# Skelton dovetail saw pass round.



## Mr T (5 Dec 2014)

Shane Skelton of Skelton Saws has kindly agreed to provide one of his hand made dovetail saws for a pass round. You may have seen some talk about it on the other thread "Skelton Saws". The current list is:

Myself
Jimi43
Berncarpenter
Matthewwh
Bedrock

GS Haydon and Peter Sefton have made separate arrangements with Shane.

I hope to have the saw on Monday and try it out and also let some of my evening class students loose on it. I'll send it off to Jimi later next week, when he's finished with it he'll post it off to the next on the list and so on. Best to make it recorded delivery postage and to keep up the impetus, especially with Christmas postal delays, try not to hold on to it for more than two or three days. 

If you'd like to join in, copy and paste the list into your reply and add your username at the bottom, then send a private message with your real name and address to the person before you. The pass round is open to all current members as of today and we'll limit it to those in areas served by Royal Mail first and second class post.

I'm looking forward to your reviews and comments.

Chris


----------



## jimi43 (5 Dec 2014)

Thanks Chris (AND SHANE!!)

PM sent to you with address etc.

Cheers

Jimi


----------



## Peter Sefton (5 Dec 2014)

Looking forward to playing with the saw possibly next week.

Cheers guys


----------



## Doug B (5 Dec 2014)

Myself
Jimi43
Berncarpenter
Matthewwh
Bedrock
Doug B


----------



## matthewwh (6 Dec 2014)

Thank you Chris and Shane, I'm looking forward to it!


----------



## tobytools (6 Dec 2014)

Myself
Jimi43
Berncarpenter
Matthewwh
Bedrock
Doug B
Tobytools


----------



## Mr T (11 Dec 2014)

I've been having trouble posting images for this review so it may go over two postings!

When Shane first showed me his saw at the Harrogate show I only had a few minutes to try it, so I was looking forward to giving it a more thorough test drive. The saw comes nicely packaged wrapped in rust preventive paper in a cardboard box. 
On first site it is certainly a thing of beauty. The shape and detail of the hand cut rosewood handle was very elegant as was the attention to detail and fitting of the brass saw nut and screws. The brass back sits snugly into the handle indicating there will be little prospect of slackening.























The saw balances nicely in the hand and has a good “feel”. I have mentioned before that I find the handle just a tad too small for my gorilla like hands. I compared it with my current dovetail saws, a Veritas and a Roberts and Lee, and found it felt slightly narrower between the “points top and bottom. The grip was also 2-3mm narrower front to back, although the reverse was true across the width. Even though it feel a little under size it had a better feel than the others. Shane tells me he can supply a larger handle in necessary. This is the advantage of handmade, you can have some input in the making process.




In use I found that my index finger preferred to sit on the brass back rather than the front of the handle however I quite liked that as it gave a better feel for the cut.




The proof of the pudding is in the sawing, how did it do. This saw is 15tpi, a lot courser than the 20 tpi of the Veritas and the Roberts and Lee, so I would expect a rougher cut. I started with a few practice cuts to get my eye in. I found that the start of the cut at the back corner was fine. However there was a tendency to jump out of the kerf if I got into my stride too early, I needed to have a millimetre or so depth of kerf before I could start sawing proper. However once I got going the cut was quick and smooth. I have a tendency to stop short of the gauge line when sawing dovetails, I found that this saw improved my accuracy in this dimension.




I went on to try a set of dovetails in some spotty sycamore and cherry from the off cuts box. Again the cut was quick and smooth and my cutting to the shoulders seemed OK. My other problem with dovetails is wandering from the line at the back of the cut when cutting on the left of the tail. I’m afraid the shot of the back of the cut shows the saw could not help me there! However the back shot does show how clean the cut is. 









To be continued....


----------



## Mr T (11 Dec 2014)

...........Continued.

After cutting away the waste from the pins I could see how clean the saw cut face was and it looked good (I may later post a shot of a similar cut from one my other DT saws for comparison).
Some of my evening and afternoon class students tried the saw out and all agreed about easy and speed of cutting, but then they may have been trying humour me!








Having used the Skelton I made a few cuts with my current saws and they were very lacklustre in comparison. However assessing the Skelton in comparison with my other saws if tricky. Obviously the Skelton is new and very sharp, my current saws are probably a little tired so underperforming. But the hardened steel blade on the Skelton will probably ensure that it stays sharp longer. I can’t remember what set Shane uses, but I have always found that the Veritas binds in the kerf, presumably because of lack of set.

All in all this is the best dovetail saw I have tried, but then, at £245, it’s also the most expensive! As some of my sawing errors show fancy tools aren’t a cure all, they can’t make a bad craftsman into a good craftsman, but they can make a good craftsman better. I wonder if there is also a tendency to do better work with quality tools almost because of a sense of letting the tools down if you do shoddy work.

A final note, one of my students said it was the “Rolex of saws”. 

Jimi43 now has the saw I look forward to his comments


----------



## 8squared (11 Dec 2014)

Myself
Jimi43
Berncarpenter
Matthewwh
Bedrock
Doug B
Tobytool
8squared


----------



## jimi43 (11 Dec 2014)

Thanks for the review Chris...and I can confirm that I have safely received the saw and will be reviewing it as soon as possible so I can pass it on.

First impressions...very nice indeed! 8) 

Cheers

Jimi


----------



## bugbear (11 Dec 2014)

Mr T":a9fk6tlu said:


> I wonder if there is also a tendency to do better work with quality tools almost because of a sense of letting the tools down if you do shoddy work.



I don't wonder about that at all. I think you're absolutely correct.

BugBear


----------



## SkeltonSaws (11 Dec 2014)

Good Evening All,

So nice to see the saw out there and being used. Thanks Chris for this and the review - some good pictures too. I noticed that you were unsure about the set - The saw plate is 18 thou with a maximum of 3 thou set per side and minimum of 2 thou set per side. It's pleasing that you have picked up on the attention to detail - obviously I have aimed to produce the best saw both aesthetically and functionally that is on the market and I think that it is probably the handmade attention to detail that sets it apart from other saws that are mass produced. The way that I fit the brass into the handle is completely unique to any other saw available and is inspired from my gunsmithing days and letting actions into stocks. 

I look forward to following all your comments and reviews as the saw passes around.

Keep sawing everyone and enjoy!

Shane


----------



## G S Haydon (11 Dec 2014)

Thanks Mr T, my what big hand you have! I know you mentioned it but mine look like little boy hands in comparison!


----------



## jimi43 (12 Dec 2014)

First of all...huge thanks again to Shane for the chance to have a look at this fine saw.

And fine it is..as in "fine art".

Before I begin my findings..I will emphasise that I am looking at this mostly from an aesthetic and ergonomic standpoint...I will leave other to review "making dovetails"...I am sure there are some in the list who are past masters at this! And I apologise for any repetition...but things repeated stay in the mind after all! :wink: 

I've spoken with Shane at length...he has a true passion for his craft and the attention to detail is astounding. 

This extends to the packaging...which when you buy a boutique saw is sort of expected but often absent these days.







The spring steel plate needs to be protected as it can corrode easily and the saw comes wrapped in rust inhibiting paper..this is good as I keep most of my saws in the stuff and they're never even developed a spot..








