# storage shelfs (mdf??)



## Greek Enigma (25 May 2011)

if in wrong section (im sorry)

Hi im completely retarded when it comes to woodwork  

basically my mum lives in a mobile home and we cant seem to find a correct size unit to go in the corner so im going to make one instead :shock: 

(DOESN'T NEED TO BE FANCY) just to hold her records etc so needs to be deep.

like this but with more depth & alot widerhttp://www.argos.co.uk/webapp/wcs/s...ne Shop for Entertainment cabinets and units.

WILL MDF BE OK???????????

ok basically bought some mdf and thought ide just cut it up with a jigsaw
and screw it together then just use white paint all over it

than google shocked me !!!

i noticed something saying mdf is now band in America as its dangerous and always lets of fumes from the glue used to hold all the dust together 
(im guessing mdf is wood dust and glue DANGEROUS GLUE)

is this true?

or is it ok

p.s if ok

will mdf be the correct material for the job? or have i picked the wrong stuff for a quick cheap way for this


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## Greek Enigma (25 May 2011)

also if mdf is correct one to use (i dnt know about wood mdf chipboard etc)

then should i just cut/drill countersink then sand countersink etc then just use any white paint???

thanks all (homer) (homer) 

whys homer in the smiles???

but love homer so
(homer) (homer) (homer) (homer) (homer) (homer) (homer)


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## Dibs-h (25 May 2011)

I think MDF would be fine for the job you have in mind. With something like MDF - good extraction. Or facemask and cut outside. Can't say I've heard anything about it being banned tho.

HIH

DIbs

p.s. You could use biscuits to assemble and for the shelves - but would need some mechanism to clamp. MDF will need pilot drilling - otherwise you'll split it. Paint - can't say, as I haven't use it for ages.


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## Greek Enigma (25 May 2011)

Dibs-h":wzptjgh7 said:


> I think MDF would be fine for the job you have in mind. With something like MDF - good extraction. Or facemask and cut outside. Can't say I've heard anything about it being banned tho.
> 
> HIH
> 
> ...



hi mate

yeah i allways pilot drill

i am a newbie in wood but jave used wood once before

garage unit i built (its on here)

but thanks ok ill just go ahead and hope it hold up

im just going to put it together argos unit style lol (screws from side)

aka non adjustable as just wont it done

thanks

will do this tomorrow and say how it went (or post pic lol) of my beautiful mdf build lmfao

nah looks arnt important like i said 

thanks for the quick response


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## chunkolini (25 May 2011)

Bear in mind records are hellaciously heavy, and a sagging shelf is a truly tragic sight.
If you plan for this you should be fine.
I picked up this link from this a while back, the Sagulator, tells you how a shelf will be before sagging, you enter the load length and material.
http://www.woodbin.com/calcs/sagulator.htm
Chunko'.


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## barkwindjammer (25 May 2011)

If you put vertical dividers into the box, and its on a good base then it should be fine, and if its for your Mum-take your time and do a nice job,

these things are great for the DIYer, and cheap

http://www.screwfix.com/p/white-assembl ... f-10/25399


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## Harbo (25 May 2011)

My LP collection is housed in a series of cube boxes - just slightly larger than the size of the record sleeves. They can be placed side by side and stacked on top of each other.
No sagging at all.

Rod


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## Chip shop (25 May 2011)

It might be worth fixing a supporting batten underneath the back of each shelf (better screw holding). White pine from you're local builder's merchant or B&Q would do the trick.

Remember to give the whole thing a coat of primer before getting at it with the gloss.


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## Greek Enigma (1 Jun 2011)

Hi everyone OMG I FORGOT ABOUT THE POST AND JUST BUILD IT

anyway here it is but i need help








well i know nothing about wood work so just doing everything my way

ok i just did measures etc

drilled pilot holes 

drilled countersinks

and put together

NOW ..... shall i fill holes with wood filler and sand then paint with any white paint

or do i need to seal mdf (or do something special with mdf)

before i can paint whatever white paint i got in the shed lol

remember this dos not need to be perfect at all

thankyou all you helpful bunch 8)


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## Greek Enigma (5 Jun 2011)

anyone?


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## Ateallthepies (5 Jun 2011)

I always now use a 2-pack wood filler for MDF. I have in the past used other fillers like tetrion and had screw holes 'pop' the surface.

You can use any paint, oil or water based. Just knock the first coat with the appropriate thinners. This is so the first layer of paint can soak into the surface and key better. You will need at least four coats for a nice finish.

I use a water based acrylic primer for MDF for the first two coats then an oil based undercoat and then either a gloss, satinwood or eggshell oil based finish coat using a 4" foam roller while cutting in the corners with a brush. You can achieve an almost sprayed finish with practice with this method. 

