# Sous Vide Recipes. What are your best/favourite/proven uses? All suggestions welcome.



## Bm101 (2 Nov 2020)

Following from a previous thread about cooking wagyu steak.... I recently bought an Aldi sous vide machine. I've cooked a (rather extravagant) rib of beef in it for the first go which was possibly a bit daft but it was amazing. 6 hours at 52.5 and then rubbed it with salt, ground pepper and dried rosemary. Chucked it back in a hot oven for 15 minutes.
It was cooked perfectly rare wall to wall so to speak. Even the Mrs, not a great carnivore, went back_twice_ for more. I was astounded how good it was.
I also bought my first T Bone at the same local butcher and perhaps madly I also put that in. (Finished in the cast pan etc)I didn't get that quite right tbh. 
Moving forwards I'm back to far more affordable and usual joints. So I was interested in what you guys could afford me in the way of good advice and experience.
Today I picked up an aged Lidl joint of roasting beef. It looks quite nice. I haven't bought a beef joint in years due to constant dissappointments so I'm hoping the sous vide gives me an option to enjoy rare and tender beef again. Shooting at the stars with a pop gun possibly but I live in hope.
I also picked up a much more affordable gammon joint. Thinking of doing that with a balsamaic/brown sugar glaze that looks deadly.








Sous Vide City Ham With Balsamic Brown Sugar Glaze Recipe


Sous vide makes it easy to produce a juicy, evenly cooked Christmas or Easter ham. A dead-simple glaze of balsamic vinegar and brown sugar finishes it off.




www.seriouseats.com




Next up I'm going to try and get a bit of venison from her old mans butcher in Essex (lockdown allowing). Father in law cooks that every year at christmas and it's amazing. He makes a big show of carving the loin Every. Single.Year.
Be sweetly pleasing if I could quietly make him quieten down lol. (In a nice way... )
Open to any and all ideas. From rabbit to fish and vegetables. Not just the big meat dishes. We could all eat more healthily.
Also.... while on the subject does anyone smoke duck?
And any tried and tested bombproof websites for sous vide recipes?

Cheers guys, as always.
Chris


----------



## marcros (2 Nov 2020)

you could also get yourself a blow torch to finish steaks. A mate swears by it, I dont have a sous vide myself (yet)


----------



## Bm101 (2 Nov 2020)

Rather than the cast preheated iron pan ? I do have a rothenberger superfire 2 Mark. By coincidence.


----------



## Rorschach (2 Nov 2020)

Next time I do beef I am going to try the reverse sear method, I have heard it is more forgiving.


----------



## craigs (2 Nov 2020)

I use my sous vide for everything from burgers, to brisket, to cod loin (or any fish) and making yoghurt. try a pork fillet and cook it pink. also whole carrots in butter. look at the chefsteps website, or anova


----------



## AJB Temple (2 Nov 2020)

Check out this website for sous vide recipes used by restaurant chefs. 

I would not use a blowtorch, even with Map gas, to finish steaks - takes ages. Black steel or cast iron pan, preheated (ridged or flat) or a hot BBQ cast iron plate.

Reverse sear works very well. If your oven is capable of maintaining an even and low temperature, similar results to SV can be achieved with low and slow. It is worth getting Neil Rankin's book on this. Highly recommended.


----------



## Rorschach (2 Nov 2020)

I'll be honest the main thing I use mine for is Chicken breasts, one of the most difficult to cook pieces of meat is easy when done sous vide. That being said, I tend to eat thighs more often now.


----------



## craigs (2 Nov 2020)

Bm101 said:


> Rather than the cast preheated iron pan ? I do have a rothenberger superfire 2 Mark. By coincidence.


If you want to do the best searing, put a grate over a charcoal chimney starter, some chap done a load of testing and this was the best way as it gives you super high heat and you need a short time so you dont cook the interior more.

a la


----------



## D_W (2 Nov 2020)

For those of us who don't like vinegar, the world of food has really gone down hill in the last 25 years!!

I don't know much about the sous vide trend, but appreciate good meat with salt, garlic butter and black pepper. I think that's a taste that's a few decades out of date now.


----------



## D_W (2 Nov 2020)

serious question for the knowledgeable - why not heat a billet of metal with some mass to do the searing. Like a section of railroad track dumped in a fire and pulled back out. 

I've been forging things lately, so I'm aware of the potential for injury, but if the objective is to get heat on a surface quickly, I can't think of a better way to do it. 

I suppose this could be made more safe by suspending the segment of metal above a fire so that it didn't have to be moved. 

I'm also aware that a fire pit grill that's too hot will literally render and burn the fat of meat immediately (resulting in fire on contact) and leave behind char.


----------



## Rorschach (2 Nov 2020)

D_W said:


> I don't know much about the sous vide trend, but appreciate good meat with salt, garlic butter and black pepper. I think that's a taste that's a few decades out of date now.



On the contrary, using Sous vide cooking allows you to get the absolute best out of even the cheaper cuts of meat both in terms of texture and flavour. Salt, butter and pepper are often the only additions needed.


----------



## D_W (2 Nov 2020)

That would generally be my aim - to work with meat that needs no more than that. Nothing is much less inviting than meat that was started yesterday by someone, described in huge detail, and then is still tough and could be woven into a rope when you actually go to eat it.... 

...I just haven't followed the movement. Parents were children of farmers and all of the expensive cuts were sold, so cooking slowly was the only thing we ever did, but not the same way as is being discussed here.


----------



## AJB Temple (2 Nov 2020)

DW - because searing is a standard kitchen / chef I'm restaurant technique. Works fine with a hot steel or cast iron pan usually over gas or induction. As it is a frequent task it needs to be convenient.


----------



## D_W (2 Nov 2020)

OK - never mind my comments. I read the definition (cooking in a bag or jar in water for a long period of time). English speaking people using french to refer to something kind of reminds me of the japanese tool users (of which I am one - but many go overboard wanting to use only the japanese name). 

The idea of cooking food in a bag immersed makes sense.


----------



## AJB Temple (2 Nov 2020)

The advantage of sous vide DW is that it delivers a consistent temperature throughout the chosen cut, but with no loss of moisture. Even slow cooked in a casserole, meat will leach moisture out. It has drawbacks though. I am not a fan of it for fish for example.


