# Turning Pens



## cd (8 Sep 2005)

Hi all,
For some time now I've been wanting to have a go at turning pens, problem is I don't really know where to start equipment wise. I've looked a pen kits, mandrels, presses, barrel trimmers, bushes etc. These all seem to come in different shapes and sizes :? . I know several members are pen turners so what I'm wondering is what do I need to get started ?

Thanks in advance
cd


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## trevtheturner (9 Sep 2005)

Hi cd,

I bought most of my kit from Turners' Retreat stand at the Stoneleigh Park Show last autumn. I'll just list it for clarity:

1. a mandrel with a morse taper to fit my lathe, complete with 7mm bushes.

2. a barrel trimmer to square the ends of the blanks with the tubes, so that they fit snugly on the mandrel for turning.

3. a set of Crown pen-turning tools comprising a small gouge, a small skew and a parting tool. This set, in the light of experience, was not essential. In place of the small gouge you could use a small bowl gouge for the roughing, followed by a small spindle gouge for the remaining turning. The small skew can be useful for final planing cuts, especially on difficult woods. The small parting tool I have never used because I use the barrel trimmer, although I do use a 1/4" beading/parting tool as a scraper for final finishing when turning acrylic and corian.

4. a few ready drilled blanks.

5. a few pen kits - standard 7mm slimline click-pen kits, 24ct gold plated, about £3 per kit.

6. some good quality superglue, or Titebond polyurethane (takes a few hours to set but is gap filling if you get a loose tube).

7. sanding and polishing materials (I use different processes depending on the material I have used) which you no doubt already have.

That is all you need really to get started. I haven't bothered with a press. I saw a demonstrator at a show using a 'quick clamp' of suitable size. I do the same, having added hardwood facings to the soft jaws of the clamp to provide enough resistance to the components to press them in place (some bits will otherwise just sink in to the soft jaws!)

I now cut all my own blanks from woods with interesting colours/grain patterns and for drilling them use a 6.9mm bit (from Axminster, who will no doubt have the rest of the stuff listed above) as I find this provides a better fit for the brass tubes than a 7mm bit. I made a very simple jig to hold the blanks vertically on the drill press table for drilling.

Essentially, to start with, you just need to stay with a mandrel with 7mm bushes together with 7mm pen kits.

If I can help with anything else, ask away.

Cheers,

Trev.


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## cd (9 Sep 2005)

Thanks Trev,
Just what I was looking for, I'm hoping to go to Stoneleigh this year, so if patience allows I might wait and pick up the bits there.
It would be nice to start using up some of the small offcuts I've been saving up  

cd


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## geoff_tulip (9 Sep 2005)

i agree - i make them using the 7mm mandrel, for the 7mm kits - other mandrels are available for 'thicker pen kits' - but not alot of kits available in these sizes in uk- standard turning tools will do fine- you can make a simple 7mm mandrel from a piece of 7mm threaded bar with two flanges on either end, and nuts on both ends for tightening, and grip using jacobs chuck on one end and tailstock into punched/drilled centre on other.
i have an excess of pen kits if you are interested - £1.50 each , a good drill bit is essential for straight drilling and a pot of superglue should be everything you need.


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## cd (9 Sep 2005)

Thanks for the offer Geoff,
I'm going to try and get to the stonleigh show and see what I can pick up there. Once I've got the mandrel and bits I may come back to you about the pen kits if the offer's still there.

cd


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## trevtheturner (9 Sep 2005)

Hi cd,

If you can get to the Stoneleigh Show on the Sunday, let me know and I will bring a few ready-drilled pen blanks along for you.

Cheers,

Trev.


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## Jaco (11 Sep 2005)

Trev, you want to drop some off at my place on the way???? :shock:  :shock:


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## trevtheturner (11 Sep 2005)

Wouldn't mind, Jaco. Need to bring my gun? and snake bite antidote? :wink: 

Cheers,

Trev.


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## cd (11 Sep 2005)

Cheers Trev,
Unfortunately SWMBO has plans for the sunday  , I'm probably going to go on the saturday all being well. 

cd


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## Taffy Turner (12 Sep 2005)

Inspired by this thread, I bought the Planet Complete Pen Turning Kit at Yandles on Saturday, together with some exotic pen blanks.

As soon as the cricket season finishes (two more weekends), I will be back to the turning and will have a go at some pens. I will keep you all posted as to the results.

Regards

Gary


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## trevtheturner (12 Sep 2005)

Gary,

FWIW I use the Planet mandrel and find it excellent.

