# Long plywood kitchen cabinets



## alexnharvey (23 Dec 2022)

Hello. I would like to make my own kitchen cabinets. I want to minimise having the double vertical walls which are a consequence of the standard units and the spacers which are required where no unit will fit, effectively creating a made to measure kitchen.

I would like to use birch plywood for the units, or similar. I anticipate having the ply laminate "end grain" visible as a feature, rather than hiding it with inserts or tape. I might use melamine faced ply in places, particularly the inside bottom faces on which items rest. The doors might also be melamine or fenix ntm faced.

I am wondering if i can use 2400mm long sections to form the tops and bottoms of the units and then have the sides inserted between those, either in dados cut into the long pieces, or fixed by one of the other common methods, dowels or confirmat type screws. As I will not be creating feet for the cabinets by using full height walls I could use plastic legs to support the cabinets and attach them to the walls at the rear, but it is not out of the question to use wooden legs if these would be better.

Is there an obvious reason not to do it this way or is it a reasonable design choice?


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## Spectric (23 Dec 2022)

Before starting this I would read some books on the subject and get a bigger picture of different approaches so you can work towards something you want. For me you can initially divide kitchens into two groups, the sheet material boxes often MDF but also ply where things like euro hinges are used or my preffered style is more traditional and chunky, here you can use a panel and frame design where the ply slots into the uprights.


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## niall Y (23 Dec 2022)

HI, in principal it is as good a way as any of building a kitchen. But there are things to take into account.
If you are building long units away from the kitchen - will you be able to get them in there, afterwards?
Ply is fine for cabinets , but if you are having the edges on show, you will need a good quality board. You won't want any voids, or veneer folds, to spoil the look. Birch-ply, an ideal candidate, is both costly and in short supply, due to the embargo on trade with Russia. An alternative is Poplar-ply ,which also has nice neat edges, but is easily dented.

Plastic legs are fine for small individual units, that you can hoick off the ground and place where needed, but with a long unit that has to be slid, you are in danger of snapping the legs unless you take care

If you are applying a worktop to the cabinets after fitting, then there is no advantage to a whole ply top. A strip to the front only, will be fine. This will also give a cost and weight saving


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## Agent_zed (23 Dec 2022)

If you watch any of the American renovation shows they seem to make all their custom cabinets out of plywood and from what I can see they are often pocket screwed together. They then spray paint in situ.

Can't see any reason not to do what you are thinking.


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## alexnharvey (23 Dec 2022)

Thank you all. @Spectric I am leaning towards euro style where the doors and drawers hide the cabinets rather than 'in frame' style. If I were to do an in-frame style I would probably cheat and use a faux frame attached to the front of the cabinets, as indeed many of the 'mid range' kitchen makers seem to use this method with mdf framing style pieces.
There are some plywood inset kitchens (e.g. plyko) which use the ply itself to create a frame for the doors, so the doors sit within the cabinet rather than closing onto it. This creates quite an interesting effect but I think my wife would prefer the seamless euro kitchen look.

@niall Y My plan would be to cut and finish the cabinet pieces in my garage, create any dados (if using) and then assemble the cabinets in situ. It is a good point that I do not need a full top piece for the cabinets if there will be a worktop, unless my wife accepts an integrated plywood with fenix/melamine top face as the worksurface. I was planning to use birch ply with cosmetically acceptable edges, although if the edges are to be hidden by the doors it is not quite so important and ply is very expensive at present. I may tot up the material cost and find I have to reconsider faced chipboard or mdf for the cabinets and prioritise the doors and drawer fronts for the fancier materials. I hadn't considered the issue of not being able to slide the plastic legs. That will need some more thought. I might bridge across the legs with some cheap material to create a kind of plinth that the cabinet would rest on.

@Agent_zed Pocket screws would be quite a good and quick method of assembly.


