# Bench Rebate Plane



## Sawyer (14 Mar 2012)

I've been looking for a bench rebate plane but can't justify the cost of the Lie Nielson one. So the first place to look seemed to be Ebay for a 2nd hand Record, or similar. No joy, but came up with, brand new, the Faithfull Bench Rebate Plane no. 10.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from= ... Categories

It was a pleasant surprise to discover that somebody is making these again, but are Faithfull planes any good?

At that price, £35, I'm guessing that they come from the Far East, and it seems too cheap to be of any reasonable quality. 

Anyone know about Faithfull planes, and the bench rebate in particular?


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## Richard T (14 Mar 2012)

Can't comment on the quality of Faithful as I have not tried one but I have found a second hand Stanley #78 to be an excellent plane and a good substitute for the missing #10/ bench rebate/ carriage makers' etc. from my armoury. 
I know they don't have the same width but at 1 -1/4" they're not bad at all.


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## Pete W (15 Mar 2012)

I've never had a No.10 or similar and can't say I've ever missed it.

As for the Faithful, I'd guess it will be the old problem of quality control - you might get a good one, or (perhaps more likely) you won't. Would a rabbeting block plane (like the Quangsheng from Workshop Heaven) be a reasonable compromise?


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## Sawyer (15 Mar 2012)

I reckon that the rabbeting block plane would a bit on the light side, Pete. For the lighter stuff, I already have a side-filister rebate plane, a wooden rebate plane and a shoulder plane. I'd like something with a bit more 'heft', hence my search for a no. 10.


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## The Wood Butcher (15 Mar 2012)

I'd wait and get a Record or Stanley from the bay. They come up often enough but you'll be looking at £80-£100 for one in good nick.


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## Paul Chapman (15 Mar 2012)

Pennyfarthing Tools are advertising a Record #010 at the moment - looks to be in good nick http://www.pennyfarthingtools.co.uk/new-woodwork.htm

Cheers :wink: 

Paul


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## Karl (15 Mar 2012)

I had a Faithfull No 7 once. The sole was so curved it could have passed for a compass plane!


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## beech1948 (15 Mar 2012)

If your considering a #78 then instead buy a Record #778. It has two metal arms instead of the Stanley single arm.

Al


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## AndyT (15 Mar 2012)

Paul Chapman":2y2s62ue said:


> Pennyfarthing Tools are advertising a Record #010 at the moment - looks to be in good nick http://www.pennyfarthingtools.co.uk/new-woodwork.htm
> 
> Cheers :wink:
> 
> Paul



- I wouldn't rely on their website as 100% accurate guide to their stock - the new address at Wantage is on the home tab, but 'contact us' still leads to Salisbury - and the recent items section has a good sprinkling of broken image links!


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## bugbear (16 Mar 2012)

beech1948":g13ro6nd said:


> If your considering a #78 then instead buy a Record #778. It has two metal arms instead of the Stanley single arm.
> 
> Al



And a proper screw depth adjuster.

BugBear


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## bugbear (16 Mar 2012)

Sawyer":21sm6n02 said:


> I've been looking for a bench rebate plane



At the risk of asking a silly question - what do you want to do with it?

If you actually want to cut big ol' rebates, I'd be more tempted by either a skew rebate or a moving fillster, both wooden, both superb, both cheap!

Skew rebates (especially) are very cheap.

Tuning woodies takes a little thought and care, but much good advice is available on the 'net from those who've gone before you...

BugBear


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## Sawyer (16 Mar 2012)

Bugbear, I'd use it for large rebates on stuff like door frames, which is why the greater width and weight attracts. To be honest, it's not at all urgent as I am pretty well equipped already and it would only get used occasionally. This is why I don't want to shell out £320+ for a Lie Nielson: however excellent it probably is. Alternatively, I'm skeptical that the £35 Faithfull would actually be any use. 
I now note that Anant do them too. :| Don't think I'll be going down _that_ route, somehow.

So perhaps I'll take my time and keep looking around. The going rate for a 010 seems to be around £90: not cheap , so probably worth looking at wooden ones. Ones I've seen in the past have been skewed though, so I suppose not ambidextrous, which is one of the 010's advantages.

