# Plane Hammer



## wizer (11 Nov 2009)

Hi Guys

I fancy making a plane hammer. I've got a bit of Goncalo Alves that I was going to use but I've seen a few references that suggest that steel is better for this purpose.

What do you think? and if it's to be steel, could I maybe set some steel into the gonc? Or does the whole head have to be steel.

cheers


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## Mr Ed (11 Nov 2009)

Brass is the thing I think

Ed


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## wizer (11 Nov 2009)

Would it not be too soft Ed?


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## Philly (11 Nov 2009)

Tom
If its for a wooden plane use a wooden head, if a metal plane use metal. Brass is good as its a soft metal.
Hope this helps,
Philly


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## Mr Ed (11 Nov 2009)

Well it is softish, but thats the idea - the face of the hammer gets dinged, not the top of the plane blade. Brass is not so soft that it will be wrecked after a few weeks.

Ed


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## Racers (11 Nov 2009)

Hi, Wizer

Here's mine 





Brass and nylon.

Pete


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## Mr Ed (11 Nov 2009)

I use one of these;






which is not ideal, but works OK. For some time I've been planning to make one that is brass one end and wood the other, along the lines of the one Pete showed.

Ed


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## Paul Chapman (11 Nov 2009)

I have one of Philly's brass-head plane hammers. It's really nice  

Cheers :wink: 

Paul


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## wizer (11 Nov 2009)

thanks chaps, I'll get some brass rod.


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## aesmith (11 Nov 2009)

Hi, I'm not a great wooden plane expert, but do you strike the iron itself when adjusting? I only strike the plane body and the wedge.


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## Mr Ed (11 Nov 2009)

I could write what I know about wooden planes on a post it note, but I tap the blade and thought that was what most people do. Obviously you have to strike the back of the plane to reduce the cut. I know you can hit the front of the plane to increase the cut, but it seems less precise that tapping the blade.

Ed


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## Paul Chapman (11 Nov 2009)

Also useful for adjusting metal planes without lateral adjustment levers, like the LN #9.

Cheers :wink: 

Paul


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## woodbloke (11 Nov 2009)

EdSutton":pb0srqhn said:


> I use one of these;
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Same here...works fine :wink: I also use it to adjust the LN No9 - Rob


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## lurker (11 Nov 2009)

Wizer

The reason most people use brass is for the weight, I think.

You could make a hollow wooden head & fill with molten lead.

If you do use the brass rod, your lathe can be used to true up the faces


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## Mattty (11 Nov 2009)

Racers":mot209q8 said:


> Hi, Wizer
> 
> Here's mine
> 
> ...



That is such a lovely looking plane. It's just asking to be used. Does it work as beautifully as well?


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## wizer (11 Nov 2009)

IIRC Pete, that's a scraper and didn't Lurker make one also?


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## Racers (11 Nov 2009)

Hi, Chaps

Its the small scraper plane that made the shavings in the picture, so yes it works well.


Pete


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## wizer (11 Nov 2009)

Was there a build thread? Interested to know how they're made and where the blade comes from.


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## Doug B (11 Nov 2009)

wizer":2bzxbjoo said:


> Was there a build thread? Interested to know how they're made and where the blade comes from.



My moneys on Pete having made the blade as well as the plane, though it`s a fairly safe bet as i don`t have much money


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## lurker (11 Nov 2009)

Yep I did have a go at making one

it......was....not........exactly...............a.............success.

However I'm now in the process of making another blade & will have another go. This time it will stick to the Maddex design more faithfully


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## wizer (11 Nov 2009)

If you guys are having a blade making orgy, can I put an order in ?? I quite fancy making a woody.


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## lurker (11 Nov 2009)

wizer":c37lsdua said:


> If you guys are having a blade making orgy, can I put an order in ?? I quite fancy making a woody.



something could be organised................ if you beg hard enough :lol:


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## wizer (11 Nov 2009)




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## Philly (11 Nov 2009)

I'll make you a blade, Tom - PM me with your requirements.
Cheers
Philly


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## Ironballs (11 Nov 2009)

I also have the Philly hammer to go with my Philly plane


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## katellwood (11 Nov 2009)

Other peoples generosity has helped me out recently here 

Wizer do you want an offcut of 3/4 inch brass if so how long


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## wizer (11 Nov 2009)

That's most kind. I was thinking the head should be about 2.5" and me being me I'll need a backup. So 5-6"?


