# Scrollsaw Challenge



## Gill

A number of people seem to have enjoyed the recent spate of scrollsaw projects that have been posted and said something along the lines of, “I must dust off my old scrollsaw”. Well, here’s your chance!

Lin and I have consulted the finest (and cheapest) pattern designers we know and they have produced two free scrollsaw patterns exclusively for members of UK Workshop. These patterns are designed to be simple enough for scrollers who are absolute novices, yet detailed enough to be satisfying. Our challenge is to all woodworkers who have scrollsaws languishing disused – have a go at one or both of these patterns and surprise yourself with what you can achieve. And to those of you who don’t have scrollsaws, here’s an ideal opportunity to get one and see what you can do.

These are the two patterns:



 

 

Click on them to link to the fullsize patterns.

Lin has put together a quick guide to scrolling for those of you who need one. Of course, we’ll both be having a go at these patterns ourselves so you’ll be able to see how we get on too. Any questions or problems, we’ll be on hand to help out. When you’ve finished, don’t be shy – we’d love to see the results and share in your delight.

Bon chance!

Gill




Lin’s Scrolling Guide

*Materials Needed:*

Pattern printed out as “Fit to Page”.

Blades - #2 should work for either project (suppliers listed below)* but you will probably find larger sized blades are also effective.

½” or ¾” wood (tight grained pine will work fine for both projects).

Spray adhesive or artist’s repositionable spray mount adhesive.

Sand paper (various grits).

Drill bit (smaller than the smallest cutout area on the pattern).

Painter’s tape-blue or lavender (lavender is the better of the two to use - less wood fibres are pulled off with it). These tapes aren’t readily available in the UK. A low tack masking tape such as Scotch® Masking Tape is a suitable alternative and is available at branches of WH Smith, Staples, and other stationers. Conventional masking tapes tend to be a little too sticky, but they can be used at a push.

Two #6 wood screws 1” long (to attach the motorcycle to a base).

Countersink bit (for the motorcycle pattern).

Finishes of choice.



*How to:*

First take a deep breath and relax……this is supposed to be fun.

Trim your pattern down. Leave about ½” paper on the outside of the entire piece. 

Sand your wood to 220 grit, wipe or blow off any excess dust. 

Apply the painters/masking tape to the wood. Cover all areas that will have the pattern on it. This tape has two uses. It helps to lubricate the blade during the cut and makes removing the pattern a snap. Artists repositionable spray mount adhesive also helps to lubricate the blade, but not as much as masking tape. If you use repositionable spray mount adhesive, you can get away with omitting the masking tape. But be warned – the risk of having the pattern come loose around the blade will increase.

Spray back of pattern with adhesive (I prefer to give it a fairly good coat of adhesive…I don’t want my pattern pulling up during the cut) and place on the painters tape. Smooth out any folds or bubbles quickly. This glue dries fairly quickly.

After glue has dried drill your holes for cutting. 

Find a comfortable position at the saw for cutting. A sore back and/or arms is not fun.

Make all the cuts, starting in or near the middle of the pattern and work your way to the outside. I generally cut the smallest cuts first then work my way to the larger ones for stability of the piece.
While cutting take your time and don’t get upset if you wander off the line a bit, just slowly bring it back on the line. The point that I want to stress here is that once the pattern is taken off, those lines are no longer there. I do not always stay on the line. There are times when I purposely cut off the line for wood stability or to help the look of the pattern itself. Other times I wander off just a bit, not intentionally but it happens.

Take your time while cutting. Remember, the saw is supposed to do the work, not you. If the cutting isn’t going well, it may be that your blade is dull and should be changed.

Do not be afraid to hold the wood with your finger tips close to blade while cutting. If the cutting area is extremely close to another cut this will help you complete the cut without the wood breaking.

After all cuts are completed do some touch up sanding on the back of the piece. There will generally be some fuzzies that need to be removed. Either by hand with 220 grit or a palm sander works much faster.

Remove the painter tape. The pattern will come with it.

Touch up sand the front of the piece to whatever grit you prefer.

If you are working on the motorcycle pattern will will need to take the piece and center it on the base you will attach to. Draw a light pencil line at the front of each of the flat area of the wheel. Find centre of this mark and back it up half the width of the wood thickness you used and drill and countersink your holes for the screws.

Finishing choices at this point are up to you. 


We want pics please…………


If you want to try some practice cuts on a piece of waste wood before starting the project, here’s a ‘warming up’ exercise for you:









*List of online blade suppliers

Shesto

Hobbies of Dereham

Hegner

Flying Dutchman


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## trevtheturner

Thanks, Gill and Lin, for a very useful posting.

Now all I need is that decent scrollsaw ...................!! :roll: :wink: 

Cheers,

Trev.


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## radicalwood

Thanks Gill and Lin

Will give them a go when I get back from Holiday in a couple of weeks.

Cheers Neil


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## Alf

Hmm, I admit I'm tempted to dust off the Delta - if it still works.  If it had been a different sort of plane I'd have probably already started... :wink: :lol: 

Cheers, Alf


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## dedee

Gill/Lin,
OK I'm up for it so long as there is no time limit......

I'll have a go at the chopper as I am not quite sure what to do about the missing bits on the Spitfire - any hints?

Interesting tip about placing masking tape on the wood before spray mounting the pattern. Sometimes I can spend ages getting the spray mount off the wood if I have left it overnight.

Andy


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## Les Mahon

Gill?Lin

I'm game to give it a go! bought the scrollsaw some months ago, but it has not seen much service!

I fancy the sptifire, but like and I'm strugling to work out the missing bits! does it have something to do with mounting on a contrasting backboard????