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## Spectric (23 Dec 2022)

One thing to bear in mind is what tools do you have, this can dictate what direction you go. I think having faceframes is more of the bespoke kitchen market but can be easier to make. As for your ply edges this is another area that you need to read about, you can use hardwood edging that hides the ends which can be fitted using any of several methods. The one I use is done on a router table using these Edge Banding Bits - Infinity Tools
but people have used biscuits or just simple tongue & grove. Now your ply has nice edges it opens up other possibilities, but you will need to cut it clean and square so a decent tracksaw would be very handy.


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## alexnharvey (23 Dec 2022)

Track saw and pocket screws is the current plan tool wise. If I can avoid dados it seems like it makes my life much easier.

Have you made your kitchen @Spectric , I saw some of your deliberations in older threads.


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## Spectric (23 Dec 2022)

Not yet, still working on other projects but aim to use a freestanding style using panel and frames which means I dont have to be extremely accurate with the ply panels and not much edging. Cost of ply has rocketed but I much prefer it over MDF as it looks like wood and is not such a filthy material to work with.


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## COWS (23 Dec 2022)

Birch ply would be my go to for kitchen carcasses. If you can build it in 2400mm sections, see no problems with that. As for elevating it off the ground, you might consider building a 150mm high plinth... like an open top box. Leave a gap to the wall to run services etc and take off the front what you require for kick space.

I perhaps wouldn't dado the partitions as dowels, biscuits, dominos with screws would be more than strong enough. As niall y says, just a strip along the front will be fine to tie the partitions together. Use a 9mm ply for the backs too. 

If you want a melamine surface for bottom/mid shelf, I'd use a high pressure laminate and contact adhesive on side you want to use before assembly. Eggar, Formica, Polyrey are all pretty good and you'll find pretty much any colour you desire from one of those.

Also if you want to match the door fronts with the laminate, do both sides.

Good luck. Kitchens are a great thing to make.

Ps.. Plan it first. you don't want to end up not being able to fit your dishwasher in or something.


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## alexnharvey (23 Dec 2022)

@COWS I hadn't considered gluing my own laminate to the ply or whatever material I use for the cabinets. I assumed that factory produced laminate faced ply would be glued at high pressure and so would be a better job than gluing at home.


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## Sachakins (23 Dec 2022)

Worth a look, not kitchen but sounds to you idea


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## COWS (23 Dec 2022)

alexnharvey said:


> @COWS I hadn't considered gluing my own laminate to the ply or whatever material I use for the cabinets. I assumed that factory produced laminate faced ply would be glued at high pressure and so would be a better job than gluing at home.


They are yes but I've done a lot of laminate work in the past. This is the type of glue I used. Its somewhat more expensive than I remember. Prior to using spray glue, I used Evo Stick 528 using a part of a handsaw blade with the teeth worn right down as a spreader. Also used rollers for pressing it out.

However you go about it, I believe you will build a kitchen that will last for as long as you want and probably for less than buying a mid rage showroom one.

edit: spelling


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## Inspector (23 Dec 2022)

You should look into pre-finished plywood or veneered chipboard/MDF for the carcasses. Many shops use it here because it saves time and the interiors are a nice maple or birch. Biscuits are designed for this kind of work if you have one use it. If not screws (or even brad nails) and glue are simple and will hold well enough until everything is mounted. Better than legs making a plinth as COWS mentioned is nice and solid, although here they are normally 2x4 (90mm high) here. You face the space under the cabinet with the material of your choosing. The beauty of them is that you can level and anchor the whole plinth at one time ensuring the cabinets sit level and it simplifies cabinet construction. Screw them down into the plinth and to the wall. If you are smart you let in plywood along the wall so you have something to screw into without having to look for studs. I think plywood edges don't look all that good and add work to making them nice looking. I would glue solid edging on. 