Cheers,

Trev.


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## Taffy Turner (12 Sep 2005)

Trev,

Cheers - that's a relief! It wasn't a planned purchase, I was just wandering around idly browsing as you do, when I noticed Planet Tools were selling complete pen turning kits for £35, so I thought "what the heck - lets give it a try". I'm glad that I didn't buy a lemon!

Regards

Gary


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## trevtheturner (12 Sep 2005)

In addition to the mandrel, what else did you get in your complete kit, Gary? Sounds like a good buy to me. Planet is generally good quality kit - but look where it is made! :wink: 

Cheers,

Trev.


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## cd (12 Sep 2005)

Sounds like a good buy Gary,
I've seen some kits at around the £50 mark so I too would be interested in what you got with it. Was it a show offer or is it generally available ?

Charles


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## Taffy Turner (13 Sep 2005)

Trev, Charles

Uuummm :-k - from memory (I am in work, and the kit is at home), the kit contains a mandrel (available in No1 or 2 Morse Taper), a barrel trimmer, various sized spacers for the mandrel to allow different size / bores of pen to be accommodated, a couple of allen keys, a small spanner for locking up the mandrel, 5 pen kits and a set of instructions, all housed in a good quality plastic case.

I think that the normal price for the kit is around £50, but the £35 was a special show offer.

The kit seems to be good quality, and I have several other items made by Planet, drive centres, calipers etc which I have been pleased with. They seem to make good stuff, but as they are a small, relatively unknown manufacturer, their prices are realistic, especially compared to Robert Sorby et all.

Regards

Gary


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## Jaco (13 Sep 2005)

trevtheturner":2ac7eav2 said:


> Wouldn't mind, Jaco. Need to bring my gun? and snake bite antidote? :wink:



Trev, not quite sure why you want to do that.
Its the Tigers. gaitors and pythons that become a problem, but then we just arm-wrestle them!


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## Taffy Turner (13 Sep 2005)

Jaco,

I will be coming to South Africa at the end of January on a cricket tour - make sure all the snakes have been cleared away from the pitches before then please mate!!

Regards

Gary


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## Anonymous (14 Oct 2005)

Ive just received an email from rutlands about a new range of pen kits and accessories. I normally buy my pen stuff from craft supplies but recently Ive been disapointed with the quality. Looking at rutlands website theres a big selection and it looks good stuff too. I'm going to order a couple of kits as soon as I can reclaim my credit card off SWMBO!


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## cd (16 Oct 2005)

Update:

Well, I had a good day out at Stoneliegh on Saturday, took my Dad and enjoyed some good demo's and picked up some great tips. Missed getting to Terry for 12  in fact I didn't get to the chestnut stand until about 3:30.
I got all the bits I wanted for the Pens from the guys at Turners Retreat including a personal demo of how to make a pen from scratch, very helpful  .

And despite swmbo's best efforts to keep me decorating, I found a half hour this evening to have a go.







The wood an offcut of Paduak I had lying around, finished with some friction polish.

cd


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## DaveL (16 Oct 2005)

cd":srjoysdp said:


> took my Dad


 
I am glad I am the only one to take their Dad out for the day.  

Nice pen, can I ask how much the kit of bits cost? :^o


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## trevtheturner (16 Oct 2005)

Nice pen, cd.  Now you will find all those small offcuts of interesting timbers that you keep, wondering what on earth you might one day do with them ........................

I had an enjoyable day at Stoneleigh today.  Came home with an empty wallet as usual. :roll: 

Cheers,

Trev.


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## cd (17 Oct 2005)

DaveL":5rwn9wor said:


> I am glad I am the only one to take their Dad out for the day.


Dad's not really a "woody" but really enjoyed the Day and I don't think I've had a day out with just him for years :shock: 



DaveL":5rwn9wor said:


> Nice pen, can I ask how much the kit of bits cost? :^o


I'm trying hard not to add it up I bought some other things as well but the Mandrel,MT adapter, barell trimmer, 10 kits (5 pen 5 pencil) was about £35 I included some abasives, spare screws and a couple of cutters for my RS230kt. So all in was a bit more than that :!: but they knocked about £10 of the whole lot.

Trev,
Im already changing my idea of what is an offcut, anything bigger than my thumb :shock: can be used .

cd


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## Gill (16 Nov 2005)

I think I've got lost; you don't often find me in this part of the forum  .