----------



## D_W (2 Nov 2020)

AJB Temple said:


> DW - because searing is a standard kitchen / chef I'm restaurant technique. Works fine with a hot steel or cast iron pan usually over gas or induction. As it is a frequent task it needs to be convenient.



I get that. all clad is located just south of me - moving on from my parents house allowed me to explore the world of spending enough money to be able to sear in pan and then throw the meat in the oven to finish, though I'm not remotely close to foodie and kind of figured that searing would make more sense after the fact than before if texture is important. 

But I don't generally consider too much what chefs do where time is money except to observe what they're doing to get a general idea of steps (as pan searing and dumping the meat in the oven is something I saw on TV and it fits a lazy man like me well).


----------



## AJB Temple (2 Nov 2020)

D_W said:


> I get that. all clad is located just south of me - moving on from my parents house allowed me to explore the world of spending enough money to be able to sear in pan and then throw the meat in the oven to finish, though I'm not remotely close to foodie and kind of figured that searing would make more sense after the fact than before if texture is important.
> 
> But I don't generally consider too much what chefs do where time is money except to observe what they're doing to get a general idea of steps (as pan searing and dumping the meat in the oven is something I saw on TV and it fits a lazy man like me well).


It's not just that time is money, but customers expect food to arrive quickly. If it is a high class restaurant aiming for excellence, sous vide enables food to be cooked bar finishing, and held at temperature. At home we can usually plan a special meal and allow for the time that sous vide or slow cook or cook pot simmer takes. We all seek optimised flavour I guess.


----------



## Bm101 (2 Nov 2020)

AJB Temple said:


> Check out this website for sous vide recipes used by restaurant chefs.
> 
> I would not use a blowtorch, even with Map gas, to finish steaks - takes ages. Black steel or cast iron pan, preheated (ridged or flat) or a hot BBQ cast iron plate.
> 
> Reverse sear works very well. If your oven is capable of maintaining an even and low temperature, similar results to SV can be achieved with low and slow. It is worth getting Neil Rankin's book on this. Highly recommended.


Yeh I was being nice tbh. I wouldnt use mapp. I'm missing your weblink atm.
Thanks for all the replies guys.


----------



## AJB Temple (2 Nov 2020)

Sorry weblink is here: Sous Vide Recipes - Great British Chefs


----------



## D_W (2 Nov 2020)

AJB Temple said:


> The advantage of sous vide DW is that it delivers a consistent temperature throughout the chosen cut, but with no loss of moisture. Even slow cooked in a casserole, meat will leach moisture out. It has drawbacks though. I am not a fan of it for fish for example.



I can't imagine it for fish, either. Beef and pork come to mind for me as those are my two standby meats for back and forth between oven and cooktop (and in no way advanced, just trying to get the texture of the meat and the flavor right without it being tough or overcooked). I suppose butter is the poor man's searing bag. 

As little as I know about meat, I learned pretty quickly when I left home (my mother cooks the life out of everything) that temperature control is awfully important if you're looking for the internal bits to have some kind of specific quality (other than cooked to death or, oops...still below room temperature). 

As a kid, the go-to for my mother was pressure cooking. Sans bag, this results in almost magical things with cheap meat, but the result is missing the bag part - the meat is soft, but something has to be done with it after the cook to put flavor back in. Thus, the idea of the bag is very attractive - get control of blasting the flavor out of it into the liquid. 

Laziness points me to understanding the smallest number of variables necessary to get good flavor, temp and texture. 

Somewhat interesting that here in the states, "safe" electric pressure cookers are all over the place now - I guess the folks of means never started at the low end side and ate what we ate, so they've not heard of pressure cookers other than that they can blow up a kitchen. Something is missing from the current ones, though - I don't know if they work at lower pressure, but they don't do the same job as my mother's did.


----------



## D_W (2 Nov 2020)

I still think I can create a trend of searing with railroad track and open fire. Not with the sensible people, but the money is to be made convincing the idiots!


----------



## D_W (2 Nov 2020)

Rorschach said:


> Salt, butter and pepper are often the only additions needed.



revisiting this - i'm obviously swayed that I need to try this, but in a bag doesn't sound appealing. I can do it in glass, though. 

But as you mention salt, butter and pepper - I often beat the drum with the mrs. "what are we doing to this?". She'll say "what are you talking about?" - already a little angry when she says it. And my response is (whether we're doing the cooking or going to a friend's house with some kind of trial dish that has become almost unrelated to what it started out as, "what exactly is wrong with the food that we're using here that keeps it from being able to stand on its own?", or "geezus, we've got 1/2 food, and 1/2 other things, 8 hours, I don't know what it is and it just makes me wish for a good pork chop. what's the gain in this?".


----------



## craigs (2 Nov 2020)

D_W said:


> I can't imagine it for fish, either. Beef and pork come to mind for me as those are my two standby meats for back and forth between oven and cooktop (and in no way advanced, just trying to get the texture of the meat and the flavor right without it being tough or overcooked). I suppose butter is the poor man's searing bag.
> 
> As little as I know about meat, I learned pretty quickly when I left home (my mother cooks the life out of everything) that temperature control is awfully important if you're looking for the internal bits to have some kind of specific quality (other than cooked to death or, oops...still below room temperature).
> 
> ...


oooohhhh fiieeesh!

I have never cooked better cod loin as well as salmon than with my sous vide, prefect texture, just finish it off in a pan basting with butter and its amazing.

unlike ovens with high temp going from the outside to eventually hit the right temp in the middle, sous vide you set the wata temp to you final temp and whatever you put in there will eventually come up to that temp and therefore perfectly cooked to your liking, also as its a slower process and lacking scorching heat, you get much more tender results.

i dont use bags, i bought a foodsaver vacuum sealer, the only glass i use is kilner jars for making yoghurt.


----------



## AJB Temple (2 Nov 2020)

Oddly enough, the classic restaurant way in the multi star Michelin places before sous vide took off in restaurant kitchens was to poach fish (and other things) in clarified butter. I know people like Marco PW and Thomas Keller used to do this back in the 80s or 90's and it would not surprise me if some high end restaurants still use the technique. (I am not a pro chef by the way - just a bit obsessed with cooking). 