Thanks for the paterns and hint's, might just force me into action!

BTW I got blue painters tape in B&Q over here, so I assume ti's available in th uk as well?

Les


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## froglet

I would guess that the Spitfire is a silhouette, i.e. you cut out the pattern to leave a spitfire shaped hole in a board, and with the bike you end up with bike shaped piece of wood.

I (and maybe my wife) will have a go at the spitfire as a first project as long as there is no deadline as the recently purchased scrollsaw has not been taken out of the box yet and this will force the issue.

Graeme


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## Gill

It's great that so many of you are up for it  !

Graeme's right - the Spitfire pattern is such that when you cut out the holes you can place a coloured backing board behind it to show the picture. This example indicates what the portrait would look like if you were to use a yellowish wood and a green backing board:






Oh, and there are certainly no deadlines .

Hope this helps.

Gill


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## dedee

Gill, of course #-o Should have realised that.

Andy


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## MikeW

Hi Gill and Lin,

I'll show this to my granddaughter and if she's up to it, we'll do it!

Now if I don't kill myself getting it down the ladder from the attic or inhale too much dust blowing it off...

Hey, thanks. 

Mike & Jackie


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## Les Mahon

Gill,

Thanks for that clarification :roll: Like most things it's obvious when you see it. I have to admit I would probably have trown away all the wrong bits if I't tried without your pic!

Les


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## Gill

Any more questions, just ask  . Sometimes it's not easy to look at a scrollsaw pattern and work out what needs to be cut and what needs to be left.

In case anyone's wondering what they should be left with after cutting out the chopper, I thought I'd better post a piccy. As with the Spitfire, keep the yellow bits!






I'm really looking forward to seeing what you guys can achieve.


Gill


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## Dewy

Scroll saws can do more than sawing.
There is a file type made for engineering which has flats on both ends to fit in a scroll saw.
These files can be coarse down to very fine and either normal files or needle for fine work in flat, round, triangular half round etc.


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## Ed451

OK OK, I give...

I got a scroll saw for Christmas last year and I haven't known where to start, until now. I'll try some practice cuts first, then plague all of you with questions on how to proceed.  

Ed


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## Lin

Sounds like a plan. I'm glad the interest is there.....Bring on the questions if any help is needed. I'll be cutting one of the two patterns myself this week-end.....Just trying to decide which pattern and what wood to use. Great stuff going on here.
Lin


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## Gill

There might be too much interest, Lin! His Lordship saw the printed out pattern of the chopper and said, "I wouldn't mind having a go at that one over the weekend" :shock: !



It's *my *scrollsaw, mate! I'll show you how to use the Hegner 1, if you like. And isn't it time you got your lathe turning again?

:lol: 

Gill


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## Gill

I'm sure you lot can do better than this  ! I decided to try cutting the Spitfire out of cheap 18mm construction grade boards from B&Q and use a #5 blade to cut it. No doubt some of you will be tempted to use whatever sticky tape you've got hanging around, rather than buy good quality masking tape. So I used parcel tape to show you what would happen...

Anyway that comes later. I started off by jointing two pieces of the pine board.






Next, I took some parcel tape and dabbed it over my jeans to remove some of the excess stickiness before applying it to the area I was going to cut. I sprayed the reverse of the pattern with glue and stuck it onto the parcel tape, then drilled pilot holes for the piercing cuts.






The next step was to start cutting. As I mentioned before, I used a #5 Flying Dutchman blade, a good quality blade but even it struggled with the B&Q pine; it was like cutting cotton wool! The pine had no strength and as a result the inner part of the Spitfire's roundel broke off. Ah well, these things happen.

I continued cutting nevertheless and when I came to tight corners, I simply overshot them and returned to them later, as in this photograph.






After the final saw cut, the piece looked like this (Where's my inner roundel  ?)






I then removed the parcel tape - and a large part of the wood!






After a lot of sanding (and it's _very _ hard to get a decent finish with that pine) to remove the wood where fibres had been pulled off by the parcel tape, I gave it a coat of Danish oil and fastened some green card to the back. This is how it ended up.




At least it does bear a resemblance to a Spitfire.


The cost of the wooden board from B&Q was £3.81 so it certainly wasn't an expensive project. I reckon I used about 1/3 of the pine, so my Spitfire probably cost about £1.50 all in. I'm sure you guys will be able to make a much better job of this than me, but I was trying to do the job on the cheap to demonstrate that scrolling doesn't need lots of expensive wood and equipment.

Right, now for that chopper!



Gill


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## Lin

Just a thought on this. Gill has hit upon one of the problems with using tape directly on the wood. I tend to use the painter tape but even with it I have had slight tearing with certain species. Aspen and oak will give me a bit of tear out if the blue tape is left on too long. There is another option here. I did this when I first started out and it does work but does have its' own issues also. You can glue the pattern directly to the wood and use the clear shipping tape on top of it. The issues that come up doing it this way would be the sawdust can sneak under the tape making your line hard to see and when the cutting is done you will need to remove the tape before using mineral spirits on the pattern to remove it. I tried to get the mineral spirits to remove tape and pattern together and the tape is some strong stuff and the mineral spirits just don't seem to get thru or under it well enough to release the pattern. If using mineral spirits to release a pattern....Brush it on and let it sit for a few minutes and the pattern will peel off...then you will need to put more mineral spirits on the piece and rub off the excess glue. Just another way.....and this one will avoid the tear out from tape.
Gill, How hard would it be for you to just cut the piece that broke off on you then glue it to the backer as a separate piece. I know the it suppose to be connected but I have done this in a pinch with one that did not want to co-operate with me during the cut. Even without the piece it looks just fine.....Thinking that may be the one I try out tomorrow. 
Lin
Lin


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## Gill

Hi Lin

I could cut it out as a separate piece as you suggested, but that would rather defeat the object of the exercise as far as I was concerned. I feel I've got nothing to prove, so I was simply trying to show what could be achieved using readily available materials. I also wanted to demonstrate how some of those readily available materials have their limitations - and I believe I made my point.

