# Custom Cutters



## Nick W (26 Jun 2006)

Does anyone have recommendations (pref. from experience) for makers of custom router cutters?


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## Colin C (26 Jun 2006)

Hi Nick I would like to know why if you dont mind  , I have not had any made so I would not know.


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## JFC (26 Jun 2006)

Ive looked for ages and everyone has said no  Spindle moulder tooling is cheaper to make so they assume you will buy a spindle moulder .
If you find some please let me know .


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## jasonB (26 Jun 2006)

Not used them but I believe that Titman do a bespoke router bit service.

Jason


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## Nick W (26 Jun 2006)

You'll love this one people. Just spoke to Titman, they will do a custom cutter, but I have to go through my 'local' supplier (best part of 30 miles away) - even to get a price, and 'We don't sell to users, only to tool companies. That has been our policy for 40 years'. 

Another company stuck in the same time warp as Tilgear I fear.

Think I'll stick to Wealden for my normal needs; one 'phone call or web visit, and it's here the next morning.

Colin,

I have a need for a very particular, non-standard shape.


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## Nick W (26 Jun 2006)

Oh yes, nearly forgot, I have had a price from Trend, and am waiting from one from NLS Tools, whose name I got from the good people at Wealden (they, unfortunately don't do custom bits  ).


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## Scrit (26 Jun 2006)

Nick W":21lo1pw8 said:


> Just spoke to Titman, they will do a custom cutter, but I have to go through my 'local' supplier (best part of 30 miles away) - even to get a price, and 'We don't sell to users, only to tool companies. That has been our policy for 40 years'. ......
> 
> I have a need for a very particular, non-standard shape.



Unlike Trend, Wealden and NLS (or for that matter Tilgear), Titman are a true industrial manufacturer (the others buy-in from Israel, Italy, Germany, China, etc.) and they aren't set-up to take credit cards and deal with non-trade enquiries, so going through a dealer isn't a hassle if you already have an account with a dealer. They will generally take a drawing and give a cost/time estimate quite quickly providing you can tell them who you are dealing with. The custom cutters generally run £65 to £125 + VAT on 1/2in shank in my exerience (can be much more if the cutter is very large/complicated), but they seem to be generally a similar price but better quality than Trend from my own usage. The major downer is that most of this stuff is 6 to 8 weeks turnaround wherever you go, whereas spindle cutters are 6 to 10 working days, even in carbide tipped.

Scrit


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## Nick W (26 Jun 2006)

Scrit,

What you say is, as usual, very true, and I would, other things being equal, prefer to buy from them as a British Manufacturing Company. However as they have a very thin dealer network, and won't sell direct, while they haven't exactly lost my custom ('cos I've never bought from them before), they certainly have failed to gain it. That is a shame, as it would have been a pretty easy sale, and I do seem to be building quite a reasonable collection of cutters, both router and spindle. Not a huge purchaser, but more than most I would say. 

I have now ordered from NLS, and they have quoted a 3 week turnaround, so we shall see how they perform.


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## Anonymous (26 Jun 2006)

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## JFC (26 Jun 2006)

Nick , NLS are a great firm and have sorted my needs out where most other companys couldn't be bothered . (Trend to name one . Very unhelpful and i wont bother using them again . In fact i will go out of my way to buy a fraud router cutter rather than a trend one ) :twisted: 
I can only sing praises for NLS , quick turn around and a spot on cutter . So spot on they put bits in there i didn't know where on the paint covered mould until i looked at the end grain sample !


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## Colin C (26 Jun 2006)

Sorry just one question  
How is NLS and what are they details please


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## Jake (26 Jun 2006)

Nick W":3dz8rpxh said:


> I do seem to be building quite a reasonable collection of cutters, both router and spindle.



I'm curious then why you are after a router cutter in this instance, rather than getting some spindle blades ground. You obviously have a good reason, but I can't work out what it is.


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## Scrit (27 Jun 2006)

Nick W":alqf01o5 said:


> However as they _(Titman)_ have a very thin dealer network, and won't sell direct, while they haven't exactly lost my custom ('cos I've never bought from them before), they certainly have failed to gain it.



Their network is predominently commercial/industrial and they are well known in the CNC and Corian markets where people tend to buy hundreds or even thousands of pounds of tooling at a go. For example I tend to buy my dowel boring bits in tens (i.e. £150+ a punt) but get them next day, even if some are from my supplier and the rest from Titman themselves. Titman do, however, sell through most of the saw doctors and sharpening services in the North of England (so presumably they have southern agents, after all they are n Clacton-on-Sea in Essex) as well as some of the professional machinery suppliers (same is true of Freud these days). In fact I know of 7 or 8 suppliers in my own patch (or at least within 40 miles). They are just approaching a different market to Trend.

If anyone would like a Titman dealer who carries stock and does mail order might I suggest JMJ Woodworking Machinery at Skidby near Hull? Din't know if they do credit cards, but Steve in the Tooling Dept knows what he's about and he'll get specials delivered mail order to you fromTitman without going through JMJ (this is standard Titman service). BTW I have no association with JMJ other than being a satisfied customer.

Scrit


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## Anonymous (27 Jun 2006)

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## Nick W (27 Jun 2006)

Colin,

You will find NLS Tools here

Jake,

I need a router cutter because part of the job is to apply the moulding to a concave curve that a spindle moulder won't get into, and the shape is such that it won't come out of a standard 40/50mm knife, and I don't have a suitable block to carry a knife of the right shape. There, 3 reaso ns for the price of one :lol:


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## Anonymous (27 Jun 2006)

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## wrightclan (27 Jun 2006)

Hi Nick,

Perhaps you've already considered this. But many times, what at first seems like a complex single moulding, can be achieved with a combination of smaller, standard bits, and even some angled cuts on a table saw, as part of the overall shape. As it's a curved piece, tablesaw cutting obviously won't come into play. But have you considered how it might be done with a combination of bits in one piece or in a build-up of mouldings?

