# Lathe choice again?



## gasmansteve (24 Aug 2008)

Hi folks
Need to update my little Draper lathe which I bought a while back to see if I liked turning (I did) and seriously looking at the Hegner, Vicmarc 175 and Jet 1642 lathes. I was interested in the Nova variable speed lathe until someone pointed out the external motors might be easier (cheaper) to repair unlike the combined head/motor types like the Nova`s??.
Found a few recommendations for the Vicmarc and its ticking a few boxes at present but I`m tempted to hang on for the Harrogate show and check out any offers anyone care to comment on these lathes please?.
Cheers
Steve


----------



## Paul.J (24 Aug 2008)

Steve,as you know i have the Hegner and am really pleased with it,though i am still having problems with the banjo movement.
It is great when i clean it all down,slides very easily but as soon as shavings/dust get on the bed it just won't move without having to put the tool down and moving it with both hands,which i find very annoying.
I have tried what as been suggested in the past,though i might try some felt material glued to the underside of the banjo so it cleans the dust away as i move it.
Apart from this niggle it is a quiet smooth running machine.


----------



## Argee (24 Aug 2008)

Paul.J":17czuvbv said:


> Apart from this niggle it is a quiet smooth running machine.


Paul, have you tried slacking off the locking nut underneath, so that there's slightly more clearance when the banjo is released? I've never had such a problem with mine.

Ray.


----------



## Paul.J (24 Aug 2008)

*Argee wrote*


> have you tried slacking off the locking nut underneath, so that there's slightly more clearance when the banjo is released?


Hello Ray.
Yes i have tried this Ray.Though my nut is on top :?: 
I have had the spanner by me when turning loosening and tightening the nut to see if it helps.
I have put a larger diameter washer also on the top to replace the smaller one and this seemed to help a little.


----------



## TEP (24 Aug 2008)

Seen this problem before, (not on my lathe thankfully). What the guy did was to glue some Velcro hook strip along each side of the banjo. Then he has a strip of what I think was thick felt with the opposite Velcro stitched on which was fixed each side so it pressed hard against the bed. It seemed to clear the rubbish ahead as he moved the tool rest.

Quite a inexpensive way of solving a problem. It may just work for you.


----------



## Paul.J (24 Aug 2008)

Thanks Tam.
I will try the felt pads next time


----------



## Wanlock Dod (25 Aug 2008)

Steve,

I've also got a Hegner, and I think it's great  

Cheers,

Dod


----------



## gasmansteve (25 Aug 2008)

Ta for the info. I sent for the Hegner dvd and it seems pretty impressive. I gather the 1hp is an option which I would have thought would be a standard nowadays at those prices?. I keep stopping my Draper using the chisels so I suppose any increase on 1/3 hp (I think) would be a blessing :? . Doesn`t seem to be many Vicmarc users about as I would like to hear what users think of those too.
Thanks again
Steve


----------



## NickWelford (25 Aug 2008)

The extra HP will certainly teach you to take lighter cuts - it can be dangerous if the lathe doesn't stop = just think where all that energy is going to go - Take care........


----------



## Argee (25 Aug 2008)

NickWelford":2cpqmos8 said:


> The extra HP will certainly teach you to take lighter cuts - it can be dangerous if the lathe doesn't stop = just think where all that energy is going to go - Take care........


The Hegners have a torque sensor which keeps the power constant during cutting, but cuts the motor in the event of a potential stall.

Ray.


----------



## boysie39 (25 Aug 2008)

Steve,I cant give you any recommendations on what lathe to buy but I would suggest that whomever you buy from ,1st they have it in stock.2nd that you get a delivery date from them and hold them to it.3rd Dont buy it from someone just because you feel that they are known to you why not give them the buisness.
I bought and paid for a lathe on the 14-08-08 on the 19/08 I quired when my lathe would arrive so that I could have someone here to sign for it when it arrived. From what I could gather they wer'nt sure if it had been shipped as yet.It is now the 25/08 and no word yet but there is some smoke swirling around . Anyway I dont think this happens too often at least not with good companys. So best of luck and choose wisley REgards Boysie


----------



## gasmansteve (25 Aug 2008)

Sorry to hear about the lathe Boysie, hope it arrives soon. You would think nowadays that firms can`t afford to behave like that unless it is a genuine mistake. Any apologies etc from the firm concerned? care to mention them? 
Cheers
Steve


