# flattening the sole of a bench plane



## Anonymous (1 Mar 2005)

i have gone through 3 sheets of 240grit wet and dry trying to flatten the sole of my bench plane and i don't seem to be much further forward can anyone give me some advice on how to speed up the initial flattening.

Cheers,
Derek.


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## Midnight (1 Mar 2005)

derek...

short answer is to get more aggressive with the grit..
Back when I flattened mine, I started with 60, 80 and 120 grit sanding belts slit open and glued to an offcut of kitchen worktop. Mark a cross hatch grid in felt tip all over the sole of the plane and work the sole over the 60 grit till the cross hatching's gone. Re-mark the sole and repeat on the 80 grit; be warned that it's gonna take no time at all now. Re-mark one last time and repeat the buffing on the 120 grit.. 

Remember to keep the blade fitted and cap iron at working tension, but retract the blade as far back as needed to ensure it doesn't get buffed away too...

Stop every half dozen strokes to brush or vac the swarf out of the paper. Given that corrugated sole planes work like a charm, I didn't se much point in taking the grits past 120; if nothing else it gave the candle wax something to key into....

Have fun.....


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## GaryD (1 Mar 2005)

Hi Derek,

Last time I dressed one of my planes I think I used my water stone I then finished off with wet and dry.
Make sure your oil or water stone is dead flat if not dress before use


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## Anonymous (2 Mar 2005)

Midnight":3eh5aiup said:


> Remember to keep the blade fitted and cap iron at working tension, but retract the blade as far back as needed to ensure it doesn't get buffed away too...



Why do you need to leave the blade in place, sorry for my ignorance.

Cheers,
Derek.


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## Anonymous (2 Mar 2005)

derek681":2zbfw4eq said:


> Midnight":2zbfw4eq said:
> 
> 
> > Remember to keep the blade fitted and cap iron at working tension, but retract the blade as far back as needed to ensure it doesn't get buffed away too...
> ...



So that the plane sole is trued under the conditions it will be in when in use. The tension from the lever cap can impart a small flex to the plane, so if you true the sole with it not there, when you re-assemble the imparted flex will affect the flatness of the sole.

That said, I've never seen any studies that show how MUCH flex there is; it may (probably?) be not enough to make a difference, but that's the theory, anyway.


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## Philly (2 Mar 2005)

Derek
Dont know whether you have it but David Charlesworths first book has loads on flattening plane soles. Sort of the difinitive book for me.
Hope this helps
Philly


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## Anonymous (2 Mar 2005)

Derek

Exactly as Mike (midnight) said. I start with 80 grit until is it dead flat and then move towards 240 to polish out the scratches


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## CHJ (2 Mar 2005)

Tony":1i4zscnm said:


> Derek
> 
> Exactly as Mike (midnight) said. I start with 80 grit until is it dead flat and then move towards 240 to polish out the scratches



What!! No Granite Surface Table, Engineers blue and a Scraper. Shame on you. :twisted: Modern Engineers :roll:


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## ike (2 Mar 2005)

I took a large flat Second file to mine - worked a dream.


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## Derek Cohen (Perth Oz) (2 Mar 2005)

Hi Derek 

In addition to beginning with 60/80 grit (and working your way upward to at least 360/400 grit), you may want to consider getting a l-o-n-g piece of float glass. Mine is 10mm thick by 1 metre long. This makes very fast work of the lapping since each stroke is three times your average lapping surface. 

Here is mine (example at the beginning of a restoration):

http://www.wdynamic.com/galoots/4images/details.php?image_id=1149

Be careful when you lap a sole that you do not rock it or lift it at either end. Press down firmly and evenly.

Regards from Perth

Derek (another one)


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## Anonymous (2 Mar 2005)

CHJ":8t3ky75u said:


> Tony":8t3ky75u said:
> 
> 
> > Derek
> ...



:lol: :lol: :lol: :lol: 

Did I mention that the sandpaper is clamped to a surface plate? :wink:


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## Chris Knight (2 Mar 2005)

Plainly the use of float glass introduces an error. It is always curved with a radius of approximately 4000 miles. That is why I do indeed prefer a granite surface plate and scrapers.

