# Hi first post need help with a project



## JonnBoy (16 Jul 2014)

Hi Chaps

i need some advice my son is doing a small eco project at school and we need a part made could any one steer us in the right way 

what we are going to use is a A/C Motor with an 11mm O/D shaft we want to marry it up with a pulley wheel which has an I/D hole of 17mm

the motor has a key cut out 

we intend to buy both parts from ebay can supply numbers of items if that helps 

so looking if any one could help we are in Croydon Surrey 

regards JB


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## nev (16 Jul 2014)

how about 11.11mm internal and 17.46mm external? 
http://www.bearingshopuk.co.uk/bearings ... meter=4260


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## JonnBoy (16 Jul 2014)

JonnBoy":3nf9h8yc said:


> Hi Chaps
> 
> i need some advice my son is doing a small eco project at school and we need a part made could any one steer us in the right way
> 
> ...




has to be 11mm for the motor shaft hoping to find someone with a lathe that might be able to make it


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## nev (16 Jul 2014)

:shock: 0.1 of a mm too big ? I would imagine a bit of glue or threadlock would be that thick. 
I also suspect that low cost parts (if thats what you are looking at) from ebay will probably not be _exactly_ 11.00mm or 17.00mm , but I am only guessing.

alternatively cut the bush on one side lengthwise with a hacksaw , it should then squeeze into the 17 and over the 11.

good luck with the project.


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## Higon (16 Jul 2014)

hi JonnBoy
I'm a bit far away, but have PM'd you.


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## JonnBoy (16 Jul 2014)

nev":pee44a6w said:


> :shock: 0.1 of a mm too big ? I would imagine a bit of glue or threadlock would be that thick.
> I also suspect that low cost parts (if thats what you are looking at) from ebay will probably not be _exactly_ 11.00mm or 17.00mm , but I am only guessing.
> 
> alternatively cut the bush on one side lengthwise with a hacksaw , it should then squeeze into the 17 and over the 11.
> ...



do i have to post a few times to PM back ?

what we have is a 1/4 HP motor with a 11mm O/D shaft 
the pulley wheel is an Alternator 6 Groove Pulley 80mm Dia 17mm I/D hole so we need to marry both together if i can get something lathed i can JB weld the wheel to the made part 

what we are going to spin is a very high output 12v alternator 215 amps with a pulley wheel of 56mm O/D 

JB


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## nev (16 Jul 2014)

JonnBoy":16refzx3 said:


> do i have to post a few times to PM back ?



yes. 3 so you should be good to go now.

Your school project is somewhat meatier than I imagined, how things have changed since I was in school


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## JonnBoy (16 Jul 2014)

nev":3forv74s said:


> JonnBoy":3forv74s said:
> 
> 
> > do i have to post a few times to PM back ?
> ...


 

Hi Nev yes has moved on a bit 

he has taken part of the project to show how to save energy and make the electric bill smaller we had it working on a DC motor but the drain on the battery was to much to keep it all going so on to the AC motor 250w 

what we have done is to build a high amped out put to charge a battery bank by only using a small amount of electric from the 1/4HP Motor for day and night use to battery bank then on to a 3kw pure-sine wave inverter will never run at full power but there if needed it's running all the lights in the house LED 5w fridge freezer and large freezer at night solar PV takes care of the day 

the project he is doing is around what we are doing at home to save on the electric bill 

with the use of solar Panels & Gride tie inverter and battery bank for night use 

just need to get the pulley wheel to marry up with the motor shaft looks like a lot of phoning around Thursday :roll: 
or if someone can steer us where to get one made 

JB


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## Lons (16 Jul 2014)

Any small engineering company should be able to provide a bit of 17mm mild steel bar drilled out to 11mm. Or if they don't have any, can drill thicker stock and turn it down to 17mm. Shouldn't cost much.