----------



## cornucopia (26 Aug 2008)

name and shame  

I used a little vicmarc vl100 lathe for a couple of days once, it was super smooth and quiet, but unsuitable for anything bigger than box's pen's etc


----------



## gasmansteve (26 Aug 2008)

I was looking at the vl175 with a bed length of 1000mm which should be more than adequate for me. Not sure if the very rare times a longer bed than this would be needed would justify the added cost?. I`m very interested in comments folk have on any lathes really. I just want a well made and reliable one preferably with electronic variable speed (don`t we all) and have learnt over the years with other stuff that you certainly do get what you pay for. The CL4 looks quite a nice lathe and I`ve been very impressed with my Record bandsaw so that one might be in the offing but as I say open to anyones views and opinions !.
Regards
Steve


----------



## Neil Dyball (26 Aug 2008)

Hi,

I've not used any of the Vicmarc's but their owners all seem to speak very highly of them.

I now have a Record CL4, having upgraded from a DML36SH. I think it's a super machine for the money, the variable speed is excellent and it does everything I ask of it. As I'm a definite leisure turner I couldn't justify the expense of a new lathe and bought mine second hand on eBay, a couple of years old (but like new) for around £550 including loads of 'extras'. Incidentally the guy I bought it from had just purchased a new Vicmarc.

I firmly believe that "you get what you pay for" to a large extent and the Vicmarc's are definitely very well engineered from what I've seen, not that the CL4 isn't, just that it's all relative! 

Cheers,

Neil.


----------



## cornucopia (26 Aug 2008)

gasmansteve":zpkur6ul said:


> I was looking at the vl175 with a bed length of 1000mm which should be more than adequate for me. Not sure if the very rare times a longer bed than this would be needed would justify the added cost?. I`m very interested in comments folk have on any lathes really. I just want a well made and reliable one preferably with electronic variable speed (don`t we all) and have learnt over the years with other stuff that you certainly do get what you pay for. The CL4 looks quite a nice lathe and I`ve been very impressed with my Record bandsaw so that one might be in the offing but as I say open to anyones views and opinions !.
> Regards
> Steve



in that case then.......... what you need is a vb36 \/ :lol:


----------



## gasmansteve (26 Aug 2008)

Yeh right just need them six numbers on Saturday for that :lol: 
Whats your lathe Corny?
I used to think that `the lathe maketh the bowl` but having a few turnings under me belt I realise its the bloke (or woman - bit of pc there!) holding the chisel thats more important. :wink: 
Regards
Steve


----------



## cornucopia (26 Aug 2008)

gasmansteve":3076q8e6 said:


> Yeh right just need them six numbers on Saturday for that :lol:
> Whats your lathe Corny?
> I used to think that `the lathe maketh the bowl` but having a few turnings under me belt I realise its the bloke (or woman - bit of pc there!) holding the chisel thats more important. :wink:
> Regards
> Steve



why a vb36 of course 8) :twisted: :wink:


----------



## gasmansteve (26 Aug 2008)

£4,030.25 inc vat :shock: :shock: Nice touch the 25p bit I wonder what that buys ?. I don`t think SWMBO would be too chuffed if yours truly shelled out that for `another silly bloody hobby`  

Steve


----------



## boysie39 (26 Aug 2008)

Gasman, seems the problem is you brits being akward by having your bank holidays at different times than us. Anyway lathe arrived this morning ,it's a Nova 1624/44 have it all set up for tomorrow. Even I think I can turn something good on this little beaut.
I think it would be unfair to mention names as I will be buying from him again and I dont want to rock the boat. If I can help with any Info.about the lathe just ASK. All's well that ends well. REgards Boysie
PS Chas, I missed out on the new entrys ,have had a big clear out will update you for next one Boysie.


----------



## SVB (26 Aug 2008)

Steve,

Well - an innocent question but I may set the cat amongst the feathered fiends with the reply!

First - cards on the table. I have a 300 Viccy and think it is the Canine's important bits!

I have turned on Hegner, Jet and the Viccy 175. IN MY opinion (not shouting here, just an important qualification!) the choice is between the Jet and Viccy. The Hegner's tool rest is a disaster - try to turn anything smaller than 1" dia is impossible without a mod - and to ask for extra cash for 1hp is a joke. Also the hassle to remove the tailstock, which if you turn deep bowls / hollow forms you will need to do is a real PITA! Added to this it is only a couple of bits of 2" sq tube welded up - not great IMHO for the work I do which is mainly out of balance / wet / hollow forms when weight counts!