Given that a loin portion of salmon can be pan seared and finished in four minutes in a pan, I am not super convinced by sous vide for that, or a Dover Sole or similar fish where some pan seared colour is desirable.


----------



## Farm Labourer (2 Nov 2020)

I rear Hereford beef, the traditional way - they only get to eat grass/hay. IMHO the big issue with beef, is how it's bred, fed and slaughtered. My neighbour will send his beef of on a 14 hr trip to Cornwall as they can slaughter for 65p/kilo less than they can here, his cattle are packed full of soya to up the killing-weight. His beef then magically appears on the shelves at Tesco some 18 hrs later.

Mine goes about 16 miles, is off-loaded and killed within about 15 mins. It then hangs for 28-35 days before being butchered. I take every animal to the abbatoir myself, to ensure that it's as stress-free as possible, I load at 0500 and am on my way home by 6 after washing out.

It's not a nice process but at the end of the day we eat meat and I try to ensure that the beef that I eat and sell is as best as it can be. Yes it's a hobby- business but it does not need to be a pure chase for profit as livestock are involved. I'd be far more ruthless as an arable farmer!

I like the sous-vide concept but I have an all steaks take 10 minutes mentality for room temp steaks. One min/side for rare. 2 mins/side for med rare and 2.5 mins/side on a hot grill for med. The rest of the ten mins is taken up keeping them warm in an a=oven at 150 - which allows them to warm through. 

If anyone asks for well-done - I send them 4 miles down the road to the local pub!


----------



## AJB Temple (2 Nov 2020)

I would buy your beef FL. It is very difficult to find the good stuff in a sea of mediocrity with beef.


----------



## Tris (3 Nov 2020)

Good grief! After a 14 hr drive I shouldn't think the beef could ever be tender, far too much stress and adrenaline. Yours would be a treat by comparison FL. 
One of the best pieces of beef I ever tasted was from an old dairy cow, slaughtered 5 miles from the farm at a small abbatoir, properly butchered and hung, then slow cooked in a range.
Making myself feel hungry now.


----------



## stuartpaul (3 Nov 2020)

Farm Labourer said:


> .......... If anyone asks for well-done - I send them 4 miles down the road to the local pub!


And pray tell what's wrong with properly cooked food?! 

Can't stand meat that's still mooing and then being criticised for wanting it cooked the way I want it.

This sous-vide thing is boil in the bag yes?


----------



## guineafowl21 (3 Nov 2020)

stuartpaul said:


> And pray tell what's wrong with properly cooked food?!


This is a neverending argument...

The reason cows are cut up in a certain way, into named cuts, is to make the best of each area’s characteristics:
Steaks are sliced thinly from the tenderest parts of the animal, and are intended for rare cooking.
Tougher areas, like silverside, are intended for slower cooking, such as roasting.
Very tough areas, like shin, are intended for the slowest cooking, like casseroles.

By cooking a steak right through, as if it were the outside of a roast joint, you’re buying a much more expensive cut and eating it like a cheaper cut. “Properly cooked” doesn’t always mean cooked right through - think of a soft-boiled egg. Much nicer.

Of course you should have it how you want it, but you get criticized because you’re eating it other than as intended - it’s seen as a waste. Many people are squeamish about the ‘blood’ on the plate, but it’s not blood.


----------



## Bm101 (3 Nov 2020)

stuartpaul said:


> Can't stand meat that's still mooing and then being criticised for wanting it cooked the way I want it.


No criticism here Stuart. Eat your meat how you want of course. Eat at my house and I will cook your steak as you want it. Even if it makes me inwardly shudder. 
And if you want to add coca-cola to an Islay single malt that's up to you too. (Just don't ask for one at my house. I do draw the line at that sort of _malarky_).
We are all different thankfully.
I'm not sure what criticism you have encountered of course, but maybe it's just people being enthusiastic about sharing their love of the benefits of eating a more tender and flavoursome (_really _trying not seem critical here!) version of what you like with the misguided view that you can't make up your own mind about what you quite rightly enjoy. Bit like ex-smokers trying to help out smokers by trying to convince them they can quit too. It's well meant but unwelcome advice.
I promise, never to try to convince you, in this thread on sous vide cookery, to cook your meat other than how you want to... *fingerguns*


----------



## Bm101 (3 Nov 2020)

AJB Temple said:


> I would buy your beef FL. It is very difficult to find the good stuff in a sea of mediocrity with beef.


Yup. Me too!


----------



## Bm101 (3 Nov 2020)

D_W said:


> For those of us who don't like vinegar, the world of food has really gone down hill in the last 25 years!!
> 
> I don't know much about the sous vide trend, but appreciate good meat with salt, garlic butter and black pepper. I think that's a taste that's a few decades out of date now.


Not in my house!


Appreciate all the replies guys. It's always good to get your opinions. Someone always surprises me.


----------



## Geoff_S (3 Nov 2020)

Bm101 said:


> Following from a previous thread about cooking wagyu steak.... I recently bought an Aldi sous vide machine. I've cooked a (rather extravagant) rib of beef in it for the first go which was possibly a bit daft but it was amazing. 6 hours at 52.5 and then rubbed it with salt, ground pepper and dried rosemary. Chucked it back in a hot oven for 15 minutes.
> It was cooked perfectly rare wall to wall so to speak. Even the Mrs, not a great carnivore, went back_twice_ for more. I was astounded how good it was.
> I also bought my first T Bone at the same local butcher and perhaps madly I also put that in. (Finished in the cast pan etc)I didn't get that quite right tbh.
> Moving forwards I'm back to far more affordable and usual joints. So I was interested in what you guys could afford me in the way of good advice and experience.
> ...



Where do you get bags big enough for a rib of beef?

Cheers


----------



## RobinBHM (3 Nov 2020)

What a fascinating thread, shame I rare....ly eat beef


----------



## Bm101 (3 Nov 2020)

It was one rib Geoff! I reckon you could get two _maybe_ a three rib in. I haven't tried experimeting to make the bags oversize but out of 90 degrees but reckon it's doable.
Was the Aldi sold vacuum machine.