The inner roundel is an important component of this project and I'm not suggesting that people who cut the Spitfire should be cavalier about it. Nevertheless, if it (or any other component) doesn't get cut according to the plan, it isn't a disaster. The picture is still identifiable as a Spitfire and that flexibility is something which scrollers need to remember when they make 'mistakes' on other, more advanced projects. To my mind, scrolling a portrait is more about producing a representation than a facsimile - if a facsimile is the order of the day, use a camera instead of a saw.

Gill


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## Lin

My version of the "Spitfire"......Searched my wood stash and ended up with a piece of 1/4" redoak that was the right size for the pattern. I cut it with a #2R blade and the lettering was cut from 1/8" white plexi wtih a #3 double skip tooth blade......The plexi doesn't seem to like the reverse teeth......wants to melt back on me everytime I try it. Red felt behind the cutout area.
Lin


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## Lin

Word of warning Gill.......If you let him use *your* saw.......there will be issues about whose turn it is now.....It happened here....even though it was my saw.....Now *I *have two saws......I allow him use which ever one I'm not using when he has the need.
The lathe is his but if I want to use it.....guess who wins.......lol
Lin


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## Anonymous

I think this is a great idea too! I can't wait to see what people come up with! I'm thinking boxes, clocks, and more!

If you need any help, please let me know! I've got a lot of good resources!

Bob Duncan
Associate Editor
Scroll Saw Workshop magazine


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## MikeW

Welcome to the UK Workshop Bob!


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## Lin

Bob, I second the welcome....
Lin


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## Gill

I'm pleased you found your way over here Bob. I hope I'm not out of order in revealing that this thread might get a small mention in a future edition of _Scroll Saw Workshop_. So come on guys - let's do ourselves justice.

Gill


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## Les Mahon

So..... How'd I do :shock: 







And a couple of WIP pics just for completness:










Made in 9mm thick ash - and kind of small (roughly 100mmx200mm overall) because that's what was lying around! I really enjoyed doing it - thanks for putting up the templates, I might even be tempted to try the chopper!

Les


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## Gill

Well done Les =D> !

That looks really good, much better than mine in fact  . I'm delighted you've had a go at it.

I take it you didn't have any problems cutting out the roundel? What sort of blades did you use? Roughly how long did it take you to complete it?

I see you used a Delta to cut it out - I've never used one but they're supposed to be nice saws, especially when it comes to changing blades.

I hope you have more success with the chopper than I did. Actually, cutting it wasn't a problem - I enjoyed that. This is how it looked before I started to apply the finish.





What I didn't enjoy was picking up the debris after our workshop gremlin decided to take the completed project for a ride off a high shelf.





Ah well, out with the PVA and nobody'll ever be able to tell. I don't think I'll mount it on a stand - it looks okay without.

If anyone is interested in cutting other subjects, just let me know and I'll see what I can do to provide patterns.

Gill


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## Lin

Les, Wonderful work on the "Spitfire". I really like the wood you "had on hand". Nice grain lines....The blue behind it looks great also. I'm going to try the "chopper" also......I won't be sitting it high on a shelf.....I tend to have shop gremlins also..lol
I to am curious to what blade size and brand you used on the "Spitfire".
All info is helpful to all of us....
Lin


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## Alf

Well I hesitate to post this, but here goes. 

Naturally, me being me, I didn't entirely follow the sage advice from the experts. 8-[ F'rinstance my Spitfire is a little smaller, 'cos it would fit the off-cut of 10mm Cherry I had handy. It was either that or it'd never happen at all I fear.  I also totally disregarded the advice about masking tape and went my own way. 8-[ Anyway, it wouldn't be a project report _a la Alf_ if it didn't include a shot of a hand plane; cleaning up the cherry in this case. :wink: Also, for the benefit of the discussion on the Hand Tools board about using candles as a plane lubricant, a shot of what I usually do. 



 

 

I then immediately departed from the rules and applied a coat of "Patina" finish front and back; the theory being any solvent used to remove the pattern later would be shrugged off by the finish. Some rather elderly UHU spray adhesive still worked, so I glued on the pattern, let it dry, then bored the holes to insert the blade using a 2mm HSS bit. Before you ask, the pink paper isn't 'cos I's a girl, but 'cos it was free.  



 

Then I dug out the Delta from its corner and cleaned it up... 



 

...well, most of it. 



 

Eventually I remembered how to get the right tension on the #2 blade (from Axminster, years ago) after only breaking one in the process. :roll: Given Gill's experience I was particularly careful of the first cut round the roundel, but it went okay. 



 

Taking the advice this time, I went straight across and left the sharp corner to negotiate later. 



 

The tail section done and it's all going worryingly well. 




 

Don't speak too soon; I went straight across where I shouldn't have on one bit of the fuselage, #-o and the port wing got a bit bigger than it was supposed to... Never mind, I Airman-ed on (instead of Soldiered, see? Well it _is_ a Spitfire :roll: ) and after an hour got to this point. 



 

The moment of truth, and I peeled off the pattern. The wood was untouched and the Patina didn't object one whit about the white spirit used to remove the glue residue. Result.  A quick swipe with some abrasive to remove the spelching on the back and the Maxi finally proves useful in providing a background. 