Traditional saw making in England has all but disappeared so SKELTON SAWS are important on so many levels. Researchers of historically significant tools will be pleased to know that each saw is numbered..this is No.10 and further than that...the company keeps a record of each saw...along with a log of the owner. In a hundred years time when someone wants to go back through history..it will all be there...as I know the saw will be.








In use...balance is all important and care has been taken to ensure this saw is perfect in this respect. This is just one of a number of factors which makes the cutting of dovetails a breeze.


I will start right off by saying that I wanted to compare this saw with others..I have two candidates...my treasured saw "Ginger" from Klaus and Pedder...and another fine saw I have just acquired by W.Taylor...who Simon Barley lists but about which nothing appears to be known. 


As expected both Ginger....








...and the SKELTON SAW...








...cut beautifully. It's not fair at all to compare two Rolls Royces...they are both sublime!

I am no cabinet maker nor jointer and I think I can count on the fingers of one hand how many dovetail joints I have done...so I have no intention of getting into a "my dovetail's better than yours" competition...I'll leave that up to the true experts..but I will show the results of the actual cuts...








Three cuts...TLT left...next to the SKELTON and then on the right...the old TAYLOR
Considering the Taylor is a few moons older and in dire need of seeing a dentist...it didn't do too badly but the other two were sublime...and as to be expected..nothing in it really...maybe the TLT is finer...but only by a gnat's whatsit!


I followed the tapered concept...level brass back to bench..cut to line..peer over and then cut back to line. This is something I think is of benefit to novices and experienced users alike...and makes sense...another "attention to history" moment.








So..some of the other "special things".

The back is solid..slot cut very accurately and then carefully cut into the handle by hand.

As we can see..the design of the handle is straight from the Georgian period...and like most things of that era..they reached the zenith of beauty and functionality...and SKELTON saws have obviously reproduced this faithfully...this I like a lot...as I love that period too.








Echoes of history are very evident...and this is something which attracts me. Modern interpretations of this style had been attempted by other makers over the generations and sadly...nothing comes close to the class of this shape.

The plate fits seamlessly into the slot in the brass back...with the company logo boldly emblazoned on its side...a mark hand stamped using a press and one of CHALCO STAMP AND DIE's wonderful punches...I just knew this the moment I saw it!








The teeth are beautiful. They are hand cut using a purpose-made die..individually and then hand sharpened and set. I know of one other maker that goes to these lengths to achieve perfection....I have one such saw! :wink: 

For the technical buffs..here is the full specification:

Handle: Selected Indian rosewood...plantation grown.
Cut: Rip
Rake: 8 degrees
Plate type: Selected spring steel tapered cut.
Plate thickness: 18 thou.
Set: 2-3 thou.
Teeth: 15 TPI (16 PPI)

Finishing touches include the saw medallion...not a random "Warranted" gooble-de-gook but justifiable pride.








The engraved design is based on the SKELTON of YORKSHIRE family shield...a peacock carrying an oak branch and acorn in its mouth and the SKELTON family name. This is a nice touch historically but also it stands alone to emphasise all the other bespoke elements which may not be fully appreciated on first inspection. The "Spirit of Ecstasy" on this fine saw.








So...in conclusion..the acid test...would I buy one...well no...because I already have a fine dovetail saw...

But I do need to take longer than a couple of days to make absolutely sure that I like it...so I shall be sending a hand print off to Shane so he's ready when he makes a carcass saw... :mrgreen: :mrgreen: 

Recent appreciation for the use of hand tools has been exponential and we were that close to not being able to compete in that market...here and overseas.

Mr Skelton has allowed me to breath a huge sigh of relief because with this saw...we are very much in the running again in Britain...which is just as it should be!

Cheers

Jimi


----------



## G S Haydon (12 Dec 2014)

Nicely contrasted with the two lawyers Jim. i just love those classic lines of the Skelton.


----------



## SkeltonSaws (13 Dec 2014)

Good Afternoon!

I am humbled Jimi ! Thank you for your appraisal, it is really nice to see that you have understood what we are about and what I have aimed to create in a saw. We really appreciate the time and the effort that you have taken to write this review the pictures are fantastic! We especially like the last one and the 'Saw Maker's Wife' may use that one if that is ok? in one of her posts. There really isn't much comparison between your old saw and mine when put side by side - very nice! Yours is however just slightly younger than the one I have aimed to replicate (only 20-30 years I would say) The tell tale sign being yours is flat topped. By this time the rounded lug had begun to fall out of fashion and the flat top was much quicker to make. We too are really pleased with how our medallions have turned out, such an intricate metal stamp, the talented Ian Houghton at Chalco Stamp & Die Company made an amazing job. 
Thanks again...enjoy everyone! 

Shane


----------



## pedder (13 Dec 2014)

I really like the transition betwen he spine and the handle. 





Cheers Pedder


----------



## jimi43 (14 Dec 2014)

Hey Shane...the saw's a beauty...pictures don't lie so my review just reflects what everyone can see.

I appreciate you explaining some of the more technical things...and I appreciated most understanding the fine line (no pun intended!) between the plate steel being too thick moving to optimum and then too thin for anyone other than real expert users for fear of bending it.

As I say...there is not much in it between yours and the fine lawyer's of this parish...I am so glad I have mine from Germany because it means I don't have to choose when you get around to expanding your range! :mrgreen: 

Since my mate Pedder was kind enough to comment on your back/handle transition...(thanks Pedder...one thing I forgot to mention which is Uber Cool!)...I suppose I should post this picture to show I haven't forsaken Ginger!






...and this shot was actually balanced AND held in place by two high power rare earth magnets (hidden behind) as I was terrified that I might bend the plate otherwise! LOL!

Both of these saws are at the top of their game...and perhaps I should say that Europe now has some formidable tools up there with the best....but bearing different genes.

Shane...as far as the picture is concerned I will zap the missus the links to the high res ones...feel free to use any you wish as discussed.

The saw is now in the care of Royal Mail (Special Delivery as befits the saw)...although Annie did tell the lady that it was an "valuable antique saw"....so it least came over to her as a fine facsimile of your favourite period!

I did look in Simon Barley's book this evening when I had time at the section on dating open handles and I get your point now..this is valuable stuff for me...the nuances are quite subtle aren't they. I think I have old planes fairly nailed down but saw handles was a something I was "learning"!

For the interest of you and Pedder (and any other old saw fans)...the antique saw has "W.Taylor" in plane capitals on the back...






...but if you look really closely at the steel..there is an engraving in fine old script which says "G.Burridge"....which I noticed while taking the SKELTON SAW pictures! I take it this is the "very posh" original owner as there is no record in Barley.

Simon Barley shows this maker but no details are known...but there is also another W.Taylor in the USA...I'm pretty sure they're not related....any idea guys?

Cheers..

Jimi


----------



## Peter Sefton (14 Dec 2014)

I have been playing with one of Shanes saws this week, No 8 to be exact. 

No doubt it is a beautiful hand made saw. I was using it dovetailing some 12mm Chestnut on this weeks beginners course. I hope to give it a fuller workout next week and set up some tests in line with the ones we judged the dovetail saws we reviewed for Nick Gibbs back in 2011.

I will post my thoughts once its been fully assessed in a few different timbers and thicknesses.

