# Hubble, bubble, more lathe trouble!!!



## Bodrighy (3 May 2007)

My Perform CCL has decided that it wants to enter the Grand Prix and I can only get top speed and 2nd top. I can't move the handle any further. I have opened it up as far as I dare not having much mechanical knowledge and can see nothing obviously wrong, not too much dust, belt looks sound and is still tight. I haven't played around inside at all and haven't been doing any real big stuf. Simply can't move the handle to the 8 slower speeds. 
Before I ring Axminster (only got it in January) does anyone have any ideas?

Pete


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## CHJ (3 May 2007)

How long is it since you sprayed the top pulley shaft with a dry PTFE lubricant?
How long is it since you greased the motor pulley via the motor shaft grease point?

Sounds if one or the other pulley is binding on its shaft.

To remove the belt so that you can check movement you need to open up the motor pulley, BUT WHATEVER YOU DO, DO NOT TRY TO PRY IT APART WITH A SCREWDRIVER OR SUCH, you may shatter the pulley flanges.

Best bet would be to remove the Circlip and spring from the motor shaft, not a difficult task, but if you do not have mechanical experience it will be a slight learning curve.

Might be worth giving both shaft-pulley interfaces a squirt of WD40 and let it soak in then try. If belt gets to oily wipe it down with meths or similar.

Don't spray WD40 at the headstock bearings, may wash out grease.

Another point to check, make sure the inner Motor pulley half is secure on the shaft, if the grub srew has loosened it may have opened up (moved towards the motor) if this is the case the belt may be on the shaft not up in the vee groove.


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## Intarsiaplans (3 May 2007)

I had and still have the same problems with my ccbl lathe and have to lubricate it once in a while with wd40...be carefull not to spray the belt and such cause than it will spin round and before the lathe works properly again.... and give it a good blow with some canned air or something to get rid of the dust.

Danny


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## Bodrighy (3 May 2007)

CHJ":14g6kmok said:


> How long is it since you sprayed the top pulley shaft with a dry PTFE lubricant?
> How long is it since you greased the motor pulley via the motor shaft grease point?
> 
> Sounds if one or the other pulley is binding on its shaft.
> ...



Thinking about it, the handle did seem to get more dificult to pull down to the slower speed before it stuck which would indicate lack of lubricant. As far as lubricating goes, I read the manual when I got it and it said to lubricate it every coup;le of months so I haven't yet. Better get some fast. It will certainly be a learning curve, last thing with a spring that I took apart was a biro and I lost the spring.

I am not totally useless however, I used to run a series 2 Landrover and I had the engine apart a few times so I guess I could do this. 

Thanks Chas. Keep this and I am going to get a bill from you for consultancy fees :lol: 

Pete


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## CHJ (3 May 2007)

If you can pull an engine apart then the odd circlip and spring compression to get it back on should not be a problem if it comes to it,

Try the wd40 squirt in the mean time to see if it frees up.

The dry PTFE spray recommended in the manual (grand name isn't it) is quite good for lubricating without the mess of black oil spray around the place, worth the expenditure in the long run for other tasks as well as the lathe.


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## Paul.J (3 May 2007)

Pete.
I thought i noticed mine playing up today with the speeds,but wasn't too sure.Something i'll keep an eye on.
Keep us posted.
Good luck with yours.
Paul.J.


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## Bodrighy (4 May 2007)

Hi Paul, 
Symptoms were a gradual difficulty in moving the speed control back to slow speed. It was so gradual I didn't notice it at first and then when I did it was too late. Hopefully it is simply a matter of lubricating it. Have just ordered PTFE Dry as per the guru's (Chas) advice and will let you know if it works. A bit hairy starting the thing up at full speed! [-o< 

Pete


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## Bodrighy (7 May 2007)

********or words to that effect :x 

Got the PTFE from Axminster and now the lathe sounds much smoother but the speed is stuck at fast and the lever jumps feeling the same as one of the tightening screws on the banjo...like the spindle or whatever is burred. I'll have to either strip it down and have a look or give Axminster a ring. Don't know if I am just unlucky or have done something stupid tho' I can't think what.

Pete


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## TEP (7 May 2007)

Sorry to hear about your problem with the lathe Pete, but as it is still under warranty give it to Axminster. In my experience they have always been very good at sorting any after sales/warranty problems. It just means you will be without a lathe for a bit.

Good luck!


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## PowerTool (7 May 2007)

Have no idea if this is possible,but when giving my lathe it's monthly service,I did notice the top pulley is on a keyway - in top speed,the pulley will be at the furthest end of it ; could it have slipped off the keyway ?

Andrew


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## CHJ (7 May 2007)

Pete, if the operating handle is moving to the left without moving the cone pulley then it sounds like the lever shaft is turning in the forked lever that moves the pulley, I do not know the exact manufacturing details of the joint but I would say that it may just be a grub screw that has come adrift (need to take head off machine and look from underneath) worst case could be that the fork casting has cracked.