 

It's now in a prime position directly opposite as you enter the workshop. Well it seemed a good place, given the cupboard's full of, erm, _planes_... :wink: 



 

Gill, Lin _et al_; I don't know how you do it, I really don't. Perspiration was dripping from my furrowed brow and I was a boss-eyed wreck by the finish. :shock: :lol: 

Cheers, Alf


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## Gill

Alf

I'm proud of you! That's a smashing result, and cut with a #2 blade too. They can be rather fragile - you did really well to only break one.

I'm looking closely to see where those errors are that you claimed to make; you're either exaggerating or my spectacles need the sawdust wiping off them again .

You'll be pleased to hear that I've got some maple cut (on the tablesaw, as instructed  ) for the sidetable. The next step is summoning up the courage to subject the legs to a morticer that I've never used before :? . It'll happen some day soon after the weekend. Just as you get anxious about cutting wood with a scrollsaw, I get anxious about cutting wood with other tools  !

I suppose it's all about familiarity and confidence. The more scrolling you do, the easier it seems to be. And admit it, Alf - it was a rather enjoyable way to dispose of an offcut, wasn't it?

Gill

PS Using pink paper was a good idea - it reduces glare and makes it easier on the eyes. I often use yellow paper for the same reason.


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## trevtheturner

Nice job, Alf, and what an excellent idea to hang it on your _plane_ cupboard (only one _plane_ cupboard? :shock: ).

Interesting use for Patina, too.

Cheers,

Trev.


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## cambournepete

Gill":37rdnz2r said:


> Using pink paper was a good idea - it reduces glare and makes it easier on the eyes. I often use yellow paper for the same reason.



And my wife finds orange paper (or overlays) easiest for reading (not that you'd ever know judging by the number of shelves I need to build) - something to do with it helping dyslexics...

Pete


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## Chris Knight

Well done Alf!


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## Alf

Gill":3s65bjjw said:


> I'm looking closely to see where those errors are that you claimed to make; you're either exaggerating or my spectacles need the sawdust wiping off them again .


Don'tcha just love the way the camera lies like that? 



Gill":3s65bjjw said:


> Just as you get anxious about cutting wood with a scrollsaw, I get anxious about cutting wood with other tools  !


I get anxious about cutting wood with _anything_. 8-[]



Gill":3s65bjjw said:


> And admit it, Alf - it was a rather enjoyable way to dispose of an offcut, wasn't it?


Yep. Right up there with champing on a piece while someone saws your leg off without anaesthetic... :wink: Oops, I wasn't supposed to say that was I? :-# :lol: I wonder if maybe I fret too much as it is...? <groan>



trevtheturner":3s65bjjw said:


> only one _plane_ cupboard? :shock:


Don't be daft, Trev. :roll: 

Cheers, Alf


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## trevtheturner

:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: :lol:


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## dedee

Alf, very nice. Are you going to have a go at the motorbike as well?

I got as far as taking the patterns to the workshop last night and fully intended to start but was greeted by a puddle of water surrounding the dehumidifier - see off topic post. 


Andy


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## Lin

Alf, Super job on the spitfire. I to had trouble finding any of the errors you spoke of......I know that doing something you haven't ever done or not done for a while is WORK......When I jump on something new, even something new on the scrollsaw.....I start worrying before I even make the first cut that I will mess up. I have come to love the idea that once that pattern is taken off.......Noone but me knows which line I didn't stay on..... :lol: 
Hope you find the time to give a go at the "motorbike".....
My best laid plans last week-end to cut it.....were put on hold with company showing up for the day...
Just think of the beautiful fretwork overlays that you could cut for your tables and such. A few more of these pattern challenges and you will feel more comfortable with it. 
Patina........Now who would have thought. You just may be onto something here.......??
Glad you posted. I enjoyed looking...
Lin


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## Lin

Finally found a bit of time to cut the "Chopper".....so here it is. I used a 1" thick piece of cherry and a #7R Olson Precision Ground blade. I went with the larger blade and precision ground becasue of the thickness and hardness of the cherry. I couldn't make the really tight, tight turns so I cut to the turn then backed up a bit then turned around in the waste and backed up to into my cut to come out of it. Worked out really well. I only used one blade on the piece and that blade mowed right thru the cherry with only a slight burn mark here and there on the turns I did make as a spin. The blade didn't try to bow on me at all. Think I'll use them a bit more often.....
Lin


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## DaveL

Lin,

Very nice.  

I have still to order some decent blades for my cheap scroll saw, but I do have some cherry so the tuit creeps almost into view.


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## Gill

My chopper was last seen being ridden by my 12" tall friends Ken and Barbie who needed wheels to get to a picnic over at Dave L's.

8) 






Gill


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## DaveL

Gill, 

Nice one! :lol: 

Is that the one that crashed or have you cut a new one? 
If you have repaired it, I can't see the join, now which one of us should have the short fat hairy legs? 8-[


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## Gill

Hi Dave

Thanks  . It's the repaired one.

And before anyone asks - no, I didn't get creative with an airbrush over the repair while I was manipulating the photograph   . As if I would... O

Gill

PS Congratulations Lin - your chopper turned out very nicely (sorry that I forgot to comment before  )


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## scroller frank

hi all.
well done to all of you,   you never now what you can do till you try,!  
it's nice to see so many "have a go ", see it didn't hurt did it ?
well done Gill and Lin for the encouragement,
i have had a go at the motorbike ,but can't get a photo (no camera)
if it all goes wrong ,you can always throw it on the fire , so it's not wasted.
all the best-------- Frank---------


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## Gill

Hi Frank

It's nice to have you with us, even if you can't post piccies  .

