# Hanging doors



## Mcluma

Hanging doors
With this refurb we are also changing all the doors. We have three floors and UK regulations stipulate that all the doors to main living or bedrooms have to be fire rated.
I do not like hanging doors, especially heavy fire rated doors. So I try to make my life as easy as possible.
I’m using 3D fire rated hinges, these hinges when fitted can be altered three ways by using an Allen key
Up/down
In/out
Left/right




Untitled by mcluma, on Flickr

They are more expensive, but they are worth every penny when adjusting the door, especially when working with an old house
For fitting the hinges to the door and doorframe I’m using the trend hinge jig. However the radius of these hinges does not match the guide and cutter. That is what I noticed when hanging the cinema room doors. So I had to make 3 new guides which would fit the different hinge radius.




Untitled by mcluma, on Flickr




Untitled by mcluma, on Flickr




Untitled by mcluma, on Flickr




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Here you can see that the door has been prepared and I’m now ready for cutting the doorframe.




Untitled by mcluma, on Flickr




Untitled by mcluma, on Flickr




Untitled by mcluma, on Flickr

I couldn’t hang the door as I picked the wrong door from the store room. (I picked a fire rated door and this should have been a normal door as it is for the bathroom)


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## Jacob

Looks OK but door hinge jigs are not good IMHO. Faster, neater the old fashioned way - 2 marking gauges, tape, combi square, chisels. Not at all difficult once you have cracked the setting out.
NB You can fire proof existing doors if you want to. Envirograf supply the stuff.
The other essential bit of kit is free - you make a couple of door wedges like I've used here big-windows-t55532.html
then add one or two thin wedges for aligning the door in the hole.


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## twothumbs

It is what is best for you and works that is important. The Building Regs. are probably the England and Wales ones. Scotland, and NI are different or not the same, though of course often share similar aims of safety. Fire doors are becoming more difficult than just buying off the shelf due to the manufacturers test results and ironmongery used in the tests. Thanks for sharing this. 
Interestingly there are universities here that found they had problems with large corridor doors being too heavy, in that small girl students from the far east were unable to push them open. Could be serious. Good luck.


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## Mcluma

Jacob":2wxahwpw said:


> NB You can fire proof existing doors if you want to. Envirograf supply the stuff.



The old oak doors where not thick enough, they need to be a solid 44mm doors. the doors i had where disallowed as the fields where only 10mm thick


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## andersonec

twothumbs":gzi2m50c said:


> Interestingly there are universities here that found they had problems with large corridor doors being too heavy, in that small girl students from the far east were unable to push them open. Could be serious. Good luck.




Don't we have small girls in this country then? :? 


Andy


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## Phil Pascoe

:wink: Fortunately, not many.


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## twothumbs

You do get very light far east female students who are probably lighter than the door leaf. At 7-8 stones (98 - 112 lbs) they are about the same as a wide corridor leaf....at say 103 lbs plus a good closer. Now I am wondering what we did in schools and other places where children are not with an adult and have automatic hold backs. They are fine as long as you are on the safe side when it goes off. Mmmmm? Need to think about this...the old grey cells are not working.


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## twothumbs

You do get very light far east female students who are probably lighter than the door leaf. At 7-8 stones (98 - 112 lbs) they are about the same as a wide corridor leaf....at say 103 lbs plus a good closer. Now I am wondering what we did in schools and other places where children are not with an adult and have automatic hold backs. They are fine as long as you are on the safe side when it goes off. Mmmmm? Need to think about this...the old grey cells are not working.


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## Stormer1940

Jacob":1obmj4lm said:


> Looks OK but door hinge jigs are not good IMHO. Faster, neater the old fashioned way - 2 marking gauges, tape, combi square, chisels. Not at all difficult once you have cracked the setting out.
> NB You can fire proof existing doors if you want to. Envirograf supply the stuff.
> The other essential bit of kit is free - you make a couple of door wedges like I've used here big-windows-t55532.html
> then add one or two thin wedges for aligning the door in the hole.