His Lordship videotaped part of a television programme today which shows how wooden pens are turned. If anyone would like a copy, I've transferred it to WMV format - just PM me your email address and I'll send it. The file is large (7.88MB) so it takes about 5 minutes to download on 1mb broadband. The programme itself is just under 5 minutes long.

Gill


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## WoodPecker (16 Nov 2005)

What type of lathe would be suitable for turning pens?


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## Taffy Turner (16 Nov 2005)

I think most lathes are capable of turning pens - you just nee dthe correct mandrel.

If you are buying a lathe just to turn pens, then most of the mini-lathes would do the job I would have though.

Regards

Gary


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## trevtheturner (17 Nov 2005)

Hi Adrian,

Exactly what Gary said.

In addition, if you do not have a lathe but are contemplating getting one, be aware that turning can become addictive! (Ask Chas.). It is most unlikely, indeed almost certain, that you would not want to stop at turning pens.

Before I started turning I sought advice from lots of turners and the best advice I received from some of the 'pros' was to get the biggest and best that I could within my budget. This was on the basis that on a small lathe you can only turn small things, but on a large lathe you can turn large things and also small things (down to miniatures if you want). So I bought a lathe with 40" between centres and a maximum bowl turning capacity of 30" diameter - this is the lathe I use for pen turning. :wink: If you buy a small one, probably within about 3 months you will be wanting to ditch it for a larger one.

Cheers,

Trev.


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## Taffy Turner (17 Nov 2005)

Hi Adrian,

I would agree 100% with Trevor.

FWIW in the For Sale section at the back of this months Woodturning magazine there is a second hand Record CL4 for sale for £600.

This is the lathe that I have, and I am more than happy with it. It is a lot of lathe for the money, and at £600, provided it is in good nick (advert claims nearly new), I wouldn't have thought you could go far wrong.

Regards

Gary


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## WoodPecker (17 Nov 2005)

Those are encouraging comments. I've committed to buying a SH CL3, from a good source  Reckoned I'd bite the bullet straight off, I'm sure I'll manage with the manual speed change. 

I've read a good few chapters of Keith Rowleys book.
And my better half is buying me the 6 piece RP spindle turning set for Crimbo.

Should be well set for the new year 8) 

By the way *Gill* thanks for sending (And taping) the pen turning vid, great introduction.


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## Taffy Turner (17 Nov 2005)

Adrian,

The CL3 is a perfectly good lathe. Once you become more experienced, if you decide that you want to upgrade to variable speed (well worth it IMHO), you can buy an upgrade kit (this was discussed on here a few months ago - a search should find the thread OK).

You won't go far wrong with the RP spindle turning set.

Good luck, and let us know how you get on.

Regards

Gary


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## Taffy Turner (17 Nov 2005)

A question for the experienced pen turners out there - when drilling the blanks do you use a brad point drill or a normal bullet point?

I have a load of blanks to drill this w/e, and am wondering which drill would be best?

Cheers

Gary


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## cd (17 Nov 2005)

Gary,
Wouldn't say I'm experienced ( made six now) but I did drill for 20 pens at the weekend and used a brad point.
I find it much easier to drill where I want with a brad point for most things tbh.

cd


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## trevtheturner (18 Nov 2005)

Hi Gary,

I use just an ordinary HSS bit in my drill press. 7mm bit is recommended for the 7mm slimline pens but I now use a 6.9mm (obtained from Axminster) as I find this provides a better fit for the brass tubes. I don't know whether it is standard practice but I also give the tubes a going-over with abrasive paper to remove the tarnish on them and to provide some roughening to provide a good key for the glue.

What do you, and cd, use to hold your blanks for drilling? I use a simple jig made of two pieces of wood, about 2" wide x 5" high, joined at right angles along their length and absolutely square across their bottom edges. I then merely fix the blank into the right angle with two small quick clamps and hold the assembly down square onto the drill press table. I find this quick and easy, and saves me 40+ quid for a special pen blank vice from Axminster. Mind you, if I was really making a lot of them .....

Cheers,

Trev.


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## Taffy Turner (18 Nov 2005)

CD, Trev,

Thanks for the advice.

Yes - first job is to make a jig to hold the blanks square. I will try using both bits and see if there is a difference.

What do you guys use to glue the barrels in with? I was planning on using Gorilla glue, which is a PU glue, and as such will foam, hopefully helping to center the barrel in the hole. I have seen both PU glues and Cyanoacrylates recommended on various websites, but there is nothing like a personal recommendation.