Therefore, you have the Jet and Viccy. I found the Jet a bit light and bouncy to use BUT is was on a first floor workshop and just stood on lightly supported floorboards so may not be a fair reflection.

In contrast, I have found Vicmarc's nothing but a real pleasure. I notice you are in North Yorks - I would really suggest a couple of tanks of fuel being well worth it there and back to go to Phil Iron's and have a go. I am sure you would not regret it. I would have no hesitation in buying the same again tomorrow. HOWEVER - I am not sure if Vicmarc was the subject of the previous post, but they are cast iron and Australian. Therefore, if not in stock they have to come from the other side of the world therefore not instant (although Phil does have a room full of spares and accessories so back up is not a problem not that I have ever needed any!).

Well, I hope I have not offended anyone but my 2hp worth.

By the way, no connection to Phil or Vicmarc, just a happy owner.


----------



## big soft moose (28 Aug 2008)

gasman - just muddying the waters further i know but you could do worse than one of the big old heavy lathes like the union graduate or the wadkin.

see the bottom two here http://www.gandmtools.co.uk/cat_branch.php?sub=15 (750 for the graduate , 550 for the wadkin)

both are three phase but converting them to single phase would not be that difficult / expensive.

come to that i believe blister has a short bed single phase graduate for sale for £1k

if you dont want to spend that much the poolewood supalathe also on the link (325 notes) could well be an option

i would buy the graduate myself but swimbo would nail me up by the dangly bits if i spent that much on a lathe this close to our wedding day.


( just to be clear i have no connection to g and m tools )


----------



## gasmansteve (29 Aug 2008)

Many thanks chaps for all the helpful replies. Its becoming harder than choosing a ruddy car this :? . I was looking at maybe upto a grand and half which gives me a fair choice but I`m still very tempted to hang on until the Harrogate show. We recently got an excellent price on a caravan (yes I`m one of em you shout at on the road  ) purely because of it being bought at a show mebs the same for lathes ????.
Regards
Steve


----------



## Argee (30 Aug 2008)

gasmansteve":1ol77ar4 said:


> Its becoming harder than choosing a ruddy car this :? I was looking at maybe upto a grand and half which gives me a fair choice but I`m still very tempted to hang on until the Harrogate show.


You're making it hard for yourself, Steve. This is your second thread on the topic and you're no further forward. What you should be doing is getting out to *see and try* a couple of different models, then another couple. You won't get *any *idea of whether a lathe suits you until you try it. If that first time is going to be after delivery, you may just as well toss a coin between the top two contenders now, whatever they currently are.

You're not very likely to be able to try one at Harrogate, nor are you likely to get much of a deal either, due to the current economic climate, Internet competition, etc. If you _*want *_to buy one untried, you've already got enough info for further narrowing-down and pricing research. Otherwise, join a club or two, get some hands-on time, it's the best way, as has already been said, many times. That sounds a bit blunt, but I don't see any urgency, so you should try some first.

Ray.


----------



## Bodrighy (30 Aug 2008)

As Argee says, the only real way to decide is to try for yourself. If like me when I started money was a problem thn fair enough go on recommendation but the budget you have will cover most of the better ones. Every turner has a favourite based on his or her experience and the lathes within your budget are all excellent machines. A good turner can create beautiful pieces with a Black & Decker drill attachment so gou out and test drive before you drive yourself crazy trying to decide.

Using the car example I have driven Astons, Jags, Bentleys and Lexuses (driven not owned) and still prefer driving series 2 Landrovers or lightweights. 

Pete


----------



## gasmansteve (30 Aug 2008)

I`m not sure but think I`ve had my wrists slapped here  .Never been to the Harrogate show and somewhat naively (is that a word?) thought I`d be able to try all the lathes on show, obviously not ! I was looking for a lathe which would last me a good few years. I do belong to Jorvick club at York which has a Hegner for speakers demos etc and I`ve had a go on it and indeed do like it. I have found if you ask people that actually use the equipment rather than salesmen you get a better evaluation. If maybe a hundred turners said avoid lathe B like the plague but 5 diy`ers said buy it that you might agree could help with choice even before seeing it. Obviously the final choice is mine but unbiased opinions are very helpful. I know noone who owns the Jet so who would be my next contact for that? a local dealer who would obviously say its the dogs whatsits  ? and perhaps after many positive comments I would .I think most of us buy things not just lathes by seeing/using or being recommended by others. Maybe its just my way of going about things as I do go into great detail when buying stuff. Hope that explains my reasoning. :wink: 
Regards
Steve


----------



## Bodrighy (31 Aug 2008)

Trh some of the ameican forums for Jet users as they are quite popular in the States. I have a Jet mini which is generally good but the big ones are a different ball game.