Pete


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## eribaMotters (23 Dec 2022)

I have recently completed a couple of units in 18mm birch plywood nd MDF. The plywood is now getting difficult to obtain and as mentioned earlier Poplar is the available alternative. I have used Timbmet, minimum order of £500 but free delivery. I paid £88 + vat a sheet a few weeks ago, same as a month earlier for S-BB grade Birch plywood.
The problems you will face is you have to be very accurate and careful in your cutting, construction and finish. I biscuit joint my cabinets together, and fish with two coats of acrylic satin varnish. The MDF I use an acrylic eggshell.
I plant a 33mm thick M&T frame onto the front and then use inset drawers or doors. The frame is painted but the doors/drawers are sometimes varnished as this gives a nice contrast. 













Instead of a plinth or plastic legs look at the IKEA Capita legs. I used these in the bookcase and desk units shown.

Colin


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## sometimewoodworker (24 Dec 2022)

alexnharvey said:


> I am wondering if i can use 2400mm long sections to form the tops and bottoms of the units and then have the sides inserted between those, either in dados cut into the long pieces, or fixed by one of the other common methods, dowels or confirmat type screws. As I will not be creating feet for the cabinets by using full height walls I could use plastic legs to support the cabinets and attach them to the walls at the rear, but it is not out of the question to use wooden legs if these would be better.
> 
> Is there an obvious reason not to do it this way or is it a reasonable design choice?


there is absolutely no reason not to make them that way. Plastic levelling legs, I used the IKEA ones, are perfectly good. You may well not need full thickness backs, you definitely do not need full width/length pieces on the top. There is a good system for attaching the backs to the wall’s using plastic adjustable spacers.

Your design is almost the same as the one I made for my kitchen, though the length is not as long as yours, it is 1700mm long. I also put in 32mm system shelf pin holes which make fitting draw slides really foolproof using euro screws. I mostly used dominoes, pocket holes and glue.

My kitchen has been in place for 2 years now, it has a granite top so you can certainly that the plastic legs are easily sturdy enough, I used one pair under each vertical.


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## Lefley (24 Dec 2022)

alexnharvey said:


> Track saw and pocket screws is the current plan tool wise. If I can avoid dados it seems like it makes my life much easier.
> 
> Have you made your kitchen @Spectric , I saw some of your deliberations in older threads.


 they create boxes in euro style is you really need two sheets of ply to put euro hinges for doors back to back . a single sheet in between cabinets can not accommodate euro hinges going both ways, i suppose you could use one sheet between turn put a second strip on front and strips where slides for drawers would go. but that is just more work then building boxes with one bottom and two sides with a strip at top , front and back,


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## sometimewoodworker (24 Dec 2022)

Lefley said:


> the reason they create boxes in euro style is you really need two sheets of ply to put euro hinges for doors back to back . a single sheet in between cabinets can not accommodate euro hinges going both ways, i suppose you could use one sheet between turn put a second strip on front and strips where slides for drawers would go. but that is just more work then building boxes with one bottom and two sides with a strip at top , front and back,


That is incorrect information, a single 19mm panel can easily accommodate two back to back doors using euro hinges. There are 4 different ways, one is to use euro screws that protrude 8mm or less into the panel, there are lengths of euro screws from 8mm total length so that’s easy enough. A second is to use 25mm panels, this will allow for the use of 13mm euro screws. A third is to offset the hinges so the screws don’t meet. The last that I can think of is to drill the 32mm system holes using a 16mm offset to each other on different sides of the panel.

So these are at least 4 different ways to do the job you say can’t be done.

FWIW. I have not offset the holes, I have draw slides that use the same holes, I just use 8mm Euro screws


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## Lefley (24 Dec 2022)

sometimewoodworker said:


> That is incorrect information, a single 19mm panel can easily accommodate two back to back doors using euro hinges. There are 4 different ways, one is to use euro screws that protrude 8mm or less into the panel, there are lengths of euro screws from 8mm total length so that’s easy enough. A second is to use 25mm panels, this will allow for the use of 13mm euro screws. A third is to offset the hinges so the screws don’t meet. The last that I can think of is to drill the 32mm system holes using a 16mm offset to each other on different sides of the panel.
> 
> So these are at least 4 different ways to do the job you say can’t be done.
> 
> FWIW. I have not offset the holes, I have draw slides that use the same holes, I just use 8mm Euro screws


my mistake i thought he said he was going to be using 1/2 inch panels. we don't use metric sheets in cansda .i converted wrong.