'Bench rebate plane' though descriptive is a bit of a mouthfull. I much prefer the more picturesque 'carriage' or 'badger Plane'.


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## AndyT (16 Mar 2012)

When I made some glazed doors a while ago (https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/glazed-doors-mostly-by-hand-t39419.html) I tried out different ways of making the rebates, including planing them all the way, and rough chiselling followed by planing. I found that the quickest way was to use a narrow plough plane to cut two deep grooves, one from the face and one from the edge, then use a rebate plane just for the final tidying up. This also has the advantage of producing a potentially useful long thin stick!


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## GazPal (18 Mar 2012)

AndyT":3b7oj2ah said:


> When I made some glazed doors a while ago (https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/glazed-doors-mostly-by-hand-t39419.html) I tried out different ways of making the rebates, including planing them all the way, and rough chiselling followed by planing. *I found that the quickest way was to use a narrow plough plane to cut two deep grooves, one from the face and one from the edge, then use a rebate plane just for the final tidying up. This also has the advantage of producing a potentially useful long thin stick*!




This is among the quickest methods (Sawing being another) for rapid stock removal and producing accurately cut rebates.


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## Dangermouse (19 Mar 2012)

I purchased a Fathfull no10 carrage plane new, as it was on offer and ultra cheap, expecting it to be rubbish. But on taking a straight edge to it found that it was within British standard of 3 thou and the sides within a few thou too. So after a bit of fettling of about an hour it became a very good plane. The blade shapened up well and cuts fine, although its not up to LN quality, and I'm thinking of putting in a thick blade from Ray Iles, the Replacement Carriage Maker Plane Cutter Ref: RI001, costs around £18 to £20.


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## Jacob (19 Mar 2012)

beech1948":ezk6xd5p said:


> If your considering a #78 then instead buy a Record #778. It has two metal arms instead of the Stanley single arm.
> 
> Al


Yebbut one arm is enough, and half the time to adjust! 
Also the Stanley has a very clever design detail in that the fence covers the unused portion of the blade and so avoids cut fingers - a hazard with all the other makes I believe.


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## Benchwayze (19 Mar 2012)

Dangermouse":2dkkf2fa said:


> I purchased a Fathfull no10 carrage plane new, as it was on offer and ultra cheap, expecting it to be rubbish. But on taking a straight edge to it found that it was within British standard of 3 thou and the sides within a few thou too. So after a bit of fettling of about an hour it became a very good plane. The blade shapened up well and cuts fine, although its not up to LN quality, and I'm thinking of putting in a thick blade from Ray Iles, the Replacement Carriage Maker Plane Cutter Ref: RI001, costs around £18 to £20.



=D> 
Can't ask much more. Nice one DM


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## pswallace (19 Mar 2012)

I can't speak for the rebate plane faithful do but I have just recently bought A number 6 fore plane made by faithful (actually after reading A reply from Dangermouse on cheap fore planes) and I am really impressed ,had to flatten the sole for about 90 minutes but what do you expect for £35. After I polished the back or face of the iron and reground the bevel and honed A micro bevel I'm really happy with it. . . . . .by the way thanks Dangermouse!


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## Pete W (20 Mar 2012)

As noted far up the thread, the trouble with the low-cost toolmakers is consistency and quality control. It's always possible to get a good one, all-too-common to get a bad one. The very first planes I got were a Faithful set of No 5 and block plane (together with a sliding bevel, a square and a marking gauge). The block plane was excellent straight out of the box; the jack was rubbish and no amount of work could fettle it.

If you buy from a good retailer who'll exchange a poorer example it can be worth a punt, I think. But any time you get a good plane for little money you should count your blessings


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## Sawyer (20 Mar 2012)

Looks pretty good in the photo anyway, for what that's worth. At about 1/3 the price of a 2nd hand Record 010, I might be tempted to take a chance. If so, I'll let people know what it's like.

Thanks for the replies so far, everybody.