Ambiano Vacuum Food Sealer


Find Ambiano Vacuum Food Sealer at ALDI.




www.aldi.co.uk


----------



## doctor Bob (3 Nov 2020)

I have never heard of this machine, I'm 55. Mind you I have zero taste, think "cheese is cheese" all taste the same.


----------



## guineafowl21 (3 Nov 2020)

Bm101 said:


> And if you want to add coca-cola to an Islay single malt that's up to you too. (Just don't ask for one at my house. I do draw the line at that sort of _malarky_).


That’s an excellent analogy - I might steal it 

Paying a premium for an Islay single, then drowning it in coke might be what you like, but if all you want is whisky-flavoured coke it seems like a waste. It’s certainly not what the distillery would recommend.


----------



## harry the b (3 Nov 2020)

Have a look at the komado guru forum.they have a section dedicated to sous vide.


----------



## craigs (3 Nov 2020)

oh i completely forgot, look at the "sous vide everything" channel on youtube Sous Vide Everything


----------



## Rorschach (3 Nov 2020)

You'll get no criticism from me, you enjoy your food the way you like it and I'll enjoy mine the way I like it. If you come to my house I'll do my best to accommodate you, unless you are vegan in which case don't come over


----------



## Phil Pascoe (3 Nov 2020)

All the talk of just salt, pepper and butter ........... I hope you've all tried white peppercorns in a mill. A totally different taste, wonderful especially with eggs, and different altogether to the horrible stale ground stuff. Not very common, but worth getting in. Grains of paradise are excellent as well.




__





Buy Wholefoods Online | Whole foods UK | Organic Foods | Health Foods







www.buywholefoodsonline.co.uk





Incidentally, a very good firm to buy from. Some stuff is expensive (flour for one) but for herbs and spices they are brilliant. You don't realise how old and stale some of the little supermarket jars are. Sign up for the mailshots and there's a freebie on (usually) £30 orders every week. £30 gets you free P&P.


----------



## D_W (3 Nov 2020)

Geoff_S said:


> Where do you get bags big enough for a rib of beef?
> 
> Cheers


Funeral home.


----------



## Bm101 (3 Nov 2020)

Rorschach said:


> You'll get no criticism from me, you enjoy your food the way you like it and I'll enjoy mine the way I like it. If you come to my house I'll do my best to accommodate you, unless you are vegan in which case don't come over


I don't like the tone of this post Rorcharch. There is no need for it.
In the first weeks of the the last lockdown when everyone and their dog was panic buying and in terror of zombies I fortuitously placed an ad in the well known magazine, Vegan Weekly. I offered free two half pound bags of mung beans and 2 soya latte substitutes for whoever could come over and lift all that up at once as a sort of competition/catfish temptation.
I had six applicants within a 2 days. 
All of them well meaning, polite but more importantly _severely lacking in iron. _
They had no strength to fight back as my 6 year old lass easily held them down and I butchered them (humanely obviously!) for the pot. 

I only mention this because we are going into second temp lockdown. The freezer is pretty well full after some local families ignored halloween trick or treat restrictions but you never know. If the lockdown is extended again has any one got any vegan friends that like travel, are fun to meet and open to new experiences?


----------



## Garno (3 Nov 2020)

Am I the only one who had to google what sous-vide was? 

Anyone else notice they have stopped serving fish and chips in newspaper ................ I hate change.


----------



## Rorschach (3 Nov 2020)

Garno said:


> Am I the only one who had to google what sous-vide was?
> 
> Anyone else notice they have stopped serving fish and chips in newspaper ................ I hate change.



You obviously ain't been to a chippy this decade, or this century for that matter!


----------



## Bm101 (3 Nov 2020)

To be honest Gary, I'm by no means a 'foodie' but I do have a deep seated desire to make any meat that I eat taste better. If I can do that with little/processional or no change to the effort I already put in then I will enjoy it even more.
Gary ....you aren't a vegan are you?
Fancy a daytrip to mine?


----------



## Phil Pascoe (4 Nov 2020)

Rorschach said:


> You obviously ain't been to a chippy this decade, or this century for that matter!


Since the late '70s, iirc.


----------



## Garno (4 Nov 2020)

Bm101 said:


> To be honest Gary, I'm by no means a 'foodie' but I do have a deep seated desire to make any meat that I eat taste better. If I can do that with little/processional or no change to the effort I already put in then I will enjoy it even more.
> Gary ....you aren't a vegan are you?
> Fancy a daytrip to mine?



Chris I will hopefully take you up on that but it is conditional.
1) It will be sometime in the new year, probably summer.
2) You don't have me as your sous chef.
3) I will not be expected to wash up the dishes.
4) You will not expect me to take the dog out for a walk.
5) There will be lots of meat.
6) Zero talk of Vegan.
7) We both look up at the sky    ( You know what that means)
Apart from those we will sort something out.
Gary


----------



## Geoff_S (4 Nov 2020)

Sous Viding 2 monstrous pork chops as I type .......


----------



## Mark Karacsonyi (4 Nov 2020)

Although my wife, has gone down this ‘space age’ cooking route, which I will not knock. I go with the BBQ grill every time. Even in the rain/snow under the lean-to.


----------



## Mark Karacsonyi (4 Nov 2020)

However, the ultimate must be the bogrács, (cast iron, or copper).


----------



## Phil Pascoe (4 Nov 2020)

Just today ordered an Aldi one. There are cheaper but the reviews aren't bad and I like the guarantee.

You could use one of these on a fire -


https://www.biggreenegg.co.uk/shop/eggcessories/dutch-oven?gclid=CjwKCAiAv4n9BRA9EiwA30WNDyj3lGKFfgbZGAFyfpspjFzX7ocQUtguWwR6IRuaOwFKl_H4M-yXuhoCoVgQAvD_BwE


A nice bit of kit for the price, too. Good for bread.


----------



## Benchwayze (4 Nov 2020)

Most of my weekly budget for meat goes on ribeye steak. Tender, flavoursome and cooked medium rare, I think it's value for money. When I want a roast joint, I prefer lamb and pork.


