# Drilling metal



## transatlantic (1 Apr 2021)

I have this set of drill bits which I use for drilling metal (and wood), yet I always seem to end up cutting incompatible metal and ruining the bit. For example I recently bought a set of Tool Clips (pictured below), no idea of the material as it wasn't listed, but I needed to enlargen the hole ... drill bit ruined 

What drill bit should I have used for this kind of thing? and is there a set I can buy that will cut all common metals? or is it going to be a case of multiple different sets?


----------



## bp122 (1 Apr 2021)

Any high speed steel (hss) bits will do. You can buy these from Bosch and DeWalt from Screwfix or go to UK Drills website.


----------



## bp122 (1 Apr 2021)

And good practice is to not force the bit at high speed without cooling it. Use oil to cool the bit and allow sufficient cooling.


----------



## Myfordman (1 Apr 2021)

Those clips are made of spring steel and not that suitable for drilling.


----------



## transatlantic (1 Apr 2021)

But I did you HSS bits (see the link I posted). And the bit in question has only been used on wood previously, so was sharp.


----------



## transatlantic (1 Apr 2021)

Myfordman said:


> Those clips are made of spring steel and not that suitable for drilling.



So how would I go about enlargening the hole?


----------



## Myfordman (1 Apr 2021)

You don't normally as it will weaken the clip but if you absolutely must then grind it.


----------



## transatlantic (1 Apr 2021)

Myfordman said:


> You don't normally as it will weaken the clip but if you absolutely must then grind it.



So like with a dremel?









8153 Grinding Bits | Dremel


Dremel 8153 3/16 In. (4.8 mm) Aluminum Oxide Grinding Stone




us.dremel.com


----------



## Spectric (1 Apr 2021)

As 9 fingers has said spring steel is not good for drilling, but you might have sucess using decent drill bits, Cobalt types or a small grindstone in a die grinder.


----------



## Ttrees (1 Apr 2021)

I'd still be inclined to use the drill something like that, if its worked already.
If it won't cut, nor would say a slim chainsaw file, (there's at least two common sizes)
Then a diamond file might be the ticket... I've never used those, but see them in the shops frequently.
That's if the hole just needs the teeniest amount opened up.

If those need a large opening, it might be worth revisiting the drill...
Did the bit cut any holes in them?
Have you tested the bit in mild steel to see if the bit was much good to start with?

I'd reckon those bits are fine, and just need a sharpen.
Recently had to drill large holes in some hardened steel, and bought a good few fancy cobalts for the job.
I didn't notice much difference between them and the HSS used after them to be honest.
The edge gets wiped out quick.

No point in looking for better bits IMO, the next level up is cobalt and will likely have a split point which won't serve any purpose for opening up a hole.
Some bits aren't sharp out of the box.

I'd try testing on some scrap to see if they were any good to start with..
Have a scrap piece of softer metal held down well, as if those brackets are setup for a pillar drill, then that is a good opportunity for an accident testing random bits on the fly.

Might be worth considering a different method than good screws for holding those clips down.
I wouldn't expect anyone to learn sharpening drills for something as little.
But if wanting to know anyway...

I've messed about with cutting angles and whatnot for a few days, in the last month, making stout washers for a machine from a lawnmower blade, had to scrap that idea as could only get the holes drilled so big.
I was expecting to find more info about this, thinking there was an additional technique 
to grinding the heel away the reduced cutting angle for hard steels.
I was doing a lot of searching, but seemingly everyone does the same all over the world with the traditional grind, taking split points ut of the equation.

I reckon AvE's video is about as good as you will find, regarding technique used, the same technique as on the bench grinder.
Could be worth a quick try, to see if they might cut those brackets.

Tom


----------



## TFrench (1 Apr 2021)

I had some bosch drill bits from screwfix in my van to get me out of the poo if I forgot my good set. They were absolutely shocking, I don't know how bosch dare put their name to them! I tried to drill a piece of 3mm stainless (something I do a lot, so it's not like I don't know what I'm doing) and the bit just wouldn't touch it. Borrowed a dormer one from the on site engineers and it went straight through, so its not like the steel had work hardened. They went straight in the bin after that.


----------



## David bonner (2 Apr 2021)

Get some titanium drills you carnt beat them yep the gold types or yellow ones ok and get the right size then you’ll be ok.


----------



## transatlantic (2 Apr 2021)

So is sprung steel harder than stainless steel then? as the description in the link I posted for the drill bits says they're suitable for stainless steel.


----------



## David bonner (2 Apr 2021)

transatlantic said:


> So is sprung steel harder than stainless steel then? as the description in the link I posted for the drill bits says they're suitable for stainless steel.



yes it is ok a lot harder than stainless Steel.


----------



## MikeK (2 Apr 2021)

transatlantic said:


> So is sprung steel harder than stainless steel then? as the description in the link I posted for the drill bits says they're suitable for stainless steel.



I've drilled lots of 1/4 and 5/16-inch holes in hardened steel and carbide plate, but have always used carbide (not HSS or cobalt) drills. I used very slow speeds, 100-200 RPM, lots of pressure, and never made a pilot hole.