Bob


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## nev (16 Jul 2014)

maybe worth an ask on a model engineering type forum like http://www.model-engineer.co.uk/forums/


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## JonnBoy (16 Jul 2014)

nev":1gx0hwdy said:


> maybe worth an ask on a model engineering type forum like http://www.model-engineer.co.uk/forums/



have had a look on scoot and found 2 places not to far away 

will try them in the morning


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## rxh (17 Jul 2014)

I am near Croydon and may be able to help. I'll send a PM this evening. How long does the adaptor need to be?


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## JonnBoy (17 Jul 2014)

rxh":38gqy9z2 said:


> I am near Croydon and may be able to help. I'll send a PM this evening. How long does the adaptor need to be?


Hi rxh
about 50mm long


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## seaco (17 Jul 2014)

I will make this for you so let me get this right, you want an adaptor with 17mm OD with a 11mm ID hole and it to be 50mm in length is that correct.

Let me know if you still need this making?


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## flh801978 (17 Jul 2014)

Slightly off topic but how are you going to spin a 3000 watt generator with a 187.5 watt motor?

or have I got hold of the wrong end of the stick

Ian


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## Higon (17 Jul 2014)

Try this place, give them a shout and they might be able to suggest an off the shelf solution, (£2.75 or similar I think?)
http://shop.marksman-ind.com/1108-taper-lock-bush---metric-shafts-3140-p.asp

If you don't mind a toothed belt solution, I used these people to make some pulleys for me for some servo / steppers. Very happy with them, most helpful and quick too. This link is to their multi V pulleys, £6.75!
http://www.beltingonline.com/80mm-3-groove-spz-v-pulley-1210-t-l-spz80-9482

If they (belting online) can't help, try a google of Taperlock bearing.


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## JonnBoy (17 Jul 2014)

flh801978":2rwxp71p said:


> Slightly off topic but how are you going to spin a 3000 watt generator with a 187.5 watt motor?
> 
> or have I got hold of the wrong end of the stick
> 
> Ian



Hi Ian 

what we have is a large battery bank to run 3kw inverter pure sine wave at night 

we use solar Panel during the day but the charger to re charge the battery's is around 1.5kw then steps down when battery's are charged and move to float 

the motor is going to power a high output 12v alternator 215amps regulated this will help keep the battery's topped up well 

so the idea is at night we can run small items fine from battery bank the motor low wattage will run the alternator if we need to say run a washing machine / dishwasher / pre heater 2k for are hot water into are combi boiler when we get round to doing it 

are electric bill has dropped loads already just getting it more sorted for the winter so my son is doing a project at school re saving energy and how to get more Eco at home gets him off the X Box for a while lol


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## rxh (17 Jul 2014)

How do you want to transmit the turning effort between shaft and pulley? Does the pulley have a screw that could be tightened through a hole in the wall of the adaptor and engage in the keyway of the shaft?


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## flh801978 (17 Jul 2014)

"""the motor is going to power a high output 12v alternator 215amps regulated this will help keep the battery's topped up well

so the idea is at night we can run small items fine from battery bank the motor low wattage will run the alternator if we need to say run a washing machine / dishwasher / pre heater 2k for are hot water into are combi boiler when we get round to doing it """"

Sorry I'm still confused

Where/how are you powering the 1/4 hp motor from ? that you want the pulley to fit
The national grid? or from your batterys?
Whats the advantage of powering the motor from the grid? over just using a battery charger to top up the batterys.
as i said earlier how are you going to get your motor to spin a generator 16 times bigger than the motors power?

