# What bowl gouge would you recommend?



## YouSpinMeRightRound (8 Apr 2014)

Hi everyone,

Since I got some rather helpful advice on my first thread, I thought I'd come pick some brains once more.

I want to start working on bowls, so I'll need a bowl gouge. The advice I see everywhere is to stick with HSS, so let's restrict it to that. *What HSS bowl gouge would you suggest I get, and why?* Are there any other tools you'd recommend for basic bowl turning?

If relevant, I'm limited to 9" diameter on my shiny new AWSL, and am unlikely to go deeper than 4" (5" at most).

While I'm waiting for the wisdom of this forum and whatever I settle on being delivered, *is there any safe way I can practice with regular gouges?* I mean for very shallow things, almost plates. Don't worry, you wan't have to persuade me not to do anything stupid. If the people with many more years of experience than me say it's a bad idea, I'll wait for the gouge.


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## Bodrighy (8 Apr 2014)

To be honest the only thing to think about is size, am for something in the region of 3/8" or 1/2" initially, a decent all round size. Personally I would recommend one of the major makers e.g. Ashley Isles, Sorby, Crown etc. Record tend to have handles that are too short for my taste but the steel is good. 

Pete


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## Grahamshed (8 Apr 2014)

I cannot really recommend a bowl gouge. I have just brought a crown Elsworth one which is supposed to be brilliant but I haven't used it yet. As far as using other gouges..... Definitely not a spindle roughing gouge but the spindle detail gouge is useable as far as I know. It is much the same but not as strong so not for deep bowl use but you could play with it while you wait.

But I won't be surprised if I am contradicted on that.


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## Paul.J (8 Apr 2014)

I love using the my Sorby 3/8 bowl gouge,which i have gotta replace now,which i got with the six piece starter set,of which i still use frequently the parting tool,roughing gouge,spindle gouge.the only one i don't use very often is the skew,but my favourite bowl gouge for larger bowls is my Henry Taylor 1/2" bowl gouge and the 5/8" Woodcut replaceable tipped tool.
If you are just starting out i'd go for the Sorby six piece set and build on that as you get more experience.


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## Spindle (8 Apr 2014)

Hi

I'd go for a 3/8" fingernail ground bowl gouge - my preference is for Robert Sorby gouges but I'm sure Ashley Isles would be just as good.

Other tools I think are essential when learning to bowl turn would be an 1/8", (or possibly 1/4"), parting tool, a 1/2" or 3/4" round nose scraper and a 3/4" straight scraper in that order of preference.

The scrapers could be replaced with a replaceable tip carbide scraper if that floats your boat, (I'm a bit of a traditionalist).

Edited to add: If you think you will expand your turning experience to include spindle turning as well, (silly not to  ), you would do well to consider the Sorby six piece beginners set as suggested by Paul J - it was the set I started with and with the benefit of fifteen years experience I think it represents the most suitable beginners set available, it is also substantial saving over buying individual tools.

End of shameless plug  

Regards Mick


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## Spindle (8 Apr 2014)

YouSpinMeRightRound":37iojbaj said:


> is there any safe way I can practice with regular gouges?



Hi

I'm not sure what you mean by 'regular gouges', especially as it seems you have no turning tools at present, (sorry if I've jumped to the wrong conclusion there).

The accepted tools for bowl turning are: Bowl gouges, parting tools and scrapers - yes spindle gouges can be used for bowl turning once you understand their strength limitations however as a beginner why add another layer of complexity, stick to bowl gouges initially.

Carving gouges, chisels, old files, pointy bits of metal should never be directed at a spinning bowl blank :wink: :roll: 

Regards Mick


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## NickWelford (8 Apr 2014)

You would do really well to join a local club, where you can usually get to try different tools and see how they feel to you. The number of different recommendations here shows that a lot comes down to personal taste and feeling. I agree that the advice here is (generally) very good, but it does differ from bod to bod, so you might end up with pricey tools that don't get a lot of use. We all have some!!