Regards

Gary


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## trevtheturner (18 Nov 2005)

Hi Gary,

I actually use both types of glue for fixing the barrels.

If I am preparing some blanks for future use, or if the tubes are a bit loose in the blank, I use Titebond polyurethane. Probably exactly the same as Gorilla - it foams and has the gap filling properties. I leave these to cure for at least eight hours, usually overnight.

If I want to get on with a pen straightaway I use cyanoacrylate - the slow cure one which has a setting time of 20 seconds+. But you still need to be quick. On more than one occasion I have found the tube stuck half in, half out!  

If you don't already have one, I strongly recommend the tube inserter tool (£4.10) available from Turners Retreat (01302-744344 - www.turners-retreat.co.uk). This allows you to get the tube home quickly and safely whilst keeping the glue off your fingers. But be sparing with the cyanoacrylate, else you may find the tube is stuck fast to the inserter from the squeeze-out. DAMHIKT! Experience has taught me that it's in with the tube and out with the inserter almost as one action, then wipe/clean the inserter before the next one.

Cheers,

Trev.


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## Taffy Turner (18 Nov 2005)

Cheers Trev,

I will bare that in mind - it wouldn't be the first time I have supeglued the wrong items together!!!  

Learned an interesting fact when using superglue to glue a crack in a blank the other day. It is much better to remove your Trend Airstream before using the glue, otherwise it blows nasty fumes in your face, which makes your eyes burn for about an hour after!! 

I certainly won't be making that mistake again in a hurry. I had to go back into the house and flush my eyes out with water in the end.  

No long term harm done as far as I can tell. #-o 

Regards

Gary


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## cd (18 Nov 2005)

Hi Gary,
I've only used CA glue for the barrels the barrels I've had a couple come loose when I'm trimming the blanks square so I might try some polyurethane glue next time. I too would recommend an inserter for the tubes but being a bit tight I just turned one. If I get a chance tonight I'll take a picture of it and the guide I've made to drill the blanks, its much easier than trying to describe them.



> It is much better to remove your Trend Airstream before using the glue, otherwise it blows nasty fumes in your face which makes your eyes burn for about an hour after!!
> 
> I certainly won't be making that mistake again in a hurry.


  I remeber that, But you only do it once :wink: 


cd


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## Johnboy (18 Nov 2005)

I use a 5 minute epoxy to glue the tubes in. Fills any gaps and is quick setting. Never had one come loose.

John


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## cd (18 Nov 2005)

I found a few minutes to take a couple of pics this evening

first two are the guide I made up to drill the blanks 






and with a blank held in it






and the simple tube inserter I turned 






out of interest what do you use to finish your pens, I've only used friction polish so far and it seems OK but I'm wondering what other have tried.

cd


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## trevtheturner (19 Nov 2005)

*Gary,*

Thanks for the tip about superglue fumes. I have never noticed them so far, so it's nice to be made aware of the danger. Pleased to hear that there was no lasting harm done.  

*cd,*

Thanks for the pics. of your drilling jig. That is exactly what I do - and you're right, a picture is worth a thousand words. :wink: 

Also like your tube inserter, just the job. And to think, I got sucked in at a show and wasted four quid on mine!  

Cheers,

Trev.


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## trevtheturner (19 Nov 2005)

*cd*,

Pen finishing - I have tried the following:

For wooden pens I have tried various methods. 
a. sanding sealer, flattened with 0000 wire wool, then waxed. 
b. sanding sealer, flattened, then melamine lacquer burnished with burnishing cream, then waxed.
c. the method I have finally settled on, quick and easy with just as good results, friction polish followed with a polish with carnauba wax from a stick with the lathe running at high speed. I have turned three ebony pens this evening. An absolutely filthy wood to turn but a brilliant glass-like finish achieved with this method.

I have also turned acrylic and corian for pens. I use a 3/8" beading/parting tool, used as a scraper, horizontal on the tool rest to provide a finished surface on the blank, then a light sanding with 1200 wet 'n' dry, then burnish with the cream, followed by friction polish. Prior to discovering Chestnut burnishing cream I used car rubbing-down compound on these, followed by car polish. That worked okay too.

So, having gone through all my trials and errors, what it comes down to is - friction polish. My only reservation about friction polish is that the finish may not be as durable as, say, a lacquer. However, as it is speedy and I've not had any complaints so far, I'll stick with it for the time being.

Cheers,

Trev.


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