Ian


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## woodfarmer (17 Jul 2014)

flh801978":3u48sbf1 said:


> Slightly off topic but how are you going to spin a 3000 watt generator with a 187.5 watt motor?
> 
> or have I got hold of the wrong end of the stick
> 
> Ian



You beat me to it


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## JonnBoy (17 Jul 2014)

woodfarmer":32yox1wx said:


> flh801978":32yox1wx said:
> 
> 
> > Slightly off topic but how are you going to spin a 3000 watt generator with a 187.5 watt motor?
> ...



we will get there in the end 

12V power inverter converts 12v DC to 240v AC from a battery bank


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## JonnBoy (17 Jul 2014)

JonnBoy":1mj6uo5r said:


> flh801978":1mj6uo5r said:
> 
> 
> > Slightly off topic but how are you going to spin a 3000 watt generator with a 187.5 watt motor?
> ...



Hope this will help 

it's a Power Inverter 12V DC that converts to 240V AC 3Kw max runs from a battery bank for night time use


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## flh801978 (17 Jul 2014)

I understand inverters and all but why are you connecting a weedy little motor to attempt to generate a 16 fold increase in power ?

Or are you attempting to get something for nothing ?


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## JonnBoy (17 Jul 2014)

flh801978":tf0jei23 said:


> I understand inverters and all but why are you connecting a weedy little motor to attempt to generate a 16 fold increase in power ?
> 
> Or are you attempting to get something for nothing ?



the motor will be run from the mains it is not going to be running all the time it will be on a timer at night plus an over ride at night when needed in the winter 
during the day when it all swaps over to solar power which is working very well the motor will not be used but i will have topped up the bank at night so the charger i have for the day will not have to be on so long and eat even more AC power than the motor so it will work out cheaper 

we have had it all working but used a DC motor just to see if it all worked but it just ate the second battery we had 

so the simple 2 pole motor will spin at around 2900 rpm will be more than enough to run a simple car alternator i only need around 1500rpm and it will work fine it is not like a normal car alternator this one put out more regulated amps at a slower rpm 

sorry Mods for going off topic on this site 

just need to marry wheel to motor will get there


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## seaco (18 Jul 2014)

Sent you a PM...


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## flh801978 (18 Jul 2014)

So just to get this straight

you are powering a ac motor from the mains/national grid? to convert good electricity into mechanical energy ( with all its attendant losses )
Then via a belt drive ( with all its attendant losses )
To drive a alternator/generator ( with huge losses )
To charge a battery?

then convert the dc from your battery back to ac 240 ( with huge losses) to run whatever you want?

this is besides the fact that you seem to think that driving a 4 hp generator with a 1/4 hp motor is going to work

Ian


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## JonnBoy (18 Jul 2014)

flh801978":2vp9399h said:


> So just to get this straight
> 
> you are powering a ac motor from the mains/national grid? to convert good electricity into mechanical energy ( with all its attendant losses )
> Then via a belt drive ( with all its attendant losses )
> ...



Ian not a battery that would be crazy

where are you getting this from 4 hp generator


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## flh801978 (18 Jul 2014)

well then to drive your high load stuff washing machine using your battery bank as a floating supply/smoother

you said you were driving a 3000 w generator from a 1/4hp motor ( 3000watts is about 4 hp )


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## JonnBoy (18 Jul 2014)

flh801978":10dctm38 said:


> well then to drive your high load stuff washing machine using your battery bank as a floating supply/smoother
> 
> you said you were driving a 3000 w generator from a 1/4hp motor ( 3000watts is about 4 hp )



a power inverter not a generator i do not have a generator

looks a bit like this http://thumbs1.ebaystatic.com/d/l225/m/ ... 15LBuw.jpg


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## Chrispy (18 Jul 2014)

Sounds like the op has invented the mythical perpetual motion here, (in two ways) going round in ever decreasing circles.