Gill


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## Lin

Frank, Do you have a scanner? I know a few who have scanned their projects to post a pic of them. Not real easy to do but a possiblity.....Just a thought. Glad you cut the "motor bike". What wood and blade did you use?
Lin


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## scroller frank

Hi Lin  
no i don't have a scanner, my computer skills are such that i would have to find a 12 year old to show me how to use one!  
I have got a printer, but even get that in a muddle sometimes!.
I cut the bike from 3/4" oak, i get it from the scrap bin of a local kitchen maker , free!..
The blades i have used are a brand called "Saw Bird" (made in Germany)
i have also used "Hobbies" blades ,also---- (Made in Germany)----
My saw is a Delta 2 speed, i have had it for about 6 years , i usually make wooden toys, but am going to try my hand at some "Real Fretwork", a nice fancy clock? or something!!!!!!!!
-------------Frank---------


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## Jaco

Came across this site as i was touring the "World" at 0400.
Phil
8) 


http://www.jpwoodworks.net/


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## fremar

I quite fancy having a go at this challenge. Can anyone recommend a make/model of a decent starter scrollsaw?

Oh Dear more kit needed


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## Gill

fremar":gwk6pi4f said:


> Can anyone recommend a make/model of a decent starter scrollsaw?



Simple question - complicated answer  !

Practically any scrollsaw on the market will enable you to cut the Spitfire and chopper patterns. It's when you decide that you want to cut more ambitious patterns that you could easily become frustrated by the limitations of your machine. It would be such a shame for the saw to end up out of the way in the workshop, never to see the light of day again, and for you to think that scrolling was just too difficult because you had an inappropriate machine for your ambitions.

So what are the limitations of 'starter machines'? They are normally made of lightweight material which means the scrollsaw will vibrate when it's used. This makes it difficult to hold your wood and feed it accurately; your hands also get a similar feeling to the 'white knuckle' effect of holding a pneumatic drill for any length of time. These machines also have limited cutting depth so you can only cut relatively thin pieces of wood (most scrollers like to 'stack cut' several pieces at a time). Blade changing is often quite arduous - since you'll break a number of blades when you begin scrolling, this can be extremely tedious. Also, more basic machines tend to use pin-head blades which sit on rockers; this limits the ability to undertake fine work as your skills develop because if you decide to make internal cuts you'll have to drill a particularly large hole in order to feed your blade through. Almost all scrollsaws have the facility to tilt the table but more basic models have angle guages that are often less than reliable; when you're cutting relief work, a difference of ½° can be significant. Another limitation is throat size. When you're cutting a pattern, you'll often need to swing your wood in an almost completely circular movement, so you'll need a saw with a throat that can accept the piece of wood you're intending to work with. As you cut, you'll find that sawdust gathers at the point of the cut. Most modern scrollsaws have a blower which will disperse this dust but it's important to beware of machines that don't because sawdust build up will not only obscure your pattern but it will shorten the life of your blades. Finally, basic models often come with just a single speed. That's usually not a problem at first, but as your skills progress you'll find there are times when the saw seems to be 'running away' with you and the ability to slow the machine becomes important.

So those are the pitfalls to beware of when looking for scrollsaws. When I started, I used a Spiralux saw such as this one on eBay which gave me a taste for scrolling, even if ¼" plywood was as much as it could cope with! However, it had the virtue that it's impossible to cut yourself with a Spiralux. Nowadays, I think most scrollers would be drawn to the sort of cheap saws that you see in B&Q and other sheds. I've never tried one of these machines myself because when I started scrolling you either had to buy a quality machine or cut by hand - cheap Far Eastern products weren't available. I've heard quite a good report of the Ferm saw (although the person who recommended it never posted again  !) and I know from seeing demonstrations of the SIP saw that it should be avoided like the plague. For myself, I'm struck by how similar all these saws look and how similarly they're priced. I'd be surprised if any of them were much better than the SIP.

Woodworkers who want a saw that will give them a good introduction to scrolling should expect to spend significantly more than £100 and look at saws such as the Delta 40-540 which has a very good reputation amongst scrollers. A more expensive alternative might be the Axminster AWFS18 which looks suspiciously like a rebadged Hegner. I've never used this saw myself but I have heard that it's very good.

I hope this helps and I haven't made scrolling sound more daunting than it really is!

If you can get to the Stoneleigh exhibition at the middle of the month you'll be able to check out very high quality saws at the Hegner stand. That should give you more idea of what to look out for.

Gill


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## les chicken

Gill 
I read your post with interest also admiring the work you and your fellow scrollers turn out. I do not own a scrollsaw and my only experience was many hours fretsawing by hand when at school. My question is that when at Yandles I watched the demonstration of the SIP scrollsaw and having no experience of such was quite impressed with the work that was done in front of me, also the ease of blade change etc. As I own the SIP 10" cast table saw which I am very impressed with, can you point out the negatives of the SIP scrollsaw that I should be aware of if I was thinking of a purchase.  :shock: :?: 

Many thanks

Les


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## Lin

Thought I'd toss out another pattern for those that have shown an interest in trying out there scrolling techniques.....It's set up to be cut as an 8" x 10" but can be resized as needed. Cut out the black....
Lin


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## Gill

That's a nice pattern, Lin  . Being a mutt nut and somewhat crazy about wolves too, I'll have a go at that one myself. Perhaps spiral blades might be the order of the day?