Cheers Peter


----------



## condeesteso (15 Dec 2014)

I saw the Skelton over at Jim's the other day. Very attractive and finely made indeed. Agreed nice to see a new maker in England (Yorkshire even =D> =D> ). I only saw it briefly but hadn't realised it's a rip/dovetail as it seems a fair bit bigger than Jim's TLT and my Gramercy.
If the pass-round is closed never mind, but if I could jump on the end please? I'd be very keen to try it.


----------



## Mr T (15 Dec 2014)

> I saw the Skelton over at Jim's the other day. Very attractive and finely made indeed. Agreed nice to see a new maker in England (Yorkshire even =D> =D> ). I only saw it briefly but hadn't realised it's a rip/dovetail as it seems a fair bit bigger than Jim's TLT and my Gramercy.
> If the pass-round is closed never mind, but if I could jump on the end please? I'd be very keen to try it.



Good to see the saw drawing so much interest. Just add your name to the bottom of the list Douglas.

Myself
Jimi43
Berncarpenter
Matthewwh
Bedrock
Doug B
Tobytool
8squared


----------



## condeesteso (16 Dec 2014)

Excellent, is it this easy Mr T?

Myself
Jimi43
Berncarpenter
Matthewwh
Bedrock
Doug B
Tobytool
8squared
Condeesteso (Douglas)


----------



## Mr T (16 Dec 2014)

> Excellent, is it this easy Mr T?



Almost Douglas. You have to PM your address to the previous person on the list, then when you have finished with it, send the saw to the next person or back to Shane if you are the last person on the list.Unfortunately the last on the list does not get to keep the saw!

Chris


----------



## jimi43 (16 Dec 2014)

Bern has advised me that the saw has arrived safely with him...phew!

Lovely saw..and a huge thanks to Shane for trusting us with this fine tool.

Cheers

Jimi


----------



## Berncarpenter (17 Dec 2014)

First let me say a big thank you to Chris for organising the pass round and Shane for the chance to try out No 10  I received the saw yesterday at 11.30 from Jimi in good condition , thanks Jimi for being so prompt to send on. I immediately stopped working on a customers job {sorry Mrs Penny} and spent about 12 hours putting the saw through its paces.

On opening the box my first impressions were - Wow its beautiful , the most finely crafted saw that ive ever seen. Must have stood there gazing at it for a good 10 minutes . Shane you are a very talented craftsman indeed.

I think Chris and Jimi have done an excellent job with there reviews and i will try not to repeat whats already been covered.I am currently using a LN 15 tpi thin plate dovetail saw thats been with me since last summer , I really like it and get really good results from it . Its done allot of work cutting at least a couple of hundred dovetails. So this is what i will compare no 10 with.







Very similar in size and style , with the same TPI . No 10 has very crisp sharp teeth with slightly shallower gullets, running my fingers over them they are like sharp pins . LN teeth were never this sharp . 






The handles are much the same size and shape with No 10 being more refined and the fit and finish is just perfect.One small thing that i found a bit of a niggle , I like to rest my fore finger on the little recess just along side the brass back of the LN it fits in there perfectly.











With No 10 I wasnt able to get comfy with it there and had to rest it further down the handle near the fixing screws. [thats probably were it should be] 










I found this a little strange and it took me a while to get used to it.The brass back is thicker and heavier on No 10 and i like the round end at the front .

So to the important bit , how good does it do at its job. Well it takes 10 less stokes than the LN to get to the base line , very sharp teeth and the weighty brass back help here. Although sawing some hard oak it did want to grab a little , I think the teeth need more use and a chance to dull slightly to be better in very hard stuff. It can be steered easily if you start off at slightly wrong angle,much the same as the LN.I made some practice cuts in Popular about 4mm apart which went fine and then sawed in-between them getting gradually closer to the last cut and ending up with less than 1/2mm apart.











TO BE CONTINUED 

Cheers Bern


----------



## Berncarpenter (17 Dec 2014)

Practice over I decided to make a dove tail template from Birds eye maple and Black walnut
Marking out





No 10 cut through the Maple tails accurately and quickly no trouble at all






Same with the Walnut Pins 






Straight off the saw and spot on






After clean up and cutting angles 
















I have fallen for this saw and had to send it of to Matthew today because while its with me I'm not going to get any work done I JUST CANT LEAVE IT ALONE. I didn't think i would find the performance any better than my LN but was so wrong . This saw works as good as it looks.

I have put the dovetail template in with the saw for you Shane as a little thank you for the pass round . 

Cheers Bern


----------



## jimi43 (17 Dec 2014)

Oh wow! 

What a superb review Bern and a lovely touch to include the thank you present....darn it...I want it back now!

It really makes me warm inside that we have such a seriously great saw maker in England again!

Cheers mate!

Jimi


----------



## Berncarpenter (17 Dec 2014)

Thanks Jimi
I struggled with the write up one finger typing and very poor spelling it took me ages to do. I am better with wood than words.

Cheers Bern


----------



## SkeltonSaws (18 Dec 2014)

Good Morning All! 

This is just a quick post from me (Jaq) as Shane isn't here today, but he just wanted me to acknowledge that he has read your reviews and he will get back to you later today. Shane read your review 'Bern' late last night when we returned from yet another concert-all the girls here sing! He is so pleased that it is getting such a positive reception. Like you Bern - Shane is no writer and I tend to type just about everything through his voice. However, this hasn't really held him back as his practical skills, no doubt like you have more than made up for his dyslexia. I'm not practical, but even I can see that your dovetails are first class. I may download that picture if that is ok? for my Twitter page. Everyone's photos on here have been really good, I took all the pictures for our website and did in fact write it all myself too, but now against some of these they look a bit poor! Are you in 'Saw Therapy' now 'Bern'?! 12 hours ...that made me laugh! Anyway ...Thanks all and Shane will get back to you tonight with any technical stuff and to answer any questions you may have.

Thanks 

Jaq


----------



## matthewwh (18 Dec 2014)

Skelton Saw safely received at WH.

First impressions: GORGEOUS!

More detailed review and analysis to follow once I've had a play. 

I'm inclined to pop an order in for one before Shane realises that he is giving them away far too cheaply at £245.


----------



## jimi43 (18 Dec 2014)

matthewwh":3n8beuot said:


> Skelton Saw safely received at WH.
> 
> First impressions: GORGEOUS!
> 
> ...




You know Matthew...I was JUST thinking the same thing! :mrgreen: 

But I think I shall wait for "other types" to come into the range! :wink: 

Jim


----------



## Paul Chapman (18 Dec 2014)

matthewwh":31rozsuk said:


> I'm inclined to pop an order in for one before Shane realises that he is giving them away far too cheaply at £245.



I think it's always difficult for custom saw makers to know how much to charge, particularly when starting out. I have three saws that were made for me by Mike Wenzloff. They are superb and I reckon they were too cheap - he always has a backlog. Maybe once you are established, adjust the price to control the demand to a level you can cope with :-k I would have happily paid more for my Wenzloffs.

Cheers :wink: 

Paul


----------



## Harbo (18 Dec 2014)

I have two Wenzloffs and two Gramercys so cannot really justify buying another one - the saw does look stunning though!

Rod


----------



## SkeltonSaws (18 Dec 2014)

Good Evening Bern and all!