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## WillyEckerslike (24 Dec 2022)

sometimewoodworker said:


> That is incorrect information, a single 19mm panel can easily accommodate two back to back doors using euro hinges. There are 4 different ways, one is to use euro screws that protrude 8mm or less into the panel, there are lengths of euro screws from 8mm total length so that’s easy enough. A second is to use 25mm panels, this will allow for the use of 13mm euro screws. A third is to offset the hinges so the screws don’t meet. The last that I can think of is to drill the 32mm system holes using a 16mm offset to each other on different sides of the panel.
> 
> So these are at least 4 different ways to do the job you say can’t be done.
> 
> FWIW. I have not offset the holes, I have draw slides that use the same holes, I just use 8mm Euro screws


Does that work with overlay doors? I can see it wouldn't be a problem with inset hinges


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## SimonL (24 Dec 2022)

@alexnharvey I have recently started a kitchen almost exactly as you describe above - I am part way through. 
I have decided for various reasons to make the cabinets individually (singles or doubles i.e. 600 or 1200 wide) so will get the double uprights in places
I have done some previous jobs in the house which leave the edges exposed (inset doors rather than overlay) and I find when finished they are quite subdued and really nice. 
I am using rebates & dado's and mostly just glue - some pocket holes on the back where I've put a stretcher or support to keep everything square. 
I've also used the plastic levelling legs which I've used before - work well for me
I'm using a track saw and router
some of my inspiration came from:
Lozi Designs
Birkwood Scotland

I have sketchup files for the cabinet design if helpful. 
example pic of the rebate/dado - not sanded or finished at this point;




The right hand cabinet is for the sink and this recess will be filled with a fake drawer front later....


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## COWS (24 Dec 2022)

WillyEckerslike said:


> Does that work with overlay doors? I can see it wouldn't be a problem with inset hinges



It wouldn't make a difference. It's the mount plates that will go back to back. The only difference is that overlay doors, the plate would be closer to the front edge.



Inspector said:


> You should look into pre-finished plywood or veneered chipboard/MDF for the carcasses


Pre finish boards are fine. But I would steer clear of chipboard. MDF is better but Ply is king. If you were to build the whole unit with melamine surface, then the labour to lay all the laminate would be too much so would make sense to buy. For only shelf surfaces I would lay it myself. A lot of the pre finish melamines are wafer thin unless you spend £££. 

Another option you could look at is using a company like Cutwrights for pre finish stuff. I used these a fair bit when I worked in hospitality build.


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## WillyEckerslike (24 Dec 2022)

COWS said:


> It wouldn't make a difference. It's the mount plates that will go back to back. The only difference is that overlay doors, the plate would be closer to the front edge.


What about the doors meeting each other edge to edge? An overlay door has 2mm gap to the edge of the carcass which means for an 18mm carcass, 16mm is covered by the door. You couldn't then hang a door off the other face without the doors hitting each other.


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## alexnharvey (24 Dec 2022)

The current fashion is to have most units with drawers and pull outs rather than doors on the base cabinets and so we'll have either no or very few doors that are back to back.


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## Sideways (24 Dec 2022)

Practicalities: if you have a washing machine or dishwasher in your kitchen, or even the stop tap for the incoming water main, put your cabinets on plastic legs so that they aren't destroyed by a water leak.


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## sometimewoodworker (24 Dec 2022)

COWS said:


> It wouldn't make a difference. It's the mount plates that will go back to back. The only difference is that overlay doors, the plate would be closer to the front edge.


Not correct. With all Euro hinge types the plate that fits on the carcass is in the same position. The hinge body is different in the 3 main types.