Les - I saw the SIP scrollsaw being demonstrated at a recent show and watched in horror as the saw vibrated so much that the demonstrators mug of coffee slid along the table that the saw was mounted on towards the floor. Fortunately, he caught it in time. Having encountered dubious comments about the SIP scrollsaw on other forums, I approached the demonstrator with a view to checking out the saw in depth myself. I got no further than asking him how you changed blades. After about 5 minutes of fiddling with the saw casing and inserting screwdrivers where I doubt screwdrivers are meant to go, he summoned his colleague who he claimed was much more knowledgable about scrollsaws. The pair then spent another 5 minutes fiddling with the saw (the blade doggedly remained where it was throughout) before I got fed up and left. By that stage I'd simply written off the saw as a bad machine. I returned to the SIP display about half an hour later and found that the scrollsaw had been withdrawn from the exhibition.

I'm not knocking SIP products. Some of them are very good indeed and whilst at the show I purchased a SIP SCMS which was very reasonably priced and has since performed admirably. Whilst making my purchase, I told the rep of my reservations with the scrollsaw and he said I was the first person to ever make such comments. He sounded genuinely pleased to hear my opinion (perhaps I sounded well-informed :? ?) and said he would pass my comments on to the firm's designers. Apparently, SIP not only value constructive feedback but they'll act upon it; this is why their SCMS was quickly upgraded to include a trenching facility. SIP might not have a good scrollsaw yet, but future models should be worth looking out for.

Gill


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## woodshavings

I bought the Axminster CCVFS perform Variable Speed Scroll Saw - it was about £50.

It takes both plain ended and pinned blades. However, to release the bottom blade, you have to remove a cover, so the cover has remained off! The quality of the socket head screws used to clamp the blades is poor; they rounded out after a few uses, so I replaced them with decent ones. 

You certainly must clamp/screw the saw to the bench - otherwise it goes for a walk!

I am too new at scrolling to say if its a good saw - I've no comparison but it sure beats hand fret sawing. Just started on some Christmas decorations that Gill was kind enough to copy the pattens for me last year. I am just ashamed at my efforts when I see those produced by Gill and Lin.  

John


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## scroller frank

Hi Fremar  
I'm with Gill on this one, cheap, lightwieght scrollsaws do tend to "dance around" all over the bench , ( you will need a chair with casters on to keep up with it!) ----- verrrrry frustrating!!!!!!!!!!! -----  
I use a delta 2 speed, quite old now , (1996) . but i think it was a good buy. it is heavy, and does'nt vibrate much at all, the blade changing is also quick and simple,handy when doing a lot of inside cuts.


Gill , when is the Stoneliegh show? 
i will be going to Harogate in november, but i havn't heard about Stoneliegh.


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## les chicken

Gill 
Thanks for that very indepth reply. When I was watching the demo at Yandles I asked the demonstrator what blade he was using his reply a metal one, my reply "smart buttocks do you think I am stupid" which broke the ice as I think they must have had a bit of a bad day  . He then preceded to give a very thorough demo which was very impressive changing blades to use on a different material (wood to perspex) it took him about 30 seconds to change the blade, his coffee or tea whatever it was not moving. His speed using the machine was a blur at times which goes to show that if you know what you are doing it makes a difference. Listening to your experience being a prolific :lol: :lol: scroller it is a shame you did not see the same demo. If I had seen the same demo as you I would have walked away but now I am confused. Any other comments would be appreciated.

Les


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## Gill

Hi Frank

The Stoneleigh show takes place over 14 - 16 October. This thread might be useful to you, as might this one.

Along with a lot of other members of this forum, I'm aiming to go on the Sunday.


Hi Les - I don't know what more I can add. I've heard dubious reports about the SIP saw online and the demonstration I saw did nothing to allay my fears. Your experience was different and I respect that. At least I hope that the problem areas with some saws that I've outlined earlier will give potential buyers an idea of what faults to beware of.

Gill

Edit: PS 30 seconds to change a blade? That sounds pretty slow to me. I'd be upset with anything that took longer than 15 seconds.


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## Lin

Reading all the posts about what scrollsaw to buy is interesting.....I haven't heard of most of the brands with the exception of Delta and Hegner.....I have scrolled on a Dewalt and a variable speed Delta....Don't remember what series Delta is was.....both had little to no vibration....both were attached to a sturdy table.....I found both to be fairly easy to change blades on after I was shown how......the Delta had the smaller table of the two..it was 16" and the Dewalt was 20". What I drive is not available across the pond but thought I'd toss out a pic of my "Twin" RBI Hawks.
I have not owned any other scrollsaw. (used the Delta and Dewalt at our crollers club meetings) I bought the 20" on the left first and 3.5 years later bought the G4 on the right.....This pic is right after I got the 26" G4......Yes I do use both of them....just not at the same time. My hubby scrolls sometimes also and we no longer fight over who gets to use the saw......I allow him to use which ever one I'm not using at the time. These are my babies and my bread and butter for buying new "Toys" 
Thanks for looking...
Lin


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## Lin

Phil, Just checked out the link that you posted......I know that guy from some other forums.......He and his wife have had several patterns published in the scrollsaw mags....I have cut a few of them I think....nice designs......I believe he even has some patterns in some of the scrolling books I have.......small world....
Lin


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## scroller frank

Hi Gill,Lin & all,
been out and got my self a camera!  so i thought i would show you what i've been up to! hav'nt had a lot of time ,so this is it for now, just some of my jigsaws.






all the best ------------- Frank---------


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## Gill

Wow!

Not only are those nicely cut, Frank, but you've got quite a bit of talent with the paintbrush too  . Thanks ever so much for sharing them with us.