I prefer marking, scoring back line with marking gauge, cutting the straights with a chisel and then freehand routering.
I have a jig and I have used it once. May sell it.... Win Bags are a great addition for door hanging to.


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## Setch

I don't hang lots of doors at once, but think even jacob is over complicating things - all you need are hinges, and the chisel you'll be using to chop them in. The knuckle of the hinge aligns it square on the door egde, and you scribe round with a chisel - KISS!


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## promhandicam

Setch":3ea941rr said:


> I don't hang lots of doors at once, but think even jacob is over complicating things - all you need are hinges, and the chisel you'll be using to chop them in. The knuckle of the hinge aligns it square on the door egde, and you scribe round with a chisel - KISS!



I prefer a stanley knife for marking out as you describe it rather than a chisel.


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## Mcluma

Setch":3o5xwfcn said:


> I don't hang lots of doors at once, but think even jacob is over complicating things - all you need are hinges, and the chisel you'll be using to chop them in. The knuckle of the hinge aligns it square on the door egde, and you scribe round with a chisel - KISS!




That will not work with the 3d hinges, in the door they are recessed by a good 10mm, and they are not flush with the knuckle of the hinge

The issue with these hinges is that the radious is not matching up with the jig of trend so i had to make my on jig inserts

Once i had this done the fit is perfect. routing out the hinges really beats using a chissel. also the set-up for using the same jig on the door and the doorpost makes it silly person proof

what i cannot understand is that Trend has not made an insert or sell a collar to handle these euro round hinges

yes i can buy the jig from the manufacturer but at a price of £200,- and then you constanly have to move the jig as it is only good for cutting one hinge at a time


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## gwr

I have never used a hinge jig so cant comment much on them.Can anyone tell me if they are angled so as the router cuts slightly deeper at the back? I know this won't be an issue with a lot of modern hinges.


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## Stormer1940

gwr":14t77mdw said:


> I have never used a hinge jig so cant comment much on them.Can anyone tell me if they are angled so as the router cuts slightly deeper at the back? I know this won't be an issue with a lot of modern hinges.


 The one I have does not. Mine is the 2 piece 76mm jig. £35 off ebay...


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## Jacob

Setch":1k5czhwj said:


> I don't hang lots of doors at once, but think even jacob is over complicating things - all you need are hinges, and the chisel you'll be using to chop them in. The knuckle of the hinge aligns it square on the door egde, and you scribe round with a chisel - KISS!


Well yes no prob if your only tool is a chisel! But a few bits and bobs are useful if you've got them. Handy to mark up with a couple of gauges. Cheapo beech ones are ideal - no need to go mad with expensive fashionable metal versions. You need several anyway, as a rule.


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## Mcluma

One is in, another 25 to go





Untitled by mcluma, on Flickr


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## Stormer1940

Have you taken the finished floor level in to account? I'd hate to see you hanging 25 40KG doors and then they needed to be taken off for trimming.... I'm not being sarcastic here I just know how heavy those blooming doors are...


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## Mcluma

These doors are pre-finished, so no trimming what so ever, so door cassing needs to be spot on, hence the use of these hinges.

I will be using solid oak thresholds troughout the house


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## houtslager

" One is in, another 25 to go "

Blimey how big is your house ?

K


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## Mcluma

Did today another one




Untitled by mcluma, on Flickr


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## RogerS

Stormer1940":3lbcudwu said:


> Jacob":3lbcudwu said:
> 
> 
> 
> Looks OK but door hinge jigs are not good IMHO. Faster, neater the old fashioned way - 2 marking gauges, tape, combi square, chisels. Not at all difficult once you have cracked the setting out.
> NB You can fire proof existing doors if you want to. Envirograf supply the stuff.
> The other essential bit of kit is free - you make a couple of door wedges like I've used here big-windows-t55532.html
> then add one or two thin wedges for aligning the door in the hole.
> 
> 
> 
> 
> I prefer marking, scoring back line with marking gauge, cutting the straights with a chisel and then freehand routering.
> I have a jig and I have used it once. May sell it.... Win Bags are a great addition for door hanging to.
Click to expand...