WillyEckerslike said:


> What about the doors meeting each other edge to edge? An overlay door has 2mm gap to the edge of the carcass which means for an 18mm carcass, 16mm is covered by the door. You couldn't then hang a door off the other face without the doors hitting each other.


That is not a problem if you use the correct hinge. There are 3 main types of Euro hinge for Euro cabinets ; the inset, the full overlay, and the half overlay. I assume that you don’t have much experience of Euro hinges. Within the main types there are different degrees that they open to, naturally you would not usually use a 170° degree hinge on back to back doors, a 107° would probably be the best choice 

There are also variations available for face frames if you want


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## johnnyb (24 Dec 2022)

the method you describe is a bit impractical as most kitchens won't have 2400mm unbroken run. the only advantage I can think of is a small saving in ply. the dis advantages are numerous the main one being⁰ movement around. getting everything level and square. incorporating appliances. if I was to do it as suggested I would make and level plinths in advance a plop the unit on those. modular just means units of a sensible size so they can be worked on. tall units would end up like wardrobes with the same problems.


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## johnnyb (24 Dec 2022)

I like certain cupboard arrangements. I draw them out full size on a piece of mdf. I like units 530 deep and the back screwed on so I can take it off for spraying. I like cabs 790 tall with 80mm legs( instead of 150mm) this allows 2 shelves or an extra deep bottom drawer( it does mean it's difficult to adjust the back legs unless you use ones that can be adjusted through a hole in the cabinet.)
these are just decisions that are made and once made stuck with.
I like integrated appliances so have a method of doing those. but dislike integrated fridges and freezers as they rarely fit that well after a period of use.( love american / french doors).


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## sometimewoodworker (24 Dec 2022)

johnnyb said:


> the method you describe is a bit impractical as most kitchens won't have 2400mm unbroken run.


Clearly @alexnharvey has that amount or he would not be considered it.
FWIW My kitchen has a little short of 5 metres, the 2 longer cabinets are 150mm and about 170mm


johnnyb said:


> the dis advantages are numerous the main one being movement around. getting everything level and square


That maybe your conception. If you are getting things shipped to you that may be correct but as he is building them himself you are incorrect. The reason that you don’t find many/any suppliers with long cabinets is that the market for them is small so shorter ones that can be put together are the norm.


johnnyb said:


> modular just means units of a sensible size so they can be worked on.


In a totally custom job that is irrelevant, as you design and build the cabinets to whatever length suits you.


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## johnnyb (24 Dec 2022)

what are the advantages of a long cabinet?


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## WillyEckerslike (24 Dec 2022)

sometimewoodworker said:


> Not correct. With all Euro hinge types the plate that fits on the carcass is in the same position. The hinge body is different in the 3 main types.


Not correct. The majority of inset hinges require that the plate that fits on the carcass is set back to accommodate the thickness of the door (which is of course variable) therefore 37mm plus the door thickness. I assume you don't have much experience of fitting these hinges.


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## COWS (24 Dec 2022)

WillyEckerslike said:


> What about the doors meeting each other edge to edge? An overlay door has 2mm gap to the edge of the carcass which means for an 18mm carcass, 16mm is covered by the door. You couldn't then hang a door off the other face without the doors hitting each other.


Half crank hinges.


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## WillyEckerslike (24 Dec 2022)

COWS said:


> Half crank hinges.


Yes I've had that pointed out to me already thank you - albeit somewhat less tactfully.


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## pe2dave (24 Dec 2022)

A consideration. If (when?) your washing machine / dishwasher overflows, you'll be grateful not to have wood down to the floor? Those plastic legs serve a good purpose.


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## sometimewoodworker (24 Dec 2022)

WillyEckerslike said:


> Not correct. The majority of inset hinges require that the plate that fits on the carcass is set back to accommodate the thickness of the door (which is of course variable) therefore 37mm plus the door thickness. I assume you don't have much experience of fitting these hinges.


Maybe I’ve only fitted a few hundred of them but almost none of the inset variations


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## sometimewoodworker (24 Dec 2022)

johnnyb said:


> what are the advantages of a long cabinet?