Are the patterns your own?

Gill


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## Lin

Frank, Double WOW......great cutting and I agree with Gill.....you are good with a brush.....I on the other hand am not.....Please tell where the patterns came from......what are they cut from?....what kind of paint did you use?....Is that some sort of metal on the truck handle? ..You got yourself a whole farm there.....really neat..hope you don't mind all the questions...I think you did sooooooooo good.....I really like the set....I'm not much for puzzles but this I like.
What ya going to cut next?
Lin


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## trevtheturner

That is super work, Frank.

Watch out for my Spitfires, Lin. They are still in the hanger at the moment - hope they don't crash before take-off! :roll: 

Cheers,

Trev.


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## dedee

Frank, really nice take on the standard jigsaws 

Andy


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## scroller frank

Hi All,
thanks for all your nice comments,  
Gill said:



> Are the patterns your own?


 no Gill they are not mine ,(i'm not that clever!)
the patterns are in a book by Tony and June Burns, the book is called "Scroll Saw Farm Puzzles" (Fox Chapel co inc )

isbn no. 1-56523-138-40. 
they are cut from white"pine" , from out of the rubbish skip next door to where i work! i painted them with very thin water colour , if you don't dilute it enough it looks really, really bad , i also use accrilic paint , but again very thin,
Lin said:


> Is that some sort of metal on the truck handle?



no Lin, its gold felt tip, the type used to wright on tyres.
as for the "good with a paintbrush", it was just good luck that it came out rite  
next on my list is a clock, but thats after i've mended my grandsons tractor. i don,t think it's supposed to fly!!!!!!!!
all the best--------Frank-----
P.S hope to get to Stoneleigh on the sunday


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## Lin

Trev, You said "Spitfires" as in plural.......You gonna try stacking cutting first time outta the gate?.......If you are going to use thinner stock......that would be the way to go.......I'm now wait for Pics of your planes once they get off the ground...
Lin


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## trevtheturner

Well, at long, long last I finally got around to finishing the cutting of my Spitfires today.   Got them up into the air.   Then, you know what? They carried right on out over the green hills of Herefordshire and disappeared in a north westerly direction! Reckon they must have crashed somewhere in Snowdonia.   Probably never to be seen again.   

Cheers,

Trev.


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## DaveL

trevtheturner":232e0ibh said:


> Got them up into the air.   Then, you know what? They carried right on out over the green hills of Herefordshire and disappeared in a north westerly direction! Reckon they must have crashed somewhere in Snowdonia.   Probably never to be seen again.



So just how much single malt have you sampled this evening? :roll:


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## Gill

Hi Trev

:?: 

Gill


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## trevtheturner

Patience. I'll find 'em. :wink: I hope........... :roll: 

Trev.


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## Gill

It's so sad that our Spitfire squadron is flying the 'Missing Man' formation.

Gill


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## trevtheturner

Phew!! Found them at last - flying over the brown hills of North Wales. :lol: :lol: 

(Actually, after my earlier post I had to glue the two halves back together, find a backing, take the pic. - amongst a couple of other little jobs I was doing - then post it).

I used a piece of spalted sycamore, planed to about 1/4 thick, and as the piece was large enough thought if I am going to do one, I might as well do two! Stack cutting, I believe it is called? I stacked (stuck) the two halves of the wood together with double sided tape, then covered the top with masking take, to which I attached the pattern with photographic adhesive - all worked well. Only busted one blade, towards the end. They are as they came off the saw, apart from the two pieces being stuck back together, as you can see - not yet tidied, sanded or finished. When all done, I might just put them in a frame to hang alongside my _real_ pictures of the Battle of Britain Flight. 







With many thanks to my kind benefactor (see you Sunday?) who loaned me a nice Hegner 1 to have a go at this. A very interesting exercise and more than a little bit tricky in places, especially when it came to the roundel - amazing how aware I became of the direction of the grain in the wood whilst I was cutting.

Checked the piggy bank - not enough in there yet - need to save a few pounds for that scrollsaw.

And now I'm off for that single malt, Dave!

Cheers,

Trev.


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## DaveL

Trev, 

Very nice, I am still looking for some suitable timber to use for this, your choice is great. :mrgreen:


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## Gill

Just as the chaps in the mess were about to share a couple of unclaimed eggs for breakfast  8) !

You've done a grand job there, Trev  . Stack cutting your first project was quite ambitious but it's come out a treat - and at the cost of only one saw blade. That's quite remarkable  . Nevertheless, it'll probably be well worth considering changing your blade for your next project; scrollsaw blades aren't renowned for their longevity.

I love the effect of the spalted sycamore. As you know, I've got a little of that myself and I think I'll save it until I want to cut something really special. You'll have to show us how they look when they've been properly finished.

Well done!

Gill (who'll definitely be at Stoneleigh on Sunday  )


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## scroller frank

Hi Trev,
great job there ,  glad you found them ok, (how are the hills of north wales?) :lol: 
great choice of wood, makes realistic clouds.

keek up the good work,-- --Frank----


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## Jaco

Nice job Trev!!!!


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## Chris Knight

Trev,

They look great - well done!


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## Lin

Trev, You done good.....give yourself a pat on the back. Stack cutting first time outta the gate.......great job......more than that I really like the choice of wood......the spalt gives them that up in the air look. Wispy clouds and such......no wonder you had a hard time finding them.......hope your piggy bank grows quickly.......I think you may have a knack for this stuff.
Lin


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## trevtheturner

Thank you all for your kind and reassuring comments. They are much appreciated.  