As has been recommended though, first stop axminster customer services, if it is a known occurence they will sort it pdq.

PS to avoid excessive loads on the lever/operating fork WHEN REDUCING SPEEDS the lathe shaft should always be rotated by hand when moving if motor not running. (the cone can't move without the belt being in motion)


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## Paul.J (7 May 2007)

Pete.
Do you pull the lever out and move it till it clicks,engages back in,and then push the lever back in too.
Paul.J.


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## Bodrighy (7 May 2007)

Paul: I used to but as it no longer wants to move in a normal fashion that doesn't apply. I still have to pull the handle out o disengage the pin but after that zilch.

Chas: The handle wouldn't move at all at first form the fast speed position. Now it moves but in a clunky way. I have never tried to move it unles the motor is swithched (read that bit in the manual) but have run it with the guard off (no wood on it of course) and the pulleys don't move at all. Axminster here I come!! 

Thanks for all your advice. What makes it really annoying is that I have just collected a load of wood beachcombing. 

pete


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## Russell (8 May 2007)

Possible reason for this problem. The speed adjustment leaver has teeth on either these have worn and no longer engaged on the shaft moving the pulley or there is a grub screw that locks the moving shaft (bottom one I think) to the pulley assembly has come loose however this allows the shaft to crash into the pulleys.

You can check the first easily by removing the speed handle ( note its position and check the teeth are engaging.

I suggest removing the circlip and spring from the top pulley and striping the unit down for a service to make sure the pulleys move and have not just gone stiff on the shaft.


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## Bodrighy (8 May 2007)

Russell":31fbhzxt said:


> Possible reason for this problem. The speed adjustment leaver has teeth on either these have worn and no longer engaged on the shaft moving the pulley or there is a grub screw that locks the moving shaft (bottom one I think) to the pulley assembly has come loose however this allows the shaft to crash into the pulleys.
> 
> You can check the first easily by removing the speed handle ( note its position and check the teeth are engaging.
> 
> I suggest removing the circlip and spring from the top pulley and striping the unit down for a service to make sure the pulleys move and have not just gone stiff on the shaft.



Hi Russell, thnks for your input. I have gone as far as removing the handle and the locating disc behind it. This seems all OK so I am guessing that the teeth have gone. I have to get circlip pliers before going any further and in the meantime have e-mailed Axminster to get their advice. I suspect it is some kind of wear inside. If the build is anything like that on the banjo handles this is likely. I'll keep you all posted as to the results of all this as I know there are others who have a CCL and it might be useful to be warned. 

Pete


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## bwlossie (8 May 2007)

Hi Pete,
I bought a Perform round about the same time as you.
I bought a small grease gun and packet of red liquid grease from Axminster. After I had had the lathe for about a month I took off the cover to the grease the shaft.
I noticed that when the cover was off the two grub screw in the pulley/shaft were slightly loose. I tightened these up, the screw going in about 2/3 turns.
I have not had the same problem as you but it may be an idea to check these grub screws.
Barry.


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## Paul.J (8 May 2007)

*Paul.J. wrote*
The two grub screws on the drive shaft were loose(piccy3),so these were tightened. 

*bwloosie wrote*
I noticed that when the cover was off the two grub screw in the pulley/shaft were slightly loose. 

Barry.I have put this on my post earlier.Perhaps they are all the same. :?: 
Anyone else had this problem.
Needless to say i have since checked evreything else.I think :? 
Paul.J.


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## bwlossie (9 May 2007)

Hi Paul,
By the looks of your picture [3] Yes they are the same screws.
It would seem this is a common problem with the Perform. Other than this though I am quite satisfied with it now I have overcome the banjo problem.
Barry.


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## Bodrighy (9 May 2007)

Well I have dry greased the shafts, and after reccomendation from Axminster carefully squirted some WD40 onto the bearings. I have also checked all the grub screws and tightened 2 that were a bit loose. Result? My lathe whispers, runs really smoothly, better than original.....  
all at top speed. Now the speed control moves freely from full speed to slow but the pulleys remain in position. Definitely reckon something is broken inside. 
Back to Axminster. ](*,) 

Probably shouldn't but can turn small stuff though I am standing well out of target area when switching on. Limiting myself to one small piece per night.

Pete


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## CHJ (9 May 2007)

Bodrighy":2xaiqtt1 said:


> ...snip.. Result? My lathe whispers, runs really smoothly, better than original.....
> ...snip..
> Pete



Well they say it is an ill wind that...

