# Which joint?



## stuartpaul (3 Jan 2019)

I'm in the early stages of designing a storage chest and I want to do something different for the legs instead of the usual squares.

Came across the gilpin leg which has a 'fin' (reminiscent of a sabre type leg) and thought that would do what I'm looking for. The only decent images are fine woodworking site restricted to members.







However, the more I think about it the more difficult I see the side/leg joint becoming. I'm therefore thinking about a simple angled leg but concerned about strength. Should I angle the tenon or the mortice?






I have to admit to being taught to have angled tenons/straight mortice but I wondering if this gives enough glue area? Also concerned about the overall strength of the finished article which may well end up being sat on.

Any thoughts/comments appreciated.

Stuart


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## thetyreman (3 Jan 2019)

why not do the normal square legs? it'd be a lot easier


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## Sheffield Tony (3 Jan 2019)

stuartpaul":28pw1mg4 said:


> I have to admit to being taught to have angled tenons/straight mortice but I wondering if this gives enough glue area? Also concerned about the overall strength of the finished article which may well end up being sat on.



Doesn't make much sense to me - short grain in the tenon = not very strong. You could go for the left option, but instead of the rails meeting at a mitre, use a (hidden) box joint. Won't come apart easily then, but glue-up might get stressful !

What happens where the panel meets the leg, without that outer stile ?


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## MikeG. (3 Jan 2019)

Angle the mortice! Simply for the beauty of the joint.


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## Woody2Shoes (3 Jan 2019)

Hi - looking at the FWW site I see an article about the "Gilpinoid leg" from issue #249 - the article shows that the 'fin' leg has more structure to it than meets the eye.

I don't want to post images from the article, but the design of the legs starts with a square cross-section that then gets two 'wings' removed from it. The remaining leg piece, in cross-section, effectively looks like a conventional square leg with 90deg mortices (for straight tenons to go into on both sides, in the conventional way) plus a 'fin' of timber projecting outwards from the corner.

The example shows it made from one piece of timber, but I could imagine making it from two or more individual pieces.

So - the design uses perfectly conventional mortices and tenons, but is enhanced by the 'fin' projection on the outer corner.

Cheers, W2S


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## stuartpaul (3 Jan 2019)

thetyreman":13yv4xxi said:


> why not do the normal square legs? it'd be a lot easier


It would indeed, - but where's the fun in that? It's exactly because I don't want bog standard square legs I'm looking for something different.



Sheffield Tony":13yv4xxi said:


> You could go for the left option, but instead of the rails meeting at a mitre, use a (hidden) box joint. Won't come apart easily then, but glue-up might get stressful !
> 
> What happens where the panel meets the leg, without that outer stile ?


Not sure what you mean by hidden box joint? There will be an outer stile, it'll run parallel to the leg probably located by biscuits.



MikeG.":13yv4xxi said:


> Angle the mortice! Simply for the beauty of the joint.


 At the moment this is my preferred option but it does mean there is more opportunity for cock ups!



Woody2Shoes":13yv4xxi said:


> .....Cheers, W2S


Woody, - sorry, didn't mean I couldn't access the detail just that I didn't want to post a link that might lead others to a paywall. I found it in one of my mags as I'm catching up on reading and I really quite liked the style. I might give more though to a two parter but not sure it'll work.


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## CStanford (3 Jan 2019)

Send Hank Gilpin a message. You'll very likely receive a reply.

http://hankgilpin.com/


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## Inspector (3 Jan 2019)

I'll probably be alone in this but I would break out my Lamello for that illustrated joint and put 5 or so biscuits in each side. Maybe staggering them a little vertically so they touch in the middle. Kept to inside will give them lots of meat and I'm confident 3 people can park themselves on it safely.

I think it would be aesthetically pleasing to use a bigger piece and I'd cut a cove with my table saw on both sides to make the fin. 

Your choice and nothing is wrong unless it breaks. Then it was a learning tool. 

Pete


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## Woody2Shoes (3 Jan 2019)

stuartpaul":12avl8k9 said:


> Woody2Shoes":12avl8k9 said:
> 
> 
> > .....Cheers, W2S
> ...



If you have the article why not just copy his method? It looks pretty straightforward (although profligate with timber!). I could see alternative ways to make it with either two or three strips of timber down the leg - per attached scribble. Cheers, W2S


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## stuartpaul (4 Jan 2019)

Current lack of table saw means I'm scratching my head on how to do this with a router table. The 
real benefit of this type of leg (for me anyhow) comes in joining the sides/end panels. Having said that the waste of timber is excessive and caused the initial rethink.

I have got an alternative design but it hasn't got the same flair hence the angled mortice and tenon approach which would still give me the design we like most.


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## woodbloke66 (4 Jan 2019)

I'd plane a 45deg angle on two surfaces of the legs (to form a 90 deg corner) and then domino (or similar) the sides in place. That's the simplest way to do it and I built a small cabinet a few years ago with these sorts of corners, where the 'leg' pokes out at 45deg - Rob


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## Hornbeam (4 Jan 2019)

I would make the chest as a box with the corners chamfered off at 45 degrees and then biscuit joint the legs to the 45 degree chamfer.
The exact configuration of teh corner will depend on the thicknesses of the front and side stiles. If these are quite thin then you may need to include a larger square corner post with was chamfered and then the legs and the stiles would all be biscuited to the corner post (you could use loose tongues but need to be carefull how much meat you take out of the corner.
Table saw not required (other than for usual dimensioning ) and chamfers cut on router table
Can also be glued up in stages so no stressful trying to get all joints to come together at one ...

Ian


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## stuartpaul (5 Jan 2019)

Thank you for the very helpful suggestions.

Having spent the morning in sketchup I'm still not sure which way I will go but at least I have a number of options.

Thanks again.


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