# second hand hegner buyers beware !!



## mac1012 (27 Jan 2014)

Just been looking at second hand hegners on ebay and this one caught my eye and not for the reasons you might think.

http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll? ... 1260268889

the blurb says its a multicut 2 which it is and a link to compare on hegner website but.......

it is a multicut 2 but pre 1995 , you can tell this by the air hose going straight into the top of the upper arm after 1995 it changed to a holder connected to the upper arm bush (and post 1995 you can convert to a flexi hose pre 1995 you cannot )

the on off switch has a very old metal looking lever bit like really old light switches used to be 

there is no quick release tension and more important the throat is not 18inch but I think 14 0r 15inch the m2 pre 1995 were not 18inch throat , you can tell by the shape it looks very much like a more modern m1 it is a multicut 2 but only really in name compared to the modern m2
just be aware because there is one or two on ebay that are pre 1995 and the spec is greatly different despite the sellers comparing there saw with the latest models 

mark


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## mac1012 (27 Jan 2014)

I sent a message to the seller and as I thought the spec of this machine on ebay is same as a new hegner, throat 365mm and 50mm depth cut so the machine in no way resembles the spec of a multicut 2 which the seller encourages you to click link to hegner site for spec of m2 

mark


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## Grahamshed (27 Jan 2014)

I see it finishes in an hour or so. If ir stays around the price it is now then I would guess the buyer knows the situation.
Interesting to watch though and see what it reaches. the seller does allow returns.


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## martinka (27 Jan 2014)

There's another one finishing in 4 days which is the same model but has the hold down arm with it. I believe this model, as far as most parts are concerned, is the same as the later Multicut 1


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## powertools (27 Jan 2014)

I think that anybody who wants to take up scroll sawing as a hobby and feels the need to own a top of the range saw in order to do it should just bite the bullet and buy a new one. There have been many threads in the past where people have purchased 20 year old machines that were the best 20 years ago but were worn out when they purchased them and had then to spend stupid amounts to buy the parts to put the thing right.


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## mac1012 (27 Jan 2014)

know but the buyer may not know the situation graham , I think it is wrong to advertise a machine in this way it is blatant mis selling in my opinion , I don't think it is worth that kind of money , when I upgrade my hegner which is 3 years old I will sell it for around 200 half price what I brought it for I wouldn't pay nearly 200 for a hegner at least 20 years old but then again its not my money

I think it is important to make people aware that a m2 this old is totally different to a recent m2 especially when they are linking it to hegner website

they are not the only ones that have done it I seen it done a lot on ebay 

mark


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## martinka (28 Jan 2014)

To be fair, Mark, I think a fair few of the Hegner sellers don't know what they are selling, other than that Hegners are well thought of and hold their price. The ones who do know what they've got, hang on to them.


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## scrimper (28 Jan 2014)

Looking at the machine in the link above it went for around £190 which IMHO is not unreasonable, I would prefer to pay £190 for this than waste it on a new cheaper machine that is not fit for purpose, I understand that it's older but in my experience scrollsaws are pretty reliable and will go on for many years without wearing out. Hegner spares are horrendously expensive but are rarely needed unless one is really unlucky.

Perhaps the seller was naughty if he showed a link to a newer model but in fairness when buying on ebay or any auction site it pays to consider caveat emptor and a prospective buyer should do at least a little research before parting with the cash.


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## mac1012 (28 Jan 2014)

martin scrimper , sorry we will have to agree to disagree on both counts, I believe some sellers know exactly what they are doing some may not either way you have to be careful.

goods should be as descripton whether new or second hand and there was not much info on this one only the link ,on this one your info on throat size etc is only provided by the link to the hegner website so that is what the customer would research , how is fred blogs gonna know that pre 1995 is a totally different m2 as you cant research that info.

yeah you could email seller but that's missing the point if the seller is saying this is the correct info for what I am selling 

it just annoys me when people on ebay put things like this would cost 1,ooo pounds new etc and its no where near the same spec

I wouldn't touch the old ones with a barge pole certainly not pre 1995 I would rather pay the extra and get new but that's me.

maybe its me being picky but if you wanna spend your money on a item that now way reflects what you are buying then fill your boots.

you may get a gem but then again you may not.

mark


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## mac1012 (28 Jan 2014)

just to add when I said I thinks it is important people know the difference I didn't mean the seller on ebay , I meant its important I let any people on here especially new people what the differences are , my reason for doing this thread was to give people some info on here who are thinking of getting second hand hegner what to look out for so to avoid disappointment and make a better informed choice.