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## flh801978 (18 Jul 2014)

John boy whats the alternator if not a generator?

and the picture you have linked to is an alternator not an inverter in the accepted use of the word


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## JonnBoy (18 Jul 2014)

flh801978":1i9efpao said:


> John boy whats the alternator if not a generator?
> 
> and the picture you have linked to is an alternator not an inverter in the accepted use of the word



the photo is what the motor is going to spin 

my battery bank is big and is more than capable to run the Power inverter 

all the alternator is going to do is top up the batteries at night if i need to put them under load as it is all regulated will never need the 215amps at one time it is not a normal alternator you find theses on ice cream vans or major in car hi fi installs 

bit like this but my battery bank it a lot bigger
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FmCHU5x-oPo this is major over kill 
i only need one 

this is a photo of a 3Kw built in charger http://www.amazon.co.uk/Power-Inverter- ... B009NEY6R2
it is a bit like this one i have for night time use has been working very well 
i think we have are wires crossed along the way


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## flh801978 (18 Jul 2014)

I'm still failing to see what you are trying to do

You have a small 1/4 hp motor which will run on mains electricity ( which you are paying for)?
You will attempt to drive the alternator with this to generate electricity to run a washing machine or heavy load when theres no sunshine ?

why not use the electricity ( from the mains ) to run the load far more efficiently than going through motors and belts and converters?

If you want to get 215 amps @12v out of the alternator you need to put in ,in excess of 14.5 amps @240v to a motor to turn the alternator ( with your attendant losses )


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## JonnBoy (18 Jul 2014)

flh801978":2vpi62f3 said:


> I'm still failing to see what you are trying to do
> 
> You have a small 1/4 hp motor which will run on mains electricity ( which you are paying for)?
> You will attempt to drive the alternator with this to generate electricity to run a washing machine or heavy load when theres no sunshine ?
> ...



you are still missing the point i have a large battery bank that works fine 
this is just an add on 
all i have stated it is a regulated 215amp alternator when it is used does not mean i will need this amount of amps maybe 50 60 or 70 + it will there when i need it so my 185w motor will be cheaper to run than the washing machine for 30mins or more 

you will be glad that i will have my spacer soon with thanks to the members of this site and would like to thank the posting of the web sites have ordered other bits that could not find some collar rings 

it's 19.37pm now and have only used 39p on electric for the hole day not bad all white goods have been used supplemented from my Grid inverter sun will drop out inverter just after 9pm then 9.30pm we swap to 12v sine wave inverter and it all starts again not bad for DIY self build 

i did ask the Mrs how about a 12v camping kettle that did not go down to well (hammer) (hammer)


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## JonnBoy (19 Jul 2014)

JonnBoy":rw9rysns said:


> flh801978":rw9rysns said:
> 
> 
> > I'm still failing to see what you are trying to do
> ...



this is a basic view how the solar works during the day 

http://www.sa12energyservices.co.uk/ima ... -large.jpg

this shows how my system works but i use the solar panels to run the grid inverter which runs the charger during the day

http://www.mother-earth-solar.com/image ... system.jpg

the alternator is only a top up to the battery bank hope this will help what i have done at home 

met one of the forum members today thank you so much for your help 

will try and get the alternator running soon


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## JonnBoy (22 Jul 2014)

Chrispy":11vlt6gu said:


> Sounds like the op has invented the mythical perpetual motion here, (in two ways) going round in ever decreasing circles.



motor and extra battery bank to fit up arrives in 2 days 

then join it all up and see what i get


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## JonnBoy (1 Aug 2014)

JonnBoy":nxdhzbml said:


> Chrispy":nxdhzbml said:
> 
> 
> > Sounds like the op has invented the mythical perpetual motion here, (in two ways) going round in ever decreasing circles.
> ...




motor her have gone for 1/3hp @250w my machined part is fitted wheel is very tight and spins very true need to get a new drive belt as the one i have was in a box and now has a slight kink in it just got one from ebay £3.49 posted 

but have had it running around 3200rmp with no struggle at all even with the exciter wire connected to make the magnetic field work plenty of power to drive will find some time hope over the week end to get the motor bolted down 

many thank's to the members of this site for all your help and making my part for me 

i will try when all running to post a vid on youtube so you can see what i have done having the extra 2 x 125a battery's extra i have now 750amp i will increase 1000amp near winter

regards John


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