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## Vann (21 Mar 2012)

Dangermouse":2lawqc35 said:


> I purchased a Fathfull no10 carrage plane new, as it was on offer and ultra cheap, expecting it to be rubbish. But on taking a straight edge to it found that it was within British standard of 3 thou and the sides within a few thou too. So after a bit of fettling of about an hour it became a very good plane. The blade shapened up well and cuts fine, although its not up to LN quality, and I'm thinking of putting in a thick blade from Ray Iles, the Replacement Carriage Maker Plane Cutter Ref: RI001, costs around £18 to £20.


Hi Dangermouse.

What is the frog-to-body mating arrangement? Stanley stuck to their earlier cantilevered frog arrangement on their bench rabbets (10, 10¼, 10½) when they updated the arrangement on all their standard bench planes to the current stepped "Bailey" type. Record fitted the stepped "Bailey" type frog to all their bench rabbets (010 & 010¼). Lie-Nielsen went for a bedrock frog on their No.10¼. So the latter two manufacturers used their standard No.3 frogs on their rabbet range.

What does your _Faithful_ have (does it copy the Stanley arrangement _Faithful_ly #-o :lol: )?

Cheers, Vann.


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## RobNichols (3 Oct 2022)

I have a Faithful No.7 plane and I'm very pleased with it. I took a little time to flatten the base (an hour or so), and since then I've been really pleased with it. It's really good for jointing board. I don't think I'd buy a No.4 or No. 5 from Faithful as there are so many good second hand example at around the same price. But for planes that are otherwise pricey I think it's worth a punt.


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## Just4Fun (4 Oct 2022)

Pete W said:


> the trouble with the low-cost toolmakers is consistency and quality control. It's always possible to get a good one, all-too-common to get a bad one.


An interesting point. I bought 2 new Silverline #4s in the same order. I am happy with, and use, both but they are different. Not in ways that affect their use but the difference is noticable and measurable. Variations could lead to problems, although they haven't in my case.


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## D_W (4 Oct 2022)

Sawyer said:


> Looks pretty good in the photo anyway, for what that's worth. At about 1/3 the price of a 2nd hand Record 010, I might be tempted to take a chance. If so, I'll let people know what it's like.
> 
> Thanks for the replies so far, everybody.



I guess the question I'd have for you, because I've bought just about anything I even had a bit of curiosity for, is figuring out where you'll use one of these. 

I had the LN version. Everything I imagined it would be good for, it wasn't really. It looks like it will be useful based on the iron going all the way to the edge, but these close type cuts are either wide and thin shavings or narrow (like cleaning up a rebate, or whatever it might be). 

I bought the LN version from someone who never managed to use it at all, and I didn't manage to plane more than a couple of hundred feet with it. Maybe the double iron would make it a good plane for cleaning up facets on a fielded raised panel, but I never got there. In the end, it went to the same place as the LN 140 -to ebay.


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## RobNichols (7 Oct 2022)

RobNichols said:


> I have a Faithful No.7 plane and I'm very pleased with it. I took a little time to flatten the base (an hour or so), and since then I've been really pleased with it. It's really good for jointing board. I don't think I'd buy a No.4 or No. 5 from Faithful as there are so many good second hand example at around the same price. But for planes that are otherwise pricey I think it's worth a punt.


I took the punt as I spotted Toolchimp are selling them at £32.57. I'm pleased so far. 

After reading some of the reviews I thought I'd check all the screws as someone was complaining that the frog screws where cross threaded. One of mine is a little tight, but doesn't appear to be damaged.

The sole looks pretty flat on first look, though probably a little flattening wouldn't hurt. Also one side isn't quite square. So a little fettling is in order I think. But at this price I'm happy to do that.


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## RobNichols (20 Nov 2022)

I got to use my Faithful No. 10 in anger today to shave a couple of millimeters off a door frame. It worked a treat and cut lovely even shavings. It cut right into the corners as you'd expect. I found I had to give the chip breaker a little more work as initially I was getting some jamming. However, a little work at the diamond stones fixed that.

I'm really pleased with it. Definitely a good addition to the tool chest.


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## Just4Fun (20 Nov 2022)

I saw a fairly modern Stanley in a flea market a few days ago, complete with fence. I don't really need such an item and they wanted 90 euro for it so I decided to pass.


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