PS. That blasted blue stuff gets everywhere. Plan on having at least a box full of latex gloves per plane.


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## Philly (2 Mar 2005)

Lol Chris :lol: 
You always were a stickler for detail!
I must admit that a 4000 mile radius is fine for woodworking......although maybe not for metalwork :roll: 
Cheers
Close Enough Philly


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## jasonB (2 Mar 2005)

Which way up should the curve be for best results :?: :lol: 

Jason


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## Chris Knight (2 Mar 2005)

jasonB":2divg1hm said:


> Which way up should the curve be for best results



Concave side up Jason. That way you get a nice gentle camber automatically!


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## Midnight (2 Mar 2005)

> What!! No Granite Surface Table, Engineers blue and a Scraper. Shame on you. Modern Engineers



Didn't I mention these were modern Stanley planes..? sorry.. meant to.. bottom line being that even if I'd lapped to 12,000 grit... they'd still have their limitations..

I learned my lesson... cut my losses... never had to worry about it since...


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## CHJ (2 Mar 2005)

Midnight":1ne9lo1w said:


> Didn't I mention these were modern Stanley planes..?
> 
> I learned my lesson... cut my losses... never had to worry about it since...



Tuché


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## Anonymous (3 Mar 2005)

I've never found flattening a plane sole to be a difficult or long winded process. 
Here is an old article I wrote about it. I have since made some changes in my methods that makes this chore even easier. I'll write it up one of these days but this article gives the basis of quickly flattening a plane.


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## aldel (3 Mar 2005)

Just a note to say that when using abrasive paper on a granite /float glass surface I use a 50/50 mix of car window wash fluid and water as a lubricant. This enables the grit to cut better without clogging and speeds up the entire process.

Cheers Aldel


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## dickm (5 Mar 2005)

It's probably cheating, but for initial flatting of a damaged/repaired early Bailey plane, I used my belt sander in inverted mode. A bit vicious, but quick!


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## J.A.S (24 Mar 2005)

Derek,

I hope you'll forgive me if this is a hijack.

In Hack's _The Handplane Book_, and elsewhere, I've seen it suggested that, while lapping, the plane should not be held by knob and tote, but around the frog area. Is this what the rest of you do? 

I just wondered if, while lapping the sole, it might be better to hold the plane as one normally would, in order to make it flat in the same conditions that it would be used.

Jeremy


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## Frank D. (25 Mar 2005)

Hi Jeremy,
It's a good idea to hold a plane near the frog when you flatten a sole. You shouldn't be looking to reacreate the same conditions as when you plane because planing wood and flattening the sole are completely different operations. If you hold the plane by the handles while flattening the sole you will exert more pressure on the front and the back which will cause the sole to rock and be convex along the length. What turns out to be an advantage while planing definitely can turn out to be catastrophic while flattening, because in one operation you're taking off wood under the sole; in the other you're taking off the sole.
HTH,
Frank


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## J.A.S (25 Mar 2005)

Thanks, Frank! 

You've soled me :roll: .

The query only came into my head while looking at Dunbar's _Restoring, Tuning and Using Classic Woodworking Tools_. In one photo, he's lapping a plane sole, while holding the plane by tote and knob.

Jeremy


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## Anonymous (25 Mar 2005)

This brings up the interesting point of static vs. dynamic. The methods used to check a plane sole (reference plate or straight edge) have the plane static with no external force applied. A plane in use has many dynamic forces applied. 
Jeff Gorman has shown a metal plane can deflect with a moderate amount of downforce. His tests didn't consider the dynamic forces of a plane in action which would be much greater (that's why we need heavy benches!). Too, the wood we plane has irregularities of more than .0015" or we wouldn't be planing it :wink: . 
The conclusion I reached from this is that the act of planing forces the plane to try to conform to the surface being planed. Ergo that sole that checked out superflat with a straightedge is not that way during the planing process until the planed surface itself approaches the same level of flatness.