Winbag...surely not Jacob? Oh, sorry, thought you said Windbag :lol: :lol:


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## RogerS

Chris, can you please point me in the direction of the relevant part of the Regs as I'd not come across this requirement before. Is it a new one?


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## Mcluma

I have to check, but our building inspector is very clued up on these things, another inspector said the same thing on the house my MIL is building (also 3 floors)

Well another door is in, that makes the top floor done, (5 doors), now its on with the door trim, which will take a bit of time, as its bespoke (I will be using my reclaimed oak floorboards)

I made some samples which the wife liked, but she didn't like the colour of the oak. so i need to give it a light oak stain and then varnish, which means a few extra steps in the process






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Untitled by mcluma, on Flickr


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## chippy1970

Could you have not used standard square cornered hinges rather than those rounded ones ? We fit hundreds of fire doors per year and usually use the normal ball bearing type as specified by most architects. I've not read the whole thread so maybe I missed the reason. We hang quite a lot of pre finished door sets too and normally there is no need to have adjustable hinges you just make sure you fit the lining right.


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## wabbitpoo

If your OH is fussy about the colour, surely she'll also hate the rounded corners of the recesses that dont match the radius of the hinges - yuk!


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## chippy1970

wabbitpoo":kk6zgvrf said:


> If your OH is fussy about the colour, surely she'll also hate the rounded corners of the recesses that dont match the radius of the hinges - yuk!



Im not the only one who spotted that then :lol:


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## Mcluma

chippy1970":rtl9a5ov said:


> wabbitpoo":rtl9a5ov said:
> 
> 
> 
> If your OH is fussy about the colour, surely she'll also hate the rounded corners of the recesses that dont match the radius of the hinges - yuk!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Im not the only one who spotted that then :lol:
Click to expand...



That is the whole reason i had to modify the trend jig so as to not have these issues, but i filled them with brummer oak filler, now you cannot see the mistake anymore


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## Mcluma

Finished the doors on the top floor (door handles and locks), and I'm almost done with the door trims, only the cinema doors left to do, and some skirting boards

I've been using the reclaimed oak floor boards, and the result is lovely

It will be all oak in the hall way, but inside the room it will be white so there i used pine




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IMG_0590 by mcluma, on Flickr


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## wabbitpoo

Mcluma":ewzcwhvr said:


> chippy1970":ewzcwhvr said:
> 
> 
> 
> 
> 
> wabbitpoo":ewzcwhvr said:
> 
> 
> 
> If your OH is fussy about the colour, surely she'll also hate the rounded corners of the recesses that dont match the radius of the hinges - yuk!
> 
> 
> 
> 
> Im not the only one who spotted that then :lol:
> 
> Click to expand...
> 
> 
> 
> That is the whole reason i had to modify the trend jig so as to not have these issues, but i filled them with brummer oak filler, now you cannot see the mistake anymore
Click to expand...


Sorry - I missed the point of the post!


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## Mcluma

Did another two last night

These are the doors that give access from the bedroom into the dressing room. Unfortunately not completely matching the rest of the doors of the house, as it was an after thought to put double doors in. The manufacturer didn't had this size in the matching profile - colour etc is the same

The wife is happy and that counts for more ;D




Untitled by mcluma, on Flickr


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## Noel

The cinema? The dressing room? Where did I go wrong? 

Seriously hope all goes well, sounds like a rather large property.

Noel, who has a total of 11 doors....


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## maltrout512

Noel":1bj427o8 said:


> The cinema? The dressing room? Where did I go wrong?
> 
> Seriously hope all goes well, sounds like a rather large property.
> 
> Noel, who has a total of 11 doors....