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: 

mark


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## bugbear (28 Jan 2014)

martinka":1peanaz5 said:


> There's another one finishing in 4 days which is the same model but has the hold down arm with it. I believe this model, as far as most parts are concerned, is the same as the later Multicut 1



Quite right - I've got one!

original-hegner-muticut-2-manual-sought-t69816.html?hilit=hegner

BugBear


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## scrimper (28 Jan 2014)

mac1012":392gwpv1 said:


> martin scrimper , sorry we will have to agree to disagree on both counts, I believe some sellers know exactly what they are doing some may not either way you have to be careful.
> 
> goods should be as descripton whether new or second hand and there was not much info on this one only the link ,on this one your info on throat size etc is only provided by the link to the hegner website so that is what the customer would research , how is fred blogs gonna know that pre 1995 is a totally different m2 as you cant research that info.
> 
> ...



As I said above whatever the rights and wrongs; when you are buying on ebay it is Caveat Emptor.
There have been enough stories about people who have been conned or made purchases that did not turn out as the buyer expected for buyers to know that they must be on their guard when buying this way. It may not be right but it happens.

I still think this saw will make a decent saw for the buyer, it may not be cutting edge but it's a damn sight better than some of the cheap saws on the market.


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## rspsteve (28 Jan 2014)

I bought one 5 months ago and have not even opened it up.... :shock: it could be a parcel full of bricks... (hammer) 

I messaged a seller after the aution ended as i missed it he put me on to a doctor friend who was selling his he wrapped it up so well i thought i would leave it safe till i decide to use it.

Maybe i will open it up tomorow 

Hoping its not the dreaded pre 95 version!


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## scrimper (28 Jan 2014)

rspsteve":scfgaaww said:


> I bought one 5 months ago and have not even opened it up.... :shock: it could be a parcel full of bricks... (hammer)
> 
> I messaged a seller after the aution ended as i missed it he put me on to a doctor friend who was selling his he wrapped it up so well i thought i would leave it safe till i decide to use it.
> 
> ...



Sorry but someone had to say this.......Are you mad? :shock:


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## megga (31 Jan 2014)

Oh sh*t i have bid on this http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/171225568229? ... 120wt_1275 and after reading this thread, i now think it will be an old one as well. What would you lot say its worth????


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## mac1012 (31 Jan 2014)

it is an old one so its before 1995 , people are very coy about saying how old it is or showing a picture with the date plaque 

he states multicut 2 but the throat size is only I think 14 inch same as a new m1 it has no quick release so you will have to do more winding on the tension screw but not a problem if you never had it , just slows things down a bit , my guess is it will go for around 180 190 so you will prob be outbid

at least he has been honest with saying a new one will cost 400 which is the multicut one and not trying to compare cost with a new m2 which range betwwen 650 and 800

mark


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## megga (31 Jan 2014)

I put a £200 bid on, but after reading this thread, i canceled the bid. The idear of a machine 20+ years old scared me of a bit. Although they are good machines, everything has a shelf life. I brought a new Axminster instead, would love a Hegner, but for the M1 with vairable speed, £550, thats well out my budget and the Mrs would hang draw and quater me, at least just £400, she will just kick my head in, lock me outside, with hold her "lady rights" from me then end up by making me pay and take her on a shopping trip.