John


----------



## Bm101 (4 Nov 2020)

Mark Karacsonyi said:


> However, the ultimate must be the bogrács, (cast iron, or copper).


Interesting stuff. Thanks.








Bogrács, the Hungarian tradition of outdoor cooking


Ready for the ultimate bogrács experience? :)




dailynewshungary.com


----------



## Bm101 (4 Nov 2020)

Benchwayze said:


> Most of my weekly budget for meat goes on ribeye steak. Tender, flavoursome and cooked medium rare, I think it's value for money. When I want a roast joint, I prefer lamb and pork.
> 
> 
> John


I can't see much point in eating any of the other inferior cuts either John.  Well marbled rib eye is the thing.


----------



## Benchwayze (4 Nov 2020)

Indeed Bm.
Although my Christmas lunch is now a Beef Wellington, for which I prefer a middle cut fillet. I lash out for enough fillet to make four individual, 'Wellingtons'. I freeze them down and they last me for special occasions. 

Par excellence! For which I thank my Lady wife who showed me how!

John


----------



## sometimewoodworker (5 Nov 2020)

D_W said:


> I can't imagine it for fish, either.


If referring to sous vide, that is completely wrong. Sous vide is perfect for fish, custards etc.


----------



## sometimewoodworker (5 Nov 2020)

stuartpaul said:


> This sous-vide thing is boil in the bag yes?


No. Never gets near boiling, unless it’s potatoes that go to 90C


----------



## sometimewoodworker (5 Nov 2020)

guineafowl21 said:


> By cooking a steak right through, as if it were the outside of a roast joint, you’re buying a much more expensive cut and eating it like a cheaper cut.


True


guineafowl21 said:


> “Properly cooked” doesn’t always mean cooked right through


That is not true, properly cooked means exactly that. The difference is in the opinion of the temperature you need to get to for it to be “properly cooked“ 
I go for about 56C for pork it looks a bit like this



If it were not Sous Vide it would be dangerously undercooked 

I don’t generally go for beef as the beef here isn’t very good.


----------



## Harken in Wood (5 Nov 2020)

U.K. Workshop? I am at a loss to understand the connection!


----------



## sometimewoodworker (5 Nov 2020)

Harken in Wood said:


> U.K. Workshop? I am at a loss to understand the connection!


Don’t you consider cooking as work?
The kitchen is the workshop of the cooks, so how doesn’t it fit?


----------



## craigs (5 Nov 2020)

sometimewoodworker said:


> True
> 
> That is not true, properly cooked means exactly that. The difference is in the opinion of the temperature you need to get to for it to be “properly cooked“
> I go for about 56C for pork it looks a bit like this
> ...


and the buffalo is pretty dire


----------



## guineafowl21 (5 Nov 2020)

sometimewoodworker said:


> That is not true, properly cooked means exactly that. The difference is in the opinion of the temperature you need to get to for it to be “properly cooked“


Yes, perhaps a bad choice of words on my part, if you equate ‘properly cooked’ with ‘microbially safe’. But a blue steak, which is raw in the middle, is properly cooked to some,

Meat turns brown long after it’s cooked to a safe temperature, and I think it’s that colour change that well-done enthusiasts are looking for.


----------



## marcros (5 Nov 2020)

Bm101 said:


> Interesting stuff. Thanks.
> 
> 
> 
> ...



I had to Google that but could be an interesting addition to the fire pit I am converting the old.bbq into.


----------



## marcros (5 Nov 2020)

I cooked some wookie last night from morrisons. 

Disappointing. It was Chewie.


----------



## stuartpaul (5 Nov 2020)

Bm101 said:


> No criticism here Stuart. Eat your meat how you want of course. Eat at my house and I will cook your steak as you want it. Even if it makes me inwardly shudder.
> And if you want to add coca-cola to an Islay single malt that's up to you too. (Just don't ask for one at my house. I do draw the line at that sort of _malarky_).
> We are all different thankfully.
> I'm not sure what criticism you have encountered of course, but maybe it's just people being enthusiastic about sharing their love of the benefits of eating a more tender and flavoursome (_really _trying not seem critical here!) version of what you like with the misguided view that you can't make up your own mind about what you quite rightly enjoy. Bit like ex-smokers trying to help out smokers by trying to convince them they can quit too. It's well meant but unwelcome advice.
> ...


Thanks Chris, I am an exceedingly unadventurous eater well set in my ways and pretty much incapable (unwilling?!) of change. My wife will cheerfully testify to this. She still laughs out loud at the memory of watching me eat street food in Vietnam.

I just get a little peed off when people tell me how I should eat my food when I know how I like my food. And I really don't care if it will supposedly taste better if cooked differently. I have left restaurants when chefs have refused to cook meat how I want it.

That's in no way a dig against anybody who chooses to eat their food how they like it.

I agree with you entirely about coke and single islay, - surely it has to be fanta?!


----------



## Phil Pascoe (5 Nov 2020)

I remember years ago a chap known to be rather full of his own importance came into the bar with a young lady and ordered two double Hennessy X.O.s ............. with two bottles of Canada Dry. I remember the barmaid laughing at him. 
First class Cognacs, Armagnacs and malt whiskies with lemonade, ginger or coke with loads of ice are common drinks of choice amongst the Chinese.


----------



## Droogs (5 Nov 2020)

For the ultimate roast beef try the following:
Place your joint in the bag along with 1/2 cup of stewed earl grey tea with 1 x teaspoon of mixed steak seasoning, 1/8 tspn garlic powder, 1/2 tspn white pepper. 
cook as per machine instructions for meat weight
when ready take out and sear outside 3 minutes per side
leave 5 mins to rest slice and serve


----------



## sometimewoodworker (5 Nov 2020)

Droogs said:


> For the ultimate roast beef try the following:
> Place your joint in the bag along with 1/2 cup of stewed earl grey tea with 1 x teaspoon of mixed steak seasoning, 1/8 tspn garlic powder, 1/2 tspn white pepper.
> cook as per machine instructions for meat weight
> when ready take out and sear outside 3 minutes per side
> leave 5 mins to rest slice and serve


You will get a better sear if you drop the sealed sous vide bags into an iced water bath for a short time after cooking, this allows you to get a better sear in a shorter time (3 minutes per side is rather long) while not changing the core significantly.