So glad that you liked the weight and the balance and the general feel of the saw. One slight thing that I noticed you mentioned that the LN saw was 15 TPI, this can be a little confusing it's actually 15 PPI so in effect it's 14 TPI - Ours is 15 TPI/ 16 PPI (So has one extra tooth per inch than a LN) Therefore it should give a finer finish. Although the teeth are finer on our saw which would normally result in a slower cut, the rake angle combined with the hang angle of the handle and tapered blade speeds up the cut. Bern, you truly know how to cut beautiful dovetails -this is the first thing that I always look at on a handmade piece of furniture. I'm looking forward to receiving your template. Thanks for your great comments.

Kind regards 

Shane 

PS Mrs Penny can breath a sigh of relief!


----------



## Berncarpenter (19 Dec 2014)

SkeltonSaws":1lytkpkz said:


> Good Morning All!
> 
> This is just a quick post from me (Jaq) as Shane isn't here today, but he just wanted me to acknowledge that he has read your reviews and he will get back to you later today. Shane read your review 'Bern' late last night when we returned from yet another concert-all the girls here sing! He is so pleased that it is getting such a positive reception. Like you Bern - Shane is no writer and I tend to type just about everything through his voice. However, this hasn't really held him back as his practical skills, no doubt like you have more than made up for his dyslexia. I'm not practical, but even I can see that your dovetails are first class. I may download that picture if that is ok? for my Twitter page. Everyone's photos on here have been really good, I took all the pictures for our website and did in fact write it all myself too, but now against some of these they look a bit poor! Are you in 'Saw Therapy' now 'Bern'?! 12 hours ...that made me laugh! Anyway ...Thanks all and Shane will get back to you tonight with any technical stuff and to answer any questions you may have.
> 
> ...



Hi Jaq
Thanks for replying so quickly and apologies for being so slow with mine , but I've had a tuff day  Happy for you to use any of the photos and heres a few more for you to view.





















Its funny how the clock whizzes round in my workshop , 12 hours flew by so no therapy needed .You got some very talented craftsmen and writers yet to come and I'm sure there will be a video 8) 

Cheers Bern


----------



## Berncarpenter (19 Dec 2014)

SkeltonSaws":2qe6qjry said:


> Good Evening Bern and all!
> 
> So glad that you liked the weight and the balance and the general feel of the saw. One slight thing that I noticed you mentioned that the LN saw was 15 TPI, this can be a little confusing it's actually 15 PPI so in effect it's 14 TPI - Ours is 15 TPI/ 16 PPI (So has one extra tooth per inch than a LN) Therefore it should give a finer finish. Although the teeth are finer on our saw which would normally result in a slower cut, the rake angle combined with the hang angle of the handle and tapered blade speeds up the cut. Bern, you truly know how to cut beautiful dovetails -this is the first thing that I always look at on a handmade piece of furniture. I'm looking forward to receiving your template. Thanks for your great comments.
> 
> ...



Hi Shane
Sorry for the TPI mistake #-o Also i forgot to mention the difference in the hang of the handle ,it can be seen clearly in these shots.











I was really impressed with your saw and i will be ordering one from you in the near future .

Cheers Bern


----------



## jimi43 (19 Dec 2014)

Superb photographs Bern!! 8) 

And equally stunning dovetails!!

I just knew there would be someone following who would show us all how it can be done and the beauty of doing it with a great tool is that you feel good doing it!

You can't design that feeling into a production line

Jim


----------



## G S Haydon (23 Dec 2014)

Part - 1






Inn life there’s a first time for everything and in this case it’s my first time with a woodworking tool custom-made by a small family business and I've been eager to find out what he’s come up with. Just for the record Shane has be lending his saws out to anyone who wants a go, for free. A few UK tool sellers are offering this and I hope it continues. I feel it means a greater breadth of experience is applied to any “review” and helps cut through the “wow look at the new shiny thing” that we can all suffer from. Also, I’ll just make one further thing clear: You don’t need this saw to cut great joinery. Comfortable and sharp, the two key ingredients for great work, can be found in humble tools. I should know; my normal DT saws of choice are a Zona and less-than-pretty Spear & Jackson – but that is not the point of tools like this. The reason that someone wants to purchase the work of someone like Shane is for the attention to detail and the appreciation of craftsperson. So then let us focus on that, as it is those factors I feel that will set it apart.






The design inspiration for the saw is from the 18th century, a wise place to start. The finish and presentation are of the highest order, and the saw is very nicely packed with a useful guide for those who need one. The medallion is attractive and features a peacock with a beak full of oak leaf and acorns; sounds odd, looks cool. I think I need a coat of arms, perhaps a cream tea, or a pint of cider, anyway…..The split nuts are dressed and fit perfectly with the rosewood grip. I’ve become aware that my assumed “medium-sized” hands are more like medium/small. No matter; the saw is comfortable and would take a larger hand than mine. It invites a proper position of all the digits. The grip is completely handmade from Rosewood and is a tribute to the care that has gone into making it.











Although very comfortable, the only area I felt could have been improved was the transition from the sides to the of the grip into the curved areas. The transition is just a little to obvious. If it was one of my daily users I would rub it with a rasp – but that’s not something I would want to attempt on a custom-made saw, More likely, I’d discuss it with the maker so they could maintain the flawless look. The image below might just help illustrate what I mean. I know I’m being critical, but comfort is such a key factor for me. See if you can spot it when contrasted with my Dad’s tenon saw.






The sawplate is high quality Swedish steel and is brilliantly sharp. The back is solid brass rather than folded, and stamped with the Skelton name. On lovely aspect of the handle is how it flows into the brass back, which terminates into the handle with intended and perfect union.

I’ll hold off from too much of the how it in use until next time, but there will be no surprises. Due to its substantial back and super-sharp teeth, you saw by the book: light to virtually no pressure and simply steer it.

After my short time with the saw I did further appreciate that for those who do buy tools of this nature, there is in addition to proper function a degree of art and appreciation that is very enjoyable. As I alluded to at the start, it will not cut your joinery any better or make you a master woodworker – but it won’t make your joinery worse and potentially you’ll be enjoying the journey all the more. Next time, the important stuff: making something with it.

PS, Part 2 will indeed cover more of the factors involved in how the saw works such as the weight, balance and how it is sharpened. I will be very reluctantly sending this one back to you shane!


----------



## bugbear (24 Dec 2014)

G S Haydon":244mh721 said:


> Although very comfortable, the only area I felt could have been improved was the transition from the sides to the of the grip into the curved areas. The transition is just a little to obvious. If it was one of my daily users I would rub it with a rasp – but that’s not something I would want to attempt on a custom-made saw, More likely, I’d discuss it with the maker so they could maintain the flawless look. The image below might just help illustrate what I mean. I know I’m being critical, but comfort is such a key factor for me. See if you can spot it when contrasted with my Dad’s tenon saw.



I've seen this before on high end saws. When you look at shop made replacement
handles for saws by new workrer (always an enjoyable project) it's often noticeable that the handles
are a little square, with just the corners knocked off; 

post911633.html?hilit=%20remove%20the%20corners%20#p911633

Conversely, expert makers tend to make a perfect curves, but also leave a distinct transition to the cheek, as Graham has noted. 

I think they do this because it's (actually) _hard_. Working the curve of the handle whilst creating a perfect line to the arris takes considerable skill. It's much easier to make the corner round (as Graham notes, removing this arris would be very simple).