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## katellwood (11 Nov 2009)

I believe I'm close by, PM me your address and I will drop a piece off


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## Ironballs (11 Nov 2009)

If you catch him in the right/wrong mood he might sell you a tablesaw too :wink:


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## Racers (12 Nov 2009)

Hi, Wizer

Plane and blade my by me, no wip thread sorry. The blade cane from an off cut of this chisel.





Pete


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## wizer (12 Nov 2009)

ooer how about one of these hammer heads:






http://www.japan-tool.com/gennou/home_gennou.html


:shock: :shock:


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## Alf (12 Nov 2009)

See, I can kinda see the point in a dedicated plane hammer if you're going to the trouble of using materials to avoid any damage to the planes - but I look at that one and wonder what it is I'm missing? 

Cheers, Alf


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## wizer (12 Nov 2009)

Actually I think these hammers are intended to be used as mallets for hitting hooped Japanese Chisels. The price staggers tho. I'd suggest they lean rather heavily on the traditional craftsman stories.


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## wizer (12 Nov 2009)

Aesthetically, I think they are lovely. This ones particularly hovers my craft:


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## Mr Ed (12 Nov 2009)

I think I'd struggle a bit with the idea of paying a lot for a hammer with no handle though...

Ed


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## wizer (12 Nov 2009)

Why? We're woodworkers. I think I'd prefer it.


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## Mr Ed (12 Nov 2009)

I'm a builder but if I bought a house I'd expect it to have a roof on.

Ed


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## Aled Dafis (12 Nov 2009)

Check out The August 4th post here

http://www.sauerandsteiner.com/archive/2009_08_01_archive.html

Cheers

Aled


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## wizer (12 Nov 2009)

Thanks Aled, it's beautiful. I love it!


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## Aled Dafis (12 Nov 2009)

Yes I know, stunning.

As hard as I've tried though, I've been unable to make the "man maths" work out on this one...









Yet!! :twisted: :twisted: 

Still working on it though.

Cheers

Aled


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## Mr Ed (12 Nov 2009)

I remember reading that post at the time, interesting, but it just doesn't do it for me - I'm obviously some sort of hammer heathen!

Ed


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## wizer (16 Nov 2009)

Ok, so I have decided on my design and the construction method. I have a piece of 20mm brass bar (thanks katellwood). 

What sort of drill bit should I use to drill the mortice for the handle? I'm thinking 12 or 14mm. I don't think my Lidl brad points are gong to be up to the challenge 

Recommendations appreciated


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## Mr Ed (17 Nov 2009)

I use HSS bits for brass.

Ed


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## Aled Dafis (17 Nov 2009)

Standard HSS bits will be fine.

I'd prepare a simple block of wood to act as a drilling jig to aid you in drilling the 12mm hole centrally in the brass bar.

A picture makes it clearer than my explanations ever could. (sorry, but my CAD proramme doesn't have a "wood" plugin yet)







Just make sure that the 12mm hole in the jig is exactly central to the 20mm hole for the hammer head. An off centre hole in round bar often looks far worse than it usually is.

Cheers

Aled

Edit - just found the "wood" setting


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## lurker (17 Nov 2009)

Wizer,

To some extent the size of the hole will be governed by the capacity of the drill chuck unless you get a "blacksmith" HSS bit.

Aled's advice regarding centreing jig is not to be ignored. DAMHIKT


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## Harbo (17 Nov 2009)

Here's one I made a while back from a spare handle, some brass tubing and some box "dowelling".

Not that heavy but works fine - the boxwood has survived the bashing it gets  






Rod (sorry about the picture size - old photo!)


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## Mr Ed (5 Jan 2010)

I couldn't post the hammer I'd made when this thread came round, as it was covert, being secret santa and all that. Here it is - brass head 19mm dia, about 70mm long and cocobolo handle.






