# FOOT SWITCH TYPE



## Alexam (30 Jul 2015)

Excuse my ignorance, but a foot switch operation for the scrollsaw is press to start and press again to stop, or start when depressed and only run when foot continues pressure, so foot lifted and motor stops ?

I have a Record SSD16 and would like to get something appropriate, so any ideas where and which one would be appreciated.


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## Chippygeoff (30 Jul 2015)

Hi Alex. When i bought my Hegner I did a deal with them, which included the foot switch, I press down to start the saw and lift my foot off and the saw stops. I did have a spare foot switch but I was looking for it a few weeks back but failed to find it, you could have had that one. When buying a foot switch, say from e-bay, you have to be careful as many of them are for guitars and not suitable for the scroll saw. I understand Axminster do one that is quite reasonable. No doubt other members will come forward as to where they got theirs. Once you start using a foot switch you will wonder how you ever got on without one.


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## Alexam (30 Jul 2015)

Thanks Geoff. I was curious about 'momentary' foot switches and not shure what that meant. Will have a look at Axminster.

There are loads on Amazon, but not sure if they area all suitable http://stuccu.co.uk/s/Scroll+Saw+Foot+S ... 2wodvJAOWg


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## MMUK (30 Jul 2015)

From a safety point of view, I'd recommend a non-latching, or momentary, foot switch.

This would be ideal and under £13.

http://www.amazon.co.uk/dp/B00EDK2CRM/r ... Y5RA4PFTP2


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## AES (30 Jul 2015)

Hullo Alexam,

Yes, confirm, the foot switch that I posted here a week or two back for use with my Excali (which I'm pretty sure could be used for other makes of scroll saw and many other things too) is of the "momentary" type - i.e. press with the foot the saw runs; lift the foot off the saw stops. Note also that in the case of my Excali, the original ON/OFF switch is still active - i.e. until the ON/OFF switch is set to ON then the foot switch doesn't operate at all.

HTH
AES


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## Alexam (31 Jul 2015)

Thanks both very much. The monetary switch it is then. Will gert one ordered.


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## Lons (31 Jul 2015)

Probably a stupid question but is there any reason why a foot switch from an old sewing machine wouldn't work? 
Variable speed and off when you lift your foot. I haven't looked at loadings but assume a scrollsaw motor isn't going to draw more power than a sewing machine?

Bob


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## AES (31 Jul 2015)

It's a very good question Lons. I had the same thought when I was having problems with getting a foot switch for my Excali. I did a bit of googling and found several threads where it said (in short) "Be careful, they don't all work", and my wife was not at all willing to let me try her sewing machine switch out on my saw!

So I gave up the idea and (eventually) bought the "proper" switch.

But I must say that when I look at the cable on my foot switch, it looks to me like it could happily handle 13 amps at least, whereas the saw has a data plate clearly saying "rated at 1.5 amps", and is fitted with a 5 amp fuse (BTW, the motor on my saw is 60 V DC).

I'm not sure about using a sewing machine with a variable speed (rheostat?) built in, but I still have the feeling that if using "only" a momentary on/off switch just about anything would do - I can't believe the electrical characteristics of a typical 220 Volt sewing machine motor and a typical 220 Volt scroll saw motor are all that different. But in the end I was just too chicken to risk voiding the warranty on my new saw and bought the "proper" one - at considerably more than 13 quid I may say.

Finally I should add that I was in touch with Axi (the UK distributor for Excali) and their customer support people told me they had NO foot switch in their range suitable for my Excali.

So perhaps it's the DC motor on my saw that is a special characteristic, but finally, I just dunno mate!

AES


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## Lons (31 Jul 2015)

Reason I asked is because I have a switch. Replaced my wifes' ancient sewing machine recently (hardly used 'cos she hates sewing ), and rather than chuck in the skip i salvaged the motor, footswitch and some other bits - as you do :lol:.
I have a cheap scroll saw and will give it a go when I get a chance.

Interestingly I have a Foredom woodcarving machine with a very similar footswitch so will compare those as well.

cheers
Bob


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## AES (31 Jul 2015)

- as you do :lol:.

Yes Lons, you're dead right, "as you do".

I for one (and I guess several other members?) would be interested to hear the results of any experiments you make in that area. Is your wife's sewing machine foot switch fitted with a speed control as well, or is it just on/off?

The Foredom switch is interesting too. How much did it cost (or was it included within the kit)?