I think in this instance the desire to do good/difficult work is overriding the pursuit of ergonomics, but that a more comfortable
handle might not (perversely) look as "polished".

BugBear


----------



## G S Haydon (24 Dec 2014)

Seems reasonable BB. I know Shane has done a better job than I would likely do. My S&J with a rasp chucked at them would win no beauty contests!


----------



## Harbo (24 Dec 2014)

I modified my Gramercy ones from their original designs and rounded them off more: 












Final shapes:






Rod


----------



## bugbear (24 Dec 2014)

Intriguingly the "finished" Grammercy DT saws on their site look more square in profile, albeit with well rounded arrises, almost the "fault" I accuse first time makers of.

https://www.toolsforworkingwood.com/sto ... vetail_Saw

BugBear


----------



## Berncarpenter (25 Dec 2014)

Excellent start Graham very well written work unlike my post :mrgreen: Personally i like the crisp lines of the handle and especially this part 






Looking forward to part 2 

Cheers Bern


----------



## jimi43 (25 Dec 2014)

Berncarpenter":1era8vis said:


> Excellent start Graham very well written work unlike my post :mrgreen: Personally i like the crisp lines of the handle and especially this part
> 
> http://i1291.photobucket.com/albums/b544/BernardBillsberry/DSC_0415_zps79383b4a.jpg[/img
> 
> ...


----------



## G S Haydon (26 Dec 2014)

For the record Bern, my writing is of no consequence when compared with your work! Stunning results by you as always. Good shots of the handle to, there are so many nice touches it's a job to capture them all!


----------



## matthewwh (3 Jan 2015)

I am extremely privileged to be among the first people in nearly 200 years to hold in my hand a brand new, genuine, handmade, English, Georgian dovetail saw.

Without wishing to overstate anything, this is one of the most important hand tools I have encountered in ten years. You only need to google Georgian furniture to see what the effect was the last time woodworkers enjoyed this experience.

As well as being a functionally flawless precision instrument the Skelton dovetail saw is both a gorgeous object in its own right and an exquisite demonstration of the deep levels of perfection that can be achieved by a skilled person working entirely with hand tools.






Consider the elegant lines of the hand rasped handle, the way that they flow gracefully from one radius to another throughout the sweep of the handle before blending into a crisp ridge that continues all the way around the teardrop to the spine. 

At the handle transition, the flat surface blends into a deeply concave one whilst also turning through a 90 degree corner, the transition subtly echoed by the stopped chamfers on the brass back (which is shaped from solid brass bar entirely with hand files). 

This saw is the physical embodiement of everything that our society has sacraficed on the alter of mechanised volume production. We routinely see British and Irish craftsmen working to this level of quality in handmade furniture, gunsmithing, and instrument making, but to find it in toolmaking is something quite rare and very special indeed.

I love the way that Shane has proudly used his family crest for the medallion. He has clearly put 100% of himself into these saws and while his acquired experience as both a gunsmith and a cabinetmaker shine through, the family crest gives a respectful nod both to the standards and skills he has inherited and to his family's support.






So what's it like to use?

The handle fits my hand precisely, the hang is perfect for accurate work, and it is the only saw I have ever used where the transition from the 'scalpel' grip (with thumb and forefinger to place the kerf) to the 'milking' grip (squeezing gently with the little finger to minimise influencing the saw while it follows the kerf) involves no movement whatsoever - just a slight, barely noticeable transfer of pressure.

The best way I can describe the difference that all this makes, is to say that this saw returns your handshake - rather like the difference between shaking hands with a mannequin and a real person. Through that richly informative connection comes a crystal clear live feed of all the subtle nuances that the saw is experiencing at the toothline. 

I had always believed that the slight cant of the blade was there to allow you to cut down to the line on the seen side with the reassurance that you have a little touch of safety margin on the unseen reverse face of the timber. Talking with Shane I have now learned that it is included to provide a faster, smoother cut for a given pitch, each tooth 'seeing' a small measure more of the timber than the preceding one and acting as a limiter to feed the next tooth. What I had thought to be the purpose turns out to be a fringe benefit - we never stop learning. 

The bottom line?

I managed to last three hours before I gave in and called Shane to order one for myself. After a wonderful chat and some emailed photos, I am now the proud and delighted first custodian of saw number 9, which I will covet and treasure.


----------



## jimi43 (3 Jan 2015)

Superb review Matthew and there are some phrases and analogies there which I truly wish I had thought of. 

They described my emotions superbly..the best being _*"The best way I can describe the difference that all this makes, is to say that this saw returns your handshake - rather like the difference between shaking hands with a mannequin and a real person."*_

Absolutely spot on mate! =D> 

Thank you my friend...you made my night.

Jimi


----------



## David C (3 Jan 2015)

Well, I will have to admit to having been rather daunted by the prospect of writing about Shane's incredible saw.

I was holding off till inspiration struck. But it did not.

The combination of words like excellent, perfect, superbly hand made, beautifully finished, etc etc is quite an art.

Matthew has done such a good job that I will just say I agree with every word.

best wishes,
David Charlesworth


----------



## Mr T (3 Jan 2015)

Well!....I think we have a tool laureate in our midst! I think I was trying to say something similar to Matthew in my comparatively crude review earlier. 
The hand shake analogy really says it all. 

Unfortunately I still can't afford one.

Chris


----------



## Berncarpenter (3 Jan 2015)

Mathew all thats needed now is the woman that does the voice over for the M&S food ads  Very difficult to put into words how good this tool is but you nailed it =D> =D> =D> 

Cheers Bern


----------



## SkeltonSaws (4 Jan 2015)

Dear All,

Thanks again for your overwhelming comments - Matthew I really appreciate your review and once again some really stunning photos of the saw. It is nice that there is an overall appreciation for the look and feel of the handle. I cleared out the workshop of trial handles and just about filled the wheelie bin up before finally making the perfect one!! Actually if you've not already read (on Twitter) I've just this last week finished my design for a new 12" carcass saw. Hopefully this will be available to purchase in the coming months. This is a true carcass saw and embraces elements again from the 18th Century models. The carcass will be a virtual companion to the dovetail saw in appearance, but the overall weight and balance and general feel of the saw have again been optimised for best performance for a saw of this size. (ie brass thickness and hang angle have been changed as well as some other details...) For Christmas, two new books came into my possession, the first being 'The Tool Chest of Benjamin Seaton' and also 'British Saws & Saw Makers from c1660' by Simon Barley. Amazing books and well worth a read if you are really into the history of both saws and hand tools. Maybe one day with a bit of luck I might make it into the latter! 

David, was the first person to receive a saw last year. I am so pleased that he continues to enjoy using it - his experience and knowledge of using hand tools has not only been inspiring to me, but I am sure to many of you too over the years. I feel honoured by his kind words and his continued endorsement of the dovetail saw. 

Thanks very much all.