I prefer the milled slot to a round hole as I feel its more positive for the handle fitting. Going to make a Mk2 version for myself now.

Have you made one yet Tom?

Ed


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## Aled Dafis (5 Jan 2010)

Did you sneak a milling machine into the workshop without telling us Ed?


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## Mr Ed (5 Jan 2010)

Aled Dafis":1z4e4sd2 said:


> Did you sneak a milling machine into the workshop without telling us Ed?



I wish I had - it was a slow process doing it the way I did. I have a vertical slide for my lathe,
so I mount that on the cross slide and effectively get a 3 axis milling machine laying on its side, with the cutter mounted in the chuck.

It has a very limited capacity as its only a small lathe,
but its good enough for things like this.

Ed


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## wizer (5 Jan 2010)

No not yet Ed. I ran out of time before the op and I didn't expect to still be 'recovering'. So progress is slow atm. I have no pressing job on in the workshop for the foreseable future, so it'll get done soon. I need to spend some time getting to know the Philly Plane soon, so a hammer will be needed. I'm thinking about inlaying a wood insert on one side of the hammer.


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## Karl (5 Jan 2010)

Tom - I use 2 "hammers" on my PhillyPlanes - a lignum mallet when knocking the body, and a jap hammer for increasing the blade set. A metal double faced hammer with one wooden face would be a good idea. 

Cheers

Karl


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## Harbo (5 Jan 2010)

Nice looking hammer Mr Ed.

January's F&C has David Barron "giving away" his production secrets on the short handled chisel hammer he sells.
Head from 32mm diam brass with round wedged hole - very easy to modify shape and size of handle if required?

The one I made is very light but does the business.

Rod


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## Mr Ed (5 Jan 2010)

Harbo":1g3gqeuj said:


> Head from 32mm diam brass



I've not seen the article, but that size of stock sounds a bit hefty for a plane adjusting hammer to me. I've always seen them as a small delicate thing for precise taps.

Ed


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## wizer (5 Jan 2010)

Cheers Karl. Just got to work out how to do it. I'm thinking some sort of double screw that I can tap into the brass, somehow.


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## Harbo (5 Jan 2010)

Mr Ed - you are probably right - it is a chisel hammer really.
The hammer has some nice details which could be adapted like relieving the edges and rounding off one end slightly.
The handle attachment using a wedge and brass pin is nice?
Though for a 19mm head you would have to go for an oval socket like yours? 

Rod


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## Mr Ed (5 Jan 2010)

Harbo":yauv49eq said:


> Mr Ed - you are probably right - it is a chisel hammer really.



That size makes sense for a chisel hammer - it sounds like the Glen Drake one, which is something I had a notion of copying one day when I get the chance.

Ed


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## Aled Dafis (5 Jan 2010)

Harbo":2q8gn20p said:


> January's F&C has David Barron "giving away" his production secrets on the short handled chisel hammer he sells.
> Head from 32mm diam brass with round wedged hole - very easy to modify shape and size of handle if required?
> 
> Rod



I was also suprised to see him giving away his secrets, seems a very labour intensive way of making tools though. Does anybody know how much he charges for them?

I really liked his planes in the previous issue, I was very tempted, but thankfully he doesn't have a web presence for his tools.

A small hammer like this has been on my "to do" list for a few years, based on the Glen Drake hammers

http://www.glen-drake.com/v-web/ecommerce/os/catalog/index.php?cPath=21

which I can only assume were the inspiration for David barron's hammers.

Cheers

Aled


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## Mr Ed (5 Jan 2010)

wizer":1jjttbg3 said:


> Cheers Karl. Just got to work out how to do it. I'm thinking some sort of double screw that I can tap into the brass, somehow.



I was thinking of a wooden face on one end of my hammer. I was planning to bore a hole in the brass and then turn a small spigot on the wood bit and epoxy it in, before turning the 2 together to finished size.

Only thing I wondered about, was that if I use a hardwood (say rosewood for example) is that actually going to be much softer than the brass? Might be a lot of work putting a wood face on one end for no gain...