Pete


----------



## Argee (31 Aug 2008)

gasmansteve":k03xszv7 said:


> I`m not sure but think I`ve had my wrists slapped here


That wasn't the intention, Steve! 

When you've got so many different things to pick from (lathes included), the best way is to see and try two, then you can probably eliminate one of those two. Now move on and try a *different *two and so on, until you've reduced your field to some really strong contenders. Along the way, you may find something that causes you to re-evaluate your requirements. *Then *you can make a fully-informed choice that you know will suit you. 

Ray.


----------



## Paul.J (31 Aug 2008)

I don't think you get a really true picture of any tool/machine using it just for a few minutes.You can look all you like but looks aren't everything.
I felt just the same when deciding which lathe i wanted,i didn't want to make the wrong choice,but with me not been able to drive i didn't really get to see any lathes so just sought advice from members and it was down to the Hegner or the Nova in my price range.
I would love to have bought a Wivamac or a Vicmarc which both seem to have really good reviews,or a VB36 :lol: 
But i was impressed with the Hegner DVD and the 30 day trial period,plus recommendations from forum members, that that was the one i decided to go with,and now the only problem i am having is with the banjo on it,which goes back to what i said at the start,problems will sometimes occur no matteer how long you look


----------



## gasmansteve (31 Aug 2008)

Point taken Ray. My point being if you don`t know folk who have the lathe you want to try or might be interested in then how do you try it?. Which brings me back to the reason for my original post in asking more experienced turners than I for their views to maybe narrow my choices down. BTW Just noticed on the Harrogate woodworking show web site that Warco seem to be resurrecting Graduate wood lathes.
Regards
Steve


----------



## TobyB (2 Sep 2008)

Vicmarc I used on a course was very nice - but I'd not get one into my basement workshop ... and I liked the idea of a rotating head lathe. I did buy a Wivamac after looking at them at Harrogate - and very very happy with it in practice, and a nice bit of engineering - not sure my skills will ever be up to its potential though.

Briefly looked at the Hegner - seems to be an overly specialised bit of kit for most turners ...

Cheers

Toby


----------



## gasmansteve (2 Sep 2008)

TobyB":n69g3dfe said:


> Briefly looked at the Hegner - seems to be an overly specialised bit of kit for most turners ...
> 
> Toby



Hi Toby
Wonder if you could expand on that please?.

Regards
Steve


----------



## TobyB (3 Sep 2008)

I haven't used one I admit - but looked at one or two for real (in the steel?) as well as their web site etc. I suspect it's THE thing if I wanted to make 2-3' bowls and vast artistic hollow forms to display in big galleries and sell to corporate headquarters. I suppose I might want to do that at some point ... maybe. It didn't look like a tool you could easily make small boxes, table lamps, etc on ... and looked pretty cumbersome for making small, simple, "everyday" bowls (that I have the skills, tools and wood for). I think one of Richard Raffans books made similar remarks. So ... perhaps it's like an F1 car or a military-spec HumVee ... very good for its specialised field ... I prefered to get a more versatile everyday workhorse estate car ... I'm sure delighted Hegner owners will now tell us otherwise however!

Oh yes - I also dismissed the Hegner on grounds of cost, size and weight ... never get that into my cellar workshop!

Cheers

Toby


----------



## Argee (3 Sep 2008)

TobyB":3onlhr6x said:


> I haven't used one I admit - It didn't look like a tool you could easily make small boxes, table lamps, etc on ... and looked pretty cumbersome for making small, simple, "everyday" bowls (that I have the skills, tools and wood for).


Having a swivelling headstock, that you can position anywhere that's comfortable is "cumbersome"? Turning pens and lace bobbins is about as small as you need, isn't it?










Ray.


----------



## TobyB (3 Sep 2008)

Ah ha ... never seen that before! The only Hegner lathe I'd seen on the web or for real was the VB36 bowl-turning thing, and for that matter all the discussions of Hegners I'd read seemed to relate to this too ... didn't realise they made this. So all my comments related to the VB36 monster. Looked further on the web - seen that a HDB200XL exists ... looks like a very reasonable bit of kit you've got there Argee. 