AES


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## Lons (1 Aug 2015)

AES":3f4a9w1r said:


> - as you do :lol:.
> 
> Yes Lons, you're dead right, "as you do".
> 
> ...



The sewing machine switch is variable speed and the Fordom switch came with the kit which I bought s/h a few years ago. Fordom gear isn't cheap though.
I thought all sewing machine footswitches were variable speed but really don't know as haven't given it much thought before now.

Bob


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## AES (1 Aug 2015)

Bob:

QUOTE: I thought all sewing machine footswitches were variable speed but really don't know as haven't given it much thought before now.
UNQUOTE:

Maybe, I dunno, but if yours is variable speed and it works OK on your saw then you'll have discovered a cheap way of getting both on/off and variable speed on your saw. I would be interested to hear how that experiment goes.

AES


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## Alexam (1 Aug 2015)

Hi Guys,

the foot switch recommended by Steve (MMUK) has just been delivered and looks very solid. 

Just wanted to check with the electricians amongst you about the wiring. It has three points to connect wires, Com 1 - No 3 and NC 2. Which way do I wire these terminals to get the correct oiperation with the scroll saw to work when the foot switch is depressed.

It seems thre is no earth connection, so should I put a screw in the metal case?


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## Claymore (1 Aug 2015)

Malcolm I have had one of those for months but haven't a clue how to wire it up 8-( they seem to be a solid bit of kit but it would help if they had a wiring diagram for us non sparky's
Brian
Ps if you get yours sorted any chance of a photo of the wiring plus the odd tip? lol


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## Alexam (1 Aug 2015)

I'd be happy to once I have to information.


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## Monkey Mark (1 Aug 2015)

Claymore":f6chwnfc said:


> Malcolm I have had one of those for months but haven't a clue how to wire it up 8-( they seem to be a solid bit of kit but it would help if they had a wiring diagram for us non sparky's
> Brian
> Ps if you get yours sorted any chance of a photo of the wiring plus the odd tip? lol


If it helps, I've just answered that on this thread. https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/post983832.html#p983832


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## Monkey Mark (1 Aug 2015)

With regards to using a sewing machine foot pedal. Just keep in mind that as you slow the speed down the amperage will increase. Make sure the cabling and motor can take it.


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## Lons (1 Aug 2015)

Monkey Mark":nfw83uc4 said:


> With regards to using a sewing machine foot pedal. Just keep in mind that as you slow the speed down the amperage will increase. Make sure the cabling and motor can take it.



Yep thanks Mark.


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## Monkey Mark (1 Aug 2015)

Not sure how helpful it would be but on instructables someone shows how they used a sewing machine pedal to control something like an exact saw.http://m.instructables.com/id/cheap-diy-foot-speed-control-for-dremel-or-other-t/


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## Alexam (2 Aug 2015)

Sorted, as it was a question asked some time ago. A member redmoorphil did a diagram which I hope you can find here found-a-decent-foot-switch-for-my-scroll-saw-t70311.html

I have done another similar diagram and can e-mail to anyone who wishes.

Alex

PS - NOT QUITE ................. Have now wired iit up and it works BUT. The switch on the scrollsaw (two button - on & off plus twospeed fast and slow........ once running with the footswitch depressed, releasing to footrswitch does cut the power, but it will not start again when foot depressed again - it has to be switched on with the button. This must be something to do with the scrollsaw switching.

The red and green buttons have 4 contacts and there are other contacts connected to the speed switch. I need to make a change if the footswitch is to be fully operational and don't know what that change is. Any ideas please. It's a Record SDD16.


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## Alexam (3 Aug 2015)

AES":2dng9pf6 said:


> Hullo Alexam,
> 
> Yes, confirm, the foot switch that I posted here a week or two back for use with my Excali (which I'm pretty sure could be used for other makes of scroll saw and many other things too) is of the "momentary" type - i.e. press with the foot the saw runs; lift the foot off the saw stops. Note also that in the case of my Excali, the original ON/OFF switch is still active - i.e. until the ON/OFF switch is set to ON then the foot switch doesn't operate at all.
> 
> ...




I have just found that once connected to the new foot switch, that only works with the foot switch depressed and the start button on the machine has been pressed. When I lift my foot, the machine stops. However, I can only get the machine started again by depressing the foot switch AND pressing the start button. I am trying to find answers of how to get around the saw NVR at present.