I had the picture in mind when I picked up that piece of rough spalted wood and it seems to have turned out as I hoped. In fact, I was just pleased to have produced anything from my first effort! It won't be my last.

One of my sons is a wolf nut, so I can see your wolf pattern coming in handy for a Christmas present, Lin - thanks for posting it.

Cheers,

Trev.


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## Gill

trevtheturner":t7eoycyo said:


> I was just pleased to have produced anything from my first effort! It won't be my last.

















Gill


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## Gill

At the Stoneleigh exhibition it was suggested that another vintage aircraft pattern might be well received. The one I've come up with is a bit more testing than the Spitfire pattern; I've asked Lin if she can think of ways to simplify it but that might take a while to work through. In the meantime, there may be some people who have newly acquired SIP saws which they're keen to put to the test. So here it is - a Lancaster bomber. Click on the picture below for the full pattern.





I'd suggest a fairly fine blade for this project, such as a #2 or #3. If you don't have one of those, use a coarser blade and don't worry if you can't cut quite as much detail; it should still make a nice picture. Alternatively, enlarge the pattern until you're happy that it's suitable for you. A fairly resilient wood such as maple or sycamore would be my choice for the project, but there's no reason why a decent grade plywood or even MDF wouldn't work. Because some of the detail is quite fine, I wouldn't use material that was less than 6mm thick.

This project certainly won't be as easy as the others - bon chance!

Gill


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## trevtheturner

:shock: Blimey, Gill, you're a hard taskmaster! :wink: 

Took the SIP out of its box this evening. A quick check and all looks okay, and it works. But the blade supplied in it must be about a #72 - I think my tree pruning saw has a finer blade! :lol: :lol: A small amount of vibration with it running at high speed, free-standing on the bench although it didn't try to go walkabout. Couple of quick-clamps and it was fine. I have cut a baseboard to bolt it to for ease of moving it about, and for clamping it to the bench wherever might be convenient at the time.

Thanks for posting the pic. of the Lancaster - I will certainly have a go at it in due course.

Cheers,

Trev.


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## Gill

trevtheturner":3t0ffa8l said:


> :shock: Blimey, Gill, you're a hard taskmaster! :wink:



Oh dear :? . Perhaps you might be interested in a Hurricane pattern that's at a skill level much more akin to that of the Spitfire?







(Click on image for full pattern, as usual.)

Gill

PS The lettering might look a bit daunting. In practice, it shouldn't be too difficult but the picture will hardly suffer if you choose to omit it.


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## trevtheturner

Gill":3rmmzjft said:


> Oh dear :? .



No, not at all, Gill. I was only joking.  
But thanks for posting the Hurricane pattern. I'll do that one as well (probably first!).

Cheers,

Trev.


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## dedee

Never in the field of scrollsaw woodwork have so many patterns been offered to so many by so few.

Andy (humming the Battle of Britain theme)


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## Greenfield Bob

Here is the Wolf by Lin. Fun to cut out. I have a friend who loves Wolf pictures, so I will give it to her.
Thanks Lin

Bob


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## Gill

That's come out really well, Bob  . I presume you can confirm it's a project that an inexperienced scroller could tackle?

I'm trying to work out what wood you used, and I'm hazarding Baltic Birch plywood - is that right? What thickness and what sort of blade did you use?

Gill


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## Greenfield Bob

Gill, It is 1/8" baltic birch and I used a 2/0 flat blade. The little cutouts need to be done first and the big area around the left has to be cut carefully or you can break it. I don't know if I could have cut it when I first started scrolling. It might be a challange for the inexperienced scroller but I think it would be fun project if they don't get in a hurry.

Bob


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## Lin

Gill, I'll add what I can on the "Wolf".....I cut it around a year ago...no pics....sorry..I stack cut two of them from 1/8" redoak ply.....I used a 2R blade from Olsen on it......As I remember the hardest cuts were on the left side....One to plan your cuts and do the most intricate first. I don't rmember if I did it on this one but many patterns of this ptye......if I'm worried about possible breakage I will put cut pieces back in....using shipping tape....front and back to help with support for an ajoining cut.....another thing I have done in the past to help support a piece is to tape a playing card/business card over the hole......just a little hole for the blade itself to come thru....I always plan my cuts for tight areas....IF I'm cutting one that is really close to another cut.....I cut that one by cutting the ajacent line first before going on around the cut.....(I'm I making sense here?)...Less bounce possible on the cut then....meaning more support for it and less likely it will break..also if the cut looks like it's just to close to the other for you to feel comfortable with....back off the distance a bit.....don't cut it quite so close.....once the pattern is taken off.....noone but you will know that you change the pattern.....I do it all the time.......Help.....I don't think I'm explaining this very well..........Cutting the wolf from thicker stock will help.
Bob, You did great on the wolf.....
Lin


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## Gill

Thanks Lin (and Bob  ) - very useful tips that will be of value to people cutting not only the wolf, but the Lancaster too.

Gill


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## Greenfield Bob

Thanks Lin, for coming in and helping on your ideas on cutting it. My problem is, I know how to do it but not how to tell how to do it.

Bob


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## Lin

Since I just recently finished the "Work To Live" cutting....pic of completed project on "Completed Project" board......I thought I'd toss out the pattern for those that might have an interest in cutting this one. You will need to resize the pattern to suit yourself. I cut it at approx. 11" x 11" to fit the 1/2" piece of cherry I had on hand. You will need two patterns of this.....the extra to do the dolphins as a glue on overlay. I used a #5R blade on the lettering and the dolphins both. I used a #7R to cut the outer round with the BB stacked below it. Any questions ask away.
Lin


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