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## Wybrook (8 Apr 2014)

+1 for the Sorby set


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## CHJ (8 Apr 2014)

The 'normal' bowl gouges in the 3/8-1/2" range supplied under the brand names of Hamlet, Crown, Ashley Iles , Record, Sorby are what I would recommend and to avoid any with exotic grinds and celebrity marketing.

Time to consider the more exotic when you know what a standard tool can do and have developed enough knowledge to be aware of any advantages that might meet your method of working better.

One of the limitations you face is that of having to buy on-line ("awaiting to be delivered"), as mentioned by Pete the feel of a tool in your hands can influence your turning considerable (he finds crown handles too short) on the other hand I'm not very comfortable with Sorby handles and have a crown that is a go-for for certain tasks..

Picking up the various makes of 'equivalent tools' at a show is my method these days in choosing replacements, when one feels right in the hand it invariable performs better on the lathe.

As mentioned above if you can get to a club and handle a few of the tools there you may get a feel for a brand or size that feel 'right'


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## woodfarmer (8 Apr 2014)

As you see, if ten people answer you will get ten different answers. But there is a theme to it.
As a beginner myself, although I don't have the experience and skill I do know what it is like to do battle with a bit of wood. My tool of choice is my Crown !/2" bowl gouge and the reason is it is a big strong tool that gives you confidence. It also give you lots of leverage. After a while you will find it ceases to be a battle and you then learn to use it better. At this point you will have enough technique going that a 3/8 gouge would work well for you in the sizes you envisage using. but starting off on the first few cuts on a rough blank you do need an "edge" in more ways than one.

As important as the tool you want to choose your wood carefully and select something that cuts and turns easily. Green pear, sycamore etc. it will help you to learn how to present the tool and to get a feel for it. You also stand a better chance of learning how the tool should cut and when to resharpen it.

Hope that helps.....


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## procell (8 Apr 2014)

Whatever Bowl gouge you eventually choose you will no doubt have a few catches. Its all part of the learning curve. Spending a few hours watching you tube videos of experts turning bowl before you even pick up a tool can be time well spent. Like many in these forums I am a beginner but would agree with 1/2" bowl gouge as a good starting point. The main thing is go for a recognized name and get the best you can afford as it will pay you back many times over in the long run.


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## Spindle (8 Apr 2014)

Hi

I think the size of the bowl gouge should be matched to the OP's choice of lathe - in this case I'd consider a 1/2" bowl gouge as being OTT.

Regards Mick


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## Bodrighy (8 Apr 2014)

Spindle":zhxuhrq5 said:


> Hi
> 
> I think the size of the bowl gouge should be matched to the OP's choice of lathe - in this case I'd consider a 1/2" bowl gouge as being OTT.
> 
> Regards Mick



A 1/2" bowl gouge is fine for bowls of most sizes that can be turned on his lathe, large or small. If I had tools that matched the lathe I would end up with three sets of tools. The main problem would be if he bought a small one e.g. 1/4" or less. As a beginner he is almost bound to get catches and safety wise there is a need to have a gouge that has a decent sized shank. The thing that makes the main difference is the style of grind and that is something that will be found with experience and practice as with the type of handle. Where possible I usually buy unhandled tools and put my own grind on them for example but that is not something that perhaps a beginner would or should be doing. Joining a club if possible and seeing what is available would be ideal. 

Pete


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## Dalboy (8 Apr 2014)

I would feel lost without my two 3/8" bowl gauges (they have different grinds) The standard grind one came with the Robert Sorby set


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## CHJ (8 Apr 2014)

A word of caution when referring to 3/8" versus 1/2" bowl gouges, dependent upon brand and which catalogue you are looking at, the means of cataloguing the size may differ.

Some brands use the round stock diameter to rate size.
Others use the distance across the top of the flute.

Therefore a 1/2" round stock with a 3/8" flute may have two differing size ratings dependent upon brand.

Five out of my six regular use round gouges are 1/2" stock, the other is 3/8" stock (or metric equivalents), I would go along with the suggestion by Mick to err on the smaller sizes (I.E. don't buy a 1/2" flute, 5/8" stock) gouge.


