# safe edge on a buarstuard file



## thetyreman (14 Mar 2020)

I want to get rid of the abrasive edges on the BUARSTARD file I have here  

just wondered if it would be sensible to use a grinding wheel on the sides, and do I need to dip it in water to stop overheating? or just leave it,

cheers,

Ben.


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## Ttrees (14 Mar 2020)

I've ground a few files on a bench grinder, and noticed no degradation to the teeth after doing so.
I did dip/leave them in water as the whole file will get hot and not just the edge.
It takes an age on the bench grinder, so I wouldn't have an issue doing it with an angle grinder again.

Tom


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## sunnybob (14 Mar 2020)

Why?


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## thetyreman (14 Mar 2020)

sunnybob":289st4ti said:


> Why?



I want one without abraisive edges for certain jobs, a good example is opening the mouth on a plane that I recently made, I did not need the sides to be abraisive so that's why.


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## lurker (14 Mar 2020)

You could stick some wet and dry to a bit of thin ply.
Cast iron is surprisingly soft.


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## That would work (14 Mar 2020)

I still enjoy a metalwork lesson when I can talk about turnip files and keep a straight face :lol:


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## That would work (14 Mar 2020)

Turnip??? Barsteward then!!!!
Bloody nanny state.


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## Rorschach (14 Mar 2020)

I have always done mine on a belt sander as I found it easier to maintain a straight flat edge. I think it would be hard on a standard bench grinder unless it was a very small file.

Slighly OTT but a few years ago I bought a file at a car boot for 10p, it had been modified to be an edge only file, no face on it. It was done on a surface grinder and it's absolutely perfect with just one edge that is wickedly sharp and perfectly 90deg. In the right situation it is the perfect tool for the job and I wouldn't be without it.


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## sunnybob (14 Mar 2020)

thetyreman":1yl657a9 said:


> sunnybob":1yl657a9 said:
> 
> 
> > Why?
> ...


 
Am I getting this right?;
you want the roughest file made, but you only want teeth on the edges and not the flats?
If so, would it not be easier to buy a much smaller file that is the width you want (swiss needle files come in many shapes and sizes), and if needed, glue that to the edge of a flat piece of wood.

A B'stard file seems a bit overkill for cast iron, even worse for brass. There will only be one or two teeth in conact, giving score lines youll never get rid of.
If you decide to grind off, you will need to keep a large bucket of cold water handy and constantly quench the file, or it will lose its hardness on the remaining teeth


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## thetyreman (14 Mar 2020)

sorry I should explain myself, it's for shaping wood not cast iron, and also to remove the edges not the flats, partly my fault, I have been making a wooden plane and plan on making more, krenov style planes, I want to avoid it touching the edges of the mouth when carefully opening the mouth slowly with the file.


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## Ttrees (14 Mar 2020)

Rorschach":1f7qwem9 said:


> I have always done mine on a belt sander as I found it easier to maintain a straight flat edge. I think it would be hard on a standard bench grinder unless it was a very small file.
> 
> Slighly OTT but a few years ago I bought a file at a car boot for 10p, it had been modified to be an edge only file, no face on it. It was done on a surface grinder and it's absolutely perfect with just one edge that is wickedly sharp and perfectly 90deg. In the right situation it is the perfect tool for the job and I wouldn't be without it.



Rob Cosman done similar thing to make a nice burnisher for himself.
I should have said, the bench grinder would be my choice for just the removal of the teeth, but not for grinding a large amount off of a smallish to medium sized file.
I've not found it to be terribly wasteful on the cheap bench grinder wheels


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## TFrench (14 Mar 2020)

If it's just to take the teeth off and you don't need a perfect straight edge I'd just do it with a flap disc in an angle grinder. 

Sent from my SM-G973F using Tapatalk


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## AES (15 Mar 2020)

Sorry, what's a "BUARSTARD" file???  

(What they all said).


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## Vann (15 Mar 2020)

You'd think the moderators would have made an exception for this type of file. It is a legitimate term after all (hammer) .

Or do they think we'd all loose our cool and call each other "second cuts"? :roll: 

Oh sorry, I've never tried grinding a safety edge on a file - but I think might experiment.

Cheers, Vann.


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## AES (15 Mar 2020)

My guess is that the naughty words filter is a bit of software that just works automatically without human intervention. And if you consider, that word would be VERY useful in other contexts IF a thread turned into a slanging match - it wouldprobably have appeared here already in some threads if that filter wasn't there. ;-)


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## ED65 (15 Mar 2020)

thetyreman":2tljrlrk said:


> ...do I need to dip it in water to stop overheating?


Rule of thumb is if it gets too hot cool it down, or work more slowly. 

You should do this work bare-handed for various reasons, and it's easy to keep on top of overheating that way. The body of the file should never get even close to 100° so well below any temperature that puts temper at risk.


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## ED65 (15 Mar 2020)

sunnybob":9kc334hg said:


> you want the roughest file made...


Just a minor correction on this point to prevent future confusion in those not in the know, b*astard files are at least one notch down from the coarsest cut in conventional naming (which not all makers follow).

The usual convention in coarseness grading or 'cut' in main-sequence files is:
Dead Smooth
Smooth
2nd Cut or Second Cut
B*stard
Coarse

On top of this coarseness is related to file length, so a 12" 2nd Cut file might be coarser than an 8" B*stard, etc. And it's why long (>14") b*astard files seem so very coarse.

On top of this non-standard file types like dreadnoughts (vixen files in the US, same cut sold as bodywork files and aluminium files) and "multi-cut" or "millenicut" files are even coarser in terms of tooth count, but leave a surprisingly smooth surface – very like the floats traditional to plane making.


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## Ttrees (15 Mar 2020)

I'd say I reached that temperature whilst grinding this file ED65
Not suggesting that its not possibly problematic, it seemed fine for this wee file and possibly others.
Sorry I have no better photos of it ATM
Tom


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## Normancb (15 Mar 2020)

Arc Eurotrade sells flat files with two safe edges - though I think they start at second cut. You probably need to smooth the edges a bit as there is usually some burring from the manufacture but you can do that easily with a diamond file.


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## Bm101 (15 Mar 2020)

https://youtu.be/re_bp5Lp0To

Take a look at this Ben. Bill Carter on blunt chisels.


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