This method or allowing the bags sealed in the fridge where they will keep for quite a long time, then searing from cold allowing the sear to heat the meat, is another variation. This is good for chicken breasts and thinner cuts.


----------



## Terry - Somerset (5 Nov 2020)

A I understand it, from a food safety perspective:

bacteria start to get killed off at ~75C and at 100C are dead
chicken, turkey, pork etc needs cooking so the juices run clear - not pink
bacteria inhabit only the surface of beef. Rare steaks are fine so long as the outside is fully cooked (seared)
burgers etc need to be cooked fully as the process of mincing means any bacteria on the outside of the meat will be dispersed. 
We are all at liberty to eat what we like and accept the consequences.

When travelling, if locals are eating and apparently enjoying a particular food, I will give it a go, however unappetising it may seem to my Brit born and bred sensitivities!


----------



## sometimewoodworker (5 Nov 2020)

guineafowl21 said:


> Yes, perhaps a bad choice of words on my part, if you equate ‘properly cooked’ with ‘microbially safe’. But a blue steak, which is raw in the middle, is properly cooked to some,
> 
> Meat turns brown long after it’s cooked to a safe temperature, and I think it’s that colour change that well-done enthusiasts are looking for.


I agree on the colour change being an indicator to many. SWMBO will not touch the pork I cook because it’s still pink.

and properly cooked is usually a bit more that pasteurised, as the ‘microbially safe’ temperature for pork and almost all meat is minimum 55C but that would be not nearly enough for me.

Before the exact temperature of sous vide colour was available the only reasonably safe indicator was colour so I can understand her thoughts on this.


----------



## sometimewoodworker (5 Nov 2020)

Terry - Somerset said:


> A I understand it, from a food safety perspective:
> 
> bacteria start to get killed off at ~75C and at 100C are dead


You have the temperatures too high, they are in my post above.


----------



## Phil Pascoe (5 Nov 2020)

The temp. at which pork ceases to be pink is higher than than the temp. at which it is actually cooked. It can be pink and cooked properly.
Steaks and mince are fine undercooked or raw so long as they are from the inside of a joint and not the outer, which can be contaminated especially if hung for a long time. Steak Tartare, anyone?
The main reason historically for insisting pork was (over)cooked was nothing bacterial, it was the risk of parasitic infection, which basically is long gone. As a matter of interest, Sir Hugh Pennington said years ago after a major outbreak of food poisoning (a butcher's in Scotland, iirc) caused by burgers that there had never been a major outbreak caused by lack of hand washing, they were without exception causes by bad storage.
I remember about twenty years ago an outbreak of salmonella - they looked into meat and seafoods then found it was caused by Spanish farmers in a drought watering their salad crops with raw sewage. This is a reason why there's little use of salad crops in Chinese cookery - the historic use of "night soil" to fertilise crops.


----------



## Rorschach (5 Nov 2020)

It's a mistake to go by temperature alone. The temperature at which food is "safe" is the temp at which the bacteria are killed instantly. But long exposure to lower temperatures will also kill bacteria. That is the fundamental principle of Sous vide, you are pasteurising the meat by cooking for a long time at a low temperature which both kills bacteria but also maintains the texture.

I cook my chicken at well below 75C when I am sous viding, but it is held at pasteurisation temps for long enough to make it safe even though the juices are still very much pink.


----------



## Rorschach (5 Nov 2020)

Terry - Somerset said:


> A I understand it, from a food safety perspective:
> 
> bacteria start to get killed off at ~75C and at 100C are dead
> chicken, turkey, pork etc needs cooking so the juices run clear - not pink
> ...



Yes and no, see my above post for why you are not quite correct, at least when referring to Sous vide.


----------



## AJB Temple (5 Nov 2020)

For my sins, briefly I used to be CEO of a logistics company that delivered food for airlines, mainly in America. The business had kitchens that produced all sorts of stuff from sandwiches to so called in-flight fine dining. I remember getting lectured by a hygiene guy (as a major outbreak of food poisoning in a plane is a big deal). It was years ago but his pet list as I recall went far beyond bacteria on the surface of food. He has this detector thing and I was present for a check on a customer's development kitchen. His hit list (leaving aside cooking temperature) was bacterial transference caused by:


Hands not washed well enough or at all
Dirty clothes
Dirty knives, boards and work surfaces
Poor fridge hygiene and absence of separation (eg cooked v fresh or meat v veg)
Dirty wipe down cloths
Insufficient use of antibacterial sprays in kitchen generally
Washing up in the sink is a waste of time - use a HOT dishwasher
Poor food storage and separation
Leaving cooked food out too long
Dirty plates, flatware and cutlery
Not getting food from suppliers with top notch hygiene standards
Bugs in the ventilation systems (blowing buggy air everywhere)
And finally....again, hands boards and knives not washed well enough. 
It made me a bit obsessive in my own kitchen actually, having seen the spread of bacteria with my own eyes under his infra red detector or whatever it was.


----------



## Phil Pascoe (5 Nov 2020)

Indeed. The filthiest things in many households are dishcloths, teatowels and face flannels.


----------



## Geoff_S (5 Nov 2020)

Harken in Wood said:


> U.K. Workshop? I am at a loss to understand the connection!



If I spend too long in my workshop without eating, I start to feel feint.


----------



## Droogs (5 Nov 2020)

@Geoff_S What, all sneaky and Trump like


----------



## Bm101 (5 Nov 2020)

Harken in Wood said:


> U.K. Workshop? I am at a loss to understand the connection!


 
* General Chat (Off-Topic) *
For non-woodworking related topics - yes I know it's a scary thought but there is a life outside woodworking


----------



## D_W (5 Nov 2020)

Harken in Wood said:


> U.K. Workshop? I am at a loss to understand the connection!



Perhaps you didn't notice the "off topic, general chat" heading at the top of this?. I'm sure you didn't, but meat and bread are kind of popular on US forums, too - both are kind of in line with making things (pizza from scratch, too, as well as growing gardens). 

I'd imagine that if you quizzed a country club group who golfs three times a week, you might not find much excitement for cooking/making/bread/pizza, but on a knife or woodworking or metalworking forum, I'd imagine the turnout is pretty strong.