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## finneyb (8 Apr 2014)

I got the Axminster set, currently £75. Having said that there is a school of thought that says don't buy a set because you get tools you don't need. I've added others as a go eg Ellsworth and I don't use some of the Axi set, but have re-shaped some of them for specific little jobs.

Brian


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## Grahamshed (8 Apr 2014)

Yep, its worth remembering that tools can be reshaped. I was looking at skews the other day and there was one that was 1.25 inches and shaped to a curve to make its use 'safer and better' I was quite tempted but a similar sized skew without the shaping was less than half the price and the curve us easy enough to do on any form of grinder.


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## Random Orbital Bob (8 Apr 2014)

Safety wise. Don't use a spindle gouge on a bowl. Tang versus solid shaft inside the handle can cause tool to snap with catches.


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## nev (8 Apr 2014)

From asking a similar question back in 2011, I opted for a superflute. It It is the only bowl gouge I have and have yet to feel the need to purchase another. It works fine for everything I do bowl wise from small to large and referring to the comments earlier made, it does also feel 'good' in the hand, which I think also gives one confidence.


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## Bodrighy (8 Apr 2014)

Random Orbital Bob":3uu5c9dh said:


> Safety wise. Don't use a spindle gouge on a bowl. Tang versus solid shaft inside the handle can cause tool to snap with catches.




The only spindle gouge with a tang (apart from really old ones) that I have come across is a roughing gouge. I agree that using any tanged gouge with a long overhang is potentially dangerous though.

Pete


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## YouSpinMeRightRound (8 Apr 2014)

Wow, that's a great response. Thanks everyone! 



Spindle":206uzqff said:


> YouSpinMeRightRound":206uzqff said:
> 
> 
> > is there any safe way I can practice with regular gouges?
> ...


I have a set of basic chisels that I'm happy with for now (except for the lack of a bowl gouge), but it was a reasonable assumption that I had none yet. I was talking about using a spindle gouge.



NickWelford":206uzqff said:


> You would do really well to join a local club, where you can usually get to try different tools and see how they feel to you.


I'd love to follow this advice, but there don't appear to be any local turning clubs.



CHJ":206uzqff said:


> One of the limitations you face is that of having to buy on-line ("awaiting to be delivered"), as mentioned by Pete the feel of a tool in your hands can influence your turning
> ...
> when one feels right in the hand it invariable performs better on the lathe.


Interesting. There's a tool shop in town with some turning tools, very small selection but I've drooled over some Sorby chisels there in the past. I prefer to buy online because they're much more expensive, but if the shop is actually providing a service I don't mind paying their prices. I'll drop in later in the week. 



Random Orbital Bob":206uzqff said:


> Safety wise. Don't use a spindle gouge on a bowl. Tang versus solid shaft inside the handle can cause tool to snap with catches.


Good to know. I'm fond of my eyes, and their chisel-free status. 

The take-home message I'm getting is:
a) It doesn't matter who I buy it from, as long as they're reputable.
b) Once (a) is met, choose based on how the tool feels in my hand (and price!)
c) Probably go for 3/8"


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## CHJ (8 Apr 2014)

Continental style spindle gouges are forged from flat stock and have a tang, the Sorby 840H34 3/4in Spindle Gouge is an example.




Never use on endgrain. (Bowl Blank)


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## Bodrighy (8 Apr 2014)

I didn't realise that they still made then like that Chas, obviously not looked hard enough LOL. 

Pete


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## CHJ (8 Apr 2014)

Bodrighy":2w90d30a said:


> I didn't realise that they still made then like that Chas, obviously not looked hard enough LOL.
> 
> Pete


They're great if you have a skew aversion, and the wider form gives you a long between grinds work time for most tasks as you can rotate onto a different quadrant and still maintain proper rest support.


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## Robbo3 (8 Apr 2014)

Also, just FYI (For Your Information) there are double ended gouges from Hope Tools, made by Ashley Isles. You will of course need a handle to put them in.
- http://www.hopewoodturning.co.uk/new_products_10.html


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## Mark Hancock (9 Apr 2014)

CHJ":38nu0au1 said:


> A word of caution when referring to 3/8" versus 1/2" bowl gouges, dependent upon brand and which catalogue you are looking at, the means of cataloguing the size may differ.
> 
> Some brands use the round stock diameter to rate size.
> Others use the distance across the top of the flute.
> ...