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## scrimper (31 Jan 2014)

megga":2z4hr6qp said:


> I put a £200 bid on, but after reading this thread, i canceled the bid. The idear of a machine 20+ years old scared me of a bit. Although they are good machines, everything has a shelf life.



TBH I wouldn't worry too much about the shelf life of an Hegner, unlike most stuff one buys today these machines are built like a 'brick chicken house' and will go on for years and years much like many of the older woodworking machines and it's also fair to say that scroll saws often don't get too much hard use, Yes the hard line users on this forum are using them every day but they are in a minority.

It's fair to say that Hegner spares are over priced (IMHO) but at least you can get them if you need them unlike some machines that are purchased from China as a container load and when they are gone that's it, and no parts either!


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## mac1012 (31 Jan 2014)

am I right in assuming that you have just paid 400 for a axminster one ??

you could have got a single speed hegner one for 400 I have that model and make and sell craft work have done for three years 

with the right blade selection you don't always need variable speed unless doing metal or very thin stuff I looked at axminster one but decided on hegner 

I sure it be ok and looks a good machine but I would have gone for a new hegner but that's not to say the ax wont perform well

I wouldn't pay 200 for that second hand model no quick release and at least 20 years old , its a big risk to take I think you made a wise choice not getting it but that's me I just don't think it worth it if it was post 1995 then maybe , some on here have had there fingers burnt and some have found a gem I guess that's the risk you take and you could have got it and have been perfectly happy with it, then maybe not....

the reason I started this thread is that some of the information either by accident or miss selling is not always correct as there was one saying it was a multicut two and an had 18inch throat it was a muliticut two but pre 1995 and only had 14 inch throat which is same as newer multicut 1, the newer multicut 2 has 18inch throat after 1995 and a lot of sellers are putting specs up of latest machines but are selling old machines with different specs ,so it was to give people on here a heads up to be careful and make sure they know what they are buying.

mark


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## megga (31 Jan 2014)

Bloody hell it went for £241???? now thats a smidge over priced


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## Hobartian (24 May 2014)

I live in Australia and have just bought a used Hegner Multicut-2 saw. I have not owned one before and not having read this thread I have bought a machine manufactured in 1988.

The seller didn't know much about the saw and told me it belonged to her deceased brother and that the family was selling all his tools.

Unfortunately for some unknown reason it was listed at a Model 18S which it is definitely not. However, it appears to be in good condition and the price of 126 pounds sterling seems fair.

Now considering my purchase.

1. I have a saw with thirty two centimeter throat compared to forty six centimeters for the later model.

2. It has only one speed.

3. It does not have a quick release lever.

4. It does not have a light or vacuum cleaner attachment.

Obviously nothing can be done about the throat size but I understand an independent speed controller could be used. It wouldn't be hard to add a light or vacuum cleaner attachment but has anyone got thoughts about the quick release lever.

On a different note I have started using the saw and noted that installing a new blade seems to require a lot of fiddling. The end of the blade only goes into the holder for a short distance and then hits the tensioning bolt and the holder is not shaped internally to specifically hold the blade in a vertical position. Are there other holders available perhaps made by another manufacturer that are easier to use?

Looking forwards to reading any responses to this post.


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## scrimper (24 May 2014)

Hello Ian (is it Ian)  

Regarding your saw.

1) not much you can do about throat size.

2)The motor on Hegners are Induction type you cannot use an independent speed controller (it has to be part of the motor circuit) However many people manage perfectly well on single speed.

3) The Quick release lever is very good but again you can manage perfectly well without one, I understand you can change this by buying a top arm but it is expensive, it's well worth getting the quick release top clamp though (piecework clamp).

4)Neither the absence of light or vac attachment is a problem, you can easily buy an adjustable light attachment (with magnifier if you wish) and fit it to your table and as regards the vac attachment I have never found the dust from any of my fretsaws to be a problem and never used any dust collection on them. However if you want to use dust extraction it's very simple to make and rig up your own system using a domestic vac using various bits of pipe and tubing even plastic bottles from the kitchen can be used for various sizes of connection or tubing. Make sure you use a quiet vac though, one of my pleasures of using my Hegner is that it is very smooth and quiet and I would hate having a vac running all the time it is in use spoiling the experience!