Fewer uprights, easier to level, thinner uprights. To name just 3.

Of course if you are not making them on site, I did and I assume that @alexnharvey is also doing that


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## johnnyb (24 Dec 2022)

as long as you've considered all your options then crack on. Good luck.


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## Mikey RR (24 Dec 2022)

Hi everyone.

I'm in a similar boat, designing replacement kitchen cabinets. Going back to materials, I found out you can get exterior MDF now:









Medite Exterior MDF Full Board - MDF Direct


Specifically for use in a wide range of external applications and gives all the design freedom of interior MDF.




mdfdirect.co.uk





The page does say "As Medite Exterior complies with MDF H2 as defined by EN 622 Part 5, it is also suitable for environmentally sensitive interior applications," can anyone see any downsides? Other than the mess that cutting and routing MDF makes?

Cheers!
Mike


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## COWS (24 Dec 2022)

Mikey RR said:


> Hi everyone.
> 
> I'm in a similar boat, designing replacement kitchen cabinets. Going back to materials, I found out you can get exterior MDF now:
> 
> ...


What you have there if I'm not mistaken is moisture resistant mdf. I find it odd that its advertised vas exterior grade as it will absorb water, albeit not as quickly as standard. You can buy Tricoya mdf that I believe you can use externally without issue. But the cost is eye watering.

Using moisture resistant for interior applications like kitchens, bathrooms and any cabinet work is fine. Use extraction as much as you can, even if it's a Henry. Seal and decorate it well though.


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## Mikey RR (24 Dec 2022)

COWS said:


> What you have there if I'm not mistaken is moisture resistant mdf. I find it odd that its advertised vas exterior grade as it will absorb water, albeit not as quickly as standard. You can buy Tricoya mdf that I believe you can use externally without issue. But the cost is eye watering.
> 
> Using moisture resistant for interior applications like kitchens, bathrooms and any cabinet work is fine. Use extraction as much as you can, even if it's a Henry. Seal and decorate it well though.


Thanks @COWS, I had my eye on a Henry, until I noticed Trend now do a hoover with a much finer filter. My routers are Trends and I'm quite happy with their stuff, so might pull the trigger in the January sales.

I went a bit nuts on Black Friday, I got myself the Makita track saw and a Bosch tablesaw. I've never done anything at this scale before, my hand tool centric approach wouldn't scale up to a full kitchen! (And any excuse to buy new toys.)


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## COWS (24 Dec 2022)

Mikey RR said:


> Thanks @COWS, I had my eye on a Henry, until I noticed Trend now do a hoover with a much finer filter. My routers are Trends and I'm quite happy with their stuff, so might pull the trigger in the January sales.
> 
> I went a bit nuts on Black Friday, I got myself the Makita track saw and a Bosch tablesaw. I've never done anything at this scale before, my hand tool centric approach wouldn't scale up to a full kitchen! (And any excuse to buy new toys.)


Trend extractors are great. You won't be disappointed with one of these. I had a couple years ago. I didn't much like the Dewalt I had for a while, but they may have improved in 15 years. I'm on Festool ones atm but acctually prefer my 2010 midi to the M class one I bought this year.

Enjoy your new tools friend, and take care when using them.


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## johnnyb (24 Dec 2022)

I find mdf fairly unsatisfactory as carcass material. it's heavy dusty and difficult to join. ok on say a door panel. I don't really like the effect when it's painted either. I'm taken with poplar ply as it's light. birch or maple faced is absolutely super. probably better than birch bb. it's much nicer finished( with wb)than mrmdf which tends to absorb and raise fibres.


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## doctor Bob (24 Dec 2022)

COWS said:


> What you have there if I'm not mistaken is moisture resistant mdf. I find it odd that its advertised vas exterior grade as it will absorb water, albeit not as quickly as standard. You can buy Tricoya mdf that I believe you can use externally without issue. But the cost is eye watering.
> 
> Using moisture resistant for interior applications like kitchens, bathrooms and any cabinet work is fine. Use extraction as much as you can, even if it's a Henry. Seal and decorate it well though.