Best wishes and a Happy New Year 

Shane


----------



## Bedrock (12 Jan 2015)

I have had the real pleasure of playing with this saw over the last weekend. I won't try to write a review, given Matthew's excellent posting. I tried it in comparison with an LN 15TPI rip, which I have had for some years, and a rescue Roberts and Lee which is at 20TPI, with a very thin plate. I have never really been happy with the LN as it is a bit "grabby". Having compared it with the Skelton, the set was still clearly excessive, and having taken a stone again to both sides, it is now considerably better. Not as good as the Skelton but much more likely to become a consistent user. 
The R&L had just been sharpened, and now gives a clean cut, but does not hold to the line as well as the Skelton. It's probably better for thinner stock.
The woods used were American Black Walnut, Chestnut and Oak.
From the pictures, originally I was not sure about the round cheeks, but in the flesh, it is a very attractive design which compliments the excellent engineering.
If I was in the market for another D/T saw, this would be a very serious runner, notwithstanding the price, which I think is a fair reflection of the thought and skill that has gone into it.
Thank you for the opportunity of trying it.
Can Doug B PM me his address so that I can pass it on.
Mike


----------



## SkeltonSaws (12 Jan 2015)

Evening All!

This is the 2nd time that I've typed this and submitted it but not sure where it went! 

Great to see that the saw is still doing the rounds. Thanks for your comments Mike. (If your LN is grabbing too much for you, then for £25 including return postage I can adjust the rake angle and reset the teeth to give a maximum of 3 thou set per side) The R & L saw should only require 1-2 passes of a 600-800 grit diamond stone along the side of the teeth that is taking more of the cut to even the set. 

Whilst we really love seeing all the reviews on here. (Many of the authors already accomplished writers in this area) We don't want this to be off putting to people who fancy trying the saw out. I would like as many people as possible to have a go- so if you've been thinking about it but have been worrying about writing something just get your name down - no words necessary!


I will be receiving some 20 thou steel plate for the carcass saw in the next couple of weeks, so will be getting on with the first builds.

Recently I have had a really interesting conversation with a man who is in possession of an original 18th Century Squires / Peters saw. It is 1 of only 2 known in existence. The style differs slightly from the early Kenyon saws. I am hoping to come into contact with this at some point in the future with the intention of faithfully reproducing it in all its glory.

Kind regards - Keep Sawing!

Shane


----------



## G S Haydon (12 Jan 2015)

It's been a while since "Part 1" but here goes "Part 2"

If thou can bear it my vid can be seen here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GhGmTwO_iwY with a link to a proper "car crash" vid within. And a very similar write up can be found here http://www.popularwoodworking.com/woodw ... saw-part-2

Anyway back to the task at hand. The main reason I was bale to wrap my head around this saw was thanks to a set of Gyokucho saws I bought from Matthew with some Christmas vouchers. 'Twas only then I got it. I was having a look at Japanese saws etc on the interweb and of course saw example of Japanese craftspeople making traditional tools, preserving skills and making unique items. I thought that was great and then realised I had the same thing sitting on my bench. I had the same passion and drive there for me to play with. I could of set up a contest between the Dozuki and the Skelton but I fear that would be missing the point. The very real thing about this saw is the person behind the creation. I'm confident I have that right, even more so now I have seen Shane's posting about research for the carcase saw. I could copy and paste a spec sheet based on the info on Shane's website but If you want that I suggest you visit the site and see it for yourself. My advice would be get you hands on one while you can. It's easy to look on and think that a "posh" saw might not be for you but the way I've come to look at it was like having a classic work of art for a Month to enjoy with the only cost to me a bit of return postage! Not bad. We've had a spate of it here recently, shoulder planes, bench planes and now custom saws. It's a credit to everyone who participates in this forum that these things can happen. I don't think I can add any more beyond that given by folks way above my stature, the only thing I would underline is try one!


----------



## jimi43 (12 Jan 2015)

SkeltonSaws":1p13a99l said:


> Recently I have had a really interesting conversation with a man who is in possession of an original 18th Century Squires / Peters saw. It is 1 of only 2 known in existence. The style differs slightly from the early Kenyon saws. I am hoping to come into contact with this at some point in the future with the intention of faithfully reproducing it in all its glory.
> 
> Kind regards - Keep Sawing!
> 
> Shane



Would this be the little baby Shane? :mrgreen: 8) 





















I saw it at MAC Timbers and I trust the man to which you refer is none other than Richard Arnold of this parish....

If not...then this is the "other" one! And what a beauty it is too!

Cheers mate

Jimi


----------



## tobytools (13 Jan 2015)

And what is so special about that saw, looks like any other carboot find that you would walk away from.. 

TT


----------



## jimi43 (13 Jan 2015)

tobytools":3nvi9s43 said:


> And what is so special about that saw, looks like any other carboot find that you would walk away from..
> 
> TT



Let me know if you find one in a bootsale Toby...don't walk away from it....I'll take it off your hands! :mrgreen: 

It is a very early and rare saw as mentioned by Shane in his post. Richard brought it along to MAC Timbers last year and it was a thing of beauty indeed.

According to Simon Barley (British Saws and Saw Makers from c 1660)...

PETERS, John - 102 Wardour Street, LONDON c1760-1797

_Rees and Rees state that according to his trade card, Peters succeeded to the business of WILLIAM SQUIRE, they give the date as sometime between 1760 and 1789. By the 1790s, three other saw makers were working at the same address, GEORGE STEVENS and EDWARD and ROBERT WILLIAMS (RCG, p43). *Two back saws have been recorded with Squire struck on the reverse of the back, and Peters on the front (the usual place), suggesting that one had taken over the stock of the other and added his own mark; this double striking is extremely rare (see Joseph Wilson and Fallshaw) and seems to imply that the backs acquired by Peters had already been marked and could simply be turned around to be given a fresh mark by the new owner/maker.*_

I hope this helps.

Incidentally.......Simon Barley's book is well worth getting. It is the "Goodman" of British saws.

Jimi



Jimi


----------



## SkeltonSaws (13 Jan 2015)

That's the one Jimi! Hopefully, I will reproduce this saw as it was bought originally (Commissioning a new stamp of course) Need to get my hands on it first - have been very kindly offered loan, but far too important and valuable to be put in the post! This makes a Skelton Dovetail look cheap in price comparison....and goes to show that quality workmanship always pays. Over 200 years and still standing the test of time! Obviously though am busy with the new carcass at the moment. 

Speak soon 

Shane


----------



## jimi43 (13 Jan 2015)

SkeltonSaws":2p1kea10 said:


> That's the one Jimi! Hopefully, I will reproduce this saw as it was bought originally (Commissioning a new stamp of course) Need to get my hands on it first - have been very kindly offered loan, but far too important and valuable to be put in the post! This makes a Skelton Dovetail look cheap in price comparison....and goes to show that quality workmanship always pays. Over 200 years and still standing the test of time! Obviously though am busy with the new carcass at the moment.
> 
> Speak soon
> 
> Shane



I can honestly say Shane that a trip down to see Richard would be the best way to spend the day you could imagine!

I will say in public because it's probably an understatement but Richard is one of the most helpful, generous and amiable gentlemen (in the true sense of the word!) I have had the pleasure to call a friend.

And he also has a mean collection of planes!

I tried the saw...it's magic. 

Of course...the finishing of the Skelton carcass saw is also an important piece of work....not that I'm biased or anything! :mrgreen: :mrgreen: 

Whatever you do...I'm sure a reproduction of this unique piece of history would be a great thing to own....I look forward to seeing it.

Cheers

Jimi


----------



## Doug B (22 Jan 2015)

Thanks to Chris for organising this pass around.

Thanks to Shane for the opportunity of trying his very fine saw.

Cheers.

Doug.


----------



## tobytools (25 Jan 2015)

Saw received, will have a play then pass on, how long can I keep it for? With work and college ect idea he time will be limited.