I'm still mulling it over.

Ed


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## wizer (5 Jan 2010)

I was thinking of using Goncalo Alves or Lignum.


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## Mr Ed (5 Jan 2010)

wizer":ta03tif7 said:


> I was thinking of using Goncalo Alves or Lignum.



Well they're both pretty hard as well, so my same comment applies - is it soft enough compared to the brass to make it worth bothering?


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## Karl (5 Jan 2010)

Ed - I would not hit my woodies with any form of metal plane, brass or not. I use a BIG lignum mallett to rap the back of my PP's, and there is not a mark in sight. 

Obviously the metal hammer is used for increasing the depth of cut by tapping the blade.

Cheers

Karl


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## Mr Ed (5 Jan 2010)

Karl":25s5baw7 said:


> Ed - I would not hit my woodies with any form of metal plane,



I agree, I would use a hammer :lol:


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## Karl (5 Jan 2010)

Mr Ed":2ffarjmv said:


> Karl":2ffarjmv said:
> 
> 
> > Ed - I would not hit my woodies with any form of metal plane,
> ...



:lol:


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## Mr Ed (5 Jan 2010)

I have very limited experience of wooden planes, but the few taps I made on the heel of the plane I did for secret santa left no impressions. It is end grain after all and in a wood like Goncalo Alves its pretty resilient.

I think on a plane with a metal lever cap and screw you can be a bit more delicate as you can release the pressure on the blade without having to give the back of the plane a bit clout, the taps on the back with the screw slightly slackened off are only to reduce the depth of cut. With a traditional wedge you need quite a hit to release the wedge.

I can see why you wouldn't want to damage the back of your planes, but is a hardwood face any less harsh than brass?

Ed


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## Mr Ed (5 Jan 2010)

I have also considered milling the end of the hammer to function as a chipbreaker screwdriver as in these Glen-Drake plane adjustment hammers;







It would still work on a round stock hammer head.

Ed


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## Karl (5 Jan 2010)

Ed - i've just realised that the SS plane you made had a lever cap instead of a wedge. The PhillyPlanes I have (and a HNT Gordon Smoother) all use a wedge. 

The wedge is removed by rapping the back of the plane. The tighter the fit of the wedge, the harder the knock required to release the wedge. A metal plane will mark the back of the plane, end grain or not. DAMHIK!

My PhillyPlanes are all Goncalo Alves; the HNT is Ironwood.

Cheers

Karl


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## Mr Ed (5 Jan 2010)

Karl":15f36hw5 said:


> A metal plane will mark the back of the plane, end grain or not. DAMHIK!



You really must start using a hammer as recommended earlier! :lol: 

Ed


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## Karl (5 Jan 2010)

Wow - twice in one night. Those kids have frazzled my brain!

Cheers

Karl


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## wizer (5 Jan 2010)

planes mad!


don't tell Brad :lol:


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## Harbo (5 Jan 2010)

Aled - I cannot remember the exact figures but they were very reasonably priced - I think under £20 at the time?
Anyway cheap enough to tempt me, but I resisted in the end!

Mr Ed - I used boxwood in mine which has not damaged my woodies so far?

Rod


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## wizer (16 Jan 2010)

Well they say there's nothing new under the sun. I just found this (about halfway down the page)

http://www.daedtoolworks.com/blog/2010/ ... e-day.html

which is exactly how I imagined I'd like to make it. Not sure I'll be able to do it on my wood lathe tho. Worth a try. It's working out how to do the threaded part for the wood attachment. I'm thinking along the lines of gluing a piece of threaded rod in the end. Any ideas?


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## Mr Ed (16 Jan 2010)

Yes I saw that - it looks good. Theres a lot of work in it though, but I might have a go at one when I have a spare day.

Ed



Oh and this ones nice as well :wink: 

https://www.ukworkshop.co.uk/forums/view ... 31&start=0


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## wizer (16 Jan 2010)

It's lovely Ed. Tho, for some reason I want a dual head one. Which is probably making it too complicated. Maybe I should do one in brass and one with gonc.


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