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## mseries (3 Aug 2015)

Alexam":2u1ptdut said:


> I have just found that once connected to the new foot switch, that only works with the foot switch depressed and the start button on the machine has been pressed. When I lift my foot, the machine stops. However, I can only get the machine started again by depressing the foot switch AND pressing the start button. I am trying to find answers of how to get around this at present.



Like your saw has a built in NVR


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## Lons (3 Aug 2015)

I personally wouldn't overide the NVR as it's there for safety. Would be only too easy to catch the footswitch with your foot when your hand is too near the blade. Might be a nuisance to press the switch but much safer surely.

Bob


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## AES (3 Aug 2015)

Hullo again Alexam.

Oh! The ON/OFF switch on my Excali is not an NVR switch so what you describe doesn't happen to me - once the switch on the saw is set to ON it stays ON all the time and the foot switch then works all the time just as I described earlier (i.e. foot on, saw ON/foot off, saw OFF).

Maybe that's why the Axi customer service people told me that their foot switch wasn't suitable for the Excali, I just don't know.

I was also worried to read that the foot switch you bought is single pole (i.e. only the +ve or the -ve line is switched, not both lines). I'm definitely NOT an electrician but I'm not sure that's the ideal for this use and I think it's probably significant that every electrical item that I've ever looked at, both domestic and workshop, switches both poles simultaneously.

Now I've got used to having the foot switch on the Excali I use it a lot and certainly wouldn't want to have to go back to turning the switch on the saw ON every time, most inconvenient, though no doubt safer overall if your saw's ON/OFF switch is an NVR.

Sorry, I just don't know a good answer to help you. Just as a remark, I can appreciate that scroll saw manufacturers want to keep their prices down, but judging by the amount of correspondence about foot switches I've found during my own searches (both here and on the net generally) I think it's a pity that all saw manufacturers don't at least offer suitable foot switches as a standard available option at time of purchase (or even as an all-inclusive package).

Good luck anyway mate.

AES


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## Monkey Mark (3 Aug 2015)

Yes, it will be a no volt return switch. 
As said, the nvr is for safety so I don't think it wise to say on here how to Bypass. Though I could easily tell you how if you ask directly.


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## Monkey Mark (3 Aug 2015)

AES":2wnyw5mg said:


> I was also worried to read that the foot switch you bought is single pole (i.e. only the +ve or the -ve line is switched, not both lines). I'm definitely NOT an electrician but I'm not sure that's the ideal for this use and I think it's probably significant that every electrical item that I've ever looked at, both domestic and workshop, switches both poles simultaneously.


Double pole switching is certainly becoming more commonplace, mainly down to Europe. Some parts of Europe have the polarity reversed, common to have both normal and reverse on the same site. Hence double pole. 

In everyday use, single pole is fine. 

You can buy stand alone nvr switches. If someone felt the need they could fit one BEFORE the foot pedal. Pedal (should) operate normally with the added protection of an nvr. 

P. S. I train electrical installation at a college, so I'm expected to know my stuff.  that's not me trying to be clever, just saying I'm not passing on third hand information or a Google warrior.


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## AES (3 Aug 2015)

@Monkey Mark:

You wrote, QUOTE: ... that's not me trying to be clever .... UNQUOTE:

No, that's fine as far as I'm concerned, I'm NOT an electrical expert and personally welcome inputs from someone what knows 'is onions. I can't be sure but I have the feeling that all electrical appliances here (Switzerland) have double pole on/off switches. Dunno if it's regs or just custom.

BTW, a bit off topic I know, but not so long ago I was reading a motor caravanning book which suggested that camp sites are often wired "wrong way round", so, they said, it's a good idea to carry both a polarity tester and TWO mains connectors/adaptors, one wired one way, on t'other.

Just hope Alexam gets on OK with his foot switch.

AES


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## MMUK (3 Aug 2015)

Alexam":1u9aoa0m said:


> Hi Guys,
> 
> the foot switch recommended by Steve (MMUK) has just been delivered and looks very solid.
> 
> ...



The live wire from the supply goes to COM and the live wire going back up to the machine goes to NO.

You only need to use a 2 core flex for the switch, just use a bit of brown tape over the exposed parts of the blue core once stripped back. I would then remove the live wire from the load side of the NVR, connect this to the wire fitted to the NO terminal in the foot switch and then the wire from the COM terminal goes into the NVR where the original wire was removed from.

