# First use of hammer fixings.



## Benchwayze (5 Aug 2015)

I have never used hammer fixings and I have to repair a gate post. 

One advisor tells me to drill through the post into the brick, full depth for the length of screw. Then simply hammer the fixing home through the post and into the wall, not using a screwdriver at all. This leaves a lot of the plastic plug in the timber, and not in the wall where I think it needs to be. 

Others advise me to drill the post, and then transfer the position to the wall. Drill the wall, and then put the plastic plug into the hole. Pass the screw through the timber, line it up with the plug, and screw part way in. Then hammer the whole shebang home. 

So which is the right way, or the best way! 
Any ideas welcome
TIA

Cheers 

John


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## blackrodd (5 Aug 2015)

I've used fischer frame fixings and as far as I'm aware, the whole of the plug or plastic should be in the masonry,
irrespective of whether it's a specified "hammer" fixing or standard plug.
As I understand it, the mammer fixings should be screwed in the last 5, or 10mm in any event
There is a frame fixing made for fixing through the wood as you say, but needs a countersink for the end which you mentioned.
As a preference, personally, drill through the post and mark the masonry,in 3, or 4 places in the usual fashion.
Regards Rodders


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## Lons (5 Aug 2015)

I've used hammer fixings for years, probably well into four figure quantity and though not the perfect solution for every situation they are very useful, secure and easy to fix.

Hammer fixings are hammered fully home not screwed and if you examine one you'll see that the "thread" isn't like a normal screw, it slopes back towards the head so the threads act like a barb. That being said, it is possible to unscrew them if done carefully and with little pressure. As far as the plastic head bit, the wood should be countersunk so that's buried and I finish off by driving it home the final few mm with a punch. The correct size should be used to get the length of fix into masonary and again if you look you'll see that the split plug section is similar on all lengths, just the smooth body of the plug is different and that's inside the wood.
If they didn't fix as I state then why have them at all, you might as well use long screws and standard plugs. Hammer fixings were devised specifically for speed of use.

You can however also buy screwfixings which are fitted in the same manner but never hammered, always screwed in.

Additionally there are specific PVCu frame screwfixings designed to prevent distortion of the frames.

I have most sizes in all types in my kit and can take close up pics and post if required.

My method of fixing is fast, simple and never fails: Position the timber and determine wher the best fixing will be for the first one. Drill the wood with a bit 1/2 mm larger than the hammerfix, hold timber in place and drill through into masonary with an sds, (you could mark and drill the first hole seperately. Position the timber, push the plastic outer fully home and then hammer in the fixing so it bites but not fully hole. Plumb up the timber then drill the other holes right through, insert packers to plumb up if required and and fully fix. Reason for slightly larger in wood is because the plastic can stick if the wood swells.

Cheers
Bob


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## Benchwayze (6 Aug 2015)

Thank you folks. 


If the plastic is in the masonry, how much of the screw needs to be in the plugged hole? 

Hmmm! Maybe my problem now is finding some fixings long enough to go through a 75mm square post, without counter-boring. Also, building up the post up with two thickness of timber is a no-no. I think I prefer the plastic to be in the masonry full depth, but then will the threaded portion of the screw reach the expanding section of the plug! 

I will be tackling this today! I'll keep you posted.  

Thanks again. 

John


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## Alexam (6 Aug 2015)

You may have already seen this video, which is very clear. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8NIUfORnK8g


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## Benchwayze (6 Aug 2015)

Alexam":lv1zj1yj said:


> You may have already seen this video, which is very clear. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8NIUfORnK8g



Thanks Alex. yes I did see it. It looks as though the fix is sound, but the conflicting info I had just bothered me. 

Thanks again 
John


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## Phil Pascoe (6 Aug 2015)

Use Thunderbolts, and have done with it. Easy.


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## Benchwayze (6 Aug 2015)

Are those the fixings that self-tap into the brickwork Phil? If so, I used those to fix the post initially. The wind snatches the gate out of the hand easily, and the slamming has worked those fixings loose.


:?


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## Phil Pascoe (6 Aug 2015)

I'd think it would wrench any fitting loose, then. If your original fittings are still there you could possibly resin them back in - I doubt anything would move that.


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## Benchwayze (6 Aug 2015)

Thanks again Phil.

Yes, I considered using 'No-nonsense' or maybe some body-filler paste. 
As to the door swinging, I fitted a retaining hook and eye, but sometimes you forget, and a sudden draught down the 'wind-tunnel' does the damage. 
It is also the fact that the gate is heavier than the one it replaced.

I'll try the hammer fixings first though.
Thanks again.  


John


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## No skills (6 Aug 2015)

I think for a timber that thick I'd use studding and resin anchor, sometimes with the hammer or screw in fixings theres just not enough fixing in the masonary.


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## Mcluma (6 Aug 2015)

No skills":z6osorhy said:


> I think for a timber that thick I'd use studding and resin anchor, sometimes with the hammer or screw in fixings theres just not enough fixing in the masonary.



hammer fixings are just not going to do it

For gate posts, always chemical anchors. there is just too much slamming.


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## Benchwayze (6 Aug 2015)

I think you might be right Chris, & no-skills. 

The gate on the other side was fixed with plain old rawlplugs and no 12 screws. But then there isn't the 'wind-tunnel' effect on that side! 

Thanks. 

John


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## Lons (6 Aug 2015)

Hi John
As said, if slamming a heavy gate is a real problem then go for resin fix but any fixing is only as good as the structure you're fixing to and the hinges and catch will suffer anyway so the only real answer is to prevent the slamming.

For 75mm timber you need 120mm minimum fixings btw. http://www.screwfix.com/p/nylon-hammer- ... f-10/19157 I buy these from Screwfix or Toolstation. They also sell larger as well as Fischer and Rawlplug FRAME fixings.

I stand by all my previous comments based on 20 years running my own construction company and I've just watched the video linked in a previous post which IMHO gives poor advice:

* The guy says sometimes known as frame fixings which is rubbish, they are a very different product.
* He drills the hole the length of the plug. It should be deeper as unless the hole is carefully blown out there will be dust in the bottom which will stop the plug short.
* He doesn't countersink and hammers the whole fixing fully home, marking and splintering the wood - very rough work - using a punch prevents that. A final twist with a screwdriver doesn't do any harm but not normally necessary
* The hole he drills is partly in to the mortar bed which is the weakest part of the wall, should be in to solid stone. (Bricks are a different matter as sometimes hollow)
* He makes no attempt to pack behind the timber to a stone wall which will never be plumb, (maybe that's nitpicking :wink: )

Cheers
Bob


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## blackrodd (6 Aug 2015)

+1 for Lons above I agree, but still say on Fischer fixings I'm sure the advice is to screw the final 5, or 6 mm.
The O.P, perhaps give some thought to using 2 good angle or a a "U" shaped bracket that will surround the post and be fixed in place by drill and plugs, and help against the initial shock to the post.
Regards Rodders

PS I've been trying to find a link, These are very good too, but the hole and drilling is crucial,--

http://www.amazon.co.uk/s/?ie=UTF8&keyw ... rp6sxp5c_b


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## Benchwayze (6 Aug 2015)

I think when I've finished re-attaching the post, I'll put a pulley on the top of the door, and a socking great weight hanging down the hinge post, to slow down travel, just in case I forget to put the hook and eye in place! I had hoped to get this done today, but other things conspired against me, so here's hoping Friday will be free!. :lol: 

Thanks everyone, esp MMUK who knocked my door tonight and presented me with a handful of self-tap fixings. 


John


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