seeing it.

Jim


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## Scouse (6 Sep 2011)

I keep an eye out for one of those 10 1/2 jobbies because I need one too; can't quite remember why, but I do anyway... 

The price always puts me off, but I'm expecting a Paramo No.10 Planemaster to drop through the letter box in the next day or two, so that's the same thing isn't it? ISN'T IT??? #-o


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## condeesteso (6 Sep 2011)

"can't quite remember why". Same problem - actually I get very bored with UK television, so I just get on ebay and buy things** (or comment here and annoy people, either way beats TV).
Ellis - it could be effectively the same... but mine LOOKS really great. So I win, yes?
I'll give it a tune asap, and report.

** would be a bit smarter if I got on ebay and SOLD things (wife told me to tell you that). And yes, I still have one.


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## Mike Wingate (6 Sep 2011)

I am having to redrill and tap the rear handle attachment and brass cap on my No.7 for 6mm and make a new threaded bar, may use studding. Just bought an old, black Stanley 78 in it's box. Looks brand new.


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## Scouse (8 Sep 2011)

condeesteso":1lgcfxk5 said:


> Ellis - it could be effectively the same... but mine LOOKS really great. So I win, yes?



Them's fightin' words! We could play 'Rebate Plane Top Trumps'; Paramo Planemaster... Number of spare blades... 5! By any reasonable measure of quality that means mine is 5 better than yours, so I win after all!

It arrived yesterday, all £1.70's worth






I don't think it has ever been used, it even still has the paper Design Centre sticker on the handle, and I know it makes me a collector, but I think I might keep it that way.






The bloke I got it off said it belonged to his dad, but it was still in the greaseproof wrapping paper. It is a bit of an oddball in a sea of Baileys, but I can see what they were trying to achieve; it is a clever design, if poorly executed.

Oh, and the blades are resharpenable, the leaflet says that you can send off for a blade honing guide for three shillings and sixpence in postal orders, so I'll do that tomorrow...


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## Alf (8 Sep 2011)

I would love to say it's a thing of beauty, but my nose would hit the monitor and that _hurts_. But it is a pristine example of the type, and if you've got to have one, why not a shiny one?



Scouse":2559jxnq said:


> Them's fightin' words! We could play 'Rebate Plane Top Trumps'


Ooo, Hand Plane Top Trumps; I like it. We should totally work out some categories for that. It'd keep our more schoolboy-minded members happy for hours; I can just imagine Jacob's triumph if he bested a Holtey with a old woodie jack.


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## Richard T (8 Sep 2011)

Oh 'El! 8-[


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## Scouse (8 Sep 2011)

If Alf said it's a thing of beauty (and she did, if you ignore the other extraneous words she used... :-" ) that's enough for me!



Richard T":2s5okv50 said:


> Oh 'El! 8-[



You sound like my mum! There's a related question on your infill thread, Richard...

I wouldn't be surprised if there was a goldrush to buy Planemasters now, like when Chris Schwarz tells Americans to buy plough planes etc...

El.


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## Richard T (8 Sep 2011)

If you ignore the other extraneous words she used .... like "of" and "beauty" we're left with "It's a thing." And I couldn't agree more.

Really though, it would be interesting to see how a "proper stuff" chap such as yourself gets on with using one. Not quite as much fun, maybe, as watching Jacob driving an infill but interesting nevertheless.


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## jimi43 (8 Sep 2011)

Ok....don't worry Scouse mate...I will PM you the name of a good psychiatrist..... :mrgreen: :wink: 

Jim


.....no wait...if you just take that top bit off and then...um...no scratch that...um...if you were to take lever A and fit it to...nah...ok...PM sent! :mrgreen:


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## condeesteso (9 Sep 2011)

Actually Ellis you are right, I concede. Five blades, it's a bit of a looker and it cost less than the Stanley. But does Roy Underhill use one. I think not :wink:


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## Scouse (9 Sep 2011)

condeesteso":11ga65il said:


> But does Roy Underhill use one. I think not :wink:



He has got one, but he keeps quiet so the price of spare blades won't go up; 3 shillings is a weeks wages, you know... :wink: :mrgreen:


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## condeesteso (9 Sep 2011)

Only one real conclusion here Ellis.

It's a thing.

Cherish the thing.


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## condeesteso (22 Dec 2011)

Re-activating an old thread. Just got given an early English Stanley 4 1/2. Not at all bad!! Laminated blade, nice stiff cap. Nasty stained beech knob & tote, but working rather well. I have some very nice cherry set aside for a new tote and knob, but I need one of Liogier's smaller rasps to profile the tote. That will be ordered soon, then I plan to smarten this plane up a bit. Then probably sell it on as it's one too many. Will post pics when I can start the tote etc. No respect to originality here, just make it look fab.
The Marples woodie jointer recently acquired for £10 and is working v well... massive blade and cap, sole was untrue (slight twist) but soon sorted with the Lie 62 (ironic, that).
But the early Stanley... Made in England indeed. Well I should have one of those at least and it does work very well!


