# What is this joint called?



## Richard Berry (5 Oct 2021)

When I was designing my workbench I came up with a simple joint to connect the stretchers to the leg.

The long stretcher attaches to the inner face of the leg using a dovetail. The short stretcher captures the dovetail joint with a mortice and tenon. I draw bored it, but it could also be wedged or left simple. 

Does anyone know the name for this type of joint? It is really solid and resists racking exceptionally well.


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## gregmcateer (5 Oct 2021)

Nifty?
Sorry, hat, coat


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## Wildman (5 Oct 2021)

a dovetenon thingy?


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## Richard Berry (5 Oct 2021)

I was sort of expecting this type of reply. 

If I were to name it I would call it a mortice and tenon captured lapped halving dovetail.


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## dzj (5 Oct 2021)

Looks like some kind of Jappanese joinery. There's this fellow on Youtube that has done many how-to
videos on this subject. I think his name is Bracht or similar. Maybe if you send him this photo he might know.
HTH


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## Richard Berry (5 Oct 2021)

dzj said:


> Looks like some kind of Jappanese joinery. There's this fellow on Youtube that has done many how-to
> videos on this subject. I think his name is Bracht or similar. Maybe if you send him this photo he might know.
> HTH


Good idea. Dorian Bracht is the name that springs to mind. I subscribe to his channel and do enjoy the content. Thanks for the suggestion.


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## Sandyn (5 Oct 2021)

It's one of those Origami joints, very clever!!


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## Southdownswolf (5 Oct 2021)

This is like a dog that is a mixture of breeds - cocker spaniel and poodle - cockerpoo. Or a mongrel...

You have a mongrel joint. 



(Said with tongue firmly in cheek)


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## hlvd (6 Oct 2021)

The problem with that is you need to take the four complete frames apart should you want to dissemble your bench. With the traditional way both end frames can be glued up, leaving only the stretchers to be removable.


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## JAW911 (6 Oct 2021)

It is Ari Otishi. 
Half-lapped, half-blind dovetail with through mortise and tenon joint.


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## JAW911 (6 Oct 2021)

Sorry typo…..OTOSHI


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## MorrisWoodman12 (6 Oct 2021)

Southdownswolf said:


> You have a mongrel joint.


Is that not quite cannabis?


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## Woody2Shoes (6 Oct 2021)

JAW911 said:


> It is Ari Otishi.
> Half-lapped, half-blind dovetail with through mortise and tenon joint.


Well spotted! Ari Otoshi is what it looks like:



Cabin Building Plans





https://cabinbuildingplans.com/assets/images/otoshi.png


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## Derekspr (6 Oct 2021)

Richard Berry said:


> When I was designing my workbench I came up with a simple joint to connect the stretchers to the leg.
> 
> The long stretcher attaches to the inner face of the leg using a dovetail. The short stretcher captures the dovetail joint with a mortice and tenon. I draw bored it, but it could also be wedged or left simple.
> 
> Does anyone know the name for this type of joint? It is really solid and resists racking exceptionally well.


Fascinating what we can all come up with. I had to match a 1920's art deco oak piece of furniture and got carried away with running dovetails and double tennons (back dowelled) just to keep the look that kept the face at 1 inch width and you cannot see the joints. The doors had to match hand carved linen fold panels, so its all been fun. Just the drawers to finish off this week. Retirement is great.


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## Trainee neophyte (6 Oct 2021)

Southdownswolf said:


> You have a mongrel joint.


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## Richard Berry (7 Oct 2021)

JAW911 said:


> It is Ari Otishi.
> Half-lapped, half-blind dovetail with through mortise and tenon joint.


Thanks for the info. I am always amazed at the depth of knowledge on this forum.


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## Richard Berry (7 Oct 2021)

Woody2Shoes said:


> Well spotted! Ari Otoshi is what it looks like:
> 
> 
> 
> ...



Thanks for the link. Ari Otoshi is not the easiest joint name to remember.


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## Woody2Shoes (10 Oct 2021)

By a spooky co-incidence, this joint is featured in the current issue (#292) of Fine Woodworking ("Japanese joinery in practice"). I think that the peg is an 'extra' to the basic joint geometry. Apparently, it is/was common in joints to the sole plate of buildings, where the through mortice allows water to drain out at the bottom (aka 'defensive detailing').
There is also a version, for use at the corner of a room/building where only half the dovetail is cut (to keep strength and adequate endgrain at the corner).
I'd post a snapshot but I think its copyrighted material and I might not be wise to do that.


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## John Brown (10 Oct 2021)

Looks like showing off to me...


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## Derekspr (19 Oct 2021)

Derekspr said:


> Fascinating what we can all come up with. I had to match a 1920's art deco oak piece of furniture and got carried away with running dovetails and double tennons (back dowelled) just to keep the look that kept the face at 1 inch width and you cannot see the joints. The doors had to match hand carved linen fold panels, so its all been fun. Just the drawers to finish off this week. Retirement is great.View attachment 119264
> View attachment 119265
> View attachment 119266
> View attachment 119267
> View attachment 119268


Now at last completed the drawers in and the whole piece is can fulfill its function for many years to come. It’s great to be able to share listen and discuss issues with others in this forum.


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