Brad


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## Anonymous (27 Jun 2006)

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## Nick W (27 Jun 2006)

Thanks for the hints, but it is not a complex moulding, just a particular one, and the radius of the concave parts to which I need to apply the moulding is too small for a spindle moulder head, and because it is concave a vertical profile cutter won't cut the mustard.


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## Nick W (14 Oct 2006)

It has just occurred to me that I ought to post the results of this thread.

I was making a low chest of drawers, with cushioned drawer fronts, and the same moulding applied to the top (both sides) and feet. Here it is:






One of the feet





The drawer fronts





Figure in the top





It is made of Sapele with a waxed garnet shellac finish.

In the end I went for the NLS option (it was cheapest). The cutter came within the time they estimated, to spec, and worked very well, with a good rake angle on the blades. My only quibble might be with the quality of the ground finish on the profile of the blades, but they cut nice and cleanly, which is what counts, so overall I am very happy with the product.


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## Philly (14 Oct 2006)

That came out nice! Love the figure in the Sapele, beautiful.
Cheers
Philly


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## Matt1245 (14 Oct 2006)

Really nice looking chest of drawers. Sapele is one of my favourite timbers at the moment.



> You'll love this one people. Just spoke to Titman, they will do a custom cutter, but I have to go through my 'local' supplier (best part of 30 miles away) - even to get a price, and 'We don't sell to users, only to tool companies. That has been our policy for 40 years'.
> 
> Another company stuck in the same time warp as Tilgear I fear.



I wish more companies would only supply through distributors, as it's one way of showing support to the people in the shops doing the hard work of selling the products for them, rather than undercutting them, taking all there profits and making it even harder in rip off britain to make a living.

Rant over  

Matt.


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## Paul Chapman (14 Oct 2006)

That's very nice, Nick :wink: 

Paul


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## Anonymous (14 Oct 2006)

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## Anonymous (14 Oct 2006)

Mr_Grimsdale":3tght0ds said:


> It's nice to try and be independent of machinery and expensive tooling IMHO.



OOOh!!! Have to disagree with that, IMHO


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## Nick W (15 Oct 2006)

Jacob,

In theory I agree, but in practice I have to (try to) make a living.


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## Anonymous (15 Oct 2006)

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## Nick W (15 Oct 2006)

Jacob,

Everything I do is desinged and made to order, and usually a one off, though I will certainly start using that cushioned profile as part of my design armoury. But, at the end of the day the cutter has already paid for itself in time saved, so in some ways it doesn't owe me anything.


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## Scrit (15 Oct 2006)

Did you know that Felder do a "soft-form" cutterblock for the spindle moulder with a range of profiles like that?

Scrit


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## Nick W (15 Oct 2006)

Ididn't knwo about that, but the problem of getting into the inner radius of the feet would still stand - though I suppose I _could_ have done that part by hand.


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## Scrit (15 Oct 2006)

Nick W":20uit973 said:


> I didn't know about that, but the problem of getting into the inner radius of the feet would still stand - though I suppose I _could_ have done that part by hand.


I'm not so sure, they look borderline for a ring fence or guide bearing in a spindle to me

Scrit


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## Chris Knight (15 Oct 2006)

Nick,
It is a couple of years ago now but I visited Wealden and spoke to someone there who explained how they sourced their cutters to me - I was buying a few at the time. He went on to say that they could/would(?) do a profile to order. I forget the details I am afraid but it might be worth contacting them.


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## Scrit (15 Oct 2006)

Chris

I believe their catalogue now says that they've stopped doing the one-offs, which is why I use Titman, Colton or CUK

Scrit


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## Chris Knight (15 Oct 2006)

Scrit,
Thanks. Shame - all good things have to come to an end I s'pose.


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## Inspector (15 Oct 2006)

Nick

Just curious. How close is this bit to the one you had made?

http://www.leevalley.com/wood/page.aspx ... at=1,46168


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## Nick W (15 Oct 2006)

Scrit,

The radius at the base of each foot is approx 1 1/2", so a moulder block would not fit, or at least none that I've got. And anyway you'd have had a fit seeing how I profiled them on the router table, so it was probably better to stay away from a moulder.   

This, by the way explains the slightly wobbly profile on the feet. Now in an ideal world I might have tidied them up, but the imperfection makes them look more hand crafted I feel. Of course the photographer had to choose the worst example to picture, and then light the imperfections to perfection, as it were. :roll: And he chose the worst bit of finishing too. #-o 

Inspector,

I don't know how close that one is as they don't give the critical dimensions. The profile I wanted was a quarter ellipse major radius 1", minor 1/4", and by having the cutter made that's exactly (within grinding tolerances before the philosophers/engineers start questioning what _exact _means) what I got.

W37,

I did ask Wealden if they could make the cutter, but indeed they have now stopped doing that, which is why they referred me to NLS.



Sorry for the use of inches here, I don't normally work pre-historic :lol: , but the customer would only think imperial (lovley old lady), so I had to work imperial for the major dimensions in the design, and it was easier to carry this through the whole project.


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## Nick W (7 Jan 2007)

Further to what has been said above about Titman, it now appears that they will sell stuff to anyone on line :shock: . Go here


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## Nick W (17 Sep 2007)

PostScript:

It would appear that NLS will no longer do custom cutters


> Thank you for your enquiry, however, I regret that we ceased the manufacture of this kind of tooling in October 2006, and therefore are unable to offer a quotation,


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