TT


----------



## Mr T (27 Jan 2015)

I'd suggest keeping it to have a go over the weekend then sending it on.

Chris


----------



## tobytools (3 Feb 2015)

ok. ive had the saw for a good week, first i say thanks to shane for letting me play with it.
secondly what a pleasure it was, i find it hard to believe its hand made as its flawless.. well done.
ill keep it brief as the masters have already done fantastic reviews.
the saw in use is as you would expect, 
I've used various high end saws and id say this is in my opinion the best available. 

i cut many dovetails it a variety of woods and it preformed well in all... there is only one flaw with this saw and thats its price, i could never justify (same as a lot of people) spending that much on a saw that has one function (rip cuts for dt) 
if i was a wealthy man ye sure id buy one but im not so i couldn't.
so to summarises:
.the tpi ect is perfect as well as the weight, length you name it. the proportions are bang on the money
.saw looks and works beautifully 
.do i want one??.... yes
.can i afford one??..... no
.does this saw make me cut better dove tails... 

just to clear up, i know the price is a bargain when look at in replication of shames hard work ect so its not an insult to your skill me saying its too pricy.. most will probably agree but not say

thanks again and the saw will be in the post tomorrow afternoon when i finish college..

all the best 
TT


----------



## tobytools (5 Feb 2015)

Lost the adress for the next participant, I've sent a pm and awaiting reply so I can send on. Sorry to hold up the proceedings 
Thanks
TT


----------



## Mr T (10 Feb 2015)

I seem to have lost track of the saw! Who has it at the moment?

Chris


----------



## tobytools (10 Feb 2015)

Mr T":f6dnp1la said:


> I seem to have lost track of the saw! Who has it at the moment?
> 
> Chris


 i passed the saw on and its been received by 8squared today.
TT


----------



## 8squared (23 Feb 2015)

Sadly... It's on its way to its new carer.

Will post a review tomorrow... but for now here's a pic of my shocking work.

Please forgive me.


----------



## jimi43 (23 Feb 2015)

8squared":1c8lajzx said:


> Sadly... It's on its way to its new carer.
> 
> Will post a review tomorrow... but for now here's a pic of my shocking work.
> 
> Please forgive me.



Blimey! There's so many dovetails there you are going to need a cot! :mrgreen: 

Cheers

Jim


----------



## 8squared (23 Feb 2015)

Thats just 8 of 47.

Made the most of it you could say.


----------



## condeesteso (24 Feb 2015)

Arrived with me this morning - looks just as good as the last time we met (when Jimi43 had it). A thought struck me, this saw is somewhat blessed - it's been through quite a few hands and not got lost (unlike a Riley awl, a Liogier rasp...).
I shall report back asap, though I feel I'll only be repeating what's gone before.


----------



## 8squared (24 Feb 2015)

First of all a thankyou must be given to Mr Skelton for allowing this pass around to happen.

Not sure if my review will be of a help to anyone as I'm a novice woodworker... 

but as a newcomer to anything you will often be told buy the best you can... so while the option was available I thought I'd give it a go to compare to the type of saws a novice may buy, but I also have a keen interest in doing dovetails as from my memory I was fairly good in secondary school... not now though.

At first glance it was a nice saw, the rosewood handle looked very nice, the weight of the brass back was very noticeable, I did notice and liked the rounded profile of it, the only issue I had was the blade was "wonky" (more on this later).

First thing i did was to do some test cuts in end grain mahogany... straight away it was clear how nice the saw was going to be, if a saw can do a 1" cut often past my line due to it cutting so cleanly and quick with few strokes rather than many it has to be good.

So onto my first dovetail, the biggest problem I had was cutting straight lines on my marks... using the Skelton my lines were straight but not on my marks. With practice the balance of the saw became very useful as it was easy to feel when I was holding it straight or just a little lean... and soon I was cutting to my lines pretty much.

As for the blade being wonky I couldn't quite work out so emailed Mr Skelton and the reply was quick and the information was simple... the tapered blade allows you to cut to the line on the front but stops short of the line on the back side... something I wasn't aware of due to only using parallel blades, I soon found it a fantastic detail.

Forgive me if I'm teaching anyone to suck eggs and this may be long winded.

As I got more into using the saw I soon found the saw more of an extension of my hand, when picking it up the handle was comfortable that I didn't need to fidget with my grip like I have been doing previously and I no longer needed to concentrate on my cutting it just became second nature.

So overall it was a very pleasant experience to have the chance to use the Skelton saw.

As a novice looking for a dovetail I do feel some possibly many will find it an investment too far and unjustifiable.

However if my circumstances were different, due to my keen interest in mastering the art of dovetails and my experience of this saw I would surely without hesitation purchase one...

sadly they are not so I won't, at least not right now.

I feel the Skelton saw is an investment and in experienced hands that will be invaluable... I await that experience.

Thanks again Mr Skelton for the chance.


----------



## condeesteso (26 Feb 2015)

Had me worried for a moment there 8. Had to nip off and sight the blade... no, all fine and true  

I have to go North tomorrow so won't get to try the saw properly 'til Monday. As far as I know I'm last on the list so not holding anyone up?
Will report back asap.


----------



## Mr T (27 Feb 2015)

I like that good down to earth review 8.

Chris


----------



## condeesteso (10 Mar 2015)

sorry for the delay. I don't have much to add at all at this stage. I've tested it on various hardwoods in the range 8 - 30mm.
I compared it with my Gramercy (which I am very used to) and a Japanese dozuki with a rip blade in. It is obviously very good indeed - it cuts as fast as the Dozuki and a little quicker than the Gramercy. It is significantly heavier than the Gramercy and I like the weight. I think you always get better with a saw as you use it more and I found it easy to overshoot at first!
My own view of the benchmark is Jim's Two Lawyers dovetail. I didn't get the chance to compare side-by-side but I have used Jim's before and will not fault it at all. I am sure that the Skelton is as good but it's a bit different - slightly bigger and heavier [and lower tpi I recall).
Basically very good indeed. I would not think of looking for faults, there are none. I really think it is very good value and a decent investment (lifetime tool, works very well indeed, residual value high).
It's been mentioned above but just my own personal taste - on a fine tool like this I prefer the fully sculpted handle:





l-r is Gramercy; Skelton; my Two Lawyers carcase saw (German plum handle) - I prefer the fully rounded form of the other two - but it's a detail and personal taste and of no consequence to performance or feel.

Like others I am very pleased to see excellence coming back in British / English tool making. I know we have a few already (plane makers in particular) but here's a couple of the very hot new arrivals:





Shane Skelton's saw next to a Sparks No70 - which has just arrived and is another absolute gem.

Very well done Shane, I'll be along for a saw but I'm keen to see what happens on the Rich Arnold lend :wink: 

[what's hot'n'tasty and comes out of Scarborough...?]

p.s. forgot to mention - the work that has gone into maker's marks is brilliant. It matters and it is very well done. My Two Lawyers carcase is unmarked and that is a bad oversight on a premium tool.

p.p.s. I will pack and return to Shane as I am the last on the list. Will get it out tomorrow, c/w/ Bern's dovetail guide which basically meant no-one after dared cut any show-off dovetails. He's a bit nifty, that Bern.