I like my Wivamac head that both rotates and slides up to the centre of the bed - definitely not "cumbersome".

Cheers

Toby


----------



## cornucopia (3 Sep 2008)

TobyB":21aqn0pt said:


> Ah ha ... never seen that before! The only Hegner lathe I'd seen on the web or for real was the VB36 bowl-turning thing, and for that matter all the discussions of Hegners I'd read seemed to relate to this too ... didn't realise they made this. So all my comments related to the VB36 monster. Looked further on the web - seen that a HDB200XL exists ... looks like a very reasonable bit of kit you've got there Argee.
> 
> I like my Wivamac head that both rotates and slides up to the centre of the bed - definitely not "cumbersome".
> 
> ...



you seem to be confused #-o hegner u.k manafacture the best lathe ever (in my opinion) the vb36, they also sell the hdb200xl as well as many other top quality things.
you are also misinformed if you belive the vb36 is not capable of turning its hand to anything asked of it- trust me it is  it can be used to make a thimble or a 3' tall vase, it is trully superb 




disclamer: I have no ties with hegner u.k nor am i related to anyone who works for hegner u.k. - the above statement is my unbiased opinion based on being a vb36 owner for several years.


----------



## Argee (3 Sep 2008)

TobyB":3fh64iv6 said:


> ... looks like a very reasonable bit of kit you've got there Argee.


And so it is, but it's *nothing *compared to a VB36, which I would have bought if I could have justified it. As I'm not a professional or a production turner, I went with what I consider to be the next best (and "standard format") lathe. 

Ray.


----------



## gasmansteve (3 Sep 2008)

Just a small thought Ray. Would I still be able to use my Supernova 2 chuck with the Hegner HDB obviously with the correct threaded insert?. I really like that chuck and have a few different jaw sets for it.

Steve


----------



## Argee (3 Sep 2008)

gasmansteve":1e6gaybd said:


> Would I still be able to use my Supernova 2 chuck with the Hegner HDB obviously with the correct threaded insert?


The Hegner comes as standard with a 33mm x 3.5mm pitch thread. In the table on *this* page (fourth row down), Peter Childs lists it as *"Code MC22 - Special- please enquire."*

I'd like to be able to confirm it's possible for you, but it seems you'll either need to check with Peter Childs or Hegner for a definitive answer.

Ray.


----------



## CHJ (4 Sep 2008)

I think you will find that the supernova has to be a solid threaded body model for the Hegner, the insert versions outer thread diameter is not big enough to accommodate a 33 mm insert.

PaulJ has Hegner and supernova2 chuck and I know for certain that is a solid model.


----------



## Paul.J (4 Sep 2008)

Yes Steve i had a SN2 chuck for my Perform lathe which i was hoping to keep for the Hegner,but i decided to buy another SN2 as i was told that the exsert would protrude too far and can cause a slight wobble,there was no insert to fit.
As i was going to be turning bigger pieces i didn't want this so opted for a direct fit.
I phoned Sorby up who gave me a code number for a SN2 that would fit the Hegner,but it was just about the same time that Record started dealing with the Nova range,so i had to get it from Record.
I believe that the new Sorby Patriot chuck will fit direct.If you go down that route of course.
I think your spare jaws will fit the new PC.


----------



## gasmansteve (4 Sep 2008)

Thanks for that Paul. I wasn`t aware the SN2 jaws fit the new Patriot chuck.
Hope the sticking tailstock is sorted now?
Cheers
Steve


----------



## robo hippy (4 Sep 2008)

As far as the Jet lathes go, I had a Powermatic 3520A for 8 years and abused it severly. I am a production bowl turner. Powermatic is owned by the same company that owns Jet, and there is a comparable model available over where you are that is sold as a Jet. It runs on 220 current and is 3 phase with a converter. Excellent torque on all speeds, and on both speed ranges. Being made in China, it is cheap for what you get, probably the best buy for the dollars, now about $3,000. They have a 16 inch 1 1/2 hp model as well, and is nice, but I liked the extra hp. I don't think I could turn without the variable speed that you get with the 3 phase converters. I now have a Robust lathe which is more custom made here in the US. Paid too much for it, but it is worth it to me. I do prefer the sliding headstocks, you get a bowl and a spindle lathe in one machine. No more having to bend over the bed of the lathe to turn anything. Haven't really tried the pivoting headstocks, but the idea of putting a tool rest extention on a banjo doesn't sit well for me. I don't think it would take my agressive style of turning.
robo hippy


----------