As far as I am aware the British way to size a bowl gouge is from the inside of the flute on one side to the outside of the bar on the other side. The American way is the diameter of the bar. So an American 1/2" bowl gouge is a British 3/8".

There is more confusion when it comes to the measurement of spindle gouges, spindle roughing gouges, continental gouges etc. Some manufacturers use the British way of defining a bowl gouge. some use the width of the flute and some use the diameter/overall width of the bar.


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## Mark Hancock (9 Apr 2014)

What appears to have been overlooked in some of the replies is that as you increase the size of bowl gouge although you increase the stability of the tool you also tend to increase the width of cut. Can the size of lathe, it's power and swing cope with a 1/2" bowl gouge? IMHO it is OTT. A 3/8" bowl gouge with a standard profile flute such as the Sorby one with a medium swept back grind will be perfectly sufficient. It would also allow for a later upgrade of the lathe to a larger one and still be perfectly useable.


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## Grahamshed (9 Apr 2014)

But what size lathe are we talking about ?


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## Rhossydd (9 Apr 2014)

Another vote for the Henry Taylor Superflute as mentioned above.
Reassuringly big and solid, it gives confidence for both heavy stock removal, but also fine delicate finishing cuts.
It's always my 'first go to' tool when bowl turning.


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## Rhossydd (9 Apr 2014)

Grahamshed":c67u4zth said:


> But what size lathe are we talking about ?


Pay attention; The first post mentions the OP's lathe. http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-ho ... ning-lathe


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## Grahamshed (9 Apr 2014)

Rhossydd":1v0teir0 said:


> Grahamshed":1v0teir0 said:
> 
> 
> > But what size lathe are we talking about ?
> ...


Oh yes.



(homer) If I could remember that long ago I wouldn't be locked up where I am now.


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## YouSpinMeRightRound (11 Apr 2014)

Well, I'm glad I came in under budget on the lathe and chuck. I walked in to the shop in town today, left £120 poorer and with a Sorby 6 piece set. 

Thanks again for all the advice, everyone who commented.


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## Dalboy (11 Apr 2014)

YouSpinMeRightRound":24wayggj said:


> Well, I'm glad I came in under budget on the and chuck. I walked in to the shop in town today, left £120 poorer and with a Sorby 6 piece set.
> 
> Thanks again for all the advice, everyone who commented.



You will not be disappointed. Now you can start to make a list of all the other bits and pieces you will want or need, OH yes this is only the start :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## YouSpinMeRightRound (11 Apr 2014)

Dalboy":15egec6x said:


> YouSpinMeRightRound":15egec6x said:
> 
> 
> > Well, I'm glad I came in under budget on the and chuck. I walked in to the shop in town today, left £120 poorer and with a Sorby 6 piece set.
> ...



List already started, I'm afraid. Top of the list is something for cutting threads.

Edit: and eccentric turning. How do any of you have any money left?


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## Spindle (11 Apr 2014)

YouSpinMeRightRound":urt1vgov said:


> List already started, I'm afraid. Top of the list is something for cutting threads.



Strange choice for someone who wanted to turn bowls - or are you coming across to spindles as well  :wink: 

If so a long hole boring set up should be high on the list

Regards Mick


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## YouSpinMeRightRound (11 Apr 2014)

Spindle":awr12sji said:


> YouSpinMeRightRound":awr12sji said:
> 
> 
> > List already started, I'm afraid. Top of the list is something for cutting threads.
> ...


No, spindles really isn't my thing. The threads are for wooden nuts and bolts (and related bits), beloved of a certain 4 year old.


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## Spindle (11 Apr 2014)

Hi

I have three sizes of these:

http://www.axminster.co.uk/axminster-wo ... utting-kit

They work well on beech, my choice of woods for threading.

Regards Mick


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