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## jimi43 (22 Dec 2011)

Unusual for you to venture over the Pond for ancient Stanleys Douglas.... :mrgreen: 

I must say...your tuning of the old woodie jointer did you proud...just as it should be...or better!

For now I am totally avoiding the "woodie slope".....that's deeper than the Mariana Trench!

Jim

:deer


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## Scouse (23 Dec 2011)

I've no experience with English Stanleys, tending more toward Records, so it will be interesting to see how it turns out. 

The general consensus on here in the past has been that they were ever so slightly not as good as their blue competitors and slightly more not as good as their US stablemates. Having said that I do have a soft spot for a sad old car boot Acorn no.5, apparently made by Stanley as a cheaper alternative, but it just gets used for roughing.



jimi43":2iid7345 said:


> For now I am totally avoiding the "woodie slope".....



Sounds like you are already at base camp for that slope and planning an assault on 'Denial Ridge'!!! :mrgreen: 

El.


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## Richard T (23 Dec 2011)

Douglas wrote " I need one of Liogier's smaller rasps"

That's a great statement. I probably "need" three ....  
I'll see how the cash situation is after all this Christmas stuff.


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## RogerP (23 Dec 2011)

Scouse":mboiq9mr said:


> ...... The general consensus on here in the past has been that they were ever so slightly not as good as their blue competitors and slightly more not as good as their US stablemates.



For what it's worth the English Stanley 5 made casting is a little thicker so the plane that is slightly heavier than the USA counterpart. The number 5 is the only model I have both US and English variants.


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## condeesteso (23 Dec 2011)

Yes, it's an odd one as all my old planes (indeed all the new ones too :wink: ) are American. Only exceptions were 2 excellent Records, both SS, a 4 1/2 and a 6. Anyway will see how good it can be got, and make it pretty. Damn, it's just cost me 2 Liogiers under the excuse banner that I needed the half-round to make the tote. So I'm a hundred quid down and I can blame this Stanley... 
Anyway, season's greetings to all the plane nuts out there.


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## Benchwayze (26 Dec 2011)

Ahuuum! We can easily have more tools than we need, but we can never have too many that we don't 


John :ho2


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## condeesteso (28 Dec 2011)

Here's the Stan 4 1/2 then. I couldn't wait for the Liogiers so struggled on the tote with nasty old machined rasps etc.






Spent the first while tuning til I was happy it actually worked OK, only then would I spend time on a knob and tote. But it works well - the blade is a nice laminate, cap seating very well, frog well-bedded etc. Sole was near flat but a tads high at toe, so got lapped, It's set-up as a smoother with slight camber, but can take 15 thou shavings happily (it's hard work though, a calorie burner):





The knob is cherry from a large branch, hence knotty - but well seasoned and has character. The tote is cherry, off the end of a board and a bit wild. The grain works in favour of the tote shape though (note the grain flow over the top, where they usually break):





And here it is actually working for a living - flatting a 6 x 2 ash board 7 feet long:





Have to say I like it, and I am impressed with it's build and performance. I can't say it's better than the Record SS as I don't think it is. And I rate the SS blade assembly for stiffness. But it is rather good. They can be picked up very cheaply - recommended if you want a quality bargain and are happy doing a bit of tuning. The knob and tote work is obviously not necessary, but it sure looks pretty


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## No skills (28 Dec 2011)

Nice job.

8)


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## jimi43 (28 Dec 2011)

Just proves how nice these old classics can be when tarted up a bit.

I must say that cherry has some beautiful figuring and a very nice job with the shapes mate!

Excellent all around!

Jim


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## Richard T (29 Dec 2011)

Cracking job Douglas - that back handle looks the business for shape. Nice grain too. 

Having made practice handles from both straight board and the middle of a fork, I am firmly of the opinion that the more interesting and complicated the grain, the better it is for plane handles. As you mention, with good planning the horn can be very much stronger with mad grain than the usual swept - straight - back.


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## condeesteso (29 Dec 2011)

Thanks Jim and Skills. It got me out of the house over boxing day. Yes Richard - I think the messy grain all directions is a plus on the tote, just need to take a look and orientate the grain to best advantage. Having that piece around was more luck than judgement but I'd do that again (wild grain for a tote). It's a part of hand-made again I think, as production can't do that. Looking forward to getting some Liogiers as those cheap rasps are tricky - they track very badly.
b/t/w - saw blades on the way next day or two (hope the workshop's warmed up a bit). Ooooh, did you notice the plural there :wink: Pack in bulk - save the planet.


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