HTH,

Steve.


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## Greek Enigma (5 Jun 2011)

Ateallthepies":3mrdngoj said:


> I always now use a 2-pack wood filler for MDF. I have in the past used other fillers like tetrion and had screw holes 'pop' the surface.
> 
> You can use any paint, oil or water based. Just knock the first coat with the appropriate thinners. This is so the first layer of paint can soak into the surface and key better. You will need at least four coats for a nice finish.
> 
> ...



omg im iffy to do this method

i was just wanting to quickly paint it (as its nothing special)

couldnt i use some kind of sealer then 2 coats of any paint?

or is that a nono?

as i really dnt want to do your method if i dnt need to

although i know your method will be great i just want to use what i have if possable


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## Ateallthepies (5 Jun 2011)

Yes use whatever you have. 

If you have some emulsion just knock the first coat with some water. About 10-20% water to paint is fine. Then just keep adding full coats until you are happy. 

If you have oil based paint use that. If you have undercoat use that first then whatever top coat you have.

Try to sand in between coats with something like 120 grit or higher to get a smoother finish.

It is best to have the final coats a wipe-able finish like gloss, satinwood or eggshell. Emulsion and undercoat will pick up dust and grime over time and look bad and won't be able to be removed unless re-painted.


Steve.


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## Greek Enigma (5 Jun 2011)

Ateallthepies":1iwijbis said:


> Yes use whatever you have.
> 
> If you have some emulsion just knock the first coat with some water. About 10-20% water to paint is fine. Then just keep adding full coats until you are happy.
> 
> ...



nice one

well bussy till saturday

so ill do it then

thanks for everything steve


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## Greek Enigma (7 Jun 2011)

Ok here goes

Have quiet alot of different paints in the shed

whats the best white paint i should use???

like say 1st if you have this if not this 2nd or this 3rd etc

ps im a lil lost about watering down the paint??? (wouldnt that rot the mdf)

also i heard mdf must be sealed before anypainting as its like a spunge??

sorry to keep asking about it im just making sure

thankyou


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## Hudson Carpentry (7 Jun 2011)

No the paint will mix with the water and help fight that sponge like effect, it will in no way "rot" the material. To rot wood you need a continuing source of damp, the paint with water will dry far to quickly for anything to rot. If you don't water the paint down you will end up putting 2-3 coats on and still see the MDF colour showing through.

For the watering down matt emulation is best. If you read back you will be able to form a list of which paint types are better.

If you don't have them types then list what types you do have and I or someone will advice you further.


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## Greek Enigma (7 Jun 2011)

Hudson Carpentry":czz6phs0 said:


> No the paint will mix with the water and help fight that sponge like effect, it will in no way "rot" the material. To rot wood you need a continuing source of damp, the paint with water will dry far to quickly for anything to rot. If you don't water the paint down you will end up putting 2-3 coats on and still see the MDF colour showing through.
> 
> For the watering down matt emulation is best. If you read back you will be able to form a list of which paint types are better.
> 
> If you don't have them types then list what types you do have and I or someone will advice you further.



so steve that has been helping me was spot on then?

he mentioned emulsion and oil based

i was just curious which was best incase i have both in the shed

thanks again to you

and steve

i totally get the watering down now

thankyou    

so no sealing needed if i do that then?

thanks all for your help im very greatful

as when i go to do it i an look back at what you all have wrote

again claps hands to both of you for being very helpful


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## Hudson Carpentry (7 Jun 2011)

No the watering down will effectively seal the MDF. As your only putting "whats in the shed" on I wouldn't worry and would just get on with it. If you wanted to do it "properly/professionally" you're more then likely going to have to buy new products. However many professionals, myself included use the watered down emulsion as a way to "seal" MDF first. Many say its a far better method then products designed to prime MDF. Another popular way is to water down some PVA glue and apply first.

There are pros and cons of using both oil and water based. It only becomes a matter of which is best when you consider application and user. In your case I would use water as it drys faster and there are less vapours. Oil would have been better if painted before installed. Oil don't retain its colour as well as water based but water based don't soak in as well.

I also have never heard of any baning of MDF, the dust is toxic due to the glue and you should protect yourself. However if it was that bad it wouldn't be available in DIY sheds or the alike.