----------



## D_W (5 Nov 2020)

Of course, I started this thread turned off by the sort of foreign language branding of the process, but I'm sold in the idea as I already live in the world of less cooked meats. 

I think we'll use the term "with vacuum" here. My mrs is a recipe cooker and not particularly good at judgement in pan to oven and back cooking (she will cook pretty much everything until it's the same color and then a beyond that a little for fear of getting sick), but she may be willing to do this since it takes care of the temperature part of the process.


----------



## AJB Temple (5 Nov 2020)

I really enjoy the cooking and bread threads when they crop up. It's the same mentality as woodwork to me: making good stuff ourselves.


----------



## Phil Pascoe (5 Nov 2020)

Ah, back to bread. I've found the best white bread flour yet (by a mile), and I've tried probably ten or twelve -








Marriages 100% Canadian Manitoba Very Strong White Bread Flour 16kg


Canadian Manitoba Very Strong White Bread Flour 16kg Very high protein for bread, rolls and pasta. The ultimate flour for long fermentation baking. Exceptionally strong, milled from all Canadian Spring wheat. Ingredients Flour (WHEAT Flour, Calcium, Iron, Niacin, Thiamin) Nutrition Energy...




www.flour2door.co.uk


----------



## sometimewoodworker (6 Nov 2020)

D_W said:


> I think we'll use the term "with vacuum" here.


That is rather restrictive and confusing to say the least.
certainly sous vide has that literal meaning, but the cooking term sous vide definitely isn’t restricted to vacuum sealed cooking, so trying to use the term “with vacuum", an unknown & incorrect phrase to replace the well known, maybe not to you, Sous Vide cooking term is a poor idea.

You of course are welcome to use whatever term you like, but as with food and degrees of cooking, others may well like & use something different.

I do have a couple of vacuum sealing machines but only use them for some of my Sous Vide cooking, the rest is for freezer use.

The original Sous Vide used professional, very very expensive, machines for both cooking and packing food for cooking. The original packaging machines were chamber machines that cost upwards of £700. Since you can now get completely different principle machines for less than 10% of that and can use a simple reusable bag costing under 1% of that, the packaging is cheap.
Going on to the heating machines they are now similarly lower in price for non professional machines so almost anyone can use a process that was only usable in professional kitchens.


----------



## sometimewoodworker (6 Nov 2020)

FWIW Paprika Recipe Manager for iOS, Mac, Android, and Windows is a great cooking app I have got 50 Sous Vide recipes in it and can share any if anyone is interested, either as a paprikaapp or html file.


----------



## Rorschach (6 Nov 2020)

I might have mentioned it here before but if you have a vacuum sealer they are useful without having the immersion circulator to do sous vide cooking.

I use my vacuum sealer in combination with my slow cooker to confit duck legs. Rather than immersing them in a big pan of fat which is costly and messy I seal them in a bag along with a couple of spoonfuls of duck fat and then cook in the slow cooker until I see the meat pulling away from the bone. The slow cooker maintains a cooking temp of around 90C on low which is perfect for gently cooking the duck legs without drying them out and I find it easier and more cost effective than the immersion circulator in this case.

Once cooked I put the bags straight into a big bowl of cold water, you could add ice if you wish, to cool them as quickly as possible and then freeze them. They will keep in the freezer very well like this as they are theoretically sterile inside. When you want to serve you just need to defrost and brown them in a frying pan until crispy. They won't be encased in a deep layer of fat so much easier to get out and reheat with less mess again than the standard method and you may even be able to separate the fat and juices to roast potatoes and make gravy if you wish.


----------



## D_W (6 Nov 2020)

sometimewoodworker said:


> That is rather restrictive and confusing to say the least.
> certainly sous vide has that literal meaning, but the cooking term sous vide definitely isn’t restricted to vacuum sealed cooking, so trying to use the term “with vacuum", an unknown & incorrect phrase to replace the well known, maybe not to you, Sous Vide cooking term is a poor idea.
> 
> You of course are welcome to use whatever term you like, but as with food and degrees of cooking, others may well like & use something different.
> ...



I believe that's the literal translation, isn't it? Names often start as something narrow and don't expand as the definition of something gets more broad.


----------



## Droogs (6 Nov 2020)

There is of course another great use for this kit and that is to use the bags and sealer as a small scall vacuum veneer press.


----------



## Bm101 (8 Nov 2020)

Probably not one for Stuart Paul (  ).
I did the gammon yesterday, brown sugar melted down with balsamic vinegar glaze. Very nice. Awesome tbf.
Today I did that Lidl aged beef joint. I was going to try Droog's tea suggestion. Sorry Droogs. Port. And. Garlic.
Then I saw this port and garlic idea.








Sous Vide Beef Tenderloin with Port Wine and Garlic


Sous Vide Beef Tenderloin with Port, Garlic, and Thyme! Fool-proof recipe – I'll never feel anxious cooking beef tenderloin again. Serve for Christmas dinner or a special holiday meal.




www.simplyrecipes.com




3 hours at 56.
Holy Sh*t.
It came out rare with a R.
Would the kids eat it?
The Mrs?







Made the cooking juices into gravy and the kids ate that too. Fu*kin' Marvellous.
No one ate the vegetables LMAO!
I'm really excited about cooking again. Amazeballs.
Happy days.
£8 joint of meat works out cheaper tham Mcdonalds burgers. That's perspective on it.


----------



## Droogs (8 Nov 2020)

The use of tea is from a Mrs Beaton recipe, the tannin in the tea slowly tenderizes the meat. I also go over the joint with the carving fork and get rid of any frustration to give the tea an easy route in (before cooking). The juices then used to make the gravy. Just awesome


----------



## Phil Pascoe (8 Nov 2020)

I bought the Sous Vide Cookbook (Rachel Collins) which looks to be a decent recipe book. One of the first things I read is to try using asafoetida instead of garlic as garlic in a sous vide tends to make things bitter. I tried my new Aldi sous vide yesterday with two chicken breasts. Fine, but I find the thing difficult to programme atm - it just doesn't like my touch. My wife programmed it effortlessly.