Any probs give me a shout and I'll pop over one eve on way home from work, I virtually pass your place anyway.


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## Monkey Mark (3 Aug 2015)

AES":lcmenp31 said:


> @Monkey Mark:
> 
> You wrote, QUOTE: ... that's not me trying to be clever .... UNQUOTE:
> 
> ...


 It's funny you should mention caravans. I found out about Europe through me owning a European built caravan (Adria, built in Slovenia).
You're right, it is recommended that people take a polarity tester. As well as a "wrongly" wired hook up cable, clearly marked of course. You can buy a unit which you wire in before the consumer unit that detects the polarity and switches accordingly, negating the requirement to check (I believe a lot of European built caravans now have them fitted as standard).

I think some countries have to have double pole switches fitted, but not in the uk except for certain items.

With caravans, they now all have to be built with double poles in them. It may be built in the UK, but it could easily travel over to Europe, hence them now being mandatory.


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## kfenelon (4 Aug 2015)

I have considered getting a foot switch but because I sit on a stool my feet do not reach the floor and I feel very comfortable any suggestions ?


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## AES (4 Aug 2015)

@kfenelon:

I'm not being sarcastic, honest, but is the stool & the bench the saw is fitted to at the right height for you? If not, I suggest you move one or both to suit you and the saw. Then see how you manage with the foot switch. If it/they is/are already at the right height for you, then I suggest packing the foot switch up to a suitable height, perhaps using ply or soft wood off cuts. Perhaps even angle the packing so that the front (toes end) of the foot switch suits your final sitting position.

I too sit at my saw (and at my little band saw) because of back problems, and use an old office type chair which is height adjustable to sit on - I managed to find a sitting height which is suitable for both saws and for the foot switch. I guess it's just a matter of trial and error (and the length of your legs)!  

I don't know what your floor is made of but if you do end up packing the switch up on wood, don't forget to use an old bit of carpet or something to stop the foot switch sliding around under your foot.

HTH
AES


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## Alexam (4 Aug 2015)

A shorter stool? ......................... Sorry, couldn't resist that. :roll: So when on the stool, are your feet anywhere near something that the foot switch could be attached to to overcome the problem?


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## Alexam (4 Aug 2015)

MMUK":14lq5zc7 said:


> Alexam":14lq5zc7 said:
> 
> 
> > Hi Guys,
> ...




I have wired the foot switch already 



but with the Stop/Start switch connected, it will only run with foot down until foot lifted and then need the start switch started again with foot down.

I have a solution passed to me and that is to rewire the switch so that the footswitch then becomes the NVR switch,



to do this I will connect the white and brown wires of the block being held (the switch) and connect the black and blue wires. This cuts out the switch and should leave the foot switch in complete control.

The switch on your machine may well be different, so check with someone who knows about these things, as I had to do.


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## Monkey Mark (4 Aug 2015)

As above really. Perhaps an angled plywood box? Rubber Base so non slip. Nice and light, stable and you could hide your chocolate stash in there too!


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## Monkey Mark (4 Aug 2015)

Alexam":3i98kgll said:


> MMUK":3i98kgll said:
> 
> 
> > Alexam":3i98kgll said:
> ...


Exactly what I would do. Though you'll lose the nvr function if I'm looking at it correctly.


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## kfenelon (4 Aug 2015)

Thank you for all your suggestions


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## Alexam (4 Aug 2015)

Just to confirm that by-passing the Stop/Start switches as above works perfectly and the rocker switch for the two speed control is not affected. The popwer lead is from a specific, switched wall socket so that to start working, the wall socket is switched on and from thereafter the foot switch is in control.

Thanks for all those who pitched in to help and I hope this will help others looking to do something similar.


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## MMUK (4 Aug 2015)

Just for everyone's info.

It's not advisable to bypass the NVR. Should a fault occur with either the foot switch or machine itself you lose a layer of protection. The NVR is designed to fail in the OFF position should a fault or voltage loss occur.


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## Monkey Mark (4 Aug 2015)

MMUK":18h1tak0 said:


> Just for everyone's info.
> 
> It's not advisable to bypass the NVR. Should a fault occur with either the foot switch or machine itself you lose a layer of protection. The NVR is designed to fail in the OFF position should a fault or voltage loss occur.


Well pointed out. Just to add, stand alone in-line nvr switches can be purchased should someone make this alteration and wish to fit one before the pedal, maintaining that layer of safety.


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