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## Greek Enigma (7 Jun 2011)

Hudson Carpentry":1qho2ggs said:


> No the watering down will effectively seal the MDF. As your only putting "whats in the shed" on I wouldn't worry and would just get on with it. If you wanted to do it "properly/professionally" you're more then likely going to have to buy new products. However many professionals, myself included use the watered down emulsion as a way to "seal" MDF first. Many say its a far better method then products designed to prime MDF. Another popular way is to water down some PVA glue and apply first.
> 
> There are pros and cons of using both oil and water based. It only becomes a matter of which is best when you consider application and user. In your case I would use water as it drys faster and there are less vapours. Oil would have been better if painted before installed. Oil don't retain its colour as well as water based but water based don't soak in as well.
> 
> I also have never heard of any baning of MDF, the dust is toxic due to the glue and you should protect yourself. However if it was that bad it wouldn't be available in DIY sheds or the alike.



thanks so much for the knowledge you have on wood  

p.s its not for the shed its for records etc

pics are a page back

also i just wrote a funny story

go check it out in forum


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## DOOGYREV (7 Jun 2011)

1st Coat use Primer (or emulsion if you only have that) 
Rub it down 
2nd Coat use Undercoat (if you don't have it, you can use Satinwood or Eggshell) 
Rub it down if needed 
3rd Coat use Satinwood, Eggshell or Gloss (whatever you have) 

don't worry about the mdf rotting if you add water, as all the water will have evaporated before you apply the second coat. 
The first coat you apply will do the all the sealing you need.


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## bosshogg (7 Jun 2011)

MDF is porous only at the exposed edges, easily sealed with wood workers glue - PVA - just apply it down any exposed edges, rub it with your finger to get it all the way up to the edges, let it dry - 1 day - then sand with any not too rough sandpaper. MDF will accept any type of paint, I have seen painters seal it with emulsion - 2 coats - then paint it with gloss, so you can do it with almost anything you choose, of course the better the foundation/undercoat (2 coats, let dry & rub down between coats) you use the better and longer lasting the finish...bosshogg 


> No man is an island


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## Greek Enigma (7 Jun 2011)

hi everyone

only thing is dnt think i can sand between coats as no room in shed and ill have to do sanding in the living room ahhhhhhh

dnt think thats good lol

so ill just di what everyone says but forget sanding 

dnt need to be perfect

when i move i might try better things with wood


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## Ateallthepies (7 Jun 2011)

Try not to miss out the sanding, it really goes a long way to a better finish. You don't have to rub the hell out of it just a wipe all over with 120 or higher grit to knock off the fluffy bits and imperfections from the previous coat. For the unit you made it can be sanded in a minute or two.

Steve.


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## Greek Enigma (7 Jun 2011)

Ateallthepies":120ehzk3 said:


> Try not to miss out the sanding, it really goes a long way to a better finish. You don't have to rub the hell out of it just a wipe all over with 120 or higher grit to knock off the fluffy bits and imperfections from the previous coat. For the unit you made it can be sanded in a minute or two.
> 
> Steve.



ok well ill do it outside on a good day then repeat another day etc etc

as no space etc


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## Greek Enigma (27 Jun 2011)

hi everyone
well very bussy with other stuff at present

but can someone make me understand the following

1. is mdf the best/cheapest wood type to use to knock up quick furniture (also where is the cheapest place for wood mdf etc etc near me?) im near bracknell

2.is mdf the only type of wood that needs sealing?

3.must all mdf be painted to seal the toxic glue it has?

4 whats the difference between oil paint and water based?

5.i see you say final coats must be gloss, satinwood, or eggshell (ive only ever heard of gloss ) is there more or just this 3 types of paint for top coats?

6.whats the best final coats to use for hard-wearing (gloss, eggshell, or satinwood) and theirs probably loads more????

sorry im so new to wood and dnt know about it

im trying to get it

so is this all the types of paint....oil based, water based (only used for undercoats are these???)
gloss, eggshel, satinwood for final coats(and whats the difference between them all)


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## DOOGYREV (27 Jun 2011)

Hi Greek Enigma,
How are you getting on with your mould problem?
1.	Yes, In a nutshell it is. Try Wickes often the will have slightly damaged sheets, reduced to £8, and Brewers used to charge around £18 for a 8’x4’ 18mm Sheet and £1 a cut and they will deliver to you. You’ve also got Swinly Saw Mill just around the corner, its worth popping in and asking them if they got any cheap timber.
2.	No, all woods should be sealed.
3.	Not quite, the main reason to paint MDF is for same reason that anything is painted, and not to seal the ‘toxic glue’ and don’t get to hung up about the glue you really should stop worrying about this!!!
4.	Water based paints use water to make them a liquid, the reason the paint dries is because the water evaporates from the paint, leaving you with a dry painted surface.
Oil based paints use Oil to make them a liquid, the reason the paint dries is because the Oil evaporates from the paint, leaving you with a dry painted surface.
5.	Not that you need to worry about, just stick with Eggshell or Satinwood, (there more or less the same anyway) and leave you with an ‘eggshell satin’ finish gloss is harder to apply and leaves you with shiny (gloss) finish.
6.	Gloss is harder, but the other two are plenty good enough.
7.	You’ve got primer comes in both (Water and Oil Based)
You’ve got Undercoat it comes in both Water and Oil Based
You’ve got Gloss, Eggshell & Satinwood they all come in both Water and Oil Based