Joking apart Pete, despite having to go through the frustration of having to fix a broken part that is so basic to the operation that it should not have failed even on a machine built to a lower finish standard, the fact that you have been through this learning curve and have a sweeter running headstock is a positive. 
Hope the fix does not mean that you have to trade in the sweeter running assembly and can get replacement parts fitted.


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## Bodrighy (9 May 2007)

CHJ":3kc1yb2m said:


> Bodrighy":3kc1yb2m said:
> 
> 
> > ...snip.. Result? My lathe whispers, runs really smoothly, better than original.....
> ...



If it does you can bet that I will be opening it up, checking everything and lubricating anything that moves, or should move, before I use it :lol: 
For years, due to finances and a huge family, I ran old Landrovers that I often had to sort out at the roadside so frustration is something that I have learnt to live with. My main concern is that suddenly I have been asked to run a stall at three different places in the next couple of months and need to build up some stock for them. I have a good supply of wood in so hope that this will get sorted quickly

Pete


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## Russell (9 May 2007)

When you move the speed control check and see if the push rod moves and is sliding through the casting connected to the pully. If that moves a locking pin has come out they are a pig to relocate. If it doesn't move the push rod needs replacing or the speed conrol arm needs replacing or both depending on wear.


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## Paul.J (10 May 2007)

Pete.
Were the 2 grub screws the ones on the drive shaft,the one in piccy 3 on my post.
If so have the 2 flanges moved away from the motor.I've got about an 1/8" gap between my flange and the motor.
Difficult to see the speed lever operating :roll: Though there are 2 more grub screws their as well.
Paul.J.


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## Bodrighy (11 May 2007)

Next stage in the dead lathe saga....


Just spoke to John Fowler at Axminster. reckons that cogs and / or yoke inside have stripped and is going to send up replacements on spec. Siad to open it up off the lathe and have a look.
That failing it will be a tip to Axminster fo me..

Pete


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## Paul.J (11 May 2007)

*Bodrighy wrote*
reckons that cogs and / or yoke inside have stripped 
Did he say how this has happened on a relatively new machine,or is it a common fault with the machine.
Paul.J.


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## Russell (11 May 2007)

They strip because it gets stiff to change the speed and the metal is soft or someone tried to adjust the speed with the lathe switched off.


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## CHJ (11 May 2007)

I think Russell has hit the spot, hence my warning on a previous reply.


CHJ":3fiqi4nw said:


> PS to avoid excessive loads on the lever/operating fork WHEN REDUCING SPEEDS the lathe shaft should always be rotated by hand when moving if motor not running. (the cone can't move without the belt being in motion)



If you look through past posts of mine on the subject of the performs or any other brand of these Vee Pulley Clones, you will find comments about the need to service the headstock on a regular basis to keep it sweet, with my use this turned out to be at about 1 month intervals others may not need to do it so often.

Pete, I note you said that you always adjusted with machine running, in this case I can only conclude that the headstock pulley/shaft interface may not have been sufficiently lubricated in the first instance, I know it can creep up on you without being obvious.

Hope your spares sort it.


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## Bodrighy (11 May 2007)

I suspect that it has happened because it hasn't been lubricated enough by me. As fa as I can make out it isn't a common fault as long as good maintenance is done. Here I stand guilty as charged. Using a lot of reclaimed old wood there is a lot of dust generated and I suspect that I will need to lubricate and clean moe frequently. 

When I open it up I'll take some pictures if it is of any use to you 

Pete


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## CHJ (11 May 2007)

Pete, there go we all but for the grace of whoever, it is good of you to air the saga and hopefully the resultant suggestions and solutions will aid others at some future date resolve their little niggles.

Been thinking about trying to put together a FAQ/Machine/Tool problem and associated solution links page so that all these little snippets don't disappear into the ether, I am having difficulty with a simple format though, I think i'll wait and see how much of an improvement the incorporation of the Google search makes, which I believe Charley is incorporating in the new site layout, before spending too much time on it.


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## Paul.J (11 May 2007)

Bodrighy wrote.
I suspect that it has happened because it hasn't been lubricated enough by me.
Surely lack of lube wouldn't cause that amount of damage on a new machine :?: would it. :shock: 
Paul.J.


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## Bodrighy (11 May 2007)

I suspect that Russells comment about the metal being soft has something to do with it. It did get a bit stiff before it went all together. Being 6' 5"I get a lot of leverage and could have inadvertantly forced it. I have never tried to change speed unless it was running but if, due to lack of lube, it was getting stuck I guess I could have forced it. I will know better when I open it up tomorrow. Axminster are sending up the bits they think are causing the problem and if that isn't it I have to get back to them. They said there is no problem doing my own maintenance (warranty) as long as there are no signs of me using a hammer.

Pete


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## Paul.J (12 May 2007)

*Bodrighy wrote*
When I open it up I'll take some pictures if it is of any use to you
Yes Pete that will be useful  
Paul.J.


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