Exterior MDF is very much a "thing", different to MR MDF. It's not as good as Tricoya, but better than MR.


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## Mikey RR (24 Dec 2022)

COWS said:


> Trend extractors are great. You won't be disappointed with one of these. I had a couple years ago. I didn't much like the Dewalt I had for a while, but they may have improved in 15 years. I'm on Festool ones atm but acctually prefer my 2010 midi to the M class one I bought this year.
> 
> Enjoy your new tools friend, and take care when using them.


Thanks, I'll definitely pull the trigger on the Trend! This is exactly the information I came here for.

If anything, I'm possibly a little bit over cautious around spinning metal. I've put off buying a tablesaw until now because kickback sounded so scary; but if I'm respectful of the tool then I think I can minimize the risk. It probably isn't any more dangerous than a router table.


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## Mikey RR (24 Dec 2022)

johnnyb said:


> I find mdf fairly unsatisfactory as carcass material. it's heavy dusty and difficult to join. ok on say a door panel. I don't really like the effect when it's painted either. I'm taken with poplar ply as it's light. birch or maple faced is absolutely super. probably better than birch bb. it's much nicer finished( with wb)than mrmdf which tends to absorb and raise fibres.


So, in frame and panel construction, it's fine, but as the overall structure, it's less satisfactory?

I am trying to decide if I'm going to go f&p on the bookcases. I do prefer the look, but cutting those mortice and tenon joints might be a bit of a pain.


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## COWS (24 Dec 2022)

doctor Bob said:


> Exterior MDF is very much a "thing", different to MR MDF. It's not as good as Tricoya, but better than MR.


Thanks for the correction @doctor Bob. Is it any good?


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## johnnyb (24 Dec 2022)

I usually " fake" frame and panel using thin strips nailed on tbh.


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## Mikey RR (24 Dec 2022)

johnnyb said:


> I usually " fake" frame and panel using thin strips nailed on tbh.


I was thinking of faking it too, the front stile is the only really important frame component as it's the only part visible from every angle.

I'd love to get a Domino but I don't think that'll fit the budget.


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## johnnyb (24 Dec 2022)

domino's are OK but clever design will allow you to conceal where it's screwed together. I do use domino's but don't use them all the time. screws n glue in birch ply give a very strong joint.


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## johnnyb (24 Dec 2022)

I only use dados and rebates when I have to flat-pack like a wardrobe.


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## Mikey RR (24 Dec 2022)

One option I'm considering is to use 12mm or 15mm sheets, making individual cabinets, screw them together in place and then face the 24 to 30mm edge. The screw heads holding the top batten, shelves and bottom will be on the inside where no-one will ever see, and the screws holding the two cabinets together can be hidden behind the hinge.

EDIT: @johnnyb after rereading your comment, I think this might be what you were suggesting?


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## WillyEckerslike (24 Dec 2022)

The first time I came across exterior MDF was 30 years ago when it was the main cladding material for the Orangery at the British Garden Exhibit in the 1992 Floriade. It was being hailed as the ultimate shop fitting material and known (to us at least) as Medite.


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## Mikey RR (24 Dec 2022)

WillyEckerslike said:


> The first time I came across exterior MDF was 30 years ago when it was the main cladding material for the Orangery at the British Garden Exhibit in the 1992 Floriade. It was being hailed as the ultimate shop fitting material and known (to us at least) as Medite.


Thats the stuff I'm interested in for my kitchen.









Medite Exterior MDF Full Board - MDF Direct


Specifically for use in a wide range of external applications and gives all the design freedom of interior MDF.




mdfdirect.co.uk


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## doctor Bob (24 Dec 2022)

Mikey RR said:


> Thats the stuff I'm interested in for my kitchen.
> 
> 
> 
> ...


It's just overkill, if I use it I only use it on "wet cabinets".