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## Philly (26 Mar 2005)

Roger
I agree with you-you only have to vary the amount of pressure whilst planing to see the difference. I am sure this has a big effect on the performance of the plane.
You watch DC planing in his second vid-He doesn't just effortlessly slide the plane over the wood, there is some serious, calculated pressure being applied. Obviously technique is a big part of planing and has a large effect on the final surface quality.
Just my thoughts,
Philly


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## Alf (26 Mar 2005)

Philly":jniacd86 said:


> You watch DC planing in his second vid-He doesn't just effortlessly slide the plane over the wood, there is some serious, calculated pressure being applied.


And it's not being applied to the front knob either... :-k 

Cheers, Alf


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## bugbear (29 Mar 2005)

I suppose I'd better say...

I think this is the most accurate and fastest way to flatten a sole.

http://www.geocities.com/plybench/flatten.html


BugBear (who's sure Alf's been expecting this)


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## Alf (29 Mar 2005)

bugbear":9yi6couw said:


> BugBear (who's sure Alf's been expecting this)


Who, me? Not at all... :^o :wink:

Cheers, Alf


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## Philly (29 Mar 2005)

Hmm
Interesting stuff. So lapping by hand gives you a slightly convex sole (didn't DC say this is better than concave??). But by how much?
And how much would it cost to take your plane to a machine show and have them mill the sole flat? Anybody done this?
I see on the Dick website that they offer a similar service.
It all comes down to your reference surface, though. Float glass may be flat but you sit it on an uneven surface and is it still flat?? Any suggestions? In BB's link the Guy mentioned he put the glass on a thin rubber mat-doesn't that defeat the object?
If you can get 1 thou shavings is your plane "flat" enough?
Cheers
Questioning Philly :-k


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## mudman (29 Mar 2005)

Philly":21globdd said:


> Hmm
> Interesting stuff. So lapping by hand gives you a slightly convex sole (didn't DC say this is better than concave??).


Convex would be bad as you are effectively shortening the length of the sole. However, a slight concavity would not be too bad as the toe and heel still retain contact. The effect in this situation is to limit the ability to produce those gossamer-like shavings to the amount that the sole deviates from flat at the mouth. So if this is 1 thou, then you can still get the 1 thou shaving. Of course if it is too conves, then this will limit the planes ability to press the wood fibres down ahead of the blade and you won't get a very nice finish. I seem to remember reading that it doesn't have to be completely flat, but must contact the wood at toe and heel with a slight bump infront of the mouth to ensure contact here as well.


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## Jake (29 Mar 2005)

I was imagining the convexity/concavity being side to side not front to back.


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## Anonymous (29 Mar 2005)

Philly":dy829zyx said:


> And how much would it cost to take your plane to a machine show and have them mill the sole flat? Anybody done this?
> 
> Any suggestions?
> 
> ...



Ok

Milling won't give a particularly good surface and I would recommend surface grinding by a local engineering shop if you don't want to flatten it yourself. I have had this done at work on some very distorted chisels and it worked very well. I would expect to pay around a tenner in a machine shop

My suggestion would be to buy LN or Clifton as all that I have bought came perfectly flat :wink: 

Or, veritas - mine (3) all needed a little work and were lovely and flat after 5 minutes on wet 'n' dry.

I would say that 1 thou shavings are pretty thick and you should be ashamed of yourself #-o Get into the workshop and flatten the soles of those planes :lol: 


In my experience, using 80 grit wet 'n' dry followed by 120 grit (lube with oil or washing up liquid/water 1/10) gives a flattened sole in 10-15 minutes max. provided the sole is not too bad to start off with.
When I worked on the #6 and #7, I used a linisher (like an upside down belt sander) to get it pretty close and then 80 followed by 120


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## bugbear (29 Mar 2005)

> Float glass may be flat but you sit it on an uneven surface and is it still flat?? Any suggestions? In BB's link the Guy mentioned he put the glass on a thin rubber mat-doesn't that defeat the object?



This is normal - you want the glass to be your reference, not the surface it's on. You therefore try to support the glass uniformly. Since you don't have a flat rigid surface (that's why you're using the glass) you use a conformant surface. It won't support the glass 100% uniformly, but it ain't bad.

BugBear


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