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## Greek Enigma (28 Jun 2011)

DOOGYREV":39cms3el said:


> Hi Greek Enigma,
> How are you getting on with your mould problem?
> 1.	Yes, In a nutshell it is. Try Wickes often the will have slightly damaged sheets, reduced to £8, and Brewers used to charge around £18 for a 8’x4’ 18mm Sheet and £1 a cut and they will deliver to you. You’ve also got Swinly Saw Mill just around the corner, its worth popping in and asking them if they got any cheap timber.
> 2.	No, all woods should be sealed.
> ...



cheers ma8

when you say i got primer, do you mean watered down water or oil based?

and when you say i got under coat, do you mean not watered down water or oil?

so eggshell & satinwood are also gloss?

thanks for the help

how you know all this info?


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## DOOGYREV (28 Jun 2011)

Greek Enigma":2104eipw said:


> DOOGYREV":2104eipw said:
> 
> 
> > Hi Greek Enigma,
> ...


 
When I say "you've got" I dont mean you personally. 

Ok I will try and keep it simple for you, when your painting mdf wood etc.. you need to give it 3 coats of paint and rub down between coats. 
First coat use primer (this will also 'seal it') - You can get both water & oil based primers 
Rub it down 
Second coat use undercoat. - You can get both water & oil based undercoats 
Rub down 
Top coat use Eggshell or Satinwood. I wouldn't bother with gloss if I were you - Again you can get all three in both water & oil based 

No, Eggshell and Satin wood are almost the same, Gloss is different. 

Really isn't alot to know, Prime - Rub down - Undercoat - Rubdown - Top Coat - Done. Then just clean your brushes with water or white spirit. 

Hope that makes it a bit clearer for you.


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## Greek Enigma (30 Jun 2011)

DOOGYREV":2zotg1or said:


> Greek Enigma":2zotg1or said:
> 
> 
> > DOOGYREV":2zotg1or said:
> ...



i totaly understand
what i mean is on here people say no need for primer just used watered down emulsion? (correct?)

and no need for undercoat (just use emulsion)

and thats all finished

unless you want a tough scratch resistant & clean easy surface
then use a last coat of gloss, eggshell or satinwood

so what i mean is, is this the correct method thats in my head...without having to buy all the gimmicks


1.apply watered down emulsion to seal/prime (2 to 3 times on edges maybe)

2.apply undercoat (use emulsion again NOT WATERED DOWN THIS TIME)

3.all finished (unless needing scratch resistant and easy clean surface then do step 4

4.gloss, satinwood or eggshell

and use 120grit sandpaper between coats?

p.s if painting anywood (not just mdf) should i use same method...maybe just no need to seal?

i mean i know some woods arn't painted and waxed or oild (another thread for another time if i do something like that maybe  )


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## DOOGYREV (30 Jun 2011)

Greek Enigma":2f12n0gv said:


> i totaly understand
> what i mean is on here people say no need for primer just used watered down emulsion? (correct?)
> 
> Yes thats fine, its the same as priming
> ...



Yes if you want a wood finish then dont paint it
If your not going to top coat it because you dont have any paint, PM me and I will be happy give you some.


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## Greek Enigma (3 Jul 2011)

DOOGYREV":v7od5f2y said:


> Greek Enigma":v7od5f2y said:
> 
> 
> > i totaly understand
> ...



thats real nice of you ma8...but i wouldn't feel right doing that

what i ment was say the wood or mdf was just for say up on the wall never touched etc

why must it still be painted with gloss eggshell or satinwood?

or is it because emulsion is mainly for wallpaper or something lol

omg im a .

ummmm...i get the process everyone has described (do all pros use that method?)

this is the only forum im a member of as newish to internet

do you know any other good forums?

as i see this is suppossed to be just about wood

for instance say i wanted to rebuild a house

ide need to get alot of info

because im thinking of buy and doing up places in future so need to get info ( a major lot)

ide like to learn alot of things

cheers for help everyone


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## DOOGYREV (4 Jul 2011)

Greek Enigma":1a40uy4d said:


> DOOGYREV":1a40uy4d said:
> 
> 
> > If your not going to top coat it because you dont have any paint, PM me and I will be happy give you some.
> ...


 
Your welcome


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