----------



## swagman (13 Mar 2015)

Is anyone privy to the price on the new Skelton Carcass Saw. Shane has not provided any info on his website. 

Stewie;


----------



## pedder (13 Mar 2015)

Hi Stewie, 

the homepage says 245 GBP
http://skeltonsaws.co.uk/our-products/

I've written it before, that is a beautiful saw and all the reviews confirm it works perfect. 
Very great first shoot! Good to have another sawmaker on this side of the pond.

Cheers 
Pedder


----------



## swagman (13 Mar 2015)

pedder":3rtdqzkm said:


> Hi Stewie,
> 
> the homepage says 245 GBP
> http://skeltonsaws.co.uk/our-products/
> ...



Hi Pedder. I have read the homepage and it only references the 10" Dovetail Saw, not their 12" Carcass Saw.

regards Stewie;


----------



## pedder (13 Mar 2015)

swagman":160ubyjz said:


> Hi Pedder. I have read the homepage and it only references the 10" Dovetail Saw, not their 12" Carcass Saw.
> 
> regards Stewie;




Sorry Stewie , 
I've got you wrong. Ididn't even read about the carcas saw. Where did you get it from?


Cheers 
Pedder


----------



## Mr T (13 Mar 2015)

Thanks for the review Condeesteso.

I am relieved to know that the saw has made it to everyone and is back with Shane. And finally thanks to Shane for letting us experience his fantastic saw.

Chris


----------



## swagman (13 Mar 2015)

pedder":mt12inyt said:


> swagman":mt12inyt said:
> 
> 
> > Hi Pedder. I have read the homepage and it only references the 10" Dovetail Saw, not their 12" Carcass Saw.
> ...




https://twitter.com/skeltonsaws


----------



## SkeltonSaws (16 Mar 2015)

Good Evening All, (Jacqueline here actually) 

As you can imagine, we've happily been quite busy of late, so apologies for our late reply. Thank you all for your encouraging words, we are glad that you all enjoyed using the saw. It's also nice to be recognised by other Saw Maker's around the globe such as Pedder - Thank you. I've noticed that there has been some interest in the new Carcass Saw - this is now available for sale and if you email me with your interest I can in turn email you back all of the specifications ...however, I know that you are all largely concerned with the price, so I can confirm that it is £275 and can be bought in either rip or crosscut £520 for a pair. I am in the process of re-writing and updating information for the website, which will be implemented probably in a few weeks time. We may also include a blog ..so watch out for that one!

In other news... If you take a look at the Lie-Neilsen Website you'll note that Shane has now become the authorised Saw Doctor for LN saws in the UK. If you need your LN saw re-sharpening give us a call for prices etc.. Don't forget however, Shane will sharpen any saws, so just call or email. 

I noticed that Shane was working on a drawing of the next saw last night, so am sure that this will make an appearance probably around the Autumn if not before! 

Just one last thing I noticed Douglas, that you said that you were surprised that the saw had made it around without getting lost, well funny you should say that...as we haven't actually received the saw back as yet! If you could email us at [email protected] with the tracking number that would be great and I'll chase it up. Some good photos by the way  

Think that's about all for now - but as I say we are only an email / call away and that's the best place to catch us 

Thanks again

Jaq & Shane


----------



## pedder (17 Mar 2015)

Hi Jaq and Shane,

are you going to make a full line of saws? A few years ago I lost an ebay auction regarding a Kenyon tenon saw. The seller was kind enough to send me his pictures to publish them:






More here: 
http://pedder-altedamenauskiel.blogspot ... andle.html

HTH

Cheers Pedder


----------



## SkeltonSaws (17 Mar 2015)

Hi Pedder

Fantastic photo of what I believe to be a very early Kenyon Saw (Pre-London Pattern) Have never seen one before with a fishtail. Yes, the saw range will be increasing and I also hope to include some limited editions of the rarest English saws. The Skelton Saw range will eventually comprise of 10" Dovetail / 12" Carcass / 14" Sash / 16" Tenon and 19" Tenon. 

Hope you are well Pedder and thanks for the picture.

Best regards

Shane


----------



## swagman (17 Mar 2015)

Hi Pedder. The sudden change in direction from the bottom rail to the sweep of the lambs tongue would have been a contributing factor to its fracture at that very spot. A definite weak point within its shaping. The condition of those saw teeth is a bit of a shocker. I wouldn't feel too disappointed not winning that saw on ebay. 

Stewie;


----------



## pedder (17 Mar 2015)

Hi Stewie, 

I lost for about 200 $, so it wasn't even close. At 50 $ it was my highest bid on a saw ever, though. I like the shape of the lower ogee curve and the short horns. It makes the saw at least as special as the Saw wich was pattern for Jaq and Shanes dovetailsaw wich left a big rumor in 2009, after Chris Schwar published his blog: 

http://www.popularwoodworking.com/woodw ... ocking-saw

every sawmaker made one saw at that time, I collected some on my blog: 
http://pedder-altedamenauskiel.blogspot ... ilsaw.html


Let me say I find the skelton saw the best. The transition to the spine makes the design lighter. 

Cheers 
Pedder


----------



## SkeltonSaws (17 Mar 2015)

Hi Pedder again! 

This is the most we've been on here for a while. Thanks for the comments and the link. To be honest, I thought that the Kenyon was cheap (Regardless of condition) It could've been sympathetically restored, however just to own a Kenyon of that age would be fantastic! Let me know if you find another!! 

Cheers

Shane


----------



## condeesteso (17 Mar 2015)

Jaq & Shane, since speaking I got a txt confirmationfrom UPS of delivery (12.20 pm today), signed for by your surname. I assumed all was OK??... will call you tomorrow am

hold on... am I a day late on this :shock: Please tell me you have the saw and Bern's guide???


----------



## SkeltonSaws (17 Mar 2015)

Just to let you know that Saw No 10 is safely back home now - Thank You Douglas!

Loving the Dovetail Marker too Bern  

Have a lovely evening 

Jaq


----------



## matthewwh (17 Mar 2015)

Many thanks Jaq and Shane (and indeed Chris Tribe) for the passaround. 

Being able to experience the the quality of Shane's workmanship and standards at first hand made a lasting impression on me and I'm sure I'm not alone in that sentiment.

I'm absolutely delighted with the dovetail saw by the way, it fits like a glove! 

The new carcase saw looks really tempting........


----------



## jimi43 (17 Mar 2015)

matthewwh":1svti875 said:


> Many thanks Jaq and Shane (and indeed Chris Tribe) for the passaround.
> 
> Being able to experience the the quality of Shane's workmanship and standards at first hand made a lasting impression on me and I'm sure I'm not alone in that sentiment.
> 
> ...



I couldn't agree with you more Matthew and I would like to say that the passaround by any company is a very generous and potentially dangerous thing to embark upon because you have to be darn sure that what you are passing around for review is up to the mettle.

Fortunately..in this instance..not only are these saws up to close inspection..they go beyond that and it was a real privilege to be part of this particular event.

As far as owning one is concerned...unlike you Matthew...I have the breaking strain of a bleedin' KIT KAT....so I'll let you know what the "other" saw is like after my birthday! :wink: 

Thanks to Chris from me too...and also Bern whose superb dovetail marker was a fine "thank you"...I only wish I could come close to that quality but Bern stepped in...and that was pure class mate! =D> 

Jimi


----------