 
I had to change some doors in a bungalow a few years back 23 in total. Only 4 of them were wardrobes


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## Allylearm

Mt tuppence as an alternative method. As there is more than one way to skin a cat.

If hanging a lot of doors by hand I made up a hinging stick marked out for top clearence on door and where hinges were to be placed. This can then be placed tight to door lintol and mark where the hinge tails are to go. 

To lift the door as long as you have a floor you just place top hinge tail on bottom chisel cut on standard and let the door incline at an angle past standard edge (the more or less angle of door lifts or drops hinge in position, screwing in one screw to locate hinge (bottom screw hole), push door back flush with standard edge and locating hinge at the bottom of the door into standard hinge recess and screw one screw in place. Try the door for fit, adjust by removing door or finish fitting screws to hinges, if they need tightened to get the hinge to rear of tail, adjust your screw entry by fixing a brad hole to rear of screw slot and loosen other screw to allow the new screw to bring the hinge back. Take out the offending screw if you need a lot more travel. Only fix all screws in place when satisfied with fit of hinge or door. I prefer the screw holes closest to standard edge to first screw in, they carry weight of door better and give better alignment and let you see the door looking after all hinges are fixed in place.

Minus about this method though it is fast, you can slip the tail and crease or cut the chisel edge (not bad but annoying). But practice makes perfect as they say. You can hang any door except shop hung doors they need another method as you usually cannot get enough angle as your tight against a wall.


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## thebigt

101 doors on a new vets in just under 4 weeks,mostly done with a trend hinge jig but mainly makita laminate trimmer for hinge rebate and a good chissell flew them up,,,never want to see another door though again,lol


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## Graham Orm

I realise this is an old thread (before anyone jumps on me!) but it wasn't me who resurrected it. :duno: 

Anyway...FYI....35 mm fire doors are now widely available avoiding the need to rout out the old casings. I gave up with a jig ages ago, took longer to set up than using a chisel. OK if you have 101 doors to fit, but not worth it for the odd one or two.


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## alunt

Sorry to resurrect an old thread again... but...

Question for Mcluma: How did you work out the radius required to make your inserts?

I've just bought the Trend Hinge Jig to fit Eclipse Stainless Steel radius hinges on my oak doors and have run into the same problem of the cutter taking too much off.
I tried making new inserts but cant seem to get the radius identical to the hinges.


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## Mcluma

alunt":11v59qsj said:


> Sorry to resurrect an old thread again... but...
> 
> Question for Mcluma: How did you work out the radius required to make your inserts?
> 
> I've just bought the Trend Hinge Jig to fit Eclipse Stainless Steel radius hinges on my oak doors and have run into the same problem of the cutter taking too much off.
> I tried making new inserts but cant seem to get the radius identical to the hinges.




I called the manufacturer (uk based) and they provided me with the drawing - send that over to my budy in Tokyo and he cut the new inserts for me

so in the end it where 32 doors and 4 doors with a centre bottom and top hinge


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## alunt

Mcluma: Thanks for the reply.

I actually figured it in the end by trial & error.
I got the radius with a 20mm flat bit.
I made a template from MDF, which after a bit of faffing got perfect then used the template with a flush trimming bit to form 3 oak inserts.
Job done.
I've hung the first door, 7 more to go.


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## dejaa

I'm probably a bit too late now as i guess you've already finished tyhis job.

However for the future I would simply make my own jig;- 

Fix two pieces of wood at right angles, one side long enough to be clamped at either side of the hinge position, theother piece piece sitting on top of the door edge.

Decide on the router cutter diameter and cut a rebate out of the top piece to a width and depth to just take the hinge taking into account the diameter of the router guide diameter..

let me know if you want a picture more details

David


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## Graham Orm

Mark the hinge out with a Stanley knife and free-hand with a 1/4" router, simple accurate and very quick.


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