# Sargent planes vs Stanley & Record



## J_SAMa (10 Oct 2013)

Hi all,
I've noticed that Sargent planes in eBay don't go for as much as Stanley or Record ones do. We're they of lesser quality or is it just because Stanley and Record have more collecting value? I hope it's the latter as I could really save a lot do money buying Sargent instead of Stanley or Record. Also what if a Sargent is compared to a post 50's Stanley?
Keep in mind that I'm currently looking at a few Sargent jointers, which I think do not require as much finesse or accuracy as smoothers. So maybe even they were slightly inferior to their competitors they would still do?
Sam


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## woodbrains (10 Oct 2013)

Hello,

I once had a Sargent 5 VBM ( very best made) but it was not good TBH. The frog seat was not machined lower to allow the blade to be supported by the frog low down enough and it chattered like crazy. The blade adjuster wheel did not have a left hand thread, which is a minor point, but it drove me nuts to have to advance and retract the wrong way to all the other planes I had. I suppose you could get used to it, esp if your other planes had the backward adjuster like a Millers Falls. I would avoid and get a good pre 1960 Record. You can pick them up cheaply if you shop around. I've not spent more than £38 pounds on any of my Records from a 3 to a 7 and half numbers. 

Mike.


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## J_SAMa (12 Oct 2013)

What about other manufacturers? Like Millers Falls and Union? Any of them good? They always seem to go for less than Stanley and Record.


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## Graham Orm (12 Oct 2013)

Stanleys are cheap enough if you wait and watch.

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/200970519120? ... 1438.l2649


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## Vann (13 Oct 2013)

J_SAMa":1bi1puk2 said:


> What about other manufacturers? Like Millers Falls and Union? Any of them good? They always seem to go for less than Stanley and Record.


You probably need to ask this on a USA forum. Very few Sargent, Millers Falls and Union planes made it to New Zealand, and I think the same applies to Britain. We have little experience with them, so we don't know if they're any good (or which models are good and which are bad).

Other than a couple of USA Stanleys, the only American plane I have (excluding the odd Veritas and L-N of course) is one Vaughn & Bushall 704 awaiting some refurbing. I don't know anything about American planes, except that early Stanleys (pre-WW2) are generally well made.

Cheers, Vann.


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## ac445ab (13 Oct 2013)

I have a couple of Sargent VBM planes and I find them good. 
The VBM planes were manufactured in the early XXth century for a short period. They have thicker blades than Stanley planes and perform well for me. However, Sargent bench planes haven't the frog adjusting screw but this is a minor issue I think. 

Ciao 
Giuliano


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## yetloh (15 Oct 2013)

I have a Union No 4 which I reckon is as good in quality as a Stanley or Record.

Jim


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## MisterInquisitive (16 Oct 2013)

I live near where Sargent made planes back in the day. All of the names mentioned are fine--Miller's Falls, Union, Sargent, Stanley. If you can fettle a Bailey there's no reason you shouldn't be able to get any of the other brands to work. Vaughan & Bushnell actually forged their plane parts instead of making castings, so there's an argument in their favor. Plus V&B made a Bedrock-style frog/sole interface which is nice but not necessary. There are a lot of people in the States who reject anything other than the Stanleys, but only because Stanley is so well documented and they know not whereof they speak. Stanley UK made a lot of planes imported into the US from the 1970s on, and the same people think the UK planes were junk. Which is just not the case. In my experience the only worthwhile judgment is on a plane-by-plane basis. If you get a chance at a Miller's Falls or a Sargent, check it out thoroughly in person if possible for the same problems you'd investigate on a Stanley. Probably just as good as a Stanley, maybe sometimes better in some respects, worse in others, but only in the smallest matters. If you know how to use a plane, you can make any of them work.


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