----------



## eribaMotters (2 Apr 2021)

transatlantic said:


> I have this set of drill bits which I use for drilling metal (and wood), yet I always seem to end up cutting incompatible metal and ruining the bit. For example I recently bought a set of Tool Clips (pictured below), no idea of the material as it wasn't listed, but I needed to enlargen the hole ... drill bit ruined
> 
> What drill bit should I have used for this kind of thing? and is there a set I can buy that will cut all common metals? or is it going to be a case of multiple different sets?
> 
> ...


You should not need to make the hole larger. It is designed as being the correct size for the clip. A larger hole would weaken the clip. Just use a smaller screw. 

Colin


----------



## David bonner (2 Apr 2021)

Ok just to let you know on small drills in metal you use high speeds and on larger drill bits you do the opposite for large drilling ie slow the big drill down and also you should use oil any kind of it to cool the drill bit down either for fast work and slow work the two meals you are referring to are two different types stainless steel is chrome vanadium ie hence a spanner in the tool kit and spring steel is a hardened steel that’s been tampered on a higher heat to harden it.


----------



## Fergie 307 (2 Apr 2021)

The only thing that will cut these properly is carbide. Carbide tools will cut hss. A good quality sharp HSS drill would probably get through one but wouldn't like it and will be blunted, so will become progressively worse as you try and do more. As others have said cheaper and easier to buy the right size screw.


----------



## David bonner (2 Apr 2021)

Yeah but if the hole is too big and the screw is of to small then your buggered because the clip will fall out of the hole also there’s another way get the screw and place a washer over the hole.to hood it all.


----------



## transatlantic (3 Apr 2021)

eribaMotters said:


> You should not need to make the hole larger. It is designed as being the correct size for the clip. A larger hole would weaken the clip. Just use a smaller screw.
> 
> Colin



Really? just use a smaller screw! .. cheers buddy! hadn't occured to me.

.... 

But no, thank you for pointing out the obvious, but I wasn't using a screw. I needed to enlargen the hole slightly (by about 1mm) to get a bolt through. And no, I couldn't use a smaller diameter bolt as it needed to fit the threaded hole that is already in place.


----------



## David bonner (3 Apr 2021)

Abolt what type of bolt a screw head bolt or a nut head or a Phillips head bolt and or a pointed end bolt?.


----------



## eribaMotters (3 Apr 2021)

transatlantic said:


> Really? just use a smaller screw! .. cheers buddy! hadn't occured to me.
> 
> ....
> 
> But no, thank you for pointing out the obvious, but I wasn't using a screw. I needed to enlargen the hole slightly (by about 1mm) to get a bolt through. And no, I couldn't use a smaller diameter bolt as it needed to fit the threaded hole that is already in place.


Get a strip of timber 70 x 25 mm, drill and countersink or counterbore two holes in it and bolt to the metalwork that is already tapped. You can then easily fix the clips wherever you need them with ease.

Colin


----------



## transatlantic (3 Apr 2021)

I appreciate you're trying to help, but for what I am using this with, I really did just want to enlarge the hole.

As suggested, I tried with a grinder and it did the job (I used a dremel with a cone shaped bit)


----------



## TheTiddles (3 Apr 2021)

transatlantic said:


> So is sprung steel harder than stainless steel then? as the description in the link I posted for the drill bits says they're suitable for stainless steel.



In general yes for the types you will mostly come across, but there are hundreds of types of spring steel and thousands of types of stainless, then you can treat them all differently to adjust their properties, so asking for general properties of either is like saying “what’s the best food?”

Aidan


----------



## Stevekane (3 Apr 2021)

Its funny but somtimes you find that opening out a hole in metal can actually more dificult than just drilling a hole, its to do with the pointy bit of the drill not having anything to do, your just relying on the flutes being sharp and hard enough to cut through, well thats my experience anyway,,


----------



## RobinBHM (3 Apr 2021)

Stepped drills are great for thin metal...not sure they would like spring steel though.

Engineers use quality drill bits like dormer.

And using a drill press makes drilling easy


----------



## Echo-Star (3 Apr 2021)

David bonner said:


> Yeah but if the hole is too big and the screw is of to small then your buggered because the clip will fall out of the hole also there’s another way get the screw and place a washer over the hole.to hood it all.



Simple ideas are always the best


----------



## KimG (4 Apr 2021)

reply was redundant so I deleted it.


----------



## woodfarmer (5 Apr 2021)

TFrench said:


> I had some bosch drill bits from screwfix in my van to get me out of the poo if I forgot my good set. They were absolutely shocking, I don't know how bosch dare put their name to them! I tried to drill a piece of 3mm stainless (something I do a lot, so it's not like I don't know what I'm doing) and the bit just wouldn't touch it. Borrowed a dormer one from the on site engineers and it went straight through, so its not like the steel had work hardened. They went straight in the bin after that.


I also bought a set of botch drillbits, turned out made in China. first one bent drilling through corrugated roof sheet. The rest failed miserably so all I have left is two I wont use. 95% of Good bits that fail are due to too high a speed and consequently running it without cutting. You then have a basic fire making setup. DRills with 5-8% of cobalt work well. just make sure you keep them cutting and don't let them get hot so slowish speed. The speeds recommended are for production use where tool life is costed against time of running expensive machinery. I have one hss drill (1 3/16ths) which gets used fairly often which was last sharpened by an old guy in 1970. and it is only now begining to show signs of getting blunt. I have always run it dry but at a very slow speed.


----------