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## Mikey RR (26 Dec 2022)

doctor Bob said:


> It's just overkill, if I use it I only use it on "wet cabinets".


I don't know, you've not seen the mess I make when washing up.


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## Jar944 (28 Dec 2022)

alexnharvey said:


> Hello. I would like to make my own kitchen cabinets. I want to minimise having the double vertical walls which are a consequence of the standard units and the spacers which are required where no unit will fit, effectively creating a made to measure kitchen.
> 
> I would like to use birch plywood for the units, or similar. I anticipate having the ply laminate "end grain" visible as a feature, rather than hiding it with inserts or tape. I might use melamine faced ply in places, particularly the inside bottom faces on which items rest. The doors might also be melamine or fenix ntm faced.
> 
> ...


Works fine.


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## alexnharvey (28 Dec 2022)

Jar944 said:


> Works fine.View attachment 149936


That looks great. What sort of ply is that?


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## Jar944 (28 Dec 2022)

alexnharvey said:


> That looks great. What sort of ply is that?


Maple and birch.


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## D_W (28 Dec 2022)

alexnharvey said:


> Track saw and pocket screws is the current plan tool wise. If I can avoid dados it seems like it makes my life much easier.
> 
> Have you made your kitchen @Spectric , I saw some of your deliberations in older threads.



I built ply cabinets for my kitchen. Dado works fine and is helpful for assembly as long as the ply remains flat and there is just a bit of room in the dadoes for glue. If the joint is tight in dry fit, you will be in for a battle at glue up and there will be lengths to deal with that can't easily be clamped together.

if you can design things so that parts are glued if you're intending to glue - in a couple of phases on a really large cabinet, getting partial glue ups square and tight to aid subsequent, you'll appreciate it.

at the time I made my kitchen, I'd worked 20 years before in a factory where despite using cheap sides and backs, everything was rabbet and dado on the box with frames applied (different than you're mentioning) so I did what I was familiar with but dadoed the internal parts, too, which made glue up harder, but the boxes are incredibly rigid now and won't sag. that also allowed use of less hard ply (cherry face, poplar lumber core) and less thick (1/2 inch).

too, most of the feedback I got was "that's an antiquated and overly difficult way to make kitchen cabinets. Get engineered materials and screws made for them.

it definitely would've been easier.

Another option that was done in the US and may still be done custom in some cases is building a frame with lumber as a skeleton for layout and then building anything nonstandard to it. the kitchen that I removed was a combination of birch ply, but all of the nonstandard areas made to get everything to fit over wide spans was clearly partially built in situ and not in full boxes.

Not having a second knowledgeable person present for glue up, though, was the only real big thing I'd change - as impractical as it may be commercially to build cabinets with strong glued dadoes and rebate edges - it is amateur impractical only if things are too tight and glue gets a grip almost right away.


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## Mikey RR (30 Dec 2022)

D_W said:


> I built ply cabinets for my kitchen. Dado works fine and is helpful for assembly as long as the ply remains flat and there is just a bit of room in the dadoes for glue. If the joint is tight in dry fit, you will be in for a battle at glue up and there will be lengths to deal with that can't easily be clamped together.
> 
> if you can design things so that parts are glued if you're intending to glue - in a couple of phases on a really large cabinet, getting partial glue ups square and tight to aid subsequent, you'll appreciate it.
> 
> ...


I used the extended open time glue from Titebond when laminating up the top for my Holtzapfel workbench, and I think I rushed more than I needed to.


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## Agent_zed (3 Jan 2023)

Something else you may want to consider is a plinth step. If you cabs are quite tall they look quite useful. Random example SPACE STEP: All you need to know about planning – Blum EASY ASSEMBLY Blog


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## alexnharvey (3 Jan 2023)

Agent_zed said:


> Something else you may want to consider is a plinth step. If you cabs are quite tall they look quite useful. Random example SPACE STEP: All you need to know about planning – Blum EASY ASSEMBLY Blog


That's a great idea. Thanks


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