----------



## Bm101 (8 Nov 2020)

Yeh. It's 'delicate' Phil.


----------



## Droogs (8 Nov 2020)

Not made by Sharp is it Phil


----------



## Garno (8 Nov 2020)

Bm101 said:


> Probably not one for Stuart Paul (  ).
> I did the gammon yesterday, brown sugar melted down with balsamic vinegar glaze. Very nice. Awesome tbf.
> Today I did that Lidl aged beef joint. I was going to try Droog's tea suggestion. Sorry Droogs. Port. And. Garlic.
> Then I saw this port and garlic idea.
> ...



I've seen thicker pieces of paper, With all that blood it would be far too raw for my delicate palette and fat gut.


----------



## Phil Pascoe (9 Nov 2020)

Bm101 said:


> Probably not one for Stuart Paul (  ).
> I did the gammon yesterday, brown sugar melted down with balsamic vinegar glaze. Very nice. Awesome tbf.
> Today I did that Lidl aged beef joint. I was going to try Droog's tea suggestion. Sorry Droogs. Port. And. Garlic.
> Then I saw this port and garlic idea.
> ...



How would you like your beef sir? Oh, just chop off his horns and wipe his assss.


----------



## stuartpaul (9 Nov 2020)

Bm101 said:


> Probably not one for Stuart Paul (  ).
> I did the gammon yesterday, brown sugar melted down with balsamic vinegar glaze. Very nice. Awesome tbf.
> Today I did that Lidl aged beef joint. I was going to try Droog's tea suggestion. Sorry Droogs. Port. And. Garlic.
> Then I saw this port and garlic idea.
> ...


I suspect Chris that it would taste very nice, - if it was properly cooked!


----------



## guineafowl21 (9 Nov 2020)

Well, I’ve gone and got one now. Trying some pork shoulder steaks at 60C for 90mins (one-touch programme).


----------



## Geoff_S (10 Nov 2020)

Bm101 said:


> Probably not one for Stuart Paul (  ).
> I did the gammon yesterday, brown sugar melted down with balsamic vinegar glaze. Very nice. Awesome tbf.
> Today I did that Lidl aged beef joint. I was going to try Droog's tea suggestion. Sorry Droogs. Port. And. Garlic.
> Then I saw this port and garlic idea.
> ...



Was your slice the one on the left?


----------



## AJB Temple (10 Nov 2020)

Phil Pascoe said:


> Ah, back to bread. I've found the best white bread flour yet (by a mile), and I've tried probably ten or twelve -
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Which have you tried Phil? I am presently using Dove's Farm very strong organic white (24kg sacks) for making sourdough (I use their Rye for the ferment). I find it a bit heavy. I tried Marriages a while ago from Bakery Bits but then they were useless during lockdown and I was unable to get it.


----------



## Phil Pascoe (11 Nov 2020)

A thread drift, but one for AJB -


----------



## craigs (11 Nov 2020)

have a look at shipton mill, I buy all my flour there and they stock canadian and french flour as well as English flours....in fact you can pretty much get everything there right down to ye olde grain


----------



## Phil Pascoe (11 Nov 2020)

The Cornish Mill and Bakehouse (not white), Wessex, Carrs, Bacheldre, Shipton Mill, Buywholefoodsonline unbranded (which I believe is Shipton), Matthews, Dove's, (Allinson's, Tesco's, Morrison's) ... that I recall. Some weren't white flours, but I tend now to bake only white (sometimes with a small% of rye or wholemeal) as I prefer lighter breads. I liked Matthew's Cotswold Crunch, but it seemed to have got heavier - maybe the proportion of barley was increased.
Shipton? Interesting. I found it well down my list of choices.


----------



## dannyr (11 Nov 2020)

Haven't read all this looong thread, but yet to be convinced about sous-vide -- I'm not a foodie but occasionally like a good restaurant meal -- a few years ago a fine local restaurant made a big splash about going sous-vide - same chefs but I have to say I preferred the taste and texture of the same dishes before s-v.


----------



## craigs (11 Nov 2020)

I prefer the convenience of SV, i dont have the check the oven or worry something gets overcooked. yesterday i vac sealed and threw in a 2kg silverside which went for 4 hours @ 54c, it could have been left in another hour or 2 without any real difference. The result was delicious and as my daughter would say.."soooo jooooseeeyyy"


----------



## Phil Pascoe (11 Nov 2020)

That's why I like Dutch ovens, as well. Keep the temp. down and another hour or so won't make a difference.
A chicken, a load of shallots and half a bottle of Worcestershire sauce, four hours on about 140c - 150c. Wonderful. Brown it at the end if needs be.


----------



## AJB Temple (11 Nov 2020)

I agree about Dutch ovens. Also very useful for baking. 

You can also slow cook chicken all day at around 80 degrees C in the oven. Low and slow. Keeps it very moist and the meat falls off the bone. 

As an alternative to running the oven for several hours for things cooked wet, I am quite a big fan of slow cookers. Very cheap to run and almost* silly person proof. 

*I say almost because I left home at just over 17 to go to uni and invested in a Kenwood slow cooker which had a green plastic outside and a big brown pot. This was used to make spaghetti Bolognese (I know there is no such thing really) for my first ever party. This produced something which gave about 40 people Delhi belly almost instantly. To be fair it was only my second ever attempt at cooking, the first being burnt steak for my girlfriend, who had previously distinguished herself by tempting me with burnt fish fingers served with pasta and salad cream. She is also the cause of my lifelong dislike for cheesecake.


----------



## Phil Pascoe (11 Nov 2020)

burnt fish fingers served with pasta and salad cream ...

Reminds me of one of the last Scout camps I did. As was customary we ate what was left over on the last day. Potatoes, cornflakes, sausages and mackerel, fried for the same length of time in the same pan. Did the same on another one - the last meal amongst other things was limpets and steak and kidney pudding uncooked out of the tin. That was the day I had my appendix out. Cast iron guts? Me?


----------



## Rorschach (11 Nov 2020)

Just a personal preference thing but in general I don't like slow cooked meat. Something about the texture doesn't really appeal, especially poultry. For certain cuts it is a necessary evil but whenever possible I prefer other methods.


----------