Sorry if my comments are not very positive but at least you have a top quality saw to use.


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## Roughcut (24 May 2014)

I have to agree with all that Scrimper has said.
I have an older version Hegner Multicut 2 saw.
Personally I don't find that I require a quick release tensioner for the top arm.
I have purchased a quick release blade clamp which is great for quick blade changes and especially when doing pierced fret work.
Some of us on here have also modified the dust blower with a flexible machine coolant tube which works better than the original set-up.
Parts were sourced from suppliers on Ebay for the dust blower modification for around £10 or so as I remember.
ps. If you need to order parts from a Hegner supplier it's usual practice to reference the Hegner Multicut 1 parts list for your older version Multicut 2 requirements as they are essentially the same saw.


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## Hobartian (25 May 2014)

Thanks Scrimper and Roughcut for your responses which were in no way negative and entirely positive!

I have been searching the net regarding my difficulty in installing the blades. I found out that my machine is missing the blade clamp holder that should be attached at the front right hand edge of the machine. I can buy another one in Australia from the distributor but it will cost me "a full arm". Now that I am aware of how it is made I will fabricate something that will do the job. (I might even make it from timber using my scroll saw!)

Returning to the original post it is unfortunate that Hegner has chosen to to use the name Multicut-2 which they used over twenty six years ago on their current range. Sellers are entitled to advertise their Hegner using the model number on the name plate. To a novice all the machines look alike and thus the great bargain buy may not be as good as one thought.


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## bugbear (25 May 2014)

Hobartian":3942thum said:


> I found out that my machine is missing the blade clamp holder that should be attached at the front right hand edge of the machine. I can buy another one in Australia from the distributor but it will cost me "a full arm". Now that I am aware of how it is made I will fabricate something that will do the job. (I might even make it from timber using my scroll saw!)



Would you like some photos and/or measurements?

BugBear


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## Hobartian (25 May 2014)

Thanks Bugbear for your offer to provide a pictures and dimensions of the blade clamp guide. That would certainly be helpful.


I would also like to know more about the Quick Release Clamp Part No 110000450.
Is this clamp the same as the standard blade clamp only with knurled knob and thus does not need a tool to tighten it? I was hoping it would have provision for easily inserting the blade without possibility of the blade being held out of alignment.

I did some internal cutting today and reconnecting the top end of the blade for each new cut was a real chore and held me up considerably.

The other query relates to the Quick Release Tension Rod Assembly which my saw does not have. I read online that a bicycle quick release axle can be used for this function. However, re-tensioning the blade did not hold me up much so this is of lesser importance to me.

Thanks


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## bugbear (25 May 2014)

Hobartian":3ggioowq said:


> Thanks Bugbear for your offer to provide a pictures and dimensions of the blade clamp guide. That would certainly be helpful.

















The basic block is 42 x 25.5 x 10 (in mm).

BugBear


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## scrimper (25 May 2014)

Hobartian":1c63htam said:


> I would also like to know more about the Quick Release Clamp Part No 110000450.
> Is this clamp the same as the standard blade clamp only with knurled knob and thus does not need a tool to tighten it? I was hoping it would have provision for easily inserting the blade without possibility of the blade being held out of alignment.



This is the piecework or quick release clamp.............. http://www.hegner.co.uk/Quick-Clamp-for-Piercework

It really is essential in my opinion, it is expensive for what it is (usual with Hegner parts) if you are handy you might be able to make one yourself from odds and sods in the workshop, it's basically a normal blade clamp with a threaded bolt with a knurled knob on the end and replaces the allen type screw.

In the info it mentions that it has rotating bearing surfaces within the clamp and the new ones do have this feature, however mine is an early one and it's just a bolt with a Knurled knob and it works 100% perfectly without any rotating bits!

If I wanted one I would make my own rather than spend £20+ p&p on one.


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